PDA

View Full Version : Teleport, eh?



Berserk Monk
2009-05-25, 11:32 AM
Just wondering how many people out there have every played a caster that could cast this spell. I mean, it's a pretty underrated spell. An entire adventure would be different with the use of "We're here one secound, now we're there."

Sinfire Titan
2009-05-25, 11:33 AM
I've played three epic campaigns now, and every time someone could have used Teleport to make things easier, they forgot they could cast it.

shadzar
2009-05-25, 11:35 AM
It just isn't a versatile enough spell for me to always carry around.

You need to scry in advance because you never know what you are going to teleport into. That means you have to take two spells for the effect of one.

There are plenty of other means of travel that I can employ without magic for me to use it ion a standard basis where real-time isn't of concern.

Goatman_Ted
2009-05-25, 11:35 AM
I mean, it's a pretty underrated spell.

I'm not sure if you're going for irony there. But I sure found it.


edit.
I haven't seen a wizard who hadn't dropped Conjuration who didn't use it constantly.
It's integral to almost all gishes as a Dimension Door spell that lets them keep hurting things until their next turn.
It's almost always on top of >50% of the "What do you ban" lists on these boards for exactly the reasons you list.

Eldariel
2009-05-25, 12:40 PM
Every campaign with an arcane caster I've played in has made heavy use of Teleport. Underrated? Hardly, it's acknowledged to be among the best things in a Wizard's arsenal; not only does it have the obvious traveling utility, it's also a great way to ensure nobody ever reaches you in combat.

Really, the fact that Teleportation is Conjuration is one of the principal reasons Conjuration so kicks ass. From level 7 you've got Dimension Door (mostly for in-combat utility) and from level 9 on, you can pretty much go wherever whenever.

Yuki Akuma
2009-05-25, 12:46 PM
You need to scry in advance because you never know what you are going to teleport into. That means you have to take two spells for the effect of one.

Only if you're teleporting somewhere you're not really familiar with, or you have a DM who randomly generated volcanoes when you teleport.

shadzar
2009-05-25, 12:58 PM
Only if you're teleporting somewhere you're not really familiar with, or you have a DM who randomly generated volcanoes when you teleport.

:smallconfused: Smart-arse!

Just being familiar doesn't mean anything but you know where the place you want to go is.

Do you end up on the street in Villagetownville? Do you end up in the mayor's house? There is no GPS for teleport, so you have a range of error the less you know about a place.

:tongue:

There are just too many spells of more use than move from point A to point B for me.

monty
2009-05-25, 12:59 PM
I've actually never done it, but only because whenever I've played a sufficiently high-level caster, I couldn't have it - whether it's the dread necromancer, or the crazy wizard with four banned schools, or whatever. If I actually played a character who could cast it, though, I'd probably be doing it all the time.

Keld Denar
2009-05-25, 01:09 PM
Depending on the campaign and the party and the rules. I used to play a lot of Living Greyhawk (R.I.P.), where just about any method of getting pounce is not allowed. So...making a full attack is very important. Well, my buddy who played a wizard (conjourer) would take to memorizing a large number of Dim Doors each day, and we'd walk around in formation with me and the other beat stick in front, and him right behind. Whenever we'd hit an encounter, we'd roll init. If either melee beat the wizard, we'd delay for him. Then, he'd Dim Door us up to within 5' stepping range of whatever it was we were fighting, and me and the other guy would come off delay and blenderize it. My buddy was pretty impressed by this, and it made a lot of fights end before they started. We used this tactic from level 7 all the way up through level 14 in dozens of different modules.

His exact words, that I remember to this day, were: "Man, that's the most damage I've ever done with a 4th level spell. Ever."

Sometimes the most important part of being a wizard isn't doing your own job, but making everyone elses job easier.

Zeful
2009-05-25, 01:14 PM
:smallconfused: Smart-arse!

Just being familiar doesn't mean anything but you know where the place you want to go is.

Do you end up on the street in Villagetownville? Do you end up in the mayor's house? There is no GPS for teleport, so you have a range of error the less you know about a place.

:tongue:

There are just too many spells of more use than move from point A to point B for me.

