Girl Genius V: Madre de Diodes! [Archive] - Giant in the Playground Forums

Mauve Shirt

2009-05-22, 11:20 AM

Previously on GG: Agatha has finally met up with Gil, Merlot is causing havoc, and Zola has disappeared.
And Gil is experiencing Battle draught side effects.

Links!
Thread IV (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=102230)
Link to current comic (http://girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php) and link to the beginning of the strip. (http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20021104)
Wiki Project devoted to to Girl Genius (http://girlgenius.wikia.com/wiki/The_Department_of_Almost_Certainly_True_History)
Wikipedia entry on Girl Genius. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Girl_Genius)
TV Tropes page on Girl Genius. (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/GirlGenius)
The Continuing Adventures of Othar Tryggvassen, Gentleman Adventurer! (http://twitter.com/Othar) (A compliation [and much easier to read if you're just catching up] of the entries can be found here at the GG website (http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/fun/twitter_othar_01.php))
Kaja Foglio's LJ Page (http://www.livejournal.com/users/kajafoglio/) and Studio Foglio News LJ Page (http://studiofoglio.livejournal.com/) (Both updated infrequently)
Links to Webcomic Ranking websites. (http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/info/rankingsites.php) (Used to have Vote Incentives [sketches, parodies of strips, etc] that were changed daily. Might once again.)
The Secret Blueprints (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4272360&postcount=1478) (NOTE: Contains background infomation on the GG Universe, so it should probably be read after "catching up" to the newest comic, as it contains many spoilers.)

Evil DM Mark3

2009-05-22, 11:37 AM

Selrahc

2009-05-22, 12:29 PM

Or alternatively, Gil's dad, the morally dubious overlord of all Europe, who happens to be a master of biological experiments, maybe did some enhancement work on Gil?

EENick

2009-05-22, 12:32 PM

Or alternatively, Gil's dad, the morally dubious overlord of all Europe, who happens to be a master of biological experiments, maybe did some enhancement work on Gil?

That seems the most likely to me.

You know Agatha's one boyfriend is turning green and her other is super strong.

Between the two of them she is dating the Hulk!

Evil DM Mark3

2009-05-22, 12:46 PM

Between the two of them she is dating the Hulk!

Bruce banner as a spark...

WIN!

Ganurath

2009-05-22, 12:59 PM

Bruce banner as a spark...

WIN!Isn't that how he became the Hulk in the first place?

evileeyore

2009-05-22, 01:22 PM

Or alternatively, Gil's dad, the morally dubious overlord of all Europe, who happens to be a master of biological experiments, maybe did some enhancement work on Gil?

This seems to be the most likely of all theories.

slayerx

2009-05-22, 01:34 PM

I don't think so actually. I mean come on, Gil threw a large Jagger over his head while badly injured. It has been suspected by a lot of people for a long time that The Spark is more than just a mental boost.

you really can't compare vole to that battle clank... Vole probably weigh like the same as a pro wrestler (couple of hundred lbs), while the clank would be more in the neighborhood of that of van (couple of tons)... not to mention that Gil was able to work with vole's momentum to help send him flying... throwing a person down like that can be down

And the only other spark's we have seen possible superior strength is just Klaus and Othar... Kluas however i think it said that he was partially a construct (hence all the stitching) and thus i would not be surprised if their was some muscle enhancement... And Othar, considering how large he is compared to most people and his resilience, i would not be surprised if he too has been taking in muscle enhancing modification

Occasional Sage

2009-05-22, 01:36 PM

That seems the most likely to me.

You know Agatha's one boyfriend is turning green and her other is super strong.

Between the two of them she is dating the Hulk!

Except that she hasn't, you know, gone on any dates with either of them! Unless you use The Castle's standards (http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20090415), but really now...

Oracle_Hunter

2009-05-22, 01:56 PM

Occasional Sage

2009-05-22, 02:02 PM

EENick

2009-05-22, 02:23 PM

Except that she hasn't, you know, gone on any dates with either of them! Unless you use The Castle's standards (http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20090415), but really now...

Sparks don't date like normal people.

Fighting a berzerk clank together? Date
Fighting Othar Together? Date
Playing a deadly game of chess with the other together? Date

Oracle_Hunter

2009-05-22, 02:24 PM

Also, if he knew that he'd constructed the Perfect Heirtm, why would he spend so much time testing him?
Because Gil was an experiment - Klaus didn't know how it would turn out. You have to stress-test your creations to make sure they work as planned.

As for Theory #3, remember that Klaus was already a talented bio-Spark, a close personal friend of the Heterodyne Boys, and potentially dropped off near some old Mongfish labs.

And wouldn't your hypothetical Warrior Race want to destroy something as "unnatural" as an Engineered Heir :smallamused:

PePe QuiCoSE

2009-05-22, 02:37 PM

oooooh nice, Agatha can also be Gil´s damsel in distress. Sorry Pinky.

PaladinFreak

2009-05-22, 02:46 PM

While Gil has demonstrated great strength in the past (e.g. beating the crud out of Othar), the ability to pick up and throw a clank that is three times the size of a man is not something we have seen before. My bet is on a side effect of the Battledraught.

eMpTy Kay

2009-05-22, 03:54 PM

Mauve Shirt, can you edit the first post to have all the needed links? (See first post in last thread.)

Mauve Shirt

2009-05-22, 04:15 PM

Consider it done! Because it is!

eee

2009-05-22, 04:19 PM

I think it is clear that Gil has been enhanced with Jager Tek (http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20080428); the question now is how did Klaus "enhance" Gil?

The way I see it, here are the options:
(1) Klaus injected Gil with Jager Serums at a young age
(2) Klaus has been secretly dosing Gil with Jager Serums over the years
(3) Klaus grew Gil in a tank, using Jager Tek to construct the Perfect Heir

Discuss!

I doubt (3), since we've been strongly led to believe that A) Lucrezia 'exiled' Klaus to Skifander, B) while there, he met and married a local girl, and C) they had Gil in the regular way. Tank growth would seem to have no part in this.

As for the rest, yes, it would certainly seem Klaus modified Gil in some way to be more than human. Given his closeness to the Heterodynes, his control of the Castle after he took over Mechanicsburg, and his command of teh Jagers, Klaus may even have gotten hold of or managed to synthesize some Jägerbräu. Refined it to prevent the physical transformation aspects. And given it to Gil, creating a human being with the abilities of a Jager.

But it may not stop there. From what we've seen of Zeetha, the Skifandians ALSO seem to be superhuman, with increased strength, speed, and endurance. How much of that is due to training, and how much to natural ability, we don't know. If they are more than human biologically, then the offspring of a normal human and a Skifandian would also probably be extraordinary, by human standards. Even more so when you consider Klaus is far more, both mentally and physically, than a normal human to begin with. And we don't know what other enhancement techniques and modifications the Baron may have used on Gil. We do know he seems to feel that Gil might not be someone he, Klaus, could stop if Gil determined to oppose him (http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20060329). And I don't think that's just paternal pride talking. It may be that Klaus has, deliberately and as skillfully as he could, created a Superman...

Isn't that how he became the Hulk in the first place?

RE Bruce Banner: Is it? DC and Marvel have re-conned their characters so much I can't keep up on these things anymore. And it's not just changes in origins. I open a comic these days, and while the costumes are usually the same, these just... aren't the characters I grew up with. Or that I really care to read about, anymore.

The last comic I enjoyed whole-heartedly was Phil's Angel and the Ape, I think.

The Glyphstone

2009-05-22, 06:56 PM

I'd never read Secret Blueprints before.....the Foglios have got to take us to England at some point now, just because that will be too awesome to avoid.

Rockphed

2009-05-22, 11:10 PM

RE Bruce Banner: Is it? DC and Marvel have re-conned their characters so much I can't keep up on these things anymore. And it's not just changes in origins. I open a comic these days, and while the costumes are usually the same, these just... aren't the characters I grew up with. Or that I really care to read about, anymore.

This is exactly why I never bothered even trying to look at comic books growing up. On the other hand, I fully expect the Foglios to stop writing Girl Genius at some point. At that point, I will, hopefully, feel satisfied with how the comic went. If I don't, at least I will be fairly certain that they won't be changing it just because some executive decides to take a darker and edgier take on things. Furthermore, I have no doubt that any loose ends lying around aren't close enough to the center of the story to make the end feel forced.

I should probably stop rambling about things I know nothing about.

LurkerInPlayground

2009-05-22, 11:18 PM

I don't think so actually. I mean come on, Gil threw a large Jagger over his head while badly injured. It has been suspected by a lot of people for a long time that The Spark is more than just a mental boost.
Tarvek got his ass handed to him by a Geisterdamen mook. So no. Granted, it was a strong and well-armed mook. However, other minor characters with the Spark (e.g. Theo and the Circus) aren't characterized by their athletic abilities. It's a stretch to claim that the Spark does anything other then give mental insight. Nor does athletic ability correlate with the strength of a Spark, illustated by Othar, who is considered a fairly minor Spark.

Gil is unusually strong and fast, although whether this is due to his natural gifts, tampering by his father or a combination of those things and the battle draught is not entirely explicit. Point being, Gil is special, to the point of being nearly superhuman. My guess would be that his already impressive abilities are being pushed to limits of self-injury by the battle draught numbing his sense of pain.

Occasional Sage

2009-05-23, 12:06 AM

OK, are the Foglios using Othar's Twitter (http://twitter.com/Othar) to tease us about the main plotline? If so, I'm REALLY intrigued now! And frustrated. And impatient. And and andandandandand!

Cyan

2009-05-23, 12:19 AM

Love the new thread title. :smallsmile:

evileeyore

2009-05-23, 01:22 AM

Love the new thread title. :smallsmile:

I agree.

One thing that has been bothering me:

Klaus having the locket. Where did he get it? (Presumeably from Moloch) Why did he fix it? Does he understand what it does? Why was he carrying it? What were his plans for it?

Oracle_Hunter

2009-05-23, 02:04 AM

Klaus having the locket. Where did he get it? (Presumeably from Moloch) Why did he fix it? Does he understand what it does? Why was he carrying it? What were his plans for it?
He got it from Moloch and recognized it as having belonged to Lucrezia. (http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20061204) Likely he also noticed the hidden clockwork (thoughtfully exposed by Moloch) (http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20030224) and tried to analyze it.

It seems likely that he understood what the mechanism did. First of all, he repaired it; secondly he has a known talent for synthesizing the technology of others; and finally, putting a Spark-removal device on a dangerous Spark makes very good sense :smallbiggrin:

evileeyore

2009-05-23, 02:41 AM

He got it from Moloch and recognized it as having belonged to Lucrezia. (http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20061204)

First off, that's maybe what Lucrezia thought, it is left ambigious. Klaus may have had other motives. But the notion he carried to trick her into putting it on, not a bad one.

It seems likely that he understood what the mechanism did.

Did he? One could infer that, but I'm not so sure.

First of all, he repaired it;

Agian, did he? Or as AI suggest later, did he make soemthing else?

putting a Spark-removal device on a dangerous Spark makes very good sense :smallbiggrin:

Sure. If that's what it did. Except, you know, it hasn't.

It's suppressed the Other completely, but not Agatha at all. So it's rather a poor Spark-Suppressor, but it seems to be a great Possession-Supressor.

Except, I'm not sure Klaus thinks that's what it did. Or maybe he just overreacted in stereotypical Klaus fashion... kill it, then study the remains later when it's safe. I'm not sure.

It still remains a relatively unanswered quandry. Argggh! And it'll be ages before Gil gets back to his Father and gets answers!

hmmm. On second thought... The locket may have been designed towards dual-purposes. Spark Suppression to allow Agatha to slowly come into her own as a Spark, Other Suppression incase Barry (or anyone else0 wasn't around to save her from the body-stealing Other. It's not entirely inconcievable that Barry knew not only who the Other was, but what the Other was up to towards the end.

