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View Full Version : [D&D3.5]Character Build for tomorrow night



sailor_grenoble
2009-02-28, 01:36 PM
(WARNING: LONG)

Hello Forum!

Tomorrow night, a friend of mine will start a campaign of D&D3.5, with the characters starting at level 20 and (if we don't decide that we really can't appreciate this system) will continue in epic levels.
The campaign will be mostly for laugh, with much gonzo, so the characters will essentially be caricatures, exagerations and larger-than-life personalities.


The GM allows WBL to create the character and about every non-setting specific WotC book (it won't come up soon, but he also had a look at the epic spellcasting rules, and decided this garbage should never have hit the paper in the first place).

I settled for a meleer, whose build will be presented below (there will be at least an arcane caster and a divine caster in the party, plus a skillmonkey)
(why meleer: I 'm burnt out on magic users for now, having played several in parallel in the past year in several different game systems)
(and for those who will ask why no ToB in this build, the answer will be easy: just to see what can be done)


I had a pretty clear idea of what I wanted the character to be able to do so everything went relatively smoothly, except for one thing:
I have no idea for the last two levels of the build, so I'm turning to YOU, forumists, for help, and also because experienced D&D players will see the glaring problems of this build, so that we will stress them during the game


Build:

Fighter 1: Able Learner, Improved Initiative, Endurance
Fighter 2: Weapon Focus (falchion)
Fighter 3: Power Attack
Fighter 4: Improved Bull Rush
Barbarian 1: Rage 1/day, Pounce
Occult Slayer 1: Shock Trooper, Magical Defense +1, Weapon Bond
Occult Slayer 2: Vicious Strike, Mind Over Magic 1/day
Occult Slayer 3: Magical Defense +2, Auravision
Occult Slayer 4: Steadfast Determination, Mind Over Magic 2/day, Nondetection Cloack
Occult Slayer 5: Magical Defense +3, Blank Thoughts
Fighter 5:
Fighter 6: Combat Reflexes, Robilar's Gambit
Fighter 7:
Warlock 1: Eldricht Blast 1d6
Ranger 1: Leap Attack, Favored Ennemy: Outsider (evil), Track, Wild Empathy
Fighter 8: Dodge
Fighter 9:
Fighter 10: Mobility, Elusive Target
Open
Open


Stats: (32 points buy)
Strength: 16+4(lvl)+2(manual)+6(item)=28 (+9) (32/+11 while raging)
Dexterity: 12+1(lvl)+1(manual)+4(item)=18 (+4)
Constitution: 16+2(manual)+4(item)=22 (+6) (26/+8 while raging)
Intelligence: 12=12 (+1)
Wisdom: 10+2(item)=12 (+1)
Charisma: 12+4(item)=16 (+3)


Feats: Able Learner (H), Improved Initiative (F1), Endurance (1), Weapon Focus (falchion) (F2), Power Attack (3), Improved Bull Rush (F4), Shock Trooper (6), Steadfast Determination (9), Combat Reflexes (F6), Robilar's Gambit (12), Leap Attack (15), Track (R1), Dodge (F8), Mobility (F10), Elusive Target (18)


Relevant skills:
Jump 17+9(Str)+1(luck)+5(comp)+2(synergy)-4=+30
Tumble 10+4(Dex)+1(luck)+1(comp)+2(synergy)-4=+14
Spellcraft 17+1(Int)+1(luck)+1(comp)+2(synergy)=+22
UMD 15+3(Cha)+1(luck)+1(comp)=+20


Invocation:
See the Unseen


Equipement:(uses rules in MIC to put bonuses on items with other abilities)
keen, flaming, corrosive, frost, shock, enervating +1 falchion
glamered, ghost ward, nimbleness, moderate fortification, +5 full plate
animated, ghost ward, +4 heavy steel shield
ring of protection +5
ring of evasion
wings of flying of resistance +5 of charisma +4
pale green ioun stone
incandescent blue ioun stone
necklace of adaptation of health +4
luckstone
boots of striding and springing
bag of holding (type II)
gloves of dexterity +4
belt of giant strength +6
manual of bodily health +2
manual of gainful exercise +2
manual of quickness of action +1
wand of Dimension Door (50 charges)
wand of CLW (50 charges)
heward's handy haversack


