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View Full Version : Assaulting a tower alone, druid-style (3.5)



Quietus
2009-05-20, 05:39 AM
So, after the game last night, where my DM had mentioned that our characters (currently involved in a big war, recently pushed back the invading army's front lines, now pushing deeper into their territory) may be tasked with the work of invading and overtaking what amounts to a watchtower, which are generally highly guarded. Our highest level members are level 8, and some of our lowest are 5 or 6.

The regulars include : Zetris (Elven Druid8, my character), Rose (Human Sorcerer8, has unique powers), Pierce (Human Barbarian8, has unique powers), and Dalia (Halfling Cleric7, DMPC healbot). Others who show up on a fairly regular basis include a generic Fighter of some sort, a Wizard who I've aimed to a mix of blast-for-fun and buff/debuff (haste, ray of enfeeblement, slow, web, grease), and a Cleric5 who is looking at picking up Druid levels (Zetris will have her first student!) and Theurging Druid and Cleric (DM has already allowed it), becoming basically a mana battery.

The tower (we assaulted one already, as a significantly different party, at level 3 - it was tough, but we managed to do it, barely. We diplomacized the final boss into not fighting us) is fairly basic. Three floors, top floor is open-air arrow-firing zone. Second floor is combination sleeping quarters and murder hole/arrow slit area - crossbowmen can fire at anyone approaching the outside area of the tower, and murder holes allow oil to be poured onto unwelcome visitors, then lit on fire.

First floor is four rooms; First is the entrance hallway, big wooden entrance gate on one side, portcullis on the other. Murder holes mean flaming oil drops on you, while slots in the wall allow for much spear-like stabbing. If you get through here, you enter the inner area, where you can find stairs leading to the second floor, a lever to open/close the portcullis leading to and from the last room, and two doors. These doors lead to armories, basically, where the guards can access the arrow slits that let spears stab at you in the first room. Essentially, assuming normal entrance into the building and following the map, you'd go Murder hole zone->"inner courtyard"->stairs->second floor(boss fight).

Now comes the changeup. The DM mentioned on the ride home the possibility of sending each of us at a tower individually, since we're much more powerful than we were five levels ago. Those below level 8 would assault one, while those who have made it to 8 each get their own. The rest of the ten-thousand-man army would march forward to the next tower they can reach.

Important stats for my druid : Level 8, 11 str/16 dex/10 con/16 int/22 wis/14 cha, using the old "con bonus for new HP" wild shape rules. Zetris has researched a couple semi-new spells, and sunk 90% of her wealth into this, and into restoring the swamp area she called home. The two spells are Druidic Mark (like Arcane Mark, but a self-sustaining plant instead of an.. arcane.. marking, 0-level spell), and Flame Bow (as Flame Blade, but as with a longbow, 2-level spell). My DM won't let me use Flame Blade/Bow in animal form unless my animal form has hands that would allow it, but animal forms can spit Produce Flames at things.

Magic item wise, I have a Clasp'ed +1 studded leather, and may be able to borrow a use of a Karma Bead for +4 CL (CL 12!) as I break off from the army. 10 minutes ought to do the trick.



So, my best bet for assaulting the tower solo... I see three, maybe four options that jump out at me. In all cases, I intend to let them know I'm there beforehand, informing them that anyone who lays down weapons and leaves of their own accord will be unharmed, while anyone else will be lucky if their death is swift - and I will follow through with this. Considering our last major fight was with the army currently controlling this tower, they spent an hour summoning an aspect of Hextor, and our group defeated it with rounds left in Pierce's Rage, and my character did the vast majority of the damage (dropping a tower on it kinda helped), I suspect Zetris' name is likely to be known among them. Rumors of our group's success have had a little over a week to spread.

