Krod Mandoon and the Flaming Sword of Fire. New Comedy Central show. Is targeting us?

[Kobold_Love]

I have seen the previews for this show a few times on Comedy Central. Each time I have thought to myself "Are they targeting the geek D&D culture?".

I figured we'd be too small in number, at least compared to things such as WoW and video games, to be a feasible target audience.

Your thoughts on this?


p.s. I hoping the show succeeds, though.

[Starbuck_II]

Yes, I think it starts the warrior/magical spirit within everyone.

Deep down everyone loves roleplaying games, but most will not let themselves show this a facet of themselves.
(possibly to negative stigma associated)

It could be good.

[Kobold_Love]

Here is a preview:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_3LYk2L9TXM

[Prime32]

I hope this is real.:smallbiggrin:

[hanzo66]

It certainly looks like a decent satire of Fantasy pieces in a Mel Brooks sort of way.

Might check it out...

[Fawkes]

I hope this is real.:smallbiggrin:

What do you mean? Of course it's real. It's premiering on Comedy Central and the BBC on April 9.

[Loch]

AWESOME!! so AWESOME!!

[Closet_Skeleton]

So the one female character is a slut?

If you have multiple female characters, one being a stereotype is a limited problem, if you only have a single female character whose gender is entirely a novelty trait you're almost beyond hope.

I prefer my comedy to be slightly more subversive. I get that your target audience is guys who don't know what real women are like, but surely there's a better way to get comedy from that fact.

It's not like the hero being an idiot and the villain being a pervert is actually that differant from the material they're parodying.

Give me satire over farce any day.

[Ent]

What's Krod backwards?

Yeah, I think it's targeted.

[Fawkes]

Give me satire over farce any day.

Dude, watch an episode first before you judge. :smallconfused:

[Closet_Skeleton]

Dude, watch an episode first before you judge. :smallconfused:

How? It doesn't air for eight days.

There's a time for everything and the time for kneejerk trailer reactions is now. It's not like my comments are any less valid than anyone elses, they're just more indepth (depending on your point of view).

Once it's aired, it will be too late for me to be able to say "I told you so".

edit:

You mean like 99.99875% of D&D parties with a female PC/player?

That's exactly my point, lazy comedy enforces stereotypes rather than commenting on them intelligently.

If you're going to market something to geeks based on your stereotypes of them, it would be better to take advantage of the fact that they're intelligent rather than that they're bad with women.

[newbDM]

So the one female character is a slut?

If you have multiple female characters, one being a stereotype is a limited problem, if you only have a single female character whose gender is entirely a novelty trait you're almost beyond hope.


You mean like 99.99875% of D&D parties with a female PC/player?



Oh, and I just saw another trailer on Comedy Central for the show. The main character even uses the term Tumble. It was after his ex-ish ( the "slutty" female character) did some back flips past some enemies, in the process having hew skirt/cloth fall down (as she was upside down). I believe he said something on the lines of "If you have to tumble, at least wear something else!". Yeah, I have a feeling it somewhat inspired by D&D...

[Whoracle]

Oh, and I just saw another trailer on Comedy Central for the show. The main character even uses the term Tumble. It was after his ex-ish ( the "slutty" female character) did some back flips past some enemies, in the process having hew skirt/cloth fall down (as she was upside down). I believe he said something on the lines of "If you have to tumble, at least wear something else!". Yeah, I have a feeling it somewhat inspired by D&D...

Even though you might well be right, you ARE aware that "to tumble" is a completely valid english term for such acrobatics, do you?

[kamikasei]

It was after his ex-ish ( the "slutty" female character) did some back flips past some enemies, in the process having hew skirt/cloth fall down (as she was upside down).

:smallannoyed:

This actually does sound simply too stupid to be much good.

[Human Paragon 3]

Oh, and I just saw another trailer on Comedy Central for the show. The main character even uses the term Tumble. It was after his ex-ish ( the "slutty" female character) did some back flips past some enemies, in the process having hew skirt/cloth fall down (as she was upside down). I believe he said something on the lines of "If you have to tumble, at least wear something else!". Yeah, I have a feeling it somewhat inspired by D&D...

Sounds like Order of the Stick: The Movie. (see also, this (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0035.html).)

[newbDM]

Sounds like Order of the Stick: The Movie. (see also, this (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0035.html).)

Oh, damn...

So ronery, yet so on topic. Kinda makes you think about the truth behind geek subculture.

[Brimlock]

Well... I tend not to like irony in my fantasy. The wink-wink, tongue-in-cheek style of entertainments like Xena: Warrior Princess leaves me rather cold, by and large. The screen fantasies I find most compelling tend to be the ones that "play it straight," à la Dragonslayer and the first Conan film.

However, with that said, this show is clearly total slapstick and (unlike Xena) won't be making any attempt to balance its unseriousness with a veneer of grittiness or pathos. As such, maybe it'll be able to blow right past my qualms. I hope it will. It comes down to how good the writing and direction are, I suppose. I'll definitely give it a chance.

[Fawkes]

:smallannoyed:

This actually does sound simply too stupid to be much good.

I don't think that was an entirely accurate description. Watch the 30-second clip here (http://www.comedycentral.com/videos/index.jhtml?videoId=222705&title=preview-enter-the-freedom). It's not really that stupid.

[Tanaar]

So the one female character is a slut?

If you have multiple female characters, one being a stereotype is a limited problem, if you only have a single female character whose gender is entirely a novelty trait you're almost beyond hope.

I prefer my comedy to be slightly more subversive. I get that your target audience is guys who don't know what real women are like, but surely there's a better way to get comedy from that fact.

It's not like the hero being an idiot and the villain being a pervert is actually that differant from the material they're parodying.

Give me satire over farce any day.

My reactions and feelings toward it were almost identical. And it appears to be far more parody than 'serious' fun. I am apprehensive, and fear that it will perpetuate some of the negative stereotypes, e.g. that people who roleplay great heroes in their spare time don't know how to interact with a real woman (which is often a fallacy).

[Piedmon_Sama]

Mm yes, you see when I was roleplaying the courting of the Elven Queen of the Misted Woods

[Closet_Skeleton]

My reactions and feelings toward it were almost identical. And it appears to be far more parody than 'serious' fun. I am apprehensive, and fear that it will perpetuate some of the negative stereotypes, e.g. that people who roleplay great heroes in their spare time don't know how to interact with a real woman (which is often a fallacy).

My problem isn't that it's parody, it's that it doesn't appear to be very inventive parody. I have no idea how affectionate (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/AffectionateParody) it is but it doesn't seem to be particularly witty.

edit:


Honestly...if its that much of a problem then don't watch it. Its as simple as that. You don't get offended, the people who enjoy it won't have to get grief for it. Everyone will be happy.

It isn't a problem at all, but I'm unlikely to be watching it as I'm not much of a television person. As it stands my only hope for this show would be if they put the 'lowest common denominator' (not a phrase I like) parts in the trailer.


If you do watch it, then you only have yourself to blame for getting offended.

I'm not getting offended, I'm rolling my eyes with disatisfaction.

I don't see anything wrong with desiring a higher standard of entertainment.

[Innis Cabal]

Honestly...if its that much of a problem then don't watch it. Its as simple as that. You don't get offended, the people who enjoy it won't have to get grief for it. Everyone will be happy.

