There Are No Dump Stats [Feats]

[Miles Invictus]

Most classes have dump stats. For example, your typical fighter will leave Wisdom and Charisma by the wayside, and your typical wizard generally ignores Strength. Theoretically, all abilities should be useful to all classes -- but if all abilities were useful, dump stats would not exist.

These feats are the start of what could be called a personal project of mine. I intend to devise a collection of feats, skill uses, and house rules that encourage unorthodox builds and unique ability combinations. I only have Core resources at my disposal, so there may be some overlap between my contributions and splatbooks. I expect these feats are a bit more powerful than normal. I find this acceptable, as the prerequisites require investments in areas that are typically ignored.

So...what does everyone think?

Armored Arcanist (General)
You have learned to cast spells in lighter armors.
Prerequisites: Str 15, Base Attack Bonus +1
Benefit: Your arcane spell failure chance is reduced by 15%. This only applies to armor – arcane spell failure from another source (including shields) is not reduced.
Special: Any class that ignores arcane spell failure in light armor counts as having this feat.

Armored Arcanist, Greater (General)
You have learned to cast spells in medium armors.
Prerequisites: Str 17, Base Attack Bonus +4, Armored Arcanist
Benefit: Your arcane spell failure chance is reduced by another 15% (to a total of 30%). This only applies to armor – arcane spell failure from another source (including shields) is not reduced.

Armored Arcanist, Perfect (General)
You have learned to cast spells in the heaviest armors.
Prerequisites: Str 19, Base Attack Bonus +8, Greater Armored Arcanist
Benefit: Your arcane spell failure chance is reduced by 15% (to a total of 45%). This only applies to armor – arcane spell failure from another source (including shields) is not reduced.

Eldritch Combat Training (General)
You have learned to balance your martial and magical talents.
Prerequisites: Str 15, BAB 1, spellcasting as a class ability.
Benefit: Gain +1 BAB, spells known, and spells per day as if you gained a level in one of your spellcasting classes. If you have more than one spellcasting class, you may choose which one to progress. This feat will not grant you BAB or spellcasting progression above your character level. (For example, a single-classed Wizard will gain the BAB benefits of this feat, but not the spellcasting ones.) This feat can be taken multiple times. The effects stack, though they will not surpass the limits mentioned above.
Special: Any class with a good base attack bonus or spellcasting progression may select this as a bonus feat.

Exploit Opening (General)
When aided by an ally, you take full advantage of the situation.
Prerequisites: Int 15
Benefit: When at least one ally is using Aid Another on you in combat, add your Int bonus to attack or AC (your choice). This bonus only applies against the enemy your ally is aiding you against. This bonus stacks with other Int-related bonuses, as well as with the effects of Aid Another.
Normal: When an ally aids you, you get a +2 to attack or AC vs. a specific enemy.
Special: Any class with a good base attack bonus may select this as a bonus feat.

Grapple Casting (General)
You excel at casting while grappled.
Prerequisites: Str 15, Eschew Materials
Benefit: Whenever you cast a single-target spell against a foe you are grappling with, you may ignore that spell's somatic component, and you do not need to make a Concentration check to cast the spell.
Normal: While in a grapple, you cannot cast spells with somatic components, you must have the needed material components or focuses in hand, and you must make a Concentration check to avoid losing the spell.

Indomitable Spirit (General)
You are resistant to magical compulsion.
Prerequisites: Cha 13
Benefit: Add your Cha modifier to all saving throw versus charms and compulsions. This does not stack with other Cha-based bonuses to saves. (e.g. Paladin's Divine Grace, Blackguard's Dark Blessing)
Special: Any class with a good base attack bonus may select this as a bonus feat.

Protective Strike (General)
You get attacks of opportunity against enemies who threaten nearby allies.
Prerequisites: Wis 15, Base Attack Bonus +4
Benefit: Whenever an enemy attacks one of your allies (not you), they provoke a special attack of opportunity – a protective strike – from you. You can only make one protective strike on a particular enemy per round.
Normal: Enemy attacks do not provoke attacks of opportunity.
Special: Any class with a good base attack bonus may select this as a bonus feat.