Option one : The frontal assault. Big speech, then turn into a tiger (no dinosaurs unfortunately, haven't met them in-game), or other Large, pouncy, melee-worthy form. Possibly a soldier crodlu (big, angry dinosaur-like reptile ostrich, way cooler than it sounds. Foot speed 90 feet+, five attacks, and lots of strength). Walk up to the wall, slash it with my claws (natural spell + stone shape = instant door plus intimidation factor of "Did that woman really turn into a tiger, then slash through our wall?"). Proceed to maul anything that doesn't drop their weapons and run. This would be pre-buffed with all three physical +4 boosts, barkskin, and either Resist Energy (fire) or Spider Climb. Because it's so much cooler if the Tiger is on the ceiling. And has a fireball in its mouth.

Option two : Druidic Siege. Wall of Air will block all their crossbow bolts. Air walk will let me "fly". And Flame Bow will ignore Wall of Air, doing 1d8+5 fire damage on touch attacks, with an attack bonus of +9, unbuffed. I'll have to roll their dex mod to hit. Either use Stone Shape to prevent retreat (Door becomes wall, ta-da!), or let them retreat, then fall back to option one.

Option three : Twelve hours of torture. The Spike Stones spell is... brutal. With the Karma Bead, I can affect 12 20-foot squares at medium range. This is more than enough to cover an entire floor. Two, if I Stone Shape a nice big hole in the floor between them so I keep line of sight. Spike Stones = 1d8 damage to anything that moves per 5' they move. Essentially, for twelve hours, anything inside the building is frozen in place, or takes a reverse cure light. I then use Air Walk (six inches off the ground, can't touch this!) to lion-pounce... or Flame Bow to pick off targets.. or perhaps, if I'm feeling particularly vindictive, some way to force them to move, because the spell is triggered on movement, not "walking".

Part of me is really fond of Option Three. I can combine this with Option Two, casting Air Walk (ten feet in the air), Stone Shape (Up to 22 cubic feet; Plenty of room for a 4x5 foot door that spreads among two floors), Spike Stones to cover both floors, then pick off targets at my leisure. Keep Wind Wall in memory for if they start picking up crossbows, and kill those targets first.

My spell column is : 6/6/5/4/3, and this would require one level 2 spell, one level 3 spell, and two level 4 spells, with Wind Wall (another level 3) in memory. This means I could go with Option Three, have Two ready with Flame Bow in hand, Wind Wall prepared, and if all goes poorly, have the rest of my level 2 spells prepared to zilla up and melee brute the place. All of this would leave me with two level three spells and one level four. And all of my orisons/firsts.. which would probably include a Produce Flame (share with my pet snake for 2x the fireballs), a cure light for emergencies, and an entangle for the lulz. Because it's not bad enough to halve the speed of everything in a building and make it impossible for them to walk.. I need to halve it again and force reflex saves every minute for the next 8-12 minutes versus entanglement.

My animal companion, Orm, is a 54-HP medium viper, with poison DC 18 (1d6 con/1d6 con), 20 if I Bear's Endurance us. Attack bonus +8 unbuffed (+13 if I GMF us both for +3 bite attacks and hit him with Cat's Grace). And in this world, poison is deadly - second save comes one ROUND after infection, rather than one minute. His actual damage output is low, and my DM loves rolling high on poison saves; my poison has come into play twice in three levels. It's about time for karma to turn around and stop biting ME in the ass, methinks.

So, as a point of curiosity - what's the general consensus on this plan? Does it sound decent? Anything to add? Keep in mind that aside from the lowest-power stuff in the Completes, we're nearly core-only.

Jack_Simth
2009-05-20, 07:06 AM
You'll probably do fine with any of those plans, depending on the DM. You could also simply use Stone Shape to seal all entrances and windows, and kill them all by slow suffocation. Goes surprisingly quickly if it's a densely-packed tower.

Depending on the terrain, I'd be fond of turning into a Dire Badger and undermining the tower (unlike most critters with a Burrow speed, the Dire Badger explicitly leaves a tunnel).

Lunawarrior0
2009-05-20, 07:51 AM
Personally, depending on how much attention they pay to the local wild life, I would have fun with a sneak attack of some kind. Turn into a crow or dove or something, then go land on the wall. After someone noticed me I would turn into a tiger and pounce on the one who noticed me. But really as you are level 8 and plan to avoid most of the normal defenses that come with a tower, you should be able to win with any of your tactics.