If you do watch it, then you only have yourself to blame for getting offended.

[JaxGaret]

So the one female character is a slut?

I get that your target audience is guys who don't know what real women are like, but surely there's a better way to get comedy from that fact.

I don't think the point of having a slutty girl on the show is comedy. It's to have a slutty girl on the show.

It's not rocket surgery - it's the same reason for the existence of professional cheerleaders and beer commercials filled with hot women etc. (any such thing where sex is used as a selling point/entertainment). Purely to attract and entertain a larger male audience.

[TheCountAlucard]

It's not rocket surgery...

Rocket science + brain surgery = WIN.

[Ascension]

Personally, my problem with it is the farting ogre. I really, really can't stand fart jokes. They immediately make me toss something from the actual comedy bin into the mindless drivel for nincompoops bin.

[Hectonkhyres]

Dude, watch an episode first before you judge. :smallconfused:
Wait... last time somebody told me to see something first hand before I judged, I ended up blowing sixty dollars picking up a copy of Spore. And we all know how that turned out.

Seriously: It is a profoundly good idea to try and judge whether you are going to like something before you jump in head first. Humans were, after all, endowed with the power of foresight for a reason. It would save us all from a litany of horrible, horrible mistakes if we just used it.

[Tensu]

Wait... last time somebody told me to see something first hand before I judged, I ended up blowing sixty dollars picking up a copy of Spore. And we all know how that turned out.

Only game I ever refused to accept the terms of service for.

[Innis Cabal]

I mean...I guess it makes sense to just get burned once and never reserve judgment ever again. Especially in an act of comedy that you think is either low brow or just not your sort of thing :smallconfused:

I'll just say it again, because honestly I think it needs to be said. "Its just a show. You don't have to watch it. It isn't important, its all make beleive."

[thegurullamen]

I'll just say it again, because honestly I think it needs to be said. "Its just a show. You don't have to watch it. It isn't important, its all make beleive."

Yes. And? Your point doesn't address the problem people have with shows like this, it just denigrates the medium.

People like seeing television (or reading books or watching plays or etc.) that deals with their interests. Krod Mandoon looks like it wants to fill this niche with the geek crowd. As this is rare (parodies about fantasy are few and far between,) many people hope it will be worth watching because if it's a flop, it'll be a long while before this subject matter shows up on a national channel again. If it's good, there's a chance execs from other companies will latch on and throw us a few bones, hopefully some of which are also worth watching.

I might be overstating it, but it's not just about some new show. Not since the days of Andy Griffith has a show been "just a show." New shows change the way future shows are made. Anyone who doubts this should look at the impact Survivor had on television for the past decade or what Lost is doing for shows with heavy continuity. Krod could be the opening for a new genre, subgenre or something--anything, really--that isn't fantasy-as-produced-by-the-channel-formerly-known-as-SciFi.

There's also the geek stereotype. It's not hard to see how a show like this could be rife with poorly constructed jokes at our expense. It's still fairly mainstream to think geek=loser. A show like this can invert the idea or avoid it altogether and present a geeky half hour of entertainment that doesn't side with the mainstream by poking fun at how stupid the geeks are. And it can do this while gaining mainstream approval if the quality is high enough. Knowing the productions CC is responsible for, though, I don't find much if any of this likely, which brings me to the last point.

Television shows are expensive to produce, financially and in many other ways. Creative talents are tapped, thousands of man-hours are spent and if the end product is worthless, all of it is wasted. Consider that a show has to pass through several layers of production before it ever sees air and it staggers you to see how much crap there is out there. All of it was vetted at several stages in its production when the supervisor at any one point could have stopped it in its tracks with a simple "This stinks. Trash it." Instead it was green lights all the way to its cancellation.

Now, apply all of that to a fledgling genre and you get what could be a smart comedy or a gimmicky farce. Either way, you've got a good indicator of what's to come. TV iz serius bidnes.

[Innis Cabal]

It still is just a show, and saying its not by merit of how it effects -other- shows is not an indication of that fact being untrue. If anything it helps the argument.

In the end, its for entertainment, that is it. Its not some extensive look into the psyche of the human mind. Are there shows like that? Yep. Is this one of them? Nope. Its a comedy, a spoof as it appears. It is there to amuse you. Or not. If it dosn't, don't watch it. When it comes to the media, its as simple as turning it off. Thats it. Don't like something on channel x? Lucky for you even basic TV comes with 3 channels! If you have cable? WAAAY more! Change the channel to channel y and move on with it.

Does it adress the "issues"? No, some of us don't think it has issues, and there is no reason for anyone to defend its virtues when its not going to sway someones opinions. Its a needless and pointless argument over taste. So saying "Don't watch it so you won't complain so we can watch it and enjoy it" is just as valid as anything else. Does it keep a "nerd" sterotype going? So what? Who cares what people think about people who play D&D? Is someone elses opinion on your hobby important? Is it that offensive that people keep the sterotype going? Its not like you get passed over for a job or get shot to death in a parking lot because you roll a d20 around on a table or play Halo 3. Regardless if there is a niche or not for the "geek community" the more the "Geek community" lash's out at these sorts of things the more backlash they'll get. Isn't the saying in the geek community from MSTK all about this? I think so

If your offended by a fighting bar wench, then its as easy as ignoring her. If you don't find fart jokes amusing (And I happen to agree on this point) then guess what you can do? Not watch it. As for those who like those sorts of things? You have a show now! Endorse it! Love it! And hopefully for you guys it gets a second season!

[Hectonkhyres]

How many live action fantasy series have been made in the years since the last gasps of the Legendary Journeys of Hercules/Xena: Warrior Princess franchise? Oh, one or two perhaps... but nothing of any note. The few that have spontaneously generated, such as the recent Sword of Truth attempt, sucked even more than their source material. And nobody has chosen to try a non-derivative piece in the history of television.

It is my fear that, if they try this Krod Mandoon spiel and it fails horribly, they will have poisoned the waters for every other fantasy series that might try to make its way to the small screen anytime in the next two decades. Producers will simply assume that it failed due to the fact that it is a fantasy series and not because it is a poorly written piece of drek with a halfassed crew and a bad premise.

Even worse is if it sucks mightily and is an instant hit. If that were to happen, producers would instantly dub it the golden child that can do no wrong and will order two dozen (equally sucky) series clones to try to cash in on the moment's novelty. Its the Survivor/Real World syndrome. I do not want my chosen niche to become synonymous with the sort of shallow pap that is likely to be vomited forth from such a cascade of crappyness.

I'm hoping its both good and successful though. If it is, it opens up a whole new market for the fantasy genre. And, hey, I might actually enjoy watching the damn thing. You never know.

[Ganurath]

It could be funny, but it won't last long as the viewership won't pay for the special effects budget... Unless the violence provides a boost.

Also, UMLAUTS DO NOT WORK THAT WAY! GOODNIGHT!

[kamikasei]

Innis, who's saying they're offended by it? Who's suggesting they're somehow forced to watch it? Who's saying that its "not just a show", except in the ways shared by any TV show?

I just see an OP saying "hey check this out it looks cool", others chiming in saying "yeah awesome!" and a few piping up to say "nah, it looks stupid. For example, <warning sign X>".

