jack of all trades

[lilhowie624]

ok im starting a new charecter and i wanted to make him a pretty much jack of all trades and the master of none. and i would like a little help.

the restrictions are no more than 5 lvs in any class
must multi class 4+ times

needs an avg bab
saves and skills dont care

so far im thinking
bard
spell thief
dusk blade
cleric

but id like more cheese on my plate than i got.

all DnD wotc stamped books are a go. just cite the source so i can read up
again ty all in advance

[BRC]

Factotum is kind of the ultimate "Jack of all Trades" class, I would go with Factotum, Rogue, Chamelon(PRC) and somthing else.

[RagnaroksChosen]

ok im starting a new charecter and i wanted to make him a pretty much jack of all trades and the master of none. and i would like a little help.

the restrictions are no more than 5 lvs in any class
must multi class 4+ times

needs an avg bab
saves and skills dont care

so far im thinking
bard
spell thief
dusk blade
cleric

but id like more cheese on my plate than i got.

all DnD wotc stamped books are a go. just cite the source so i can read up
again ty all in advance

Well I would do some thing like

Duskblade 3
Spell thief 1
bard 5 [With alternate bardic knack]
Divine soul 5
Factotum x

Feats
able learner or jack of all trades
Master spell theif

[Darth Stabber]

Rogue 5
Spellthief 5
Dread commando 5
Scout 5

You end up with 12 bonus damage dice, wear Armor with no penalty (except spell Failure)

[monty]

Edit: I can't read, apparently.

[Sstoopidtallkid]

Do you have to multiclass? Factotum/Chameleon or Bard with Bardic Knack is usually the best at doing anything, with a proper build. Alternatively, someone could link Haberdash for you, for a character that can really do anything.

[Starbuck_II]

ok im starting a new charecter and i wanted to make him a pretty much jack of all trades and the master of none. and i would like a little help.

the restrictions are no more than 5 lvs in any class
must multi class 4+ times

needs an avg bab
saves and skills dont care

so far im thinking
bard
spell thief
dusk blade
cleric

but id like more cheese on my plate than i got.

all DnD wotc stamped books are a go. just cite the source so i can read up
again ty all in advance

Domotrovi (Fey HD 2) 2 LA 2, Lurk 5, Swashbuckler 3, Warblade 5, Slayer 3

[Draz74]

Incarnate is an interesting jack-of-all-trades, albeit with poor BAB.

What I really can't believe nobody's mentioned, though, is the Binder.

Let's see ...

Factotum 3 / Binder 3 / Incarnate 3 / Marshal 2 / Chameleon 5 / Exemplar 4 would be entertaining. The Improved Binding feat is a must.

This character only has +14 BAB, though.

[Eldariel]

Bard with Bardic Knack & the feat Jack of All Trades is pretty good in all skills. Add to that Bards' decent spellcasting, medium BAB, decent saves, Bardic Music, decent weapon proficiencies and I think we have a winner.

[Thurbane]

Here's my shortlist that classes and PrCs that excel at being a JoaT:

Bard (PHB)
Binder (ToM)*
Chameleon (RoD)
Dragonfire Adept (DrMa)
Exemplar (CAd)
Factotum (Dng)
Master of Masks (CS)
Rogue (PHB)

*The feats in ToM that allow non-binders to bind (limited) vestiges are also really good to add to versatility.

[lilhowie624]

thats so far for the help.

as for mulitclass yes i must. the DM wants me to show the 3 other players what you can do with a multiclass charecter. hes not giving xp penalty and is leinent of the alinment restrictions. so long as i dont go something like paladin black gaurd. and is willing to let me multi class in and out of restricted classes such as monk and paladin.

can some one spoil the factotum ive never seen that one.

but so far it seems fairly good again ty.

[edit] i can only have a +1 lvl adjustment. as per the dms campaine. would prefer none. going human or something else.

[BRC]

thats so far for the help.

as for mulitclass yes i must. the DM wants me to show the 3 other players what you can do with a multiclass charecter. hes not giving xp penalty and is leinent of the alinment restrictions. so long as i dont go something like paladin black gaurd. and is willing to let me multi class in and out of restricted classes such as monk and paladin.

can some one spoil the factotum ive never seen that one.

but so far it seems fairly good again ty.
The exact stats arn't OGL so we can't post the table or anything for you, but Factotum's are in the book "Dungeonscape" (A great book btw). They can do a little bit of everything, they've got every skill as a class skill, they get things called "Inspiration Points" that they can use to boost their rolls, to heal, to get sneak attack, to cast spells, to turn undead, heck, at higher levels (Though your multiclass limit means you won't get this) they can literally simulate class features from any base class.

