Battletech Custom 'Mech Designs

[ShneekeyTheLost]

Okay, I happen to enjoy making custom 'mechs. Lately, I've gone on an upgrade kick, taking old school 3025 mechs and upgrading them to Tech Level 2. Because lets face it, a lot of the 'upgrades' that happened in the books... suck. Come on, equipping a solid LRM mech with an Arrow IV Launcher? Epic Phail.

I also try to keep to IS tech, because around here, EVERYONE does Clan Tech. At the last convention I went to, there was a Clan VS IS war, only there were 25 people who signed up for Clan and only 5 who signed up for IS. That tells you how many Clan fanboys there are around here.

So, I like to upgrade the old school mechs, and make them a force to be feared, even against Clan mechs. I heavily use C3, TAG artillery, LRM Indirect Fire, and dirty tactics to win.

In the first place, most of my mechs had jump jets, C3, Tag (if they didn't have a C3 Master), and a Flamer in the nose.

What, wondering why? Simple. Whenever I've got a choice, I go for either Urban or heavily broken terrain maps. This helps neuter the Clan range advantage. I also use a mix of Energy, Ballistic, and Missile weapons. I don't use any SRM Streak systems (although I heavily use SRM systems as close-up damage output). I do happen to use, and enjoy, Inferno SRM rounds, since Clan mechs tend to 'run hot'.

So, standard tactics: If I'm on a flat plain, I use the flamers to start fires to block LoS. This keeps me from getting destroyed outside my own optimum range and neuters the Clan's superior range advantage. If I am on broken/urban ground, this is not necessary typically. Flamers are also superior anti-elemental/infantry weapons.

I use my up close mechs to target for my ranged mechs, who typically stand so far back that they generally don't have LoS on opponent mechs. So how can I use them? Simple. I use Semi-Guided Missiles and TAG. Here's how it works. First, C3 lets me use the range classification from another mech in the C3 network. So I am effectively firing from long range. Then I use TAG to call in indirect fire. That lets me target them. Finally, the semi-guided missiles negate any terrain or cover penalties, except those between my ally mech and the target mech. So the only modifiers I have are my opponent's movement modifiers. So basically, I've got 5-6's to hit with my LRM/20's. And I've got a LOT of Trebuchets and Archers and Bombardiers back there. Archers and Bombadiers are my C3 Master mechs, because they are relatively protected, and have the space.

So these missile mechs all have at least 2 LRM/20's with semi-guided missiles, and tied into the C3 tac net. And I love to concentrate fire. So how do you take out a MadCat? By having six missile mechs concentrate fire at effective close range.

I like to use a modified Hunchback as one of my 'spotters'. It's got max armor, jump jets, C3, TAG, and I replaced the AC/20 with a RAC/5. This gives him superior range, and higher damage potential, at lower weight. I could have gone to the logical UAC/20, but I like having the longer range and variable damage output potential. I also put in a couple of Medium Lasers to round out the damage potential.

Oh, one of the best things I like about my modified Hunchback? It's got an IS Light Engine, not an XL. So even if it looses one side torso, it can still survive. Also, at 50 tons, it is a medium mech, and far more available than resorting exclusively to Heavy and Assault mechs.

So, who else has some custom mech designs they'd like to share?

[Texas Jedi]

I liked running some Battletech missions but I haven't in a while because I couldn't find anybody to play with. All of my friends went to Warhammer and I didn't have the disposable income to buy several armies worth of units.

I had worked out a new bit of technology exclusive for the IS and for the nation of St. Ives specifically. I really liked coming up with scenarios where the St. Ives League managed to beat the superior forces of the Capellan Confederation during their "civil war".

The technology was never truly play tested but I tried to make it fair. It was called the liquid helium heat sink. Basically you had a tank of liquid Hydrogen (is colder than Liquid He) taking up a critical slot in the central torso. You then ran a bunch of cables and tubes like a circulation system throughout the mech. It would pump the LHe through these veins and arteries and cool off the mech much like our blood does to us. Each LHe heat sink would negate 3 points of heat. It would also allow a greater amount of LHe heat sinks around the engine so you wouldn't take up as many critical slots as normal heat sinks. It would also allow the engine to run more effectively so it make an IS XL engine 3 hits instead of 2 to go critical.

Those were some hefty positives so I made it have some huge negatives. First is the cost, it costs triple the amount of normal double heat sinks to install. The cost of maintenance is much smaller so it costs as much as a normal heat sink to replace. Second, if the center torso tank gets hit in a critical breach it has big chance to blow up the mech. The liquid hydrogen tank is under extreme pressure and is very dangerous if damaged. Third, if there is a critical hit to a LHe heat sink it does damage to the mech's internal structure because it is leaking an extremely cold liquid until the leak is sealed (next turn).

I created a few mechs using this system. My favorite was the Black Knight IIC. I created it specifically to a character I created, but that is a story for another time. I favored energy weapons PPC's and pulse lasers because of the ease of which they hit. The mech also had an sword that did damage as an axe.

[Erloas]

Well I'll start out by saying I've only been playing Battletech about 3 years, and only about 1 of those was with a group that played often. Since I've moved I haven't found any new players, though I have got a few people to try it now and again. And on occasion some of the my previous group runs a play-by-email game (one of the guys designed an interface for hosting the map and entering in movement and firing commands). They were never highly competitive games, mostly just for fun.

The first thing I noticed when I started was how inefficient many of the designs were and it bothered me. They tended to play with "book 'Mechs" most of the time, just to keep people on even ground. So they could supply people with 'Mechs and they would still have a chance against other players. There were a few games when they allowed custom 'Mechs, and really what I found is that they took a lot of the fun out of the game.

The book 'Mechs have character, they have good points and they have bad, and how you deal with those bad points is as much a part of the game as anything. The custom 'Mechs just took a lot of that away and so many weapons basically became useless. All the pulse lasers, targeting computers, and really good gunnery pilots basically made any light 'Mech useless because even with speed they would take too many shots. So much of the game basically just became people taking the strongest longest range weapons they could get and sniping.

While there is a whole different side to the game by making custom 'Mechs and using all of the high tech level items, to me many of those changes took some of the character out of the game.

Any more when I play we pick fairly random squads. Pick a point value, pay a little bit of attention to how they are set up, and try to get a range of weight classes. I think playing that way puts a lot more focus on the players ability to access what they have and what they can do with it and make the most of it in any given situation, and it takes the focus off building 'Mechs and lists with the intention of winning at all costs.

[ShneekeyTheLost]

[QUOTE=Texas Jedi;5968270
The technology was never truly play tested but I tried to make it fair. It was called the liquid helium heat sink. Basically you had a tank of liquid Hydrogen (is colder than Liquid He) taking up a critical slot in the central torso. You then ran a bunch of cables and tubes like a circulation system throughout the mech. It would pump the LHe through these veins and arteries and cool off the mech much like our blood does to us. Each LHe heat sink would negate 3 points of heat. It would also allow a greater amount of LHe heat sinks around the engine so you wouldn't take up as many critical slots as normal heat sinks. It would also allow the engine to run more effectively so it make an IS XL engine 3 hits instead of 2 to go critical.

Those were some hefty positives so I made it have some huge negatives. First is the cost, it costs triple the amount of normal double heat sinks to install. The cost of maintenance is much smaller so it costs as much as a normal heat sink to replace. Second, if the center torso tank gets hit in a critical breach it has big chance to blow up the mech. The liquid hydrogen tank is under extreme pressure and is very dangerous if damaged. Third, if there is a critical hit to a LHe heat sink it does damage to the mech's internal structure because it is leaking an extremely cold liquid until the leak is sealed (next turn).

I created a few mechs using this system. My favorite was the Black Knight IIC. I created it specifically to a character I created, but that is a story for another time. I favored energy weapons PPC's and pulse lasers because of the ease of which they hit. The mech also had an sword that did damage as an axe.[/QUOTE]

Those aren't very serious negatives. If you are in critical slots in the center torso, you've got bigger problems, like engine or gyro hits. Or, god forbid, you have a machine Gun and AMMO in your center torso...

There are 'triple heat sinks', but they are Tech Level 3, which I don't bother with.

Swords are slightly different than axes. They do less damage (1.5x of a punch, rather than 2x of an axe) but have a -1 on to hit.

@Erloas

I have taken to 'upgrading' old-school mechs, but I like to keep the same flavor.

For example, the Banshee, which was one of the worst mech designs evar. It was a 95 ton mech... with a PPC and an AC/5. It was a 4/6/0, which was fast for a 95 ton mech (as fast as possible, in fact), and had okay armor. However, most mechs smaller than it could keep out of range and pepper it.

So when I 'upgraded' it with TL 2 gear, I slapped in an XL engine (which has the serious disadvantage of blowing up the mech if it looses either of its side torso locations), slapped in some Jump Jets (to go along with the flavor of 'uber fast and maneuverable for an assault mech'), a C3 Computer (which just makes sense), and upgraded the AC/5 to a RAC/5 (Rotary Autocannon has an option to fire 1,2,4, or 6 rounds. If it does so, it rolls on the appropriate SRM chart to determine how many hits land, then rolls for hit location per shot, and will jam on a 2,3, or 4 respectively). I also slapped in a Targeting Computer. Unlike the completely broken Clan version, the only thing it does is gives you a -1 on your attack rolls, and lets all of the RAC's shots that hit end up in the same hit location (you can't take a +4 for called shots).

In the end, it's a lot more survivable. It has more armor, the RAC/5 is a vast improvement, and has 3 tons of ammo to support it (since it still eats one shot of ammo per shot, even if you are firing 6 shots in a round). It still has the PPC for energy weapon support. It is more maneuverable in broken or urban settings. But it is still the same thing.

I think your problem is with people who replace the AC/20 on a Hunchback with a Gauss Rifle. All the sudden you have a LOT deadlier mech, because its range just more than doubled, takes WAY less heat per shot, doesn't have exploding ammo, and only looses 5 damage on a shot.

Also, people who run with a lot of weapons typically don't run with a lot of heat sinks, and forget that they have to make Ammo Explosion and Shut Down checks, and automatically shuts down at 30+ heat. Particularly not when I'm running with SRM Infernos :smallamused:

[Erloas]

I'm familiar with all of the tech level 2 gear.
As for the custome 'Mechs it really depends on how the people make them. Its the fact that some people stack their designs to mitigate parts of the game. Someone that takes a 'Mech and adds a bunch of Pulse Lasers, then a targetting computer, then gets some unbalanced 1/6 pilot and is able to hit even the fastest 'Mechs almost all the time.

I've thought about some custom 'Mechs, but unfortunately as it is now I don't play enough to spend the time to make a bunch of them. I really haven't tried out the C3 networks because the last group I was in didn't use them because they didn't think they weren't really balanced (it was just before and just after the new books started coming out). Then, as now, there were also a fair number of new players and some of those things complicated the game too much for someone just learning the game and it doesn't seem fair for one person to have it and others not. So really I haven't had much experience with it myself.

Before I build any 'Mechs I've got to find some more regular players. And I need to get another copy of Heavy Metal Pro. I didn't get my copy working after I tried to move it off my old computer and I've been waiting patiently for them to finish the new version for a few years now before I buy another copy.

[RandomLunatic]

Oh, I love this! Possibly more than playing the actual game itself.

Please note that all commentary is only current through BMR(R). Of the new release books, I only have TW, and I have yet to actually play a game using that ruleset.

Lacking much in the way of imagination, most of mine are modifications of stock 'Mechs to correct their numerous design flaws.

