Can V's mate fight?

[Zerg Cookie]

Maybe V's mate is like, super powerful, and will kill the dragon?
/Discuss

[Pronounceable]

She certainly doesn't look like it. Then again, them being elves, maybe she has a few nonmagic levels under her belt. Wouldn't be enough to stop the dragon in any case.

They always could have some neighbors around that might try to help. Which probably isn't much of concern to the dragon as she's already scouted out the place.

[MickJay]

Very unlikely, the dragon already scouted the area and if there was some risk, she'd be prepared for that. I don't doubt the "Parent" can pull off an equivalent of pulling a shotgun from the wall to defend h'self and the children, but I don't think it would accomplish anything. There will be no time to prepare or call neighbours, either, since the dragon's going to appear right on the front lawn.

V would probably be despairing less if he knew his mate had chances with the dragon, too.

[Zombie of tap]

This is ridiculous, but it's always been comforting for me to believe that V's mate was a retired 18th level rogue, and the kids are immortal.

[Kaytara]

V's mate should have at least a few levels on him, though. If he's a druid, he may be able to wildshape into something big enough to slow the dragon down.

[Morty]

I V's mate could fight well enough to at least have a chance against the dragon, V wouldn't be quite as horrified by the dragon's threat.

[tom712]

Don't forget that the dragon was observing V's house for few days. He probably found out what is the other parent capable of. He is not dumb.

Anyway, judging from V's expression... his mate won't be a threat to the dragon and V knows it.

[Kaytara]

Don't forget that the dragon was observing V's house for few days. He probably found out what is the other parent capable of. He is not dumb.

Anyway, judging from V's expression... his mate won't be a threat to the dragon and V knows it.

I don't think you can learn just how adept in combat someone is by watching them cook and clean the house for a few days.

If V's mate stood a chance against the dragon, I'm sure V would be pretty horrified anyway, so that's no indication.

In any case, I never said the mate would actually threaten the dragon - just be able to slow it down for a few rounds, possibly buying V the time to get his children to safety, or something. V is horrified because, at this point, that doesn't seem like an option at the moment, since he can't Teleport.

[ukemi]

V's mate could be keeping house while V is out adventuring, trying to level up. Once V catches up to their mate, they will go adventure together.

Just a thought.

[Oslecamo]

V's mate could be keeping house while V is out adventuring, trying to level up. Once V catches up to their mate, they will go adventure together.

Just a thought.

Since the mate said V will return when he/she "masters the ways of magic", then the dragon would be running into some epic character.

On the other hand, V seemed quite worried about the dragon going after them.

[Rajhiim]

I don't know if we can just assume V's other half is doomed. Some have pointed out perhaps V's mate can defend h'self but that thought has been countered with thoughts of if that was the case, V wouldn't be so worried.

Well consider -- V is 100% arrogant and self-centered when it comes to power. V's mate could be an equal level druid and V would still deem V > V's mate. V thinks V > all, including "the laws of physics." :smile:

I do think the next couple strips, V's story line anyhow, could be dark.

Oh -- about the actual strip - I am surprised the Giant let us even see V's mate. It would have been hilarious for us to never have actually seen the other "parent."

One more point - anyone else notice both children are much darker than V and V's mate? Perhaps the proverbial milkman has been around town?

:belkar:

[Aquillion]

On the other hand, V seemed quite worried about the dragon going after them.Maybe V is horrified at what will happen to the dragon. :smalltongue:

[Adumbration]

Perhaps V's mate will wildshape into that infamous, overpowered grappling machine from one of the Monster Manuals?

I think a druid wouldn't be farfetched at all: requires no special equipment that a dragon would notice - armor, weapons, spellbooks, excessive magic items. It also fits V's mate's outlook: lean, mean and green.

[Zombie of tap]

On the other hand, V seemed quite worried about the dragon going after them.

V's mate could have never told V.....:smallsmile::smalleek:....

[whitelaughter]

People in D&D tend to clump by character level; I imagine that V's mate is the same level that V was at the start of the comic. As V has gained at least 10 levels since then, V's mate is toast.

Even if spouse was an Epic level spellcaster, Mumma Dragon will have the element of suprise, the option to cast buffing spells and the panic caused by two noncombatant children in the combat zone. Mumma Dragon could repeat her tactic of antimagic to casually dismantle the family; or be truly evil and Magic Jar into one the the children, and force spouse to fight hir own child to the death.

