An Examination of V's Usage of the Soul Splice

[krko]

Having spent the entire day pondering over the recent events in the comic(thank you road trip:smallmad:), I noticed something quite interesting. Here is a chart of the spells V cast while in the splice.


Level 0

Level 1
Possibly a ton of silent Prestidigitations for the glowing hand effects (j/k :) )

Level 2

Level 3

Level 4

Level 5
Telekinesis

Level 6
Quickened Bear's Endurance
Quickened Shield
Disintegrate

Level 7
Greater Teleport (4)
Delayed Blast Fireball
Energy Immunity (Acid)

Level 8
Quickened Stoneskin
Quickened Fireshield
Quickened Dimensional Anchor
Mind Blank
Protection from Spells
Create Greater Undead

Level 9
Disjunction
Time Stop (2)
Shapechange
Crushing Hand

Level 10
Quickened Disintegrate
Quickened Chain Lightning
Empowered Sunburst

Epic
Familicide (Haera)
Epic Teleport (Ganonron) (2)


For a total of 27 spells.

Interesting facts:
Number of Necromancy Spells: 2 (Familicide and Create Greater Undead) none in combat
Number of Conjuration Spells: 6 (4 greater teleports and 2 epic ones) none in combat
Number of High Arcana Used: Zero (Assuming Jephton has High Arcana other than Spell Power, likely being a "master of arcane flexibility")
Number of Evocation Spells: 5, all in combat
Number of Transmutation Spells: 8, 6 in combat
Number of Abjuration spells cast: 6, all in combat.
No divination, enchantment, or illusion spells.

From these data it is apparent that V did not get the maximum value of the splice. Despite having an epic necromancer and conjurer bound to her, s/he didn't bother use any conjuration or necromancy spell that could have a direct effect on combat. S/he didn't bother using any High Arcana Jephton might've had (although this is pure speculation). S/he didn't try to dominate redcloak (pure speculation on hir capability to this as well).What s/he did was fight like s/he usually did, with evocations, transmutaions, and abjurations (although there were far better abjurations available for her to cast).

So what am I doing? First off, I am not complaining about about how V acted. In fact if you examine hir actions, it is completely in-character for V, being an evoker who dropped conjuration and necromancy. Instead, this is the reason why V lost. If V used conjuration and necromancy more in hir battle (say, via bringing along summoned monsters with hir when teleporting into Xykon's Lair or casting control undead [hard w/o Haera, but maybe ganonron or jephton...] on Xykon) would've probably given V the fight. Instead s/he acted in combat as if only three schools of magic existed. This narrow mindedness is a sign of V's inexperience with the power given to hir. (though three of them namely divination, enchantment, and illusion are useless on Xykon) In conclusion, the reason V lost was not that the power the fiends gave hir was lacking, but s/he did know how to use it properly

Also long post is long

[Azukar]

I know it's not actual Necromancy, but Disjunction was Haerta's spell (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0652.html). So V did get slightly more out of her than you think.

[krko]

I know it's not actual Necromancy, but Disjunction was Haerta's spell (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0652.html). So V did get slightly more out of her than you think.
I only put the caster's names on the epic spells for fun :smallsmile:. I mean we know that all of the quickened spells on the V vs X fight were either V's or Ganonron's.

[Lkctgo]

WoW! What committment, you actually went to check all the spells up!

[Lkctgo]

Good Work!:smalltongue:

[Vizen]

In conclusion, the reason V lost was not that the power the fiends gave hir was lacking, but s/he did know how to use it properly

You know, that is some very good reasoning. (As far as I know) Xykon gained his levels one by one up to whatever it is now, giving him plenty of time to study what each school of magic provides him at that level, and therefore have a greater understanding of the magic he's using, whereas V took a sudden leap into the epic levels. So yes, inexperience as you said applied there.

Though I think V felt as if he didn't have much time. He knew the Soul Splice was only going to last as long as he could hold it, and that every second he's holding it, he has to spend in the IFCC's respective domains. This means that he felt he had to solve everything as fast as he could. Taking the time to use a lot of the spells would of cut into his time, and as such he chose to go with what he knew, and what would deal the damage required as fast as possible.

Though I'm just speculating. It's also 3am and I've been drinking. Mmm.

[[TS] Shadow]

This is a very logical perspective of the fight. V had the ability to use all of the powerful spells he normally wouldn't have access too, but instead he fought like he normally did. I think that when it comes down to it, V just isn't very good at reacting to new situations, even if the odds are in his favor. And the whole "phychologically exausted" thing probably had something to do with it as well.

[Lissou]

You know, that is some very good reasoning. (As far as I know) Xykon gained his levels one by one up to whatever it is now, giving him plenty of time to study what each school of magic provides him at that level, and therefore have a greater understanding of the magic he's using, whereas V took a sudden leap into the epic levels. So yes, inexperience as you said applied there.

Xykon? Study?
Not to mention he's a sorcerer. He has no barred school, and doesn't select his spells. Well, depending on fourth-walling, he either choses which one he gets when he gets new ones, once and for all, or he just gets them from within, because they match him the most, without ever making any choice whatsoever.