Don't those criticizing have just as much basis to do so as those praising, since neither group have seen more than the other? Or is it that you think only praise should be allowed, that the response to all criticism should be "just ignore it"?

[bosssmiley]

Well... I tend not to like irony in my fantasy. The wink-wink, tongue-in-cheek style of entertainments like Xena: Warrior Princess leaves me rather cold, by and large. The screen fantasies I find most compelling tend to be the ones that "play it straight," à la Dragonslayer and the first Conan film.

You thought the first Conan film was serious? (http://www.thecimmerian.com/?p=3371) Oh, that's a good'un! :smallamused:

And just think, for the money that's been wasted on this travesty we could have had the "Korgoth of Barbaria" series. What a wasted opportunity. :smallannoyed:

[Closet_Skeleton]

This is the media section of an internet forum, I come here to discuss media, [exagerated bile]not to be told about my ability to press an off switch, which I already knew about thank you very much[/exagerated bile].


Innis, who's saying they're offended by it?

Oddly I'm becoming more offended by Innis' assumptions of my feelings than the trailers but it isn't like I can blame him for repeating the same point multiple times in one thread when every forum poster ever, including myself, has done so.

[Nevrmore]

So the one female character is a slut?

If you have multiple female characters, one being a stereotype is a limited problem, if you only have a single female character whose gender is entirely a novelty trait you're almost beyond hope.

I prefer my comedy to be slightly more subversive. I get that your target audience is guys who don't know what real women are like, but surely there's a better way to get comedy from that fact.

It's not like the hero being an idiot and the villain being a pervert is actually that differant from the material they're parodying.

Give me satire over farce any day.
Wow.

Shut up.

Seriously, what is this feminist knee-jerk BS? "WHOA WHOA WHOA, guys, they made a joke about that girl's promiscuity! Well, that rules out this show for our Thursday get-togethers. Now I'll just adjust my purity ring and get back to watching something with more empowering female role models. Also, the Bible."

I'm not even saying that your complaints are invalid. The previews of the show do look pretty vapid and the characters stupid, but the tone of your post was just so pretentious as to make me completely antipathetic towards your argument. Seriously, "I get your target audience is guys who don't know what real women are like?" So sorry that the show crossed you, oh mighty pimp of pimps.

[kamikasei]

You're lumping together some pretty weird things there, Nevrmore. Feminism = purity rings = the Bible? Knowing what real women are like = pimpdom?

(Not to rag on the biblically oriented, I've just never seen "feminism implies religiousness" as a stereotype before.)

[Nevrmore]

I went for a potluck of stereotypes.

And I meant "pimp" as in "player" as in "sleeps with a lot of women." Duh.

[Innis Cabal]

Innis, who's saying they're offended by it? Who's suggesting they're somehow forced to watch it? Who's saying that its "not just a show", except in the ways shared by any TV show?

I just see an OP saying "hey check this out it looks cool", others chiming in saying "yeah awesome!" and a few piping up to say "nah, it looks stupid. For example, <warning sign X>".

Don't those criticizing have just as much basis to do so as those praising, since neither group have seen more than the other? Or is it that you think only praise should be allowed, that the response to all criticism should be "just ignore it"?

I'm going to have to go with thegurullamen, as my post was directly after his and adressed only his points and no one elses.

And simply put...ya, in the end if the criticism is over something so senseless and meaningless as a TV show honestly the best answer is "Just ignore it". Because honestly, life is to bloody short to get all hot and bothered over a media format when you don't ever have to subject yourself to it.

Who are any of us to say how this show should run? WHo are any of us to tell another person their taste is "lowbrow" or "uncultured" if you ask me thats pretty rude in and of itself and is far more insulting then making assumptions about peoples feelings.

[Tensu]

(Not to rag on the biblically oriented, I've just never seen "feminism implies religiousness" as a stereotype before.)

I generally tend to assume the opposite. I mean, Lilith magazine? seriously?

[kamikasei]

I'm going to have to go with thegurullamen, as my post was directly after his and adressed only his points and no one elses.

Your last post followed his. You were talking about people being offended before he posted in the thread.


And simply put...ya, in the end if the criticism is over something so senseless and meaningless as a TV show honestly the best answer is "Just ignore it". Because honestly, life is to bloody short to get all hot and bothered over a media format when you don't ever have to subject yourself to it.

But where is this assumption that anyone is "hot and bothered" coming from? As I said: our attention was drawn to the show, some said they liked the look of it, others said they didn't. "Offense" or the rest of it don't enter in to it. Again, you seem to be assuming that those voicing any criticism are much more invested in it than those offering support; why?

It seems to me you're saying that criticism is inherently invalid. On what basis can any piece of entertainment be criticised, in your view? If my opinion of something is negative, does that mean I should never express it?

If when this show starts airing I find myself rolling my eyes rather than laughing, I won't watch it. I won't burst in to threads about it to say it sucks, I won't interrupt conversations about it to do the same. If asked my opinion on it, I'll say I think it sucks. If it comes up in other discussions, I will voice my opinion just as someone who likes it would voice theirs.

Until then, we have only a little information to go off of. The OP was wondering if it might be targeted at "us" - RP and fantasy geeks. If it is, then considering whether it looks like being good or not is perfectly legitimate, as is considering whether it's really targeted at geeks or targeted at the mainstream and poking fun at geeks, or just targeted at the mainstream and milking fantasy tropes for laughs.

Maybe the show will turn out to have an entirely different audience whose needs it satisfies perfectly well, and the fact that I don't like it will be entirely immaterial. There will still be things to criticise about it, it just won't generally be relevant. But the topic of this thread wasn't "thing: praise it!" but "thing: what do you think?", which means criticism is relevant.

[Closet_Skeleton]

Shut up.

:smalltongue:


Seriously, what is this feminist knee-jerk BS? "WHOA WHOA WHOA, guys, they made a joke about that girl's promiscuity! Well, that rules out this show for our Thursday get-togethers. Now I'll just adjust my purity ring and get back to watching something with more empowering female role models. Also, the Bible.

Did you just call my reaction knee-jerk and then launch into a sarcastic tirade against my point of view based entirely off the tone you interpreted to have?

It isn't the content, it's the presentation. There's nothing wrong with a promiscuous character, but there's something rather crude and pathetic a show where a character's promiscuity is the entire point of her character. All the characters is this show (going by the trailer) are also one note characters, but it's annoying when the male characters get to have characterisation based on things other than their gender while the female ones don't. Except for the fact that the protagonist is basically the male stereotype equivilant of the female character, which shows how the problem wouldn't really be there if there was more than one female character.

But really it just shows that the jokes are all kind of obvious and you can't expect much actual wit from this show.


The previews of the show do look pretty vapid and the characters stupid, but the tone of your post was just so pretentious as to make me completely antipathetic towards your argument.

Tone is impossible to get over the internet, especially in a post I didn't spend much time making.


So sorry that the show crossed you, oh mighty pimp of pimps.

:smallconfused:

I'm a virgin thank you very much.

[Innis Cabal]

Honestly...if its that much of a problem then don't watch it. Its as simple as that. You don't get offended, the people who enjoy it won't have to get grief for it. Everyone will be happy.

If you do watch it, then you only have yourself to blame for getting offended.

