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Rocket45
2009-05-21, 01:34 PM
Hey I'm making a new druid, i always just used the core books but now I am expanding to try and use all of the 3.5 books/abilities and I had some questions.

I am planning on going Druid 5/Planar Shepherd 10, so my question is how much will i really miss plant/elemental forms?.

I know i can use enhance wild shape(x2) to turn into a plant and gain all their (ex) abilities but that seems rather expensive.

And ive also heard that elemental forms are cool, but dont match up the animal forms you can assume at that level.

Is spontaneous healer(CD) worth it? When I first saw it I really liked it considering how many slots this one feat would free up, but I dont see this very often in druid builds.

Is assume supernatural ability worth it?
I thought it might considering I can turn into magical beasts being a planar shepherd.


Any way I can get around the good requirements of exalted wild shape?
I dont have a problem with doing good deeds, its just my party is all of a non-good alignment, and trying to always do good is likely to get me killed by my teammates. I was wondering if anyone had found a loophole or something.

TLDR:
how much will i really miss plant/elemental forms?(due to being a planar shepherd)
Is spontaneous healer(CD) worth it?
Is assume supernatural ability worth it?
Any way I can get around the good requirements of exalted wild shape?

wadledo
2009-05-21, 01:39 PM
Read here. (http://forums.gleemax.com/showthread.php?t=733400)

Eldariel
2009-05-21, 01:47 PM
Hey I'm making a new druid, i always just used the core books but now I am expanding to try and use all of the 3.5 books/abilities and I had some questions.

I am planning on going Druid 5/Planar Shepherd 10, so my question is how much will i really miss plant/elemental forms?.

I know i can use enhance wild shape(x2) to turn into a plant and gain all their (ex) abilities but that seems rather expensive.

And ive also heard that elemental forms are cool, but dont match up the animal forms you can assume at that level.

You won't miss 'em. The forms Planar Shepherd gives you are vastly superior - there's a reason it's considered one of the 3 most broken PrCs in the game (choose appropriate plane to get good forms and solid Planar Bubble-effect).


Is spontaneous healer(CD) worth it? When I first saw it I really liked it considering how many slots this one feat would free up, but I dont see this very often in druid builds.

It's decent on early levels. However, feats are precious. Later on, you don't want to use your spell slots for out-of-combat healing; that's what Wands of Lesser Vigor (SC)/Cure Light Wounds (PHB) are for. Spell slots are precious, not something you want to use on something so mundane.

Also, Summon Nature's Ally IV can summon a Unicorn, which is actually a great healer as it can use its own actions to cast a bunch of healing spells. This is another reason. In-combat healing is uneconomic action-wise; you should focus on killing an opponent; the damaged guy escapes and uses his Healing Belt [MiC] to heal himself if need be. Only really Heal-spell is worth it as it heals so much it can actually counteract the damage dealt.



Is assume supernatural ability worth it?
I thought it might considering I can turn into magical beasts being a planar shepherd.

It's fcking awesome, but you have the Outsider-forms which you should focus on (as they come with Spell-Likes and Supernaturals automatically). Any other shapeshifter should pick it, but it's redundant for a Planar Shepherd.


Any way I can get around the good requirements of exalted wild shape?
I dont have a problem with doing good deeds, its just my party is all of a non-good alignment, and trying to always do good is likely to get me killed by my teammates. I was wondering if anyone had found a loophole or something.

Not really. Alignment requirements on feats are pretty adamant.

Yuki Akuma
2009-05-21, 01:49 PM
You want to get an exalted feat without being good?

Yeah that isn't going to work.

Exalted isn't just good. Exalted is Super Good. It's not going to work if you're even the tiniest bit evil, I'm sorry.

Darrin
2009-05-21, 02:26 PM
I am planning on going Druid 5/Planar Shepherd 10, so my question is how much will i really miss plant/elemental forms?.


Not very much. You lose Shambling Mound electro-cheese, but there are plenty of other abusable wildshape combos.



I know i can use enhance wild shape(x2) to turn into a plant and gain all their (ex) abilities but that seems rather expensive.


Not plants. Just Elementals and Outsiders that are native to your chosen plane. And you get their SU and SLAs, too. So turn into a Noble Djinn and grant your friends three free wishes per day (no XP cost).



And ive also heard that elemental forms are cool, but dont match up the animal forms you can assume at that level.