For now, my defences look like that:
AC: 37 (flat-footed 34)
Touch AC: 27
Fort Save: 25 (28 against spells) plus whatever the last 2 levels will add; no auto-fail on a 1
Ref Save: 19 (22 against spells) plus whatever the last 2 levels will add
Will Save: 22 (25 against spells) plus whatever the last 2 levels will add
Immune to Mind-Affecting effects
spellturning as per the spell (except that it also works on SLAs) 2/day

As for offence:
full attack on a leaping power attack charge, combined with a flight speed of 60 feet


Miscellaneous:
This build assumes that
_ a spellcaster casts Greater Magic Weapon every morning on the falchion
_ in important fights, deathward and haste are cast on this character

MeklorIlavator
2009-02-28, 02:11 PM
Can't say too much about this build, except the following:
A: Haste should always be cast on the character at this level. You might want to get some boots of speed, but in any case, the spell is just that good.

B: Why is your wisdom high/boosted? After steadfast determination it doesn't provide much to the character, except Roleplaying possibly.

C: Why any of the following feats:
Endurance
Weapon Focus?
Neither of these give great bonues. If you want some other feats that are good, check out the Mage Slayer line from Complete Arcane.

D: For the weapon, have you considered Magebane(Complete Arcane)? Remember, it activates against anything with spell-like abilities! At this level, that's pretty much everything.

E: The AC looks pretty low. Look at some of the epic/high level challenges. So far, most of the one's I've looked at will hit on everything but a 1(and then only because everything misses).

Sendal
2009-02-28, 02:35 PM
You probably already realise this, but the way you wrote this bit makes me think you may have overlooked it.


As for offence:
full attack on a leaping power attack charge, combined with a flight speed of 60 feet

Of course you mean in two different situations, not at the same time. Making a jump check to jump at least 10 feet and landing in a square threatening the target is not possible whilst flying.

If your looking for more useful feats to take (and someone with that many fighter levels usualy is) I would like to say I am a great fan of the combat expertese tree. You would only have to boost your inteligence a little to open that route to your character, and it gives you much needed options.

If you ever find one realy tough oponent with horrific damage output, you can place yourself between it and the party and boost your AC to high heaven. Sure you won't be able to hit it any more, but you can rely on the now safe other party members to do that for you.

sailor_grenoble
2009-02-28, 02:40 PM
Can't say too much about this build, except the following:
A: Haste should always be cast on the character at this level. You might want to get some boots of speed, but in any case, the spell is just that good.I know, that's why I said I assumed it would be cast


B: Why is your wisdom high/boosted? After steadfast determination it doesn't provide much to the character, except Roleplaying possibly.mainly roleplaying


C: Why any of the following feats:
Endurance
Weapon Focus?they are prerequisites for the real stuff: Endurance for Steadfast Determination and Weapon Focus for Occult Slayer. Otherwise, I wouldn't have taken them



D: For the weapon, have you considered Magebane(Complete Arcane)? Remember, it activates against anything with spell-like abilities! At this level, that's pretty much everything.must have missed it. It's outside my budget to add it, but I can exchange enervating for magebane and another +1 ability.


E: The AC looks pretty low. Look at some of the epic/high level challenges. So far, most of the one's I've looked at will hit on everything but a 1(and then only because everything misses).since after a charge, AC will go down anyway, it wasn't really a priority. besides, I'm at the limit of my budget.

sailor_grenoble
2009-02-28, 02:53 PM
Of course you mean in two different situations, not at the same time. Making a jump check to jump at least 10 feet and landing in a square threatening the target is not possible whilst flying.yep, it was a shortcut, leap attack on the ground, and just a flying charge otherwise. (even if, technically, nothing prevents a jump while flying :smalltongue:)


If your looking for more useful feats to take (and someone with that many fighter levels usualy is) I would like to say I am a great fan of the combat expertese tree. You would only have to boost your inteligence a little to open that route to your character, and it gives you much needed options.