Protective Interference (General)
Your protective strikes disrupt enemy attacks.
Prerequisites: Wis 15, Base Attack Bonus +8, Protective Strike
Benefit: If you successfully hit an enemy with a protective strike, they must make a concentration check (DC 10 + damage dealt) or their attack fails.
Normal: Protective strikes do not interrupt enemy attacks.
Special: Any class with a good base attack bonus may select this as a bonus feat.

Provoke (General)
Entice an enemy into making attacks of opportunity on you.
Prerequisite: Cha 15
Benefit: As a swift action during your round, you may attempt to provoke one enemy who can threaten you with an attack of opportunity. Your target must make a Will save (DC 10 + ½ character level + Cha modifier). If your target fails, they must make an attack of opportunity against you, and are unable to make attacks of opportunity against any other creature until the beginning of their next round.
Normal: Enemies may make attacks of opportunity against anyone they wish.
Special: Any class with a good base attack bonus may select this as a bonus feat.

[Jack_Simth]

All abilities ARE important.

Strength, while more important to combat, is also carrying capacity (before the Handy Haversack, anyway). A Wizard is going to need some to carry around all those scrolls he needs to have on hand (I've got a Sorcerer who rolled a 5 on 4d6 DL; it's in Strength - I know about carrying capacity).

Dex is touch AC and reflex saves. The Fighter can afford to crimp it a little (12 or so) if he plans on full plate, as can the Paladin... but NOBODY wants to be without touch AC when there's a Wizard or Sorcerer around.

Con is HP and Fort saves. Everyone needs it.

Intelligence is skill points. Not having a language among the party that your opponents lack is annoying. The Fighter probably wants Ride at some point. And Jump. And Swim. Oh, and Intelligence is required for Combat Expertiese....

Wisdom is Will saves. No fighter can afford to be without a good Will save. Nor Barbarian, Ranger, or Rogue.

Charisma is social interaction - while it doesn't come up much (just due to the nature of most games), it's still there. If the DM throws a few social encounters the party's way, it's not a dump stat. Otherwse, it is.

However, some aspects of these are less important to one character build (not class!) than another - the front-line tank who's fine with being less intelligent than than the Wizard's Familiar can dump Intelligence. He'll never pick up Combat Expertiese, Improved Disarm, Improved Feint, Improved Trip, or Whirlwind attack (all require Int 13), but he can do without a high Int. And losing Combat Expertiese is a big hit to a tank (it's AC - Dodge AC - stacks with everything - and he can use the touch AC).

A Wizard can take less strength ... but he's going to want a little carrying capacity if something should happen to his donkey/extradimensional storeage (unless he implicity trusts the Fighter/Barbarian pack mule, of course....) or if he likes to rest in extradimensional spaces.

And so forth.

People "dump" the stat that's least important to their build - the Paladin-2/Fighter X doesn't dump Charisma - he wants that Divine Grace. Really Nice Feats don't change this. It's like Combat Expertise. Not everyone will have it; it's really useful, but there can be more important things to a build. This may be because they're shaving points for other places; this may be because they had a low roll.

The feats are nice, sure.... but they're like Combat Expertiese - they'll only be taken if someone wants that build. Stats will still be "dumped" as there's only so many points/a specific set of rolls. Sure, Eldritch Combat Training makes the Paladin-2/Sorcerer-6/Edritch Knight X rock (well, assuming that it's taken four times.... and applies to Spells Known, too), add the first two Armored Casting feats, and you've got a terror at 20th. But he hardly needs Dex at all. Assuming he's in +X Mithral Fullplate, he needs no more than about a +3 Dex modifier. At 20th, +6 Gauntlets of Dexterity and a +2 Manual of Quickness of Action let him get away with a base Dex of 8, while still getting the full Maximum Dex bonus for his armor.

This won't get rid of the "problem".

[Cybren]

i'd recommmend Eldritch Combat Training give an unnamed bonus to attack that can't exceed the difference between your BAB and character level.

[Fizban]

Entagled Casting could be reworded:
I'd name it Grapple Casting, and "you may ignore the somatic components of touch and single target offensive spells while grappling".

[Miles Invictus]

It's a good two weeks later, but I renamed Grapple Casting and tried to clarify a few of the feat descriptions.

Fizban: Good call.

Cybren: I intend for it to count as BAB for feat and PrC requirements. I'm hoping it encourages a little bit more warrior/spellcaster multiclassing and a little less "OMG LOST SPELLCASTING PROGRESSION!!1!"