This is actually what I said, the word offensive appears, but its in a future tense. You won't get offended if you don't watch it. Untill someone posted the negatives relating to a certain set of people it remained in the future tense. But thats neither here nor there.


It seems to me you're saying that criticism is inherently invalid. On what basis can any piece of entertainment be criticised, in your view? If my opinion of something is negative, does that mean I should never express it?

Never said that really…now whose assuming :smallwink:? I said that arguing over its flaws and criticizing others tastes for being “lowbrow” or “less refined” is inherently silly and based on the fact that tastes are allowed to differ. And there have been people who have called the show more or less that, which would imply anyone who liked it has “less refined” tastes through their enjoyment. Which is simply wrong.


Until then, we have only a little information to go off of.

Why bother saying anything on it then? You don't know anything about the show. So calling it stupid or casting a negative sterotype seems...well....an exercise in futility.

[kamikasei]

This is actually what I said, the word offensive appears, but its in a future tense. You won't get offended if you don't watch it. Untill someone posted the negatives relating to a certain set of people it remained in the future tense. But thats neither here nor there.

So your defense is that, instead of assuming we were offended, you were assuming we feared we might become offended? It's not really an improvement.

My point is that offense has nothing to do with it.


Why bother saying anything on it then? You don't know anything about the show. So calling it stupid or casting a negative sterotype seems...well....an exercise in futility.

But if it's invalid to say it looks bad or offer criticism based on the little we know, it's equally invalid to say anything else about it, and we may as well lock the thread.

Well, no, that's not strictly true. We could say things like "this appears to be a TV show", "I guess humans act in it", and "it will be on Comedy Central"; those don't require more evidence than the clips provide.


Never said that really…now whose assuming :smallwink:?

There's a difference between assuming others' motivations and taking the argument you see others making to its conclusion.


I said that arguing over its flaws and criticizing others tastes for being “lowbrow” or “less refined” is inherently silly and based on the fact that tastes are allowed to differ. And there have been people who have called the show more or less that, which would imply anyone who liked it has “less refined” tastes through their enjoyment. Which is simply wrong.

Firstly, you haven't limited your "if you don't like it, don't talk or think about it" advice to those who criticize the tastes of those who might enjoy the show. Secondly, the above is where I'm getting my "so is no criticism at all valid?" from. Is everything which has at least one person who enjoys it immune to criticism because obviously it satisfies his tastes and yours just differ? Or can someone who doesn't like a thing or aspects of a thing describe his reasons yet remain legitimate?

[Nevrmore]

Did you just call my reaction knee-jerk and then launch into a sarcastic tirade against my point of view based entirely off the tone you interpreted to have?
The word your looking for is "hyperbole." I do not actually assume that you get together with all the mothers in MacMaynerberry Villa every Thursday to discuss the evils of modern television and their portrayals of women whilst recording dramatic readings of select Bible verses and posting them to Youtube to hate and scorn from commenters.


It isn't the content, it's the presentation. There's nothing wrong with a promiscuous character, but there's something rather crude and pathetic a show where a character's promiscuity is the entire point of her character. All the characters is this show (going by the trailer) are also one note characters, but it's annoying when the male characters get to have characterisation based on things other than their gender while the female ones don't. Except for the fact that the protagonist is basically the male stereotype equivilant of the female character, which shows how the problem wouldn't really be there if there was more than one female character.
Maybe I watched a different trailer than you did, but I remember one joke about what's-her-face making out with a guy underneath a clock to get the time. Yes, that's definitely a reason to sit in your psychologist's armchair (seated on the high horse).


But really it just shows that the jokes are all kind of obvious and you can't expect much actual wit from this show.
I thought the "Death to oppression!" "To oppression!" scene was pretty funny.


Tone is impossible to get over the internet, especially in a post I didn't spend much time making.
Obviously not, as you were able to decipher that my imitation of you was sarcastic and that I was making fun of your pseudo-intellectual rant on the show.


:smallconfused:

I'm a virgin thank you very much.
Yes, yes, we already discussed your purity ring.

[JaxGaret]

simply put...ya, in the end if the criticism is over something so senseless and meaningless as a TV show honestly the best answer is "Just ignore it". Because honestly, life is to bloody short to get all hot and bothered over a media format when you don't ever have to subject yourself to it.

This begs the question: why are you posting about the show at all then, if you find TV to be so meaningless and senseless?


Who are any of us to say how this show should run?

Who, indeed. We should just shut up and take whatever **** is shoveled at us, right?

[Fawkes]

Who, indeed. We should just shut up and take whatever **** is shoveled at us, right?

You know, there's a reason that actual critics watch an episode or two first before passing judgment on a series. It's because, and listen closely here, TRAILERS ARE NOT AN ACCURATE REPRESENTATION OF A SHOW'S CONTENT.

[Sneak]

You know, there's a reason that actual critics watch an episode or two first before passing judgment on a series. It's because, and listen closely here, TRAILERS ARE NOT AN ACCURATE REPRESENTATION OF A SHOW'S CONTENT.

Yes, but that doesn't mean you can't form an opinion of the show based on the trailers and discuss it. Right now, we have nothing else to go on. So we have to judge it based on the trailers. And if that's still unacceptable, well, then there's not really any need for a thread.

[Nevrmore]

This begs the question
No, it doesn't.

[JaxGaret]

You know, there's a reason that actual critics watch an episode or two first before passing judgment on a series.

Actual critics whose opinion I should accept as gospel, right - why form an opinion of my own.

Critics can be useful tools, yes, but they're not infallible.


It's because, and listen closely here, TRAILERS ARE NOT AN ACCURATE REPRESENTATION OF A SHOW'S CONTENT.

Where was I talking about a trailer? My response was to InnisCabal's statement about "how shows should be run". Not trailers.


No, it doesn't.

Care to elaborate?

[Nevrmore]

Care to elaborate?
Begging the question, AKA circular reasoning, is a fallacious argument in which a conclusion purported to have been reached was already established or otherwise made known in the premise of the argument itself. Bringing up the point "If you think TV is senseless, why are you arguing in favor of this television show?" isn't begging the question, it's simply raising an inquiry. Sounds similar, but the meanings are completely different.

[JaxGaret]

Begging the question, AKA circular reasoning, is a fallacious argument in which a conclusion purported to have been reached was already established or otherwise made known in the premise of the argument itself. Bringing up the point "If you think TV is senseless, why are you arguing in favor of this television show?" isn't begging the question, it's simply raising an inquiry. Sounds similar, but the meanings are completely different.

Oh okay. I was using the colloquial form rather than the traditional one. Sorry if that was misleading in any way. I probably should have just said "raises" instead of "begs".

[Nevrmore]

The More You Know.

[Tyrant]

Even worse is if it sucks mightily and is an instant hit. If that were to happen, producers would instantly dub it the golden child that can do no wrong and will order two dozen (equally sucky) series clones to try to cash in on the moment's novelty. Its the Survivor/Real World syndrome. I do not want my chosen niche to become synonymous with the sort of shallow pap that is likely to be vomited forth from such a cascade of crappyness.
This is my concern with shows/movies such as this. I was concerned when I saw previews for My Super Ex Girlfriend which came out after a number of successful comic book movies that weren't paradies. My fear was that it would be sucessful and kill whatever momentum comic book movies had started gaining. Thankfully I was wrong there. However, looking at Scary Movie will show what kind of monster can be created with these types of things. That snowballed into 3 sequels and a number of increasingly awful "spinoffs" (epic movie, date movie, etc) and they just keep making these movies.