And that's another mystery well have to wait forever to get answers to. Aaargh!!

Oracle_Hunter

2009-05-23, 02:59 AM

hmmm. On second thought... The locket may have been designed towards dual-purposes. Spark Suppression to allow Agatha to slowly come into her own as a Spark, Other Suppression incase Barry (or anyone else0 wasn't around to save her from the body-stealing Other. It's not entirely inconcievable that Barry knew not only who the Other was, but what the Other was up to towards the end.
I feel that Other-Suppression was an unexpected side effect of the device - after all, even Other Agatha isn't quite sure how the Possession works. (http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20060331) Of course, Barry could have known about the Summoning Engine, but I doubt he would have understood the mechanism as well as The Other.

But I'm pretty sure Klaus knows exactly what this Locket is. First of all, it triggers his (naughty) flashback (http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20041213). Secondly, look at Other Agatha's reaction in Panel 6 (http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20061204) - that is a look of recognition. At the very least Original Lucrezia had some sentimental attachment to the Locket, whether she owned it or not.

I seriously doubt that Klaus modified the Heterodyne Device to stop The Other - he had no way of suspecting that it would possess Agatha. And if he had, he would have had her stunned down instead of negotiated with - he clearly believed he had a superior position. (http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20061127)

datalaughing

2009-05-23, 08:01 AM

It triggers his flashback because it's got pictures of Bill and Lucrezia in it. She might just recognize it as a Heterodyne locket and have inferred that Klaus wanted to give it to her daughter so that everyone would know she was a Heterodyne and then create a Wulfenbach/Heterodyne alliance (http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20061206), which would probably increase the popularity of his empire. Because otherwise that idea sort of came out of nowhere. Why would she have said that? Heck, she might have opened it and seen the pictures of herself and Bill inside, and thought it was kind of sweet.
There are so many Heterodyne sigils out there, being used as lockets and pins and decoration of every kind (I mean, the Heterodynes, like Klaus, love to label their stuff) that I doubt Klaus, Lucrezia, or anyone else could specifically recognize a single one as having belonged to her at some point.

HandofShadows

2009-05-23, 08:38 AM

Maybe, maybe not. The last person to have the locket was Moloch (after he had broken it). Klaus clearly found it after he desicovered Agathay was a Heterodyne and then repaired it. Klaus had been with the Boys for a fair period of time and almost certainly would have recognized it as being built by one of them. He might have even known what it did. Since Klaus knew that the locket didn't belong to Moloch, it's belonging to Agatha is a very easy conclution to make. Not to mention the inscription saying "Return to Agatha Clay" on it. :smallbiggrin: Klaus knew it was special, otherwise he would have not fixed/rebuilt it and kept it with him in a special case.

slayerx

2009-05-23, 10:08 AM

I feel that Other-Suppression was an unexpected side effect of the device -

I agree... i mean, the device is basically a device that makes it hard to think and can thus render a spark stupid. The procession of Agatha by the Other is essentially a mental battle between the two of them... The locket has somehow lost it's effect on Agatha, but it still has it's full effect on the Other- the result? the locket makes it hard for the other to think, while Aagtha has no problem and thus winning the mental battle against the other becomes a cake walk for her.

Mauve Shirt

2009-05-23, 11:09 AM

I wonder if Agatha's recent attitude of "Cross me and die!" is a sign of Lucrezia breaking loose. It's never really been Agatha's style.

Rockphed

2009-05-23, 11:14 AM

I think it is more the castle and town getting to her. I suspect her father and uncle would go on like that in Mechanicsburg if people were being unhelpful.

Gez

2009-05-23, 11:22 AM

I wonder if Agatha's recent attitude of "Cross me and die!" is a sign of Lucrezia breaking loose. It's never really been Agatha's style.

Dunno, I got the impression she was mostly saying that because that was what the others wanted to hear. I mean, she had just gotten a lecture on the social dynamics of Sparks. :smallwink:

Myrdhale

2009-05-23, 11:42 AM

Gil was a toddler when Klaus returned from Skifander. I find it *highly unlikely* that he'd have access to Jager Tek when totally out of touch with Europe, which eliminates #3 in my mind.

Also, if he knew that he'd constructed the Perfect Heirtm, why would he spend so much time testing him?

Jager tek has definatly been implemented to help Gil. We saw that when Mama Ginka was able to heal him using techniques that would only affect Jagers. Additionally, I'm fairly sure that the mysterious wife Klaus mentioned way back when, who we can assume is Gil's mother, was most likely a woman of some importance in Skifander (knowing Klaus, the queen or princess :smallamused:), And seeing Zeetha, we see That Skifander blood has great potential for strengths and ability is properly trained (which is what Klaus has done.)
More then likely he enhanced Gil when he got back, for fear that someone from Skifander is coming to kill him (He told Gil that's why he thought Zeetha was here).

So it's not so much building the perfect heir, it's making sure his heir is perfect enough to survive in this world, which, despite the fun-tastic adventures it produces, seems pretty god-damned dangerous.

lord_khaine

2009-05-23, 12:16 PM

for fear that someone from Skifander is coming to kill him

Gil is proberly the biggest target for assasination in europe, surpassing even Klaus as im sure by now people have discovered how hard he is to kill.

so any potential assasin from skifander would proberly have to draw a number and wait in the very long line of people who wants to kill Gil.

HandofShadows

2009-05-23, 02:16 PM

It might start out as a long line, but once they started to try and kill Gil the line would get short very quickly. Not only is Gil very formidiable, trying to kill Gil would also tick off Agatha and Zetha as well as some of the Jagers.

Aidan305

2009-05-23, 03:03 PM

On the subject of Gil getting killed.

Othar's twitter says that he dies in Castle Hetrodyne.:smalleek:

Gez

2009-05-23, 03:20 PM

Gilgamesh Wulfenbach died inside Castle Heterodyne. Well...well good. He was a dirty fighter, what with all that "winning" all the time.
Ah, Othar. You can make the saddest things funny. :smallbiggrin:

datalaughing

2009-05-23, 06:17 PM

So it seems entirely possible that Gil's death might be prevented by the actions of Othar himself. If Othar's twitter is to be believed, and if it's not an entirely separate universe from the one our normal story is in (a distinct possibility), then something needs to happen to save Gil and stop the Other. Othar is the wild card. Suddenly his role is seeming quite a bit more significant in the overall story.

LurkerInPlayground

2009-05-24, 02:39 PM

Jager tek has definatly been implemented to help Gil. We saw that when Mama Ginka was able to heal him using techniques that would only affect Jagers. Additionally, I'm fairly sure that the mysterious wife Klaus mentioned way back when, who we can assume is Gil's mother, was most likely a woman of some importance in Skifander (knowing Klaus, the queen or princess :smallamused:), And seeing Zeetha, we see That Skifander blood has great potential for strengths and ability is properly trained (which is what Klaus has done.)
More then likely he enhanced Gil when he got back, for fear that someone from Skifander is coming to kill him (He told Gil that's why he thought Zeetha was here).

So it's not so much building the perfect heir, it's making sure his heir is perfect enough to survive in this world, which, despite the fun-tastic adventures it produces, seems pretty god-damned dangerous.
Everything said here is fraught with assumptions of too many distasteful kinds. We don't know that Klaus was married to anybody important in Skifander, although it is likely he married one of their girls and, by extension, learned some of their "warrior secrets."

There's no reason to assume that these secrets are unique to royalty. Nor is there any reason to suspect that their abilities are passed through the bloodline (and it's a stupid fantasy cliche anyway). What we *do* know is that Klaus gave Gil some Skifandrian warrior training -- although Zeetha didn't seem to care that Gil received such training.

At any rate, it's reasonable to assume that Klaus learned quite a number of Heterodyne biological secrets before or after his stay in Skiff, as he was a "close family friend."

Gez

2009-05-24, 03:09 PM

There's no reason to assume that these secrets are unique to royalty. Nor is there any reason to suspect that their abilities are passed through the bloodline (and it's a stupid fantasy cliche anyway).
"Know, Agatha Clay, that the warrior tradition of the royal house of Skifander is old, proud and jealously guarded. In this life I am allowed to train one besides my own daughters. I have chosen you. (http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20050216)"

There you go. :smallwink:

Hey, know what else is a stupid fantasy cliché? Scantily-clad warrior princesses. (http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20081022) :smallbiggrin:

Elaro

2009-05-24, 07:12 PM

Hey, bringing up the tw- I'm sorry, I can't bring myself to say "Othar's Twitter". Can we find a less anachronistic name for these bits of news? Maybe "Othar's Broadcast Telegram", or something?

Anyway, "it" doesn't say that Gil dies in the reconstruction of Castle Heterodyne (although it might). It's possible that Gil was assassinated by Other!Agatha when it (she?) broke free of the locket's restraint, and made it look like an accident/one of de Kestle's jokes gone wrong.

All I'm saying is that Othar may not have as much importance as it seems.

dogmac

2009-05-24, 09:46 PM

Othar's brain bursts, I think of them as.

Elaro

2009-05-24, 11:01 PM

Oh hey, yeah, good one.

Sneaky gate!

Well, well, well, looks like the tables have turned. Or is that the weapons?

Still, Agatha's little insult there seemed to lack kick. "Nasty warped little buffoon"? Really? I realize she's pissed, but still...

memnarch

2009-05-24, 11:12 PM

Thinking that she could have come up with a better insult? :smallwink:

datalaughing

2009-05-24, 11:31 PM

I think she really should have skipped the insult and jumped straight to the blasting people.

Gorgondantess

2009-05-25, 12:06 AM

I think she really should have skipped the insult and jumped straight to the blasting people.

Aye. It is rather pathetic...:smallsigh:

Oracle_Hunter

2009-05-25, 12:10 AM

Well now, Agatha is really beginning to wear the Villain Hat these days. First a casual threat, now an exclamation that includes Fool!

Of course, this can be just what Von Mekkan was talking about (http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20071005). Still, Gil's frightened expression in the last panel is telling - I think there's some shock mixed in with the massive amounts of pain.

So, bets on Wednesday?
(1) Death Ray hits, slagging the clank. Merlot is dead
(2) Death Ray misses, but the clank is disabled. Merlot is alive
(3) Third Party takes out Merlot before he can fire
(4) Third Party takes out Agatha before she can fire
(5) Weaponry Malfunction - nobody can fire and hilarity ensues

I'm thinking number 3 (Zeetha) since Agatha is giving into anger (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fE8PieLJttY&feature=related) which (I'm sure) is against the Skifandi Warrior Code.

I'm also going to hedge on 5, since it seems so right :smallbiggrin:

Xel

2009-05-25, 12:47 AM

I'll take 1.5: Death Ray hits, surgically disabling clank. Merlot lives, has complete frothing breakdown at being spared by Agatha. Gets to spend the rest of his life in the secondary kitchen.

My second choice is: Zola interrupts by triggering sabotaged Kestle-killer with amusing results. Merlot and Zola sit blinking stupidly at each other in aftermath.

But you're not properly celebrating the good news, here. The Death Ray is unbroken!! Yay!

As to Agatha acting somewhat villianous -- hasn't she always been a bit quick to anger? Gil's always been the nice, one. Agatha just rescues people, she doesn't mince about with HOW she does it.

EDIT: I guess my second choice falls into your option #3, strictly speaking.

evileeyore

2009-05-25, 05:30 AM

I just noticed something...

Irony of ironies, Merlot finally Sparks and he's still an ineffectual buffoon.

I wonder how he'll reconcile his continued failures in the face of his own Spark? (By blaming everyone else of course, duh.) But it will be -amusing- to watch.

So my vote goes with Merlot lives. Likely rendered unconscious by Zola. The only non-Spark in the room. :smallwink:

Gez

2009-05-25, 06:22 AM

Well now, Agatha is really beginning to wear the Villain Hat these days. First a casual threat, now an exclamation that includes Fool!

What about "Die, thing of evil! (http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20050221)"?

