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View Full Version : Thri-Keens can jump *how* far?



JellyPooga
2009-03-30, 06:27 AM
Looking through EPH and actually took the time to check up on the Thri-Keen racial stats...+30 on Jump checks! WTF? Add +1 from their racial Str bonus, +4 for their faster-than-30ft base land speed and another, say 5 from their racial HD skills and even the lowliest of Thri-Keen commoners is rocking a +40 on Jump...that's, on an average roll of 10, a 25ft long-jump or a 6ft high jump (not including vertical reach) from a standing start!

I know Jump isn't the most utilitarian skill (you can't, for instance, pick locks with it), but when you consider that a dedicated jumper at level 4 (Thri-Keen ECL) of practically any other race will be rolling an average of, let's say, 22 to 24 (10 +7 ranks in Jump, +2-4 Strength, +3 Skill focus), you've got to admit that it's impressive.

Is this a typo? Or are Thri-Keens really supposed to have nigh-on magical jumping prowess (compare their racial bonus on Jump to Glibness, a level 2 spell that adds the same bonus to Bluff)?

BlueWizard
2009-03-30, 06:50 AM
They are insectoid creatures.

Cubey
2009-03-30, 06:55 AM
Or are Thri-Keens really supposed to have nigh-on magical jumping prowess (compare their racial bonus on Jump to Glibness, a level 2 spell that adds the same bonus to Bluff)?

Yes, they are.

Flickerdart
2009-03-30, 07:03 AM
This is why Jump is the easiest skill to boost and thus used for the Jumplomancer. Exemplar, Exemplar.

SydneyLosstarot
2009-03-30, 07:06 AM
Now consider a Thri-Kreen martial adept with the Sudden Leap maneuver:
moves [jump check] feet as a swift action.
Who needs Pounce now?

Shpadoinkle
2009-03-30, 07:12 AM
Yes, they're supposed to be able to jump like that. As I recall, they've been able to jump like that in previous editions too. Why? They're giant BUGS. Do you have any idea how far bugs can jump?

RebelRogue
2009-03-30, 07:18 AM
Yes, they're supposed to be able to jump like that. As I recall, they've been able to jump like that in previous editions too. Why? They're giant BUGS. Do you have any idea how far bugs can jump?
That's because of their great strength relative to their size. In real life, scaling a bug up in size would make it lose this ability. However, D&D scales everything else, so it does make sense within the game's framework.

I sort of fell like making a thri-kreen ninja now, with their Great Leap ability. One game I DM has a ninja/psywar PC. He spends a lot of time leaping over difficult terrain (sort of silly, but pretty useful) :smallbiggrin:

MickJay
2009-03-30, 07:19 AM
I always thought of them as overgrown grasshoppers with some mantis-like characteristics. If anything, they should be able to jump even better.

BlueWizard
2009-03-30, 07:21 AM
Thri-kreen monks are awesome.

Dixieboy
2009-03-30, 07:41 AM
They are insectoid creatures.

Insects would collapse upon themselves at this size :smallbiggrin:

So lets ignore real life shall we, i think the problem is balance mah friend

Cubey
2009-03-30, 08:16 AM
With the race's ECL, you can barely call it balanced. More like pretty weak.

Kaiyanwang
2009-03-30, 08:24 AM
Insects would collapse upon themselves at this size :smallbiggrin:


After a certain size, arthropods have respiratory issues dued to their respiratory system (oxigen pressure). In paleozoic, they were bigger because atmosphere had a bigger concentration of oxigen.

*hides a Catgirl corpse under the carpet*

newbDM
2009-03-30, 08:43 AM
Now consider a Thri-Kreen martial adept with the Sudden Leap maneuver:
moves [jump check] feet as a swift action.
Who needs Pounce now?

Faster than a speeding bullet.

Able to leap tall buildings in a single bound.


Now it just needs to find a way to stop a train...

newbDM
2009-03-30, 08:48 AM
After a certain size, arthropods have respiratory issues dued to their respiratory system (oxigen pressure). In paleozoic, they were bigger because atmosphere had a bigger concentration of oxigen.

*hides a Catgirl corpse under the carpet*


Dude, that is so mean. What did catgirls ever do to become sacrificial lambs in internet geek debates? :smallfrown:

Do you know how cute they are? :smallfrown:

Asbestos
2009-03-30, 09:03 AM
That's because of their great strength relative to their size. In real life, scaling a bug up in size would make it lose this ability. However, D&D scales everything else, so it does make sense within the game's framework.


Also, because some bugs are specialized for jumping. Having 'insectoid' or 'bug' as a reason for them jumping far is like saying that kangaroos jump well because they're mammals, like rabbits.

Kaiyanwang
2009-03-30, 09:24 AM
Dude, that is so mean. What did catgirls ever do to become sacrificial lambs in internet geek debates? :smallfrown:

Do you know how cute they are? :smallfrown:

Science injected in D&D demands a bloody tribute.