This assumes of course, that Mumma Dragon is telling the truth; a prudent dragon would have slaughtered the family before engaging V, so that even if she'd been defeated by V her revenge would have been complete. There would be no reason to tell V this; the pain is geater by creating a false sense of hope.

Either way, V has spent 4 panels trying to think of a way to save the family - the window of opportunity in which to act has passed, and V knows it.

[Kaihaku]

Sure, V's mate can fight.

A more relevant question is can V's mate defeat a prepared ancient black dragon with sorcerer levels? Probably not.

[Tempest Fennac]

Considering how V's mate has been looking after the children for over 2 decades, I doubt s/he has class leves unless they were an adventurer before hand.I'm guessing s/he is an Expert at best.

[Tyrmatt]

Just curious, did we ever see the wizard who indoctrinated V in OtooPCs? I remember something about V living in a tower but I've never read it myself.

Just curious...

[Kaytara]

Just curious, did we ever see the wizard who indoctrinated V in OtooPCs? I remember something about V living in a tower but I've never read it myself.

Just curious...

Yes, that wizard's name is Aarindarius. But he was wearing a robe and had a very different hairstyle. And the whole 'kicking V out of the tower so that the elf doesn't become isolated from the world' story makes a lot less sense if you assume that Aarindarius is V's mate.
So, in any case, they look significantly different and while they could be the same person (Origins is in black and white, so obviously it's hard to be sure), I doubt the Giant would mislead us like that.

[David Argall]

Now what sort of story would you have if V's mate could seriously bother the dragon? Enough to slow the dragon down so V can rush to the rescue is possible, but this is V's story, and that means the rest of the family are just princesses waiting for rescue.

[Volkov]

Maybe V's mate is like, super powerful, and will kill the dragon?
/Discuss

Is he/she/it/hermaphrodite as powerful as an entire level 20 party? If not it doesn't matter the dragon will destroy them.

[Snake-Aes]

Is he/she/it/hermaphrodite as powerful as an entire level 20 party? If not it doesn't matter the dragon will destroy them.

To be fair, a lvl 17 party should be able to take on the ABD :p

[Volkov]

To be fair, a lvl 17 party should be able to take on the ABD :p

An ABD has a cr of 18 if I remember, and it has a few levels in sorcerer. While all players hand book classes are non associated for dragons *The Draconimicon states so If I remember* thus each level of sorcerer adds only half a CR point, it seems that the ABD has at least 3 levels in the class and probably has on the order of anywhere from four through ten. I would say it probably has six or seven.

[whatchamacallit]

*Yawns* *awaits comic that will answer questions*

[Gamiress]

People in D&D tend to clump by character level; I imagine that V's mate is the same level that V was at the start of the comic. As V has gained at least 10 levels since then, V's mate is toast.

The characters were about 7-9th level at the beginning of the comic, and V is probably level 13 or 14 now.

If V's mate is a 7-9th level Druid or Ranger, s/he could probably hold off the dragon for about three rounds before things go completely off kilter, maybe enough time to give V a chance to save the children... but not his mate.

[Zeful]

People in D&D tend to clump by character level; I imagine that V's mate is the same level that V was at the start of the comic. As V has gained at least 10 levels since then, V's mate is toast.Where is this assumption supported anywhere? At all?


Even if spouse was an Epic level spellcaster, Mumma Dragon will have the element of suprise, the option to cast buffing spells and the panic caused by two noncombatant children in the combat zone. Mumma Dragon could repeat her tactic of antimagic to casually dismantle the family; or be truly evil and Magic Jar into one the the children, and force spouse to fight hir own child to the death.

This assumes of course, that Mumma Dragon is telling the truth; a prudent dragon would have slaughtered the family before engaging V, so that even if she'd been defeated by V her revenge would have been complete. There would be no reason to tell V this; the pain is geater by creating a false sense of hope.While it would be prudent to kill the family before confronting V (which is likely), I don't think this is the case. The sense of false hope is there, but only because the dragon may do something blindingly stupid, and get killed by someone with class levels, as I doubt V's mate actually has.


Either way, V has spent 4 panels trying to think of a way to save the family - the window of opportunity in which to act has passed, and V knows it.I agree.