If you ever find one realy tough oponent with horrific damage output, you can place yourself between it and the party and boost your AC to high heaven. Sure you won't be able to hit it any more, but you can rely on the now safe other party members to do that for you.I'll have to think about that, but the other players said their characters would take care of themselves, so I didn't consider this path

Starbuck_II
2009-02-28, 02:57 PM
Build:

Fighter 1: Able Learner, Improved Initiative, Endurance
Fighter 2: Weapon Focus (falchion)
Fighter 3: Power Attack
Fighter 4: Improved Bull Rush
Barbarian 1: Rage 1/day, Pounce
Occult Slayer 1: Shock Trooper, Magical Defense +1, Weapon Bond
Occult Slayer 2: Vicious Strike, Mind Over Magic 1/day
Occult Slayer 3: Magical Defense +2, Auravision
Occult Slayer 4: Steadfast Determination, Mind Over Magic 2/day, Nondetection Cloack
Occult Slayer 5: Magical Defense +3, Blank Thoughts
Fighter 5:
Fighter 6: Combat Reflexes, Robilar's Gambit
Fighter 7:
Warlock 1: Eldricht Blast 1d6
Ranger 1: Leap Attack, Favored Ennemy: Outsider (evil), Track, Wild Empathy
Fighter 8: Dodge
Fighter 9:
Fighter 10: Mobility, Elusive Target
Open
Open


You could get +6 Str/Con from Prc Berserker (from Dieties/Demigods) in their fury (like Rage). Your will saves mean you won't have much to worry about failing the will save (more friendly than Frenzied Berserker as you can choose to attack ground when all enemies dead).

ToB of course has lots of good stuff if you decide to go there.

If you had Blind fight, I'd suggest Shadowblade in Tome of Magic. Ignoring miss chance is useful.

If you had Iron Will: Prc Leviathan Hunter wold work.

Also Iron would let you take: Dragonslayer: 2 levels gives you an extra invocation, Immunity to fear, and Damage bonus versus dragons.

A Defiant works: SR versus Divine spells/Add Cha to saves.

A 2 levels of Chaotician isn't bad: Nondetection, 1/day, Displacement that True seeing can't beat, and Choatic Contagion: melee touch foe takes penalty to AC, saves, etc for a few hours. Use/class level.

2 levels of Elemental Warrior: grants resistance to a energy, and 2/day, useage of an ability for 1 minute (depends on whsat element you chose).

Biffoniacus_Furiou
2009-02-28, 03:21 PM
A Ring of Evasion won't work when wearing anything heavier than light armor, because it works as per the Rogue class feature. Replace it with a Ring of Freedom of Movement. Armbands of Might increase your power attack bonus damage, which then gets increased by Leap Attack, so it's worth getting. A Gemstone of Fortification from the Draconomicon is much cheaper than buying the property on your armor, even considering the cost for an NPC spellcaster to use Limited Wish to embed it for you, plus you never have to take it off or risk losing it. Get a Belt of Magnificense +6 from the Miniatures Handbook, it costs 200k and adds an enhancement bonus to all of your ability scores. Most opponents at that level will have resistance 10 and/or immunity to at least three different energy types, all those +1d6 abilities on your weapon aren't worth the cost. Spell Storing is a good choice if someone can keep a spell in it for you, such as (Maximized) Sound Lance or even Shivering Touch (FB).

I understand what you're trying to do with this character, but you're not going about it in a very efficient way. As it stands this looks like a Tier 4 (http://brilliantgameologists.com/boards/index.php?topic=1002.0) character, he is very one-sided and not capable of much outside his narrow area of expertise. Even in your area of focus, if your initial charge doesn't kill your opponent(s) you probably won't live through their retaliatory attacks. All those Fighter levels, and you haven't even taken Melee Weapon Mastery or Slashing Flurry (PH2). I would strongly suggest either taking more prestige classes for added versatility/survivability/usefulness, or make better use of what classes you have, at least take one of your classes that gives more than two skill points/level at level 1.