Jack Simth: In principle, I agree with you completely. In practice, my Fighter doesn't care about anything but Str, Dex, and Con, and my Wizard doesn't care about anything but Int, Dex, and Con. Why? Because there's not enough incentive for me to invest in a high Wisdom or Charisma. Yes, Wisdom improves my Will saves, but what gets rolled more -- attack/damage rolls, or saving throws? As I said, I agree with you in principle, but in practice, I know what stats I'm going to invest in, and which stats I'm going to ignore.

That's why I'm doing this. I want to provide a mechanical incentive to try new builds and new stat arrangements.

For example:
Between the Protective Strike chain and Provoke, a high-Wis/high-Cha Fighter can become an effective battlefield control unit, simply by planting himself next to the squishies and disrupting anyone who tries to attack them.
By investing in Armored Arcanist and Eldritch Combat Training, the Eldritch Knight becomes a more viable PrC.
Eldritch Combat Training and Grapple Casting make a Sorcerer/Monk hybrid dangerous, even with low-level spells like Shocking Grasp, Chill Touch, and Ray of Enfeeblement.

[fangthane]

Armored Arcanist (General)
You have learned to cast spells in lighter armors.
Prerequisites: Str 15, Base Attack Bonus +1
Benefit: Your arcane spell failure chance is reduced by 15%. This only applies to armor – arcane spell failure from another source (including shields) is not reduced.
Special: Any class that ignores arcane spell failure in light armor counts as having this feat.

Too powerful to allow just anyone to take at first level; the ability to cast without light armor penalty is a class feature currently associated only with a bare handful of classes and deliberately so. I'd change it to be the same effect as the class feature (no penalty for light armor) granted to bards and warlocks, but warlocks are weak and bards are unable to take Silent spells, so I'd also give it a minimum of +5 base attack as a prerequisite.


Armored Arcanist, Greater (General)
You have learned to cast spells in medium armors.
Prerequisites: Str 17, Base Attack Bonus +4, Armored Arcanist
Benefit: Your arcane spell failure chance is reduced by another 15% (to a total of 30%). This only applies to armor – arcane spell failure from another source (including shields) is not reduced.

Armored Arcanist, Perfect (General)
You have learned to cast spells in the heaviest armors.
Prerequisites: Str 19, Base Attack Bonus +8, Greater Armored Arcanist
Benefit: Your arcane spell failure chance is reduced by 15% (to a total of 45%). This only applies to armor – arcane spell failure from another source (including shields) is not reduced.

I'd remove these two entirely and use the Battle Armor feat from Complete Arcane (bumps the weight of armor by one category, can't be taken twice) which allows a caster to use medium armor with no penalty, in combination with the first feat. On no account should heavy armor's arcane casting penalty be removed, except potentially for a class with a seriously limited spell selection.



Eldritch Combat Training (General)
You have learned to balance your martial and magical talents.
Prerequisites: Str 15, BAB 1, spellcasting as a class ability.
Benefit: Gain +1 BAB, spells known, and spells per day as if you gained a level in one of your spellcasting classes. If you have more than one spellcasting class, you may choose which one to progress. This feat will not grant you BAB or spellcasting progression above your character level. (For example, a single-classed Wizard will gain the BAB benefits of this feat, but not the spellcasting ones.) This feat can be taken multiple times. The effects stack, though they will not surpass the limits mentioned above.
Special: Any class with a good base attack bonus or spellcasting progression may select this as a bonus feat.

I like this one - similar to practised caster (or whatever that one's called) which allows you to raise your caster level as a multi-class caster. Are the benefits retroactive? (i.e. if a single-class wizard takes it, then takes a level of fighter, can he then apply the level of casting ability, or is it set at the time it's taken?)


Grapple Casting (General)
You excel at casting while grappled.
Prerequisites: Str 15, Eschew Materials
Benefit: Whenever you cast a single-target spell against a foe you are grappling with, you may ignore that spell's somatic component, and you do not need to make a Concentration check to cast the spell.
Normal: While in a grapple, you cannot cast spells with somatic components, you must have the needed material components or focuses in hand, and you must make a Concentration check to avoid losing the spell.

I'd make this more like combat casting; give a +4 to concentration checks made while grappled, and allow somatic components to be incorporated while grappled.


