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Warclam
2009-04-19, 03:37 PM
Title says it all, really. I have a Knowledge Devotion wizard and I'd like to be able to take 10 on my Knowledge checks in combat. Anyone know a way to do this? Feat, PrC, Item, Spell?

Fiery Diamond
2009-04-19, 03:46 PM
I dunno...is there anything that mimics that ability that rogues get? Couldn't you take ten with that ability? Or does it not work that way...?

monty
2009-04-19, 03:57 PM
Exemplar, if you don't mind the caster level hit. I don't remember the requirements offhand, though, so you may have trouble qualifying for it.

Chronos
2009-04-19, 04:37 PM
Exemplar's pretty easy to qualify for. You need 6 ranks in Diplomacy, 13 ranks in any skill at all, and any Skill Focus feat at all. Given how many other PrCs require a Skill Focus feat, you're likely to have that anyway, and everyone has some skill or another that they're maxing out (probably Spellcraft and a bunch of Knowledges, for you), so it's basically just those Diplomacy ranks, and you'll qualify at level 10.

It seems to me, though, that there's something else that works specifically for all knowledge skills...

Ah, found it, but it's a cleric alternate class feature, not a feat. Improved domain (gives you one domain instead of 2, but a greater effect from it).

Warclam
2009-04-19, 04:57 PM
Mhm, I found Exemplar, but I'm not fond of losing a caster level, and those 12 skill points (cross-class) in diplomacy would be a big bite into my knowledges. Thanks, though.

Hmm... anyone know a price guideline for turning a class feature into an item?

Draz74
2009-04-19, 07:28 PM
Just find a way to boost all your Knowledge checks by an additional +9, so that if you roll a 1, it's still like Taking 10. :smalltongue:

Edit: By the way, I have to say, a 1-level dip in Dragonfire Adept is ridiculously tempting for Knowledge Devotion builds, just to get the Draconic Knowledge invocation. +6 to all Knowledge skills.

streakster
2009-04-19, 07:47 PM
Edit: By the way, I have to say, a 1-level dip in Dragonfire Adept is ridiculously tempting for Knowledge Devotion builds, just to get the Draconic Knowledge invocation. +6 to all Knowledge skills.

Plus, it comes with flaming breath. What's not to love?

Warclam
2009-04-19, 08:14 PM
Just find a way to boost all your Knowledge checks by an additional +9, so that if you roll a 1, it's still like Taking 10. :smalltongue:

Edit: By the way, I have to say, a 1-level dip in Dragonfire Adept is ridiculously tempting for Knowledge Devotion builds, just to get the Draconic Knowledge invocation. +6 to all Knowledge skills.

Yeah, except we're using this looney variant where 20 on a skill check becomes 30, and 1 becomes -10. If you've got a way for me to get +20 on my knowledge checks, please share! :smalltongue:

I'll look into the adept, though, that sounds like it might be interesting.

lsfreak
2009-04-19, 08:24 PM
Yeah, except we're using this looney variant where 20 on a skill check becomes 30, and 1 becomes -10. If you've got a way for me to get +20 on my knowledge checks, please share! :smalltongue:

I'll look into the adept, though, that sounds like it might be interesting.
Just pointing out that the regular variant for that is only for things that can automatically succeed or fail on 1's and 20's; skill checks isn't one of those. Not so say you're wrong, just making sure the houserule you're using applies to all rolls and not just attacks and saves.

Thurbane
2009-04-19, 09:08 PM
Not exactly what the OP was asking, but if you are a Gnome (or can become one?) you can take the Trivial Knowledge feat from RoS that allows you two rolls for all Knowledge skill and Bardic Knowledge checks...

Nohwl
2009-04-19, 09:46 PM
the skill trick collector of stories might help you. item familiar probably won't, but i'll mention it anyway.

Warclam
2009-04-19, 09:54 PM
Just pointing out that the regular variant for that is only for things that can automatically succeed or fail on 1's and 20's; skill checks isn't one of those. Not so say you're wrong, just making sure the houserule you're using applies to all rolls and not just attacks and saves.

Good question, but the houserule is for skill checks. The DM likes his crazy random rolls. We also have the ability to score a critical threat while rolling to confirm a critical hit, which can net you an interesting thing called a double-critical (or more!). Our dwarf fighter got pulped that way.

And no, I'm an elf, not a gnome, and Collector of Stories has been specifically ruled not to work for Knowledge Devotion. :smallfrown:

EDIT: Good news! I've just remembered that we're allowed to create our own prestige classes, as long as we don't go nuts inventing totally new abilities. I think I know the first ability that's going in.... :wink:

I like the suggestion of item familiars, maybe I'll make something that involves making your spellbook your item familiar...? Whatever I end up with, I'll post it in the homebrew section and put a link here, in case anyone else wants to see it. Thanks for your help, everyone!

Myrmex
2009-04-19, 11:32 PM
Item familiar will net you a poop-ton of +Knowledge: Know Things.

Lerky
2009-04-19, 11:38 PM
The PH says you can't re-roll a Knowledge check. Either you know it or you don't. So I'm gonna say no you can't, but I think maybe some exceptions can be made...I don't see what though:smalltongue:

BlueWizard
2009-04-20, 11:14 PM
What's wrong with rolling?

Sstoopidtallkid
2009-04-20, 11:17 PM
What's wrong with rolling?Knowledge Devotion. My guess is that he would rather avoid the risk of a low bonus during important combats, even if that means he doesn't get a high one.

Draz74
2009-04-21, 02:02 AM
Plus, it comes with flaming breath. What's not to love?
Losing a caster level. :smallsigh:


Yeah, except we're using this looney variant where 20 on a skill check becomes 30, and 1 becomes -10. If you've got a way for me to get +20 on my knowledge checks, please share! :smalltongue:
Ugh, yeah, that makes things trickier. You might just have to risk it.


and Collector of Stories has been specifically ruled not to work for Knowledge Devotion. :smallfrown:
Good ... I'm pretty sure that wasn't the intent of Collector of Stories, and it makes Knowledge Devotion builds too good.


The PH says you can't re-roll a Knowledge check. Either you know it or you don't. So I'm gonna say no you can't, but I think maybe some exceptions can be made...I don't see what though:smalltongue:

"Rerolls" are different from "Trying again." They sound like they would be the same thing, but they're actually distinct game mechanics.

BlueWizard
2009-04-21, 06:02 AM
But, rolling makes it the game. Take ten and 20 in some instances is bull crap.

Warclam
2009-04-21, 07:31 AM
Actually, checks that can't be rerolled only preclude taking 20. Taking 10 is just settling for an average result. In fact, you can take 10 on knowledge checks not made in stressful situation (ie. combat), though not Bardic Knowledge or the like since it specifically says you can't. I want to be able to do it under duress as well, since the difference between -10 and 10 can be the difference between a +2 bonus and a +5 bonus (or +1 and +4).

...Of course it wouldn't do me much good right now, since I can only score above a +2 using a natural 20 (automatic +5, under the variant and with my Int mod). Once I get some more knowledge ranks under my belt, though....