Canine Kobolds

[Ether]

Are canine kobolds found in any edition of D&D?

[Zeta Kai]

2nd Edition has "Dogbolds".

[LoopyZebra]

Earlier kobolds were described as more doglike, as I understand it. But you could certainly use kobolds from any edition and just describe them differently.

[celestialkin]

Here is a homebrew of mine that you might like:
http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=89631


Not really official, but they have turned ut to be quite fun. :smallsmile:

[celestialkin]

2nd Edition has "Dogbolds".


Really?! :smalleek:

I knew about the Urd and their god, but actual dogbolds? Have a book source?

[Innis Cabal]

Early editions they are.

In the several world building projcts I have been apart of, I have made sure to fix their little scale problem

[Gorbash]

In Baldur's Gate (and I imagine the whole 2nd ed), they're still called Kobolds, yet they are doglike, they bark etc..

[Thurbane]

From memory, the 1E MM listed kobolds as mammalian, and their language as yipping and barking...

Really?! :smalleek:

I knew about the Urd and their god, but actual dogbolds? Have a book source?
I think he's talking metaphorically. :smallwink:

[AslanCross]

A holdover in 3.5: Kobolds are reptilian and speak Draconic, but with a barking and yipping accent.

The barking kobolds in Baldur's Gate were hilarious, though.

[SurlySeraph]

The barking kobolds in Baldur's Gate were hilarious, though.

They nearly gave me a goddamn heart attack the first time they showed up. I was looking at a completely different part of the screen, and then suddenly there's this deranged yipping and two of my party members start yelling that they're low on health. It took me ten panicky seconds to find them, by which point all but two of the kobolds were dead. I'm just glad they didn't give the yipping to something actually important, like Illithids.

[Talya]

Kobolds seem different in every source.

Traditional Kobolds of ancient germanic myth were more like fae creatures, mischeivous house spirits and shapeshifters, more akin to boggarts and brownies. In D&D they've been canine or draconic. In the Terry Brooks "Landover" series they are simian. In Everquest they were rather hyena-like.

The name is also the origin of the element Cobalt, a toxic metal.

[Tsotha-lanti]

In Baldur's Gate (and I imagine the whole 2nd ed), they're still called Kobolds, yet they are doglike, they bark etc..

2E kobolds were a mix of reptilian and canine. They were yappy and barky, but had rust-colored scales, lizard tails, and little horns.

[monty]

The name is also the origin of the element Cobalt, a toxic metal.

Now I'm starting to think "The Kobolds" would be a good name for a heavy metal band. *rimshot*

[Prometheus]

They nearly gave me a goddamn heart attack the first time they showed up. I was looking at a completely different part of the screen, and then suddenly there's this deranged yipping and two of my party members start yelling that they're low on health. It took me ten panicky seconds to find them, by which point all but two of the kobolds were dead. I'm just glad they didn't give the yipping to something actually important, like Illithids.
Kobolds that come out of nowhere, looked liked dogs, and had fire arrows. I prefer this version 110% to the 3.5 version of wanna be half-dragons. People wonder why I roll my eyes at every OMG KOBOLDS R SO UBER thread.

[Skaven]

I much prefer the 3rd edition dragon-Kobolds.

They have a level of lore and complexity that most other races lack.

The dogbolds were neat, but they had all the depth of a puddle.

[monty]

Races of the Dragon is one of my favorite books. If I actually had money, I'd buy it.

[Pronounceable]

It took me many years to give up on the notion of orcs being pigheaded, and that was because of the awesomeness of 40k orks. Kobolds have yet to turn up as anything remotely cooler to budge me from my preestablished notion of little barking sobs.

Die By The Sword is that impressive.

[Zephyros]

As Talya so eloquently put it they are different depending on the setting.
In Azeroth (warcraft) they are rat-mole people. Still cannon-fodder but without the cheesy prospect of ascension n stuff :smalltongue: It even makes sense moles and rats and generally rodents are great diggers :smallbiggrin: as kobolds are supposed to be...

[Satyr]

The dogbolds were neat, but they had all the depth of a puddle.

You mean poodle.

Based on Baldur's Gate, I have always invisioned Kobolds mostly as rat-like creatures, with small horns. The rat-like appearance also fits well to their habitation, tactics and even family life and emphasises their role as sentient vermin that will adapt to survive anywhere.

[Mina Kobold]

Kobolds seem different in every source.

Traditional Kobolds of ancient germanic myth were more like fae creatures, mischeivous house spirits and shapeshifters, more akin to boggarts and brownies. In D&D they've been canine or draconic. In the Terry Brooks "Landover" series they are simian. In Everquest they were rather hyena-like.

The name is also the origin of the element Cobalt, a toxic metal.

Cobalt is named after kobolds wich (acordong to a book about that kinda things, that I've read) are a german name for dwarves or gnomes (in the medieval age they where fairyly too) Cobalt was named after them because thaey should be good miners.

