The Center Cannot Hold (Pathfinder)

[Skjaldbakka]

Ok, so now we have a thread, we has the dual benefit of not cluttering up our inboxes, as well as allowing other players I invite to chat about the game before the first session/in between sessions.

I will be claiming the first two spaces for posting game rules changes/rulings/etc.


Scheduling:

Do to various scheduling concerns, this game will meet twice a month, but not necessarily every other week, on Saturday afternoons.

The first two games are tentatively scheduled for April 11th and April 18th.

April:
11th
18th

May:
There are 5 saturdays in May, I would like to run 3 games, if everyone is up to it.
I have the 2nd, 9th, 16th, and 30th available in May.

[Skjaldbakka]

This is post is for pure mechanics info:

Campaign Options:

Sourcebooks:

Pathfinder
Tome of Battle
Expanded Psionics Handbook
Tome of Magic and Magic of Incarnum are active, but not pc'able.

Special Restrictions:
Druid and Wizard are not playable classes
There is only one Cleric PC allowed.
There is only one psionics-using character allowed.

Pathfinder Options:
32 pt. buy
Racial HP
High avg. HP
Slow XP progression
Starting XP: 40,000

Unearthed Arcana Options:
Arctic and Aquatic Environmental Races are legal, although some alteration may be needed for Pathfinder.

Other Options:
In the interest of giving each character a more unique feel, I have decided that each player can select one feat, magic item, or spell from outside of the allowed sourcebooks, and provided it is not too ridiculous, you can take that feat, magic item, or spell on your character.

Houserules:



Fighter:

Fighters gain a special ability at 10th, 13th, 16th, and 19th level.
They have the following options:
Vigor:
As the (PHB)Strength domain power, using fighter level instead of cleric level.
-can be taken multiple times, granting additional uses/day
Celerity:
As the spell, but does not cause the fighter to be dazed, 1/day.
-can be taken multiple times, granting additional uses/day
Fortitude:
The fighter gains 10 bonus HP, and DR 1/-.
-can be taken multiple times, granting 10 more hp, and +1/- DR.

[Skjaldbakka]

Ok, so, AP. I am still looking at your question about sorcerer bloodlines, and I am really thinking it may be best to just go with Elemental (water). The capital city of the empire is partly submerged.

Which reminds me....

original campaign intro:

You are in an evil empire. This empire rules with an
iron hand, and commits various atrocities on its
people. The emperor worships a dark and evil god, and
the people are forbidden from revering the old gods.
The empire steals children at a young age who show any
signs of martial or mystical prowess, and train them
to be loyal to the empire. They kidnap womanfolk and
use them to breed a race of horrible monsters. The
take the dead and use their bodies to create a legion of undead soldiers.
The country is a horrible place. The only solace is
that the empire has grown to large to enforce its
horrible policies over the entirety of the empire. You
have decided to take a stand, and have pledged to
bring down this empire.


And a more recent version:


The Center Cannot Hold is a campaign set in a custom setting of my own creation. The country, and, for all anyone knows, the world, is ruled by the Dread Emperor, the chosen servant of a profane and ancient deity whose name is known to few. A little over a hundred years ago, the Emperor conquered the indepenent nations of the land, and he has been ruling ever since. The Emperor is ruthless and evil, and the only saving grace of this land is that it is simply too much space for the land to be ruled under an iron fist. Much of the land is more of a lawless frontier, and so long as taxes are paid, the Empire stays away.

[Skjaldbakka]

Just throwing this out there, but what are your thoughts on making this a mixed PbP/chat game?

We could run at the slower pace of PbP, and then have a few faster paced chat sessions each month.

So, having looked over it more closely, I really see either water elemental or undead as working for you. It really depends on what kind of backstory you picture your character with.

As for the rotting corpse issue, it actually leaves the appearance up to you. So you could look like the corpse of someone who froze to death, perfectly preserved in the ice.

Another thought I wanted to throw out there. I don't like what they did to rogue. I feel like it got a bit too beefy. Since sneak attack works on almost everything now, and the two weapon fighting finesse rogue gets all of his necessary feats for free as rogue talents, on top of the increased staying power from having a d8 HD, it just seems like too much.

So, I aim to whip out the nerf bat, and take it down a few notches. The obvious thing to do would be to reverse Paizo's change to sneak attack, but I am not sure I like that. I am leaning more towards either sneak attack damage only applies to the first successful hit each round, or just reducing the damage dealt to d4s, instead of d6s. Or possibly slow the progression from 1/3/5/7/9/11/13/15/17/19 to 1/3/6/9/12/15/18

If I made sneak attack only function on the first hit each round, I would increase the die type to d8, and give rogues an ability that doubles their threat range when making a sneak attack (which would stack with I. Crit and Keen).

[Another_Poet]

QUERY THE FIRST

Aww, no reflavoured Celestial? I was looking forward to having a wee bit o' healing in my array of powers. :P

Okay I can deal with the Elemental (Water) background, but just so's you'se know it will always be Elemental (Ice) in my mind... and on my sheet :)

The one thing I will ask about though is the 15th level ability. It's out of whack. (We may never get to 15th level for all I know, but still.) Here's my case for it, to do with as you please:

All the other abilities are pretty balanced from bloodline to bloodline. 1st level is a special attack (either a damage-only ray or a touch attack that imparts some special condition modifier), 3rd level is a resistance, 9th level is an area attack, and 20th level is some crazy ass transformation that has enough goodies to make you feel like a kid at his birthday party. There are a couple exceptions to these (Destined, I'm looking at you) but that's the usual. At 15th level, almost all the bloodlines EXCEPT elemental grant one of two things: wings and flight, or some badass ability (extra summoned creature, incorporeality, rerolls, etc.)