Epinephrine
2009-05-20, 08:31 AM
What books do you have spells from? I saw the "nearly core only", but you have a "Flame Bow" which I've never seen.

I'm a fan of Decomposition with area damage (like spike stones) for disposing of nuisances. Take 1d8 damage, but then get festering wounds that will kill you. Knowing what spells you have access to would help.

Stone Shape is a very small amount of stone, IIRC. At 8th level it's 18 cubic feet of stone - allowing you to shape a block of stone 3' by 6' by 1', for example. And you must touch the stone, so no sealing windows unless you fly up to the stone on each window, using one casting per window.

Radar
2009-05-20, 09:26 AM
If only Stone Shape wasn't a touch spell, you could just tear down the whole tower. As it is, it would be unwise, to drop it on your own head. I like the sneak attack from the top of the tower option - gives those guys on lower levels opportunity to run away and spread your fame. :smallbiggrin: After that they will not only cover in fear, when they will see you, they'll get paranoid, if they don't see you.

Do you plan to use the tower later on, or not? If not, then when you clean the top (open) level, change into that reptile form and tear through the ceilling for a big entrance - sometimes it is worth to go that extra mile.

Quietus
2009-05-20, 01:11 PM
What books do you have spells from? I saw the "nearly core only", but you have a "Flame Bow" which I've never seen.

I'm a fan of Decomposition with area damage (like spike stones) for disposing of nuisances. Take 1d8 damage, but then get festering wounds that will kill you. Knowing what spells you have access to would help.

Stone Shape is a very small amount of stone, IIRC. At 8th level it's 18 cubic feet of stone - allowing you to shape a block of stone 3' by 6' by 1', for example. And you must touch the stone, so no sealing windows unless you fly up to the stone on each window, using one casting per window.

Spells are core-only, plus the two spells I researched; Druidic mark (druid version of arcane mark), and Flame Bow, which is Flame Blade as longbow rather than scimitar. At this level it's essentially a Produce Flame that doesn't run out of steam.


If only Stone Shape wasn't a touch spell, you could just tear down the whole tower. As it is, it would be unwise, to drop it on your own head. I like the sneak attack from the top of the tower option - gives those guys on lower levels opportunity to run away and spread your fame. :smallbiggrin: After that they will not only cover in fear, when they will see you, they'll get paranoid, if they don't see you.

Do you plan to use the tower later on, or not? If not, then when you clean the top (open) level, change into that reptile form and tear through the ceilling for a big entrance - sometimes it is worth to go that extra mile.

I do intend to let SOME get away. If they wish to leave peacefully, I won't hestitate to let them. They'll be able to see what happens perfectly well, I think. And yes, they want to be able to re-use the tower, so I'll be re-shaping it the next day into the form it was intended to be in. Otherwise I'd just prepare a lot of Stone Shape and Soften Earth and Stone. The former to weaken the tower itself, and the latter to cause the ground to settle under the weakened tower. And hell, be a Dire Badger while I'm at it, so they don't see me coming.


I'd forgotten about the Dire Badger and its tunneling ability. I could use that to tunnel below the tower, then shift into Elf form below the tower, punch the floor and open a hole in it, after turning into a tiger. Personally, if I was one of those tower guards and out of nowhere, with no warning, an armor-wearing tiger with glowing claws and teeth, flames licking out around its mouth, with a five-foot-long venomous snake wrapped around its neck... which ALSO has glowing teeth and fire around its mouth... if that came up out of the floor, I'd wet myself.

Good point on the cubic feet thing, though. I was assuming the walls are one foot thick; If that were the case, they'd be remarkably weak walls. It's more likely they're five feet thick, which means I could open a two-foot by two-foot hole in them... which is less remarkable, and would only allow entry in Small sizes. I guess I'm looking at entry via the roof, then, with Stone Shape used as a last resort escape, or not at all.

