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afroakuma
2009-01-29, 10:18 PM
Alright, I have a four-level sorcerer that I want to improve. I thought about taking a one-level dip in duskblade (for the HD, Fort bonus and the armor penalty waiver) and then going into full casting PrCs.

The sorcerer favors touch spells and ray of enfeeblement at the moment.

Any recommendations on the build? Should I bother with duskblade? Suggestions for PrCs that are not Incantatrix/Mage of the Arcane Order?

I'd (logically) like to continue with as few sorcerer levels as possible, to accrue more cool abilities.

Oh yes, and he's a fish. Merman.

MammonAzrael
2009-01-29, 10:40 PM
Hmm...Well, aside from touch and ranged touch spells, what does he prefer? (I'm assuming this is the VUaV guy).

Abjurant champion is always a solid PrC choice, and lets him land more touch attacks more reliably (and worry a bit less about wading into combat).

An Elemental Savant could be fun too.

As for his next level, I'd just stick with Sorcerer, so as not to loose those precious spells. If you're really concerned about the armor penalty, perhaps the Battle Sorcerer variant could be to your liking.

You could always toss in Monk, and then one of the Monk/spellcaster hybrid PrCs. :smallsmile:

afroakuma
2009-01-29, 10:47 PM
Hmm...Well, aside from touch and ranged touch spells, what does he prefer? (I'm assuming this is the VUaV guy).

Guilty as charged.


Abjurant champion is always a solid PrC choice, and lets him land more touch attacks more reliably (and worry a bit less about wading into combat).

I was looking at that; it would slightly short-circuit the necessity of the duskblade, though. Also, it's only five levels; where do I go after that?

Also, does their swift casting of abjurations only work on 1st and 2nd level spells?


As for his next level, I'd just stick with Sorcerer, so as not to loose those precious spells. If you're really concerned about the armor penalty, perhaps the Battle Sorcerer variant could be to your liking.


Battle Sorcerer screws with known spells too, otherwise I would have done it already.

Fax Celestis
2009-01-29, 10:50 PM
Spellthief Dip! Then take Master Spellthief.

Upsides: Cha synergy, Sneak attack, Spellthievery, Armored Mage (Light). With Master Spellthief, no CL loss.

RTGoodman
2009-01-29, 10:53 PM
I'm no authority on Sorcerers/casters in general in 3.x, but I AM pretty sure that Duskblade would be a BAD move for you to take for a couple of reasons. It's Int-based and a one-level dip doesn't get you much in the way of spells. Second, I'm relatively certain Armored Mage (or whatever the ability is called for Duskblades) specifies that you ignore ASF in light armor (or more later) for Duskblade spells ONLY, not all arcane spells.


EDIT: Fax makes a good point, though - Spellthief 1 with Master Spellthief is REALLY good for a Sorcerer, since it's Cha-based AND Master Spellthief lets you use Armored Mage for ALL your arcane caster classes.

afroakuma
2009-01-29, 10:56 PM
Spellthief Dip! Then take Master Spellthief.

Donde es Master Spellthief?

I'm not sure of the value of a one or two level spellthief dip, but I'll have to see Master Spellthief to decide.

EDIT:


Second, I'm relatively certain Armored Mage (or whatever the ability is called for Duskblades) specifies that you ignore ASF in light armor (or more later) for Duskblade spells ONLY, not all arcane spells.

Ouch - I did not see that.

Starscream
2009-01-29, 10:57 PM
I have no idea if this class is any good or not (I've never used it) but it sounds like it could be fun: Wild Mage

Full spell progression, which is always good.

Wild Magic, which is...interesting. Basically this means that whenever you cast a spell you subtract three from you caster level and then add 1d6. This sounds like a crap shoot, but on average it's an improvement. 1/3 of the time your spell will be less effective than usual. 2/3 of the time it will be as good or better than normal.

Random Deflector lets you redirect spells, spell likes, and ranged attacks that target you. It can instead target a random person withing 20 feet. This might be cool because you said you like touch spells, so I figure you are usually close to your enemies, making it more likely that attacks will backfire against them rather than your allies.

Odd class, overall. I honestly can't tell from reading the description whether it's good or not. Anyone have any opinions?

Fax Celestis
2009-01-29, 11:08 PM
Donde es Master Spellthief?

Master Spellthief esta en Complete Scoundrel.

O esta aqui. (http://realmshelps.dandello.net/cgi-bin/feats.pl?Master_Spellthief,CS)

The Demented One
2009-01-29, 11:17 PM
Living Arcanum levels! Use Living Arcanum levels!

afroakuma
2009-01-29, 11:18 PM
Ah, found it.