Elemental is the exception at 15th level. All elemental types gain a movement mode, but only Air gets the Golden Movement Mode Award Winner that is flight speed. The others get what can only (esp. at 15th level) be considered inferior movement modes, such as swim speed in water's case.

So I'm wondering if you would be willing to sub something else instead of swim speed. Sunken capital is cool and all, but I can take ranks in swim and/or just cast a spell to turn into a flippin' water elemental.

What do you think?

* * * * * * * *

QUERY THE SECOND

You asked about a hybrid Chat/PbP game and I would suggest doing what one of the other games I've played in does. There is an IC thread where the players (and DM) can post to have conversations, plan for next sessions, etc. But all the actual action happens in the chat sessions.

I like this system because the DM can control where a session ends and, thus, what the next session will start with. The IC thread isn't really "canon" it's jut a fun place to shoot the poop in character, or do some strategy planning if the last session ended with a bunch of trolls jumping out at the party.

Otherwise you have half a battle happen in PbP and it's a bit of a mess when you start up the chat session. People forget to check the thread and then they have no idea what is going on when the session begins. It gets bogged down.

Maybe I'm just a little fatigued on PbP as a whole, though. The slow pace and lack of player commitment is getting to me. So I may be biased. Just sayin'.

In any case the one thing I learned that will help immeasurably is having the chat sessions start right in the action/on the mission/whatever. Chat sessions are only, what, 6 hours long maybe? Less? Spending 1-2 hours doing shopping or agreeing to go on the mission is a waste. Players should get that stuff done in the IC thread before the chat session, or just assume it happens "off camera" and start with the actual adventure. Ultimately that's a DM call but it's my suggestion to you based on my other chat game.

* * * * * *

QUERY THE THIRD

A short one! I'm wondering if there are any feats in any of the approved sources that give a boost to a counterspell check. I plan on being something of a counterspell specialist (my condolences, Skjald) and I'll take the Improved Counterspell feat that broadens the selection of spells I can use in counterspelling, but I'm wondering if there's anything that can give me a numeric bonus to my actuall roll.


* * * * * * *

QUERY THE FINAL

Some questions as I plan my character...

-I think she'll be a former imperial commander (not general). She saw something she shouldn't, couldn't be bribed into silence and got jailed and beaten. Once she escaped she joined the resistance. That cool?

-Is the empire still known as the Merithian Empire as in the last incarnation of the game? Is Merithia its capital city, or what?

-Does the empire use any unusual mounts or vehicles?

-Does the empire use any signature weapons?

-What is the name of this "evil" god the empire follows? Do any good/neutral people ever follow the god for any reason? Do the priests try to justify the god as being good ("strength is virtue" type of thing)? My character was probably raised worshipping them.

-Do we know if the emperor is living or undead? Do we know the emperor's race?

Okay that's all :) :) :)

[Another_Poet]

My wife afound a fillable .pdf Pathfinder character sheet. If you give me your email I can send it to you.

ap

[Skjaldbakka]

sweet!

eschlintz_at_charter.net

I am working on a response, btw.

[Another_Poet]

It has been sent.

If we could find a filehosting site that isn't a pain in the rear we could keep all our sheets online. Mythweavers has such a backlog of requested sheets that I suspect they've just stopped making new sheet templates altogether, so I doubt we'll see an online Pathfinder sheet unless we do it ourselves.

Actually I could probably save the pdf to my imageshack account and you could all see it that way.

[Skjaldbakka]

A1:
If you have suggestions for a replacement power, feel free to post them, and I will take them into consideration.

A2:
I agree, on pretty much every particular.

A3:
The only check involved in counterspelling that I am aware of is the spellcraft check to ID a spell as it is being cast. Unless you are talking about dispel magic, in which case the answer is no, there is no feat in any approved sourcebook that adds to your dispel checks. You could take skill focus spellcraft if you are concerned about making those checks however.

unless the mechanic for counterspells changed in pathfinder

A4:
a) The empire does not conceal its evil. It is closer to world ruled by demonic emperer than it is world ruled by corrupt government, if that makes sense. Everyone knows the empire conducts dark experiments, but no-one is strong enough to do anything about it. Also, as far as anyone knows, the last resistance was crushed. More likely, you fled to the frontier after being confronted with your own evil. Quite possibly you were given an order to do something really evil, and could not bring yourself to do it. If you want to take Leadership, you could even have convinced your unit to leave with you, and perhaps have some thoughts about starting a resistance. Otherwise, you most likely had to fight your way free, and in true anime fashion, slaughtered your men, except for your liuetenant, who now hunts you with an undying fervor fed by misguided loyalty to the Empire, and that one guy who barely survived only through some kind of diabolic experimentation, who is not actively hunting you but whose path you will inevitably cross again.

b)No. The Merithian empire fell about 1000 years ago, and their are Meritthian ruins scattered about the landscape. That empire was known for their mastery of the arcane arts (wizards), their centurion legions (they are roman-esque), and their sudden fall (their capital was sacked w/o a fight).

c) no-one knows the name of the dark elder god the emperer follows. many people call hime the nameless devourer. he isn't really worshiped so much as feared by the general populace at large. his priests are openly evil, and tend to do things like collect taxes and exume the dead for conscription. some people secretly burn the corpses of their loved ones to save them from this fate, but those who are caught are brought into the legion while still living*

*These priests are know to use a magic that transforms a living person into an undead abomination on the spot. It is a very painful process. Typically there is a lot of screaming.

d) If he is living, he has been alive for hundreds of years. There has only ever been one emperer. So unless he is a long-lived race, or doing the dread pirate roberts things, he is undead. So really no one is sure.

[Another_Poet]

A1:
If you have suggestions for a replacement power, feel free to post them, and I will take them into consideration.