The Glyphstone
2009-05-20, 01:20 PM
It seems like you could definitely employ the Death From Above strategy - be a small, innocuous flying creature till you land on the rooftop, then turn into something huge and beatsticky. This takes all those defenses you'll need to fight through and completely negates them, as well as potentially turning them in your favor if you can seal off a level from the one below it - those murder holes are a lot more useful when it's you shooting through them and not the guards shooting at you.

Epinephrine
2009-05-20, 01:58 PM
Well, I like your spike stones idea; combine it with something that might force the enemy to move around - say, a summoned swarm of bats.

Swarms are particularly hard to fight for normal folks, a swarm that causes bleeding can kill enemies that do manage to get away, and fleeing the swarm across spike stones is just a bad idea.

Quench can put out all the fires in a tower most likely. Eight (or twelve, with the karma bead) 20' cubes? That's a lot of quenching. Do it at night - no torches, no lit fires, makes fighting a swarm in the darkness basically hopeless. Most are probably sleeping, and waken to darkness and screaming. Sure, you could technically keep your head, fumble around in the panicked crowd trying to find flint and steel, kindling, and a torch, and maybe fight the swarm - if you don't get trampled to death/cut to ribbons by spike stones.

No torches, no furnaces, nothing but darkness. And spiky stones. And screeching bats... and stuck in a dark tower with them. Want to terrorize them? Humans hate the dark. Especially when the things in the dark are trying to kill them. Warp Wood on the door out with Spike Growth around the tower and laugh. Anyone who gets away will never go in a dark tower again.

Another_Poet
2009-05-20, 02:09 PM
I enjoy Plan 3... a lot. Please use Plan 3. :)


For getting them to move, I'd try Summon Swarm of fire ants or mosquitos.

Also, 12 hours is a long time. About 8 hours in I'd ask the DM how he's going to adjudicate all those guards having to go to the bathroom. Even if they go in their pants/tunics that's mighty uncomfortable. Someone's gonna move. Especially if someone on the floor right above them also just wet their tunic and there's a dribble-down effect....

If any of the enemies are small enough in size a wind effect could force them to move.

Quietus
2009-05-21, 04:54 AM
I enjoy Plan 3... a lot. Please use Plan 3. :)


For getting them to move, I'd try Summon Swarm of fire ants or mosquitos.

Also, 12 hours is a long time. About 8 hours in I'd ask the DM how he's going to adjudicate all those guards having to go to the bathroom. Even if they go in their pants/tunics that's mighty uncomfortable. Someone's gonna move. Especially if someone on the floor right above them also just wet their tunic and there's a dribble-down effect....

If any of the enemies are small enough in size a wind effect could force them to move.

I'd love to. Hell, I might take the Summon Swarm advice to heart; I don't actually need to prepare Bull's Strength, helpful though it may be. Spike Stones + Summon Bat Swarm = one entire floor gone, barring fire and spellcasters. And if I enter at ground level, I can Spike Stone the stairs, making it REALLY painful for anyone who comes down to find out what's going on.

Interesting thing : Spike Stones is a trap. It's detectable by a Rogue (and ONLY a Rogue, since they're the only class in the game that gets Trapfinding) using the Search skill, and CAN'T be found by the Spot skill. This means that not only are they taking damage for moving.. they don't know why. Because really, what self-respecting Rogue is going to go "Oh, it hurts to walk! I'd better check for traps!"?

This all being said, I do expect to walk up and intimidate the tower beforehand, with a "This is my name, this is my affiliation, and these are the ways I've already put your side to shame. Any who surrender peacefully will be taken as prisoners and treated respectfully. Any who do not will die."-style speech. Doesn't really lend itself well to an unannounced Spike Stones spell. Still a nice thing to have in memory though, and I can always switch it out for a Summon Nature's Ally 4 spell; Brown Bears, Tigers, and Earth Elementals (Push + Spike Stones?) are all fantastic options. Hell, I could just flood the tower with summoned creatures and watch the carnage if I wanted to.


