Semi-Official Doctor who Thread Alpha

[turkishproverb]

I figured it was time for another of these, adn I did have a particular topic I wanted to star by talking about: What do YOU think is going on in "THE NEXT DOCTOR"?

I think thatDM's Doctor is fob watched into THINKING he is the doctor, when he is in fact another time lord, perhaps the Monk.

[Wraithy]

Yeah, we've practically been outright-told that the second doctor in the upcoming Christmas special isn't going to be the next doctor (they haven't actually said it, but in interviews people have always responded "maybe" when asked, which almost certainly means no).

[Z-dan]

I'm not sure what's happening, but I know he almost definitely isn't the NEXT doctor, maybe a couple of regens time?
But... I'll be sure to let you know in a couple of days :smallwink:

[Aidan305]

He's not the Monk. I can tell you that much.

The Monk is Patrick Stewart.

[Evil DM Mark3]

Well that is interesting. Posting while the episode is playing and all but no, not the Doctor, just a guy. Sweet TARDIS though.

[Lorn]

Giant steam and clockwork powered Cyberman! :smallbiggrin:
That is all.

[Kaelaroth]

Loved David Morrisey, really, really wanted him to become the new companion.
Disliked Rosita. Don't know why, particularly: maybe because she was to Rose-y. Perhaps? Or perhaps because she didn't actually do anything for the storyline.
Hated the giant cyberman. Just silly, really.
Like the CyberShades. They were cool - hope they show up, with some proper explanation as to what they were.
All in all, quite good.
Intrigued as to the title of the next special: Planet of the Dead. Zombies? :smalleek::smallconfused:

[Evil DM Mark3]

Steam Punk Real Robot Giant Mecha Cyberman? AWESOME. A little silly, rather scary, very destructive, disposed of with a wizz-bang-wallop. Pure Doctor Who. Also did anyone realise? Not only did the cybermen and Daleks war in the Void (meaning that in all likelihood some escaped like the cybermen) but at some point the Cybermen would have had to have committed a successful raid on a Dalek Battle computer. Serious bad ass points to the men in chrome!

[T-O-E]

He's not the Monk. I can tell you that much.

The Monk is Patrick Stewart.

Really? Do they hvae to keep bringing back Time-Lords? Kind of ruins the "I'm the last member of my species" thing that the doctor has.

[Dragor]

The only real thing which bugged me about the episode was

The enslavement of the children. Firstly, why in-show was it a logical reason to get loads of children to do the labour- surely an adult workforce would've done the job better and faster.

Secondly, it just seemed to be a pretty hamfisted "WOW THEY'RE WELL EVIL LETS USE LONG SHOTS OF THESE POOR BABES TOILING AWAY" to gain audience sympathy- like we didn't know the Cybermen and anyone associated with them in a favourable way are basically evil?

That's my only minor gripe. Otherwise, made me chuckle- just some very silly Doctor Who. What's not to like?

[Closet_Skeleton]

Really? Do they hvae to keep bringing back Time-Lords? Kind of ruins the "I'm the last member of my species" thing that the doctor has.

Yeah, but that very same "I'm the last member of my species" thing was crap from the first episode of the new series.

[Evil DM Mark3]

The only real thing which bugged me about the episode was

The enslavement of the children. Firstly, why in-show was it a logical reason to get loads of children to do the labour- surely an adult workforce would've done the job better and faster.Workhouse children are invisibles. If they go missing no one important enough to do anything will care. If adults start to vanish then someone will comment. Plus, as the episode shows, it is easy enough to get the children all in one place and, once working, they are less of a threat. No my gripe, even smaller than yours, was with that spiked ball that was in the machine's workings. A pendulum, ok that makes sence, by why spiked?

[Bryn]

Doctor Who + steampunk = win.

I wasn't expecting to like this one - recurring villains, plus a christmas special - so I was rather pleasantly surprised, all in all. Not a bad episode by any means.

[Evil DM Mark3]

Legs. On. Silent.

[Aidan305]

Makes you wonder why there are no contemporary accounts of a giant steampunk mechanoid terrorising london really.

[Kaelaroth]

Makes you wonder why there are no contemporary accounts of a giant steampunk mechanoid terrorising london really.

A wizard did it.

[Evil DM Mark3]

Makes you wonder why there are no contemporary accounts of a giant steampunk mechanoid terrorising london really.Whilst, for the most part (dinosaurs in london as the biggest expetion) the old series tried to maintain the "but no one was any the wiser and this could be real" feeling, the new series have adopted the "this is clearly not your word so there" attitude. In the SJA finale the brig even talks about publishing his memoirs now the general public know about alien invasions.

[Wraithy]

I found it more than a little bit strange when the crowd started cheering as their houses were on fire.


Whilst, for the most part (dinosaurs in london as the biggest expetion) the old series tried to maintain the "but no one was any the wiser and this could be real" feeling, the new series have adopted the "this is clearly not your word so there" attitude. In the SJA finale the brig even talks about publishing his memoirs now the general public know about alien invasions.

In all fairness, the Old School Dr. Who had things like Daleks invading London.

[T-O-E]

Really? Let me guess, either the Status Quo:
1. Killed off all witnesses.
Or
2. Had the Doctor go back in time to prevent the invasion from ever happening.

[Evil DM Mark3]

2. Had the Doctor go back in time to prevent the invasion from ever happening.Utterly impossible by the only rule ever adhered to constantly in Doctor Who (save for the gah get it off, get it off, it is eating my eyes Fox TV Movie). No do-overs.

[Darth Mario]

Utterly impossible by the only rule ever adhered to constantly in Doctor Who (save for the gah get it off, get it off, it is eating my eyes Fox TV Movie). No do-overs.

They tried it once, when Rose tried to save her dad. It nearly destroyed the universe.

[Haven]

Utterly impossible by the only rule ever adhered to constantly in Doctor Who (save for the gah get it off, get it off, it is eating my eyes Fox TV Movie). No do-overs.

Except for cheap laughs.

[Hermit]

Makes you wonder why there are no contemporary accounts of a giant steampunk mechanoid terrorising london really.

Maybe they all assumed it was just leftover from the Great Exhibition or something.

[Aidan305]

Maybe they all assumed it was just leftover from the Great Exhibition or something.

Now I'm reminded of the Anime Steamboy, which did have a giant city destroying machine at the exhibition.

I suppose that makes sense though, even if it is odd.

Maybe RTD is going to make something of it during season 5. Or Moffat in season 6.

[Aergoth]

Living in Canada= Sucks. We don't get the christmas specials. So we didn't get to see the sycorax, or the Starship Titanic (little shout out to DNA there.) Or Runaway Bride. Stupid stupidities.

[Evil DM Mark3]

Maybe RTD is going to make something of it during season 5. Or Moffat in season 6.

I think technically these specials are part of series 4.

[Starscream]

Overall I really liked this one. Much better than last year's special. Morrisey was great. Tennant ruled as always. The story was very character driven overall, and that's the thing that Doctor Who has always done better than most sci-fi series. Which is remarkable considering that the entire cast, title character included, is replaced every couple of years.

The giant clockwork Cyberman was silly but fun. I kept waiting for it to yell "Soo-Per-Man" in Vin Diesel's voice. The Cybershades were just plain ridiculous, but with the big budget the new series has by TV standards, I'm kind of assuming it was an homage to the original series, in which guys in stupid suits were the status quo.

Gotta love the shout out to every previous Doctor. Pure fanboy joy.

My only real complaint is that I've never really latched on to the new series Cybermen. They look fantastic, have great voices, etc. But I've always wanted the original Mondas Cybermen to return to the series, and seeing as this story takes place in the past it seems like they missed a perfectly good opportunity to use them.

The original Cybermen have invaded earth plenty of times in the past, and it seems that featuring them would been a lot simpler from a story perspective than wedging in the Cybus versions, which all relies on a glossed over line from the last series finale about the void being "dead". Then again, they'll probably use that same thing to explain the Dalek's next return, so maybe they're just thinking ahead.

Still, if that had used the Mondas Cybermen they could have then featured a new version of the Cybermats rather than the silly Cybershades. That would have been an improvement.

[psycojester]

The cybershade costumes looked awful, it looked exactly like what it was. a man in a gorilla costume wearing a plastic mask. Personally i think they should have just gone with hunched over people in ragged black robes with the riveted bras cybermasks the occasional piece of brass piping sticking out.

[Greg]

Does anyone think that the villain-ess had a bit of the master about her? "And you will obey me!"