[Volkov]

Challenge rating does not equal the level a SOLO character can be to fight the monster on even terms. For V's mate to take on the ABD on even terms he/she/it would have to be of Epic level, at least level 30 or more. I seriously, seriously doubt he/she/it is that powerful. If that was so then it would be V who would have stayed at home while the Mate adventured.

[hamishspence]

depends on how its handled. a wizard or fighter of Level X is considered CR X.

and an encounter of the same CR as the party is considered a reasonable fight, that should use up about a fifth of the party's resources, and not kill any. Not so much of an even fight, as something they are expected to win, and losing would be unusual.

Whereas, if party member was alone, all other things being equal, it would be an "even fight" in the sense that either side has a 50% chance to win.

CR can be a little tricky- maybe monsters are very slightly under-CRed. But, if V's mate's level (and CR) was equal to the dragons, it should be an "even fight" in that sense.

[Volkov]

depends on how its handled. a wizard or fighter of Level X is considered CR X.

and an encounter of the same CR as the party is considered a reasonable fight, that should use up about a fifth of the party's resources, and not kill any. Not so much of an even fight, as something they are expected to win, and losing would be unusual.

Whereas, if party member was alone, all other things being equal, it would be an "even fight" in the sense that either side has a 50% chance to win.

CR can be a little tricky- maybe monsters are very slightly under-CRed. But, if V's mate's level (and CR) was equal to the dragons, it should be an "even fight" in that sense.

CR is determined if it's a good fight for a four man party consisting of a fighter, wizard, rogue, and cleric of that level. This system breaks down with a 12 man party of clerics. I once DM'd for a party like this, killing so much as one of them is nigh impossible without bringing in the 24 virtual age category red dragon in and using a maximized breath weapon. Also undead pretty much proved useless since they all got turned to the nine hells and back.

[Aquillion]

CR is determined if it's a good fight for a four man party consisting of a fighter, wizard, rogue, and cleric of that level.Yes, but "good fight" has a very specific meaning in this context -- it doesn't mean a "challenging fight" or an "even-odds fight" (because if every fight was even odds, the chance of any player advancing past first level would be stupifyingly low -- average 11 encounters to level, 50% chance of surviving each, for a 0.5^11 = 0.00048828125-in-1 chance of surviving each level.

Instead, a CR = ECL encounter for a four-person band is typically enough for them to beat with fairly low danger by expending 20% of their resources. It is not intended to be a particularly difficult fight at all (and, indeed, major 'boss' encounters are supposed to be a CR or several above the PCs for just this reason, because otherwise they would be generally unexciting.)

[Volkov]

Yes, but "good fight" has a very specific meaning in this context -- it doesn't mean a "challenging fight" or an "even-odds fight" (because if every fight was even odds, the chance of any player advancing past first level would be stupifyingly low -- average 11 encounters to level, 50% chance of surviving each, for a 0.5^11 = 0.00048828125-in-1 chance of surviving each level.

Instead, a CR = ECL encounter for a four-person band is typically enough for them to beat with fairly low danger by expending 20% of their resources. It is not intended to be a particularly difficult fight at all (and, indeed, major 'boss' encounters are supposed to be a CR or several above the PCs for just this reason, because otherwise they would be generally unexciting.)

I still don't think that V's mate could have a hope in the hells to fight off the Dragon, because without a Cleric, all CR's leap greatly. In fact the Cleric is the closest thing to a necessary party member.

[MammonAzrael]

Well there ya go. V's mate can fight off the pangs of hunger, but that's about it.

[Assassin89]

Well there ya go. V's mate can fight off the pangs of hunger, but that's about it.

V's mate could cause the dragon to choke on a very dry muffin/pastry, but Constitution modifiers would make it difficult.

There is also the possibility of the dragon being knocked unconscious by a hard pastry.

-4 improvised weapon penalty applies though

[Silverraptor]

dun dun DUNNN!!!! We have an answer! Our sources says... Apprentice Baker VS Ancient Black Dragon! Everyone lock in your votes, its going to be a hell of a one sided fight! My money's on the Dragon. Unless V tags his/her mate in the middle of the fight.:smalltongue:

[Kaihaku]

Well there ya go. V's mate can fight off the pangs of hunger, but that's about it.

Eyep, now this thread can die.

[Silverraptor]

Eyep, now this thread can die.

Hell yes!:belkar:

[Raging Gene Ray]

V's mate could cause the dragon to choke on a very dry muffin/pastry, but Constitution modifiers would make it difficult.


Wouldn't be the first time someone was saved by a highly improbable Deus ex Machina.

[The_Void]

Wouldn't be the first time someone was saved by a highly improbable Deus ex Machina.

...

You do realise that that wouldn't be a Deus Ex Machina, don't you? Highly improbable? Yes. Deus Ex Machina? No. It's just been foreshadowed in this very chapter.

[Trixie]

Why would V marry someone not only incapable of using magic, but incapable of anything other than baking? :smallsigh:

[MorhgorRB]

Why would V marry someone not only incapable of using magic, but incapable of anything other than baking? :smallsigh:

V just loves those pastries!

[King of Nowhere]

Maybe he has weapon specialization: rolling pin.
Oh, wait, he or she or it is an apprentice...

[kusje]

...

You do realise that that wouldn't be a Deus Ex Machina, don't you? Highly improbable? Yes. Deus Ex Machina? No. It's just been foreshadowed in this very chapter.

What are you guys referring to?

[Damocles]

Remember, that the humble doily is indeed the Gateway to ULTIMATE COSMIC POWER (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0033.html)!

[Surfing HalfOrc]

OK, so V's mate CANNOT fight the ABD... But can s/he grab the kids, and haill butt to V's Master's Tower? I don't think that sending Qarr is such a non-starter on the third option as it is on the first two.

I'm sure the Giant has a plan, but what if it's as simple as "Run Away!" :smallwink:

[Zeful]

Why would V marry someone not only incapable of using magic, but incapable of anything other than baking? :smallsigh:

Love? V's and Elf not a Vulcan.

[mcv]

Why would V marry someone not only incapable of using magic, but incapable of anything other than baking?

Can we take this is proof that V is male?

[Snake-Aes]

Can we take this is proof that V is male?

No, but we can take it as proof that Trixie didn't exactly make a happy choice on what to say.

[Ozymandias9]

All hope is not lost! Perhaps V's mate is apprenticed to the baker that got Galactus to stop eating worlds in Marvel Team-up 137 (http://www.comicvine.com/marvel-team-up-/37-23882/). Though perhaps not: there is, after all, no Aunt May to help this time.

Wow, that was geeky, even for me. It will be interesting to see how the Giant resolves this one. I don't think the comic's tone is dark enough that he would actually kill them to do character development for V, but at this point I'm seeing fewer and fewer other outs. This is a phenomenally executed plot twist.

[nleseul]

Remember, that the humble doily is indeed the Gateway to ULTIMATE COSMIC POWER (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0033.html)!

So, clearly, the four words will be spoken soon.

"Imp! Fetch a doily!"

[Kaytara]

Well, this little revelation just makes me all the more curious about how the hell Vaarsuvius and his mate met. Especially if it took them years of constant contact to fall in love with each other.

[Morty]

Well, this little revelation just makes me all the more curious about how the hell Vaarsuvius and his mate met. Especially if it took them years of constant contact to fall in love with each other.

Perhaps V's mate worked for a baker who provided V and his/her master with food? Even wizards need to eat.

[Raging Gene Ray]

...
Highly improbable? Yes. Deus Ex Machina? No. It's just been foreshadowed in this very chapter.

What's the difference? I thought a Deux Ex Machina was any highly improbable event from an outside force...like the Zombie Dragon's head falling on the Death Knight.

[Optimystik]

What's the difference? I thought a Deux Ex Machina was any highly improbable event from an outside force...like the Zombie Dragon's head falling on the Death Knight.

Foreshadowing is the literary device specifically designed to counter DEMs. For example, V was saved from Leeky's treants by Durkon's thunder blast; that was not a Deus Ex because he himself discovered they weren't protected against Sonic. Textbook foreshadowing :smallsmile:

[Zeful]

What's the difference? I thought a Deux Ex Machina was any highly improbable event from an outside force...like the Zombie Dragon's head falling on the Death Knight.

Deus ex Machina: Literally God as machine. Refers to a god or other outside force solving the entanglements of the plot, generally ending the story/arc.

In this case the dragon choking on a muffin would be very, very stupid, but not DeM. DeM would be the Black dragon kills and eats the kids and while casting the Soul bind spells, and having a Gold Dragon/Epic+ Adventurer/God teleporting in killing the Black Dragon and raising the children. DeM would not be while the Black dragon was casting the soul bind spell, is attacked by Gold Dragon/Epic+ Adventurer/God, killed, and then the new character soul binding the children and the dragon as it solves nothing.

DeM seams to be used synonymously with butt-pull, simply because of the lack of foreshadowing.

[Snake-Aes]

Deus ex Machina: Literally God as machine. Refers to a god or other outside force solving the entanglements of the plot, generally ending the story/arc.

In this case the dragon choking on a muffin would be very, very stupid, but not DeM. DeM would be the Black dragon kills and eats the kids and while casting the Soul bind spells, and having a Gold Dragon/Epic+ Adventurer/God teleporting in killing the Black Dragon and raising the children. DeM would not be while the Black dragon was casting the soul bind spell, is attacked by Gold Dragon/Epic+ Adventurer/God, killed, and then the new character soul binding the children and the dragon as it solves nothing.

DeM seams to be used synonymously with butt-pull, simply because of the lack of foreshadowing.Actually, Mama dragon choking on a muffin would be a very exemplay usage of Deus ex machina.

Remember the book War of the Worlds? All of a sudden the bad guys were defeated without any action coming from the humans. No one even realized what happened since it was so sudden. Deus ex machina.

[Optimystik]

Actually, Mama dragon choking on a muffin would be a very exemplay usage of Deus ex machina.

Remember the book War of the Worlds? All of a sudden the bad guys were defeated without any action coming from the humans. No one even realized what happened since it was so sudden. Deus ex machina.

No it wouldn't. A baker would know what to put in a muffin to make it expand quickly (i.e. yeast.) Because we know V's mate is a baker, that's foreshadowing. There was no foreshadowing of Earth's 'lethal atmosphere' in WotW.

Now I'm in no way saying the death-by-muffin occurrence is likely, but it wouldn't be a Deus Ex. Read Zeful's post.

[Balgus]

Why would V marry someone not only incapable of using magic, but incapable of anything other than baking? :smallsigh:
V likes control... and having a housewife/husband means that V can wear the pants in the relationship.

Very strong evidence that V is a man... or a very masculine woman.

[Snake-Aes]

No it wouldn't. A baker would know what to put in a muffin to make it expand quickly (i.e. yeast.) Because we know V's mate is a baker, that's foreshadowing. There was no foreshadowing of Earth's 'lethal atmosphere' in WotW.

Now I'm in no way saying the death-by-muffin occurrence is likely, but it wouldn't be a Deus Ex. Read Zeful's post.

You're forgetting one little detail: how the hell will m9 baker know that a dragon is incoming, and how would it be reasonable in any form to have the dragon eat it, and make it in such a manner the dragon would die?

Bakers don't carry black gunpowder in d&d either O.o

[Optimystik]

You're forgetting one little detail: how the hell will m9 baker know that a dragon is incoming, and how would it be reasonable in any form to have the dragon eat it, and make it in such a manner the dragon would die?

Bakers don't carry black gunpowder in d&d either O.o

He's a baker. Muffins and yeast are probably on hand. Both times we've seen him he was carrying a tray of baked goodies.

I already said it wasn't likely, but if it DID happen it wouldn't be a Deus Ex.

[Faramir]

All hope is not lost! Perhaps V's mate is apprenticed to the baker that got Galactus to stop eating worlds in Marvel Team-up 137 (http://www.comicvine.com/marvel-team-up-/37-23882/). Though perhaps not: there is, after all, no Aunt May to help this time.

Wow, that was geeky, even for me. It will be interesting to see how the Giant resolves this one. I don't think the comic's tone is dark enough that he would actually kill them to do character development for V, but at this point I'm seeing fewer and fewer other outs. This is a phenomenally executed plot twist.

LOL, the Golden Oldie was always my favorite herald of Galactus :).

[Snake-Aes]

He's a baker. Muffins and yeast are probably on hand. Both times we've seen him he was carrying a tray of baked goodies.

I already said it wasn't likely, but if it DID happen it wouldn't be a Deus Ex.

