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Surfing HalfOrc
2009-05-13, 07:30 AM
OK, I was digging through some of my OLD D&D stuff when I stumbled upon a copy of Thunderdelve Mountain, a solo module for the old Basic/Expert D&D game. My son (age 8) wants to play it, but he want to play it with daddy. The module says player characters need to be at around levels 7-9 to play 3-4 characters, and levels 4-6 to play 5-8 characters.

I looked over the encounters, and at those levels you would be seriously outgunning the NPCs and monsters, except possibly for the final beastie.

As a solo adventure, the character needs to be level 7-9 (also a bit overpowered, but it's a long slog...), and the adventure is written around a dwarf fighter.

What do you folks think the character level should be for a three member party with a dwarf fighter, an archer type rogue, and either an elf magic-user/fighter, or a regular magic user, (or a cleric)? I was thinking about level 3-4 at most, or maybe have the fighter and rogue being 4th level, and the elf 2nd or 3rd.

And has anyone ever stumbled across a 3.x update to this module? I could run with that just as easily...

Thanks for any advice.

Riffington
2009-05-13, 07:51 AM
Is this his first game? If so, and he's eight, I wouldn't worry too much about it being too easy.

Also, consider the idea of doing it as the solo adventure (assuming it's just you and him, and you don't have his friends interested). In a solo adventure, it'll be easier for him to roleplay and get used to that aspect of the game- with three characters, he'll be more likely to see them as just pieces instead of people.

/started with Keep on the Borderlands
//my uncle had a pattern in the modules he wrote: of every set of potions, exactly one would be poison.

Surfing HalfOrc
2009-05-13, 12:00 PM
Here's some more information, probably useful to any 3.x gurus for calculating the adventure's overall CR and general difficulty.

Rogue 1
Rogue 2
Giant Black Widow Spider (HD 3)
Horse (HD 2)
3 Rogues-Lvl 2
Rogue 2
Ogre (HD 4+1)
4 Wolves (2+2)
Fighter 6
20 Goblins- (HD 1-1) Behind a bottleneck. Can only fight 2 at a time.
Goblin Fighter 1
Bear (Chained up) (HD 6_
Rogue 2
5 Rogues-Lvl 2
4 Rogues-Lvl 1
Gargoyle (HD 4)
3 Shadows (HD 2+2)
Wraith (HD4)
2 Vapor Ghouls (HD 3)
4 Red Worms (HD 2+2)
Dwarf Fighter 6
2 Giant Bats (HD 2)
24 Toy Soldiers (HD 3)
Rock Python (HD 5)
Fyrnaca (HD 10)

(The HD is based on the old BX D&D Rule set.)

Has anybody ever seen this module converted to 3.x? I did a quick search from home last night, but I was really sleepy and may have missed the obvious. I have both Basic and Expert Rule sets, plus Labryinth Lord. My son has played a bit in both rule sets, but mostly counts on me to know what the dice mean once they are rolled.

Another_Poet
2009-05-14, 12:11 PM
I agree, use the suggested levels and let it be easy. Go with Level 8.

Right before the big bad guy, let him level to 9 whether he's earned the XP or not. Unless he is the rules lawyer kind of 8 year old (I've met them...) and will call you on it, then let him go by the numbers.

I've never seen a 3.x conversion but there is a large collection of 1st/2nd ed monsters converted to 3.0/3.5 online. I can't recall the site but a little searching should find it for you. Most of the monsters listed are already in the 3.5 MM but the toy soldiers, vapour ghouls, red worms, and fyrnaca (?) I think you may need to search online or convert yourself.

Frankly I think it would take less time for you to just brush up on 1st ed rules (especially if there are traps in that module in addition to the monsters you listed, which there should be). He can just roll the dice and tell you the result and you can look at the THAC0 table to tell him if he hits. Old editions have a different feel that I think is great for building nostalgic memories about the fantasy genre, so let him try it.