For instance, here is my take on the 3050 Catapult:
CPLT-C3 Catapult

Chassis: Endo Steel
Power Plant: 260 Fusion
Cruising Speed: 43
Maximum Speed: 64.5
Jump Jets: Four
Jump Capacity: 120 meters
Armor: Ferro-Fibrous with CASE
Armament:
2x LRM 15
4x Medium Laser
Manufacturer: Unknown
Primary Factory: Unknown
Communications System: Unknown
Targeting and Tracking System: Unknown with C3 and Artemis IV


CPLT-C3 Catapult

Technology Base: - Inner Sphere - Level 2
Equipment Mass
Internal Structure: - EndoSteel 3.5
Engine: 260 13.5
Walking MP: 4
Running MP: 6
Jumping MP: 4
Heat Sinks: 10(20) - Double 0
Gyro: 3
Cockpit: 3
Armor Factor: 211 - Ferro-Fibrous 12

Internal Armor
Structure Value
Head 3 9
Center Torso 21 32
Center Torso(rear) 10
R/L Torso 15 23
R/L Torso(rear) 7
R/L Arm 10 20
R/L Leg 15 30

Weapons and Ammo Location Critical Tonnage
LRM 15 LA 3 7
Artemis IV LA 1 1
LRM 15 Ammo - Artemis IV LT 2 2
Medium Laser LT 1 1
Medium Laser LT 1 1
CASE LT 1 0.5
Jump Jet LT 1 1
LRM 15 Ammo - Artemis IV RT 2 2
Medium Laser RT 1 1
Medium Laser RT 1 1
CASE RT 1 0.5
Jump Jet RT 1 1
LRM 15 RA 3 7
Artemis IV RA 1 1
Jump Jet CT 2 1
C3 Slave H 1 1

Occasionally I come up with something original-ish. This one was originally made to teach bracket fire, but proved to be extremely deadly for general use, due to an absurdly-low BV (1598, for which it is near unbeatable for designs not deliberately designed to break the BV system. BV2 will probably rate it something closer to its actual value.)


AGN-1A Agonizer

Chassis: Endo Steel
Power Plant: 380 XL
Cruising Speed: 43
Maximum Speed: 64.5
Jump Jets: none
Jump Capacity: none
Armor: Stnadard with CASE
Armament:
2x ER PPC
6x ER Medium Laser
1x LB 20-X AC
1x ER Small Laser
Manufacturer: Unknown
Primary Factory: Unknown
Communications System: Unknown
Targeting and Tracking System: Unknown


AGN-1A Agonizer

Technology Base: - Inner Sphere - Level 2
Equipment Mass
Internal Structure: - EndoSteel 5
Engine: 380 XL 20.5
Walking MP: 4
Running MP: 6
Jumping MP: 0
Heat Sinks: 16(32) - Double 6
Gyro: 4
Cockpit: 3
Armor Factor: 293 18.5

Internal Armor
Structure Value
Head 3 9
Center Torso 30 50
Center Torso(rear) 10
R/L Torso 20 30
R/L Torso(rear) 10
R/L Arm 16 32
R/L Leg 20 40

Weapons and Ammo Location Critical Tonnage
ER Medium Laser LA 1 1
ER Medium Laser LA 1 1
ER PPC LA 3 7
ER Medium Laser LT 1 1
ER Medium Laser LT 1 1
LB 20-X AC Ammo - Cluster LT 1 1
LB 20-X AC Ammo - Slug LT 2 2
CASE LT 1 0.5
LB 20-X AC RT/CT 0/0 14
ER Medium Laser RA 1 1
ER Medium Laser RA 1 1
ER PPC RA 3 7
ER Small Laser H 1 0.5


It is a Berserker that works!

BRZ-A5 Berserker

Chassis: Endo Steel
Power Plant: 400 XL
Cruising Speed: 43 (54.0 with TSM)
Maximum Speed: 64.5 (86.4)
Jump Jets: none
Jump Capacity: none
Armor: Stnadard
Armament:
1x ER PPC
2x Large Pulse Laser
5x Medium Pulse Laser
3x Medium Laser
Manufacturer: Unknown
Primary Factory: Unknown
Communications System: Unknown
Targeting and Tracking System: Unknown


BRZ-A5 Berserker

Technology Base: - Inner Sphere - Level 2
Equipment Mass
Internal Structure: - EndoSteel 5
Engine: 400 XL 26.5
Walking MP: 4
Running MP: 6
Jumping MP: 0
Heat Sinks: 18(36) - Double 8
Gyro: 4
Cockpit: 3
Armor Factor: 307 19.5

Internal Armor
Structure Value
Head 3 9
Center Torso 31 52
Center Torso(rear) 10
R/L Torso 21 32
R/L Torso(rear) 10
R/L Arm 17 34
R/L Leg 21 42

Weapons and Ammo Location Critical Tonnage
Medium Laser LA 1 1
TSM LA 1 0
Large Pulse Laser LT 2 7
Medium Laser LT 1 1
Medium Pulse Laser LT 1 2
TSM LT 1 0
TSM LL 1 0
TSM RL 1 0
Large Pulse Laser RT 2 7
Medium Laser RT 1 1
Medium Pulse Laser RT 1 2
TSM RT 1 0
ER PPC RA 3 7
TSM RA 1 0
Medium Pulse Laser CT 1 2
Medium Pulse Laser CT 1 2
Medium Pulse Laser H 1 2



The Clans get plenty of love from me too. This is what I feel the Shadow Cat should have been.

Shadow Cat (Prime)

Chassis: Endo Steel
Power Plant: 300 XL
Cruising Speed: 64.5
Maximum Speed: 96.75 (
Jump Jets: None fixed, Six in most configurations
Jump Capacity: 180 meters
Armor: Ferro-Fibrous
Armament:
21 Tons of Pod Space Available
Manufacturer: Unknown
Primary Factory: Unknown
Communications System: Unknown
Targeting and Tracking System: Unknown


Shadow Cat

Technology Base: - Clan - Level 2 (Omni-Mech)
Equipment Mass
Internal Structure: - EndoSteel 2.5
Engine: 300 XL 9.5
Walking MP: 6[12]
Running MP: 9
Jumping MP: 6
Heat Sinks: 16(32) - Double 6
Gyro: 3
Cockpit: 3
Armor Factor: 169 - Ferro-Fibrous 9

Internal Armor
Structure Value
Head 3 9
Center Torso 16 25
Center Torso(rear) 7
R/L Torso 12 18
R/L Torso(rear) 6
R/L Arm 8 16
R/L Leg 12 24

Prime
Weapons and Ammo Location Critical Tonnage
[Pod] ER Medium Laser LA 1 1
[Pod] Active Probe LT 1 1
[Pod]Jump Jets LT 2 1.0
[Pod]Targeting Computer LT 2 2
MASC RL 2 2
[Pod] ER Medium Laser RT 1 1
[Pod]Jump Jets RT 2 1
[Pod] ER PPC RA 2 6
[Pod]Jump Jets CT 2 1.0
[Pod] ER Medium Laser H 1 1

Alternate A
Weapons and Ammo Location Critical Tonnage
[Pod] ER Medium Laser LA 1 1
[Pod] Jump Jets LT 2 0.5
MASC RL 2 2
[Pod] Ultra AC/20 Ammo RT 2 2
[Pod] Jump Jets RT 2 0.5
[Pod] Ultra AC/20 RA 8 12
[Pod] Jump Jets CT 2 0.5
[Pod] ER Medium Laser H 1 1

Alternate B
Weapons and Ammo Location Critical Tonnage
[Pod] LRM 20 LA 4 5
[Pod] LRM 20 Ammo LA 1 1
[Pod] ER Medium Laser LT 1 1
[Pod] LRM 20 Ammo LT 1 1
[Pod] Jump Jets LT 2 0.5
MASC RL 2 2
[Pod] ER Medium Laser RT 1 1
[Pod] Jump Jets RT 2 0.5
[Pod] LRM 20 RA 4 5
[Pod] LRM 20 Ammo RA 2 2
[Pod] Jump Jets CT 2 0.5
[Pod] ECM Suite H 1 1

Alternate C
Weapons and Ammo Location Critical Tonnage
[Pod] Medium Pulse Laser LA 1 2
[Pod] ECM Suite LT 1 1
[Pod] Medium Pulse Laser LT 1 2
[Pod] Jump Jets LT 2 0.5
MASC RL 2 2
[Pod] Active Probe RT 1 1
[Pod] Light Machine Gun RT 1 0.25
[Pod] Light Machine Gun RT 1 0.25
[Pod] Machine Gun Ammo (1/2 ton) RT 1 0.5
[Pod] Medium Pulse Laser RT 1 2
[Pod] Jump Jets RT 2 0.5
[Pod] Large Pulse Laser RA 2 6
[Pod] Jump Jets CT 2 0.5
[Pod] TAG H 1 1

There are the 'Mechs I make to be broken.

Sagittaire IIC

Chassis: Endo Steel
Power Plant: 340 XL
Cruising Speed: 43
Maximum Speed: 64.5
Jump Jets: Four
Jump Capacity: 120 meters
Armor: Ferro-Fibrous
Armament:
3x Large Pulse Laser
5x Medium Pulse Laser
Manufacturer: Unknown
Primary Factory: Unknown
Communications System: Unknown with Guardian ECM Suite
Targeting and Tracking System: Unknown with Special Targeting Computer


Sagittaire IIC

Technology Base: - Clan - Level 2
Equipment Mass
Internal Structure: - EndoSteel 4.5
Engine: 340 XL 13.5
Walking MP: 4
Running MP: 6
Jumping MP: 4
Heat Sinks: 17(34) - Double 7
Gyro: 4
Cockpit: 3
Armor Factor: 263 - Ferro-Fibrous 14

Internal Armor
Structure Value
Head 3 9
Center Torso 27 44
Center Torso(rear) 10
R/L Torso 18 28
R/L Torso(rear) 8
R/L Arm 14 28
R/L Leg 18 36

Weapons and Ammo Location Critical Tonnage
Large Pulse Laser LA 2 6
Medium Pulse Laser LA 1 2
ECM Suite LT 1 1
Large Pulse Laser LT 2 6
Medium Pulse Laser LT 1 2
Jump Jet LT 1 1
Medium Pulse Laser RT 1 2
Jump Jet RT 1 1
Targeting Computer RT 6 6
Large Pulse Laser RA 2 6
Medium Pulse Laser RA 1 2
Jump Jet CT 2 1
Medium Pulse Laser H 1 2


There are the 'Mechs I make for teh lulz.

UM-R666 UrbanMech from Hell

Chassis: Endo Steel
Power Plant: 300 Fusion
Cruising Speed: 32.25
Maximum Speed: 53.75
Jump Jets: Three
Jump Capacity: 90 meters
Armor: Unknown with CASE
Armament:
1x Ultra AC/20
1x LB 20-X AC
2x Medium Pulse Laser
1x Flamer
Manufacturer: Unknown
Primary Factory: Unknown
Communications System: Unknown with Guardian ECM Suite
Targeting and Tracking System: Unknown

Overview:
Well, now you did it-one 'Walking Trashcan' joke too many, and
the poor little guy just snapped. Now he is bigger, meaner, and out
for revenge.