Edit to add: I will give this show a chance. It does look like mostly stupid humor from what I have seen, but I will wait to judge it until after I have seen it.

[Fawkes]

Actual critics whose opinion I should accept as gospel, right - why form an opinion of my own.

Critics can be useful tools, yes, but they're not infallible.

:smallconfused: That has nothing to do with what I'm talking about. I'm saying that you can't judge the overall worth of a television program by its trailers.

It's one thing to see a trailer and say "That doesn't look good, I don't think I'll watch that", and an entirely different thing to watch a thirty second trailer and say things like
So the one female character is a slut? If you have multiple female characters, one being a stereotype is a limited problem, if you only have a single female character whose gender is entirely a novelty trait you're almost beyond hope.

I prefer my comedy to be slightly more subversive. I get that your target audience is guys who don't know what real women are like, but surely there's a better way to get comedy from that fact...Give me satire over farce any day. and
My problem isn't that it's parody, it's that it doesn't appear to be very inventive parody. I have no idea how affectionate (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/AffectionateParody) it is but it doesn't seem to be particularly witty...I don't see anything wrong with desiring a higher standard of entertainment. and
It isn't the content, it's the presentation. There's nothing wrong with a promiscuous character, but there's something rather crude and pathetic a show where a character's promiscuity is the entire point of her character. All the characters is this show (going by the trailer) are also one note characters, but it's annoying when the male characters get to have characterisation based on things other than their gender while the female ones don't. Except for the fact that the protagonist is basically the male stereotype equivilant of the female character, which shows how the problem wouldn't really be there if there was more than one female character.

But really it just shows that the jokes are all kind of obvious and you can't expect much actual wit from this show.

I have nothing against valid criticism. I do have a problem with unfounded criticism based on something that hasn't happened yet. Plus, Closet Skeleton's tone was unnecessarily pretentious and condescending, and was insulting to everyone who had posted before him.

That's my problem.

I've provided a dramatization of the first ten posts of this thread, which I hope will illustrate exactly how this argument started.
http://img219.imageshack.us/img219/2854/mandoon.jpg

[JaxGaret]

:smallconfused: That has nothing to do with what I'm talking about. I'm saying that you can't judge the overall worth of a television program by its trailers.

The whole point of a trailer is to market it to an audience. If the trailer turns you off, 9 times out of 10 the show will turn you off as well.

So, you are technically correct, in that you can't absolutely say that you can judge a show by its trailer, but you can make a pretty decent educated guess.


It's one thing to see a trailer and say "That doesn't look good, I don't think I'll watch that", and an entirely different thing to watch a thirty second trailer and say things like and and

It's not really that different. They're just extrapolating from what information they have, and making an educated guess.


I have nothing against valid criticism. I do have a problem with unfounded criticism based on something that hasn't happened yet.

Who decides if it's valid or invalid? You? I just don't see the point in railing against people posting their opinions, when that's exactly what the OP asked for:


Your thoughts on this?


Plus, Closet Skeleton's tone was unnecessarily pretentious and condescending, and was insulting to everyone who had posted before him.

Would you also be insulted if I said that TV is a complete waste of time, and anyone who watches more than a few hours of TV a day should reexamine that choice? If so, you should really think about why someone saying something like that would insult you.


I've provided a dramatization of the first ten posts of this thread, which I hope will illustrate exactly how this argument started.
http://img219.imageshack.us/img219/2854/mandoon.jpg

While that is hilarious, I did get a good chuckle out of it (nice drawing, btw!), you left out a good part of the OP's post:


I have seen the previews for this show a few times on Comedy Central. Each time I have thought to myself "Are they targeting the geek D&D culture?".

I figured we'd be too small in number, at least compared to things such as WoW and video games, to be a feasible target audience.

Your thoughts on this?


p.s. I hoping the show succeeds, though.

Note how the OP is asking for opinions, and not just fawning, positive opinions.

Also, you are missing the fact that a lot of the "negative" posters hope that the show is good. They just don't see it being the probable outcome, based on the information we have at hand.

[Trizap]

eh. I'm a bit cynical about this, aside from Scrubs, Colbert Report and The Daily Show there isn't really any intelligent comedy on there, and most TV shows tend to perpetuate stereotypes rather than subvert them, plus how many people do the research?

[Muz]

The whole point of a trailer is to market it to an audience. If the trailer turns you off, 9 times out of 10 the show will turn you off as well.

So, you are technically correct, in that you can't absolutely say that you can judge a show by its trailer, but you can make a pretty decent educated guess.

The point of a trailer is to market to the audience of the medium in which the trailer appears, making it look like something that particular audience would be interested in. Case in point: TV ads for Revenge of the Sith geared to kids made it sound like a rousing adventure romp with cute wizened Yoda and the Jedi battling those evil Sith with a nice light-hearted attitude. Ads later in the evening were darker, focusing more on Anakin's fall, the Republic falling apart, and betrayal.

Marketing can edit trailer ads in so many different ways depending on the tone they want it to appear have and the parts they want to focus on. It's not always about marketing to what the show's actual target audience (i.e. the audience the show actually speaks to when viewed in its totality)wants; just as often it's about marketing to what they think a target wants. (Again, witness Watchmen ads--some people thought they were going to see a run-of-the-mill superhero movie, while fans who'd read the graphic novel knew better what it was really about.) Sometimes this is due to misunderstanding the audience, sometimes it's due to trying to attract others with a bait-and-switch.

Now I'm not saying that the trailers for Krod aren't accurate. I'm not saying they are, either. I just don't agree with the "9 times out of 10" statement. :smallsmile:

[MCerberus]

While I will likely watch this, I'm going to keep my expectations low. Comedy central has a history of shows that take an idea and run with it... straight off a cliff. For every Sarah Silverman there's a Little Bush or Drawn Together *shudder*. That said, I'm willing to give it a fair chance.

[The Tygre]

All I'm gonna' say is...

Oh my God, you people have problems if you're arguing this much over a show before it even premiered.

That being, said, now let me speak in in plain, common half-orc about this show, after actually watching it.

Me amused.

Me laughed.

Me papa laughed.

Me friends laughed.

I glad fantasy-themed comedy is on.

Is laughing.

HAR HAR HAR.

Not all show funny, but more than enough to me entertain I.

Me like to remember that Shakespeare, famous word-smith, comedies nothing but convoluted sex-jokes and double entendres. Me not comparing centuries old classics to new show, me just saying.

Me still smoldering over loss of Korgoth of Barbaria while Tim & Eric get three god-forsaken seasons of dry-humping each other.

Me sorry.

Me not mean outburst.

Brain sleepy time.

[FatJose]

Me like to remember that Shakespeare, famous word-smith, comedies nothing but convoluted sex-jokes and double entendres. Me not comparing centuries old classics to new show, me just saying.
Well, Shakespeare also wrote comedies, Sir Half-Orc. They weren't very funny, though. Not HaHa funny anyway.