Overcoming all that in a solo adventure with dad, as a dwarf fighter nonetheless... That will be a warm fuzzy for years to come. He'll still daydream about that every so often when he's in an office building at age 30. Good times.


edit: regarding the overall CR/EL, if it were 3.5 it all depends on how spaced out the encounters are. Most of the monsters listed, until the boss at least, aren't more than CR 4 (or EL 4 for the groups). The boss is probably CR 9-11ish depending on abilities. But if you encounter a lot of these things back-to-back with no healing time in between, or if there is no way to leave and spend the night halfway through, this could be a very touh module. It all depends on pacing.

Surfing HalfOrc
2009-05-14, 12:41 PM
Yeah, but he likes low level characters. He enjoys adding a bit at a time rather than starting out with a whole bunch of options, and getting confused on what he should take next.

I have the rule set for Basic and Expert Rules (Tom Moldvey and David Cook), and Labyrith Lord, so we're good to go there.

Another_Poet
2009-05-14, 03:12 PM
Well, if the monsters listed are similar in power level in 1st ed to what they are like in 3.5 then 5th-6th level characters could take the dungeon depending on how fast and furious the encounters are. They'll need to level a bit before reaching the end though. I would be sure to provide a cleric as one of secondary characters.

Surfing HalfOrc
2009-05-14, 04:11 PM
I was planning on having either a MU or a cleric, and I'm leaning more towards the cleric right now...

I'm also wondering about the equipment list. 3.X was very good for suggesting what equipment and goodies characters "should" have at what level, but 1st Ed and BX D&D wasn't as clear. I'm thinking either one magic weapon, or piece of armor, plus assorted semi-useful items.

Matthew
2009-05-14, 04:29 PM
If you are going with level eight magician or cleric for a solo adventure then you can probably afford to be quite generous with magical items. Probably three or four permanent items would not be out of the question, judging by the tournament characters in various modules. For example, the level nine magician in Against the Giants has:

wand of frost (20 charges), cloak of protection +2, ring of protection +3, scroll (shield, phantasmal force, web, passwall), potion of healing, 2 potions of extra healing

Surfing HalfOrc
2009-05-14, 07:25 PM
If you are going with level eight magician or cleric for a solo adventure then you can probably afford to be quite generous with magical items. Probably three or four permanent items would not be out of the question, judging by the tournament characters in various modules. For example, the level nine magician in Against the Giants has:

wand of frost (20 charges), cloak of protection +2, ring of protection +3, scroll (shield, phantasmal force, web, passwall), potion of healing, 2 potions of extra healing

I'm not soling this dungeon, I'm trying with a mixed and balanced party. I've kicked it around one some 1st Ed groups I'm a member of, and it seems like 3 characters of levels 3-5 should be able to take on this dungeon without too much trouble. I may bump to 4-6 since this is my son's second adventure, and I want him to both "win" and have fun. It's no fun to just roll over the module, but it's also not much fun to keep writing up character sheets!

I'll probably have him get his friends together and take on "The Lost City." That's a cool adventure, with a cool "Boss" monster at the very end.

Matthew
2009-05-14, 07:38 PM
I'm not soling this dungeon, I'm trying with a mixed and balanced party.

I did not mean that you were, but it looks like I picked up from Riffington's post that you were playing "one on one".



I've kicked it around one some 1st Ed groups I'm a member of, and it seems like 3 characters of levels 3-5 should be able to take on this dungeon without too much trouble. I may bump to 4-6 since this is my son's second adventure, and I want him to both "win" and have fun. It's no fun to just roll over the module, but it's also not much fun to keep writing up character sheets!

I'll probably have him get his friends together and take on "The Lost City." That's a cool adventure, with a cool "Boss" monster at the very end.

The magic item list would still apply, as it was only an example of what a level nine magician might have in a tournament module . That said, the [i]Lost City is a perfectly fun module as well.

Charity
2009-05-15, 03:08 AM
psst thats not the edit button Matt

:smalltongue:

Matthew
2009-05-15, 06:55 AM
I am sure I do not know to what you are referring. :smallbiggrin:

ken-do-nim
2009-05-15, 10:38 AM
Ah, Thunderdelve, one of the few modules I don't own. I didn't realize it presented a non-solo option. Pretty cool. Enjoy it, and if you ever want to pass it on when you are done with it... :)