Alrighty; how about this: two more levels sorcerer, one level spellthief, two levels duskblade (to qualify for abjurant champion), four levels abjurant champion...

where next?

Does this work?

thegurullamen
2009-01-29, 11:20 PM
Your villain seems to be trying to PrC in Magnificent Bastard. Just drop him into something that would help that out. There's a thread somewhere on the boards about the Joker Bard (named sush as it's a counter to the Batman wizard), but I'm not sure that's right for the prince. Maybe something along the lines of a Mindspy or another mind screwy PrC. Give Master of Masks a look, as well.

Alternatively, the Spellwarp Sniper has that arcane-executioner feel that the prince gives off with his web-then-shocking-grasp-to-death fetish he has.

ShneekeyTheLost
2009-01-29, 11:22 PM
Are you LG? A two level dip in Paladin nets you Cha to all saves, Then you can blend easily into a one level dip in Spellsword, which reduces ASF by 10% and both BAB and Spellcasting. From there, you slide into Abjurant Champion. Yes, even as a Sorcerer, you can auto-quicken 1st-3rd level Abjuration spells (like Shield), and net a +5 on the AC bonus granted by such.

What is your problem with Mage of the Arcane Order? It's easily entered and provides flexibility. It's not nearly as broken as Incantatrix or Initiate of the Sevenfold Cheese.

As Fax mentioned, a one level dip in Spellthief and the feat Master Spellthief nets you lack of ASF in Light armor, negating the need for Spellsword or Paladin in the above build.

Fatespinner is very good for a four level dip. Don't bother with the last level, it doesn't promote casting, and is a very weak capstone ability.

Kroy
2009-01-29, 11:24 PM
where next?

Tippyland!

MammonAzrael
2009-01-29, 11:58 PM
You do know that the Duskblade CF Armored Mage doesn't work for spells gained through any other class, right? Of course, you could just be taking the two levels to get the free Combat casting feat, but I don't think that's worth losing two Sorcerer levels for (also, Duskblade spells are based off Int, not Cha).

Oh, and the Spellthief's ability to cast in light armor also doesn't apply to other classes spells. :smallsigh:

EDIT: Sorry to be the bearer of annoying news. :smallsigh:

afroakuma
2009-01-30, 12:07 AM
You do know that the Duskblade CF Armored Mage doesn't work for spells gained through any other class, right?

Yeah; found that out. :smallfrown:


Of course, you could just be taking the two levels to get the free Combat casting feat, but I don't think that's worth losing two Sorcerer levels for (also, Duskblade spells are based off Int, not Cha).

That's where I was going; taking the first level for the proficiencies and the BAB increase, both of which are needed for the abjurant champion.


Oh, and the Spellthief's ability to cast in light armor also doesn't apply to other classes spells. :smallsigh:


It does with the Master Spellthief feat.

MammonAzrael
2009-01-30, 12:27 AM
Hmm...if you went up to Duskblade 3 at some point he'd be able to use some nasty weapon and still deliver his oh so favorite Shocking Grasp...

It may be worth investing in Practiced Spellcaster, since you'll be losing a couple levels.

How high would you like to take him?

afroakuma
2009-01-30, 12:30 AM
I plan to do stops at ECL 8, 12 and 16.

I figure a mithril breastplate plus an abjurant champion's fourth-level swift shield should suffice for AC, what with his massive Dex. It's just retaining enough casting prowess that's bugging me.

Eldariel
2009-01-30, 01:42 AM
Losing more than 1 caster level is really going to wreak havoc on his spells (doubly so 'cause he's a Sorc and is already a level behind of Wizards). I don't think even Master Spellthief is worth it. Unless you're going to build him as a melee gish (who fights with a Sword), I'd just go Sorcerer > Abjurant Champion. The remaining levels could fall into any bunch of classes. Good options include:

Mindbender [C. Arcane]: One-level dip gets him Telepathy which in turn qualifies him for Mindsight [LoM] - seems fun for a villain.

Fatespinner [C. Arcane]: Four levels makes for nice abilities to screw fate, reroll stupid stuff and so on. The drawback is that you can enter level 9 the earliest since it requires level 4 spells and Sorcerer is a level behind as far as spell levels go.