Me still smoldering over loss of Korgoth of Barbaria while Tim & Eric get three god-forsaken seasons of dry-humping each other.
God..the tongues...and the bald black guy with the puppet... :smallfurious:
....
Yeah, I'm not seeing it. Not saying I wont see it, I mean that I don't find it funny or even really that interesting based on the trailer. I'll watch and see if I like it, though. Trailers can be and usually are deceptive. Look at the movie Slumdog Millionaire. The trailers left the impression that it was a Bollywood mega-movie with all the spontaneous singing and dancing that Indian movies are known for. WRONG. That movie was a British production and only had one scene with the cast singing and dancing and it was in the credits, completely separate from the plot. Its a great movie but I know many people who would have liked the movie but didn't see it because of the ads.

[Ascension]

Well, Shakespeare also wrote comedies, Sir Half-Orc. They weren't very funny, though. Not HaHa funny anyway.

That's if you're reading them, due to our general difficulty with understanding Elizabethan English these days. I've learned from doing Taming of the Shrew that with competent direction you can highlight every bit of innuendo without the need for a single footnote. When you do it transforms from a rather dull, misogynistic affair into a pretty uproarious sex farce. Throw some slapstick in the blocking and presto, you have a competent comedy.

[Ganurath]

All I'm gonna' say is...

Oh my God, you people have problems if you're arguing this much over a show before it even premiered.Welcome to the internet.
That being, said, now let me speak in in plain, common half-orc about this show, after actually watching it.

Me amused.To clarify, that's cliche half-orc, with a negative stereotype dialect. Common half-orc uses proper grammar, but is slightly slurred due to the prominent teeth.
I glad fantasy-themed comedy is on.

Not all show funny, but more than enough to me entertain I.More than enough to entertain The Tygre, or more than enough to entertain a Stupid Half-OrcTM?
Brain sleepy time.When it wakes up, can it drop the affront to people that play half-orcs and speak plainly? All I got out of that is that you hold a higher opinion of Shakespeare than I do and that your offense at Adult Swim's program selection isn't limited to the lack of anime.

I watched the show. My opinion of it is negative, for reasons stated above in addition to two little words: Creative anachronism.

[The Tygre]

Sir Half-Orc.

Ooh, I like the ring of that!


Welcome to the internet.

Touche, sir.



To clarify, that's cliche half-orc, with a negative stereotype dialect. Common half-orc uses proper grammar, but is slightly slurred due to the prominent teeth.

And yet another point to Sir Ganurath. You seem to have me at a disadvantage, sir.


More than enough to entertain The Tygre, or more than enough to entertain a Stupid Half-OrcTM?

A little bit of both, I think. I'm a man of simple tastes.


When it wakes up, can it drop the affront to people that play half-orcs and speak plainly?

Yes; I apologize profusely for my stereotypical and conceptually archaic script. I realize that Half-Orcs are a diverse group and are no more or less intelligent than any other race. If I have any prejudice on my part, it is because my very first D&D character was a Half-Orc Barbarian (lvl. 5) with a horn of Valhalla. I apologize and hope that in turn readers won't form their own negative schema of posters who take their names after William Blake poems. I bow in humble deference to you all.


...your offense at Adult Swim's program selection isn't limited to the lack of anime.

Sir! You wound me! I myself find that to be a stereotype of Adult Swim late-night viewers! I demand satisfaction, even if it is completely true... Furthermore, Korgoth was nothing but home-grown, occidental animation appealing to my gorey and dark sense of humor, as well as a few nods to the RPG player inside.

[Berserk Monk]

Saw the premiere last night. The show is made of win. Me and my viking friends had a huge feast while watching it.

edit: Also, this is the post that promoted me to Barbarian in the Playground. Weird coincidence.

[Fawkes]

The show wasn't fantastic, but it made me laugh several times, and that's all you need. :smallsmile:

[Leliel]

Saw it.

Is it a farce that points fun at fantasy in a ham handed way? Yep.

Is it pretending to be anything else? Nope.

And that's what makes it funny. No pop culture references, no "deep" attempts at "highbrow" humor, just good, clean, self-aware fun.

[Kool-Aid]

Watched the premier, and I have to say that so far, this is my new favorite show, reminds me waaay too much of my friends and I playing D&D. I actually made a character back in October very similar to Krod (I remember it was October because I bought a sword from a local store and proceeded to smack my friend with it).

Needless to say I'm excited for next week's episode and I hope the show does well.

[Berserk Monk]

You know what other show (well, not so much a show as a one time 30 minute pilot on Adult Swim) you guy might like: Korgoth of Barbaria. Great stuff.

[The Tygre]

Alas! It died too young for this world! Meanwhile 12 OZ. Mouse got 20 episodes and we were left in the cold, still in shock that such a hilarious show would be taken from us. Sigh...

"What about the roll?"
*Sighs; Rolls 2d12*
"...Nine!"
"Hrrm, let's see here:
1-6: Stink
7-12: Stink
13-18: Stink
19-24: Roll again
...And...Stink."
*Sulks off*
"He always wins..."

[Archpaladin Zousha]

Man, it makes me wish I had cable at home. I'm here on Easter Break and I missed out on it. :smallfrown:

[Lamech]

I thought it was okay, but not all that great. I hope it does well for the reasons that have been said by others better than I could say them.

[newbDM]

OK, so I have just watched half of the first episode.

I would have loved the show, if it wasn't for the issue with the "paganism" of the female lead. I just deleted it from my DirecTV recorder box.

And come on, pagan doesn't mean that.

[Leliel]

It's a parody.

It's not meant to represent real-life pagans, just the shallow "fiction" version of them.

Remember the MST3K rule-if it wasn't meant to be serious, you shouldn't take it that way.

[Fawkes]

I'm with Leliel. That seems like a pretty silly thing to get offended over. It's all pretty tongue-in-cheek.

[Ganurath]

Leliel, Mechafox, your points are valid if not for the fact that they depend upon everyone watching Comedy Central being at least as intelligent as you. The fact of the matter is that, from what I've seen, you're both smarter than that, and as such it's likely that there will be people that will associate what they see on Krod with reality, at least when it comes to paganism.

[Fawkes]

Leliel, Mechafox, your points are valid if not for the fact that they depend upon everyone watching Comedy Central being at least as intelligent as you. The fact of the matter is that, from what I've seen, you're both smarter than that, and as such it's likely that there will be people that will associate what they see on Krod with reality, at least when it comes to paganism.

Point taken, but, I don't think Krod is going to change anyone's opinions on paganism, and very little is going to sway those who already hold negative opinions of it.

[newbDM]

Leliel, Mechafox, your points are valid if not for the fact that they depend upon everyone watching Comedy Central being at least as intelligent as you. The fact of the matter is that, from what I've seen, you're both smarter than that, and as such it's likely that there will be people that will associate what they see on Krod with reality, at least when it comes to paganism.

Thanks.

I hate to see whole cultures/socities/etc stereotyped and degraded like that. The thing with ancient ones, such as the "pagans" (and yes, I know some still follow forms of said religion(s) today), is that they are so long gone, and the unfair stereotypes have been around so long that it is considered the truth by so many people. Just like all vikings were point horned hats, and where nothing but mindless, savage brutes who cared for nothing but beer, fighting, and rape.