Now, replace "study" with "practice" and then yeah, sure, Xykon has been using his spells to kill people randomly just for the fun of it. Although the fight in Azure City showed us he has no ideas what spells and useful against whom, he does know what they do, and is aware of all the spells he has, most likely. He probably wouldn't neglect to use a powerful one. (Less powerful ones, though? More than likely. See Magic Missile in the throne room fight).

[Logalmier]

Acid Immunity: Closest I could find is Protection from energy (Acid), a Level 3 abjuration spell

What you're seeing here is a non-core spell called Energy Immunity. It is 7th level spell and also an abjuration.

[krko]

What you're seeing here is a non-core spell called Energy Immunity. It is 7th level spell and also an abjuration.

Thanks, Edited OP


Xykon? Study?
Not to mention he's a sorcerer. He has no barred school, and doesn't select his spells. Well, depending on fourth-walling, he either choses which one he gets when he gets new ones, once and for all, or he just gets them from within, because they match him the most, without ever making any choice whatsoever.

Now, replace "study" with "practice" and then yeah, sure, Xykon has been using his spells to kill people randomly just for the fun of it. Although the fight in Azure City showed us he has no ideas what spells and useful against whom, he does know what they do, and is aware of all the spells he has, most likely. He probably wouldn't neglect to use a powerful one. (Less powerful ones, though? More than likely. See Magic Missile in the throne room fight).

Xykon does know a bit which spells are usefull against whom. In SoD he defeats Dorukan by spamming him with Energy drains to take away his higher level spell slots, same thing he did against soul spliced V. What fight in Azure city has shown is his ignorance of the incorporeal subtype than anything else. :smallamused:

Another thing I noticed is that V did not use any spell slot that is higher that 10th level during the entire splice while Xykon used a twelfth level one. One reason for this is Xykon's Energy Drain and that s/he didn't need to against the ABD. But you'd think V would've Empowered, Maximized, or Quickened the Time Stop s/he opened with against Xykon.

[Optimystik]

Xykon does know a bit which spells are usefull against whom. In SoD he defeats Dorukan by spamming him with Energy drains to take away his higher level spell slots, same thing he did against soul spliced V. What fight in Azure city has shown is his ignorance of the incorporeal subtype than anything else. :smallamused:

Xykon's knowledge of the effectiveness of level drain doesn't necessarily say much about whether he knows which spells are useful against whom. Level drain works well on any spellcaster with a pulse - he doesn't have to worry about energy types, racial bonuses, saving throws, or even magical defenses if he packs some dispels. It is quite literally the business end of the "rubber mallet" that Xavion described Sorcerers as at the beginning of SoD. This 'tactic' doesn't work as well for wizards because (a) they get a lot less castings of the same spell, and (b) they can't metamagic on the fly like sorcerers can.

[HamsterOfTheGod]

If V used conjuration and necromancy more in hir battle (say, via bringing along summoned monsters with hir when teleporting into Xykon's Lair or casting control undead [hard w/o Haera, but maybe ganonron or jephton...] on Xykon) would've probably given V the fight.

Control Undead should be an easy save for Xykon. Unless Haera was a necromancer specialized in controlling undead somehow (by say having an epic spell to use against undead) then her necromancy is also mostly useful against things with a pulse.

However, I agree with your overall analysis. V acted like V. V rushed in without preparation which would have included scrying, summoning some meat shields, changing into a form more suitable for combat and a whole host of other things.

Even if V had done all the above, I do not know if that gurantees a win for V. Xykon had magic traps, epic magic items, an extremely high AC and several spells that could get him out of combat if needed.

[Vizen]

Xykon? Study?

Oops, I forgot Xykon is a sorcerer. Practice, then. :smallbiggrin:

[krko]

I don't know but surprise round with a gated in Hecatoncheires (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/epic/monsters/abomination.htm) (CR 57!!) or a an adult Epic Dragon (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/epic/monsters/dragonEpic.htm) or a Uvuudaum (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/epic/monsters/uvuudaum.htm) (Time Stop + Epic spells as SLA's? yes please) on your side is pretty much win IMO

[Simanos]

I don't know but surprise round with a gated in Hecatoncheires (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/epic/monsters/abomination.htm) (CR 57!!) or a an adult Epic Dragon (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/epic/monsters/dragonEpic.htm) or a Uvuudaum (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/epic/monsters/uvuudaum.htm) (Time Stop + Epic spells as SLA's? yes please) on your side is pretty much win IMO
Especially when the weakness of Cloister is that summoning inside it is allowed, this was almost foreshadowed one could say...

[factotum]

Xykon? Study?

We know he at least studied long enough to research the Moderately-Escapable Forcecage spell he used against Miko, and he also spent some quite considerable time decrypting Serini's diary to found out where the gates are...Xykon may have ADD of the highest order, but he'll still sit down and apply himself to a problem if he really believes he has to.