Something like Geometer could bridge the dead levels in the build. And really, if he just bothers with an Eternal Wand [MiC] of Greater Mage Armor [SC], he'll be set for life AC-wise without bothering with any armor. Once you get Abjurant Champion-levels though, it may be worth it to start casting 'em yourself for the massively higher AC bonus.


Note that Abjurant Champ only requires proficiency in one martial weapon so having racial proficiency would qualify you, or spending one feat. I'd probably spend feats rather than class levels, especially with Sorcs.

Talic
2009-01-30, 01:49 AM
The purposes you wish to fulfill can be just as easily accomplished by fighter, if you have Complete Mage, and are willing to look into the Armored Caster variant fighter level.

Full martial proficiency, Light armor, Fort save, and D10 HD... You could do worse if you were gimping a caster level.

MammonAzrael
2009-01-30, 02:00 AM
Hmm...as it stands now you'll be losing three Sorcerer levels...

Mindbender doesn't help much with the caster levels, but it could work very well for him.

Actually, check out Unseen Seer. That may just be perfect.

xanaphia
2009-01-30, 02:08 AM
I'd wait till you can get Initiate of the Sevenfold Veil. Most broken class I've ever seen.

Otherwise, maybe some elemental class? You're a merman, so Water would be natural.

I'd keep with Sorcerer, apart from that.

afroakuma
2009-01-30, 08:40 AM
Didn't see much value in Unseen Seer. Mindbender as a one-level dip looks fine.

Greater magic armor essentially nullifies the need for ASF relief, since there will be no point to wearing armor, which in turn reduces dependency on Spellsword.

To take a one-level Spellsword dip, I'd have to take a level in Fighter first; while that would clean up the proficiency requirement for Abjurant Champion and give me a bonus feat, it will cost me spell growth.

I'm also a bit leery about taking a one-level Spellthief dip, for the same reason. Granted, it does combo well with Spellwarp Sniper, which looks useful.

It's annoying that argent savant loses one level of spell progression; a two level dip would have combined nicely with abjurant champion.

Thoughts?

afroakuma
2009-01-30, 10:46 AM
Alright, I'm scouring Crystalkeep for ideas now.

By the way, I don't really like/need Iron Will, but I couldn't think of a decent feat to replace it with. Any suggestions?

Telonius
2009-01-30, 11:27 AM
At Level 6, get leadership and a sea eel cohort. Make sure you get some Polymorph spells. Start trading them for people's voices. :smallbiggrin:

afroakuma
2009-01-30, 11:29 AM
Two cohorts. And that would be the witch class. I'd also need Craft (alchemy) and the tauric template.

MammonAzrael
2009-01-30, 02:28 PM
I thought Unseen Seer would be good because it a full progression class for your Sorcerer levels, it advances the sneak attack dice you got from your level of Spellthief, and bonus spells known. The free feat and other abilities are nice, but nothing you probably care about. At the very least, it is pretty much strictly superior than any levels in straight Sorcerer.

The levels you took of Duskblade should qualify you for Spellsword if you want to go that route, since Duskblades are proficient with all martial weapons and all types of armor and shield (except tower shields).

Of course, this all depends on how you want to eliminate your ASF chance. If you go with Spellthief and the Master Spellthief feat, you won't need Spellsword. Or you can forget about Spellthief and grab 2-3 levels of Duskblade and a level of Spellsword. That would give your mithral Breastplate a 5% chance, which you could eliminate with the Twilight armor enhancement.

I don't think you should dip into Duskblade unless you go 3 levels and grab Arcane Channeling. The free Combat Casting just isn't worth losing two casting levels of Sorcerer. If you're liking the Greater Mage Armor option, I'd say skip Spellthief, and just take three levels of Duskblade into Abjurant Champion.

From there...the dip into Mindbender is good (he'd love Telepathy). Argent Savant might be a bit excessive, how often do you really see this guy mixing it up in melee? I got the feeling he would like more subtle benefits. Fatespinner, as mentioned, could be quite fun for him. Nightmare Spinner could be a good class to take him down for the torture aspect of him.

Oh, another question! Where do you expect him to be in his political campaign at lv 8/12/16? That could help shine light on the direction you want to take him after his 4 levels of Abjurant Champion.

wadledo
2009-01-30, 02:52 PM
After 10th, you should go Dragonslayer 1/ Spellsword 1/ Abjurant champion.
I'm very certain Dragonslayer gets all Martial Weapons and Armor, but I could be wrong.

TempusCCK
2009-01-30, 03:22 PM
Consider Archmage if you like touch spells.

afroakuma
2009-01-30, 05:39 PM
Trouble is, his favorite rays aren't damage rays, but effect ones. Otherwise Spell Focus (evocation) would've been a simple pick to replace Iron Will.

