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Oslecamo
2009-05-15, 05:08 AM
Why am I writing this guide?-Introduction

I see a LOT of optimization guides for D&D out there to all kind of classes and character concepts. But problem is, they're mostly for the players.

This puts many poor DMs at a corner where they can't properly challenge the party combat wise against those characters in crack, wich is bad.

Of course, the DM could just ban/overrule stuff to make the PCs go back to sane levels again, but then the players would probably be annoyed, perhaps even come crying to net boards for help or, worst of all, start throwing net-spawned arguments whitout any actual basis at the DM. Wich will probably lead to pointless dicussions and hate wich is worst.

Besides that, it's also important for the DM to properly challenge the players with new and interesting monsters with new and interesting tactics and abilities.

So I sit down to write this thread where DMs can come seek ideas and inspiration for making their players remember the "dragons" part of D&D, all while staying whitin RAW.

Here's what I plan to do in this guide for now:
1-Monster crunch
1A-Feats and skills
1B-Templates
1B-Advancing monsters HD
1D-Adding levels
1E-Items and treasure

2-Monster life
2A-How do the monsters and players meet.
2B-Monster groups and organizations
2C-Terrain and traps
2D-Monster tactics and mentality
2E-Solo Bosses

3-Examples

Disclaimer about CR:

I'm perfectly aware that the CR system is really wonky for determining a monster's power level, if there's even such thing. Fact is, a monster's challenge to the party is also heavily based on the tactics it uses, the conditions in wich it's fighting, other monster allies it has, the party itself and several other details. And when we start messing with feats and templates and advancing HDs more nasty stuff can happen. But, CR it's all we have to try to measure all of this by RAW.

So, my best advice on the matter is to try to stick to CR but also take some responsability and check out the final numbers yourself to see if what you're gonna throw to the party is too strong or too weack for them.




Monster crunch

Feats and skills

Monsters really suck at picking their feats. The tarrasque picks toughness. Multiple times. While the party is doing those uber feat chains.

But remember, you can change your monster feats! This alone can greatly improve a monster's power and fun factor for both the DM and the party and is quite simple to do. Here are some sugestions:


Core feats
"Nom nom nom"

Improved iniative-if the monsters all act after the party, well, they're pretty much screwed. Players will normally improve their own iniative, so this feat helps the monsters keep up and at least no be caught flat-footed by the party's rogue.

Combat reflexes:A must for monsters with big reaches and a positive dex score.


Combat expertise:Many monsters have huge attack bonuses but really low AC, specially touch AC. This feat allows them to somehow mitigate that. It also unlocks other usefull feats.

Improved trip: Combos great with combat reflexes to keep PCs in a place.Also remember you can trip flying playing, stoping their movement for the turn.

Improved disarm:You can disarm the oponent from anything he's holding, including that cleric's holy symbol.

Improved grapple: Recquires improved unarmed strike, wich is normally useless for the monster in question, but worcks great for disabling casters untill they become able to spam freedom of movement.

Power attack:A must have for any melee monster, but they normally have it automatically anyway.

Improved sunder:Really evil if you use it in that super-expensive item. Great to keep the party's WBL in check in case they got too much treasure. You can use it to pretty much sunder anything but armor.

But it's best use is definetely to destroy holy symbols/spell component pouches! Remember, eschew materials only bypasses material components, not material focuses wich are also provided by the spell component pouch/holy symbol, so taking that feat won't completely protectthe casters from sundering.


Skill focus: It's not that great by itself, but it's good for monsters wich really need a good bonus in a certain skill like stealthy monsters for hide or caster monsters for concentration.


Weapon focus:Yeah it also isn't very strong but if you're in a hurry designing your monster(or if you think it's already strong enough) then +1 to attack is always usefull. More than run or toughness at least.




Noncore feats
“We could do that?”-Krork, orc warchief


Darkstalcker:If your monster is trying to hide, PICK THIS! Players will come with all kinds of combos to get blindsight and mindsight and whateversight to try to find your monsters and then ambushing them when it should be the other way. Darkstalcker makes the players go back to the old good spot/listen routine and teaches them not to relay too much on dirty tricks.

Shape shoulmeld+Open least/lesser/greater chakra Give your monster some incarnum goodiness. Remember, the monster character level will be equal to it's HD. Remeber to also pick Bonus essentia so you can actually channel chakra into those soulmelds.



Martial study: Basically a special 1 per battle power. Remember the monster's iniator level will be half the monster's HD. There's plenty to choose from.


Martial stance:Can really spice up a monster. Remember the monster can always keep it active.