Indomitable Spirit (General)
You are resistant to magical compulsion.
Prerequisites: Cha 13
Benefit: Add your Cha modifier to all saving throw versus charms and compulsions. This does not stack with other Cha-based bonuses to saves. (e.g. Paladin's Divine Grace, Blackguard's Dark Blessing)
Special: Any class with a good base attack bonus may select this as a bonus feat.

I'd just make this an enhancement bonus; stacking solved.


Protective Interference (General)
Your protective strikes disrupt enemy attacks.
Prerequisites: Wis 15, Base Attack Bonus +8, Protective Strike
Benefit: If you successfully hit an enemy with a protective strike, they must make a concentration check (DC 10 + damage dealt) or their attack fails.
Normal: Protective strikes do not interrupt enemy attacks.
Special: Any class with a good base attack bonus may select this as a bonus feat.

Seems awfully potent to be able to force concentration checks on classes which don't normally have to make any check at all. Instead, I'd change this to impose a -2 penalty to their attack, rather than completely eliminating it.


Provoke (General)
Entice an enemy into making attacks of opportunity on you.
Prerequisite: Cha 15
Benefit: As a swift action during your round, you may attempt to provoke one enemy who can threaten you with an attack of opportunity. Your target must make a Will save (DC 10 + ½ character level + Cha modifier). If your target fails, they must make an attack of opportunity against you, and are unable to make attacks of opportunity against any other creature until the beginning of their next round.
Normal: Enemies may make attacks of opportunity against anyone they wish.
Special: Any class with a good base attack bonus may select this as a bonus feat.
This would promote more varied character builds if you were to change it such that it's a bluff opposed by a sense motive. Hardly anyone ever uses those skills in earnest.

[Jack_Simth]

Jack Simth: In principle, I agree with you completely. In practice, my Fighter doesn't care about anything but Str, Dex, and Con, and my Wizard doesn't care about anything but Int, Dex, and Con. Why? Because there's not enough incentive for me to invest in a high Wisdom or Charisma. Yes, Wisdom improves my Will saves, but what gets rolled more -- attack/damage rolls, or saving throws? As I said, I agree with you in principle, but in practice, I know what stats I'm going to invest in, and which stats I'm going to ignore.This method doesn't really change that.

The Fighter will still have Str, Dex, and Con as his big three. Okay, if he's got a spare 15 he might put it into Int for Exploit Opening - but then, he might do that anyway for Combat Expertise and the ensuing chain. He might put it into Wis for Protective Strike - but then, he might do that anyway for the +2 to Will saves, spot checks, and Listen checks so he's not completly owned by Charm Person and has at least some chance of spotting the Rogue or Ranger trying to sneak up on him. He might put it into Charisma for Indomitable Spirit - but then, he might put it into Charisma anyway for Intimidation checks; also, if he puts it into Wisdom, instead, he gets the bonus to saves without having to spend a feat on it (and it applies to more saves).

The Wizard will still have Int, Dex, and Con as his big three. Okay, if he's got a spare 15 he might put it into Str for Armored Casting.... but then, he might put it into Str for the carrying capacity anyway. He's honestly more likely to put it into Wis for Will saves, or Charisma for such things as Charm Person or Planar Binding.

But in either case, it's only going to be if they've got a spare good roll. And if they've got a spare good roll, they'll put it somewhere other than their big three anyway.

Someone who rolls an 8 still has little reason not to play a half-orc fighter and put it in Charisma or Int - no readily accessible racial bonus is going to let him qualify for anything anyway, and no matter where he puts it, there's a tree he can't access; he's going to be good at the Fighter's specialty (Str, Dex, Con), and poor at the rest. Anyone semi-optimizing mechanics will prioritize stats, and assign rolls accordingly. Additional feats that depend on little-used stats, while nice for the min-maxer who wants to build a better gish, won't do what you seem to wish - keep the Half-orc from putting his low roll into either intelligence or Charisma, where he has a racial penalty.

[Mr._Blinky]

Eldritch Combat Training (General)
You have learned to balance your martial and magical talents.
Prerequisites: Str 15, BAB 1, spellcasting as a class ability.
Benefit: Gain +1 BAB, spells known, and spells per day as if you gained a level in one of your spellcasting classes. If you have more than one spellcasting class, you may choose which one to progress. This feat will not grant you BAB or spellcasting progression above your character level. (For example, a single-classed Wizard will gain the BAB benefits of this feat, but not the spellcasting ones.) This feat can be taken multiple times. The effects stack, though they will not surpass the limits mentioned above.
Special: Any class with a good base attack bonus or spellcasting progression may select this as a bonus feat.