Oh you stepped in it now. :)

Here are a bunch of ideas.


Ice Touch:
You can instantly freeze water you are tuching, to a maximum of two 5'x5'x5' units per level. The ice freezes and floats in the water, and is sturdy enough to walk on (though still slippery). Any creatures immersed in the water become trapped inside. They are not dealt any immediate damage but may not be able to breathe and, if left in the ice long enough, must deal with the dangerously cold temperatures.

or

Winter Walk
You are so accustomed to crossing sheer ice and trudging through deep snow that you are adept at crossing any difficult surface. You no longer take penalties from crossing difficult terrain.

or

Snowflight
You may drift through the air as with an Air Walk (http://http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/airwalk.htm) effect. Activating this ability is a standard action; it can be dismissed as a free action. (This is actually weaker than the flight ability most bloodlines get, but unlike flight you don't need to make a skill check to manoeuvre so it balances out.)

or

Snowjump
This ability functions just like Tree Stride (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/treeStride.htm) except that you can enter snow or ice or frost, not plants, and move to other piecesof snow or ice within range. If you enter ice the rangeis 2,000 feet and you can only move to other pieces of ice in range. If you enter snow the range is 1,500 feet and you can only move to other snow. If you enter frost the range is 500 feet and you can only move to other frost.

or

Wall of Ice spell-like ability, 2x/day.

or

Freezerburn
You know exactly how to wield cold energy against even the most cold-hardy beings. When you deliver cold damage with a weapon, spell or other effect it ignores cold resistance.

Them's my suggestions. All are awesome, snowflight is probably most similar to other bloodlines, snowjump is probably coolest.

Great answers about the empire, that helps alot. I am stil wonering if they have any strange mounts, vehicles or weapons.

I think my backstory will go something like this:


_____ was taken at a young age to the imperial training facility at [city]. Although she was allowed--indeed, required--to send happy letters to her family on a regular schedule, she hardly knows her parents or siblings. She thinks of the friendly headmaster, a now-elderly man by the name of Dr. Jarl Jandell, as her only real parent. Jandell was appointed to the training facility mostly in a caretaker capacity, and was kind to the students even as their "tutors" oversaw their heavy-handed "cultivation" (a rigorous program of psychological indoctrination, combat training, loyalty tests, depersonalisation, military history, and undead familiarisation). ____ still writes to Jandell on a regular basis, and takes his advice to ehart. He's the only moral or affectionate authority figure she's ever known.

Eventually she was selected for officer candidacy. Her natural talents outshown most other candidates, and the little girl who was raised as a living weapon was considered a virtuoso. "You're going to be a general," she was often told.

Even for prodigies, however, rank must be earned. Four years ago at age 18 she was given her first command. With her unwavering faith in the empire's goal of world unity, she led mammoth troops across the Three Desert Region, conjuring water for them every night, and carried out hit-hit-hit-hit-and-run attacks on "unallied" settlements along the Dpongo River. She was supposed to soften them up for the heavy infantry who were moving into the region, but she saw an opportunity to take two cities outright. She manage to seize and hold the twin forts of Radam-Zu with only 12 mammoth knights and 32 regulars, for a period of over 2 months until the infantry arrived to relieve her. She then pooled her leave time and went into a self-imposed solitary confinement to atone for having acted outside the scope of her orders. This, despite earning two medals for the victory.

Her short career is decorated with numerous similar daring victories. She is known in many civilised towns as a patriotic advocate of corpse donation, and made the rank of Commander in just 2 years, the second quickest of any officer in imperial history.

...more to come...

[Skjaldbakka]

The imperial training facility is in Caradhras, which is also the capital. You wer in fact abducted from your family at a young age, after it was discovered that you have magical talent. There a few holes though:

Some of it will be PM'd, because it is very much personal plot.

The holes that are not:
The empire actually is quite noticeably lacking in mounted troops. With the exception of the occasional mounted officer, there are none. Not counting underwater troops, of course. Or flying mounts.

There really isn't much of a desert terrain in the empire. There is a frozen north, however, and there are unconquered settlements there, simply because getting troops over the formidable mountain range is difficult, the ocean route is blocked because of the ice, and the people of the north have an affinity with dragons. Which are a formidable foe, even for the empire.

I kind of missed a few questions in there.

The empire has various water creatures that are used as mounts, some undead, some abberations. The nameless devourer has a strong affinity for water (read - water domain), and the emperor's aquatic forces are quite potent.

more later

Signature Weapon: The clerics of the nameless devourer weild cat of nine-tails that appear to be formed from their own blood and tissue. Where a normal such whip is a cruel device indeed, with shards of glass embedded into each lash, these whips have sharp fanged mouths. These clerics summon their weapons out of their unholy symbol, which is a embroidered black and gold glove, worn on their right hands, with a mass of writhing tentacles on the palm of the glove.

[Another_Poet]

Signature Weapon: The clerics of the nameless devourer weild cat of nine-tails that appear to be formed from their own blood and tissue. Where a normal such whip is a cruel device indeed, with shards of glass embedded into each lash, these whips have sharp fanged mouths. These clerics summon their weapons out of their unholy symbol, which is a embroidered black and gold glove, worn on their right hands, with a mass of writhing tentacles on the palm of the glove.

Ummm.... dude.

[Skjaldbakka]

I'll take that as a compliment. See what you have gotten yourself into?

[Another_Poet]

I'll take that as a compliment. See what you have gotten yourself into?

My yet-unnamed character:
"I've already doomed myself. All I regret is that I can't take more of them to Hell with me..."


edit: Oh yeah. I was gonna ask if you can post more info about the campaign world. I don't mean write a whole bunch of stuff for my sake, but if you already have things typed up, post away. As much as you got. I shouldn't have started making up regions, so I'll invent her military exploits from what you already have.