Level 2 : Nothing good here or in SNA1, except this level gets me a Hippogriff. Great for high-speed escape, if I can afford the turn to summon it. Of course, I have plenty of fly-speed forms (dire hawk, 80 foot speed) myself, plus some Burrowing.
Level 3 : Dire Weasel (d3 of them from SNA4 = lots of con damagefor the boss? Works nicely with my snake's poison), Lion, Thoqqua would be good if it weren't so few HP. Oh, and dire wolves.
Nature's Ally 4 : Brown Bears, Tigers, Medium Earth Elementals.


All this in mind, I can very easily just go with an Animal-flood style of attack, and back them up with my own spells. A heavily-buffed snake will protect me, and if things ever get too rough, I can wildshape to back myself up. This building isn't built to take masses of animals running rampant through it... and it's CERTAINLY not built for *me* running rampant.

TSED
2009-05-21, 05:13 AM
Inform them that you ARE going to take this tower, etc. etc. Offer them 30 minutes to come out and surrender (without weapons / armour).


THEN do the swarm + stone spike (+ quench?) thing. Try to get the swarm to aim not for killing, but for terrorizing and wounding.

When the spells wear out, shout that the spells have worn off and that they have 30 minutes to come out and surrender. Once again, no weapons (or armour).


THEN go and methodically slaughter every one who attempts to resist you? Those scare tactics ('you cannot hope to defeat me, look at this I could kill you all with this alone') and the fact that you keep sparing people that surrender should not only garner you a fierce reputation for DOOM, but also a reputation for mercy etc.

The flaw with this is, if I remember right, you can't really direct swarms that well, can you?

Quietus
2009-05-21, 05:49 AM
Inform them that you ARE going to take this tower, etc. etc. Offer them 30 minutes to come out and surrender (without weapons / armour).


THEN do the swarm + stone spike (+ quench?) thing. Try to get the swarm to aim not for killing, but for terrorizing and wounding.

When the spells wear out, shout that the spells have worn off and that they have 30 minutes to come out and surrender. Once again, no weapons (or armour).


THEN go and methodically slaughter every one who attempts to resist you? Those scare tactics ('you cannot hope to defeat me, look at this I could kill you all with this alone') and the fact that you keep sparing people that surrender should not only garner you a fierce reputation for DOOM, but also a reputation for mercy etc.

The flaw with this is, if I remember right, you can't really direct swarms that well, can you?

I'd let them keep their armor; It doesn't matter to me (touch attacks, or attack rolls of +13 or higher), and the army I'm working for is large enough to handle a few random unarmed mooks easily. Plus, with the borrowed one-shot use of a Karma Bead, I'm on a time limit. I might give them some small number of minutes (five at most, more likely two), before starting things. That'll let me pre-buff anything I need to, as well. Two minutes or so of movement-doom plus bat swarm should be a good enough way to soften them up.

And no, you can't control a swarm. It attacks the person nearest to it - either the target it's on top of, or the next nearest target. Nice thing about the Bat swarm is that they can't be damaged with weapons, and this tower group's favorite tactic - "Pour oil and ignite" - won't really work that well, since they'd end up coating the floor, lighting THAT on fire, and risking their motionless selves in the flames.

And no, no Quench. I'm an Elf, I don't have darkvision. And some of the creatures in there might; There may be Dwarves, and there will be a boss monster and a unique monster in there.

TSED
2009-05-21, 06:06 AM
Sounds like you've got the kinks out already, then. I said 'no armour' because it would demoralize the troops and make them feel less safe.

(Trust me, I know about fighting swarms. CONTROLLING them is different, since I am not really a caster fan.)


Ok so no Quench. That still leaves torches, which could put a hamper... but your terror should still be easily spread. Going for scare tactics over pure mortality is more effective in this scenario in my opinion, merely because the more captures you make the more impressive the play really was.

Quietus
2009-05-21, 02:45 PM
Sounds like you've got the kinks out already, then. I said 'no armour' because it would demoralize the troops and make them feel less safe.

(Trust me, I know about fighting swarms. CONTROLLING them is different, since I am not really a caster fan.)