[Shpadoinkle]

I prefer the rat-like kobolds found in Baldur's Gate as well.

[Matthew]

The art direction in the AD&D/1e Monster Manual gave us the "scaled dog like" kobold. Apparently that was not what Gygax intended; in OD&D kobolds are just weaker versions of goblins, and even during the AD&D/2e era you can see that strand of thought in Greenwood's Elminster's Notebook and other places. Suffice to say, kobolds are whatever you imagine them to be.

As to origins, the word "kobold" is probably originally Greek (Kobalos), and likely related to "goblin" through Latin and French, having its own distinct form in German.

[Athaniar]

I prefer my kobolds reptilian, but Warcraft kobolds are hilarious too with their "You no take candle!".

Oh, and a question for any german here: you call goblins kobolds, right? So what do you do to separate goblins and actual kobolds (in fantasy settings like D&D and Warcraft)?

[Narmoth]

The 2nd ed monstrous manual portrayed Kobolds like this:

http://www.dotd.com/mm/kobold.gif

This led me to think of them as kind of dog/ratlike creatures

[Dacia Brabant]

The 2nd ed monstrous manual portrayed Kobolds like this:

http://www.dotd.com/mm/kobold.gif

This led me to think of them as kind of dog/ratlike creatures

Oh man, the scorpion on a stick, I'd forgotten about that, that's the third-best weapon ever after the rat-flail and the severed rust monster tentacle. :smallbiggrin:

Didn't gnolls replace kobolds as the doglike monster when kobolds became little reptillian rats?

[newbDM]

The 2nd ed monstrous manual portrayed Kobolds like this:

http://www.dotd.com/mm/kobold.gif

This led me to think of them as kind of dog/ratlike creatures

Why is there a scorpion tied to the end of a stick......


edit:

Oh man, the scorpion on a stick, I'd forgotten about that, that's the third-best weapon ever after the rat-flail and the severed rust monster tentacle. :smallbiggrin:

Is the scorpion on a stick, or any of those other weapons actually stated out anyone? If so, are there updates to 3.5?!


Didn't gnolls replace kobolds as the doglike monster when kobolds became little reptillian rats?

Hyenas are not dogs actual, they are related to moles or something similar I believe.

[Thurbane]

Hyenas are not dogs actual, they are related to moles or something similar I believe.
Close - mongooses and meerkats.

I always assumed that, since it wasn't statted out in the 2E MM, the scorpion-on-a-stick was more of an interrogation/entertainment device than a weapon. :smallbiggrin:

[monty]

mongeese

Fixed it for you :smallbiggrin:

And yes, I know that's not correct.

[Thurbane]

Fixed it for you :smallbiggrin:

And yes, I know that's not correct.
Yeah, I thought the same thing, I read and re-read that before I posted. It looked odd. :smalltongue:

[Dacia Brabant]

Is the scorpion on a stick, or any of those other weapons actually stated out anyone? If so, are there updates to 3.5?!


I seem to remember the scorpion on a stick did have a weapon stat in the Ruins of Undermountain box set, but it might've just been under a blanket stat of improvised kobold weapons.

I'm not sure it ever was official that a severed rust monster antenna still retained its rusting powers, but I seem to remember it was in AD&D or OD&D. Or maybe just a popular house rule/in-joke.

And the rat-flail is from VG Cats. (http://www.vgcats.com/comics/?strip_id=110)


Hyenas are not dogs actual, they are related to moles or something similar I believe.

Huh, learn something new every day.

[hiryuu]

Kobolds that come out of nowhere, looked liked dogs, and had fire arrows. I prefer this version 110% to the 3.5 version of wanna be half-dragons. People wonder why I roll my eyes at every OMG KOBOLDS R SO UBER thread.

I hesitate to say how the things moved. I tell myself that they somehow hopped or skipped in the shadows of the flickering light as a seperate entity from the cave itself. They crouched as they moved, their crude implements providing another impedement to their lanky form. I think they were covered in a uniform color of rusty red-brown that glinted in the firelight, with scales like a reptile of the deep and the whipping, unrestful tail of a rat. In a moment, I felt their warm, tiny hands upon my face and arms, clutching me and dragging a rope across my hands, and through it all a chattering, irritable series of calls and echoes in the cavern reached my ears, and in my fear I swore it sounded as though they were laughing like children.

[Z-dan]

I remember the kobolds from the Suikoden games... they were very much canine, to the point that a couple of the characters that joined you literally looked like dogs standign on their hind legs...
They were also made a major race, given equal opportunities to- and constantly at war with- the elves and dwarves. From what I remember the ones you face as random encounters used what looked like rapiers as weapons- though I suppose they could be scorpions on sticks :smallbiggrin:

[Fhaolan]

Hi all,

Kobolds were described in the AD&D 1st edition Monster Manual as being 'dog-like but covered in scales'. I have been told, though I have no physical proof of this, that TSR licensed a third-party company translate the 1st edition stuff into Japanese for that market. The translated version of the MM either dropped, or de-emphasised the scales bit.