I'm thinking she should be a mounted mage, that's why I was asking about special mounts or vehicles. If I can get an aberration mount, I'll gladly take one. Possible?

Also since it's clear I won't be using the tissue-glass-face-ninetailwhip, what about "standard" weapons of the empire? I might actually waste a feat on a good weapon proficiency, and if the empire has certain favoured weapons that would make most sense. Otherwise Scimitar probably.

[Skjaldbakka]

Most of the land mounts are skeletal horses, actually. The majority of the aberrations are aquatic, and don't serve well on land. There really aren't much in the way of exotic weapons in the army branch. Rank and file for the legion favors half plate, heavy shield, morningstar. Officers are given a lot of leeway in terms of personal armaments, to suit their fighting ability.

[Another_Poet]

1 war-trained woolly rhino comin' online, BA.

[Skjaldbakka]

Ok, as much as I really hate to come off as strict GM, a wooly rhino really doesn't fit the flavor of the campaign. While you certainly could probably manage to acquire one (maybe), it just kinda breaks the 'vibe'.

I just can't wrap my head around the protaganists in a dark horror fantasy setting riding a rhino...

I don't really have a bunch of stuff written up so much as I have it all in my head. So asking a bunch of questions might be more effective at worming out information.

Here is something:

This is canon for the setting: Storytime with Skjaldbakka (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3344899&postcount=1)

[Another_Poet]

Okay, 1 battle-trained fiendish giant crocodile mount coming on-line, BA.

:smallbiggrin:


*ahem* you don't sound like a strict GM at all. T

[Another_Poet]

Okay, 1 battle-trained fiendish giant crocodile mount coming on-line, BA.

:smallbiggrin:


*ahem* you don't sound like a strict GM at all. That's totally in your purview. I'm still trying to get a feel for things.

Here's what I want. A badass mount. Something that I have to pay extra to get barding for, due to its spikes/external lungs/extra legs/eyestalks/whatever. Not too cthulhuesque. Something that a commander could ride into battle and the enemy line breaks just seeing the damn thing.

Barring that, something just unusual enough to keep people guessing.

(If you would, in fact, allow a trained giant crocodile, I would be most happy.)

So I guess my question for you is, what kind of crazy mounts will you allow? I don't need flight or anything.

Oh yeah other questions

-Does the empire cover every part of the known world (except the arctic)?
-what were the empire's most recent military campaigns?
-how the heck do normal people cope? There has to be some respite or at least a nice propaganda program so people can live their lives.

ap

[Skjaldbakka]

Actually, throw the psuedonatural, zombie, or skeleton template on that giant
crocodile, and you have a deal. Although I'll have to work out how much that
would cost to have, since its a CR 4-5 creature, and you are level 6. There are
costs listed for hippogriff mounts, I'll have to check what that CR is.

Edit- Rough guess for now is 2,000 for a psuedonatural giant crocodile. Those
are friend prices. :smallwink:

If you want a psuedonatural or skeletal hippogriff, I am cool with that too.
Skeletal would be cheaper, since it would lose flight.

-Does the empire cover every part of the known world (except the arctic)?

Yes, but geographers are pretty sure that there is an unkown world outside of
this continent. It is, however, not explored.

-what were the empire's most recent military campaigns?

Still trying to conquer the arctic, have been for a few decades. It is closer
to Louis the XIV's war with the dutch than Europes war with the american people
(by which I mean indians)

-how the heck do normal people cope? There has to be some respite or at least a
nice propaganda program so people can live their lives.

For most people, the empire is a distant thing. Out on the frontier, empirial
agents are a rare sight. Closer to the capital, it is a different story.

I don't have a map yet, but to give you a rough idea, if DC was the capital of
the empire, the garrison that is the farthest west into the empire would be in
kansas. slightly juxtaposed, since the capital of the empire is on the west
edge of the empire, but you still get the idea.

People that are closer to the empire... it takes a toll on their sanity. There
are people that are driven stark raving mad. Or quietly insane. Others
secretly worship the old gods. Some try to make their way into the empire's
infrastructure, either entering politics, such as it is, or the church of the
devourer, or the small sect of the military that accepts living applicants.

Lots of people turn to drink, or drugs.

Idea for level 15 ice elemental bloodline ability:

Cold Absorption (Su): You gain an amount of cold absorption equal to 3 times your level per day. Whenever you take cold damage, apply resistance first and apply the rest to this absorption, reducing your daily total by that amount. Any damage in excess of your absorption is applied to you normally. For every point of damage absorbed by this ability, you receive 1 temporary hit point. These hit points last for 1 hour, or until used.

-edit

It occurs to me that a mounted mage would probably not want a crocodile, since they are low to the ground, and thus don't help much in giving you a better vantage point. Although there is no mechanic for that.

[Skjaldbakka]

I have put some more thought into the Rogue, and read over the forums, and this is the solution I have come up with:


Sneak Attack:If a rogue can catch an opponent when he
is unable to defend himself effectively from her attack, she
can strike a vital spot for extra damage.

The rogue’s attack deals extra damage any time her target
would be denied a Dexterity bonus to AC (whether the target
actually has a Dexterity bonus or not), or when the rogue
f lanks her target. This extra damage is 1d8 at 1st level, and
it increases by 1d8 every two rogue levels thereafter. Should
the rogue score a critical hit with a sneak attack, this extra
damage is not multiplied. Ranged attacks can count as
sneak attacks only if the target is within 30 feet.

With a sap (blackjack) or an unarmed strike, a rogue can
make a sneak attack that deals nonlethal damage instead
of lethal damage. She cannot use a weapon that deals lethal
damage to deal nonlethal damage in a sneak attack, not
even with the usual –4 penalty.