He's a baker. Having a heart attack at the sight of a dragon is probably on hand.

[Optimystik]

He's a baker. Having a heart attack at the sight of a dragon is probably on hand.

I. Said. It. Is. Not. Likely. Already.

Improbable != Deus Ex Machina. Done with you.

[Rotipher]

There was no foreshadowing of Earth's 'lethal atmosphere' in WotW.


Actually there was, if you know your biology. The description of the Martians' anatomy, which precedes their eventual demise, makes no mention of any structures corresponding to an immune system. They didn't even produce their own white blood cells, but stole blood from other life forms.

[Raging Gene Ray]

Hmmmm....nice debate on what does and doesn't constitute a Deus Ex Machina.

I still think that the whole V's mate stops them thing is unlikely. Too easy. But:

V's master could be over having dinner with the family. Then conveniently save them...and V is shocked to discover that whatever Infernal Pact shi just made was unnecessary.

Come to think of it, even if V could teleport there, shi's already used up hir decent attack spells.

[Rotipher]

He's a baker. Muffins and yeast are probably on hand. Both times we've seen him he was carrying a tray of baked goodies.

Looked to me more like Parent was carrying a salad, in the first scene.

[Optimystik]

Actually there was, if you know your biology. The description of the Martians' anatomy, which precedes their eventual demise, makes no mention of any structures corresponding to an immune system. They didn't even produce their own white blood cells, but stole blood from other life forms.

Did it specifically say "they have no immune system"? Because that would be foreshadowing, and therefore their deaths wouldn't be a Deus Ex.


Looked to me more like Parent was carrying a salad, in the first scene.

Silly me. :smallredface:

[Gilby]

Maybe Baker is an elven word for something else than we know it as. We have only seen a couple strips of the Mate, granted she was in cooking attire does that really mean she's a baker as we know it? V is the only one to say "baker" anyways.

Come on, A dragon attacking a baker...that dragon is toast, or that dragon is cooked.

[Eloel]

Gah, it's obvious...

V's mate is a warmage that specializes in fire spells. That's how he bakes stuff. Dragon is toast.

[Nimrod's Son]

Maybe Baker is an elven word for something else than we know it as. We have only seen a couple strips of the Mate, granted she was in cooking attire does that really mean she's a baker as we know it? V is the only one to say "baker" anyways.
...Except Vaarsuvius refers to his mate as a "pastry chef" in the very same strip. Unless you're suggesting that's also some sort of elven code?

[Rotipher]

Did it specifically say "they have no immune system"? Because that would be foreshadowing, and therefore their deaths wouldn't be a Deus Ex.


No, but the term "immune system" wasn't in use when Wells wrote the novel. He'd have known that a body needs white blood cells to resist disease, however, and that defensive cells abound in organs (spleen, lymph nodes, tonsils) that the Martians explicitly lacked.

It's a subtle piece of foreshadowing, hard to spot if you don't have the relevant biological knowledge. But then, the Oracle's reference to his "important client" was rather veiled too, and I doubt anyone here would dispute that it foreshadowed Mama Dragon's appearance.

[MickJay]

Oh come on, everyone knows bakers have huge potential for having powerful magical abilities. Jack from The Book of Words is just the most famous example. :smalltongue:

[Chas the mage]

Maybe v's mate is an apprentice wizard specializing in the spell school of bakery! with spells like... uhh... bannana nut muffin missile? Bigbies tripping danish? Detect delicious? Baking soda splash? Ray of Frosting?

[Eleshar]

Perhaps V's mate is an Epic Level Baker with abilities like Resist fire, Create greater paste golem and Frying gaze...

[Lunaya]

I predict the spell, "Summon Top Chef". Gordon Ramsay materializes to give Mommy Dragon a sound tongue-lashing, humiliating her so thoroughly that she flies away in tears.

[MickJay]

Gordon Ramsey nothing, there's one guy who owns a small restaurant situated not far from Tyne river in UK, now HE is scary.

[Optimystik]

No, but the term "immune system" wasn't in use when Wells wrote the novel. He'd have known that a body needs white blood cells to resist disease, however, and that defensive cells abound in organs (spleen, lymph nodes, tonsils) that the Martians explicitly lacked.