Still don't know what to put in that spot, by the by.

Eldariel
2009-01-30, 05:41 PM
The "Split Ray" or "Chain Spell"-metamagic feats sound perfect.

afroakuma
2009-01-30, 05:56 PM
Full-round cast for a sorcerer though. Which means valid targets could sneak out of range.

Eldariel
2009-01-30, 06:04 PM
Full-round cast for a sorcerer though. Which means valid targets could sneak out of range.

It's a full round action, not a one-round casting time though, so no sneaking or interruptions any more than normal. Ability to apply metamagic on the fly is Sorcerer's biggest trump over Wizard; not something you'd want to throw away because of trivial limitations. In fact, I'd go as far as to pick the "Metamagic Specialist" ACF from PHBII (and Obtain Familiar to maintain the fellow) or "Rapid Metamagic" feat from Complete Mage to get by that (and to use Quicken Spell around level 12).

MammonAzrael
2009-01-30, 06:10 PM
Then grab the Metamagic Specialist variant from the PHB2. It lets you use metamagic without increasing the casting time, in exchange for your familiar (which I don't recall the Prince using). It is usable 3 + Int mod times per day. Could be quite the useful choice.

Eldariel
2009-01-30, 06:14 PM
There's no daily limit there. If there were, everyone would just use Rapid Metamagic instead, which likewise has no limit.

Fax Celestis
2009-01-30, 06:32 PM
There's no daily limit there. If there were, everyone would just use Rapid Metamagic instead, which likewise has no limit.

The PHB-II sorcerer variant does indeed have a limit per day. 3+Int.

Arcane_Snowman
2009-01-30, 07:08 PM
Trouble is, his favorite rays aren't damage rays, but effect ones. Otherwise Spell Focus (evocation) would've been a simple pick to replace Iron Will.

Still don't know what to put in that spot, by the by. Otyugh Hole from Complete Scoundrel Page 151 gives you Iron Will for 3000 gp, pick another feat :smallbiggrin:

Edit (didn't see the Merman thing):If you're going for a Gish Sorcerer: Sorcerer 6/Paragnostic Apostle 4/Abjurant Champion 5/Something 1
Get the Apostle's Mind Over Matter ability to get an additional +2 to AC when casting spells that gives you AC (you need a bit of Knowledge [Architecture/Engineering though])

For something that just generally has a lot it can do:
Sorcerer 5/Mindbender 1/Paragnostic Apostle 5/Fate Spinner 4/Something 1

afroakuma
2009-01-30, 07:31 PM
How about Spell Thematics?

Also, where do I go to find the Paragnostic Apostle?

And no, he's not using a familiar, so I get another feat or whatever out of that.

ericgrau
2009-01-30, 08:25 PM
Empower your rays of enfeeblement. If you look at the example in the feat description, you multiple by 1.5 after adding in the +X. That can keep ray of enfeeblement useful at higher levels.

And I agree with loading up on metamagic.

afroakuma
2009-01-30, 08:46 PM
Where do I find Rapid Metamagic?

ShneekeyTheLost
2009-01-30, 08:51 PM
Where do I find Rapid Metamagic?

PhB II for the 'replace your familiar for the ability to do it 3+int mod/day'

Complete Mage for the feat which is unlimited, and has a requirement of 15 ranks in Spellcraft (12th level).

afroakuma
2009-01-30, 09:04 PM
Certainly better than the spare feat.

Other recommendations?

ShneekeyTheLost
2009-01-30, 09:16 PM
Certainly better than the spare feat.

Other recommendations?

Rapid Metamagic allows you to get Quicken Spell... of course, with 5 levels of Abjurant Champion, all Abjuration spells 3rd level and lower are automatically quickened, but it's still pretty handy to crank out Quickened Enervation/Split Ray Empowered Enervation for 1d4+1+(2d4+2)*1.5 negative levels in yo face in one round...

Still and Silent are fun for a Sorcerer, because they a) prevent Spellcraft checks to identify WTF he's casting, and can be used to circumvent ways to shut down casters (silence, for example, is generally a no-save Boop You for casters, Silent Spell, for +1 SL allows you to bypass it).

afroakuma
2009-01-30, 09:19 PM
I could see Silent Spell messing badly with players due to his magerings having similar activation. They'd never be able to guess which spells were his and which came from a magering.