UM-R666 UrbanMech from Hell

Technology Base: - Inner Sphere - Level 2
Equipment Mass
Internal Structure: - EndoSteel 5
Engine: 300 19
Walking MP: 3
Running MP: 5
Jumping MP: 3
Heat Sinks: 12(24) - Double 2
Gyro: 3
Cockpit: 3
Armor Factor: 307 19.5

Internal Armor
Structure Value
Head 3 9
Center Torso 31 47
Center Torso(rear) 15
R/L Torso 21 32
R/L Torso(rear) 10
R/L Arm 17 34
R/L Leg 21 42

Weapons and Ammo Location Critical Tonnage
LB 20-X AC LA/LT 0/0 14
LB 20-X AC Ammo - Cluster LT 1 1
LB 20-X AC Ammo - Slug LT 2 2
Medium Pulse Laser LT 1 2
CASE LT 1 0.5
Jump Jet LT 1 2
Guardian ECM Suite RT 2 1.5
Ultra AC/20 Ammo RT 3 3
CASE RT 1 0.5
Jump Jet RT 1 2
Ultra AC/20 RA 10 15
Flamer CT 1 1
Jump Jet CT 1 2
Medium Pulse Laser H 1 2


And there are the ones I make because I got really bored. (As an aside, I believe that the Tech Manual has brought this one down from Level 3 to Tournament Legal, although why you would even think of playing this one seriously is beyond me. You might have to take the Long-Range Targeting system off, though.)

Guassasaurus Rex

Chassis: Endo Steel
Power Plant: Compact 100
Cruising Speed: Awfully Slow
Maximum Speed: Slightly Less Awfully Slow
Jump Jets: none
Jump Capacity: Only off of cliffs, buildings, bridges, etc.
Armor: Paper-Thin with CASE
Armament:
7x Gauss Rifle
Manufacturer: Unknown
Primary Factory: Unknown
Communications System: Unknown
Targeting and Tracking System: Unknown with Long-Range Targeting

Overview:
I made this to disprove the clown who said "You cannot have too
much of a good thing." Also to see how many Guass Rifles I could
shoehorn into a single 'Mech.


Guassasaurus Rex

Technology Base: - Clan - Level 3
Equipment Mass
Internal Structure: - EndoSteel 5
Engine: 100 Compact 4.5
Walking MP: 1
Running MP: 2
Jumping MP: 0
Heat Sinks: 10 0
Gyro: - Compact 1.5
Cockpit: - Small 2
Armor Factor: 16 1

Internal Armor
Structure Value
Head 3 1
Center Torso 31 3
Center Torso(rear) 0
R/L Torso 21 2
R/L Torso(rear) 0
R/L Arm 17 2
R/L Leg 21 2

Weapons and Ammo Location Critical Tonnage
Gauss Rifle LA 6 12
Gauss Rifle LT 6 12
Gauss Rifle LT 6 12
Gauss Rifle RT 6 12
Gauss Rifle RT 6 12
Gauss Rifle RA 6 12
Gauss Rifle CT 6 12
Gauss Rifle Ammo H 2 2

@Erloas: You can try downloading a free design program off the web. All these designs are made by The Drawing Board, which I believe has everything in the BMR(R), and was used to create the readouts above. I prefer another program called the BattleMech Designer, which has a slightly nicer-looking interface, prints nicer-looking sheets (IMO), and you need to do less work on the TROs it makes. However, it has a narrower selection of stuff than TDB.

[Hawriel]

Loved playing battletech. I think i only used stock mechs once. The first time i played. After that I tinkered with them at least a little. I used to build my mechs from the ground up then use a mini of the same weight class. I then moved back to moding existing mechs. Staying close to the origional idea, yet making them my own creations.

35 and 55 are my favorite weight class. They are so versetile in what you can do with them. 35 can be fast and still pack a punch. 55s can hold their own with any thing up to the assalt class mechs. The best games my friends and I had where using 200 ton lances. You can build just about any kind of lance with that weight limit.

I had two standard lances. the first had three 55s and a 35 ton mech, a Griffin, Wolverine, Shadowhawk and Jenner. The second used a 100 tonner, two 40s and a 20. A Longbow, Hermes II, Clint and a stinger. Both used C3 systems. The latter lance had the master in the stinger, it moved 10/15 with masc. Good times.

Sence your asking for designs here is my Griffin. I swapped out some of the one ton items deppending on what I needed.

Griffin 55 ton mech.
Move 5/8
Armor FF 11 tons
Internal structer endosteel
Weapons
ER large laser RA
LRM 20 RT
2.5* tons ammo LT one ton of thunder munitions may be used.
Med laser CT*
Med laser H

Equipment
Artimis IV system RT
C3s*
double heat sink LT
Case* LT
*these items are swapped deppending on what I needed for the game.


This mech was rarely killed. It could take down mechs above its weight class. True some of it was to bad rolls on the other guys part. Good rolls on mine, but this proved its self in many games.

I almost never used an XL engine. Made the mech to vulnerable. Unless I abselutly had to. My longbow had one. It was the only way to pack in 4 LRM 20s. Same with the Stinger C3 master.

Edit
Oh I forgot. The Griffin didnt have 11 tons of armor. It was FF but the point value was equel to 11 tons of standard armor. I think it works out to 8 or 8.5 tons of FF armor.

[ShneekeyTheLost]

Your mechs seem to be awful hot, RandomLunatic. You probably wouldn't want to play with my boys. I tend to load up with Inferno rounds. However, I can't seem to get TDB to export to a .txt file to post up my builds, so I'll just do it old skool.

My version of the Catapult:


Chassis: Normal
Power Plant: 260 Fusion XL
Jump Jets: 4
Armor: Normal
Armament:
2x LRM 20
2x Medium Laser
1x Flamer
Targeting and Tracking system: C3 and Semi-guided missile system

Technology Base: - Inner Sphere - Level 2
Equipment Mass
Internal Structure: - EndoSteel 3
Engine: 260 XL 5
Walking MP: 4
Running MP: 6
Jumping MP: 4
Heat Sinks: 10(20) - Double 0
Gyro: 3
Cockpit: 3
Armor Factor: 152 - Normal 9.5

Internal Armor
Structure Value
Head 3 9
Center Torso 21 22
Center Torso(rear) 7
R/L Torso 15 16
R/L Torso(rear) 4
R/L Arm 10 16
R/L Leg 15 21

Weapons and Ammo Location Critical Tonnage
LRM 20 LA 5 10
LRM 20 Ammo - Semiguided LA 2 2
Medium Laser LT 1 1
Medium Laser RT 1 1
Jump Jet LL 2 2
LRM 20 Ammo - Semiguided RA 2 2
Jump Jet RL 2 2
LRM 20 RA 3 7
C3 Slave CT 1 1
Flamer H 1 1

As you can see, mine has less armor, but has LRM/20 rather than your version's 15's. Also, how are you shoehorning in 28 crits for both EndoSteel AND FerroFibrous into your mech?

[Triaxx]

I haven't done this in a long time. In fact the last one I remember was the Mechwarrior 2 computer game.

Of course, my preferred Tabletop designs featured one forward scout, two bruisers and then a lot of missile boats.

Five hundred tons gives up a lot of room for missile boats. Especially when you're using the lightest mechs available. I've used sufficient Firefly's in one battle that the joke was they didn't need cannons, but fly swatters.

That's two fifty-five ton mechs, one thirty-five ton scout, and ten missile boats for those counting.

I'll have to see if I can dig up the sheets for them.

[RandomLunatic]

Your mechs seem to be awful hot, RandomLunatic. You probably wouldn't want to play with my boys. I tend to load up with Inferno rounds.

No, not really, as long as you can resist the allure of the Alpha Strike button-the Agonizer, for one, was explicitly designed to break newbies of the habit. And I can deal with Infernos-it generally just costs you a medium laser or two. DHS really takes most of the bite out of them.


However, I can't seem to get TDB to export to a .txt file to post up my builds, so I'll just do it old skool.

I had this problem too. It turns out what you have to do is tab over to the History/Configuration page, where you see three buttons on the right-hand side: Import, Export, and Print. Click "Export", and it will prompt you where you want to save the .txt file.


My version of the Catapult:


Chassis: Normal
Power Plant: 260 Fusion XL
Jump Jets: 4
Armor: Normal
Armament:
2x LRM 20
2x Medium Laser
1x Flamer
Targeting and Tracking system: C3 and Semi-guided missile system

Technology Base: - Inner Sphere - Level 2
Equipment Mass
Internal Structure: - EndoSteel 3
Engine: 260 XL 5
Walking MP: 4
Running MP: 6
Jumping MP: 4
Heat Sinks: 10(20) - Double 0
Gyro: 3
Cockpit: 3
Armor Factor: 152 - Normal 9.5

Internal Armor
Structure Value
Head 3 9
Center Torso 21 22
Center Torso(rear) 7
R/L Torso 15 16
R/L Torso(rear) 4
R/L Arm 10 16
R/L Leg 15 21

Weapons and Ammo Location Critical Tonnage
LRM 20 LA 5 10
LRM 20 Ammo - Semiguided LA 2 2
Medium Laser LT 1 1
Medium Laser RT 1 1
Jump Jet LL 2 2
LRM 20 Ammo - Semiguided RA 2 2
Jump Jet RL 2 2
LRM 20 RA 3 7
C3 Slave CT 1 1
Flamer H 1 1
You weaken the CPLT-C1's already borderline armor and put in an XL? Yowch. And what is the flamer for? Except for arson, it sucks, and cutting off your LOS with smoke is the last thing you want from a fire-support 'Mech. And I always found suffcient application of Medium Lasers would yield the fires I needed anyway.


As you can see, mine has less armor, but has LRM/20 rather than your version's 15's.
The Artemis IV FCSs, combined with the relative abscence of ECM in 3050, makes the average missile throw-weight identical. Mine is also capable of looking after itself in close combat, and yours is singularly unqualified to do anything but get murdered.


Also, how are you shoehorning in 28 crits for both EndoSteel AND FerroFibrous into your mech?

With my +5 shoehorn of shoehorning.:smalltongue:

In all seriousness, barely. the CPLT-C3 comes out at exactly 0 crits letfover, only after taking out both hands and LAAs (good thing the Cat already calls for this, eh?). The Agonizer, Berserker, and Guassasaurus Rex all likewise have absolutely 0 free space leftover. I am not certain on the Sagittaire, but if it was not 0, then it came close.

[ShneekeyTheLost]

Ahh, there is where we differ in technique.

You see, you are building the Catapult to be a stand-alone mech, who is superior in his own right.

I am building the Catapult to be a part of a larger group. With Semi-Guided Missiles, CE, and TAG on the part of the closer mech, I can get far superior hits than yours, even counting the Artemis IV FCS. How? Simple.

Mech 1 closes with opponent to around 7 or less hexes. He uses TAG on the target.

Catapult, using semi-guided missiles, doesn't need to have LOS, since his buddy is TAGging for him, fires as though it were close range, ignores all terrain modifiers between the Catapult and the Target (although does count any terrain modifiers between Mech 1 and Target).

So, even without any kind of a pilot, I've got 4's + his movement modifier to hit my target. At 20 hexes. When he has enough obstables to block LOS so he can't even be shot AT in return.

Let me give you an idea as to the kinds of mechs he runs with:
Javelin II, Codename: Bush Goblin - 35 ton

BGB-01 Bush Goblin

Chassis: Duralyte 314 Endo Steel
Power Plant: GM 210
Cruising Speed: 64.5
Maximum Speed: 96.75
Jump Jets: Rawlings 95
Jump Capacity: 180 meters
Armor: StarGuard I with CASE
Armament:
1 SRM 6
1 Flamer
2 ER Medium Lasers
Manufacturer: Unknown
Primary Factory: Unknown
Communications System: GRPNTR Groundpainter 5
Targeting and Tracking System: GuideRite with Laser Coordination Link with TAG, C3



Overview:
The BGB-01 Bush Goblin is a custom unit seen only in use by an
obscure but surprisingly powerful mercenary company which specializes
in counter-Clan tactics. As any light mech, it is a workhorse,
designed for multiple sorties, but it excels at recon-in-force and
rear-end raiding. It was definitely build with a Javelin in mind, and
seems to use many of the same parts as a Javelin.