Or "I'll report this! Dr Beetle's clanks will come after you! They'll find you and they'll put you in a jar in University Square to rot! And I'll come every single day while you bake in the sun and starve and claw at the glass and scream as you die slowly like the miserable rats you are! (http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20021122)"? (Scenery chewage omitted from quote.)

Mauve Shirt

2009-05-25, 06:22 AM

Geez, Agatha. Watch it, you'll turn into a "true heterodyne"!

HandofShadows

2009-05-25, 07:05 AM

Gil and Agatha save each other's life in the space of 3 seconds. Agatha has to get it through her head she needs help from friends.

Felius

2009-05-25, 08:28 AM

Gez

2009-05-25, 08:47 AM

So I'd say she have a LOT of reason to be royally pissed off with him, and show that after all, she IS a heterodyne...

She always was:

"I'll report this! Dr Beetle's clanks will come after you! They'll find you and they'll put you in a jar in University Square to rot! And I'll come every single day while you bake in the sun and starve and claw at the glass and scream as you die slowly like the miserable rats you are! (http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20021122)"

Aidan305

2009-05-25, 09:56 AM

the Baron wouldn't have saw the hive that was at the university,
Actually, that was the main reason he was there.

Exachix

2009-05-25, 10:34 AM

<QUOTE>

She always was:
<QUOTE>

That rage of anger iirc wasn't at the Baron though, that was at those who stole her Locket.

Gez

2009-05-25, 10:38 AM

That rage of anger iirc wasn't at the Baron though, that was at those who stole her Locket.

Yeah, and... ? :smalltongue:

To be clear, the reason I was quoting that was merely to point out that since the very beginning Agatha was able to rage like the best evil geniuses out there, so it's not "the Other breaking loose" or "Mechanicsburg getting to her" -- it is her nature to say such things when she's stressed.

lord_khaine

2009-05-25, 10:41 AM

yeah, the Baron had allready figured it out, out from such things as The price on honey (http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20030115).

Irony of ironies, Merlot finally Sparks and he's still an ineffectual buffoon.

where do you have the idea that Merlot is a spark from? the only thing he has done is to go crazy with a borrowed heterodyne warmachine.

Gez

2009-05-25, 10:42 AM

where do you have the idea that Merlot is a spark from? the only thing he has done is to go crazy with a borrowed heterodyne warmachine.

Up until now, Phil Foglio has only used this type of speech balloons for Sparks in their "madness place". If Merlot didn't break through, he's the first non-Spark to use them...

eee

2009-05-25, 11:18 AM

Well now, Agatha is really beginning to wear the Villain Hat these days. First a casual threat, now an exclamation that includes Fool!

Villain Hat? More like Non-Sterotypical Heroine hat. I mean, she's threatened, and raged, and done a few things that Superman, for instance, wouldn't do (but Batman would. And Reed Richards might); but even when confronted with threats like Zola's henchman pulling a gun on her, she's gone for non-lethal attacks every time (bringing the roof down behind him, making him drop his gun and run, instead of just disintegrating him). And as for the 'Fool' speech: Sounds like accurate character assessment and truth telling, to me.

Of course, this can be just what Von Mekkan was talking about (http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20071005). Still, Gil's frightened expression in the last panel is telling - I think there's some shock mixed in with the massive amounts of pain.

So, bets on Wednesday?
(1) Death Ray hits, slagging the clank. Merlot is dead
(2) Death Ray misses, but the clank is disabled. Merlot is alive
(3) Third Party takes out Merlot before he can fire
(4) Third Party takes out Agatha before she can fire
(5) Weaponry Malfunction - nobody can fire and hilarity ensues

I'm thinking number 3 (Zeetha) since Agatha is giving into anger (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fE8PieLJttY&feature=related) which (I'm sure) is against the Skifandi Warrior Code.

I'm also going to hedge on 5, since it seems so right :smallbiggrin:

I'll go with (6) the Foglios do something none of us expect that blows our socks off. After all, that's what they usually do...

Regardless of what happens, I hope Merlot survives. So that, captive and helpless, he can watch Agatha go on to become the all powerful Heterodyne, more successful than he could have imained. The unrelenting and ever growing rage he'll feel will be a better punishment for his crimes than death.

Morty

2009-05-25, 11:35 AM

This better not lead to another monolgue, this time on Agatha's part. Just shoot him already.

Pantler

2009-05-25, 11:52 AM

slayerx

2009-05-25, 12:44 PM

Please, everyone note, that while agatha isn't at fault for Doctor Merlot plight (except for existing), Doctor Merlot is actually pretty much in fault for everything Agatha has gone through until now. If it weren't for him, Dr. Beetle would still be alive, the Baron wouldn't have saw the hive that was at the university, and etc. Now, due only to his actions, he have ended in castle heterodyne, blames Agatha for it, and is trying to kill her.

First, as others have said, the Baron came there knowing about the hive engine... Dr.Beetle would still be alive but he'd probably would have become one of the baron's experiments

Second of all, Agatha would have still broken through to build a clank to find the person that stole her locket and thus would have still been discovered by the baron.

So everything would have went down more or less the same with or without merlot

Up until now, Phil Foglio has only used this type of speech balloons for Sparks in their "madness place". If Merlot didn't break through, he's the first non-Spark to use them...
Does he only use it for sparks in their "madness place" or just anybody who has gone "mad"?

If i recall, sparks are the ONLY ones we have seen go "mad" and that happens to be the time foglio uses those speech bubbles... Merlot right now is definitely going mad right now... but do the foglios use those speech bubbles for sparks going mad, or just about ANYONE going mad...

Not to mention that Merlot doesn't display the key quality of a spark that breaks through... typically, when a spark breaks through they go on a seriously mad episode where they wind up creating some kind of hideous monstrosity of science... generally something they may just kill them (http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20040409)... also, that war machine is a little too well put together to possibly be Merlot's breakthrough device

evileeyore

2009-05-25, 04:48 PM

Does he only use it for sparks in their "madness place" or just anybody who has gone "mad"?

I doubt the Madness Place Bubbles are used for simple insanity. It would blur the line too much...

But we've yet to experience someone going "mad". Horribly upset? Yes. Murderously angry? Yes. But so far, not "mad" persay.

Not to mention that Merlot doesn't display the key quality of a spark that breaks through... typically, when a spark breaks through they go on a seriously mad episode where they wind up creating some kind of hideous monstrosity of science...

Sure... but not always. Also this is Gil talking about it. Obviously not all Sparks break through and go mad or destroy themselves, else there'd be no Sparks.

...also, that war machine is a little too well put together to possibly be Merlot's breakthrough device

Merlot was a very talented scientist/engineer before hand with years of experience. Besides, he may have stumbled across the warmachine and rebuilt it or repurposed it as his breakthrough method.

ripple

2009-05-25, 11:26 PM

About the font(s):

Does he only use it for sparks in their "madness place" or just anybody who has gone "mad"?

If i recall, sparks are the ONLY ones we have seen go "mad" and that happens to be the time foglio uses those speech bubbles... Merlot right now is definitely going mad right now... but do the foglios use those speech bubbles for sparks going mad, or just about ANYONE going mad...

I doubt the Madness Place Bubbles are used for simple insanity. It would blur the line too much...

But we've yet to experience someone going "mad". Horribly upset? Yes. Murderously angry? Yes. But so far, not "mad" persay.

If it weren't for the fact that Professora K. Foglio does all the lettering (from what I think we know) then I'd guess that the wrong font was used. It's still possible that she was in a hurry or that we've misinterpreted the meaning of the "spark speech bubbles". But overall, in my mind there's at least a 40% chance that Merlot just had his breakthrough...a bit too late.

As interesting and tense as things are in the Castle right now (we're possibly heading for a cliffhanger where Zeethiggs, Von Pinn, and Othar all walk in on the Merlot/Agatha/Gil confrontation, which I think would take three pages of DR. SCOTT! JANET! BRAD! ROCKY!! to sort out), I'm quite interested in what's going on in Othar's World O'Twitter.

If Othar was on an island and is now reading about events after the fact in the Heidelburg student newspaper, but simultaneously Othar was decanted at Klaus's feet recently (http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20090128), is there *any* way that the Twitter events can be canon? And if so, what does that mean? And if not, why in the world are the Professors throwing in a little extra mind-screw on the side?

--ripple

chionophile

2009-05-25, 11:40 PM

So I guess no one else has noticed that the same speech bubbles that Merlot is using now are also used by the Jaegers (constantly) and monsters on rampages (see: Demon Horse, Bridgemonsters) as well as Sparks being sparky. Merlot has not broken through, he's just really angry and a bit whacked.

Midnight Lurker

2009-05-26, 12:00 AM

Remember, the full Madness Place effect is denoted by a combination of scary font, wavy speech bubbles, and floaty bits of wavy speech bubble. We can't be sure unless he gets the trifecta.

Gez

2009-05-26, 04:10 AM

lord_khaine

2009-05-26, 08:49 AM

well, do we have any examples of a non-spark getting really angry?

Gez

2009-05-26, 09:51 AM

well, do we have any examples of a non-spark getting really angry?

Well, possibly Merlot. That's why the jury is still out. He's the first normal human to use them without us knowing whether he has the Spark or not.

chionophile

2009-05-26, 10:25 AM

They're Spark-made.

That seems like a cop-out. Sparks can imbue their creations with special speech bubbles? Too much breaking the fourth wall. Speech bubbles like that just give an idea of what the character sounds like, the Foglios are good at using different ones for different situations. I stand by my statement that Merlot is not breaking through and will not. His whole character is based on him being jealous of those who have the spark.

EENick

2009-05-26, 11:11 AM

Oh man, the Twitter story is getting better and better.
So far it looks like the Otehr breaks through in Agatha, kills Gil, gets in control of Klaus (since he already has been infected by a wasp!), marries him and subdues most of Europe before hell breaks loose.

It does look like we are getting some major hints from Othar as to the future of the comic. Some names of people and places names we've not seen before like Pax Transylvania and Duchess of Omsk.

Years into the future too which is odd given the comic has only cover a few months so far. I wonder if we'll see a time jump after the Castle is restored.

Further given that we know the travel is a huge part of the story and a large part of the Other's plan I think it is probably safe to assume Othar might locate the Other's time machine, travel back in time, change his gender and proceed to manipulate events to destory all the sparks as the Other armed with his/her own future history! Of course he'll wipe out all the non-spark too for good measure otherwise new sparks will just be born at some future point when poor Other/Othar won't be there to kill them and his whole life's work will be ruined.

Think about it, it could all make sense.

Person: "Who are you?"
Othar: "Me I'm Oth...er...Other! Yes that is it I'm the other!"
:smallbiggrin:

Do you really think it is a coincidence how close Other is to Othar??? o_O

Mauve Shirt

2009-05-26, 11:51 AM

Dang it, I'm going to have to read his twitter now. :smallsigh:

EENick

2009-05-26, 11:57 AM

If you do try reading it on the main site here (http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/fun/twitter_othar_01.php) for the older storylines. It is MUCH easier then trying to use twitter to go all the way back to the start.

Cyan

2009-05-26, 10:50 PM

Sneaky Gate!
Looks like der Kestle finally retook control of the area?

ripple

2009-05-26, 11:00 PM

Sneaky Gate!
Looks like der Kestle finally retook control of the area?

(waits until 0000 to post)
Sure looks that way...that looks like a hydraulic flattener coming
down, although my immediate reaction to Agatha's "You!" was to
think that Von Pinn had arrived (until I went and actually looked
at the artwork.) So, why the glowing eldritch-runey-things on
that hydraulic flattener? Just greebling (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greeble)?

And perhaps the "You!" is because this is a different portion of
Der Kestle Brain, with a different intonation or attitude, possibly
the "insane" part that had killed the fun-sized tigerdog clank?
If so, then why did it rise up and smite Merlot mightily, instead
of killing the spark holding the explosive space modulator?