The rogue must be able to see the target well enough
to pick out a vital spot and must be able to reach such a
spot. A rogue cannot sneak attack while striking a creature
with concealment or striking the limbs of a creature whose
vitals are beyond reach.

This extra damage only applies to the first successful attack each round.

Deadly Precision:

The rogue is most effective when attacking an opponent that is not prepared for his attacks. As a rogue progresses in level, he gains the following bonuses, which only apply when the target is denied its dexterity bonus to AC, or is flanked.

level 2: +1 bonus to hit
level 4: +2 bonus to damage
level 6: threat range increased by 1
level 8: +1 bonus to hit
level 10: +2 bonus to damage
level 12: critical multiplier increased by 1
level 14: +1 bonus to hit
level 16: +2 bonus to damage
level 18: threat range increased by 1
level 20: crit multiplier increased by 1
Thoughts?


I have also come to a decision on the 15th level ability. It is going to be a 1/day change into a water (ice) elemental. I am working on balancing it out, but that is what it will be. It just fits really well with the plot packet.

edit - Actually, may be elemental body IV, ? times/day, with a few modifications which I won't actually be revealing to you (unless you ask me to, but they are spoilers).

And some that are mechanical. I am actually going to use the earth elemental stats for elemental body, and replace push with the water elemental's swim speed, and replace earthglide with iceglide (the same, requires ice/snow instead of earth/stone). That way it is more of an ice elemental.

[Another_Poet]

The rogue stuff really doesn't apply to me, so I'll leave that for others (do you have other players yet?) to discuss.

As for 15th level, how will that transformation be different than the Elemental Body spell I get as a bonus spell?

edit: I didn't see this part at first:


Actually, may be elemental body IV, ? times/day, with a few modifications which I won't actually be revealing to you (unless you ask me to, but they are spoilers).

And some that are mechanical. I am actually going to use the earth elemental stats for elemental body, and replace push with the water elemental's swim speed, and replace earthglide with iceglide (the same, requires ice/snow instead of earth/stone). That way it is more of an ice elemental.

This seems like a cool power although it makes me wish I had different bonus spells :)

[Skjaldbakka]

Hmm, that had not occurred to me. Back to the drawing board...

I have a few people lined up, one definite, one maybe, and one probably not.

If you want to invite someone you know, I'd be cool with that. One of the people I had planned to invite works a double on saturdays now, so he is probably out.

edit- since you get elemental body as a bonus spell, I am going to give you wall of ice as a spell-like ability. Call it 2/day for now, but I am may decide it should be more or less.

also, arbitrary plot based restriction:

As a ice/water elemental bloodline sorcerer, given the backstory for that, you cannot summon fire elementals, and you cannot cast elemental body to turn into a fire elemental. I am not otherwise mechanically restricting fire spells, although casting them makes you feel uncomfortable, RP-wise.

EDit-

In the interest of giving each character a more unique feel, I have decided that each player can select one feat, magic item, or spell from outside of the allowed sourcebooks, and provided it is not too ridiculous, you can take that feat, magic item, or spell on your character.

[Sovin N'dore]

Hello. I think I am the elusive other players... or at least one of them. I actually have participated in one of Skjaldbakka's games in this setting before so I have a bit of knowledge on the setting if it comes down to it.

So far I have only the infrastructure of my character and have just gotten around to making my appearance on the boards here... it has all been made more difficult by having a string of computer problems that has two of my computers inoperable at the moment. Hopefully I can get my old and broken box running as a backup shortly so that I can participate more in this leadup process.

[Skjaldbakka]

So, there is a very real possibility that I may be losing my job, which would make it hard to run this game. I should know by Wednsday.

Edit - I will try to run it anyway, but that may be hard to do, as I am not sure if I will be able to continue making payments on my computer.

[Another_Poet]

Aw, Skjald, that's terrible. I'm really sorry to hear that.

Sovin, nice to meet you.

If the game does go on, the wall of ice thing sounds good. FWIW I also liked your idea about ice absorption, except that I would flip it -if the amount that gets past the resistance converts to healing, the healing gets weaker with levels. I would switch it to the amount the resistance filters out. So as the resistance goes upm the healing factor goes up too.

But if you want to keep just the wall of ice idea instead, I'm all for it.

edit: a question for you. Is there some type of "handle undead" skill that imperial folks use to deal with their troops/mounts? Or do they have to work with the Command Undead spell and the like?

ap

[Skjaldbakka]

Most of the imperial army is composed of sentient undead. Ghouls and Ghasts, primarily. As such they can be trained to follow orders, even from the living. Most units will have a cleric of the nameless devourer in their ranks, however. Oftentimes, they are the commander, but not necessarily. Most non-cleric commanders are part of the living branch of the army.

Interesting note - living troops are considered to be more expendable than undead troops. A fallen ghoul cannot be reanimated, whereas a fallen living soldier can be.

[Another_Poet]

Hmm, I wonder how specially-mindwashed sorcerous ubersoldiers fit into the ladder of expendability :)

Here is my updated backstory:



YOUTH AND TRAINING
Metea was taken at a young age to the imperial training facility at Caradhras. Although she was allowed--indeed, required--to send happy letters to her family on a regular schedule, she hardly knows her parents or siblings. She thinks of the friendly headmaster, a now-elderly man by the name of Dr. Jarl Jahntz, as her only real parent. Jahntz was appointed to the training facility mostly in a caretaker capacity, and was kind to the students even as their "tutors" oversaw their heavy-handed "cultivation" (a rigorous program of psychological indoctrination, combat training, loyalty tests, depersonalisation, military history, and undead familiarisation). Metea continued to write to Jahntz on a regular basis even after her graduation, and takes his advice to heart. He's the only moral or affectionate authority figure she's ever known.