Capabilities:
The Bush Goblin is on the heavy side of the Light Mech
classification, although it's as nimble as most of that designation,
owing to it's GM210 fusion engine, and the Rawlings 96 jump jets that
lets it clear 180 meters in a single bound. It is certainly capable
of evading any heavier mechs which attempt to engage and keeping up
with other light mechs.
With a pair of Diverse Optic ER Medium
Lasers and the compact but powerful Arrowlight SRM system, this light
mech is quite capable of taking on most other light mechs in a fight,
even some Clan light mechs, and walking away.

The flamer in the
'nose' of the mech is an interesting system. Originally designed as
an additional method of venting heat from the cockpit to keep the
pilot cool, it was discovered that damage to the system would cause
overheating in the cockpit rapidly, so this was scrapped in favor of
a more conventional flamer. It is often used to create smoky fires to
cover an escape if superior ranged mechs kept them in range longer
than was safe.

It is a surprisingly survivable mech, being able to
take a PPC hit to any front location without damaging the EndoSteel
internal structure. Another hidden survivability point is the lack of
using any XL or even Light Engine technology. While it was suggested
to free up some weight, it was eventually scrapped in favor of
surviving to get back home. CASE on the SRM ammo also greatly
improves the survivability of this mech.

In larger scale combat, it
is often used as a 'screening' or 'flanking' mech, skirting the edges
of the fray, trying to use either it's TAG equipment or C3 slave to
call in fire from heavier mechs.

It also is widely used as a
'spotter' mech with their extremely mobile Arrow IV platforms built
on hovercraft which has also seen deployment by the mercenary
company, often times sneaking in close to fortifications and painting
targets for artillary fire to eliminate, then fading into the
darkness.

Deployment:
Deployed exclusively by the strange mercenary company which
invented them, they have been seen at many of the 'hot spots' they
have been hired at. It is clearly one of their primary light mechs,
and used in a number of roles from recon-in-force to defensive
patrols to rear-end raiding. The best guess is that there are at
least twenty of them currently in use, although that number is far
from hard.

Battle History:
The Bush Goblin has been seen employed primarly against the Clan,
although one infamous battle in which House Kurita refused to pay the
mercenary captain for services rendered and found themselves raided
by the mercenaries they reneged on. Bush Goblins were in the vanguard
of the raid, being supported by mechs which bore a strong resemblance
to the Catapult, calling in support fire from the LRM's with their
TAG. The light mechs managed to evade destruction largely due to
their greater maneuverability and ability to manipulate the
battlefield by creating strategically placed fires with their
flamer.
In another engagement against a major Clan offensive, a pair of
Bush Goblins were sent in as 'scouts', only to light up the
opponent's two Madcat Mk II's with their TAG and call in heavy
concentrated artillery fire and indirect LRM fire to obliterate both
of the extremely deadly assault mechs before combat had truly
ensued. Both Bush Goblins were utterly destroyed shortly thereafter,
of course, but the pilots both survived, and received commendations
and their choice of mech to pilot. Surprising some, they chose to
pilot another Bush Goblin, saying it was the best ride they'd ever
had.

Known Variants:
One variant, the Bush Goblin Sneak (BGB-R1) trades the C3 slave
and an ER Medium Laser for a Guardian ECM system and an ER light
laser. It also sports Stealth Armor, making the mech extremely
difficult to lock up in combat. Since ECM doesn't affect calling in
artillery fire with TAG, this particular variant is most often seen
in tandem with either missile launchers, or mechs loaded with
Semiguided LRM rounds, calling in fire and fading away into the
darkness.



BGB-01 Bush Goblin

Technology Base: - Inner Sphere - Level 2
Equipment Mass
Internal Structure: - EndoSteel 2
Engine: 210 9
Walking MP: 6
Running MP: 9
Jumping MP: 6
Heat Sinks: 10(20) - Double 0
Gyro: 3
Cockpit: 3
Armor Factor: 88 5.5

Internal Armor
Structure Value
Head 3 9
Center Torso 11 12
Center Torso(rear) 5
R/L Torso 8 10
R/L Torso(rear) 1
R/L Arm 6 10
R/L Leg 8 10

Weapons and Ammo Location Critical Tonnage
ER Medium Laser LA 1 1
SRM 6 LT 2 3
SRM 6 Ammo LT 1 1
CASE LT 1 0.5
Jump Jet LT 1 0.5
Jump Jet LL 2 0.5
Jump Jet RL 2 0.5
Jump Jet RT 1 0.5
ER Medium Laser RA 1 1
C3 Slave CT 1 1
TAG CT 1 1
Flamer H 1 1
Or this mech...
BRT-01 Brute - 50 ton

BRT-01 Brute

Chassis: Unknown
Power Plant: Unknown 300 Light
Cruising Speed: 64.5
Maximum Speed: 96.75
Jump Jets: Unknown
Jump Capacity: 180 meters
Armor: Unknown
Armament:
1 Flamer
1 SRM 6
2 ER Medium Lasers
Manufacturer: Unknown
Primary Factory: Unknown
Communications System: Unknown with Guardian ECM Suite
Targeting and Tracking System: Unknown with TAG, C3

Overview:
This was an interesting mech which recently started seeing
service with the mercenary group. It is very fast for a Medium mech,
able to jump large distances. But it is clear that while its armament
is a bit sub-par for a medium mech, it is designed primarily as a
'spotter'.

Capabilities:
The SRM/6 and two Medium Lasers are respectable enough, able to
take apart most Light mechs, anyways. However this mech comes into
its own when combined with some of the refitted Catapult units. SOP
is to have two catapults (or a Catapult and a Heavy with a C3 Master)
and two of these Brutes. The brutes close while the Catapults hang
back and block LoS. Then the Brutes call in Indirect LRM Fire, and
rip the mechs to pieces.
The decision to make it a Light rather than an XL engine is
doubtless to increase its survivability, enabling it to leave the
field even after one side torso is taken off completely. Of course,
since the TAG and C3 is in the center torso, it can still call in
missile barrages even if a side torso is completely gone, enabling it
to finish off an opponent then leave victorious without exposing its
weak back armor.
The MASC system is designed for short bursts to close with opponent
mechs so it can paint them with TAG and call in indirect fire quickly. Pilots
who abuse this extra speed quickly find themselves a sitting duck as the
leg actuators lock up



BRT-01 Brute

Technology Base: - Inner Sphere - Level 2
Equipment Mass
Internal Structure: - EndoSteel 2.5
Engine: 300 Light 14.5
Walking MP: 6[12]
Running MP: 9
Jumping MP: 6
Heat Sinks: 11(22) - Double 1
Gyro: 3
Cockpit: 3
Armor Factor: 168 - Ferro-Fibrous 9.5

Internal Armor
Structure Value
Head 3 9
Center Torso 16 24
Center Torso(rear) 7
R/L Torso 12 18
R/L Torso(rear) 6
R/L Arm 8 16
R/L Leg 12 24

Weapons and Ammo Location Critical Tonnage
SRM 6 LA 2 3
SRM 6 Ammo LA 1 1
Jump Jet LT 1 0.5
Jump Jet LL 2 0.5
Jump Jet RL 2 0.5
Guardian ECM Suite RT 2 1.5
Jump Jet RT 1 0.5
MASC RT 3 3
ER Medium Laser RA 1 1
ER Medium Laser RA 1 1
C3 Slave CT 1 1
TAG CT 1 1
Flamer H 1 1

Does that make more sense now?

[Joran]

For example, the Banshee, which was one of the worst mech designs evar. It was a 95 ton mech... with a PPC and an AC/5. It was a 4/6/0, which was fast for a 95 ton mech (as fast as possible, in fact), and had okay armor. However, most mechs smaller than it could keep out of range and pepper it.

So when I 'upgraded' it with TL 2 gear, I slapped in an XL engine (which has the serious disadvantage of blowing up the mech if it looses either of its side torso locations), slapped in some Jump Jets (to go along with the flavor of 'uber fast and maneuverable for an assault mech'), a C3 Computer (which just makes sense), and upgraded the AC/5 to a RAC/5 (Rotary Autocannon has an option to fire 1,2,4, or 6 rounds. If it does so, it rolls on the appropriate SRM chart to determine how many hits land, then rolls for hit location per shot, and will jam on a 2,3, or 4 respectively). I also slapped in a Targeting Computer. Unlike the completely broken Clan version, the only thing it does is gives you a -1 on your attack rolls, and lets all of the RAC's shots that hit end up in the same hit location (you can't take a +4 for called shots).

In the end, it's a lot more survivable. It has more armor, the RAC/5 is a vast improvement, and has 3 tons of ammo to support it (since it still eats one shot of ammo per shot, even if you are firing 6 shots in a round). It still has the PPC for energy weapon support. It is more maneuverable in broken or urban settings. But it is still the same thing.


I think there was a book tech 2 upgrade for the Banshee. They put in a XL engine, swapped out the AC/5 for a Gauss Rifle and an ER PPC for the regular PPC. My first time playing with it, I think I headshot two mechs. I fell in love with Gauss Rifles after that. Loved Battletech.

[RandomLunatic]

The only problem with your approach is that TAG is the only weapon you can use in a turn, so you are getting one 'Mech firing for the price of two. I, meanwhile, am getting two 'Mechs firing for the price of two, and they are ripping your spotter(s) a new one (Which, BTW, I find very wanting. 6/9/6 is simply not an acceptable movement curve for a post-3050 Light. And I am trying to figure out where all the Brute's weight is going that you are outgunned by a COM-2D Commando, but it is not working).

Your plan collapses in the face of enemy ECM, and you are staking everything on that single TAG unit connecting, which is hardly a safe bet. TAG does not get to ignore attacker movement (and he better be moving, and fast, or he will die horribly), or range (sure, you could move to short range. But if the enemy is in Short range of your weapons, you are in Short range of his.), or anything else.

I mean, I understand the concept behind SG-LRMs. I just have yet to actually see it work.

@Joran: BNC-5S (http://www.mechground.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=618&Itemid=863)

[Erloas]

There are at least half a dozen or more book 'Mech designs for each 'Mech. Something like the MadCat have a lot more.


What I've been trying to do is get a lot of lances set up using most of my 'Mechs and try to keep each one about equal in BV so I have quick packets to give to people to play without having to figure out costs every game. Since its fairly hard to get that close to a set BV with pre-made 'Mechs since they jump in BV quite a bit from one 'Mech to the next.

Right now I think I have about 4-5 lances of 2-4 'Mechs with a BV just about 5k. Seems to work fairly well for showing people the game, gives an range of 'Mechs without making the game too big where it lasts for 6+ hours to play a game.

As I said, I don't have HMP any more, but I had taken a copy of every design of all the 'Mechs I had and printed them to a PDF file so I can print them again. I just can't make any more and I don't have the newest 'Mechs I've put together yet.
I know I had downloaded The Drawing Board before but I don't remember why I didn't use it much. I had downloaded a few programs though so its hard to remember which was which. Some of the others might have been better at building a 'Mech, but the ability to search HMP and the fact that it had virtually every book design made it nice for what I was doing.


Does anyone run many tanks, infantry, protomechs or VTOLs in their games?

[ShneekeyTheLost]

The only problem with your approach is that TAG is the only weapon you can use in a turn, so you are getting one 'Mech firing for the price of two. I, meanwhile, am getting two 'Mechs firing for the price of two, and they are ripping your spotter(s) a new one (Which, BTW, I find very wanting. 6/9/6 is simply not an acceptable movement curve for a post-3050 Light. And I am trying to figure out where all the Brute's weight is going that you are outgunned by a COM-2D Commando, but it is not working).

Your plan collapses in the face of enemy ECM, and you are staking everything on that single TAG unit connecting, which is hardly a safe bet. TAG does not get to ignore attacker movement (and he better be moving, and fast, or he will die horribly), or range (sure, you could move to short range. But if the enemy is in Short range of your weapons, you are in Short range of his.), or anything else.