Bind vestige, Bind vestige improved and Practised Binder:Get your monster some pact goodiness. You get limited powers, but you get to freack out your players as that shiny valuable fullplate disapears from the monster they just killed.

Improved flight:Fly speed below good maneuvarability has several limitations.This allows you to greatly improve those monsters mobility.

Swarmfighting:This cute feat allows to create your own custom swarms of small sized creatures and keep them a reliable threat to the players.

Meta-breath feats:Really evil as they don't actually cost anything but the feat itself. They also stack. Try to don't go too overboard with it if you don't want to instantly kill your players. Normally quicken alone is a nasty suprise, allowing that dragon to breath and do something else.

Mage-slayer: Put this in a monster wich good mobility and reach and make sure casters won't be laughing in the frontline anymore. Remember that the player only realizes the monster has mage-slayer when said monster is threatening him. Also make sure the monster is doing some good damage with his aoo, since otherwise the caster will probably still pass the concentration check easily.

Pierce Magical concealment:Make sure you hit those buff-protected casters with your mage-slayer monster.

Pierce Magical protection:Codzilla? What codzilla? Combine with the above feats to teach casters some humbleness.

Hold the line: Combine with improved trip to teach those uberchargers a lesson or two.

Robillar's gambit: Really evil against melees. For a weaker effect try out karmic strike. No, they don't stack.

Savage species and Libris mortis: Those two books in particular contain a LOT of usefull monster feats. Perhaps I'll go over them someday but not now. If you have the books just pick them up and go to the feat sections to get plenty of goodies to challenge your players.


As you may have noticed, a monster's character level for picking up feats is determined by it's number of HD. This means that, right, a monster with more than 20 HD is considered epic and can pick up epic feats. And there's a lot of monsters out there with more than 20HD while being of nonepic CR. Some may call this broken, but after level 5-6 PCs start to get nasty and you may need to pull the big guns to keep them challenged whitout doing an auto-TPK. Here they are:

Epic feats
IT'S OVER 9000!!!!!

Blinding speed: If you can meet the fat dex recquirement it can be quite usefull.

Damage reduction:At epic level isn't that good, but for a monster of medium level it can be a great help.

Energy resistance: nasty if combined with monsters wich have vulnerability to a certain element, or also to allow monsters to shoot nukes over their own teammates whitout fear of hurting each other.

Exceptional deflection: Feat heavy, but definetely worth the look of that wizard's face when his shivering touch/orb of doom bounces off your BBEG.

Infinite deflection:Combine with the above to make your own wuxia-anime monstruosity wich deflects everything the party throws at him.

Great(insert ability score here):The most usefull epic feat for the DM, allowing you to either further strenghten the monster natural powers or meet other epic feats high pre-requisites. If you don't know what to pick, pick this.

Perfect multiweapon fighting:I'm sure there's some crazy combo in here waiting to be unleashed.

Epic destinies: For 3.X, made abvailable by Wotc themselves. I personally prefer the blade of ragnarock one.
http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/drfe/20080428


As a last note on feats, remember, nowhere it says that monsters can't pick up flaws, so if you're short in feats for them feel free to give your monsters one or two flaws. And if you're at it, go ahead and give them a trait.

Skills
”Did you know that wood burns better than rocks?”-Mog, goblin weaponsmith

Monsters also aren't very smart at picking their skills, and normally they're in a completely messed up state. My sugestion is to clean it all up, maximize relevant skills and then puting whatever's left on whatever you like, be it knowledge:adventurers or profession: monster.

A monster can have a total of ranks on a skill equal to it's HD+3. It may pay off to remember the epic uses of skills for monsters with lots of HD.

Relevant skills for monsters:

Spot and listen:Your first priority no matter what. Your monster can't be a challenge if it can't find the party. If you are lacking in skill points, then pick listen so you can at least detect in wich square the wizard is when either he's invisible or the monster has been blinded by some dirty trick.

Hide and move silently: Unless you're a full plate wielding ogre, it pays off to try to hide. Even large and bigger creatures normally have enough HDs to make hiding a viable strategy.

Balance:Beware of grease. 5 ranks shall be enough.

Jump: That wizard tought it was safe up there? Make him think again. Monsters with high strenght can get some sick jump modifiers.

Tumble:Nice for low levels, becomes weaker as the monsters gain better and better mobility

Bluff:Keep your rolls for this secret or the players will notice it right away. Also don't ask them to roll sense motive, just ask for their modifiers before hand and then roll it yourself. Combine it with sending spell to screw up with their mind.

Escape artist:It helps in a suprisingly big number of situations.

Sense motive:For when you don't want your players to talk their way out.