Ok so no Quench. That still leaves torches, which could put a hamper... but your terror should still be easily spread. Going for scare tactics over pure mortality is more effective in this scenario in my opinion, merely because the more captures you make the more impressive the play really was.

I agree regarding scare vs mortality; I'd RATHER be able to take every last member of the tower's current occupants into custody than have to murder them. At the very least, I want to capture the mooks; As best as I can gather, each tower will have around a dozen level 3-5 mooks, plus a boss and a unique monster of some sort. If I can demoralize/capture the mooks, that means I only have to deal with the boss and his buddy, which shouldn't be a major problem. Bead of Karma = Greater Magic Fang +3, which is a nice start, and it also would prop my Barkskin up to +5 AC. Plus summons/traps/bats/Produce Flame/Wildshape.. I can pull a "death from above" by turning into a Dire Bat and raining dual Produce Flames from myself and my snake, or just sharing an air walk with him. I can melee brute as a Lion. I can summon a zoo and let it run wild - if I'm forced into a melee-type situation, this will likely be a favorite. Of course, like any good plan, I expect most of these will be shot to hell the moment I come in contact with the enemy, so I'll have to prepare for in general, worry about specifics later.

Lycanthromancer
2009-05-21, 05:20 PM
This post so makes me want to play a druid.

Too bad I revile Vancian casters.

I might just have to play one anyway.

Coidzor
2009-05-21, 06:04 PM
So what is your time limit for taking the tower?

Quietus
2009-05-21, 06:21 PM
So what is your time limit for taking the tower?

If I can borrow a Karma Bead for a one-time buff going into it, ten minutes, so I retain the caster level boost during the assault. If I'm denied the Karma Bead buff, I have no time limit, and will happily harass the place over a very long period of time. The idea is that we're expecting the enemy army to be working on a schedule that assumes it'll take us a certain amount of time (on the scale of days) per tower, assuming a normal seige-style assault. Our party is being broken up, each of the highest-level members taking one tower apiece, with the rest (assorted level 5-6's, and a level 7 buff/healbot DMPC cleric) handling a fourth, while the army moves forward and takes the fifth.

If I have to, I'll sit around, take a couple days on my own, using several Spike Stone spells per day to prevent the enemy from moving, then casting Stone Shape from my third level slots to seal off the building. Once it's sealed, I'll either fill it with water (I have 21 total spells slots in level 0, 1, and 2 combined, for 8 gallons each), or just use my high Listen check to tell where they're trying to break through with weaponry and keep a readied action to eat/set on fire/otherwise murder the first one that appears. Nothing is more demoralizing than finally getting your first breath of fresh air after hours of hard work ruining your weapons, and having a tiger eat your buddy's face.


Heh. Every time I read the Spike Stones spell description, I learn something new. Not only is it a magic trap (and thus undetectable by the Spot skill), it literally CANNOT be disabled by Disable Device, even if they DO have a Rogue use Search to realize what's happening. Hopefully they don't have anyone who can dispel a spell at what I hope will be a DC 23 caster level check.

Another_Poet
2009-05-25, 03:24 PM
I don't think Spike Stones is undectable with the Spot skill.

I understand the rule that only rogues can find magic traps with Search, but I believe that something lying in plain sight can be seen with Spot (and, again in plain sight, has a Spot DC of 0 barring other vision modifiers).

For instance, if I dug a pit trap and didn't bother to cover it up, anyone could see it with a Spot check. Unless the Spike Stones spell description specifically says it is invisible or the like, I'd rule similar as a GM in this case. Your own GM probably will too.

If I were you I'd make sure to take the tower within 1 day. A bunch of people who can't move but can talk to each other will start planning. Someone will make the spellcraft check to identify the Spike Stones. Someone else will have levitate and go to the box of scrolls, someone else will have a means of calling for reinforcements, etc. You have the element of surprise and strong druidic magic on your side, but presumably this tower was built to hold against casters. If you are still sieging it by Day 2 I'd expect either very wise spell selection from any casters inside the tower or very strong likelihood of reinforcements from outside the tower.

ap