So does Rich really think this far ahead?

[Thrudh]

http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0188.html

So was Rich really already planning on mother dragon paying a visit to V way way back when??

Or was it all about setting up the PlayDrake joke, and then he thought up the mother dragon and V part later...

Man, if he DOES plan this far ahead, I'd love to see his notebook... He's gotta have one heck of a plot outline in there.

[Scion_of_Darkness]

I think he has plans for some story arcs, but uses improvisation to carry them out and tie them together.

[Admiral_Kelly]

I speculate it was to please the fans. A lot of people thought the first black dragon was badass.

[Optimystik]

http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0188.html

So was Rich really already planning on mother dragon paying a visit to V way way back when??

Or was it all about setting up the PlayDrake joke, and then he thought up the mother dragon and V part later...

Man, if he DOES plan this far ahead, I'd love to see his notebook... He's gotta have one heck of a plot outline in there.

The whole "another dragon put the starmetal here" bit was in advance of the Playdrake joke. Maybe not FAR in advance, but the draconic runes V read were definitely the Chekov's Gun, not the dirty magazines.

[RMS Oceanic]

I think he had this as a potential subplot to turn up later, but didn't have a specific point in the story for it to emerge.

[Ozymandias9]

The general narrative structure of the comic seems to me to imply that he has the plot of the story planned out. This was probably planned out in some form from when he first started to concretely characterize V. The details have almost certainly changed, of course.

It always confuses me when people are surprised that authors have a plan. Certainly there's a lot of improvising in coming up with the initial idea, but if you didn't have at least general plan for a project of this scope, you'd probably write yourself into a corner and produce a mediocre story.

[Tass]

He also had it more recently in 572 (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0572.html).

This explains the important client flying in. And boy was Roy right he might have gleaned some important information from the next prophecy.

I think it was pretty much planned from the start. All the way back in the 60's he showed that he plans ahead with the message from Roys farther. The faq also states that the final panel is already planned. Of course things are fleshed out and tweaked as he goes along, but the bigger arcs are certainly already build.

[Manga Shoggoth]

Rich almost certianly has the overall story planned out. He has described the story as taking up about five books, so must have a reasonable idea of what he is going to do.

That's not to say that he has everything plotted out in absolute detail. He can change the pace of the story, add of extend bits because they suddenly fit differently in the current storyline (which he has been known to do).

For the reasons given above it looks like the dragon was planned, though.

[Underground]

I dont see why Rich wouldnt have planned this ahead.

He said numberable times he has the story already set in stone and knows it until its end.

[dps]

It always confuses me when people are surprised that authors have a plan. Certainly there's a lot of improvising in coming up with the initial idea, but if you didn't have at least general plan for a project of this scope, you'd probably write yourself into a corner and produce a mediocre story.

I think that's why a lot of webcomics get abandoned and go unfinished--someone has what seems like a cool idea, but hasn't planned out the full story, and mid-way through they get stuck.

It happens in other media, too, but if you're writing a novel or a piece of music and abandon it before it's finished, the public doens't normally get to see the part that you've already done, but with a webcomic, people will see the incomplete work.

[David Argall]

I dont see why Rich wouldnt have planned this ahead.

He said numberable times he has the story already set in stone and knows it until its end.

Well, since zero is a number, the statement is correct. Our writer has said the broad outlines are set, but there is a lot of flex available. Notable here is the inn scene, which got major changes barely before it was posted. Should the material accumulate, he may stuff an entire book into the story.



Rich almost certianly has the overall story planned out. He has described the story as taking up about five books, so must have a reasonable idea of what he is going to do.
I believe his statement was that he already had material for 7 books [at a time when no more than two were finished], with hopes of expanding that. We are now deep into book 4, and there is a large amount of material on the table for gate 4 that may make it hard to do in just one book, and that still leaves the final gate and maybe the snarl to take care of. 6 books is a bare minimum.

Now given that we have warnings about Haley's pop well before the dragon, and pop's big scene is still a hundred strips away, we certainly can't rule out such long range planning. But there has been years to reverse engineer the story too. And that is a lot less work. So don't get too definite for either side here.

[One_Wolf]

Every good DM leaves several open plot lines to throw in at whatever time he chooses. Thus always keeping it interesting.

i.e. Bad guy gets away, re-occuring stranger, missing piece to tablet/scroll/amulet or other puzzle, vague prophecies, etc. . .

And the best time to bring them up is when everyone has forgotten about them.

Same goes for story writing I guess, but I have never done that. Unless you count DM'ing as story writing.

-One Wolf

[[TS] Shadow]

I bet that Rich thought that a dragon would come back for revenge, but I doubt he had the details worked out. The mother's story probably was planned out only a few months ago, at the earliest. He also introduced the fact that the Oracle gave her the info, so that means if and when V sees the Oracle again, he's going to bring up the subject. Rich might have been planning this dragon since he mentioned the Oracle in OtOotPCs, for all we know. Or he could be winging it, going strip by strip. We don't know. Only when he speaks will we get our answer, cause I know for sure that I'm not qualifed to testify to the Giant's plot planning skills.