[Evil DM Mark3]

Does anyone think that the villain-ess had a bit of the master about her? "And you will obey me!"Maybe but no, I don't think that what you are implying is true. Lots of people have that attitude.

[Kaelaroth]

Does anyone think that the villain-ess had a bit of the master about her? "And you will obey me!"

... If only... :smallfrown:

[Thiel]

Loved David Morrisey, really, really wanted him to become the new companion.
Disliked Rosita. Don't know why, particularly: maybe because she was to Rose-y. Perhaps? Or perhaps because she didn't actually do anything for the storyline.

I think the point is that she looks Rose-y and Martha-y for that matter. The "new" doctor is piecing together his personality from piecemeal so it makes sense for him to find a companion who looks like the ones he sorta remembers.

[Aergoth]

I think we'll run into Jenny again at some point. The whole "back from the dead" thing at the end of the episode means either A: Jenny is getting her own series (or could have (see back-door pilot) or B: we're going to see more of her later.
Maybe a Romana or Susan* replacement?
*Susan was the first doctors daughter. We're not entirely sure what exactly she was. If memory serves there was bits and pieces of continuity all over the place.

[Hopeless]

I figured it was time for another of these, adn I did have a particular topic I wanted to star by talking about: What do YOU think is going on in "THE NEXT DOCTOR"?

I think thatDM's Doctor is fob watched into THINKING he is the doctor, when he is in fact another time lord, perhaps the Monk.

Yes I wondered about that unfortunately no...

Please do not refer to the spoiler below unless you really want to as it reveals details you'd probably wouldn't want to know about...

The Cybermen stole dalek tech to escape the void including their info files on the doctor since they're the parallel version who have only met the tenth doctor, the infostamp or whatever they called it was used by DM to defeat the cybermen who tried to kill him (and I'm not saying what else was involved so you watch it to find out) but it backfired making him think he was the doctor mostly due to a specific trauma and since they didn't know better they though HE was the doctor and forgot about DT

[Hopeless]

The only real thing which bugged me about the episode was

The enslavement of the children. Firstly, why in-show was it a logical reason to get loads of children to do the labour- surely an adult workforce would've done the job better and faster.

Secondly, it just seemed to be a pretty hamfisted "WOW THEY'RE WELL EVIL LETS USE LONG SHOTS OF THESE POOR BABES TOILING AWAY" to gain audience sympathy- like we didn't know the Cybermen and anyone associated with them in a favourable way are basically evil?

That's my only minor gripe. Otherwise, made me chuckle- just some very silly Doctor Who. What's not to like?

They did it because
they could feasible escape attention doing so since their other attempts led to them running into the Next Doctor and this was an easier way of recruiting a workforce that in its day wasn't as untoward as you'd think. What I want to know is how they hid that oversized mecha underneath London without anyone knowing?
Did torchwood use the area they cleared out as their eventual base?
Oh and I doubt the daleks let them just get away with that tech it wouldn't surprise me if they used them as guinea pigs to find a way to escape themselves...

Read the rest of the thread the earlier answer makes more sense than mine!
Cheers!

[Starscream]

*Susan was the first doctors daughter. We're not entirely sure what exactly she was. If memory serves there was bits and pieces of continuity all over the place.

Granddaughter. And while fans over the years have at times been set against the idea of the Doctor having been romantically involved with anyone at any point in his existence, the new series seems determined to change this with characters like Rose, Martha, Madame de Pompadour, and River Song.

Heck, pretty much any female character who encounters him these days seems to fall madly in love with him*. Donna was a refreshing exception.

And Ten has flatly stated that he "was a dad once". He also once said that things often don't happen to him in the right order due to his time travel, and that his can be confusing "especially at weddings. Especially my own."

So, barring any extremely bizarre circumstances (and its hard to find a show that loves bizarre circumstances more) it seems that he did at one point have children, and that Susan is therefore probably really his granddaughter.



*Truth in television, as any of my female friends I introduce to the show does the same. And with Captain Jack as well. C'mon, that guy must have a hundred types of space STD by now.

[Mc. Lovin']

Just watched it, and I loved the "new" doctor, I wish he really was the 13th one :smallsigh:

And it looks like he's not going to have companions? I doubt it, but what he said seemed pretty final to me.

[factotum]

Does anyone think that the villain-ess had a bit of the master about her? "And you will obey me!"