--ripple

Xel

2009-05-26, 11:12 PM

(waits until 0000 to post)
Sure looks that way...that looks like a hydraulic flattener coming
down, although my immediate reaction to Agatha's "You!" was to
think that Von Pinn had arrived (until I went and actually looked
at the artwork.) So, why the glowing eldritch-runey-things on
that hydraulic flattener? Just greebling (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greeble)?

And perhaps the "You!" is because this is a different portion of
Der Kestle Brain, with a different intonation or attitude, possibly
the "insane" part that had killed the fun-sized tigerdog clank?
If so, then why did it rise up and smite Merlot mightily, instead
of killing the spark holding the explosive space modulator?

--ripple

Der Kestle FTW!!!

But you missed one possibility: Dingbot + Aetheric Junction + Kestle connection (http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20090401) => Massive killing machine + humor

The Glyphstone

2009-05-26, 11:17 PM

Alas, poor Merlot, we knew thee well. And now you're Merlot jelly.

SirSigfried

2009-05-26, 11:23 PM

It seems that Der Kestle won't tolerate Kestle sized holes in rampaging minion material.

slayerx

2009-05-26, 11:28 PM

Well, if merlot just went squish, then i think we can put the the breakthrough argument aside... i mean, what's the point of having him breakthrough if your gonna kill him before we can even confirm it... he didn't even do anything very sparky

Though y'know, i do hope we get to actually witness a true spark breakthrough... i want to see just how mad and insane a new spark gets during their moment of awakening as spark

Sure... but not always. Also this is Gil talking about it. Obviously not all Sparks break through and go mad or destroy themselves, else there'd be no Sparks.

Actually just the "destory themselves" part is obvious... but go mad and create something dangerous/unstable/and COULD kill them is standard practice... This is exactly why Gil was so surprised that Agatha's breakthrough device was benign because it was vastly different then what happens to other sparks... essentially a breakthrough seems to be like a massive jump into "the maddness place" coupled with the need to create some kind of creation which essentially somehow matches the creator's insane mindset... there is probably alot a lot of evil laughing... Agatha ofcourse was the exception to this as the device on her neck kept her from fully breaking through

And i'm not sure what your point is about Gil... the fact that the info is coming from Gil should only support my argument... i mean, his father has been studying the spark for years and has likely documented every case of the spark he could find in his studies... Klaus could easily be called one of the foremost experts on "the spark"... as such, Gil would be an extention of that knowledge making him arguable the second most qualified authority on spark behavior

Merlot was a very talented scientist/engineer before hand with years of experience. Besides, he may have stumbled across the warmachine and rebuilt it or repurposed it as his breakthrough method.
But my point is that during a breakthrough the creation process is much more mad and far less logical... If he were a spark breaking through he'd probably be sticking on numerous extra guns, melee weapons and a few other things that may not even have much purpose... the breathrough is more rapid and insane than precise and logical

Oracle_Hunter

2009-05-26, 11:56 PM

VariaVespasa

2009-05-27, 03:28 AM

Well a less ax-crazy section of the castle could well be considered a dangerous form of insanity by the rest of it. We shall see. :)

lord_khaine

2009-05-27, 03:38 AM

hmm, yes, if the personalities were fragmentet, then we can proberly assume that there will be fragments who are less hostile and homocidial than the old castle.

Jahkaivah

2009-05-27, 06:22 AM

Ah, option #3 with our special guest - Der Kestle :smallbiggrin:

The question now is: did Der Kestle just take control or has it been eavesdropping for quite some time now?

It could be Crazy Kestle, but if it is it would appear that it is Bored With Insanity (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/BoredWithInsanity) and is now less Ax Crazy (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/AxCrazy?from=Main.AxeCrazy) than the real Kestle

We already know the loyal part of Der Kestle can observe the area they are in. But it supposedly had no control of the area.

So... I see 5 possibilities...

1, Der Kestle lied.
2, Der Kestle managed to gain access to the area by itelf.
3, Der Kestle managed to gain access with help of a third party.
4, This is Crazy Kestle, now convinced that the Girl who's looking to be a very likely Heterodyne problably shouldn't die.
5, The Foglios did something unexpected.

Tanaar

2009-05-27, 06:30 AM

Oooh, a Girl Genius thread in GitP! How have I not taken note of this before?

Personally, my money is on Der Kestle finally getting some control over this section of its personality. It told Agatha it was going to try and oust the insane fraction, ja? Agatha's 'You!' outburst was her old-school Heterodyne side showing again, as Der Kestle stole her kill during what should have been a minor Crowning Moment of Awesome (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/SugarWiki/CrowningMomentOfAwesome?from=Main.CrowningMomentOf Awesome).

Alternatively, it is Insane Kestle simply pwning Merlot. I don't follow some of you folks' attachment to him, never liked him, even as an antagonist. Next to people like Herr Baron and The Other, he's small potatoes. Sorry, was small potatoes. Now he's Jäger chow.

Gez

2009-05-27, 06:37 AM

Next to people like Herr Baron and The Other, he's small potatoes. Sorry, was small potatoes. Now he's Jäger chow.

No. Now iz still small potatoes. Mashed potatoes.

Jäger don't eat roadkill. Except bogz. Merlot iz not bog. But he went splash like bog!

Jahkaivah

2009-05-27, 07:57 AM

*Sudden realisation*

No no no no, wait hang on...... this doesn't fit, what Agatha says there conflicts with the "the Cryptographers already told the Baron" possibility, and Merlot's Medium-sized No confirms that she was spot on, afterall surely Merlot would know that whether or not the Baron had already known about it before he got hauled off to Castle Heterodyne?.

Which brings us back to my original question:

How did the Baron recover the notes?
(http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20060324)
..... Hmm.... there is one other explanation, upon being asigned the job the Cryptographers had sending copies of the incrypted notes to the Baron, and when the Baron learns of the notes destruction he decides to decrypt them himself, possibly before or after Agatha's heritage is discovered, but finish decryption too late either way.

Still a plot hole of course since this explanation isn't explicidly stated....

Mauve Shirt

2009-05-27, 08:34 AM

Did the castle just drop a gigantic rock on Merlot?
The castle (well, our castle) must have gotten control over this section.

lord_khaine

2009-05-27, 09:36 AM

Did the castle just drop a gigantic rock on Merlot?
The castle (well, our castle) must have gotten control over this section.

we cant be sure, whatever fragment that control this part might as well just have gotten tired of Merlot

Meltemi

2009-05-27, 09:51 AM

It seems likely that it simply took Agatha at her word. She is obviously a powerful Spark, whether or not this particular section of the Castle believes her to be a Heterodyne, and if she says she's going to blast a hole the size of the Castle through and around Merlot, there are plenty of Sparks the Castle has known that would mean that literally.

multilis

2009-05-27, 10:50 AM

It is possible that the "insane" part of castle is also loyal to Agatha (after hearing from everybody who she is) and thinks the other part of castle is the insane part.

Or of course as already mentioned the attempt to gain control may have been successful, perhaps due to dingbot.

On Othar Twitter, a previous twitter adventure had multiple Othars, more than one might still be around. The one in castle might die/disappear/become the "Other". (If so it may end up being another Othar verses clone Othar adventure)

As well Von Pinn may have started out as a clone who then died then became a construct.

Zazu Yen

2009-05-27, 11:23 AM

Ah Merlot: grown, ripened, picked, crushed.... aged then bottled?

This part of the insane castle would want a Spark to fix it, not believing they're a certified Heterodyne but valuing the Spark non the less.

But my bet goes to the "sane" part of the Kestle gaining control of this section and watching events for a little while to see how things were going, stepping in only when a true throw down was eminent.

EDIT: OR looking back over the last two pages the Kestle did NOT want Agatha firing that death ray at a high enough power to put a "hole the size of the castle" in Merlot. In a sense, it squashed Merlot in self defense before Agatha could fire.

This implies that the castle we're dealing with is the "sane" one who knows what that death ray can do.

Oracle_Hunter

2009-05-27, 12:59 PM

No no no no, wait hang on...... this doesn't fit, what Agatha says there conflicts with the "the Cryptographers already told the Baron" possibility, and Merlot's Medium-sized No confirms that she was spot on, afterall surely Merlot would know that whether or not the Baron had already known about it before he got hauled off to Castle Heterodyne?.
Note that Agatha doesn't really know when Merlot broke Beetle's code. She assumes that he did it while she was still on Castle Wulfenbach; Klaus indicates (http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20040802) that he didn't see the notes until after she left. (http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20060324)

Merlot's small no is the realization that his own stupidity has, once again, caused him to get the foul end of the stick. His enraged no is his standard response (http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20090518) to finding this out.

Zazu Yen

2009-05-27, 01:50 PM

Mauve Shirt

2009-05-27, 02:03 PM

Question: What are the glowy blue things on the stone that was just dropped?

EENick

2009-05-27, 03:03 PM

You know it could be some sort of vaccume rather then just an overly large blunt object. We don't see any gears or blood after all. Perhaps the castle didn't just kill him after all.

Does the castle remind anyone else of Blane The Mono from the Dark Tower?

slayerx

2009-05-27, 05:51 PM

Greep

2009-05-27, 06:08 PM

W: None of the above.

Heterodyne castle: "Be careful, you are about to leave the area under my direct control"

Somethin's gotta happen concerning that eventually ;)

Bwahahaha, greep wins again.

Anyways one of the glowy blue things is the heterodyne symbol, dunno what the others are. Maybe the oriental version of lorum dipsum >.>

Jahkaivah

2009-05-27, 06:24 PM

Note that Agatha doesn't really know when Merlot broke Beetle's code. She assumes that he did it while she was still on Castle Wulfenbach; Klaus indicates (http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20040802) that he didn't see the notes until after she left. (http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20060324)

Merlot's small no is the realization that his own stupidity has, once again, caused him to get the foul end of the stick. His enraged no is his standard response (http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20090518) to finding this out.

It's... flimsy, Klaus would have wanted to question Merlot about Agatha if he was hauled off after Agatha escaped, so it seems unlikely that he could go from burning the university to Der Kestle without learning about these details...

One last thing I noticed, Klaus said "I finally cracked them", yeah I reckon the cryptographers were sending Klaus copies of any encrypted notes they find (which would be the logical thing to do).

Klaus didn't bother decrypting them himself at that point since he wasn't aware of any immediate urgency, the cryptographers manage to find out about Agatha while she was still on Castle Wulfenbach, Merlot not knowing where Agatha was burns the University down to keep his own hide safe (he problably knew that Klaus had a copy but he chanced that he would either be unable or not bother to decrypt them, atleast not untill he has time to escape), however he is caught and then sent to Der Kestle.

Then it hits the fan and Agatha's identity is discovered, she escapes, and Klaus, now motivated to found out as much as he can starts decrypting the copy of the notes he was sent, he can't question Merlot now that he's stuck in Der Kestle so Merlot is stuck with just the knowledge possessed in Beetle's notes and nothing else.

Greep

2009-05-27, 09:11 PM

This really makes me wonder. If beetle knew who Agatha was, his holding a hive machine and his throwing a bomb at, supposedly, Agatha, are a lot more significant.

LurkerInPlayground

2009-05-27, 09:41 PM

This really makes me wonder. If beetle knew who Agatha was, his holding a hive machine and his throwing a bomb at, supposedly, Agatha, are a lot more significant.
Well, we've known this for some time. Gil already suspected it earlier and Merlot's story merely confirms it. Agatha initially brushed this off, since Beetle was her beloved mentor. Klaus explained that Beetle knew who Agatha was to Dupree on his way to invade Sturmhalten.

Beetle simply wanted to hide his bid for power and it seems his plans were pretty much the same as what Tarvek and family wanted to do: back-engineer the Other's tech, with some help from Agatha, and take over Europe. He probably wanted to figure out the voice-lock that Lucrezia has on all her tech and maybe use Agatha as a pawn for other things as well.