Eventually she was selected for officer candidacy. Her natural talents outshown most other candidates, and the little girl who was raised as a living weapon was considered a virtuoso. "You're going to be a general," she was often told.

Even for prodigies, however, rank must be earned. Four years ago at age 18 she was given her first command. With her unwavering faith in the empire's goal of world unity, she led mammoth troops across the Three Mountain Region, conjuring fire to keep her lifeless troopers from freezing solid each arctic night, and carried out hit-hit-hit-and-run attacks on "unallied" settlements along the Dpongo River. She was supposed to soften them up for the heavy infantry who were moving into the region, but she saw an opportunity to take two cities outright. She manage to seize and hold the twin forts of Radam-Zu with only 12 living mammoth knights and 32 ghoul regulars, for a period of over 2 months until the infantry arrived to relieve her. She then pooled her leave time and went into a self-imposed solitary confinement to atone for having acted outside the scope of her orders. This, despite earning two medals for the victory.

Her short career is decorated with numerous similar daring victories. She is known in many civilised towns as a patriotic advocate of corpse donation, and made the rank of Commander in just 2 years, the second quickest of any officer in imperial history.

A NEW CHOICE
Although she does not know it, she is what is referred to as a Whisp - Weaponised Human Infused with Spell-like Powers. She is supposed to be the perfect soldier, the perfect commander, and the perfect weapon all in one. That is her fate, instilled in her since youth.

But one windy evening in the river town of Aluscia, that fate was challenged. And, by chance or by pure will, it was changed.

Several hundred citizens of Aluscia rose up in protest. They were told that they had to choose the 100 strongest people in town to be turned into undead troopers. In addition, their graveyard was to be conscripted. The strong naturally meant the youthful, and parents took a stand rather than giving up their children willingly.

The battle was short and fierce. Metea put it down mercilessly, and 150 youths were taken for the war effort rather than 100. Deeming this fair, Metea prepared to set out on her next orders with the new regiment - but she was given one more task first.

"We must make an example," said the death knight general in its papery voice. "Take the whole town to the river and drown them."

Metea had no difficulty with the task. She had sufficient forces to bind and haul off every person in town. But as they approached the river and began to throw in the villagers, she saw the huge chunks of ice floating in the current, and the snow along the banks. She couldn't help but remember her dreams, her terrible dreams of drowning in frigid water...

"STOP!" she called. The ghouls and zombies heeded her words, but the death knight would not allow it.

"You have one chance," he said. "Make your choice."

She surveyed the scene. "How does this build unity?" she asked.

"Make your choice."

So she made it. In a swirl of arcane power she attacked the general, only to be overpowered and knocked to the ground. She spent 6 months locked in a basement in Aluscia, well after the last of its citizens had been drowned. She was kept under lock and key as the empire decided what to do with her. They couldn't admit she went rogue - she was the posterchild of the conscription programme. They couldn't kill her; she was too valuable. In the end they planned on sending a mind-control expert to visit her.

Luckily, Aluscia became a holding place for prisoners of other kinds. As various political prisoners were moved in (mostly clerics of good deities), some daring youths decided to attempt a prison break.

In a security lull while troops were being moved, the renegades sneaked in, broke open the makeshift prison cells and rescued those within. They had no idea that one of the women they rescued was in fact a highly trained imperial officer. If they had known of her record, they would've executed her on the spot.

Thus Metea came into the fold of a fledgling rebellion group, and began her quest for truth and revenge...

CHARACTER GOALS
Metea has three main goals.

One is to find out who she truly is - what was done to her, where she is from, and why she has the dreams. Part of this is to find out what happened to her most talented classmates. There were six other WHISPs (she doesn't know any of them are called that, but she does know who her most skilled and magical rivals/comrades were). She wonders what happened to them and if they still blindly follow the empire or if any of them have turned against it like herself. Or maybe, they are all dead...

There are only two of them that she remembers fondly. The bard-warrior Josef and the the Berserk Sorcerer Raufine.

A second goal is to find a man with a star-shaped scar. There were three living men, in command of five ghasts, who did unspeakable things to her while she was in prison. She could only see their eyes through the slits of their special interrogator masks, and she can only hope to recognise the one with the star-shaped scar beside his right eye. Whenever she is in the area of living imperial troops, she tries to ask about a man with a star-shaped scar. If she gets her hands on him it will be his worst day.

And of course, her overriding goal is to turn the empire inside out and bring it to its knees. She is an unusual resistance fighter; she thinks undead troops are a great idea, although she's learned that talking of voluntary donation of bodies to the resistance is a Bad Idea. She also has a strong admiration for the ancient Merithian empire - many of her military history lessons centred on famous Merithian victories - and treats it almost as an idealised society, a golden age when everyone was united under peace rather than horror.


Sorry it's long. I get carried away. If any of the names/concepts/people don't mesh with the campaign world let me know and I will revise.

[Skjaldbakka]

Luckily, Aluscia became a holding place for prisoners of other kinds. As various political prisoners were moved in (mostly clerics of good deities), some daring youths decided to attempt a prison break.

In a security lull while troops were being moved, the renegades sneaked in, broke open the makeshift prison cells and rescued those within. They had no idea that one of the women they rescued was in fact a highly trained imperial officer. If they had known of her record, they would've executed her on the spot.

Thus Metea came into the fold of a fledgling rebellion group, and began her quest for truth and revenge...

Going to have to edit this section, don't particularly care to do so at work, will send it to you tonight after I get off work.

Love the deathknight, love the man with the star-shaped scar, love the WHISPs, although I think just special would fit better than spell-like.