MammonAzrael
2009-01-30, 09:37 PM
Silent spell is great fun. And can greatly help casting spells unnoticed at a political party or whatnot. :smallamused:
Also, just to makes sure t gets linked, 'cause it's awesome: Solo's Stupendously Superior Sorcerer Stratagems (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=74801)

afroakuma
2009-01-30, 11:30 PM
Alright, so things are looking good. But I'm still not sure how to attain the BAB for Abjurant Champion without losing too many caster levels.

Suggestions?

RTGoodman
2009-01-31, 12:48 AM
I tried to post earlier but everything got eaten by post lag.

Basically, I was gonna say that 2 levels of Paladin (or a variant Paladin (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/classes/variantCharacterClasses.htm#paladinVariantsFreedom SlaughterAndTyranny) from UA) is a pretty good dip for a "gish-y" Sorcerer. You get the BAB increase, any weapon and armor proficiencies you might need for prerequisites for PrCs, and DIVINE GRACE, which is SWEET for a Sorcerer.

You'd lose 2 levels of casting, though, so that kinda sucks.

Arcane_Snowman
2009-01-31, 12:52 AM
Also, where do I go to find the Paragnostic Apostle? In Complete Champion


I tried to post earlier but everything got eaten by post lag.

Basically, I was gonna say that 2 levels of Paladin (or a variant Paladin (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/classes/variantCharacterClasses.htm#paladinVariantsFreedom SlaughterAndTyranny) from UA) is a pretty good dip for a "gish-y" Sorcerer. You get the BAB increase, any weapon and armor proficiencies you might need for prerequisites for PrCs, and DIVINE GRACE, which is SWEET for a Sorcerer.

You'd lose 2 levels of casting, though, so that kinda sucks. When aiming for a higher level character with Cha-based casting and gishy qualities, Suel Arcanamach is an excellent choice it will allow you to get classes like Paladin and Hexblade for some Cha synergy, whilst still becoming a competent Gish. If you are really hyped about getting higher level spells, combining it with Sublime Chord is an option that is rather decent.

Suel Arcanamach Gish (with high spellcasting):
Paladin 2/Hexblade 4/Suel Arcanamach 3/Loremaster 1/Virtuoso 1/Sublime Chord 1/Abjurant Champion 4

Eldariel
2009-01-31, 04:23 AM
The PHB-II sorcerer variant does indeed have a limit per day. 3+Int.

Ah, it spilled over the next paragraph hence why I missed it. Confusing.

Definitely get Rapid Metamagic then; thanks to "Imbue Familiar with Spell Ability"-spell from Spell Compendium, your Familiar can act as an auxillary caster and as a Sorc, you'll be using Metamagic all the time.

afroakuma
2009-01-31, 08:17 AM
Well, he's not using a familiar (traded out for bonus feat) so that's out.

As for paladins, he's Neutral Evil, so no luck there.

And I am tied down to the four levels of Sorcerer.

ShneekeyTheLost
2009-01-31, 11:35 AM
Alright, so things are looking good. But I'm still not sure how to attain the BAB for Abjurant Champion without losing too many caster levels.

Suggestions?

A one-level dip in Fighter will net you all martial weapons and all armor and a +1 BAB. Then go Sorc6 for another +3 to BAB. Then go one-level dip in Spellsword for the last +1 BAB you need. You loose a total of one spell level, but end up being able to enter AbChamp at 8th.

Failing that, you can go Sorc10/AbChamp5/Fatespinner4/Archmage1.

A one-level dip in Warlock will net you Dark One's Own Luck, which is Cha to one save, which you can switch out as a standard action. Not recommended, however, as it does not give you any martial weapons or BAB or casting.

afroakuma
2009-01-31, 11:50 AM
Sounds like a plan.

The problem I had with Unseen Seer was that, beyond the first two levels, I'd lose spellcasting power to my offensive spells.

Of course, without spellthief, it hardly matters.

Alright, so: Any recommendations on spell selection?

afroakuma
2009-01-31, 05:15 PM
Also: I assume that since I'm dropping spellthief, spellwarp sniper is now out of the question. I was looking into Metamagic School Focus (necromancy) to accelerate enervations, rays of enfeeblement and vampiric touches. Thoughts?

Also, I was looking into supplementing metamagic with a reserve feat or two. Sickening Grasp would power up necromancy and add extra viciousness to shocking grasp. Storm Bolt would give me extra weaponry at higher levels, but it's kind of short-range.

Thoughts?