I mean, I understand the concept behind SG-LRMs. I just have yet to actually see it work.

@Joran: BNC-5S (http://www.mechground.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=618&Itemid=863)

The Bush Goblin has max armor and extremely heavy weapons for a Light mech. It can take out most Medium mechs by itself, without the TAG. When you use the stealth variant (using stealth armor, which prevents LoS with ANY terrain and increases the difficulty to hit by one range category), you can't even FIND the bastard, yet he is TAGing you for Arrow IV missiles from offboard artillery fire.

Dude, the Brute is a 50 ton mech, most of it's weight is in the engine and the armor. Try looking at it again.

You can go ahead and try to take him out... since he's got MASC, he's likely advancing at near-Hussar speeds. That is also known as 'good luck TRYING to hit me'. And since it is just a run, I'm only at a +2 to attack with the TAG. It's got more armor than some HEAVY mechs. Meanwhile, you're eating 4 LRM/20's a round. Let's see who survives what.

Also, ECM doesn't really hurt this that much. All I need to do is stand back four hexes and call in fire support, rather than close to melee range. Big flippin' deal. TAG is completely unaffected by ECM.

I have RIPPED Clanners a new one with this strategy. They try to hang back with their range advantage. I create enough smoke to prevent that. So they close, and I concentrate fire and eliminate them one by one. Sure, I take my hits, probably loose one of the spotters in the process, but I *HAVE* taken out four MadCats with two Brutes and two Catapult II's.

Furthermore, you can fire TAG along with the rest of your weapons, which is why he has an SRM/6. Because of the 'sandpaper' effect, he can easily take advantage of any weak armor slots and start having chances of doing crits more frequently, which are generally more dangerous to a mech than a big boom that might hit a more heavily armored location.

@ Erloas: There is one vehicle which I exploit madly...

Mobile Missile Launcher - 50 ton Hovercraft
Cruising Speed: 8
Flank Speed: 12
Engine: 165XL
Armor: 170 at 9.5 tons
Equipment:
*Arrow IV Missile Launcher with 2 tons of ammo
*C3 Master computer

Basically, it can be used as a Master Unit for up to 3 different mechs. In fact, I frequently run with 2 of these, plus 6 more mechs. Generally, I run 2 Bush Goblins, 1 Brute, and 3 Catapults. Any mech eating 2 Arrow IV missiles + 6 LRM/20's is going down QUICK.

[Triaxx]

Random: I wasn't able to get the images to load for some reason.

Erloas: Only as cannon fodder. Anything over 50 tons seems to walk right over them like they weren't there (ground) or get shredded a lot (air). Air is still awesome to play with against lighter mechs because they can and will dodge fire. And ground units are still strong enough to not be annihilated by the vast array of fire power the mechs can bring to bear. Usually.

Now, escort missions do have their perks. Especially when you get the opportunity to out gun the players.

[RandomLunatic]

The Bush Goblin has max armor and extremely heavy weapons for a Light mech.

No it does not. Max armor for a 35-tonner is 119, or 7.5 tons of standard. And your firepower is comparable to a COM-2D, which is an older 'Mech 10 tons lighter.

Even if your claims were true, so what? Having the best armed and armored Light 'Mech is kinda like being the world's tallest midget. You lord over your contemporaries, but you are still coming up short against the population at large.



It can take out most Medium mechs by itself, without the TAG.
If they are out of ammo, legless, and shut down at the time. Otherwise, I do not see it happening.


When you use the stealth variant (using stealth armor, which prevents LoS with ANY terrain and increases the difficulty to hit by one range category), you can't even FIND the bastard, yet he is TAGing you for Arrow IV missiles from offboard artillery fire.

Um, what? All Stealth Armor does is increase range penalties by 1.5, and prohibt engaging multiple targets.


Dude, the Brute is a 50 ton mech, most of it's weight is in the engine and the armor. Try looking at it again.

I know. I have built similiar 'Mechs before, and they ended up having actual firepower when I was done.

As an aside, your tonnage sink is that SRM. Pull it for beam weaponry.


You can go ahead and try to take him out... since he's got MASC, he's likely advancing at near-Hussar speeds.

And the more you use it, the more likely it is to come back and bite you in the posterior. Hard.


That is also known as 'good luck TRYING to hit me'.

The Royal Navy once thought speed would make an acceptable substitute for armor. It proved to be a tragically (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HMS_Indefatigable_(1909)) flawed (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HMS_Queen_Mary) concept (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hms_hood).


And since it is just a run, I'm only at a +2 to attack with the TAG.

+2 for range, since if you get closer than 6 hexes you will be butchered. Plus terrain and target movement. And you only get one try.


It's got more armor than some HEAVY mechs.

Most of which tend to be (in)famous for crappy armor.

This is kind of like saying you have the firepower of an Assault 'Mech because you can outgun a Charger.


Meanwhile, you're eating 4 LRM/20's a round. Let's see who survives what.

Deploying 180 tons of 'Mech and only getting 80 LRMs about half the time to show for it is rather underwhelming.


Also, ECM doesn't really hurt this that much. All I need to do is stand back four hexes and call in fire support, rather than close to melee range. Big flippin' deal. TAG is completely unaffected by ECM.

True that ECM does not hurt TAG, but it does shut down your C3 net.


I have RIPPED Clanners a new one with this strategy. They try to hang back with their range advantage. I create enough smoke to prevent that. So they close, and I concentrate fire and eliminate them one by one. Sure, I take my hits, probably loose one of the spotters in the process, but I *HAVE* taken out four MadCats with two Brutes and two Catapult II's.

I am going to guess your opponent got too fixated on killing the spotters, and that he plays Clanners as Lawful Stupid. Either that or your dice were on fire.

Me, I would just rush the Cats. Depending on how inclined I was to observe Zell, (Not very strongly, considering the stravags's evident utter disregard for it), I would leave two behind to duel the spotters while the other two go look for unengaged enemies, e.g. the Catapults. Four LRM-20s would need to get exceptionally lucky to bring down even a single Timber Wolf in 21 hexes. And once they get to your fire-support guys, it is all over. The thin-skinned, weakly gunned Cats will last two rounds, three at most, and your spotters are too pathetically gunned to be of any threat without their support.


Furthermore, you can fire TAG along with the rest of your weapons,

EDIT: As has been pointed out to me, you can as of Total Warfare. But your spotter's firepower is so anemic, nobody will notice the difference anyway.


which is why he has an SRM/6.

Oh, please, sir, stop, I beg you! I am quaking in my boots![/sarcasm]

Sadly, assuming you TAG successfully, and all four LRMs hit, the spotter's guns, weak as they are, improve your damage by almost a third. All this money and technology you are throwing into this, and your average damage output is about on par with a lance of Commandos. Epic Phail

Speaking of money, you mention a Mercenary unit several times in your fluff. Each salvo of SG missiles from a -20 rack sets you back 15,000 C-bills. How have you managed to avoid bankrupting yourself with all these fancy guided munitions?


Because of the 'sandpaper' effect, he can easily take advantage of any weak armor slots and start having chances of doing crits more frequently, which are generally more dangerous to a mech than a big boom that might hit a more heavily armored location.

"Death by a Thousand Papercuts" only works if you have some way of putting holes in the target's armor, and the only way you have to do that is the Arrow IV you have below.

And I can write a whole article on the merits of crit-finding weaponry (SRMs, MGs, SLs) versus hole-punchers (PPCs, GRs, AC/20s), but the bottom line is, crit-finders need the hole-punchers to make holes. The hole-punchers can stand just fine on their own.

@ Erloas: There is one vehicle which I exploit madly...


Mobile Missile Launcher - 50 ton Hovercraft
Cruising Speed: 8
Flank Speed: 12
Engine: 165XL
Armor: 170 at 9.5 tons
Equipment:
*Arrow IV Missile Launcher with 2 tons of ammo
*C3 Master computer

Basically, it can be used as a Master Unit for up to 3 different mechs. In fact, I frequently run with 2 of these, plus 6 more mechs. Generally, I run 2 Bush Goblins, 1 Brute, and 3 Catapults. Any mech eating 2 Arrow IV missiles + 6 LRM/20's is going down QUICK.

Nice, but I would drop a ton or two of armor for more ammo. With an artillery peice and a C3M, if the enemy is axctually shooting at it, you did something horribly, horribly wrong.

[Swordguy]

RandomLunatic, I don't mean to get all at you, but you seriously need to check the Total Warfare ruleset. TAGs can, in fact, fire alson with the rest of your weaponry. Specifically, TW, pg 142 (Targeting Acquisition Gear) has nothing about a designating unit being unable to fire other weaponry in the Weapons Attack Phase. In fact...


...a unit can use TAG to spot and make a weapon attack with no additional penalty.


Now, on-topic...

Ive generally stopped playing with custom Mechs. Or, more specifically, I've stopped playing games with unlimited custom Mechs. The VAST majority of our games are stock-only designs, because it's so easy to abuse the CBT construction system. The only custom Mechs we field are in campaign games (limited to the player's specific "avatar" PC only), and even then, they're required to adhere to the "spirit" of the design (as adjucated by the GM - ie, me, since I GM EVERYTHING around here). Each Mech has a given "feel" to it, and the modification needs to keep that feel (A Marauder, for example, needs to have a big gun over a small gun in each arm, and a big gun in a torso. Those can be PPCs over medium lasers+a Gauss Rifle, Large lasers over small lasers+an AC/20, or whatever...it can't be LRM-15s over SRM-2s, with a battery of 6 medium lasers in the torsos).

Now, if you don't care whatsoever about fluff or feel or character to your Mechs, under TW rules you can break the system by doing the following:

Only build Mechs at the upper end of each weight classification. 35, 55, 75 and 100 tons offer the best combinations of firepower, mobility, and protection (60 tons Mechs, for example, have less tonnage available for armor and weapons at the same speed as a 55-ton Mech). .Don't have too much speed - you want enough speed to get to the desired Target Movement Modifier and have an MP left to make 1 hexside change (a 5/8 Mech can run for 7 hexes - a +3 modifier - and make 1 facing change). Jump Jets generally go on everything up to 85 tons - 2 tons per jet over that makes them more expensive than they're worth. Take energy weapons up to (but not over) your total heat dissipation capacity - energy weapons are, point-for-point, the most efficient weapons in the game. Once you've loaded up on large energy weapons to your heat dissipation limit (or preferably a couple points under), take a crit-seeking missile or ballistic weapon (SRM-6 Streaks or LB-10Xs are the preferred weapon here) if tonnage permits. Make sure the ammo is in a location with lots of other, non-explosive stuff. In no circumstance take less than 90% armor. If you take an Inner Sphere XL engine, you almost MUST take at least 95% armor (with the excess armor allocated to the side torsos).

If you're playing Clan, just take a shedload of large pulse lasers (best weapons in the game - the devs have mentioned multiple times if they could retcon them they would), double heat sinks, and maybe a TComp.

Weapon heat plus non-jumping movement heat should result in no more than a +4 to your heat scale.