Aquillion

2009-05-28, 08:22 AM

This really makes me wonder. If beetle knew who Agatha was, his holding a hive machine and his throwing a bomb at, supposedly, Agatha, are a lot more significant.It's also inherent in his notes (why else would he think she could control slavers?)

And, as I recall, it's in the secret blueprints (on Adam and Lilith's page; "Beetle was the only other person who knew who Agatha was...")

lord_khaine

2009-05-28, 08:49 AM

Beetle simply wanted to hide his bid for power and it seems his plans were pretty much the same as what Tarvek and family wanted to do: back-engineer the Other's tech, with some help from Agatha, and take over Europe. He probably wanted to figure out the voice-lock that Lucrezia has on all her tech and maybe use Agatha as a pawn for other things as well.

no, Beetle wasnt plotting for power, it has been implied that both he and Adam&Lillith belived that Klaus was the Other, so he was seaching for a way to combat the Slaver Wasps, and the reason he throw a bomb at Agatha was because he though Klaus was going to turn them into Revenants.

Aidan305

2009-05-28, 09:43 AM

I'm fairly certain that it's mentioned somewhere that Beetle wanted to use Agatha and the Wasps to gain enough power to be able to protect his city from Klaus.

The Glyphstone

2009-05-28, 10:01 AM

New crazy theory:

It's already been suggested that we would have a new player enter the game - what if that's what happened? Agatha's outburst indicates that she recognizes this Kestle voice, which could mean it's the local 'crazy Kestle' or the 'Sane Kestle' that's obeying her....what if it's the Main Kestle in the Crypt, restored to local control by Dingbot's tinkering? She doesn't seem happy to hear the voice, though whether it's because she doesn't like the voice's owner or because it crushed Merlot is unknown.

Jahkaivah

2009-05-28, 10:32 AM

New crazy theory:

It's already been suggested that we would have a new player enter the game - what if that's what happened? Agatha's outburst indicates that she recognizes this Kestle voice, which could mean it's the local 'crazy Kestle' or the 'Sane Kestle' that's obeying her....what if it's the Main Kestle in the Crypt, restored to local control by Dingbot's tinkering?

Or the it's the Kestle kitchen, which has taken a good look at her (http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20080319) blood. (http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20080321)

HandofShadows

2009-05-28, 11:51 AM

no, Beetle wasnt plotting for power, it has been implied that both he and Adam&Lillith belived that Klaus was the Other, so he was seaching for a way to combat the Slaver Wasps, and the reason he throw a bomb at Agatha was because he though Klaus was going to turn them into Revenants.

This leads to a "Who REALLY was the Other?" again though. Agatha was clearly sent to Beetle after being taken from the Spider Women. I find it a bit hard to belive that Agatha's mom was able to fool the Boys into beliving that she was not the Other and it was really Klaus. Unless she really was not the Other and she honestly didn't know who it was, beliving it really was Klaus. Of course this leads back to the Other being a construct of some sort that has Lucrecias memoriers/mind.

Calemyr

2009-05-28, 03:46 PM

Let's think about this for a second. Klaus disappears mysteriously just before Lucrezia has a change of heart and agrees to marry Bill. Lucrezia then disappears about the same time the Other shows up. The Other disappears and suddenly here's Klaus again, in full badass mode and ready to pound the world into submission if it gets out of hand... What would you think if you were Punch or Judy?

No matter how you look at it, the timing is more than a bit suspicious. Perhaps Klaus was an intimate companion of the Other? Perhaps Klaus was the Other and was using Lucrezia as his pawn? Perhaps the Other had kept Klaus in a closet as a spare body in case Lucrezia was killed or unable to succeed in her objectives? Perhaps that was the plan all along, to use the Other to destabilize the world and Klaus to reshape it as he saw fit? You have to admit, none of these are all that outlandish compared to the truth as we know it.

Oracle_Hunter

2009-05-28, 05:14 PM

Let's think about this for a second. Klaus disappears mysteriously just before Lucrezia has a change of heart and agrees to marry Bill. Lucrezia then disappears about the same time the Other shows up. The Other disappears and suddenly here's Klaus again, in full badass mode and ready to pound the world into submission if it gets out of hand... What would you think if you were Punch or Judy?
Actually, they're hiding from Klaus because Barry told them to. (http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20040809) Apparently, Barry had some good reason (http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20060324) to suspect Klaus - and recall that Barry would have been on the trail of The Other pretty much all of the time.

slayerx

2009-05-28, 05:25 PM

Let's think about this for a second. Klaus disappears mysteriously just before Lucrezia has a change of heart and agrees to marry Bill. Lucrezia then disappears about the same time the Other shows up. The Other disappears and suddenly here's Klaus again, in full badass mode and ready to pound the world into submission if it gets out of hand... What would you think if you were Punch or Judy?

Klaus also came back with a son...
But really, saying Klaus is or some way related to the other JUST because he went missing during those years is a SERIOUS leap in logic. I mean, Klaus was one of the good guys, he was close friends to both Bill and Barry, and he fought the good fight right by their sides... to go from THAT to the Other is a huge leap... frankly it's so much easier to just conclude his disappearance was just a coincidence and the other was some other spark

The theory i'm going with is that the one who attacked the castle was Klaus from the future, via time travel. Most likely under the command of clank Lucrezia

Aquillion

2009-05-28, 10:19 PM

This leads to a "Who REALLY was the Other?" again though. Agatha was clearly sent to Beetle after being taken from the Spider Women. I find it a bit hard to belive that Agatha's mom was able to fool the Boys into beliving that she was not the Other and it was really Klaus. Unless she really was not the Other and she honestly didn't know who it was, beliving it really was Klaus. Of course this leads back to the Other being a construct of some sort that has Lucrecias memoriers/mind.
The problem with this, as I've said over and over, is that when the Other possessed Agatha, she showed detailed knowledge of things only Lucrezia should know (her reminiscing over Klaus, for instance). She also referred to Agatha as her daughter (http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20061115) -- in a monologue to herself.

The Other is Lucrezia. Maybe there are other versions of Lucrezia out there (heck, we know about two already), but the entity that possessed Agatha was clearly the Other (she was instantly recognized by all the Other's minions, had the Other's tech, and so forth), and was also clearly the mind of Agatha's mother, who has been canonically stated by the Foglios to be Lucrezia.

I mean, yes, I know epileptic tree theories are fun, and nothing prevents a shocking swerve where things like that line where the Other unambiguously refers to Agatha as her daughter in an internal monologue are all a dream or something -- but I'm getting tired of the sheer persistence of those theories. We have seen huge amounts of extremely difficult to explain away evidence that the Other is Lucrezia, and the only real reason anyone doubts this is "well, but she's acting really weird."

She's a Spark. She's insane even by the standards of a Spark, and it looks like she has a habit of making duplicates of herself with a distressing desire to kill the original (Clank-Lucrezia tried to have Agatha-Lucrezia offed at the first chance, say), likely while sending them backwards or forwards through time. Some of her actions probably wouldn't make sense to her, not even if you gave her a detailed map.

Felius

2009-05-28, 11:09 PM

Seems this will lead to some catfight...

Popcorn?

Oracle_Hunter

2009-05-28, 11:10 PM

All hands to the Sneaky Gate - there be a strip up there!
I did not foresee this. Zola has joined Team Heterodyne? :smalleek:

dogmac

2009-05-28, 11:11 PM

Nah, I think it is more "Zola flirts with Gil"

You schmooze you lose, Agatha!

Oracle_Hunter

2009-05-28, 11:13 PM

Nah, I think it is more "Zola flirts with Gil"

You schmooze you lose, Agatha!
Considering Agatha has already threatened Zola with DOOM, the fact that she stuck around to take care of Gil means that she's planning on sticking around for the duration.

Now that's twue wuv :smalltongue:

Also: why is Sleipnir plugging Krosp into Der Kestle? :smallconfused:

Cyan

2009-05-28, 11:15 PM

Iiiiiiinteresting. So she didn't escape after all. Well, that takes care of several potential wandering groups. Now we're down to just Othar and Von Pinn, I believe.

So much for the love triangle. Shall we call it... a love parallelogram?

Rockphed

2009-05-28, 11:20 PM

So much for the love triangle. Shall we call it... a love parallelogram?

Surely it is already a more than 2d relationship graph when you include the Zeegatha, Zeethiggs, Moletta, Tarvamesh, and Tarletta angles. Somebody needs to make a graph.

memnarch

2009-05-28, 11:22 PM

All hands to the Sneaky Gate - there be a strip up there!
I did not foresee this. Zola has joined Team Heterodyne? :smalleek:

Comics go up @12am eastern us time, if they're right on the dot.

...

Also: why is Sleipnir plugging Krosp into Der Kestle? :smallconfused:

Because it's amusing; got to love the little details like Krosp's whiskers arcing. :smallbiggrin:

ripple

2009-05-28, 11:26 PM

So much for the love triangle. Shall we call it... a love parallelogram?

At this point it's not a parallelogram because not all the points connect in reasonable ways (Tarvek is unlikely to simply fall in love with Zola, for example).

Given that both the men are in need of hospital beds (one already turning into a blueberry) I'm guessing that Professora Kaja had some influence on the scripting of this portion...time for some strong female characters with a minimally male supporting cast.

If I had to describe this, it wouldn't be as a love triangle or parallelogram...more like a love tossed salad with blueberries and smashed merlot dressing.

why is Sleipnir plugging Krosp into Der Kestle? :smallconfused:

Sleipnir is looking in the same direction as Theo, but she's smiling and distracted while Theo is scared and Krosp looks disgusted, while Zeetha looks in a different direction entirely. I'm guessing that Der Kestle is showing JagerPorn up there on a large screen, and that we've just learned something about exactly what floats Sleipnir's boat...

So, who wants to start the betting pool on who will encounter Von Pinn first? The Zeethiggs/Theo/Sleipnir party, or the Gilgatha+Zoe party, or Tarvek and cousin? I'm betting we won't see Othar again until July given the update frequency...

--ripple

Deus_e_Machina

2009-05-28, 11:33 PM

Also: why is Sleipnir plugging Krosp into Der Kestle? :smallconfused:

Obviously Krosp is a catalyst.

(Should I have bolded that, just in case?)

Xel

2009-05-29, 12:47 AM

Sleipnir is just providing light to Theo, courtesy of Krosp's whiskers. Same as Zeetha is doing with that clamp. Theo is worried, 'cause he's trying to repair something (notice the wrench), and he's probably not sure he's doing it right. Sleipnir has faith in him, so is enjoying watching (ok, I'm stretching here).

Hey, Agatha's arm-slice from the first kitchen is back. Evidently it came back on Wednesday's page, but I hadn't noticed. Also, is that blood spatter all over her apron? Either Merlot squished more than it appeared, or that's back from the earlier incidents as well.

Midnight Lurker

2009-05-29, 01:01 AM

So much for the love triangle. Shall we call it... a love parallelogram?
I think I'm going to start rooting for Agatha/Gil/Zola as my OT3 (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/OT3). :smalltongue:

Oracle_Hunter

2009-05-29, 01:17 AM

I think I'm going to start rooting for Agatha/Gil/Zola as my OT3 (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/OT3). :smalltongue:
Hawt :smallbiggrin:

...anyways, I like it more than Agatha's preferred solution. (http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20081121)

Re: Agatha's Clothing
Phil's been really bad at keeping track of status this whole Arc (:smallfrown:) but the blood on her apron comes from her time working on Tarvek. (http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20090216)

Deus_e_Machina

2009-05-29, 02:17 AM

...anyways, I like it more than Agatha's preferred solution. (http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20081121)

You got me re-reading that bit of filler, and I noticed something I'd missed on this page (http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20081126) - those two little speech bubbles on the bottom left of the panel where Agatha discusses her spare projects. It took me a moment to get who was talking there, too... but the pun is quite simply amazing.