Point taken, but, I don't think Krod is going to change anyone's opinions on paganism, and very little is going to sway those who already hold negative opinions of it.

Agreed on the later, but if all media keeps portraying them like this, then it will sway those who do not yet have an opinion. Especially the younger viewers who are not educated enough to have leanred the truth about said cultures.

[Fawkes]

Agreed on the later, but if all media keeps portraying them like this, then it will sway those who do not yet have an opinion. Especially the younger viewers who are not educated enough to have leanred the truth about said cultures.

I dunno, it seems kind of silly to demand that a farcical fantasy spoof show stick to the facts. I'm sure that there are plenty of people that can't separate reality from fantasy, but I don't think it's right to blame a comedy show for the pre-existing faults of its audience.

[Sneak]

I dunno, I've never really quite accepted the whole "people can't separate reality from fantasy" argument. Because, quite frankly, people can.

It's been one of the main arguments against violent video games. My opinion is...the people so strongly affected by a game as to do something crazy because of it were most likely extremely mentally unstable to begin with, and simply would've been set off by something else.

I guess that's kind of off-topic...but my point is, normal, healthy people can tell the different between reality and fantasy. Even children.

And as far as children watching the program goes...I think it's pretty clear that the material isn't really intended for young children in the first place. So yes, children might watch it, but it's not the responsibility of the writers to try to write for a demographic that they're not shooting for.

Despite all that, however, I will say that their stereotypical gay man portrayal did kind of bother me. Mostly because it has been done to death and just isn't funny anymore, if it ever was.

All in all, it's not the best show, the most interesting, or the funniest, but it's certainly fairly entertaining (and, IMO, worth a watch).

[Fawkes]

I'm with ya on all counts, Sneak. You summed it up pretty well.

And yeah, Bruce is definitely the least interesting character.

[Dervag]

Leliel, Mechafox, your points are valid if not for the fact that they depend upon everyone watching Comedy Central being at least as intelligent as you. The fact of the matter is that, from what I've seen, you're both smarter than that, and as such it's likely that there will be people that will associate what they see on Krod with reality, at least when it comes to paganism.Anyone that dumb would have believed something equally stupid and offensive if the show "Krod Mandoon" had never existed. All that's going to change is that they will have a slightly different set of mindless nonsense in their head. The "Krod Mandoon"-based nonsense will just replace some other piece of nonsense they would have picked up doing whatever they'd be doing instead of watching the show.

[Dark Tira]

Wait, wait, wait, somebody is upset because the term pagan was used to reference people of a made up polytheistic religion in a fantasy world? I'm pretty sure that that is the definition of pagan and not a stereotype. I'd think it's more reasonable to be mad at Krod for being so ethnocentric that he just calls his girlfriend a pagan and doesn't actually know the name of her religion.

[Sneak]

Yeah, that is true. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paganism)

"Paganism" isn't really one defined religion, anyway.

Good point. :smalltongue: :smallbiggrin:

[Ganurath]

I'm pretty sure that that is the definition of pagan and not a stereotype.I'm not sure as to the specific definition, but I can say with no lack of certainity that the definition does not include the term "fantasy world." Unless there's a fourth wall that you're breaking that I haven't noticed?

[averagejoe]

Wait, wait, wait, somebody is upset because the term pagan was used to reference people of a made up polytheistic religion in a fantasy world? I'm pretty sure that that is the definition of pagan and not a stereotype. I'd think it's more reasonable to be mad at Krod for being so ethnocentric that he just calls his girlfriend a pagan and doesn't actually know the name of her religion.

I believe that these days "pagan" has come to be used to describe the followers of the Neopagan movement. It is still, in some contexts, a blanket term to describe any non-Judeo-Christian religion, but another use is to describe any of a wide variety of practices originating from polytheistic or animistic beliefs held by those in pre-Christian Europe.

[The Glyphstone]

I'm watching this as I type (commercial).

Oh...oh god, I don't know what to say. I have a distinct feeling that this will be ending up on the So Bad Its Good page of TVTropes.

[Halna LeGavilk]

I thought this was the single funniest show I've seen in a long time. Simply because the show is using old ideas in a new way.

Take Bruce, for example. He's not funny because he's gay, he's funny because he is 'modern, cliche' gay, in a fantasy world. It takes an unfanny stereotype and turns it around and makes it funny.

It's for the same reason that the promiscuous pagan thing is funny. It's not that she has a lot of sex, it's that she has ridiculous amounts of sex. And I wouldn't classify her as a slut, either. I mean, it really takes a post-modern view of sex, in that she sees sex as 'just another weapon in my arsenal(sp)', and then pokes fun at Krod, who has the roughly more modern, 'I thought you meant the occaisonal threesome and some light bondage' view of promiscuity.

And I think that the show was just a funny show-not intelligent, not stupid, just... funny.

[Tensu]

It was Ok, not sure if it's something I'll jump through hoops to watch, but it's something I'll catch if I'm watching TV and it's on.

As for the portrayal of Paganism, there where a lot of pagan religions. none of them where that bad in terms of promiscuity, but some where close. it's important to keep in mind that paganism is a type of religion and not a specific one.


Me still smoldering over loss of Korgoth of Barbaria while Tim & Eric get three god-forsaken seasons of dry-humping each other.

Agreed.

I think the reason people use the word "epic" too much these days is because after the airing of that show, they no longer associate "awesome" with anything good.

and then there's that new "look around you" show. I thought that I might at least give it a try. I cannot remember ever being less entertained in my life. At least when my 'pendex 'sploded I still felt alive, but that... the numbness. THE HORRIBLE NUMBNESS! It was like my conciseness was slowly ceasing to exist! It was terrible!

you know, nobody seems to like those shows, so how do they manage to reman to the air? how? HOW!?

[Leliel]

Agreed.

I think the reason people use the word "epic" too much these days is because after the airing of that show, they no longer associate "awesome" with anything good.

and then there's that new "look around you" show. I thought that I might at least give it a try. I cannot remember ever being less entertained in my life. At least when my 'pendex 'sploded I still felt alive, but that... the numbness. THE HORRIBLE NUMBNESS! It was like my conciseness was slowly ceasing to exist! It was terrible!

you know, nobody seems to like those shows, so how do they manage to reman to the air? how? HOW!?

Beacuse the executives think we will, in fact, like them.

I don't know if that's a comment on our level on intelligence, or theirs....

[Fawkes]

I liked the old Look Around You. Are they making new episodes or showing the old shorts?

[Tyrant]

you know, nobody seems to like those shows, so how do they manage to reman to the air? how? HOW!?
An illogical rating system? I don't completely understand it (never really looked into it at all) but that seems to be the reason thrown around to explain things like this. Or, the majority of TV viewers actually like things like Tim and Eric. I am really hoping the latter of those two possibilities is not the case. It's the same way with movies. Stupidity sells until enough people realise it's mindnumbingly stupid and they move on to the next stupid thing.

[tyckspoon]

An illogical rating system? I don't completely understand it (never really looked into it at all) but that seems to be the reason thrown around to explain things like this. Or, the majority of TV viewers actually like things like Tim and Eric. I am really hoping the latter of those two possibilities is not the case. It's the same way with movies. Stupidity sells until enough people realise it's mindnumbingly stupid and they move on to the next stupid thing.