Example Inner Sphere CheezeMech:


BattleMech Technical Readout

Type/Model: CheezeMech CHZ-1
Tech: Inner Sphere / 3067
Config: Biped BattleMech
Rules: Level 3, Standard design

Mass: 75 tons
Chassis: Endo Steel
Power Plant: 300 Light Fusion
Walking Speed: 43.2 km/h
Maximum Speed: 64.8 km/h
Jump Jets: None
Jump Capacity: 0 meters
Armor Type: Standard
Armament:
3 PPCs
1 LB 10-X AC
Manufacturer: (Unknown)
Location: (Unknown)
Communications System: (Unknown)
Targeting & Tracking System: (Unknown)

--------------------------------------------------------
Type/Model: CheezeMech CHZ-1
Mass: 75 tons

Equipment: Crits Mass
Int. Struct.: 114 pts Endo Steel 14 4.00
(Endo Steel Loc: 4 LA, 5 RA, 1 RT, 2 LL, 2 RL)
Engine: 300 Light Fusion 10 14.50
Walking MP: 4
Running MP: 6
Jumping MP: 0
Heat Sinks: 16 Double [32] 12 6.00
(Heat Sink Loc: 1 RA, 1 LT, 2 RT)
XL Gyro: 6 1.50
Cockpit, Life Supt., Sensors: 5 3.00
Actuators: L: Sh+UA R: Sh+UA+LA+H 14 .00
Armor Factor: 208 pts Standard 0 13.00

Internal Armor
Structure Value
Head: 3 9
Center Torso: 23 29
Center Torso (Rear): 10
L/R Side Torso: 16 22/22
L/R Side Torso (Rear): 7/7
L/R Arm: 12 22/22
L/R Leg: 16 29/29

Weapons and Equipment Loc Heat Ammo Crits Mass
--------------------------------------------------------
2 PPCs LA 20 6 14.00
1 PPC RT 10 3 7.00
1 LB 10-X AC LT 2 10 7 12.00
(Ammo Locations: 1 LT)
--------------------------------------------------------
TOTALS: 32 77 75.00
Crits & Tons Left: 1 .00

Calculated Factors:
Total Cost: 13,317,938 C-Bills
Battle Value: 1,463
Cost per BV: 9,103.17
Weapon Value: 2,687 / 2,687 (Ratio = 1.84 / 1.84)
Damage Factors: SRDmg = 27; MRDmg = 25; LRDmg = 10
BattleForce2: MP: 4, Armor/Structure: 5/4
Damage PB/M/L: 5/4/4, Overheat: 0
Class: MH; Point Value: 15


And example Clan Cheezemech:


BattleMech Technical Readout

Type/Model: Gouda (Clan: Fromage)
Tech: Clan / 3055
Config: Biped BattleMech
Rules: Level 2, Standard design

Mass: 85 tons
Chassis: Standard
Power Plant: 255 XL Fusion
Walking Speed: 32.4 km/h
Maximum Speed: 54.0 km/h
Jump Jets: 3 Standard Jump Jets
Jump Capacity: 90 meters
Armor Type: Standard
Armament:
4 Large Pulse Lasers
1 LRM 15
Manufacturer: (Unknown)
Location: (Unknown)
Communications System: (Unknown)
Targeting & Tracking System: (Unknown)

--------------------------------------------------------
Type/Model: Gouda (Clan: Fromage)
Mass: 85 tons

Equipment: Crits Mass
Int. Struct.: 130 pts Standard 0 8.50
Engine: 255 XL Fusion 10 6.50
Walking MP: 3
Running MP: 5
Jumping MP: 3
Heat Sinks: 21 Double [42] 22 11.00
(Heat Sink Loc: 2 LA, 2 RA, 3 LT, 2 RT, 1 LL, 1 RL)
Gyro: 4 3.00
Cockpit, Life Supt.: 5 3.00
Actuators: L: Sh+UA R: Sh+UA 12 .00
Armor Factor: 263 pts Standard 0 16.50

Internal Armor
Structure Value
Head: 3 9
Center Torso: 27 40
Center Torso (Rear): 14
L/R Side Torso: 18 27/27
L/R Side Torso (Rear): 9/9
L/R Arm: 14 28/28
L/R Leg: 18 36/36

Weapons and Equipment Loc Heat Ammo Crits Mass
--------------------------------------------------------
2 Large Pulse Lasers RA 20 4 12.00
2 Large Pulse Lasers LA 20 4 12.00
1 LRM 15 LT 5 8 3 4.50
(Ammo Locations: 1 LT)
1 Targeting Computer RT 5 5.00
3 Standard Jump Jets: 3 3.00
(Jump Jet Loc: 1 LT, 1 RT, 1 CT)
--------------------------------------------------------
TOTALS: 45 72 85.00
Crits & Tons Left: 6 .00

Calculated Factors:
Total Cost: 16,334,575 C-Bills
Battle Value: 2,744
Cost per BV: 5,952.83
Weapon Value: 5,633 / 5,633 (Ratio = 2.05 / 2.05)
Damage Factors: SRDmg = 46; MRDmg = 43; LRDmg = 30
BattleForce2: MP: 3J, Armor/Structure: 7/5
Damage PB/M/L: 7/5/5, Overheat: 0
Class: MA; Point Value: 27


Both of these Mechs are designed to get to a good firing spot as quickly as possible, and sit there like a turret for the whole game, putting accurate, heavy, and consistent amounts of fire downrange. By the rules, movement is bad - it hurts your chances to hit too much. All else being equal, the guy who parks and acts like a turret will, in the absence of BMR rules artillery or any ruleset's Areospace fighters, win the game a statistically significant percentage of the time.

[RandomLunatic]

RandomLunatic, I don't mean to get all at you, but you seriously need to check the Total Warfare ruleset. TAGs can, in fact, fire alson with the rest of your weaponry. Specifically, TW, pg 142 (Targeting Acquisition Gear) has nothing about a designating unit being unable to fire other weaponry in the Weapons Attack Phase.

Really? *Checks* Sweet! I no longer have to use Sprints and 3050 Ostscouts as my TAG spotters!

In my defense, I will reiterate that I have never actually played a game under the Total Warfare ruleset.

Out of curiosity, what is your stance on book 'Mech variants that vary widely from the original? Things like the Fire Javvy, CGR-SB, Swaybacks, etc.

[Philistine]

I always felt MASC was a waste of space and tonnage: unless you're putting it on a mech that was already quite fast, there's just not that much difference between 1.5X and 2X your normal walking speed. Worse, if you're using it every other turn then the benefit drops to 1.75X walking speed - and even such cautious use will result in a failed check sooner or later, leaving your "fast" mech immobilized. Leaving the system on for two consecutive turns is just begging for trouble, and longer usage runs up the odds against you very quickly. So MASC is right up near the top of my "never use" list.

[Swordguy]

Really? *Checks* Sweet! I no longer have to use Sprints and 3050 Ostscouts as my TAG spotters!

In my defense, I will reiterate that I have never actually played a game under the Total Warfare ruleset.

Out of curiosity, what is your stance on book 'Mech variants that vary widely from the original? Things like the Fire Javvy, CGR-SB, Swaybacks, etc.

No problem - I figured you'd appreciate that (and it makes the argument for mass batteries of SG-LRMs make more sense now, yeah?).

Regarding wide-variance book Mechs - generally speaking, the ones that differ wildly from the standard variants aren't field refits. Most of the ones you refer to are factory-built or factory-refits, so I've got no problem with them. You almost NEVER see a Mech changed drastically as anything other than a factory refit. When it comes to games, though, you'd be making huge, sweeping changes to Mechs via field refits (a bunch of guys and a gantry) as opposed to actually being in the factory, so my tolerance for extreme changes is a lot lower. A good example is Endo-steel...if you're cheezing out a Mech, you want Endo first if possible, because it's more efficient than Ferro-fibrous armor and doesn't have the penalty of killing your Mech on a side-torso hit. However, to refit a Mech with Endo, you have to take every bit off the Mech, replace the entire skeleton of the Mech, and put every bit back on the Mech. You, in essence, building a new Mech from scratch. Have a factory? No problem. Have a Mech bay on a DropShip and a pile of parts? Problem.

That's a bad field refit (and actually now illegal to do so as per Strategic Operations).

The only reason to restrict OmniMechs to canon variants is the Clan Pulse Laser/TComp Conundrum, in that a Mech that just mounts pulse lasers and a TComp is more efficient than a Mech that mounts anything else - and so to limit that, you've gotta go with canon configs (with the caveat that you can change from one canon config to another in campaign play with very little time or cost, thus giving Omnis a strategic advantage over basic Mechs). You probably weren't around, but before the "canon variants only" thing hit tourneys at conventions every Clan Bloodname tournament was won (from 92-95) by a guy sporting a Pulse Laser/TComp boat.

[TheThan]

Wow, this thread started at just the right time.

Yesterday my bro got a hold of the battletech tech manual. While I’m no engineer, I love to create; one of my favorite parts of the mechwarrior video games was screwing around in the mech lab. So I’m going to start reading and learning how to build and modify mechs. But since I’m rather new to the battletech universe I could use some pointers, recommendations and general advise before I start to actually create something.

Seems to me the place to start is just to modify an existing mech, you know create a variant. but as I've only given the book a curtsy glance, I could be wrong.

[Philistine]

Back to the original topic: I think my all-time favorite 'mech, though it wasn't particularly mechanically powerful, was a customized Shadow Hawk. As a new recruit, my pilot got stuck with a clapped-out old SHD-2H. It needed a lot of work - but the appropriate spares weren't always available, and so it ended up as something like a hybrid of the -2H and -2K variants. Much later the company gained access to advanced tech, and the mech went through a series of refits to add double heat sinks, ER versions of the PPC and medium laser, and ferro-fibrous armor. And finally, after all that time and trouble and expense, it was just barely up to the standard of "book" machines in its weight class... but years later, it's still the first thing that comes to my mind when I think of custom battlemechs. I even remember what the pilot named it, though I don't remember the pilot's name. (Point of dubious interest: it was "Queen B," as she was both a hangar queen and a... dog.)

@TheThan: Mech editing software can be found in various places around the net, for example in the downloads section of the Battletech Wiki (http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Main_Page); assorted goodies can also be found at the official site (http://www.classicbattletech.com/).

[SAMAS]

I've never actually played Battletech, but I've probably run about a hundred various mech/vehicle designs and conversions through my head.

Since people put up so many Catapults, how about something a little heavier (based on a Cat's chassis, of course):

Type/Model: Bowman BWMN-T3
Tech: Inner Sphere / 3060
Config: Biped BattleMech
Rules: Level 3, Standard design

Mass: 95 tons
Chassis: Hollis Mark II Endo Steel
Power Plant: 380 Magna XL Fusion
Walking Speed: 43.2 km/h
Maximum Speed: 64.8 km/h
Jump Jets: None
Jump Capacity: 0 meters
Armor Type: Durallex Heavy Standard
Armament:
10 Thunderbolt 5s
2 ER Medium Lasers
1 C³ Slave Unit
Manufacturer: Hollis Incorporated
Location: Corey
Communications System: O/P COM-211
Targeting & Tracking System: O/P 1078

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Type/Model: Bowman BWMN-T3
Mass: 95 tons

Equipment: Crits Mass
Int. Struct.: 145 pts Endo Steel 14 5.00
(Endo Steel Loc: 3 LA, 3 RA, 2 LT, 2 RT, 2 LL, 2 RL)
Engine: 380 XL Fusion 12 20.50
Walking MP: 4
Running MP: 6
Jumping MP: 0
Heat Sinks: 15 Double [30] 0 5.00
Gyro: 4 4.00
Cockpit, Life Supt., Sensors: 5 3.00
Actuators: L: Sh+UA R: Sh+UA 12 .00
Armor Factor: 293 pts Standard 0 18.50

Internal Armor
Structure Value
Head: 3 9
Center Torso: 30 45
Center Torso (Rear): 15
L/R Side Torso: 20 30/30
L/R Side Torso (Rear): 10/10
L/R Arm: 16 32/32
L/R Leg: 20 40/40

Weapons and Equipment Loc Heat Ammo Crits Mass
--------------------------------------------------------
5 Thunderbolt 5s RA 15 60 10 20.00
(Ammo Locations: 2 LT, 3 RT)
5 Thunderbolt 5s LA 15 5 15.00
2 ER Medium Lasers CT 10 2 2.00
1 C³ Slave Unit HD 0 1 1.00
CASE Equipment: LT RT 2 1.00
--------------------------------------------------------
TOTALS: 40 67 95.00
Crits & Tons Left: 11 .00

Calculated Factors:
Total Cost: 25,796,876 C-Bills
Battle Value 2: 1,949 (old BV = 1,528)
Cost per BV2: 13,235.95
Weapon Value: 4,078 / 4,078 (Ratio = 2.09 / 2.09)
Damage Factors: SRDmg = 31; MRDmg = 28; LRDmg = 12
BattleForce2: MP: 4, Armor/Structure: 7/4
Damage PB/M/L: 4/4/3, Overheat: 1
Class: MA; Point Value: 20
Specials: c3s

A vehicle conversion: the Metal Slug!