Lord Iames Osari

2009-05-29, 02:29 AM

Am I the only person who noticed that Zola has her Ruthless FaceTM on? And she knows that Gil is the Wulfenbach heir now... I'm not so sure we should be so quick to assume that's a bottle of medicine she's about to pour into Gil's wound.

lord_khaine

2009-05-29, 03:07 AM

and i am sure we can assume she wont try and croak Gil, to start with he is her friend, and im sure even she is smart enough to realise she wont survive killing him.

Gez

2009-05-29, 05:00 AM

datalaughing

2009-05-29, 05:34 AM

slayerx

2009-05-29, 05:49 AM

Yeah, what the hell was up with the clank army? According to the plan they were supposed to wait like a year or two after Zola took over. Instead they showed up the same day she did. That's some pretty crappy timing.

It was lead by the guy from Sturmhalten. So maybe they thought Tarvek had vanished or knew that he'd been captured by the baron. Either way their plan for him wouldn't fly. I mean, they could have waited to see if he'd get better and make it back. Not really sure what they were thinking there.

I think what may have happened was that they wanted to take their chance to get rid of Klaus... the baron was gonna be a huge risk factor in their plans if he was left alone, so they wanted to get rid of him; essentially, try to seize control of the empire without zola, saving her for when they want to take the rest of europa and gain solid control

only probably with that theory though, is the fact the clank army demanded both Klaus AND the heterodyne heir... it would work if they were talking about Agatha, but they wouldn't know she was currently there... not to mention that Zola should have been informed on any kind of changes to the plan... though then again she IS just a pawn...

HandofShadows

2009-05-29, 07:13 AM

I don't think Zola is out to hurt Gil. In fact the way she talks, she is acting like she and Gil where back in Paris. (After being crushed she slipped into an old/familiar/safe mode of thinking). Looks like I was wrong about Der Kastel not taking action when it could of, but it does seem that it might have been watching Gil to see what his real intentions where. I guess it made up it's mind that it it trusts him and company (a little).

Mauve Shirt

2009-05-29, 11:40 AM

Oh there's Zeetha's group! :smallbiggrin: Good to see them.
And don't pout too much Agatha, how do you think he'd feel about Tarvek? Well, if she visibly liked Tarvek.

Zazu Yen

2009-05-29, 11:41 AM

I also don't think Zola will hurt Gil at this point. If she wanted to do him in, or Agatha for that matter, the time would have been ripe before Merlot was pancaked.

But Agatha might not see it that way, her expression and the gold star emote don't really give away much. She could begrudgingly thank Zola for helping Gil then rush him to the infirmary, OR she could go spar thinking Zola is trying to put poison or something worse into him.

Verrry interesting indeed.

Oracle_Hunter

2009-05-29, 12:18 PM

But Agatha might not see it that way, her expression and the gold star emote don't really give away much. She could begrudgingly thank Zola for helping Gil then rush him to the infirmary, OR she could go spar thinking Zola is trying to put poison or something worse into him.
Oh, I think Agatha is just started to find:
(1) Zola is still here
(2) Zola is making a hostile boarding action against the S.S. Agamesh

I don't quite know why it is a "gold star emote" but I'm sure someone else will point it out :smalltongue:

The Glyphstone

2009-05-29, 12:34 PM

I can totally see the following scene;

Agatha: What you doing? Get away from him!
Zola: Helping him, can't you see he's hurt?
A: I can fix him - that's my job, not yours!
Castle: Oh Really? Is that why the other young man you have is currently lying in the medical lab turning several intriguing shades of purple?
A:...NOT HELPING!
C: *snicker*

Morty

2009-05-29, 12:35 PM

I found the golden star curious, but now I think it might be an expletive. I'm also curious what is Zeetha looking at.

Rockphed

2009-05-29, 01:27 PM

I am surprised that nobody has made a love dodecahedron for Girl Genius yet. Therefore, I just made one. Unfortunately it doesn't seem to like being uploaded onto the internet. If you want the original, I guess I could send you a copy...

http://i137.photobucket.com/albums/q235/Rockphed/Lovediagram.jpg

Gez

2009-05-29, 02:04 PM

I am surprised that nobody has made a love dodecahedron for Girl Genius yet. Therefore, I just made one. Unfortunately it doesn't seem to like being uploaded onto the internet.

Use Imageshack, it won't resize. If you get the "no files were uploaded" error, click on "old version (http://www.imageshack.us/?no_multi=1)".

memnarch

2009-05-29, 04:49 PM

Use photobucket, pretty much universally accessible. Also, change the "reduce to" option from 800x600 to 1 megabyte.

Gez

2009-05-29, 04:54 PM

Use photobucket

That's what he did.

memnarch

2009-05-29, 05:32 PM

But he didn't follow the second part of my post which said

.... Also, change the "reduce to" option from 800x600 to 1 megabyte.

eee

2009-05-29, 08:47 PM

I must say, I'm disappointed Zola didn't take advantage of the massive distraction Merlot provided to flee; although now that I think about it, I can understand it. It would have been the sensible thing for her to get as far away from Agatha as possible, given she's managed to irritate Agatha and has no real idea of her personality. Or how much like an old style Heterodyne Agatha may be. But then, as we know from her backstory, Zola doesn't have much sense. Of self-preservation, at least.

Sleipnir is looking in the same direction as Theo, but she's smiling and distracted while Theo is scared and Krosp looks disgusted, while Zeetha looks in a different direction entirely. I'm guessing that Der Kestle is showing JagerPorn up there on a large screen, and that we've just learned something about exactly what floats Sleipnir's boat...

Could be Wulfenbach porn. With their oversized machinery.

So, who wants to start the betting pool on who will encounter Von Pinn first? The Zeethiggs/Theo/Sleipnir party, or the Gilgatha+Zoe party, or Tarvek and cousin? I'm betting we won't see Othar again until July given the update frequency...

--ripple

Let's not forget Wilhelm's group. I'm really hoping she's still ok, somewhere. Not only because she's a likeable character, but also because Von Zinzer is funny when he's love-stupid...

I'm also hoping Ms. Helpful isn't irrepairably charred, but things don't look good.

Xel

2009-05-29, 10:04 PM

You got me re-reading that bit of filler, and I noticed something I'd missed on this page (http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20081126) - those two little speech bubbles on the bottom left of the panel where Agatha discusses her spare projects. It took me a moment to get who was talking there, too... but the pun is quite simply amazing.

Ha! I hadn't realized what those were really from before. Thought it was the fish quoting someing, or maybe just Da Boyz being silly. Very amusing.

Rockphed

2009-05-30, 12:12 AM

lord_khaine

2009-05-30, 03:12 AM

LurkerInPlayground

2009-05-30, 03:40 AM

For once I'd agree with Khaine. Zola knows that her plot -- the plot that required the death of young Wulfenbach -- is completely over now. In the Castle, the True Heterodyne is in power, the Castle is being repaired and controls areas that were previously safe, her faithful minions have been dispatched and the other inmates have already swore fealty to Agatha. Outside the Castle, she knows that the Clank army has moved in too soon and was annihilated.

Sooo... It's again one of those good plans that ended up in disaster, and the fact that Gil showed up was all the proof she needed to know it.
It's more than that. Zola is simply assuming her natural personality where she doesn't have to be uncompromisingly ruthless to "play the role." Gil is a close personal friend who has done a lot to earn her loyalty.

I also don't think Zola will hurt Gil at this point. If she wanted to do him in, or Agatha for that matter, the time would have been ripe before Merlot was pancaked.

But Agatha might not see it that way, her expression and the gold star emote don't really give away much. She could begrudgingly thank Zola for helping Gil then rush him to the infirmary, OR she could go spar thinking Zola is trying to put poison or something worse into him.

Verrry interesting indeed.
Agatha is expressing surprise and jealousy. She doesn’t let it affect her consciously, but she still gets a visceral reaction to the effect of: “Zola is putting on the moves!”

The panel before that one is Agatha getting set to be very impressed by Gil, then she turns around and sees The Evil Miss Pink doting on Gil. Agatha knows better than to let her emotions get the best of her however.

I must say, I'm disappointed Zola didn't take advantage of the massive distraction Merlot provided to flee; although now that I think about it, I can understand it. It would have been the sensible thing for her to get as far away from Agatha as possible, given she's managed to irritate Agatha and has no real idea of her personality. Or how much like an old style Heterodyne Agatha may be. But then, as we know from her backstory, Zola doesn't have much sense. Of self-preservation, at least.
Zola is probably a bit more complicated than she gets credit for. She has sense, it just doesn’t exist if it involves anything romantically theatrical.
She’s shown a lot of initiative and cunning on her part, she’s just prone to bad judgment when it comes to wanting to be somebody special. She has a pretty average intelligence, although relative to the Sparks around her, that makes her the stupid one.

Eldan

2009-05-30, 06:02 AM

Okay, the love dodecahedron has been redone. Let us hope it works now. Be warned, it is very large.

http://i137.photobucket.com/albums/q235/Rockphed/Lovediagram-1.jpg

Thanks go to Memnarch for the advice.

Who is Sanaa Wilhelm? Can't say I remember her.

Gez

2009-05-30, 06:25 AM

Who is Sanaa Wilhelm? Can't say I remember her.

She's got her own entry in the archive menu...
http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20080213

memnarch

2009-05-30, 10:41 AM

Gez

2009-05-30, 10:48 AM

http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20080222

SirSigfried

2009-05-30, 10:51 AM

Also, how do we know that VonZinzer wants Wilhelm? ...Or is that speculation?

Comical hormonal induced clumsiness.
http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20080220

And A loving sigh.
http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20080222

Edit: Crap Ninjaed

memnarch

2009-05-30, 11:43 AM

Hee! Didn't remember that; thanks!

Cyan

2009-05-31, 10:50 PM

Back to a side-story... ah well. Should be shorter than Cinderella, at least.

memnarch

2009-05-31, 11:02 PM

Well, Weasel Queen is back. And the plot was just getting interesting too! :smalltongue:

Elaro

2009-05-31, 11:03 PM

Foglios, you magnificent bastards. And we love you for it.

FoE

2009-05-31, 11:08 PM

And so the devouring of humanity is yet again averted. Pity.

Midnight Lurker

2009-05-31, 11:20 PM

AAAAAAAAAAAAAA :furious:

Hey, wait, that strip's not half bad.

Oracle_Hunter

2009-05-31, 11:40 PM

:sigh:

Well, it was bound to happen. I've never been a huge fan of Weasel Queen (Cinderella, by comparison, was awesome :smallbiggrin:) but I'm sure Phil will be able to bring the lulz.

FoE

2009-05-31, 11:57 PM

The fashion clank won me over.

Also, the Weasel Queen's speech to Othar.

"To that person I would give myself mind, body, soul ... and body." :smallamused:

dogmac

2009-06-01, 12:11 AM

Yeah, Weasel Queen never did much for me either.

But at least this might be the end of it. One can hope, right?

I loved Cinderella, though.

Ganurath

2009-06-01, 12:19 AM

Also, the Weasel Queen's speech to Othar.

"To that person I would give myself mind, body, soul ... and body." :smallamused:Othar's response made me sympathize with her. I look forward to see what sort of violence she's capable of.

FoE

2009-06-01, 12:20 AM

In further defence of the Weasel Queen, I offer this strip. (http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20070917)

Who's a silly kitty?! :smalltongue:

Mauve Shirt

2009-06-01, 07:48 AM

No. (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/BigNo):smallsigh:

Morty

2009-06-01, 09:43 AM

Do not want!
Oh well. The previous Revenge of the Weasel Queen issues were pretty funny.

thorgrim29

2009-06-01, 10:59 AM

nooooooooooooooooooo

EENick

2009-06-01, 01:14 PM

Huzzah! More Weasle Queen! Aside from her one big ear I like her a lot. (But seriously that ear freaks me out!)

multilis

2009-06-01, 01:55 PM

"Weasel queen is the Other!" "Time travelling bunnies disguised as humans seducing nobillity of Europe!" - Weekly World News

Zazu Yen

2009-06-01, 04:55 PM

"Weasel queen is the Other!" "Time travelling bunnies disguised as humans seducing nobillity of Europe!" - Weekly World News

Oh how I miss that rag.

