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View Full Version : True Death vs Lich - Round One!



notagain111
2009-01-31, 12:43 AM
Just been browsing PrCs today, and i came accross the hunter of the dead.
C Warrior, page 42.
The hunter of the dead's level 5 ability "True Death" states: Undead slain by a hunter of the dead of 5th level or higher either by melee attacks or by spells, can never rise again as undead. They are forever destroyed.

now what if Mr. Lich gets KO'd by a hunter of the dead?
will his phylactery(sp?) still bring him back? or does this ability override his regrowingness?

Nohwl
2009-01-31, 01:38 AM
if thats what it says word for word, i would say that the lich wont rise again.

RS14
2009-01-31, 01:53 AM
Just from what you've posted, I'd agree with Nohwl. I think you can make the same argument about just about any creature it might potentially apply to.

It doesn't sound like it would apply to Vampires, though. Since they're not actually slain when reduced to 0hp. :smallannoyed:

Ascension
2009-01-31, 03:02 AM
Lich and ghost hunting is pretty much all a Hunter of the Dead is good for, though, so a price is still paid...

That being said, I imagine a Hunter of the Dead could turn a hefty profit putting down Taunting Haunts alone.

notagain111
2009-01-31, 03:20 AM
I am unfamiliar with these "Taunting Haunts"
What is it and/or what book/page can i find it on?

Ascension
2009-01-31, 01:03 PM
They're from MMV, page 82. They're basically annoyance incarnate, unkillable pranksters who go away only if you defeat them in a battle of wits, resolve whatever quest hook unfinished buisness made them rise from the grave, or, if you want to shortcut the whole process, kill them with a Hunter of the Dead.

Belial_the_Leveler
2009-01-31, 02:07 PM
Hey, there's always Thinaun weapons. Thinaun is an alloy that traps souls when the body touching it is destroyed. So a lich's soul wouldn't return to its Phylactery upon destruction and a ghost would be trapped. Still doesn't work on vampires though.

Nahal
2009-01-31, 03:33 PM
I'm not sure about that... From what I recall of the fluff the lich's soul is literally stuck in the phylactery, and the body is a soulless mockery of life. Thinaun thus wouldn't do any good, since the soul doesn't live there anymore.

As for the Hunter of the Dead bit, the RAW makes it seem like the lich is gone for good. Making the fluff work is a bit trickier in the lich's case though; with a ghost it's a simple matter of saying the hunter's blade literally severs the soul's connection to whatever's keeping it here. With the lich you might just say that whatever connection they have to the divine is tapped to follow whatever sympathetic link ties the lich's soul and body together and severs the former from the phylactery, but that stinks a bit of 4-dimensional metaphysics.

TempusCCK
2009-01-31, 03:50 PM
Well, I guess it's all a matter of how you interpret that phylactery. Is it a vessel for the Lich's soul after the lich dies, or is the Lich's soul always in the phylactery.

Either way, by RAW, Hunter of the Dead has you boned.

Zeful
2009-01-31, 04:18 PM
I'm not sure about that... From what I recall of the fluff the lich's soul is literally stuck in the phylactery, and the body is a soulless mockery of life. Thinaun thus wouldn't do any good, since the soul doesn't live there anymore.

As for the Hunter of the Dead bit, the RAW makes it seem like the lich is gone for good. Making the fluff work is a bit trickier in the lich's case though; with a ghost it's a simple matter of saying the hunter's blade literally severs the soul's connection to whatever's keeping it here. With the lich you might just say that whatever connection they have to the divine is tapped to follow whatever sympathetic link ties the lich's soul and body together and severs the former from the phylactery, but that stinks a bit of 4-dimensional metaphysics.

Or it could make things worse. The lich can't rise as an undead, but the phylactery will still keep reviving him, so he gains a new fleshy body every time he's killed?

That's how I'd rule it at least.

Limos
2009-01-31, 05:42 PM
I think the Lich would circumvent the Never Rise again bit since he doesn't Rise again. He generates a new skeletal body. His old one is gone.

Maybe you could say that it stops the Lich from generating new bodies spontaneously. His soul is still in the Phylactery, but he can't rise again on his own.