Skill tricks
"Watch me pull out your head out of this hat."-ogre magi

Like flaws, nobody says monsters can't pick those up. There are some that are really worth looking at:

Clarity of vision: Remember, it worcks against ALL kinds of invisibility, including the dreaded superior invisbility spell. Very usefull against optimized arcane casters.

Shrouded dance: Can be usefull for stealth based monsters.

Sliping past-great for big monsters in closed areas.

Twisted charge: almost a must have for charging monsters.

Acrobatic backstab:Usefull for monsters with abilities that depend on the target being flatfooted.



More to come.

Myrmex
2009-05-15, 05:48 AM
A resource for DMs. How refreshing.

Would you mind running it through a spell checker?

Belial_the_Leveler
2009-05-15, 06:04 AM
Suggestion: Epic feats for monsters with more than 20 HD.

BTW, what happened to that campaign you were running, Black Moon? I was playing in that one.

arkol
2009-05-15, 06:09 AM
I'm keeping an eye on this!

Worira
2009-05-15, 10:26 AM
The CR rules are broken enough that optimizing monsters within them is pointless. A kobold ghost adept 1 is CR 1, and can wipe parties well over that level.

kjones
2009-05-15, 10:45 AM
Worira: Yes, the CR system is broken, but what if you don't want to make a 1st level kobold ghost adept? What if you want to send them up against, say, a Purple Worm, but want to give it a little power boost without advancing it or giving it class levels?

Optimizing monsters is a really handy trick when you have a specific monster that you want to use for something, but the monster as written is not that great. (And changing around feats doesn't change CR, but a good DM will recognize that certain feat selections will result in a much more challenging encounter, and adjust accordingly.)

Oslecamo: Do you have Dungeonscape? It has a few paragraphs about monstrous feat selections.

Nohwl
2009-05-15, 10:53 AM
i'm going to have to favorite this later.

nightwyrm
2009-05-15, 11:46 AM
Turn a dire lion into an ubercharger by giving it power attack, leap attack and shock trooper.

Try giving Robilar's gambit to a hydra.

Optimizing monsters is actually quite easy just by replacing their useless feats with ones that the PCs actually take.

Oslecamo
2009-05-15, 06:19 PM
Suggestion: Epic feats for monsters with more than 20 HD.

Added.




BTW, what happened to that campaign you were running, Black Moon? I was playing in that one.

Well, the party kinda lost interest and stoped posting, so the campaign died.

Worira:That is optimizing monsters. And believe me, I've seen lv1 parties where said ghost kobold would've been eaten alive. Plus my purpose isn't to make monsters to kill the party but to give them awesome challenging battles.

kjones:Yes I have dungeonscape and I saw that part. But it's very swallow, I intend to make something more deep.

nightwyrm:Using players optimization a good tactic, but there's plenty of stuff out there wich PCs will never take but can be quite usefull for monsters. I intend to focus on that part. There's indeed plenty of ubercharger/super caster guides out there that can be perfectly applied to monsters.

Swordguy
2009-05-15, 07:22 PM
Frankly, this guide is probably 3 years overdue. But, better late than never. Good stuff.

The Tygre
2009-05-15, 07:50 PM
A good short guide. I'm definitely going to be keeping it on hand.

Dark_Scary
2009-05-15, 07:52 PM
Is this guide really the place to be inserting your own houserules?

Quick go through:

"Meta-breath feats:Really evil as they don't actually cost anything but the feat itself."
-Makes it sound like you think they don't increase recharge time. Should probably mention that.

"teaches them not to relay too much on dirty tricks."
-Do you have to take a time out to insult the players for using perfectly legitimate uses of abilities? Those spells that grant Blindsight sure aren't for Dragons.

"Robillar's gambit: Really evil against melees. For a weaker effect try out karmic strike. No, they don't stack."
-Yes they do. Why are you inserting houserules like that?

"making immediate reaction spells still cause aoos."
-"Casting a spell with a casting time of 1 swift action does not provoke attacks of opportunity." "Using an immediate action on your turn is the same as using a swift action" "using an immediate action before your turn is equivalent to using your swift action for the coming turn"

Only standard action spells provoke.

Also, minor misspellings like Darkstalker ect.

Oslecamo
2009-05-15, 08:38 PM
"Meta-breath feats:Really evil as they don't actually cost anything but the feat itself."
-Makes it sound like you think they don't increase recharge time. Should probably mention that.

If the battle ends up in the first turn, then the extra recharge time is irrelevant.



