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View Full Version : Swarm of Dancing Daggers; Plausible?



Arachu
2009-05-04, 06:27 PM
This actually roots back to the first time I read the description of a Dancing (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicItems/magicWeapons.htm#speed)weapon.

Dancing weapons hover around you, attacking nearby things. However, the SRD says nothing about the effect not stacking. So, being me, I immediately thought "I must get about 10 Dancing Daggers".

I was wondering if such an effect even makes sense (I'm the DM, but I control an NPC who adventures with the party (who only has one other member)). I can see it happening, but would it be too powerful?

(Personally, I like the idea of protecting my Gnome better :smallbiggrin:)

BladeOFGrass
2009-05-04, 06:46 PM
Not very possible.

A dancing weapon dances for four rounds, you can loose one as a standard action.

If you manage to get yourself two standard actions a round, you can release eight daggers before two of them become inert.

Perhaps, coming up with a way to copy the item like a spell from the Shadow Conjuration school?

Edit - It occurs to me that the sheer amount of gold alone, would make your PCs very envious. The Pet NPC walking around with 10 +4 items would make anyone a bit peeved unless they had equal wealth. And, if they had equal wealth, I'd assume your campaign was super-high powered or screwed.

Arachu
2009-05-04, 07:04 PM
... This is a good point...

Well, I was actually thinking something more along the lines of wearing them on a belt, and pulling the rope holding them all up.

What? It also doesn't say how you should drop them :smalltongue:

... You know, the way it's worded, if you dropped a dancing weapon, it would start jerking about immediately (which suggests a mental component anyway).

Plus, there is only two of us (Gnome Wizard and Half-Dragon (Human) Fighter/Sorcerer). And, to be fair, the PC's pretty strong (though, not a four-man team; I gave him Spiked Full-Plate at 2nd level, and we had to gang up on a Choker... (hey, we are only two people :smalltongue:))


P.S. Considering his starting equipment vs. mine, I'd probably get away with it :smalltongue:

Zaq
2009-05-04, 07:17 PM
I think the closest you're going to get easily is the Cloud of Knives spell, which I believe is from PHB2.

Hmm, I wonder, what would happen if you cast Cloud of Knives twice? Would you just reset the duration, or would you create a second separate cloud of knives? If the latter, could you fire two knives as a free action (well, as two separate free actions?) Hmmm. This deserves more consideration. I mean, we all know bonuses and such don't stack, but Cloud of Knives is a conjuration effect, and it's not like you can only have one summoned monster at once, right?

If they do stack, well, the concept of a high-level wizard casting Time Stop and then letting loose around eight or nine Clouds of Knives (with judicious use of Quicken, naturally) makes me smile. A horrible waste of a Time Stop, sure, but an awesome waste of a Time Stop. Just imagine it from the perspective of another character. Let's assume we have 4 rounds of time stop and are caster level 17... we use a quickened Cloud of Knives on the turn we cast the Time Stop, and two per Time Stop round (one natural, one quickened), for a total of 9x17=153 daggers suddenly springing into existence, nine of them being flung this way and that as free actions every round. Not exactly overpowered by any stretch of the imagination, but quite awesome.

Huh. This went off in its own little direction in a hurry, didn't it?

quick_comment
2009-05-04, 08:07 PM
Forget dancing weapons, pay a wizard to animate them. (Or shell out the cash for the +6 epic enhancement, everdancing....)

Sstoopidtallkid
2009-05-04, 10:35 PM
I think the closest you're going to get easily is the Cloud of Knives spell, which I believe is from PHB2.

Hmm, I wonder, what would happen if you cast Cloud of Knives twice? Would you just reset the duration, or would you create a second separate cloud of knives? If the latter, could you fire two knives as a free action (well, as two separate free actions?) Hmmm. This deserves more consideration. I mean, we all know bonuses and such don't stack, but Cloud of Knives is a conjuration effect, and it's not like you can only have one summoned monster at once, right?

If they do stack, well, the concept of a high-level wizard casting Time Stop and then letting loose around eight or nine Clouds of Knives (with judicious use of Quicken, naturally) makes me smile. A horrible waste of a Time Stop, sure, but an awesome waste of a Time Stop. Just imagine it from the perspective of another character. Let's assume we have 4 rounds of time stop and are caster level 17... we use a quickened Cloud of Knives on the turn we cast the Time Stop, and two per Time Stop round (one natural, one quickened), for a total of 9x17=153 daggers suddenly springing into existence, nine of them being flung this way and that as free actions every round. Not exactly overpowered by any stretch of the imagination, but quite awesome.