Man, this guy wrote a death knight antagonist into his backstory, Sovin. heheh...

wither, wither, death, death, slay, slay, down.

sorry, Larp joke
no I'm not

Also, I don't mind if you write a small novel as a backstory. I love a good story. I even occassionally love a bad story. Man, I cooked up one heck of a ridiculously angsty backstory for a character once. I wonder if I still have that... edit- no, it is deleted

[Another_Poet]

[QUOTE=Skjaldbakka;5895179]Going to have to edit this section, don't particularly care to do so at work, will send it to you tonight after I get off work.

Cool. I figured good clerics and other political prisoners were the best bet, since you said there was no active rebellion so it wouldn't be rebels in jail. But I wasn't sure it'd quite fit so edit away.

[Sovin N'dore]

Deathknight... sweet :smallbiggrin:

Jeez, making me wish I had reliable computer access to get my backstory together :smallwink:

Anyhow, I am glad to see this is still moving. Hopefully I can get some more up in the forseeable future... I am beginning to think computers don't like me anymore.

[Skjaldbakka]

notes on background:

1. Metea. That name really needs a surname or title. It just doesn't seem.... pretentious enough.

2. Keep in mind the sacrifice involved in using fire magic on a regular basis to help others. Remember using fire magic is unnatural and uncomfortable to you.


3... I was going to change a few details, but decided that I would prefer to run with the fledgling resistance angle. Just note that there were no actual clerics, just people who worshipped the old gods. Naturally, they were being held to prolong thier suffering before their execution, or for more nefarious purposes.

With a possible exception if one of the other players wants to play a cleric.

[Another_Poet]

notes on background:

1. Metea. That name really needs a surname or title. It just doesn't seem.... pretentious enough.

I think that for depersonalisation reasons they would've reduced her to one name long ago in training. Normally the military calls everyone by last name, but maybne she isn't sure where the name "Metea" (pronounced like Medea) comes from. In any case she would've been called Commander Metea for the last few years, and be known by that name. (I assume that Commander is basically one step below general - if that is wrong let me know.) Now that she has broken ties with the empire she has dropped the title but still goes by the only name she's ever had.



2. Keep in mind the sacrifice involved in using fire magic on a regular basis to help others. Remember using fire magic is unnatural and uncomfortable to you.

Yeah but I've been trained for years to use it. At this point it should be as natural as swinging my sword. Or are you saying it's unnatural because it's specifically fire magic? I didn't think of that. Is there a mechanic against me using fire magic, or just a RP factor?



3... I was going to change a few details, but decided that I would prefer to run with the fledgling resistance angle. Just note that there were no actual clerics, just people who worshipped the old gods. Naturally, they were being held to prolong thier suffering before their execution, or for more nefarious purposes.

With a possible exception if one of the other players wants to play a cleric.

Sweet!

ap

[Skjaldbakka]

Or are you saying it's unnatural because it's specifically fire magic? I didn't think of that. Is there a mechanic against me using fire magic, or just a RP factor?

Mostly just an RP factor.
You must have missed that, with all the other stuff we were talking about:


As a ice/water elemental bloodline sorcerer, given the backstory for that, you cannot summon fire elementals, and you cannot cast elemental body to turn into a fire elemental. I am not otherwise mechanically restricting fire spells, although casting them makes you feel uncomfortable, RP-wise.


I think that for depersonalisation reasons they would've reduced her to one name long ago in training. Normally the military calls everyone by last name, but maybne she isn't sure where the name "Metea" (pronounced like Medea) comes from.

The empire actually tends to cultivate a certain amount of arrogance in their officers and ... special projects. Think of it as having been groomed to be a card-carrying villain.

[Another_Poet]

Ouch, I hadn't noticed that. My apologies.

Well if that's your house rule then I'll live with it. I will take the opportunity to point out, however, that by RAW even an actual water elemental with spellcasting ability could use Elemental Body to turn into a fire elemental. It's a spell, not a bloodline ability, and it turns the subject into the desired type of elemental regardless of the subject's starting type.

On the other hand I kind of like the idea of not being able to turn into the opposite element. Although I originally wanted to go with Cold elemental simply for flavour reasons, not to limit my options. I wonder what you think of this...

Replace Fire Elemental with Lightning Elemental for purposes of my Elemental Body options.

All fire-themed powers would change to electric-themed. Cold vulnerability would remain (cold temperatures do actually interfere with electrical conduction).

The Extraodinary ability Burn (given here for your convenience)

Burn (Ex)
A fire elemental’s slam attack deals bludgeoning damage plus fire damage from the elemental’s flaming body. Those hit by a fire elemental’s slam attack also must succeed on a Reflex save or catch on fire. The flame burns for 1d4 rounds. The save DC varies with the elemental’s size (see table). A burning creature can take a move action to put out the flame. The save DC is Constitution-based.


Would change to Shock:

Burn (Ex)
A lightning elemental’s slam attack deals bludgeoning damage plus electric damage from the elemental’s highly charged body. Those hit by a lightning elemental’s slam attack also must succeed on a Fortitude save or be stunned. The stun effect lasts for 1d3 rounds. The save DC varies with the elemental’s size (see table). A stunned creature can attempt a new save each round to shake off the effect early. The save DC is Constitution-based.


Your thoughts?

edit: She will definitely be the aloof sort. And not so good at talking about her (new and seemingly alien) emotions. They pushed her too far and her cold shell broke, but she still has a way to go before she can be fully "human."

[Skjaldbakka]

I will take the opportunity to point out, however, that by RAW even an actual water elemental with spellcasting ability could use Elemental Body to turn into a fire elemental.

Normally, yes. This would not be a true statement in this campaign, however. If you were fire elemental bloodline, you would not be able to cast elemental body to become a water elemental, and so on for the other elements.