Sorry, but you never want to give BAB as part of a feat. Just don't do it. Because of how integral it is to getting into things like PrCs, it is SO easy to break. It allows you to get into classes many levels before you're supposed to. I know there are several PrCs that you're supposed to be multi-classed for, and have both casting and BAB requirements. This feat would allow you to get into the brokenly early, since they are balanced so that you can't get into them till a later level.

[Miles Invictus]

fangthane:
For Armored Arcanist, the Base Attack requirement means only martial classes can take it at first level, and there are no Core martial classes that cast spells at first level. Thus, if you take it before 3rd level, you've got less than 100% spellcasting progression. Incidentally, this feat is actually worse than the Bard special ability, since a Chain Shirt (light armor) has 20% ASF.

Regarding the suggestion that I remove the Greater/Perfect versions...I wrote these with Core in mind, so the Battle Armor feat is irrelevant. That said, you may have a point about heavy armor. However, I think any wizard who can build his strength up to 19 is either a very good roller or has sacrificed a lot of spellcasting prowess in order to get Armored Arcanist, and deserves the spoils. Besides, one Ray of Enfeeblement will screw him over, since he can't cast in armor anymore (you can't use a feat you don't meet the requirements for!), and he'll take forever to remove his armor, and if he has a high enough Strength that Enfeeblement doesn't drop him below 19, that's your fault as a DM, for letting him roll/buy such ungodly stats. (Seriously, that'd be a...what? 26-30 Strength? For a spellcaster?! I suppose you could roll up a Minotaur wizard, and aim for an 18 Str before racial adjustments...but with a -4 Int, -2 Cha, and +2 LA, just how much spellcasting are you gonna do?)

Eldritch Combat Training is meant to be retroactive -- you always have the benefits, they just happen to be capped at your character level. I'm thinking this might be a bit too powerful, though.

Grapple Casting...the idea is that a high-strength Wizard can cast spells on anyone he grapples with, without penalty. I don't think this is necessarily overpowered, since wizards are helpless in a grapple anyway. Then again, wizards already win at D&D...eh, I'll keep it the way it is, unless I get more criticism about it.

Indomitable Spirit...I don't want it to stack with those special class abilities, but I do want it to stack with everything else. Otherwise, those points are better invested into Wisdom, which applies to everything.

Protective Interference. You've got a point, but I don't think a -2 penalty is enough to justify it as a feat, since Aid Another works against the exact same targets, provides the exact same effect (+2 AC vs. that enemy's next attack), and doesn't require a feat. How about making it a Will save, DC 10 + ½ character level + Wis modifier? At worst, a 10 Wis Fighter still has about a 25-33% chance of making the save.

Provoke...this is intended to be a Fighter-type feat. No Core martial class has Bluff as a class skill. Also, if I based this on Bluff, I'd suggest it as a house rule instead of a feat, since I consider skill points to be enough of a price to pay. (Incidentally, I think the feinting in combat rules are shifted towards the defender; for me to consider them balanced, the defender would need a penalty to their check, probably between -2 and -5.)

Jack_Simth:
Well, I do have to admit that this isn't going to convince every Fighter to raise Int, Wis, and Cha. But it does make it a bit more tempting to invest points in those stats, doesn't it?

(Incidentally, I can't imagine a Fighter using Intimidate. Combatwise, you're sacrificing all of your attacks in order to reduce an enemy's attack by -2. That's great, if you're trying to capture him...except that subdual damage is quicker and easier. I suppose you could try out-of-combat Intimidation, but Diplomacy is better -- it has an easier DC, and your opponent doesn't get pissed after you leave.)

Mr. Blinky: I understand that, but I believe the fact it never surpasses the character's level would mitigate that -- especially since no character can take it until level 3, and you generally enter PrCs around level 5-7. Whether you go Fighter 7 or Fighter 6/Wizard 1 with Eldritch Combat Training, you still need at least 7 levels to reach Dwarven Defender. It's really only going to affect PrCs that require both a high BAB and high-level spells, and even then -- you're spending precious, precious feats to get into a PrC a few levels early.

