View Full Version : What level spell should this be?

2009-04-18, 01:14 PM
Summon Aspirin
V. S.
Sor/Wiz ?, Brd ?
Casting Time: 1 standard action
Duration: Instantaneous

Summons a bottle of Aspirin in your hands. The bottle contains 24 aspirin tablets. The bottle acts like a potion, except the contents are not lost if broken.

2 Aspirin tablets: +1 temporary bonus to HP
Duration: 1 hour + 1 hour/CON mod. Taking more than 2 resets the duration.
Special: Taking more than 2 Aspirin tablets resets the duration. Max temporary HP obtained from Aspirin is 1.

Now, me and another poster here are debating what level this should be. I thought that I would post it here for a second, third, and maybe fourth opinions. I don't wish to say what levels we are thinking, as I would like an objective answer.
Also, if there are any improvements that could be made, please tell.

2009-04-18, 02:12 PM
On the one hand, +1 temporary HP isn't much to write home about (there are cantrips that do that). On the other hand, since the spell is instantaneous, you could stock up on a lot of aspirin during downtime between adventures, so the net effect is basically that just knowing this spell means that you always have 1 temporary HP. Given that you can benefit from this on an adventure without using spell slots on it, I'd make it level 2 or 3, at least, maybe even 4.

Innis Cabal
2009-04-18, 02:29 PM
1st level easy. This is no better then most cantrips. No one would take this as a 4th level spell.

2009-04-18, 02:29 PM
Summoning spells don't make things, they just teleport them to where you are, and back later. Given that this spell is instantaneous, they won't get them back, and you're stealing an aspirin every time you cast the spell. As such, lawful adventurers would probably save them for emergencies. But there's still the problem that they can be cast whenever you want, so making it a 5th level spell would just mean that you need to be able to cast 5th level spells to have them. You should probably either give it a duration, or give the aspirin an expiration date.

2009-04-18, 03:37 PM
Alright, say the bottle lasts 1 hour/caster level.

2009-04-18, 05:58 PM
2nd, but ONLY because there are 24 pills in the bottle, which is a noticable amount.

2009-04-18, 06:36 PM
Silly spell, but the analysis might be interesting. I'd start by comparing to Goodberry (Druid 1). Goodberry provides 2d4 - on average, 5 berries, so it would take about 5 castings to get 25 aspirin. Depending on how you feel about it, call that a 2nd-level or 3rd-level effect. We'll go with 3rd to be on the safe side.

Two other aspects of the spell are troubling- unlimited duration (until used) and freeness. Free temporary hit points ... not a good thing. If a player were bringing this into my game, I'd disallow it, but since I'm asked 'how would I level it' as opposed to would I permit it, I'm going to up the spell by another level for unlimited duration and free.

So that brings us to a third or fourth level spell (depending on your opinion in step one). With a 24-hour duration, I'd probably be comfortable with this as a third-level spell. Without, I think I'd set it at fourth, and see how it works out in game.



Zeta Kai
2009-04-18, 07:21 PM
IMHO, I'd say Brd 2, Sor/Wis 3. If it were re-fluffed to not mention modern pharmaceuticals, I'd let Druids get it at 2nd level, as well.

2009-04-18, 09:11 PM
Um... can I point something out?

Yes you can get a huge supply of Asprin and they will store up. However, at best, that basically means you have a contiual Temp Hp which is functionally similair to DR 1/ -.(Cause u regain the temp HP each time you lose it)

At level 1 sure 1 hp per attack will matter, but at any higher level it becames more and more irrelevant. By level 5, it means nothing. That's a tiny percentage of even a wizard's HP and really won't change a life or death thing.

At level 1, compare to mage armor. On average is +4 AC or Dr 1/- going to be better? I'd argue Mage Armor in terms of strength, but since the Asprins won't actually use up a spell slot the day you cast them, they are superior.

However, as a 3rd level spell, it's irrelevant. A 5th Level Wizard will have fly, mirror image, invisability. He doesn't need Dr 1. For a fighter it's just too little damage to matter.

And all of this assumes you have a large amoutn downtime to make pills.

With all that in mind, 2nd level is DEFINATLEY correct. Above 2nd and it's irrelevant. Without the unlimited duration (uses up a slot day-of) 1st easily.

2009-04-18, 09:28 PM
What action is it to take the Aspirin tablets? If it's standard, this is a cantrip, MAYBE first level spell, because it's better than Virtue. As a swift action, first, maybe second. That's it. This is worse than Lesser Vigor in almost every way. It's like a 2 PP Psionic Vigor. Woohoo.

2009-04-18, 10:44 PM
Standard action to use the aspirin.

FYI, the user can only ever get 1 temporary hp, no matter the amount of aspirin taken.

2009-04-18, 10:57 PM
Alright, say the bottle lasts 1 hour/caster level. With them lasting for 1 hour per caster level, it's definitely 1st level. It's clearly better than Virtue, so not a cantrip, but it's not really any better than any other 1st-level spells.

2009-04-18, 11:26 PM
What action is it to take the Aspirin tablets? If it's standard, this is a cantrip, MAYBE first level spell, because it's better than Virtue. As a swift action, first, maybe second. That's it. This is worse than Lesser Vigor in almost every way. It's like a 2 PP Psionic Vigor. Woohoo.

... x24 :smallamused:

2009-04-19, 07:39 PM
x12, you need to take 2 to get the 1 temp HP.

And this is basically an extended version of Virtue, a 0-level spell. I'd say 1st level, although the high duration might actually bring it up to a 2nd level spell. It's rather useless at 2nd level, though.

Now we just wait for some epic-level sorcerer to kill someone by burying them under pill bottles. :smallamused:

2009-04-19, 09:01 PM
Though it does produce 12 uses, where as Goodberry only produces an average of 5, multiple goodberries will heal multiple times within a short period.

Where as, if I'm understanding this spell right, you can't gain an additional hp from Summon Aspirin until the duration expires, which means its only true benefit is increasing your hp above your maximum.

Level 1, for sure, in my opinion.

And I'm with DanielLC, its not a summoning spell because its instantenous. I would call it a Conjuration spell.

EDIT: just realized casting time change...

Baron Corm
2009-04-19, 09:35 PM
If you made it 2nd level, you're up against bear's endurance, which is +2 "temporary hp" per HD. At 0th level, you have virtue. So I don't see anywhere it could go other than 1st. Even at 1st, though, I would never take it. 1 hp rarely matters.

2009-04-21, 11:22 AM
level 1 without a doubt, but i would ask my dm if it could be an herb rather then a pill, i think i would take it flavorwise depending on what im playing, because optimization ruins the fun of the game =)

2009-04-21, 04:19 PM
Thank you all very much for the advice.

If you're curious, Randomizer wrote most of the spell up, then me and another person tried touching it up. He writes/draws the Well That Was Unexpected (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=68295) webcomic.