I'd suggest something like Barbarian 1/ Fighter 2/ Hexblade 2/ Occult Slayer 5/ Suel Arcanamach 4/ Spellsword 1/ Abjurant Champion 5. Pick your spells to be a toolbox for almost any situation, and get spells like Wraithstrike for combat. Note that spontaneously cast spells with a Swift Action casting time don't take any longer with metamagic, since that rule only affects spells with a casting time of a standard action or more, so a few Lesser Rods of Extend will make your Wraithstrikes go twice as long. Maybe even get Rapid Metamagic and a Lesser Rod of Quicken, so you can charge/leap attack and then cast a Quickened Whirling Blade and hit every opponent with the same bonuses for charging, and be sure to use Arcane Strike (CW). Get your armor either Mithril or Twilight (PH2 p21) with a Thistledown Suit (RotW) and you'll have 0% arcane spell failure. Cast Shield at the start of every combat, Abjurant Champion makes it a Swift Action and boosts its AC bonus to +9. I'd put that build at least at Tier 3, definitely capable of overcoming an obstacle that doesn't specifically cater to its area of focus.

Keld Denar
2009-02-28, 03:35 PM
I'd HIGHLY recommend you consider a reach weapon. Melee at this level is gonna be against a lot of really big things. Normal reach will keep you from sucking up AoOs from large creatures (who don't have reach) and if you are Enlarged (use Greater Enlarge Person for the longer duration), you'll be able to safely attack Garganuan creatures without reach without provoking. There are lots of options for reach weapons, but I'd highly recommend the Spiked Chain for 1 major reason.

Exotic Weapons Master (Flurry of Strikes)

Your AB is gonna be incredible from nearly full BAB and Shocktroopering, so that extra attack is gonna add a geometric amount of damage to your full attack. Granted, this eats another feat, but we can make it up.

Consider the PrC Pious Templar. Requires 2 feats, one of which is already a prereq for EWM and OS. The other is kinda a throw away, but you still get a minor bonus from it. From PT, you get Mettle, bonus feats (Weapon Spec plus 2 of your choice), full BAB, and Paladin casting. Now, NORMALLY pally casting sucks, but if you open up Spell Compendium, there are some real gems there. Rhino's Rush (double damage on a charge), Knight's Move (short range teleport), Righteous Fury (temp HP + MORAL bonus to Str), Favor of the Martyr (immune to Stun), and a few others. Some good utility and damage boosters there. PT also doesn't require the standard Pally code that is restrictive. You might even be able to take Sword of the Arcane Order and swap out some of your pally spells for wizard spells. This would actually net you the ability to cast Dim Door along with gems like Benign Transposition, Wraithstrike, and similar.

I'd suggest this:
Barb2/Fighter2/Ranger1/OccultSlayer5/EWM1/PT9

Take Favored Enemy: Arcanists from Complete Mage to increase the number of things you can whack. Most Evil Outsiders have SLAs, which means you count them, and Dragons, some Undead, all arcane casters, a good number of Aberations, most Fey, and a few others.

For feats, grab Extra Rage, Favored Power Attack, Mage Slayer, Combat Reflexes, Weapon Spec (free) into Melee Weapon Mastery, and the usual PA, IBR, ST, LA.

And for your weapon, all those elementals are crappy at your level. If you fight any Outsiders, they are gonna be immune or highly resistant to all but 1, regardless of whether they are demons, devils, or otherwise. Make the base weapon Adamantine or Star Metal (to protect vs Sunder) and pick up either Transmuting or Shadowstriking along with the quality upgrades like Collision, Enervating, Wounding, or the like. Viscious is actually rather handy too, being that it gives +2d6 dice for a +1 enhancement, and you'll have a TON of HP from Con focus.

Don't get Wings of Flying, get a Phoenix Cloak instead. Its better and cheaper.