[Person_Man]

How about a purely Cha based character?

Marshal (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/ex/20030906b) 4/Hexblade 4/Blackguard 4/Binder 4/Crusader 4

Slippers of Battledancing: +10 land speed, +5 competence bonus to Tumble, and if you have 5 ranks in Perform (dance) you can use your Cha instead of Str or Dex as your bonus to attack with one handed or light weapons. 33,750 gp, DMGII pg 272.

Also, your DM is only half right. Multi-classing is most useful at low-mid levels, because many classes have front loaded their best abilities. For example, a Binder/Totemist/Marshal/Crusader has 4 or more continuous buff effects. At ECL 15ish you tend to do best with Base Class(es) 5ish/Prestige Class 10, with a PrC that has a strong capstone ability. At the highest levels of play builds that have scaled powers (full casters, psionics, binding, maneuvers, etc) and/or an uber capstone such as Knight 20 are the most powerful.

[lilhowie624]

well so far as it seems the classes and feats are

my race is human so i need feats till 20

3 - bard - bardic knack
5 - factorum
5 - chamelion
2 - spell thief
5 - master of masks

feats
jack of all trades
able learner
master spell thief

can anyone else think of any feats to add to the list.
im lookin for general all purpose feats

[Person_Man]

well so far as it seems the classes and feats are

my race is human so i need feats till 20

3 - bard - bardic knack
5 - factorum
5 - chamelion
2 - spell thief
5 - master of masks

feats
jack of all trades
able learner
master spell thief

can anyone else think of any feats to add to the list.
im lookin for general all purpose feats

Quickdraw and TWF. The entire point of taking Master of Masks having proficiency with every exotic weapon and abusing it. Here's how (www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=88633).

[JeminiZero]

the restrictions are no more than 5 lvs in any class
must multi class 4+ times


Can your 4 multiclasses all advance spellcasting (or Binding/Invoking/Initiator for that matter)? E.g. Wizard 5 / IoTSV 5 / Loremaster 5 / Archmage 5?

Human and Changeling both qualify for Able Learner (all skills cost 1 point per rank) which helps with the skills for any heavily multiclassed build (e.g if you splash Rogue on level 1, you can switch to swordsage thereafter and continue to progress Search/Disable/Open Lock without difficulties).

Is there any particular role your Jack of All Trades must fill? E.g. does he need to be the trap monkey?

Edit: How about something like this.

1 Beguiler / 1 Warlock / 4 Cleric / 4 Eldritch Disciple/ 4 Geomancer / 1 Crusader / 5 Ruby Knight Vindicator

You may notice a lot of the classes are taken in 4s. This is to minimize the loss of your BAB. By the scheme above, you average out 15 BAB at level 20, so your BAB is *about* average.

You need:
-At least 15 Int to qualify for Beguiler Precocious Apprentice
-18 Wis by level 20 for your cleric level 8 spells
-4 Intimidate, 4 Hide, 8 K-Religion for Ruby Knight Vindicator
-6 K-Arcane, 6 Knowledge Nature for Geomancer
-8 K-Religion/The Planes for Eldricth Disciple

Important Feats:
Nymph's Kiss (Exalted, so its iffy, grants +1 skill point per level)
Precocious Apprentice (on Beguiler 1 to gualify for Geomancer)
Able Learner
Practiced Spellcaster Cleric
Blend into Shadows (DotU, requires Darkness as an SLA)
Darkstalker (LoM, negate blindsense)

Invocations (3 Least)
1. Devil Sight
2. Darkness
3. Spiderwalk

Important Skills:
1. Concentration
2. Spellcraft
3. Hide
4. Move Silently

At level 20 you end up with spells as a level 15 Cleric (caster level 19) for level 8 spells, Initiator level 12 for level 6 maneuvers. You invoke as a level 5 warlock (for a crappy 3d6 eldritch blast), but you at least get spider climb at will. Warlock Darkness and Blend In Shadows let you Hide in Plain Sight, with Darkstalker to negate Blindsense. You also get 2 Geomancer level 2 Drifts- get Octopus Skin to boost your Hide Checks.

With Beguiler splash and Able Learner you can pick up a couple of other skill monkey skills (Bluff, Open Lock, Sleight of Hand, Search/Disable whatever). You WILL NOT have the skill points to support them all though, as most of your classes are low on skill points and your PrCs are skill hungry (although thankfully not feat hungry).