[Manga Shoggoth]

I believe his statement was that he already had material for 7 books [at a time when no more than two were finished], with hopes of expanding that. We are now deep into book 4, and there is a large amount of material on the table for gate 4 that may make it hard to do in just one book, and that still leaves the final gate and maybe the snarl to take care of. 6 books is a bare minimum.

David, you are quite right and I should have been more specific. When I said:

"He has described the story as taking up about five books, so must have a reasonable idea of what he is going to do."

I should have clarified that the Giant was talking about the online material, not the prequels. Which means that we are on book 3, and have room for another two.

He has also spoken of another prequel, which means that we could end up with 8 books. Well, the more the merrier...

[Morgan Wick]

David, you are quite right and I should have been more specific. When I said:

"He has described the story as taking up about five books, so must have a reasonable idea of what he is going to do."

I should have clarified that the Giant was talking about the online material, not the prequels. Which means that we are on book 3, and have room for another two.

He has also spoken of another prequel, which means that we could end up with 8 books. Well, the more the merrier...

Dungeon Crawlin' Fools, No Cure for the Paladin Blues, War and XPs, and the current book all chronicle online material. (Through 120, 300, 484, and ~666 respectively.)

Besides which we have two prequels so your math doesn't add up there either.

[Teatime]

As early as Dungeon Crawling fools, Rich foreshadowed that we would be learning a lot about "Roy's siblings, Haley's father, and V's family." He then references, in-comic, that V is married, basically one story-arc after the starmetal/dragon subplot. So I would not be surprised at all if this whole sequence of events has been planned since then.

[Manga Shoggoth]

Dungeon Crawlin' Fools, No Cure for the Paladin Blues, War and XPs, and the current book all chronicle online material. (Through 120, 300, 484, and ~666 respectively.)

Besides which we have two prequels so your math doesn't add up there either.

Let's see:

Number of published prequels: 2
Number of published online material: 3

Number of prequels mentioned but not yet published: 1
Remaining books based on on-line material: (5 - 3) = 2

Therefore: Total number of books we could end up with = 2 + 3 + 1 + 2 = 8

My maths is fine and I am also perfectly capable of simple arithmetic.

[Ghastly Epigram]

Remaining books based on on-line material: (5 - 3) = 2

I simply do not see this being possible (And definitely not desirable). We are 140+ strips into Book 4, which likely means a maximum of 60 strips to go (And probably less). That leaves one book for...well, everything else. And there is quite a lot of ground to cover.

We are definitely looking at least 6 books worth of online material, and quite possibly more.

[Manga Shoggoth]

I simply do not see this being possible (And definitely not desirable). We are 140+ strips into Book 4, which likely means a maximum of 60 strips to go (And probably less). That leaves one book for...well, everything else. And there is quite a lot of ground to cover.

We are definitely looking at least 6 books worth of online material, and quite possibly more.

I 'ain't complaining...

[Carnivorous_Bea]

Well, my personal opinion is that he has an overall outline, but that the details are filled in -- and additional material is added -- as he goes along. As a writer myself, I can tell you that it's impossible to plan ahead for every idea you have; nor does every part of your outline always prove to be workable in the way you had designed. On the other hand, it isn't that hard to work new ideas into the existing plot, as long as there's already a fair amount of detail there.

So, there's no need for him to specifically plan the black dragon's revenge on V way back when they were after the starmetal. However, the starmetal plot raised the possibility of another dragon coming in, so as soon as he got the idea, he could start working it in -- with the Oracle, specifically. That's what I figure, anyway.

As for the prophecy with Roy's dad -- "when the goat turns red strikes true" -- I can tell you from my own DM'ing experience that you can easily come up with a snazzy fulfillment for a prophecy when it's as weird and vague as that! :smallbiggrin:

[Wraithfighter]

From the other topic on this:

There are two ways to play chess, outside of the super grandmaster level at least.

The first is to plan many, many moves ahead, planning things out so that nothing can surprise you and everything unfolds perfectly.

The second is to play for position, taking the logical points (knights in the center, castling, etc) and not giving up pieces for free. And maybe that rook you put in the b rank will pay off twenty moves in the future.

In this case, Rich probably did the latter. He put thought into a random monster they encountered and threw in a little bit of backstory. And now, when he needs a true threat to V that won't feel like something ret-conned in, here comes momma.

That is how you write an open ended story. Don't neccessarily foreshadow things, but put thought into everything. That tiny character in season one may turn out to be a major person as time wears on.

But, no, not major foreshadowing. Just strong writing and good memory.

[Occasional Sage]

*snip*
The faq also states that the final panel is already planned.
*snip*


In fact, I think Rich has accidentally given us a sneak peek at an early draft of that panel.

scroll down to see what I mean... (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0120.html)

[Kaihaku]

I think he has plans for some story arcs, but uses improvisation to carry them out and tie them together.

I'll second that.

I think he has some things solidly ironed out but is open to some improvisation and evolution. That said, he still must have an impressive notepad considering how carefully he does connect the dots.