Llama231
2009-01-31, 05:17 PM
Do sorcerer and wizard levels stack?
You could try that.

afroakuma
2009-01-31, 05:25 PM
Well, that would just be silly. I'd cut my spell levels in half.

afroakuma
2009-01-31, 10:47 PM
*KABLAM*

Alright, I think this will work:

Six levels of sorcerer, exchanging familiar for an extra feat.
One level of fighter, to qualify for spellsword.
One level of spellsword, to qualify for abjurant champion.
Five levels of abjurant champion.

That's thirteen out of sixteen, and I can easily slip a level of mindbender in there.

On the feats side, Split Ray and Empower Spell are must-haves, as is Rapid Metamagic. Combat Casting is a requisite for abjurant champion, so that's four down. I had considered Sickening Grasp, to bolster my necromancy spells and add a side-effect to shocking grasp and vampiric touch.

Any tips for the remainder of the feats? The fighter bonus feat? Spell selection?

Curmudgeon
2009-01-31, 11:31 PM
I'd take one of the better once-daily metamagic feats, like Sudden Maximize. The ability to make any blasty spell reliable (like 60 points of acid damage for 3rd level Acid Breath, or 90 points of cold damage for 4th level Orb of Cold, or 120 points of electrical damage for 6th level Chain Lightning), without increasing the spell level, can come in handy.

afroakuma
2009-01-31, 11:54 PM
Chain lightning would cap at 90 damage for the level 16 incarnation, though. Seems a bit weak.

Thurbane
2009-02-01, 12:00 AM
Six levels of sorcerer, exchanging familiar for an extra feat.
One level of fighter, to qualify for spellsword.
One level of spellsword, to qualify for abjurant champion.
Five levels of abjurant champion.

You could drop fighter and spellsword for 1 level of Dragonslayer, that will qualify you for Abjurant Champion. Requires some more feats, though...

afroakuma
2009-02-01, 12:05 AM
Yeah; two kinda lame ones. And it doesn't fit the character's flavor very well.
The other problem is that it, too, requires a +5 BAB, which would mean an additional 2 levels of sorcerer and render itself redundant.

Shadow_Elf
2009-02-01, 12:15 AM
You know better than almost anyone that I don't know 3.5e afro, but is a 1-level dip in Assassin worth it for the death attack for his political meetings? It seems to me that 3-rounds as a non-hostile is easy to achieve in this line of work.

afroakuma
2009-02-01, 12:19 AM
Sure, but then there's the actual stabbing afterwards. Tends to ruin the occasion. Now, if he had a non-obvious way to pull off the death attack, that might be a different story.

ShneekeyTheLost
2009-02-01, 01:22 AM
*KABLAM*

Alright, I think this will work:

Six levels of sorcerer, exchanging familiar for an extra feat.
One level of fighter, to qualify for spellsword.
One level of spellsword, to qualify for abjurant champion.
Five levels of abjurant champion.

That's thirteen out of sixteen, and I can easily slip a level of mindbender in there.

On the feats side, Split Ray and Empower Spell are must-haves, as is Rapid Metamagic. Combat Casting is a requisite for abjurant champion, so that's four down. I had considered Sickening Grasp, to bolster my necromancy spells and add a side-effect to shocking grasp and vampiric touch.

Any tips for the remainder of the feats? The fighter bonus feat? Spell selection?

Silent Spell to avoid being Silenced, and to sow confusion about which is items and which are actual spells...

Fatespinner will work well in the last three levels, as it fully promotes spellcasting and the 'spin' for DC's works wonders.

afroakuma
2009-02-01, 01:23 AM
Silent Spell to avoid being Silenced, and to sow confusion about which is items and which are actual spells...

True.


Fatespinner will work well in the last three levels, as it fully promotes spellcasting and the 'spin' for DC's works wonders.

Really? It had seemed a bit limited... 3 extra DC points per day, wasn't it?

ShneekeyTheLost
2009-02-01, 01:34 AM
True.



Really? It had seemed a bit limited... 3 extra DC points per day, wasn't it?

Fickle Finger of Fate forces reroll of one die roll, either one you screwed up on, or one they did well on. This is a 'reroll a Save or Die' effect. You can also add that spin to a given save, making it difficult to drop him by spamming 'save or loose' type spells.

afroakuma
2009-02-01, 07:58 AM
Useful, but still 1/day.

On the other hand, it's still better than sorcerer.

Any further advice on spell picks? Feats?

afroakuma
2009-02-01, 03:42 PM
Also, other than Fatespinner, are there any other good full-casting PrCs I should look into to round out the later levels?