Though...in retrospect, it's got problems -- namely that it's far better than, say, Weapon Focus, since the attack bonus applies to everything. Only a single-classed martial character has a reason to take Weapon Focus over this. What if it only did spellcasting progression OR attack bonus progression?

[Jack_Simth]

Jack_Simth:
Well, I do have to admit that this isn't going to convince every Fighter to raise Int, Wis, and Cha. But it does make it a bit more tempting to invest points in those stats, doesn't it?

Only mildly so. Still won't get rid of dump stats, which is what you're theoretically after. They're more likely to come up in 4d6 dl, arrange to suit, when there's a spare roll. Otherwise, that 15 for Protective Strike costs you, oh, a point of HP or two a level. Or a point or two of AC. Or a point or two of attack/damage. Et cetera.


(Incidentally, I can't imagine a Fighter using Intimidate. Combatwise, you're sacrificing all of your attacks in order to reduce an enemy's attack by -2. That's great, if you're trying to capture him...except that subdual damage is quicker and easier. I suppose you could try out-of-combat Intimidation, but Diplomacy is better -- it has an easier DC, and your opponent doesn't get pissed after you leave.)

It actually takes two or three Intimidation monkeys to pull off properly, but fear effects stack - Shaken + Shaken = Frightened, Frightened + Shaken = Panicked. A Rogue and Fighter, working together, can force many things to run away. If you give one or both a Familiar (which has it's master's ranks) there's a much better chance. It's a viable strategy.

[Yossarian]

It actually takes two or three Intimidation monkeys to pull off properly, but fear effects stack - Shaken + Shaken = Frightened, Frightened + Shaken = Panicked. A Rogue and Fighter, working together, can force many things to run away. If you give one or both a Familiar (which has it's master's ranks) there's a much better chance. It's a viable strategy.

Not so much, no. It's an effective strategy within an enormously limited niche--your Rogue and Fighter spend both their actions one round, and if they both succeed they partially incapacitate a single enemy for that round and that round only. Spending two actions to possibly negate a single enemy action is generally not going to be a winning proposition. If you're specifically trying to intimidate someone, then (duh) it works. In terms of general combat effectiveness? Nuh-uh.

I mean, look at trip or disarm. Even if your ultimate goal in an encounter is not specifically to knock someone down or remove their weapon, trip and disarm can still be very effective tools for general beatdown purposes. Intimidate does not compare.

And you realize Intimidate has size modifiers, right? Familiars are all Tiny animals with low charisma scores. I'm sure they would be absolutely terrifying if you were fighting, say, ants, but even a Small opponent is just going to laugh at your familiar's attempts at intimidation.

[Jack_Simth]

Yossarian:
It's a situational tactic, granted. But all it really costs are skill ranks from two or more characters... who have it as a class skill. So it isn't effective against that dragon over there (but it's really effective for a family of dragons....) but it can work well against, say, that opposing humanoid Fighter/wizard/sorcerer/whatever with no Sense Motive.

Sure, the familars have a nasty penalty... but it does give the opponent a chance to flub the opposed roll.

[Yossarian]

All it costs are skill ranks, and completely tying up all the actions of two party members just to momentarily delay the bad guy. Compared to grappling, tripping, disarming, or just whacking them repeatedly, it's horribly ineffective.

Incidentally, Intimidate is resisted by a level check + Wisdom modifier + applicable save bonuses vs. fear--Sense Motive doesn't enter into it. If you're fighting a single humanoid opponent, chances are they're 2 or 3 levels above you. Since your skill cap is 3 above your level, this means that you're looking at a roughly 50/50 chance of success per attempt if your Cha is equal to their Wis.

[Jack_Simth]

Forcing them to actually run away with no magic can definatly be worth it, though.

Especially if you have reason to want them alive later.

[Miles Invictus]

Except it doesn't force them to run away. Combat intimidation only works for one round. Assuming all three of your terror monkeys pull it off, your target flees for one round. Then they come back and start fighting again.

You basically trade three of your actions for one of your enemy's. It's not cost-effective, when there are other ways to neutralize a foe without burning so many resources: saps, non-lethal damage, and grappling, to name three that don't need more than one person to do, and don't even require skill points to be effective.

Combat intimidation might (might) be worthwhile if it were a swift action. But in place of a full attack, or an attack & move? No. Definitely not worth it.