ARg! Just as things were starting to really roll, we take a break... and who is a snail head to decry our rock "slime encrusted?" Oh, hypocrisy!

We'll I'm sure it will be entertaining, and for now I shall console myself with the concept of "space butter".

Xel

2009-06-01, 11:53 PM

In further defence of the Weasel Queen, I offer this strip. (http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20070917)

Who's a silly kitty?! :smalltongue:

Not silly, just rather out of practice. He almost let it get away! :smallsmile: At least he has the dignity to look ashamed at his inadequacy afterwards...

dogmac

2009-06-02, 11:22 PM

Yeah, yeah,yeah, yeah, yeah, get on with it.

Xel

2009-06-03, 01:19 AM

Ah, but an interesting exercise in cubism...

Ganurath

2009-06-03, 01:24 AM

Is it me, or is this conflict looking less like one of a construct gone made and more like one like a construct gone vengeful against violently xenophobic villagers?

FoE

2009-06-03, 01:36 AM

Is it me, or is this conflict looking less like one of a construct gone made and more like one like a construct gone vengeful against violently xenophobic villagers?

The moral of the story is that we should accept sexy constructs with open arms.

Also, destroy all humans.

Johnny Blade

2009-06-03, 01:36 AM

Oracle_Hunter

2009-06-03, 09:38 AM

I didn't want to comment on the return of Ferretina - after all, it's better than nothing, although how much better is debatable - but this was one wasted page.
I mean, if you feel the need to randomly insert Rubik's cubes into every panel to make a strip somewhat appealing, well, it would probably be best to not do it at all.
I think you have it in reverse.

Phil probably wanted to make a page that had a Rubik Cube into every panel, and now was the most convenient time to do it :smalltongue:

...yeah, I don't care for RotWQ either but I think these breaks is just time for the Foglios to be indulgent. Honestly, the only reason that RotWQ is so poor is that Phil is working off some very old scripts; he's evolved a lot as a writer since these things were written.

Occasional Sage

2009-06-03, 09:39 AM

I finally figured out why the name van Rijn (http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20050926) is familiar to me (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rembrandt)!

sihnfahl

2009-06-03, 11:39 AM

Honestly, the only reason that RotWQ is so poor is that Phil is working off some very old scripts; he's evolved a lot as a writer since these things were written.
And old scripts intended for Radio, not a visual medium.

eee

2009-06-03, 11:51 AM

RE this being a wasted page: Can any page by Phil Foglio actually be considered 'wasted'?

Zeetha's got her regular clothes back on in this. Just thought I'd point that out.

The villagers were a bit of a suprise. One would wonder if they are related to Mechanicsburgers.

Poor Ferretina, life has really dealt her a bad hand. Her bit reminds me of this one shot by the marvelous Fredrik K T Andersson (safe for work, unless the sight of naked but well furred kitties disturbs you):

http://andersson.elfwood.com/Catgirl_Puzzle.2524310.html

Johnny Blade

2009-06-03, 02:23 PM

I think you have it in reverse.

Phil probably wanted to make a page that had a Rubik Cube into every panel, and now was the most convenient time to do it :smalltongue:
Ah. Well, then it's A-OK, of course. :smallwink:

Pantler

2009-06-03, 02:50 PM

Regarding Othar's Twitter: The Hidden City is actually Zakopane (http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&hl=pl&geocode=&q=Zakopane,+Polska&ie=UTF8&ll=49.3,19.95&spn=0,0&z=12)? Rough country indeed! :smallwink:
Regarding RotWQ: I suppose everybody's familiar with this (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BdYH3pTCYM8)?

Gez

2009-06-03, 03:33 PM

"The winter capital of Poland (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zakopane)" -- one could have thought the Geisterdamen would have developed a warmer style of clothing, then... :smallwink:

Rockphed

2009-06-03, 03:57 PM

I never considered crossword books to be a necessity. Othar must be going senile in his old age.

Jahkaivah

2009-06-03, 07:00 PM

The Rubik's Cube gag reminds me of that awesome points of view t-shirt.

http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c226/saxcsa/Points_Of_View.jpg

Yeah I just wanted an excuse to post that.

Neon Knight

2009-06-03, 07:29 PM

It's missing an important one.

The glass has twice as much capacity as it currently needs.

DSCrankshaw

2009-06-03, 09:00 PM

Zola is probably a bit more complicated than she gets credit for. She has sense, it just doesn’t exist if it involves anything romantically theatrical. She’s shown a lot of initiative and cunning on her part, she’s just prone to bad judgment when it comes to wanting to be somebody special. She has a pretty average intelligence, although relative to the Sparks around her, that makes her the stupid one.
Yes, this has me thinking that Gil's accounting of Zola's escapades may not have been entirely accurate. She seems more cunning, at least, than he gives her credit for being. It's possible that he was being played all those times he rescued her... or simply that Spark-y hubris led him to underestimate her.

Oracle_Hunter

2009-06-03, 09:47 PM

Well... since we don't have much going on right now, I have a question: what is every character's "best page."

By "best page" I mean the page that best exhibits the nature of a given character. CMoA is almost meaningless these days (and shouldn't really be awarded until a series is over) so I'm looking for character-defining moments.

To kick things off, how about this one (http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20041229) for Bang? In it we have her boisterous personality combined with her casual use of violence - often for no other reason than to be violent. If you had to show someone one page to describe Bang, I'd go with this one :smallbiggrin:

Cyan

2009-06-03, 09:59 PM

Hmm... I kind of like this one (http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20070718) for Bang, for much the same reason.

Oracle_Hunter

2009-06-03, 10:16 PM

Hmm... I kind of like this one (http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20070718) for Bang, for much the same reason.
I dunno - without dialogue it doesn't really capture her perpetual giddiness, nor her contempt for authority.

Cracklord

2009-06-03, 11:03 PM

What will happen to this world when Tesla is born?
It will probably erase creation in self defence...

HandofShadows

2009-06-04, 11:24 AM

What will happen to this world when Tesla is born?
It will probably erase creation in self defence...

I doubt Tesel was ever born into the world of GG. We have not seen any alternate's for real world people as of yet. Also the date of his birth whoudl have already passed. The date for GG is roughly either 1892 or 1992. Agaths's brother was killed in 1X72. The X is either a 8 or 9 do to it's round shape. (The 1600's are treated as a long time ago) and it's been about 20 years since then. Tesla was born in 1856.

Shatteredtower

2009-06-04, 11:53 AM

CMoA is almost meaningless these days (and shouldn't really be awarded until a series is over) so I'm looking for character-defining moments.

Did... did Oracle_Hunter just express dissatisfaction with something relating to the TV Tropes Wiki? :smallconfused:

In any to your question, though, I could never pick a "just one" for any of the characters. Especially not Othar, who was never meant to be contained to just one page anyway. :smallwink:

Oracle_Hunter

2009-06-04, 01:22 PM

Did... did Oracle_Hunter just express dissatisfaction with something relating to the TV Tropes Wiki? :smallconfused:

In any to your question, though, I could never pick a "just one" for any of the characters. Especially not Othar, who was never meant to be contained to just one page anyway. :smallwink:
Oh yes, I have expressed displeasure about some of the... changes TV Tropes has gone through lately. It is still a fantastic idea and provides a helpful (and entertaining) language for discussing media works; but some of the "examples" pages are just out of control.

Anyhow, the reason I ask for "just one" is because it is hard to do. This allows people to butt heads over what page really best exemplifies a given character. For example, let's look at Gil.

Is this (http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20060306) the real Gil? Or is this (http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20080305) a better example? Each shows Gil exploring his character (and exposes the inner rage that is essential to his being), but in one he is (partially) play-acting a Madboy while in the other he's speaking the truth.

Personally, I think this page (http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20050110) probably does it best. It shows how thin his civilized demeanor truly is, and how quickly he can snap and unleash The Beast on anyone... even the innocent.

EDIT: I am with you on Othar. IMHO this (http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20090130) may be the best page; it exposes his Big Ham status while noting that his Gentleman Adventurer persona is slightly out-of-step with the actual events of the world.

Plus, anything without his stylized name just isn't Othar :smalltongue:

Occasional Sage

2009-06-04, 01:34 PM

I doubt Tesel was ever born into the world of GG. We have not seen any alternate's for real world people as of yet. Also the date of his birth whoudl have already passed. The date for GG is roughly either 1892 or 1992. Agaths's brother was killed in 1X72. The X is either a 8 or 9 do to it's round shape. (The 1600's are treated as a long time ago) and it's been about 20 years since then. Tesla was born in 1856.

If van Rijn really is Rembrandt (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=6209880&postcount=176), Agatha's comment about "200 years" would make this the late 19th or early 20th century. And that would give us a real-world parallel, at least in reference.

Sure it may be a coincidence, but the timing is right and the use of the surname rather than the given makes a nice divide from what our real world knows of the man. It seems like it's right, to me.

EDIT: for Bang, how about this one (http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20061101) where she explains herself perfectly? It has the bubbly, the psychopathy, and the flippancy.

Oracle_Hunter

2009-06-04, 01:45 PM

EDIT: for Bang, how about this one (http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20061101) where she explains herself perfectly? It has the bubbly, and the psychopathy, and the flippant.
Oooo, that's a good one! :smallbiggrin:

eMpTy Kay

2009-06-04, 10:32 PM

Sneaky gate is open! Hmm.. Something for the Furry Lovers out there?

Love the carrots on Agatha's arm as well.

BRC

2009-06-04, 10:35 PM

Fashion Clank is pure awesome.

Occasional Sage

2009-06-04, 11:10 PM

Fashion Clank is pure awesome.

He's Marvin the paranoid android, with a higher energy level. Which, I guess, is saying the same thing come to think of it.

What BRC said.

FoE

2009-06-04, 11:11 PM

I am conflicted. I feel like I'm being pulled in three different directions: disturbed, amused and vaguely aroused. :smalleek: :smalltongue: :smallredface:

Fashion Clank is pure awesome.

Indeed.

Rockphed

2009-06-05, 12:14 AM

for Bang, how about this one (http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20061101) where she explains herself perfectly? It has the bubbly, the psychopathy, and the flippancy.

The "Dibs" in the last panel is just icing on the cake of awesome that is Bangledesh Dupree.

Deus_e_Machina

2009-06-05, 02:54 AM

The "Dibs" in the last panel is just icing on the cake of awesome that is Bangledesh Dupree.

Mmmm... icing on Bang...

Gez

2009-06-05, 03:04 AM

I wonder how the Foglios feel when they hear the phrase, "more Bang for your Bucks".

Rockphed

2009-06-05, 03:09 AM

Mmmm... icing on Bang...

Not...What...I...Wanted...to...summon...forth! To the brain-bleach mobile!

Oracle_Hunter

2009-06-05, 04:22 AM

Not...What...I...Wanted...to...summon...forth! To the brain-bleach mobile!

:confused:

I just don't understand you.

evileeyore

2009-06-05, 05:43 AM

Well... since we don't have much going on right now, I have a question: what is every character's "best page."

Bang (http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20040901), exuberantly psycopathic... best of all like many of her plans she ends up losing her hat on this one...

Jagers (http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20031017), who know all about "plans vat end vit de losink of hats" are here being dense and insightful together...

Othar (http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20080128), shows his insightfukness and density in equal measure...

lord_khaine

2009-06-05, 06:17 AM

Krosp (http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20070216) I do think this shows the cold calculating part of him nicely.

Zetha (http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20081020) i do think this shows a decent part of her personality, but there are proberly a better comic to do so, still i think its funny.

Gez

2009-06-05, 06:47 AM

Krosp (http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20070216) I do think this shows the cold calculating part of him nicely.