Dixieboy
2009-03-30, 09:24 AM
After a certain size, arthropods have respiratory issues dued to their respiratory system (oxigen pressure). In paleozoic, they were bigger because atmosphere had a bigger concentration of oxigen.

*hides a Catgirl corpse under the carpet*

Arthropods have nothing to do with this discussion, but yes, you are right, your point?

No wait, don't answer, we must stop the genocide of the catgirl specie :smallfrown:

monty
2009-03-30, 10:05 AM
Faster than a speeding bullet.

Able to leap tall buildings in a single bound.


Now it just needs to find a way to stop a train...

Counter Charge. I doubt the train has a very good Dex. It's not "more powerful than a locomotive," per se, but it'll do the job.

Kaiyanwang
2009-03-30, 10:31 AM
Arthropods have nothing to do with this discussion, but yes, you are right, your point?

No wait, don't answer, we must stop the genocide of the catgirl specie :smallfrown:

You cited insects structure, insects are arthropods. Was just a joke about real world rules and catgirl killing (I was pointing that an insect as big as a TK would have repsiratory problems, too).

Forgive me if you can.

/derailment.

Dixieboy
2009-03-30, 11:22 AM
You cited insects structure, insects are arthropods. Was just a joke about real world rules and catgirl killing (I was pointing that an insect as big as a TK would have repsiratory problems, too).

Forgive me if you can.

/derailment.
Forgiven, and forgive me for coming off as rude, but i had too look up what an arthropod was :smallmad:

LibraryOgre
2009-03-30, 01:32 PM
I don't see what's unreasonable; thri-kreen have always been leapers. In 2e, it was 50' forward, or 20' straight up, starting at 3rd level.

hamishspence
2009-03-30, 01:35 PM
I wonder if Knight or Paladin complements Thri-keen well at all?

And is "Sir Jumpalot" a bad name for one? :smallamused:

SydneyLosstarot
2009-03-30, 01:42 PM
Do you get bonus damage if you fall on a guy from the sky with a lance? like, spirited charge.

Yay for Final Fantasy Dragoons!

Atamasama
2009-03-30, 02:19 PM
I don't understand the surprise at finding that giant grasshopper people have superhuman jumping powers.:smallconfused:

I'd rather question the system if they didn't.

tyckspoon
2009-03-30, 05:38 PM
Do you get bonus damage if you fall on a guy from the sky with a lance? like, spirited charge.

Yay for Final Fantasy Dragoons!

Normally, it would just count as a standard charge; DM's fiat as to whether or not you do extra damage for it. The Battle Jump feat allows for a damage multiplier if you manage to fall from five or more feet above the target, however.

Myou
2009-03-30, 06:06 PM
Normally, it would just count as a standard charge; DM's fiat as to whether or not you do extra damage for it. The Battle Jump feat allows for a damage multiplier if you manage to fall from five or more feet above the target, however.
You'd deal falling damage for an object of your weight though. And take the same.

Chronos
2009-03-30, 06:08 PM
That's because of their great strength relative to their size. In real life, scaling a bug up in size would make it lose this ability. However, D&D scales everything else, so it does make sense within the game's framework.In fact, using real-world physics, you can derive the rule of thumb that all creatures, regardless of size, can all jump about the same height. A flea, a dog, a human, a horse... They can all jump a few feet straight up. It looks impressive on a flea because we expect that a small creature should only be able to do small things, but the world doesn't work that way.

Heliomance
2009-03-30, 06:11 PM
And another catgirl bites the dust!

monty
2009-03-30, 06:35 PM
And another catgirl bites the dust-ah!

And another one gone and another one gone, another one bites the dust!

Also, fixed for you.

Lappy9000
2009-03-30, 06:47 PM
I hate you all. Yes, I'm joking. This whole conversation is hilarious :D

Chronos
2009-03-30, 07:06 PM
Don't worry about the catgirls. One's created every time anyone writes a slash fanfiction; we ludiphysicists are just doing what we can to keep their numbers controlled and stave off the inevitable Malthusian catgirl collapse. Trust me, it's for their own good.

Waspinator
2009-03-30, 07:44 PM
Do you get bonus damage if you fall on a guy from the sky with a lance? like, spirited charge.

Yay for Final Fantasy Dragoons!

Someone seriously needs to make a "Dragoon" school for Tome of Battle classes.

Aquillion
2009-03-30, 07:49 PM
Someone seriously needs to make a "Dragoon" school for Tome of Battle classes.I think Knight Phantom already has that covered...? :smallconfused:

Myrmex
2009-03-30, 08:26 PM
After a certain size, arthropods have respiratory issues dued to their respiratory system (oxigen pressure). In paleozoic, they were bigger because atmosphere had a bigger concentration of oxigen.

*hides a Catgirl corpse under the carpet*

This is, at least, the current theory. The evidence in support, though, is underwhelming.

Kaiyanwang
2009-03-31, 01:35 AM
This is, at least, the current theory. The evidence in support, though, is underwhelming.

Please, stop. The smell of blood didn't leave my hands. :smalleek: