View Full Version : We hates them!!! (PEACH)

2006-06-12, 10:00 PM
Hatred [General]
Requirements: Must have a fued with another type of creature for at least one logical reason.
Benefits: You have a searing hatred for the selected creature type. Goblinoids or other groups do not count, it must be a specific species, such as Goblins, Hobgoblins, Red Dragons, Worgs, etc etc. You recieve a +2 bonus on all attack and damage rolls made against that creature. In addition, you recieve a +2 bonus against any fear incurring checks related to that species of monster. Also, you incurr a -1 penatly to all skills other than Intimidate related to social behavior regarding those creatures, and a -1 to your AC when in combat with them. The mindset of the hatred is subject to change by the DM (ex. you might be a kill-on-sight hater, discriminator, etc. etc.).
Special: You may take this feat many times, selecting a different type of monster each time. The effects of this feat CANNOT stack - meaning you can only hate something once. If you have taken this feat to hate something, you cannot ever take it again to hate that very same thing. This does not stack with a ranger's Favored Enemy ability.

PEACH, please.

2006-06-12, 10:02 PM
This is a bit unbalanced. It takes a class featuer that occurs at first then every fifth level and offers it every third level. Not only that but it is better then favored enemy.

On the other hand it is more limited, so I guess it could be balanced. It would be so incredibly unbalanced if somone made a misanthrope with human as the enemy.

2006-06-12, 10:26 PM
A good DM probably wouldn't allow the player with Hatred to have many feuds. It just doesn't seem possible. Pretty balanced, it takes up a feat, which seems fair.

2006-06-12, 10:31 PM
You need to specify it a little better. Is the damage similar to the Ranger's bonus damage, and therefore precision based? Or is it more like Weapon Specialisation?

The other thing is that what it does is nerf Rangers. Imagine a fighter who takes that feat at levels 1,3,6,9 etc. and uses his other feats to buy his weapon bonus feats.

Now in straight combat, the Fighter gets the bonuses that the ranger gets, and more.

Maybe if you reduced it to a +1 bonus it would be ok.

2006-06-12, 10:34 PM
Thanks for the feedback - keep it comin!

OP Modified.

2006-06-12, 10:42 PM
I think what you might want to do instead is use a mechanic similar to the barbarian rage, but have it only work against specific creature types. Thus you get the concept of hatred being a powerful overwhelming emotion, without stepping on the toes of the ranger.

2006-06-12, 10:42 PM
Looks good now, the not stacking seems like the last bit of nerfing you need to do. I like it.

2006-06-12, 10:44 PM
What, so when you take damage from your hated foe, you rage?

Okay with me, as long as the duration is less than that of the Barbarian, something more like 2+Con mod.

2006-06-12, 10:48 PM
since when is anyone's hatred a logical one. I'd loose the logical bit from the prereq.

Pop Goes the Weasel
2006-06-13, 12:09 AM
since when is anyone's hatred a logical one. I'd loose the logical bit from the prereq.
It means you have to hate them for a reason. It exists to prevent someone from arbitrarily deciding he hates something. Otherwise, powergamers could seriously abouse this feat.

2006-06-13, 12:43 AM
How about some drawback to it? Like you recieve a -2 on a social checks regarding the creature of your hatred.

2006-06-13, 12:44 AM
There are plenty of logical reasons to hate things, as well as plenty of illogical. Usually for an emotion to be really strong, it needs to be founded on something. The "logical reason" really should stay, not just for fluff, but because it does limit the power of the feat to keep it in line with others. Not to mention that fact that it isn't too hard to come up with a logical reason, even for things you never met before.

2006-06-13, 01:30 AM
Yeah, like a reason to hate them would be that they killed your family in front of you, or betrayed your village and burned it down, or whatever. As long as it's logical. I thought it was clear enough that they dont stack, oh well.

2006-06-13, 01:37 AM
I'd say you can only take this feat once. I mean, if you really, really hate a certain type of creature that much, how can you also hate another type of creature with the same zeal? It's like, dedicate yourself to killing one creature at a time, sir!

I mean, sure I can train myself to kill hobgoblins AND bugbears, but why in the world would it matter? I mean, did they both kill members of my family? I can see this being more of a single-sighted hatred. For example, the Hobgoblin warchief sent his warriors to kill my family, so even though there were bugbears killing them too, all my hatred goes towards that single warchief, and thus I train to kill him, over and over. Except, he's not both a bugbear and a hobgoblin - just a hobgoblin.

What I'm saying is, although it's possible, it's quite unlikely for someone to have a large hatred for multiple things and be able to train themselves to such a great detail. I mean, the training would take a great deal of time. Granted, it fits quite in with my "dude who wants all orcs dead" thing. I just give my ranger this feat and Huzzah!

2006-06-13, 06:30 AM
I can't think of a good word for this. How obsessive is this hatred?

Is it going to dictate the movements of the character or is it more like the favoured enemy?

What I mean is - does the hater have to hunt down and slaughter the object of his hatred or is it more like a casual bonus to damage whenever you meet 1?

Can a hater take prisoners of the hated foe or will he have to cut their throats behind the paladin's back?

2006-06-13, 07:14 AM
I might add something in the way of a -1 AC with that. Character either flys into a blind rage whenever coming up against the object of his hatred, or maybe is willing to take extra risks just to "get back at" the offending party. Sort of a "whatever it takes, I'm gonna make you pay" mentality.

2006-06-13, 10:01 AM
Would this stack with a Ranger's Favored Enemy?

2006-06-13, 12:01 PM
Imagine if a Party member was a member of the Hated Race! ztension alert!

2006-06-13, 01:21 PM
All very good points... modifying post soon, keep it coming :P

2006-08-25, 03:53 PM
One modification I'd throw in - leaving it to the DM is all well and good, but some people have trouble saying 'no' to Haul style gamers, so I'd rather some of the munchkin-balance be hardcoded:

A character who takes Hatred is generally incapable of dealing with his most hated foes; a will save (DC 12+1 per hated foe beyond the first) is necessary to avoid attacking on sight.

Not too tough to beat the DC, even for a fighter-class, except when surrounded - and there's no way a character with a pathological hatred of a given race should be surrendering willingly. Time enough to surrender when he's hauled down by 8 of them and beaten senseless.

It would offer a hint of social balance to control power-gamers, and differentiate it a bit more from the Favored Enemy feature. Nice job overall though, and with the penalties a ranger's still superior in most respects, as he should be.

As a side note, 'you incurr a penatly' should read 'you incur a penalty' :)