Type/Model: Metal Slug SV-100
Tech: Inner Sphere / 3060
Config: Tracked Vehicle
Rules: Level 3, Custom design

Mass: 25 tons
Power Plant: 125 Nissan Fusion
Cruise Speed: 54.0 km/h
Maximum Speed: 86.4 km/h
Armor Type: Ferro-Fibrous
Armament:
1 Light AC/5
2 Machine Guns
Manufacturer: (Unknown)
Location: (Unknown)
Communications System: (Unknown)
Targeting & Tracking System: (Unknown)

--------------------------------------------------------
Type/Model: Metal Slug SV-100
Mass: 25 tons

Equipment: Items Mass
Int. Struct.: 12 pts Standard 0 2.50
Engine: 125 Fusion 0 4.00
Shielding & Transmission Equipment: 0 2.00
Cruise MP: 5
Flank MP: 8
Heat Sinks: 10 Single 0 .00
Cockpit & Controls: 0 1.50
Crew: 2 Members 0 .00
Sponson Turret Equipment: 0 .50
Armor Factor: 116 pts Ferro-Fibrous 2 6.50

Internal Armor
Structure Value
Front: 3 41
Left / Right Sides: 3 28/28
Rear: 3 19

Weapons and Equipment Loc Heat Ammo Items Mass
--------------------------------------------------------
1 Light AC/5 Front 0 20 2 6.00
1 Machine Gun Lf_Spon 0 100 2 1.00
1 Machine Gun Rt_Spon 0 1 .50
1 C.A.S.E. Equipment Body 1 .50
--------------------------------------------------------
TOTALS: 0 8 25.00
Items & Tons Left: 2 .00

Calculated Factors:
Total Cost: 744,792 C-Bills
Battle Value 2: 488 (old BV = 237)
Cost per BV: 1,526.21
Weapon Value: 110 / 110 (Ratio = .23 / .23)
Damage Factors: SRDmg = 5; MRDmg = 3; LRDmg = 0
BattleForce2: MP: 5T, Armor/Structure: 0 / 4
Damage PB/M/L: 1/1/-, Overheat: 0
Class: GL; Point Value: 5

This started as a conversion of a Zoid, but ended up more of an "Inspired by" thing:

Type/Model: Rhino RNO-1C
Tech: Inner Sphere / 3062
Config: Quad BattleMech
Rules: Level 3, Standard design

Mass: 100 tons
Chassis: Standard
Power Plant: 300 Compact Fusion
Walking Speed: 32.4 km/h
Maximum Speed: 54.0 km/h
Jump Jets: None
Jump Capacity: 0 meters
Armor Type: Standard
Armament:
4 Rocket Launcher 15s
1 Rotary AC/5
4 ER Medium Lasers
1 ER PPC
1 Improved C³ CPU
Manufacturer: (Unknown)
Location: (Unknown)
Communications System: (Unknown)
Targeting & Tracking System: (Unknown)

--------------------------------------------------------
Type/Model: Rhino RNO-1C
Mass: 100 tons

Equipment: Crits Mass
Int. Struct.: 160 pts Standard 0 10.00
Engine: 300 Compact 3 28.50
Walking MP: 3
Running MP: 5
Jumping MP: 0
Heat Sinks: 15 Double [30] 9 5.00
(Heat Sink Loc: 2 LT, 1 CT)
Gyro: 4 3.00
Cockpit, Life Supt., Sensors: 5 3.00
Leg Act: Hip + UpLeg + LowLeg + Foot 16 .00
Armor Factor: 323 pts Standard 0 20.50

Internal Armor
Structure Value
Head: 3 9
Center Torso: 31 46
Center Torso (Rear): 16
L/R Side Torso: 21 32/32
L/R Side Torso (Rear): 10/10
L/R Front Leg: 21 42/42
L/R Rear Leg: 21 42/42

Weapons and Equipment Loc Heat Ammo Crits Mass
--------------------------------------------------------
1 Rocket Launcher 15 RFL 4 2 1.00
1 Rocket Launcher 15 LFL 4 2 1.00
1 Rotary AC/5 RT 1 40 8 12.00
(Ammo Locations: 2 RT)
2 ER Medium Lasers RT 10 2 2.00
1 ER PPC LT 15 3 7.00
1 Improved C³ CPU LT 0 2 2.50
2 ER Medium Lasers CT 10 2 2.00
1 Rocket Launcher 15 LRL(R) 4 2 1.00
1 Rocket Launcher 15 RR(R) 4 2 1.00
CASE Equipment: RT 1 .50
--------------------------------------------------------
TOTALS: 41 63 100.00
Crits & Tons Left: 3 .00

Calculated Factors:
Total Cost: 15,680,000 C-Bills
Battle Value: 1,759 (+278 for C³)
Cost per BV: 8,914.16
Weapon Value: 2,994 / 2,994 (Ratio = 1.70 / 1.70)
Damage Factors: SRDmg = 47; MRDmg = 29; LRDmg = 7
BattleForce2: MP: 3, Armor/Structure: 8/8
Damage PB/M/L: 5/4/1, Overheat: 2
Class: MA; Point Value: 18
Specials: c3i

A variant of the same mech.
Type/Model: Rhino RNO-2J
Tech: Inner Sphere / 3062
Config: Quad BattleMech
Rules: Level 3, Standard design

Mass: 100 tons
Chassis: Standard
Power Plant: 300 Vlar Fusion
Walking Speed: 32.4 km/h
Maximum Speed: 54.0 km/h
Jump Jets: None
Jump Capacity: 0 meters
Armor Type: Light Ferro-Fibrous
Armament:
4 Anti-Personnel Pods
2 ER Large Lasers
2 Anti-Missile Systems
2 ER Medium Lasers
1 Thunderbolt 10
4 Thunderbolt 5s
1 Improved C³ CPU
Manufacturer: (Unknown)
Location: (Unknown)
Communications System: (Unknown)
Targeting & Tracking System: (Unknown)

--------------------------------------------------------
Type/Model: Rhino RNO-2J
Mass: 100 tons

Equipment: Crits Mass
Int. Struct.: 160 pts Standard 0 10.00
Engine: 300 6 19.00
Walking MP: 3
Running MP: 5
Jumping MP: 0
Heat Sinks: 12 Double [24] 0 2.00
Gyro: 4 3.00
Cockpit, Life Supt., Sensors: 5 3.00
Leg Act: Hip + UpLeg + LowLeg + Foot 16 .00
Armor Factor: 323 pts Light Ferro-Fibrous 7 19.50
(Armor Crit Loc: 1 HD, 1 LFL, 1 RFL, 2 LT, 1 LRL, 1 RRL)

Internal Armor
Structure Value
Head: 3 9
Center Torso: 31 46
Center Torso (Rear): 16
L/R Side Torso: 21 32/32
L/R Side Torso (Rear): 10/10
L/R Front Leg: 21 42/42
L/R Rear Leg: 21 42/42

Weapons and Equipment Loc Heat Ammo Crits Mass
--------------------------------------------------------
1 Anti-Personnel Pod RFL 0 1 .50
1 Anti-Personnel Pod LFL 0 1 .50
2 ER Large Lasers RT(T) 24 4 10.00
1 Anti-Missile System RT 1 24 3 2.50
(Ammo Locations: 1 LT, 1 RT)
1 ER Medium Laser RT(R) 5 1 1.00
1 Thunderbolt 10 RT 5 6 3 8.00
(Ammo Locations: 1 RT)
4 Thunderbolt 5s LT 12 24 6 14.00
(Ammo Locations: 2 LT)
1 Anti-Missile System LT 1 1 .50
1 ER Medium Laser LT(R) 5 1 1.00
1 Improved C³ CPU CT 0 2 2.50
1 Anti-Personnel Pod LRL 0 1 .50
1 Anti-Personnel Pod RRL 0 1 .50
CASE Equipment: LT RT 2 1.00
Turret Equipment: Right ShoulderMain 1 1.00
--------------------------------------------------------
TOTALS: 53 66 100.00
Crits & Tons Left: 0 .00

Calculated Factors:
Total Cost: 12,441,000 C-Bills
Battle Value: 1,733 (+270 for C³)
Cost per BV: 7,178.88
Weapon Value: 2,275 / 2,275 (Ratio = 1.31 / 1.31)
Damage Factors: SRDmg = 17; MRDmg = 17; LRDmg = 7
BattleForce2: MP: 3, Armor/Structure: 8/8
Damage PB/M/L: 3/2/2, Overheat: 3
Class: MA; Point Value: 17
Specials: c3i


Nothing too special about this, just a basic Med. mech:

Type/Model: Wanderer WNZ-05R
Tech: Inner Sphere / 3062
Config: Biped BattleMech
Rules: Level 3, Custom design

Mass: 50 tons
Chassis: Endo Steel
Power Plant: 250 Magna Fusion
Walking Speed: 54.0 km/h
Maximum Speed: 86.4 km/h
Jump Jets: 5 Standard Jump Jets
Jump Capacity: 150 meters
Armor Type: Stealth
Armament:
1 SN PPC*
1 Light AC/5
1 ER Medium Laser
1 Small Pulse Laser
1 Guardian ECM
Manufacturer: (Unknown)
Location: (Unknown)
Communications System: (Unknown)
Targeting & Tracking System: (Unknown)

--------------------------------------------------------
Type/Model: Wanderer WNZ-05R
Mass: 50 tons

Equipment: Crits Mass
Int. Struct.: 83 pts Endo Steel 14 2.50
(Endo Steel Loc: 1 HD, 2 LA, 2 RA, 4 LT, 4 RT, 1 CT)
Engine: 250 6 12.50
Walking MP: 5
Running MP: 8
Jumping MP: 5
Heat Sinks: 10 Double [20] 0 .00
Gyro: 4 3.00
Cockpit, Life Supt., Sensors: 5 3.00
Actuators: L: Sh+UA+LA+H R: Sh+UA+LA+H 16 .00
Armor Factor: 168 pts Stealth 12 10.50
(Armor Crit Loc: 2 LA, 2 RA, 2 LT, 2 RT, 2 LL, 2 RL)

Internal Armor
Structure Value
Head: 3 9
Center Torso: 16 21
Center Torso (Rear): 10
L/R Side Torso: 12 14/14
L/R Side Torso (Rear): 10/10
L/R Arm: 8 16/16
L/R Leg: 12 24/24

Weapons and Equipment Loc Heat Ammo Crits Mass
--------------------------------------------------------
1 Snub-Nosed PPC RA 10 2 6.00
1 Light AC/5 RA 1 20 3 6.00
(Ammo Locations: 1 RT)
1 ER Medium Laser LA 5 1 1.00
1 Small Pulse Laser LA 2 1 1.00
1 Guardian ECM LT 0 2 1.50
Stealth Armor Heat 10
CASE Equipment: RT 1 .50
5 Standard Jump Jets: 5 2.50
(Jump Jet Loc: 2 LT, 2 RT, 1 CT)
--------------------------------------------------------
TOTALS: 28 72 50.00
Crits & Tons Left: 6 .00