It is a plot-based restriction, and I hope it isn't too limiting. Calling all fire spells off limits would be too much, so there is just the RP restriction of it being uncomfortable to use fire magic.

I don't really want to create a lightning form for water bloodline's fire substitute, because then I would have to create an earth form substitute for air, an air form sub for earth, and a water form sub for fire.

If you think there is a balance issue there, I would be more than happy to give you Energy Substitution (cold) as a bonus feat special ability (that way it doesn't increase your casting time).

Of course, all the other elemental bloodlines would get that as well for their associated energy types.

Something to keep in mind, from an IG perspective, all of your spells are bloodline abilities. For the most part, but the part that isn't most is plot.

Also, I've kind of already tweaked the bloodlines a bit based on your desire to be an ice bloodline.

How about this for a compromise. Instead of ice form replacing water form, it is an extra option. so your elemental body options are ice, water, air, or earth.

[Another_Poet]

Refresh me on what energy subsitution does - I already have cold subbed in for fire on many of my bonus spells as a class ability so I think it might be redundant.



I don't really want to create a lightning form for water bloodline's fire substitute, because then I would have to create an earth form substitute for air, an air form sub for earth, and a water form sub for fire.

Not really. First off you don't have any PCs using the other elemental bloodlines so it will probably never come up. And if it were to come up, you'd already have two extra elemental types (ice and lightning) that you could allow the person to sub instead of their forbidden element.

I don't feel you're being too heavyhanded, and I appreciate the tweaking you've already done. I'm giving up quite a bit just by focusing on cold damage in an undead campaign, though, so I'm just trying to work out an equitable balance.


ap

edit: as a side-thought, I don't think I've ever put this much thought into a character before. It's kind of cool. Thanks for putting up with me,.

[Skjaldbakka]

That would be true, except that by playing an elemental bloodline, you have pretty much activated a plotline involving elementals and other elemental bloodlines.

I was actually thinking of doing that though. But lightning form would be an extra option for air, acid for earth, and fire... just gets screwed in that department, I guess.

It had not yet occured to me the difficulties in running a cold mage in an undead heavy setting. But cold immunity is not a universal undead trait (although it is a common one).

Might not be unreasonable to take an anti-undead or undead controlling spell of some kind. Is command undead still a spell in pathfinder?


edit: as a side-thought, I don't think I've ever put this much thought into a character before. It's kind of cool. Thanks for putting up with me,.

This is probably the most well-developed campaign setting I have ever run. I am glad it is bringing out the creative genius in others as well.


Re: Other forum issues

What are your thoughts on using a yahoo group? Do you have access to yahoo from work? I know my yahoo access is restricted, but I can still access groups.

Other option:
http://paizo.com/paizo/messageboards/community/gaming/playByPostDiscussion

[Another_Poet]

That would be true, except that by playing an elemental bloodline, you have pretty much activated a plotline involving elementals and other elemental bloodlines.

I was actually thinking of doing that though. But lightning form would be an extra option for air, acid for earth, and fire... just gets screwed in that department, I guess.

Well with 2 extras you don't really HAVE to stat anymore. I mean, people who can't use Air or Fire can use lightning, people who can't use Earth or Water can use Cold. It works out pretty well.

It also is a little more flavourful, as I don't know of any real-world cultures that view acid (or any kind of corrosive chemical) as a fundamental building block of the world. Lightning sure, I've seen that in African cultures and certainly the Chinese stuff. Cold, a little harder to come by, but I've seen it.

Likewise there's no need to write Sonic in. Unless you're doing a Hindu campaign and it can make or detroy all other elements.

So I would say with Lightning and Cold as backups you could cover all 4 Greek elements. Or one day you might get bored and stat out an Acid elemental (yikes). Personally I'd go with Light or Dark instead, but whatever.


It had not yet occured to me the difficulties in running a cold mage in an undead heavy setting. But cold immunity is not a universal undead trait (although it is a common one).

Might not be unreasonable to take an anti-undead or undead controlling spell of some kind. Is command undead still a spell in pathfinder?

It is in there, and I intend to take it for sure. It just seems like good policy for any imperial officer.


This is probably the most well-developed campaign setting I have ever run. I am glad it is bringing out the creative genius in others as well.

I'm glad to hear it is so well-developed. I look forward to learning more about the world.

[Another_Poet]

re. your edit -

Wow, our employers must use the same internet blocker. Surfcontrol by chance?

Anyway, yahoo groups are fine by me. I also notices that the Myth-Weavers forums are relatively vanilla looking and thus easy to handle at work, with the added benefit of also being a general gaming forum, sheet storage site, etc.

ap

[Skjaldbakka]

Websense actually, but webmail is a common thing for employers to not want you to do at work.

i'll look at mythweavers.

wow! somebody is using my name at mythweavers! that is a first for me

[Another_Poet]

Oi! I think I misunderstood something.

I thought you were balking at adding lightning elementals because of the stat-work involved in making other alternate elementals. Hence my points above.

But re-reading it I realise it is more because of the plot re-write involved in the elemental backstory. That could be more of a pain.

If you decide not to allow lightning substitution, what do you say to this: my elemental body spells disallow fire elementals, allow earth/air as usual, and allow "ice" elementals at +1 size category?


So Skjaldbakka is taken? Are you sure you didn't sign up there a long time ago and forget? What does the name mean? I've always assumed it's from Norse mythology but outside of Egil's Saga I'm not too familiar with that stuff.

ap

[Skjaldbakka]

http://www.myth-weavers.com/forumdisplay.php?f=13215

actually, I had just signed up for an account and forgotten I had. I had checked my old e-mail, and that wasn't valid, but when I checked my current e-mail, i got a reply. furthere discussion on the new thread?