No, I don't. She wouldn't have died so easily if she were the Master, and she wouldn't have been so stupid as to fall for the Cybermen's trick in the first place.

[Aidan305]

Just watched it, and I loved the "new" doctor, I wish he really was the 13th one :smallsigh:

And it looks like he's not going to have companions? I doubt it, but what he said seemed pretty final to me.

Don't you mean 11th/12th (I'm still not sure what number we're on at the moment. The final episode of the last series really messed up the count.)

[Evil DM Mark3]

Don't you mean 11th/12th (I'm still not sure what number we're on at the moment. The final episode of the last series really messed up the count.)The official answer (I think) is "Still ten."

[Keris]

The official answer (I think) is "Still ten."

Well then the official answer is wrong.:smalltongue: (kinda)

We are on the tenth doctor, but because of the "false" regeneration, has a maximum of 11 "true" regenerations now. Ignoring the possibility that he regenerated before William Hartnell, we get two more doctors before they have to come up with a plausible way for him to get more regenerations. And since Tennant isn't sticking around for season 5...

[Evil DM Mark3]

Well then the official answer is wrong.:smalltongue: (kinda)

We are on the tenth doctor, but because of the "false" regeneration, has a maximum of 11 "true" regenerations now.Or not. Does a regeneration happen when it starts or when it ends? How is this related to the healing coma that Time Lords use?
Ignoring the possibility that he regenerated before William Hartnell, we get two more doctors before they have to come up with a plausible way for him to get more regenerations.1: No he didn't (the "morbious doctors" are not The Doctor, it is one of the few word of gods that has not been quibbled later) 2: Do you really think they are going not to? Getting new regenerations is not that hard (the Master has had 27 lives to date, his original 13, 12 more regenerations he was given in the 5 doctors and at least 2 further lives after returning from the dead for the time war) and may well be a learned thing or a tech thing rather than a truly biological function. Otherwise how could they give them?

[Keris]

Or not. Does a regeneration happen when it starts or when it ends? How is this related to the healing coma that Time Lords use?
I'm assuming you're referring to the regenerations when you saw "Healing coma", unless this is something else I'm not aware of.
In episode 13 of the new season 4, The Doctor attempts to explain how he avoided regenerated, saying:
"To stop the [regeneration] energy going all the way, I siphoned off the rest into a handy bio-matching receptacle, namely, my hand, that hand there, my handy spare hand!"
This implies that a regeneration was used up.

1: No he didn't (the "morbious doctors" are not The Doctor, it is one of the few word of gods that has not been quibbled later) 2: Do you really think they are going not to? Getting new regenerations is not that hard (the Master has had 27 lives to date, his original 13, 12 more regenerations he was given in the 5 doctors and at least 2 further lives after returning from the dead for the time war) and may well be a learned thing or a tech thing rather than a truly biological function. Otherwise how could they give them?
Having looked further into it, I agree that William Hartnell was the First Doctor, but we still only have two incarnations left. The Master was granted a second set of regenerations by the High Council of Gallifrey, and possibly a third to assist in the Time War.
However, the Doctor currently claims to be the last surviving Time Lord, and until the Master or another Time Lord returns, we must assume this is the case. No High Council exists to give the Doctor more regenerations, so he will have to find another source.

[Evil DM Mark3]

I'm assuming you're referring to the regenerations when you saw "Healing coma", unless this is something else I'm not aware of.A few times the Doctor has gone into a healing coma to heal injuries that would have killed him. It is used maybe two or three times at most.

In episode 13 of the new season 4, The Doctor attempts to explain how he avoided regenerated, saying:
"To stop the [regeneration] energy going all the way, I siphoned off the rest into a handy bio-matching receptacle, namely, my hand, that hand there, my handy spare hand!"
This implies that a regeneration was used up.I know. This is part of the reason the episodes annoyed me, it is left vauge.

[turkishproverb]

Loved David Morrisey, really, really wanted him to become the new companion.
Disliked Rosita. Don't know why, particularly: maybe because she was to Rose-y. Perhaps? Or perhaps because she didn't actually do anything for the storyline.
Hated the giant cyberman. Just silly, really.
Like the CyberShades. They were cool - hope they show up, with some proper explanation as to what they were.
All in all, quite good.
Intrigued as to the title of the next special: Planet of the Dead. Zombies? :smalleek::smallconfused:

Lol, at least you in the UK were about to "Officially" see it. I liked the cybershades too. Until the cyberking showed up, I suspected they were all the cybermen could make with the low tech of the era.