Mostly, this page shows that Agatha knows how (http://www.mspaintadventures.com/?s=4&p=000708) to (http://www.mspaintadventures.com/?s=4&p=001081) establish (http://www.mspaintadventures.com/?s=4&p=001363) superiority (http://www.mspaintadventures.com/?s=4&p=001525).

lord_khaine

2009-06-05, 09:58 AM

Originally Posted by lord_khaine
Krosp I do think this shows the cold calculating part of him nicely.

Mostly, this page shows that Agatha knows how to establish superiority.

this does not make any sense at all.

Gez

2009-06-05, 10:18 AM

http://img132.imageshack.us/img132/7561/superiority.png (http://img132.imageshack.us/my.php?image=superiority.png)

Jahkaivah

2009-06-05, 11:55 AM

I would say this one for Klaus, partially because it sums up his motivations and methods. But mainly because it has a picture of him 50 feet high and towering over an army :smallbiggrin: (http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20040806)

HandofShadows

2009-06-05, 01:04 PM

If van Rijn really is Rembrandt (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=6209880&postcount=176), Agatha's comment about "200 years" would make this the late 19th or early 20th century. And that would give us a real-world parallel, at least in reference.

Very good catch. We so rearly see Rembrandt's full name being used. And if you are correct, it fits in nicely with a 1892 or so date.

Gez

2009-06-05, 01:30 PM

We also know from Othar's Twitter that Voltaire (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Voltaire) has built the scribing engine of Paris' Autonomous Library. And quite earlier in the comic, the inventor of the calming pie thought that his recipe surpassed Brillat-Savarin (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jean_Anthelme_Brillat-Savarin)'s creations.

LurkerInPlayground

2009-06-05, 11:11 PM

Yes, this has me thinking that Gil's accounting of Zola's escapades may not have been entirely accurate. She seems more cunning, at least, than he gives her credit for being. It's possible that he was being played all those times he rescued her... or simply that Spark-y hubris led him to underestimate her.
No. Gil's assessment of her is accurate. There is no conspiracy theory involving just how about how her every action is some underhanded stratagem. She just wastes all her cunning on "get-rich-quick" styled schemes or more appropriately "get-important-quick" schemes.

It's important to note what Gil *is* saying, which is that she's dumber than he is (i.e. Gil is a genius compared to virtually everybody) and that she gets herself into trouble because she has really bad judgment. Fans simply need to separate the ability to make raw calculations (i.e. intelligence) from judgment or emotionally-charged decisions.

Smart people make really dumb decisions because of the latter reasons simply because they never stopped to think it through or cannot stop to think it through. Zola has just such a blind spot about being special or the heroine of her own fairy tale -- even if she isn't especially dimwitted.

What's more, she learned from her previous mistakes, but this largely took the form of her being incredibly ruthless. This is perhaps the "wrong" lesson to take away from her previous escapades, as it still made her take an incredible risk while deliberately setting out to make enemies.

Midnight Lurker

2009-06-08, 12:25 AM

Can anyone translate the French on that blueprint? :smalltongue:

Elaro

2009-06-08, 01:05 AM

I can. It's terrible French, though.

Here goes.

FIRST PANEL
Un Lapin Géant : A Giant Rabbit
Déguisement : Disguise [Note: They were trying to say "A giant rabbit disguise", but the actual grammar for that would be "un déguisement de lapin géant". The actual expression, though, is "un costume de lapin géant".]
Oreille : Ear
Dents : Teeth
Cravate d'arc : Bow tie [the actual French for bow tie is "noeud papillon".]
Fourrure [misspelled in the comic] : fur
Épaule : Shoulder
Mamelon : the male equivalent of a teat
Joint : Joint
Griffes : Claws
Peu vilain: "A little bit of villain" ? I have no idea what they mean. Perhaps they were referring to the potbelly? If so, then the word is "Embonpoint". Wierd.
Queue Pelucheuse (non montrée) : Furry tail (not shown)
Chat : Cat
Genou : Knee
Frapper du pied la chose : Hit, with the foot, the thing. [Yeah, I don't know what they mean by that.]

SECOND PANEL
Modèles idiots de costume de lapin: Stupid models of rabbit suit. un costume de lapin" (Stupid models of a rabbit suit), and not what's written in the comic. Sigh.]

Ganurath

2009-06-08, 01:11 AM

I can. It's terrible French, though."I was built to create, not translate! Philistines..."

Eldan

2009-06-08, 03:34 AM

Jahkaivah

2009-06-08, 04:02 AM

I keep on forgetting that we are in a filler arc :smallfrown:

VariaVespasa

2009-06-08, 04:13 AM

Well, considering where the arrow is pointing, "Peu vilain" might be supposed to mean "naughty bits". I agree on the terrible french, though. (Mine isn't much better, but still, 9 years of french in school aren't easily forgotten.)

I dunno, I found it quite easy to forget. Thank god. German was MUCH more fun. Its like building a language with lego. :)

Eldan

2009-06-08, 04:24 AM

We have even more german in school. Our ancestors could never come up with a written language, since every second town has it's own words, phrases, grammar and pronounciation. And, of course, they can't possibly write them the same way as the others over there on the other side of the river.
So, the only solution was to just adopt german as the written language and forget about the entire thing.

Gez

2009-06-08, 06:57 AM

Terrible French.

"Un lapin géant déguisement" should be "Costume de lapin géant"
"cravate d'arc", as said, should be "noeud pap"
"Frappen (sic) du pied la chose" should be, well, I'm not sure what they were trying to say, but "piétinner la chose" would already be better.
"naughty bits", on the top of my head, I don't see a direct equivalent. Plenty of similar expressions ("intimate parts", "family jewels" and so on) but not "naughty bits". Still, "peu villain" is nonsensical. Translates to "not much villainous"...

Eldan

2009-06-08, 07:05 AM

I know. I just looked at the where the arrow was pointing, got myself a list of all translations of both "peu" and "villain" and still took me five minutes to come up with something tha tmade sense. I could be wrong, though.

eee

2009-06-08, 10:04 AM

Enough with the French lessons! Focus on the important stuff! Like how adorable Zeetha looks in the last panel! That hanging forelock really does things for her...

Also, it appears Krosp has just gotten really, really large.

No good can come of this.

Occasional Sage

2009-06-08, 04:38 PM

No good can come of this.

Except that the last panel can (by squinting just a bit) show Agatha groping Zeetha. Let's hear it for unintentional fanservice!

lord_khaine

2009-06-08, 05:29 PM

Except that the last panel can (by squinting just a bit) show Agatha groping Zeetha. Let's hear it for unintentional fanservice!

are we sure its unintentional?

Brother Oni

2009-06-09, 07:20 PM

Could 'peu vilian' be a nickname for genitalia, much like OotS Roy's 'trouser titan' reference?

I suddenly get an image of Mini-Me from Austin Powers now... :smalleek:

Gez

2009-06-09, 08:07 PM

Could 'peu vilian' be a nickname for genitalia, much like OotS Roy's 'trouser titan' reference?

I suddenly get an image of Mini-Me from Austin Powers now... :smalleek:

Yeah, it's a naive, clumsy, approximatively literal translation of naughty bit. "Peu" in "un peu de" could translate to "bit" in "a bit of", "naughty" as in "naughty children" could translate to "villain" in "villains enfants", and who cares that they're not the actual translations needed in the context they're used? So they wanted to translate "naughty bit" and it came out as "not very ugly". Just like "bow tie" came out as "cravate d'arc"...

Not a nickname, just the English-to-French equivalent of Engrish. Flançais? :smallamused:

And the rabbit hole is not open yet. I expected it to be the reason for a post at this time... :smallwink:

Ganurath

2009-06-09, 08:13 PM

Not a nickname, just the English-to-French equivalent of Engrish. Flançais? :smallamused:I believe the technical term is Frenglish.

Gez

2009-06-09, 08:57 PM

I believe the technical term is Frenglish.

Non, that is when you have a mélange of both vocabulaires because people use expressions or verbs of the other language when they're too paresseux to souvenir themselves of the adequat word in the language they are using.

Just like Engrish is not Japenglese or whatever other portmanteau word you want but pure English, just with mistakes committed through a lack of actual familiarity with the language, here we have English-free French but with mistakes.

AND to move away from this debate, the rabbit hole is open. Zeetha is still horribly cute. :smallbiggrin:

eMpTy Kay

2009-06-09, 09:58 PM

Sneaky Gate is open
Zeetha's bunny tail is so cute. Is it wrong that I want a bunny outfit like that for my wife?

And we see that we had been given a foreshadow of the clock in the tummy (http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20080116)

BRC

2009-06-09, 10:02 PM

Fashion Clank is giving Der Kestle a run for it's money in terms of which is my favorite sentient clockwork thing

Ganurath

2009-06-09, 10:03 PM

It's got a clock on its tummy!

dogmac

2009-06-09, 11:19 PM

Empty Kay, I was just thinking "Is it wrong I want a bunny outfit like Agatha's"?

Oracle_Hunter

2009-06-09, 11:47 PM

It looks like the Foglios are taking "cute ears" lessons from Shaenon Garrity. (http://www.webcomicsnation.com/shaenongarrity/skinhorse/series.php?view=archive&chapter=38299)

Also: Phil's latest fetish gear only serves to remind me that his was the mind behind XXXenophile.

Is he the dirtiest old man in webcomics? Do we want to see his competition? :smalleek:

FoE

2009-06-10, 12:22 AM

Depends on how you term "dirty".

I dare any one of you guys to tell me that's not awesome.

Knight13

2009-06-10, 01:29 AM

Oracle_Hunter

2009-06-10, 01:48 AM

Is anyone else really surprised the Zeetha of all people is all happy about the clock? I can see her being like that if the suit had big swords or something, but a clock just doesn't seem like her cup of tea.
Just because Zeetha is a Hot Amazon, she doesn't have to limit her interests to weaponry. For example, she's a huge fan of debauchery (http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20050523), innuendo (http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20081112), and cultivating unusual skills (http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20090330) :smalltongue:

Gez

2009-06-10, 02:50 AM

She also likes to tweak people. And making comments about the clock is to Krosp the same thing as making comments about the hat to Gil.

My attempts to replace "sneaky gate" by "rabbit hole" while we're in this filler story are so far unsuccessful.

lord_khaine

2009-06-10, 04:48 AM

a am a bit surprised Krosp isnt happy about being in a 4 meter tall robotic powered battlesuit with claws, fangs and steam comming out of the nose.

Oberon

2009-06-10, 04:56 AM

a am a bit surprised Krosp isnt happy about being in a 4 meter tall robotic powered battlesuit with claws, fangs and steam comming out of the nose.

Same. Who wouldn't want that?

Also, I love the title of this thread!

Gez

2009-06-10, 05:40 AM

Same. Who wouldn't want that?

Also, I love the title of this thread!

You can thank Señor Professor Diaz (http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20090520) for that one. Who, I'm surprised it hasn't been pointed out yet, is an extended cameo of Cameron Diaz (http://dresdencodak.com/about/) -- look at his hat (http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20090413) and compare to Diaz's stickman persona (http://dresdencodak.com/gallery/).

Zazu Yen

2009-06-10, 11:44 AM

Ganurath

2009-06-10, 11:56 AM

I think Krosp isn't getting past the "I'm in a bunny suit" thinking. I'm betting as soon as he gets to start laying waste with it he'll be happy as a clam, though still grumpy because it's a bunny suit.

A 15 foot tall bunny themed war clank made for a cat, you don't see those every day! I wonder how long it's going to take before someone makes a custom Magic card for it?Deathrabbit Clock-Clank [2]
Artifact - Equipment
Equipped creature gets +2/+2 and gains Trample. If the equipped creature is a Construct, it gets an additional +1/+1 and gains First Strike.
Deathrabbit Clock-Clank can only be attached to a Cat.
Equip [3]