According to this theory, that is why if you see any D&D-based manga or anime (Such as 'Record of the Lodos Wars'), the Kobolds are usually drawn as goblin-sized anthropomorphic dogs or wolves.

[Matthew]

Hi all,

Kobolds were described in the AD&D 1st edition Monster Manual as being 'dog-like but covered in scales'. I have been told, though I have no physical proof of this, that TSR licensed a third-party company translate the 1st edition stuff into Japanese for that market. The translated version of the MM either dropped, or de-emphasised the scales bit.

According to this theory, that is why if you see any D&D-based manga or anime (Such as 'Record of the Lodos Wars'), the Kobolds are usually drawn as goblin-sized anthropomorphic dogs or wolves.

Not in the first edition Monster Manual. the description there is:


Description: The hide of kobolds runs from very dark rusty brawn to a rusty black. They have no hair. Their eyes are reddish and their small horns are tan to white. They favor red or orange garb. Kobolds live for up to 135 years.

However, the accompanying illustration is of a scale covered anthropomorphic dog like being. This has been widely reported as artistic interpretation/error. In the second edition Monster Manual the association with dogs was integrated into the text:


Kobolds are a cowardly, sadistic race of short humanoids that vigorously contest the human and demi-human races for living space and food. They especially dislike gnomes and attack them on sight. Barely clearing 3 feet in height, kobolds have scaly hides that range from dark, rusty brown to a rusty black. They smell of damp dogs and stagnant water. Their eyes glow like a bright red spark and they have two small horns ranging from tan to white. Because of the kobolds' fondness for wearing raggedy garb of red and orange, their non-prehensile rat-like tails, and their language (which sounds like small dogs yapping), these fell creatures are often not taken seriously. This is often a fatal mistake, for what they lack in size and strength they make up in ferocity and tenacity.

However, Kobolds as depicted in Elminster's Notebook are quite different (Dragon #216).

[Fhaolan]

Ah, I was misremembering based on the illustration.

Perhaps then the Japanese version the 1st edition MM had different illustrations?

[Mauril Everleaf]

I always thought that kobolds were a race of Chupacabras (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chupacabra#Appearance). I have a really hard time shaking this look, regardless of what the various Monster Manuals say.

[Matthew]

Ah, I was misremembering based on the illustration.

Perhaps then the Japanese version the 1st edition MM had different illustrations?

I think, the initial Japanese translation would be BEMCI, rather than first edition AD&D, though I know there were Japanese translations of second edition. Some of the art is definitely different, but I couldn't say as to details inside. In Moldvay Basic (1981), Kobolds are definitely described as "dog-like", and that is continued in the Rules Cyclopedia (1991).

http://home.flash.net/~brenfrow/jp/jp-basic.jpg http://home.flash.net/~brenfrow/jp/jp-expert.jpg

[Waspinator]

Warcraft Kobolds are covered in the Warcraft RPG Manual of Monsters, which is part of a third-party 3.5E line of Warcraft books. Make sure you don't get the ones that say "World of Warcraft" if you want compatibility with normal D&D.

Anyway, this kind of Kobold sounds like what you want:
http://img123.imageshack.us/img123/5023/koboldmggg6.jpg

[Neithan]

Oh, and a question for any german here: you call goblins kobolds, right? So what do you do to separate goblins and actual kobolds (in fantasy settings like D&D and Warcraft)?

We call the short green fantasy guys goblins. There's no real fixed idea how a Kobold would look like, but it's indeed probably somethink like a brownie.
Fantasy and fairy tale creatures are such a mess-up, we usually stick to how it's written and pronounce it like a german word, which is rarely a problem with english names, but probably sounds very silly to english speakers. :smallbiggrin:

(I didn't know the g in gnoll or gnome is not spoken. And you pronounce lich like "lytsh". That's hilarious. :smallbiggrin:)

[Mina Kobold]

We call the short green fantasy guys goblins. There's no real fixed idea how a Kobold would look like, but it's indeed probably somethink like a brownie.
Fantasy and fairy tale creatures are such a mess-up, we usually stick to how it's written and pronounce it like a german word, which is rarely a problem with english names, but probably sounds very silly to english speakers. :smallbiggrin:

(I didn't know the g in gnoll or gnome is not spoken. And you pronounce lich like "lytsh". That's hilarious. :smallbiggrin:)

Goblin is translated in Danish (I'm Danish) to the name of those elf's working for Santa Claus but also those house spirit thingys and garden Gnomes (they're mostly pictured either as garden gnomes or small humans with red hats) Kobolds mean nothing in Danish but it might just be the same as those Dwarf/gnome things it meant in German. Wierd huh?