Nymphs Kiss helps a bit if your DM will let you take it. Try and start with 16 Int, and Beguiler on level 1 to get lots of skill points. You also want at least 13 Wis (put your 5 level up points to Wis to get 18 natueral Wis for your level 8 cleric spells).

You have about 2 free feats. Bind Vestige/Improved Bind helps add to your versatility. Craven can grant you some sneak attack. If you take a flaw, you can use 3 free feats to go down the extend/persist/DMM spell + nightstick abuse route.

[lilhowie624]

as i said i appreciate your help all of you. as for the spell caster lvls and initiator lvls its with classes that support them.

i like the spread of class abilities and skills.

and to answer a few questions i will be the skill monkey of the group.

my group as i found out over the weekend is as follows
fighter - 14
knight - 15
barbarian 9 / ranger 6
cleric 10 / marshel 6

me -> ill start at lvl 12 and go from there

and as i stated if i can source the wotc book all classes and feats are availiable.

my DM is generous and will allow 2 flaws for 2 feats.
they have to be flaws i will use.

[dspeyer]

The 12th level build that occurs to me is factotum 3 / beguiler 4 / bard 1 / swordsage 4.

Factotum at the start gives you 8 skills at the vital first hit die and means you can take max ranks in any skill forever. If you take able learner, you'll never have to worry about class skills again. 3rd level is when it lets you use int for most skill checks.

Beguiler gives you a lot of arcane options. The save DCs may be low, but that doesn't matter with divinations or well-placed illusions. You can also now use scrolls of some very powerful spells, and they're surprisingly cheap. Level 4 gives you second level spells, which is all level 5 would give you (except silent spell, but if you really want it, just take it).

Bard gives you bardic music and bardic knowledge (very handy, especially if you boost your intelligence way up).

Swordsage taken here starts you with 6 level 3 manuevers. You'll have a BAB of 8 and no precision damage (except assasin's stance), but these should let you hold your own in combat.

Beguiler, bard and swordsage all have 6+int skills.

After that, consider rogue (for real sneak attack), more bard (for the special abilities), cloistered cleric (for healing and buffing), or druid (wild shape is versatile enough to give up 10 skill points for it).

[Broler]

If i were you, i wouldn't take any spell casting classes without any classes like mystic theurge. otherwise that side is useless

[dspeyer]

If i were you, i wouldn't take any spell casting classes without any classes like mystic theurge. otherwise that side is useless

Prestige classes that extend the most important feature of a class strike me as cheating here.

On the other hand, low-level non-offensive spells can be very useful. Skimming through what a 4th level beguiler gets, I'd say that Dancing Lights, Detect Magic, Message, Comprehend Languages, Mage Armor, Silent Image, Fog Cloud, Glitterdust, Invisibility, Knock, and Spider Climb will be useful even to a 20th level character.

[Thurbane]

Conjurer 4/Master Specialist 4/Mage of The Arcane Order 4/Elemental Savant 4/Archmage 4?

[JeminiZero]

Prestige classes that extend the most important feature of a class strike me as cheating here.


Perhaps, but he is starting a good 2-4 levels below everyone else. If he wants to pull his weight, he may want to cheat a little.

Your group seems to lack a primary arcanist. Do consider Beguiler or Wizard of some sort (with PRCs to extend casting).

[lilhowie624]

im not afraid of what is

Originally Posted by dspeyer
Prestige classes that extend the most important feature of a class strike me as cheating here
since my goal is to make the most of all the class abilites i can. and no they dont have a prime arcanist. they belive if it can get it itll die. and if i cant stab it ill shoot it. one way or another ill kill it.
once i enter the game i dont wanna just have cheese on my plate i want the whole factory with me. i start playing in about a week(dm is currently taking some leave) and im just trying to make sure my build is ready.
my stats were given to me as follows they match everyone elses. dm wanted to minimize bad rolls and gaurentee the best of your class is obtained due to a higher stat.
18 16 14 14 12 12

[Egiam]

Complete adventurer is great for this idea. As Howie mentioned, it even has a feat called "Jack of all Trades".

[JeminiZero]

An alternative to being a controller Wizard, would be the Archivist, which gets a bunch of wizard spells through domains, and has Druid spells. It also lets you wear armor without worrying about ASF. And they are Int based casting so that will help out a little with skills.