"teaches them not to relay too much on dirty tricks."
-Do you have to take a time out to insult the players for using perfectly legitimate uses of abilities? Those spells that grant Blindsight sure aren't for Dragons.

Hey, the monsters also have the right to enjoy "legitimate" use of abilities. Darkstalker exists for a reason, and it's to allow stealthy monsters/characters to actually be stealthy.



"Robillar's gambit: Really evil against melees. For a weaker effect try out karmic strike. No, they don't stack."
-Yes they do. Why are you inserting houserules like that?

No houserule. It was confirmed by Custserv.



"making immediate reaction spells still cause aoos."
-"Casting a spell with a casting time of 1 swift action does not provoke attacks of opportunity." "Using an immediate action on your turn is the same as using a swift action" "using an immediate action before your turn is equivalent to using your swift action for the coming turn"

Only standard action spells provoke.

Now this one you're right. Gonna correct it. Thank you for pointing it out.

Myrmex
2009-05-15, 08:54 PM
Are uberchargers challenging encounters, though? They have one trick, which is do several thousand damage if they can move at least ten feet/round. Regular charging (upwards of ~100 damage) can be challenging, in that you won't wipe half the party in the first 1.5 rounds.

Dark_Scary
2009-05-15, 09:14 PM
If the battle ends up in the first turn, then the extra recharge time is irrelevant.

Any particular reason you'd think it would? Might it be worth mentioning?


Hey, the monsters also have the right to enjoy "legitimate" use of abilities. Darkstalker exists for a reason, and it's to allow stealthy monsters/characters to actually be stealthy.

I'm not saying you can't use Darkstalker on monsters, I'm saying it's unfair to criticize players for obtaining extra sensory abilities as 'dirty tricks' when the game leaps over hurdles to give those abilities to players.


No houserule. It was confirmed by Custserv.

Customer Service contradicts itself all the time, and has never demonstrated any particular ability to read rules very well.

Robilar's Gambit gives you an AoO when you are attacked, Karmic strike gives an AoO when they miss. Neither one has a statement about not being able to take other AoOs on it.

If someone makes an unarmed attack on you and misses, you would get three AoOs. If someone makes a weapon attack and misses, you would get two.

There is no interpretation here at all, and the only reasons to submit to customer service are because you can't read or you want to nerf the combination and want legitimate justification for your houserule.

And if you ask the question with a desired answer in mind, customer service is putty in your hands.

The Glyphstone
2009-05-15, 09:33 PM
Well, the party kinda lost interest and stoped posting, so the campaign died.


Did you ever go back and check? We were waiting around for quite a while, posting to each other and wondering if you were ever going to show up again...

wadledo
2009-05-15, 09:42 PM
Hell, I was even waiting, which is something I almost never admit to doing.

Yahzi
2009-05-16, 01:48 AM
Also, tactics.

Have the first wave of monsters be low-level mooks. They know they're gonna die; heck, if they get to less than 5 hps, let them just play dead. Their only role is to determine the party's capabilities and tactics. There is one mook watching invisibly from the rear, and it does nothing but watch and then run away.

Have the last few standing mooks try to run away. This will get the PCs in the habit of chasing them.

Then have the mooks attack and immediately run away; hopefully the PCs will split up or just follow at a hard run. Right into an ambush and/or traps.

Have the mooks use ballistas (touch attacks) or poison (even the cheap stuff can eventually lead to a failed save). Fortifications are fun: let the players figure out how to climb a 20 ft. wall while being shot at.

Wands are fun. Nothing like a 1st level mook dumping fireball after fireball on the PCs. If you're a 5th level BBEG, you're totally going to make 5 wands and give them to your 1st level apprentices.

In the final battle, use the mooks to hold the PCs off while the BBEG casts spells. Don't forget to have them grapple and flank.

Deepblue706
2009-05-16, 03:34 AM
Robilar's Gambit gives you an AoO when you are attacked, Karmic strike gives an AoO when they miss. Neither one has a statement about not being able to take other AoOs on it.


If I'm recalling it correctly, Karmic Strike activates when you are successfully hit in combat, not when you are missed.

Anyway, Oslecamo: Good work so far. Keep it up, inexperienced DMs need more resources.

Oslecamo
2009-05-16, 08:24 AM
Did you ever go back and check? We were waiting around for quite a while, posting to each other and wondering if you were ever going to show up again...

I now realize I didn't check the Ooc thread and you posted on it, and I apologize for that.:smallfrown:

I still got the campaign stats, and the PC sheets are still there, so since so many players seem to still have interest I'm willing to try to revive the whole thing.

Of course it will means this guide will get a bit delayed, but hey, it's not like I'm geting paid for it or anything.