You're limited to whatever elementals are native to your chosen plane, although at that level most of the really cheesy stuff is going to be magical beasts (I'm looking at you, Hydra) and outsiders.

As far as missing elementals... if you need something only an elemental can do (earthglide turns most dungeon crawls into a cakewalk before the DM starts pulling "magical force stone" out of his keister), you can just summon one via SNA.



Is spontaneous healer(CD) worth it? When I first saw it I really liked it considering how many slots this one feat would free up, but I dont see this very often in druid builds.


Usually not, mostly because it only gives you a limited number of uses per day. If you need to cast cure spells spontaneously, that's what wands, potions, and scrolls are for. Also, spontaneous healing is mostly important for healing while in combat, which is usually not very effective. As a druid wildshaped into something nasty, you're going to have enough trouble trying to figure out if you should attack or cast spells. If someone else in the party starts whining about cure spells, tell them to suck it up until combat is over.



Is assume supernatural ability worth it?
I thought it might considering I can turn into magical beasts being a planar shepherd.


Depends on how often you want to see your DM cry.



Any way I can get around the good requirements of exalted wild shape?
I dont have a problem with doing good deeds, its just my party is all of a non-good alignment, and trying to always do good is likely to get me killed by my teammates. I was wondering if anyone had found a loophole or something.


I'm not aware of any loopholes. I don't think you need Exalted Wild Shape. The stuff you can change into as a Planar Shepherd trumps anything a pegasus or unicorn can do. Wild Shape: Magical Beast + Assume Supernatural Ability means you can already turn into a unicorn or pegasus and pick up at least one (Su).

You can live without the Celestial template. It gives you smite evil 1/day (meh), SR = HD + 5, and DR 10/magic (at that level, the odds you get attacked by something without magic weapons are almost nil). There are other ways to get SR if you need it.

Frosty
2009-05-21, 02:36 PM
For a Druid/Planar Shepherd, as long as you take Natural Spell, you really cna't go wrong. You cna waste all of your other feats on TOUGHNESS and you will still break the game many, many times over.

Everytime someone plays a Planar Shepherd, God makes a DM cry.

Salt_Crow
2009-05-21, 05:18 PM
how much will i really miss plant/elemental forms?.

As other people pointed out, not much at all. Unless of course, you choose something like Thelanis or Xoriat (only 1 20HD outsider w/ no magical beast or elemental) for your home plane- then you'll miss them a little bit. Choose your home plane wisely. If you ever want to change your choice, it's RAW that you have to take PlSh levels from scratch.


Is spontaneous healer(CD) worth it?
Nah, forget about them. Spontaneous SNA is good enough and is actually so good that once you get the hang of it you'll never look back. Storm Elemental, I choose you!



Is assume supernatural ability worth it?
Again, it'd depend on your home plane. You already get Su abilities of your elemental and outsider forms and magical beast- planes like Fernia has hardly any magical beast whatsoever, save zezir iirc. If you're going w/ Lamannia (Noble Djinni can use Wish(sp) 3/day) you've got Celestial and Fiendish templates to play around with so it's not too bad at all.

Other than that, you could always use it in conjunction w/ Polymorph chain I guess :)



Any way I can get around the good requirements of exalted wild shape?
DM fiat and nothing else.

Zergrusheddie
2009-05-21, 05:52 PM
Planar Shepherd is funny. Since all demons and elementals are from the same plane, you can easily choose any plane and be stupidly powerful. For example, my favorite was the Sea of Fire. At level 14, you can turn into an Efreeti and cast Wish 3/day without any cost. Here's the funny thing: because of the errata change you do not gain the type of the creature you turn into so you can grant free wishes to yourself. With Wild shape 5/day, you can grant a total of 15 wishes per day. If you don't feel like abusing that, than you can just turn into a Balor and smash the opponents to dust all while having an Animal Companion and full casting progression.

Druids are strong enough without resorting to Planar Shepherd and if you pull out all the stops, your DM will not be happy with you and your teammates will become "the people who carry the swag" as you dominate in every single way. Some Prestige Classes let you have your cake and eat it too, but the Planar Shepherd is like Augustus Gloop in a giant bakery. It's just excessive. Taking Augment Summoning and Natural Spell will keep you powerful enough without resorting to massively broken Prestige Classes. Follow the Druid's Handbook; it has excellent advice and is great if you are just trying Druid for the first time.

Best of luck mate.
-Eddie