Only problem with Archivist is that most divine PrCs require turn undead which they DO NOT get. So you will likely want to take 4 levels of Sacred Exorcist somewhere along the line to start entering divine PrCs (grants turn undead, full casting, 4 levels is to make the most of 3/4 BAB). Turn undead also lets you abuse DMM.

Archivist also get some nifty Dark Knowledge abilities which you will not be able to make full use of. But it may help if you pick up the Collector of Stories Skill trick from Complete Scoundrel.

Also, for trapfinding, pick up the Elemental Plane languages and Summon Elemental Reserve feat. Summon elemental lets you channel a bit of a prepared summon spell and call an elemental of your choice for a few rounds, without expending the spell, so you can do it all day. Elemental Plane languages let you command the elemental to do stuff... like say opening a potentially trapped door, while your party stands a safe distance away.

Other than that, you want Divine PrCs which are easy to enter. Preferably those that don't require too many feats. Geomancer (as above) comes to mind, and can be picked up easily enough with a Beguiler-Precocious apprentice splash. You incidentally also need Beguiler anyway for trapfinding. Geomancer also doesn't require turn undead and can be entered early on.

Eldritch Disciple requires a 1 level splash in warlock. Ruby Knight Vindicator requires a 1 level splash in crusader, but both require turn undead. You might consider picking up those later on.

Putting it all together:

01: Beguiler-Feat: Able Learner, Precocious Apprentice, Extend Spell
02: Archivist 1
03: Archivist 2-Feat: Practiced Spellcaster Archivist
04: Archivist 3
05: Geomancer 1
06: Geomancer 2-Feat: Persist Spell
07: Geomancer 3
08: Geomancer 4 (Pick up Dismissal)
09: Sacred Exorcist 1-Feat: Summon Elemental [Reserve]
10: Sacred Exorcist 2
11: Sacred Exorcist 3
12: Sacred Exorcist 4-Feat: DMM Persist Spell

Race: Because of the unusual multiclassing you are carrying out, it is recommended you go with human to avoid multiclass penalty. Humans also get the nice bonus feat and skills. With 1 bonus level 1 feat, you only need to take 1 flaw to get all 3 level 1 feats in the scheme above.

Skills: Put 18 to Int as that is your prime casting stat. It also grants you bonus skill points. The most important skills for this build are:
1. Concentration
2. Spellcraft
3. Search
4. Disable Device
5. Open Lock

You will also want the knowledge skills pre-reqs to enter the above PrCs.

At level 12, you have the spells of a level 11 Archivist (any Divine spell up to 6th level). You can DMM persist your divine spells so load up on nightsticks. After that, either go down the 1 Crusader/5 Ruby Knight Vindicator or 1 Warlock/4 Eldritch Disciple route.

Source Notes:

Archivist: Base class from Heroes of Horror

Beguiler: Base class from PHB2

Precocious Apprentice: Complete Arcane, lets your level 1 Beguiler cast level 2 spells.

DMM (aka Divine Metamagic): Complete Divine

Sacred Exorcist (Complete Divine pg 56) Requires: Any Good, Knowledge (Planes) 10, Knowledge (Religion) 7, Able to Cast Dismissal of Dispel Evil (Dismissal is a level 4 Cleric spell which Archivists can learn)

Geomancer (Complete Divine pg 41) Requires: Knowledge (arcana) 6 ranks, Knowledge (nature) 6 ranks. Able to cast 2nd-level arcane spells and 2nd-level divine spells.

[dspeyer]

If you're doing the precocious apprentice bit, you may as well take mystic theurge. Five levels of beguiler for free is a nice touch. After that, there are other dual-advancement classes you can take. Ruby Knight Vindicator is pretty good, though the crusader mechanic is weak. You might take martial study twice and have your manuevers as per-encounter powers, saving a caster level. This is especially good if you can still use divine recovery, which I think you can.

You can also go on the arcane side with beguiler 5 / mage of the arcane order 4 / swordsage 1 / jade phoenix mage 5 / ...

On either side, remember loremaster and divine oracle as very easy full-casting prestige classes to enter.

[AppleChips]

What exactly does bardic knack do?

[Eldariel]

Instead of Bardic Knowledge, you can use ½ your Bard-level instead of whatever ranks you have in any given skills as your base check. Basically means you're somewhat proficient in every skill (as long as it's not trained-only; then you need a rank to be proficient) in existence, but only really good in the ones you've heavily invested skillpoints in.

Very Bardic (Jack of All Trades!) and makes Jack of All Trades-feat worthwhile as it provides you with ½ in all skills allowing you to use everything without cramming a point into every Trained Only-skill in the play.