But he didn't specifically say they lacked any systems that approximated white blood cells, either. In fact, his story set up quite the opposite - they were draining our blood, therefore they should have gotten OUR white cells and derived OUR resistances and immunities from it. The fact that they all died anyway was therefore a blatant Deus Ex.

[kusje]

Even if you could foresee that the aliens had no immune system, it still made for a pretty crappy ending because the protagonists had nothing to do with it. They could have just died right at the start and the aliens would still have been stopped.

[Nimrod's Son]

Apparently half of this forum's members know V's mate better than V does.

While he's there panicking out of his mind because he's absolutely certain that his mate is completely defenseless, V's mate is gathering strength at an astronomical rate, powered entirely by this board's optimism. That dragon doesn't stand a chance.


I predict the spell, "Summon Top Chef". Gordon Ramsay materializes to give Mommy Dragon a sound tongue-lashing, humiliating her so thoroughly that she flies away in tears.
I wouldn't be so quick to underestimate that dragon; it's been around the block a few times, after all. I think I speak for the majority of the intelligent people in the UK when I say that Gordon Ramsey is an outspoken cretin who who only seems intimidating until you stand back and listen to anything he has to say. We've had to put up with his omnipresence for a while now, and he's moved on to the USA because he's well aware that his nonsense is wearing very thin over here. Give him a chance to settle in, and I'm sure you'll find him as empty and pathetic as we do. :smallwink:

[Flickerdart]

Apparently half of this forum's members know V's mate better than V does.

While he's there panicking out of his mind because he's absolutely certain that his mate is completely defenseless, V's mate is gathering strength at an astronomical rate, powered entirely by this board's optimism. That dragon doesn't stand a chance.
Hey, there are plenty of people rooting for the Smaugette as well.

And yes, that is the dragon's name now. The Smaugette.

[Nimrod's Son]

Hey, there are plenty of people rooting for the Smaugette as well.
Well, I did say only "half the board".

As an unrelated aside, your avatar is completely excellent.

[Optimystik]

Hey, there are plenty of people rooting for the Smaugette as well.

And yes, that is the dragon's name now. The Smaugette.

Hey now - I don't think even the posters that believe the dragon to be justified think its fair to drag V's mate and kids into this.

And for the ones that do... have a heart!

[Ozymandias9]

The fact that they all died anyway was therefore a blatant Deus Ex.

No: just because a resolution is bad does not make it Deus Ex Machina. In this case, despite a clear misunderstanding of how the plot device used for resolution would actually work, it was clearly something that was intended as an element of the story as a whole.

Deus Ex Machina implies a resolution of the plot by a mechanism unrelated to the body of the plot: it's derived from the Greek tool often used by Euripidies (half of his existent plays use it). A common example of it is from his play Alcestis, where Hercules (hitherto absent from the play) shows up at the last moment and saves the heroine from the grasp of Death.

[Optimystik]

No: just because a resolution is bad does not make it Deus Ex Machina. In this case, despite a clear misunderstanding of how the plot device used for resolution would actually work, it was clearly something that was intended as an element of the story as a whole.

I just explained the plot point that elevated it from "bad resolution" to "divine intervention." The aliens' weakness was the lack of protections located conveniently in our bloodstreams. They drain said blood, yet poof! No protection. The fact that this turn of the plot is utterly unexpected is precisely what makes it a Deus Ex, as defined by Wikipedia.

Loose end: Aliens unkillable.
Solution: Lethal Earth Bacteria!
Snag: They're consuming the antidote in copious amounts.
Deus Ex: Kill them anyway!

[Rotipher]

Eh. There's no reason the Martians should have been able to incorporate human blood into their systems successfully -- the biochemistry of two different worlds' residents couldn't possibly have been that compatible -- so the vampiric aspect of their physiology wouldn't come close to working anyway. If anything, human WBCs and antibodies would mistake the entire Martian body for one big germ, and would wind up racing the bacteria to see which could kill them first! Nonetheless, it's at least a hint as to what's fatally lacking in the Martians, which is all foreshadowing really requires.

The repeated references to how humans were losing out to the Martians on an evolutionary scale, by analogy with other Earth animals losing out to humans, anticipated the irony of the ending as well: after all, humans in Wells' pre-antibiotic day were also largely helpless against bacteria, and they (along with viruses) remain our chief natural enemies.