I think the usual theory is that they're just dirt-cheap to make. That means they really only need a very small audience to make money for the network.. and a sufficient number of people will watch anything. So they're easy to make and they're pretty much guaranteed to make money... which means, from an executive viewpoint, they're completely golden. Any time there's a gap in CN's lineup they can just go "Hey, TimAndEric, crap out another one of those things you do." and be pretty sure it'll be a modest success instead of taking any sort of risk on something a larger audience may actually like.

[Yulian]

Watched the premier, and I have to say that so far, this is my new favorite show, reminds me waaay too much of my friends and I playing D&D. I actually made a character back in October very similar to Krod (I remember it was October because I bought a sword from a local store and proceeded to smack my friend with it).


That's pretty much the impression I got from it. It felt rather like a group of PCs were onscreen there...well, and the villains, too. I thought Dongalor was nonstop hysterical. He did the sort of things evil PCs do.

I liked the running gag with the crossbow bolts. I liked the punchline-style humour
"So...what we do with his body?"
"Of course."

Or
"Do you know how long I've been here?"
"Two weeks."

It was by no means perfect, but it was definitely funny. I think we could use a little less "stereotypical black-guy" stuff, a little less "Hey! Look, boobs!" stuff, and a bit more of the villains, who really were the funniest bits for me. "Pagan goat pants" has already been added to my vocabulary.

Again, not perfect, but not bad at all.

- Yulian

[Tensu]

the "it's a slightly less cliche way of saying you're the chosen one" I sure found funny.

and the dying pointlessly.:smallbiggrin:

[averagejoe]

An illogical rating system? I don't completely understand it (never really looked into it at all) but that seems to be the reason thrown around to explain things like this. Or, the majority of TV viewers actually like things like Tim and Eric. I am really hoping the latter of those two possibilities is not the case. It's the same way with movies. Stupidity sells until enough people realise it's mindnumbingly stupid and they move on to the next stupid thing.

I believe they become much more entertaining when one is high/hallucinating. Or so I've heard. That's the demographic they're targeting, I think. There's also what tyckspoon mentioned, which is a shame, because cheap minimalist cartoons don't have to be bad.

[Tensu]

while searching wikipedia trying to find out why something so bad became so popular, I learned to my horror that there's a spinoff series planned.

It was a little vague, and as it also mentioned another spin-off series planned that would be online-only, I'm not sure if it will be wasting TV slots or not.

[Fawkes]

"Do you know how long I've been here?"
"Two weeks."
"And it's co-ed!"

[charl]

That was just awesome. I don't think there's much more I can say about than that.

[ClamLeague9000]

This show loses all credibility becuase they don't admit that they stole the flaming sword thing from Yor.

Incidently, I saw like, ten minutes of this last night and didn't even crack a grin a single time. It was like something writen by Jason Friedberg and Aaron Seltzer with fewer zany pop culture references. It'll get cancelled in maybe a month.

[Thrawn183]

I saw it and I can't decide what to think. I like the heroes. I liked the way they had the villain do villainy things (ie. killing the messenger, things like that). I really, really didn't like when the villain decided to play dress up. Get rid of all of that stuff and you have something that's actually pretty darn good when you realize that they are going for something extremely tongue in cheek.

I seriously never want to see any of that guy between his neck and his ankles ever again.

Anyway, it has potential. Guess we'll just have to wait and see what happens.

[The Glyphstone]

And....the season finale.

Is anyone else as horrifically disappointed as I am? Any chance they'll film a second season, or should I sell my stock in the Baator Snowball Import Co.?

[Decoy Lockbox]

And....the season finale.

Is anyone else as horrifically disappointed as I am? Any chance they'll film a second season, or should I sell my stock in the Baator Snowball Import Co.?

One can only hope. I havn't seen the viewer numbers, but most reviews I've read have been fairly favorable.

My own take? Its not perfect, but I like it nonetheless. Its a rather niche show as a fantasy/adventure/comedy, so it has no real competition right now. I've read some interviews with the creator, and he seems like a smart enough chap.

Somehow I have a problem with stupid shows made by stupid people (i.e. every show on MTV and VH1), but not with stupid shows made by smart people(Tim and Eric, Xavier, Krod). I guess art is all in the intent, right?

[kpenguin]

Isn't that a bit of an ad hominem?

[TheSummoner]

Eh... I kinda saw the twist with Grimshank not being evil, but Ralph (spelled "Ralph" pronounced "Rafe") being the traitor coming, but that my own knowledge of the genre didn't make it any less enjoyable.

The only thing that bugged me is that they Eye didn't go off... Maybe I'm insane, but I think a downer ending where the resistance was all but destroyed, but Krod and his group escaped to fight again would've been better...

Though was the "dogs licking themselves" montage really needed?

[Arcane_Secrets]

Eh... I kinda saw the twist with Grimshank not being evil, but Ralph (spelled "Ralph" pronounced "Rafe") being the traitor coming, but that my own knowledge of the genre didn't make it any less enjoyable.

The only thing that bugged me is that they Eye didn't go off... Maybe I'm insane, but I think a downer ending where the resistance was all but destroyed, but Krod and his group escaped to fight again would've been better...

Though was the "dogs licking themselves" montage really needed?

Not really...which was part of the problem I thought Krod had. The things that the writers seemed to think were funny often weren't as funny as the little touches they put in but weren't as obvious. Krod and the rest of them arguing so hard that the caravan they were trying to rob drove by unharmed-that was truly funny.

[Innis Cabal]

and then there's that new "look around you" show. I thought that I might at least give it a try. I cannot remember ever being less entertained in my life. At least when my 'pendex 'sploded I still felt alive, but that... the numbness. THE HORRIBLE NUMBNESS! It was like my conciseness was slowly ceasing to exist! It was terrible!

you know, nobody seems to like those shows, so how do they manage to reman to the air? how? HOW!?

Its british...and hardly new. And they clearly like it. Its better then Tim and Eric...


As for this show, missed most of it sadly but what I saw was great, funny over all, not a Scrubs or anything but it has the ability to be

[Fawkes]

I saw an episode of the new Look Around You... definite They Changed It Now It Sucks (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/TheyChangedItNowItSucks).

[Neo]

Just started watching this after seeing the preview on tv.com.

Seems pretty good so far, but only works if you've played RPGs due to all the injokes.

[JoseB]

Personally I managed to see "Krod Mandoon" yesterday, and I *enjoyed* it. For some reason it struck me as similar (in spirit) to "Red Dwarf", doing for fantasy what RD did for sci-fi. To a certain extent :)

Also, and I have to say it, I couldn't help but compare in my mind the dysfunctional party led by Krod with our beloved dysfunctional party from this very comic... I found some twisted parallels, which (to me) only added to the fun. Of course, I understand that this is mostly because both works drink from the same sources and stereotypes in order to make fun of them, but nonetheless... :)

[xPANCAKEx]

i downloaded 6 episodes... it just felt incredibly laboured and unbelievably dull

i think out of all 6, i got about 2 maybe 3 genuine laughs. Sure, theres stuff thats "funny" - but nothing that will raise more than a smirk

its just dull

[JoseB]

De Gustibus Non Est Disputandum! :)