Planet of the Dead...

What planet, important to the doctor, died....

I wonder if it could be....

no...

[Starscream]

Or not. Does a regeneration happen when it starts or when it ends? How is this related to the healing coma that Time Lords use? 1: No he didn't (the "morbious doctors" are not The Doctor, it is one of the few word of gods that has not been quibbled later) 2: Do you really think they are going not to? Getting new regenerations is not that hard (the Master has had 27 lives to date, his original 13, 12 more regenerations he was given in the 5 doctors and at least 2 further lives after returning from the dead for the time war) and may well be a learned thing or a tech thing rather than a truly biological function. Otherwise how could they give them?

I'm assuming a regeneration isn't "final" until the process is totally complete. Exhibit A is Romana: Are we to believe she used up half a dozen of her lives just for fun? She is always referred to as "Romana I" or "Romana II", suggesting that Lalla Ward's portrayal was her official second incarnation, and that none of the bodies she tried on between them counts.

Besides, if the writers want a 13th Doctor we'll get one. It's not as if they are going to end the entire franchise because of a technicality. Heck, I'll be surprised if they stop at thirteen. If the Master can be given new lives, than we know it's possible. How they do it is up to them. Someday my grandchildren with be watching the adventures of the 30th Doctor, gods willing.

[turkishproverb]

Yes I wondered about that unfortunately no...

Please do not refer to the spoiler below unless you really want to as it reveals details you'd probably wouldn't want to know about...

The Cybermen stole dalek tech to escape the void including their info files on the doctor since they're the parallel version who have only met the tenth doctor, the infostamp or whatever they called it was used by DM to defeat the cybermen who tried to kill him (and I'm not saying what else was involved so you watch it to find out) but it backfired making him think he was the doctor mostly due to a specific trauma and since they didn't know better they though HE was the doctor and forgot about DT


Yea, I noticed. Ah, well, not that bad.


Well then the official answer is wrong.:smalltongue: (kinda)

We are on the tenth doctor, but because of the "false" regeneration, has a maximum of 11 "true" regenerations now. Ignoring the possibility that he regenerated before William Hartnell, we get two more doctors before they have to come up with a plausible way for him to get more regenerations. And since Tennant isn't sticking around for season 5...


1. That assumes that counted as a regeneration
2. Time lords do inf act have 13 regenerations, not 12, however there are only 13 incarnations, so the 13th regeneration normally would just kill them anyway. In the doctors case, however, since he used one without using up an incarnation......


Or not. Does a regeneration happen when it starts or when it ends? How is this related to the healing coma that Time Lords use? 1: No he didn't (the "morbious doctors" are not The Doctor, it is one of the few word of gods that has not been quibbled later) 2: Do you really think they are going not to? Getting new regenerations is not that hard (the Master has had 27 lives to date, his original 13, 12 more regenerations he was given in the 5 doctors and at least 2 further lives after returning from the dead for the time war) and may well be a learned thing or a tech thing rather than a truly biological function. Otherwise how could they give them?


Pre 1: See what I said.
1: I always liked the idea the morbius doctors were potential future incarnations brought in rather than past ones.
2: Actually, Rossolin limited the Time Lords regenerations, it was somehow policed by the time lords, so logically it would be unlimited once the time lords were gone.


I'm assuming you're referring to the regenerations when you saw "Healing coma", unless this is something else I'm not aware of.
In episode 13 of the new season 4, The Doctor attempts to explain how he avoided regenerated, saying:
"To stop the [regeneration] energy going all the way, I siphoned off the rest into a handy bio-matching receptacle, namely, my hand, that hand there, my handy spare hand!"
This implies that a regeneration was used up.

Or it implies he avoided using it up.

Besides which 13 regenerations, but only 13 incarnations


Having looked further into it, I agree that William Hartnell was the First Doctor, but we still only have two incarnations left. The Master was granted a second set of regenerations by the High Council of Gallifrey, and possibly a third to assist in the Time War.
However, the Doctor currently claims to be the last surviving Time Lord, and until the Master or another Time Lord returns, we must assume this is the case. No High Council exists to give the Doctor more regenerations, so he will have to find another source.

Alternatively, they no longer exist to enforce the "ONLY 13" rule.