Calculated Factors:
Total Cost: 5,936,000 C-Bills
Battle Value: 1,256
Cost per BV: 4,726.11
Weapon Value: 672 / 672 (Ratio = .54 / .54)
Damage Factors: SRDmg = 17; MRDmg = 10; LRDmg = 1
BattleForce2: MP: 5J, Armor/Structure: 4/4
Damage PB/M/L: 3/2/-, Overheat: 0
Class: MM; Point Value: 13
Specials: ecm

A VTOL I came up with. Probably suffers from JOAT Syndrome:

Type/Model: Gun-Cutter
Tech: Inner Sphere / 3060
Config: V.T.O.L.
Rules: Level 3, Standard design

Mass: 30 tons
Power Plant: 70 Light Fusion
Cruise Speed: 75.6 km/h
Maximum Speed: 118.8 km/h
Armor Type: Standard
Armament:
2 Light AC/5s
1 Small Pulse Laser
2 Rocket Launcher 10s
Manufacturer: (Unknown)
Location: (Unknown)
Communications System: (Unknown)
Targeting & Tracking System: (Unknown)

--------------------------------------------------------
Type/Model: Gun-Cutter
Mass: 30 tons

Equipment: Items Mass
Int. Struct.: 18 pts Standard 0 3.00
Engine: 70 Light Fusion 1 1.50
Shielding & Transmission Equipment: 0 1.00
Cruise MP: 7
Flank MP: 11
Heat Sinks: 10 Single 0 .00
Cockpit & Controls: 0 1.50
Crew: 2 Members 0 .00
Rotor Equipment: Main/Tail Rotors 0 3.00
Turret Equipment: 0 .50
Armor Factor: 64 pts Standard 0 4.00

Internal Armor
Structure Value
Front: 3 18
Left / Right Sides: 3 13/13
Rear: 3 8
Rotor: 3 2
Chin Turret: 3 10

Weapons and Equipment Loc Heat Ammo Items Mass
--------------------------------------------------------
2 Light AC/5s Front 0 40 3 12.00
1 Small Pulse Laser ChinTur 2 1 1.00
2 Rocket Launcher 10s Front 0 2 1.00
1 C.A.S.E. Equipment Body 1 .50
Infantry Bay Body 1 1.00
--------------------------------------------------------
TOTALS: 2 9 30.00
Items & Tons Left: 2 .00

Calculated Factors:
Total Cost: 2,067,000 C-Bills
Battle Value: 643
Cost per BV: 3,214.62
Weapon Value: 188 / 188 (Ratio = .29 / .29)
Damage Factors: SRDmg = 25; MRDmg = 15; LRDmg = 4
BattleForce2: MP: 7V, Armor/Structure: 0 / 3
Damage PB/M/L: 1/1/-, Overheat: 0
Class: VA; Point Value: 6
Specials: tran1

To get the full effect of this vehicle, imagine a flying saucer on tank treads:

Type/Model: Limpet Type 3 (Death Blossom)
Tech: Inner Sphere / 3060
Config: Tracked Vehicle
Rules: Level 3, Standard design

Mass: 100 tons
Power Plant: 300 Vlar XL Fusion
Cruise Speed: 32.4 km/h
Maximum Speed: 54.0 km/h
Armor Type: Standard
Armament:
4 'Mech Mortar/8s
4 Rocket Launcher 10 (OS)s
Manufacturer: (Unknown)
Location: (Unknown)
Communications System: (Unknown)
Targeting & Tracking System: (Unknown)

--------------------------------------------------------
Type/Model: Limpet Type 3 (Death Blossom)
Mass: 100 tons

Equipment: Items Mass
Int. Struct.: 40 pts Standard 0 10.00
Engine: 300 XL Fusion 2 9.50
Shielding & Transmission Equipment: 0 5.00
Cruise MP: 3
Flank MP: 5
Heat Sinks: 10 Single 0 .00
Cockpit & Controls: 0 5.00
Crew: 7 Members 0 .00
Armor Factor: 200 pts Standard 0 12.50

Internal Armor
Structure Value
Front: 10 50
Left / Right Sides: 10 50/50
Rear: 10 50

Weapons and Equipment Loc Heat Ammo Items Mass
--------------------------------------------------------
1 'Mech Mortar/8 Front 0 16 2 14.00
1 'Mech Mortar/8 Left 0 16 1 14.00
1 'Mech Mortar/8 Right 0 16 1 14.00
1 'Mech Mortar/8 Rear 0 16 1 14.00
1 Rocket Launcher 10 (OS)Front 0 1 .50
1 Rocket Launcher 10 (OS)Left 0 1 .50
1 Rocket Launcher 10 (OS)Right 0 1 .50
1 Rocket Launcher 10 (OS)Rear 0 1 .50
--------------------------------------------------------
TOTALS: 0 11 100.00
Items & Tons Left: 14 .00

Calculated Factors:
Total Cost: 17,550,000 C-Bills
Battle Value 2: 989 (old BV = 545)
Cost per BV: 17,745.2
Weapon Value: 475 / 475 (Ratio = .48 / .48)
Damage Factors: SRDmg = 40; MRDmg = 29; LRDmg = 10
BattleForce2: MP: 3T, Armor/Structure: 0 / 8
Damage PB/M/L: 2/4/4, Overheat: 0
Class: GA; Point Value: 10

This is kind of a mobile turret, based on the same design sneaking up on it is a bit of a crapshoot:

Type/Model: Limpet-T (Omni) A
Tech: Inner Sphere / 3060
Config: Tracked Omni Vehicle
Rules: Level 3, Standard design

Mass: 100 tons
Power Plant: 300 Vlar XL Fusion
Cruise Speed: 32.4 km/h
Maximum Speed: 54.0 km/h
Armor Type: Standard
Armament:
2 Gauss Rifles
1 'Mech Mortar/2
4 SRM 4s
Manufacturer: (Unknown)
Location: (Unknown)
Communications System: (Unknown)
Targeting & Tracking System: (Unknown)

--------------------------------------------------------
Type/Model: Limpet-T (Omni) A
Mass: 100 tons

Equipment: Items Mass
Int. Struct.: 50 pts Standard 0 10.00
Engine: 300 XL Fusion 2 9.50
Shielding & Transmission Equipment: 0 5.00
Cruise MP: 3
Flank MP: 5
Heat Sinks: 10 Single 0 .00
Cockpit & Controls: 0 5.00
Crew: 7 Members 0 .00
Turret Equipment: 0 3.50
Armor Factor: 200 pts Standard 0 12.50

Internal Armor
Structure Value
Front: 10 40
Left / Right Sides: 10 40/40
Rear: 10 40
Turret: 10 40

Weapons and Equipment Loc Heat Ammo Items Mass
--------------------------------------------------------
2 Gauss Rifles Turret 0 8 3 31.00
1 'Mech Mortar/2 Turret 0 12 2 6.00
1 SRM 4 Front 0 25 2 3.00
1 SRM 4 Left 0 1 2.00
1 SRM 4 Right 0 1 2.00
1 SRM 4 Rear 0 1 2.00
1 Targeting Computer 1 8.00
1 C.A.S.E. Equipment Body 1 .50
--------------------------------------------------------
TOTALS: 0 14 100.00
Items & Tons Left: 11 .00

Calculated Factors:
Total Cost: 23,336,250 C-Bills
Battle Value 2: 1,669 (old BV = 1,182)
Cost per BV: 13,982.17
Weapon Value: 1,451 / 1,451 (Ratio = .87 / .87)
Damage Factors: SRDmg = 45; MRDmg = 28; LRDmg = 19
BattleForce2: MP: 3T, Armor/Structure: 0 / 8
Damage PB/M/L: 4/5/3, Overheat: 0
Class: GA; Point Value: 17
Specials: omni

My version of the mech on the front of Rifts World Book 5: Triax and the NGR

Type/Model: Dyna-Max
Tech: Inner Sphere / 3062
Config: Biped BattleMech
Rules: Level 3, Standard design

Mass: 75 tons
Chassis: Endo Steel
Power Plant: 300 Light Fusion
Walking Speed: 43.2 km/h
Maximum Speed: 64.8 km/h
Jump Jets: None
Jump Capacity: 0 meters
Armor Type: Light Ferro-Fibrous
Armament:
2 ER Small Lasers
1 Large Pulse Laser
2 Thunderbolt 10s
2 Light AC/5s
2 Rocket Launcher 10 (OS)s
2 Flamers
Manufacturer: (Unknown)
Location: (Unknown)
Communications System: (Unknown)
Targeting & Tracking System: (Unknown)

--------------------------------------------------------
Type/Model: Dyna-Max
Mass: 75 tons

Equipment: Crits Mass
Int. Struct.: 114 pts Endo Steel 14 4.00
(Endo Steel Loc: 4 LA, 4 RA, 3 LT, 2 RT, 1 CT)
Engine: 300 Light Fusion 10 14.50
Walking MP: 4
Running MP: 6
Jumping MP: 0
Heat Sinks: 10 Double [20] 0 .00
Gyro: 4 3.00
Cockpit, Life Supt., Sensors: 5 3.00
Actuators: L: Sh+UA+LA+H R: Sh+UA+LA+H 16 .00
Armor Factor: 195 pts Light Ferro-Fibrous 7 11.50
(Armor Crit Loc: 1 HD, 2 LA, 1 RA, 1 LT, 1 RT, 1 CT)

Internal Armor
Structure Value
Head: 3 9
Center Torso: 23 28
Center Torso (Rear): 10
L/R Side Torso: 16 20/20
L/R Side Torso (Rear): 7/7
L/R Arm: 12 20/20
L/R Leg: 16 27/27

Weapons and Equipment Loc Heat Ammo Crits Mass
--------------------------------------------------------
1 ER Small Laser RA 2 1 .50
1 Large Pulse Laser RA 10 2 7.00
1 ER Small Laser LA 2 1 .50
1 Thunderbolt 10 RT 5 12 4 9.00
(Ammo Locations: 1 LT, 1 RT)
1 Light AC/5 RT 1 20 3 6.00
(Ammo Locations: 1 RT)
1 Thunderbolt 10 LT 5 2 7.00
1 Light AC/5 LT 1 2 5.00
1 Rocket Launcher 10 (OS)LL 3 1 .50
1 Flamer LL 3 1 1.00
1 Rocket Launcher 10 (OS)RL 3 1 .50
1 Flamer RL 3 1 1.00
CASE Equipment: LT RT 2 1.00
--------------------------------------------------------
TOTALS: 32 77 75.00
Crits & Tons Left: 1 .00

Calculated Factors:
Total Cost: 13,102,250 C-Bills
Battle Value 2: 1,545 (old BV = 1,178)
Cost per BV2: 8,480.42
Weapon Value: 1,742 / 1,742 (Ratio = 1.13 / 1.13)
Damage Factors: SRDmg = 33; MRDmg = 26; LRDmg = 9
BattleForce2: MP: 4, Armor/Structure: 5/4
Damage PB/M/L: 3/3/1, Overheat: 2
Class: MH; Point Value: 15

I think I better stop now....

[Triaxx]

Huh. Towards the end there my group started to play almost exclusively with naked Mechs. (With no armor at all.) On the principle that A) we can use that space for heat sinks and be able to unload the entire arsenal at once without shutting down, or B) we can use that space for more weapons, close in and then deal with the heat shut down of weapon discharge later.

I suppose it was all started with the unarmored catapult. He stripped off all the armor to increase the weapon payload, and when he opened fire, lots of things died. Of course the when the Timber Wolf showed up behind him he didn't have any close defenses of his own and was shredded.