Ghost Ward is meh. It doesn't work against ranged touch attacks, only incorp touch attacks. The only remotely scary incorps at that level would be crazy advanced Dread Wraiths, and you should make the Fort save easy. Consider getting Freedom (MIC) on your armor. FoM will save you from things like Fog spells that normally shut you down without a save, and keep you from getting swallowed whole by nasty colossal baddies. Also, Aporter is a flat gold upgrade on your armor that gives you Dim Door twice a day. That would be better than a Wand of Dim Door + a Warlock level. Get it on your shield also for 4x/day Dim Doors. You shouldn't need more than that.

Hope some of this advice helps, feel free to take or leave what you wish.

ShneekeyTheLost
2009-02-28, 04:31 PM
Right idea, wrong classes

Ranger1/Fighter2/PsiWar3/Slayer9/WarMind5

You get:

PA/Shock Trooper/Leap Attack ubercharge combo
Improved Trip

PsiWar nets you:
Psionic Lion's Pounce (full attack on charge)
Expansion (Augmented) 2 size increases
Evasion Burst (evasion in heavy armor when necessary)
Hustle (free move action, easily abusable)

Slayer nets you: 9/10 Manifestation, immunity to mind-affecting

WarMind 5 nets you Sweeping Strike, which lets you make a free attack every time you hit an opponent. This stacks with Cleave

Weapon to use: Spiked Chain.

Tactics: You threaten a huge swath around you, abuse this. Robilars + Combat Reflexes does nicely.

Use Evasion Burst when necessary, Psionic Lion's Pounce to make a full attack on a charge for full PA to smite everything, then Robilar's to kill anything that hits you. Every time you hit something, you get to hit something else.

ericgrau
2009-02-28, 07:09 PM
At your level you can afford mithral for your fullplate, giving you another 2 AC which also applies to touch AC. A dusty rose prism ioun stone adds another +1 for cheaper than the difference between +4 and +5 armor. Does the MIC let you stack natural armor on top of the other two amulet enchants? That's good for +5. Even if you don't want to boost your AC further, by spreading it out like this you could have the same AC for less gold.

+1 to boots of speed for swift action activated haste. You want haste every single fight, not just the big ones. It's just that good.

A scabbard of keen edges is cheaper than the keen enchantment and leaves room for another damage enchantment on your weapon without pushing it into epic. The 1 point of con damage from the wounding enchantment will do a lot more HP damage than the 2d6 from energy damage enchantments. Merciful is another option you might want to consider. If you plan on fighting a almost all evil opponents, then holy is another option and it isn't subject to the energy resistance of evil outsiders. It'll often bypass their DR too. For that matter your falchion should really be cold iron or adamantine. If you carry around some silversheen you can handle creatures with DR/silver at the same time. I hope you have a passable backup ranged weapon too, maybe with various bane arrows. If you think you'll rarely use it, that's just more reason to focus more on the arrows than the bow. If you have less than 50, it's cheaper.

Once your base damage + bonus damage hits 76, it's time to save leap attack for "automatic hit" (actually 95%) scenarios. i.e., when your attack bonus meets or exceeds the target's AC. Then you sacrifice just enough AB to still auto-hit. Otherwise missing even 5% of the time will hurt more than what you gain. Even as you near 76 the gains are low. For similar reasons improved weapon focus would be helpful if you have room.

Myrmex
2009-02-28, 07:58 PM
Right idea, wrong classes

Ranger1/Fighter2/PsiWar3/Slayer9/WarMind5

I second using psionics.

sailor_grenoble
2009-03-01, 01:56 PM
thanks all for your answers and advices, but the game has be cancelled, due to two of the other players saying that they just can't play this game: they felt they had to struggle too much against the system to have any fun even creating their characters, so much so that they feel they won't have any actually playing them.
TBH, I felt the same, I just decided to go along since I agreed on "giving D&D 3.5 a last chance".

I feel sorry for my friend (the GM) who seems to really like this system, but it seems 3.5 just isn't for us (while we had some great fun playing D&D 4)
we'll go on playing games that work for us


once again, thanks for the time you spent ameliorating a build that won't see any use.