Huh. This went off in its own little direction in a hurry, didn't it? Am I the only one whose immediate thought was 'LIVING CLOUD OF KNIVES!' ?

Yukitsu
2009-05-04, 11:00 PM
No, I thought of this. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qbArvIqZzkI

Olo Demonsbane
2009-05-04, 11:17 PM
I think the closest you're going to get easily is the Cloud of Knives spell, which I believe is from PHB2.

Hmm, I wonder, what would happen if you cast Cloud of Knives twice? Would you just reset the duration, or would you create a second separate cloud of knives? If the latter, could you fire two knives as a free action (well, as two separate free actions?) Hmmm. This deserves more consideration. I mean, we all know bonuses and such don't stack, but Cloud of Knives is a conjuration effect, and it's not like you can only have one summoned monster at once, right?

If they do stack, well, the concept of a high-level wizard casting Time Stop and then letting loose around eight or nine Clouds of Knives (with judicious use of Quicken, naturally) makes me smile. A horrible waste of a Time Stop, sure, but an awesome waste of a Time Stop. Just imagine it from the perspective of another character. Let's assume we have 4 rounds of time stop and are caster level 17... we use a quickened Cloud of Knives on the turn we cast the Time Stop, and two per Time Stop round (one natural, one quickened), for a total of 9x17=153 daggers suddenly springing into existence, nine of them being flung this way and that as free actions every round. Not exactly overpowered by any stretch of the imagination, but quite awesome.

Huh. This went off in its own little direction in a hurry, didn't it?

Oh, my god. Oh, my god. I am having an Epic Spell Idea. Breathe...Breathe...Happyplace...Happyplace.

Zaq
2009-05-05, 12:00 AM
Oh, my god. Oh, my god. I am having an Epic Spell Idea. Breathe...Breathe...Happyplace...Happyplace.

Care to share?

Personally I'm imagining it something like Grant's super move from Castlevania: Judgment (or as I prefer to call it, "Soul Calibur: Castlevania Edition"), but hey, reflavor as necessary.

I wonder, how many daggers does it take to make a cloud dense enough to grant concealment? (My guess: Roughly the same number as it takes licks to get to the center of a Tootsie Pop.)

Arachu
2009-05-05, 05:46 AM
Hey, could you cast an Enlarge spell on a Dancing weapon? :belkar:

As for the Cloud thing... Win. And I don't even say 'win'. :smalltongue:


... giant dancing shortspear!

Olo Demonsbane
2009-05-05, 08:35 AM
Care to share?

Personally I'm imagining it something like Grant's super move from Castlevania: Judgment (or as I prefer to call it, "Soul Calibur: Castlevania Edition"), but hey, reflavor as necessary.

I wonder, how many daggers does it take to make a cloud dense enough to grant concealment? (My guess: Roughly the same number as it takes licks to get to the center of a Tootsie Pop.)

1 :smallbiggrin:

Allright, Im AFB right now, but Ill try to articulate it...

Take the Cloud of Vermin Spell. Add in Transform and Animate to make them flying daggers, and Creation to keep replenishing them.

Now you have the Ultimate SWARM O' FLYIN DAGGERS!

MickJay
2009-05-05, 02:24 PM
If we're talking about swarms of sharp, flying objects, then perhaps modifying Blade Barrier would be easier...

Olo Demonsbane
2009-05-05, 03:17 PM
With Blade Barrier you can't do 1000d4 damage in one turn :)

MickJay
2009-05-05, 04:19 PM
The key word here is modify :smalltongue: one dancing dagger won't do much, either. Take your Blade Barrier spell, extend its duration and size, give it mobility, add some d6s, put the blades on fire, then let it cut down all your enemies in its path, or make its blades strike at the same target again, and again, and again...

ShneekeyTheLost
2009-05-05, 06:10 PM
Epic Spell: Dagger Swarm
Seeds: Conjure and Animate
DC: 66
Duration: 20 rounds

This spell summons a cloud of 100 knives and causes them to attack a specified target. Each round, each of the knives makes one attack. They have the same stats as a Tiny Animated Object.

Sstoopidtallkid
2009-05-05, 07:44 PM
It shouldn't be hard to stat up a Cloud of Knives [Construct] [Swarm] that flies around dealing xd4 per round to anyone in the area and causing bleeding.