Teleport has a margin of error period. It doesn't matter if your going to the apartment you've been living in since you became a wizard or a place you've been once, there's a chance you'll miss the mark, or get caught in some astral disturbance and torn to pieces.
You don't even need Scry, you could make a blind 'port into an area that's been properly described to you. It just has to exist.

Tsotha-lanti
2009-05-25, 01:15 PM
Underrated? How can anyone play a wizard without teleport? It's one of the most classic and overall useful spells ever.

Tehnar
2009-05-25, 01:17 PM
Then, he'd Dim Door us up to within 5' stepping range of whatever it was we were fighting, and me and the other guy would come off delay and blenderize it.

I don't think you are allowed to use the spell that way.


You instantly transfer yourself from your current location to any other spot within range. You always arrive at exactly the spot desired—whether by simply visualizing the area or by stating direction. After using this spell, you can’t take any other actions until your next turn. You can bring along objects as long as their weight doesn’t exceed your maximum load. You may also bring one additional willing Medium or smaller creature (carrying gear or objects up to its maximum load) or its equivalent per three caster levels.

The point I make is, that by RAW, if the intent was that only the caster could use no more actions, then they would use the word casting instead of using. Anyway thats the way my group reads the spell. Maybe there has been a FAQ/errata I am not aware of.

Keld Denar
2009-05-25, 01:27 PM
Capacity is mentioned AFTER the drawbacks of using the spell. I think its generally accepted that the spell only ends the turn for the caster. I haven't seen any errata or FAQ either way. The turn ending thing is kinda funny though. It seems to be another one of those holdover things from previous editions. The only real justification given for it is "that's the way it's always been."

Devils_Advocate
2009-05-25, 01:31 PM
Instantaneous travel is underrated? Since when? Teleportation is probably the biggest reason not to ban Conjuration. And there are a lot of reasons not to ban Conjuration.

Even if you limit yourself to zapping to places you've been before, so as to reduce the possibility of error and/or the need for scrying, it's still crazy useful. Insta-travel is up there with fabricate's insta-crafting as one of the big forms of utility magic. Arguably so good that it's bad, in that it significantly limits the sorts of plots that the DM can easily employ.

It's also an excellent reason to choose the Travel domain for your cleric, if no one else in the party can teleport.

monty
2009-05-25, 01:35 PM
It's also an excellent reason to choose the Travel domain for your cleric, if no one else in the party can teleport.

Although, to be fair, Travel is a pretty solid choice even if someone else can cast teleport.

shadzar
2009-05-25, 01:37 PM
Teleport has a margin of error period. It doesn't matter if your going to the apartment you've been living in since you became a wizard or a place you've been once, there's a chance you'll miss the mark, or get caught in some astral disturbance and torn to pieces.
You don't even need Scry, you could make a blind 'port into an area that's been properly described to you. It just has to exist.

But scrying tells you prior to a higher level if you are trying tog et to a safe place.

Later just use Teleport Without Error to reduce the failure factor.

Keld Denar
2009-05-25, 01:44 PM
Note that you can't Scry on a place, only on a person. So, if you don't know who's gonna be there, you can't scry on a place. And Scry allows a save, so even if you know who's gonna be there, you gotta find someone who's weakwilled enough to let you peak.

You can't just say "King's throne room" and *ping* see it and go. You gotta Scry on the king, or on the king's guard, or the queen, or someone.

Most people miss that.

Devils_Advocate
2009-05-25, 01:46 PM
The point I make is, that by RAW, if the intent was that only the caster could use no more actions, then they would use the word casting instead of using.
If the intent was that no one effected by the spell could take more actions, it would say that; "you" clearly refers to the caster.

Note how the spell describes who might take damage from it: "If you arrive in a place that is already occupied by a solid body, you and each creature traveling with you take 1d6 points of damage and are shunted to a random open space on a suitable surface within 100 feet of the intended location."

If the limitation on additional actions was meant to apply to brought creatures, it would have similar wording.

How would it even apply, anyway? It says you get no more actions until your next turn. That doesn't prevent brought creatures from acting when their turn comes up after the caster's, exactly as usual!

Edit: Oh, I see; it would prevent readied and immediate actions and attacks of opportunity. Delaying initiative would still work just fine, though.


Although, to be fair, Travel is a pretty solid choice even if someone else can cast teleport.
Touché.

shimmercat
2009-05-25, 01:59 PM
I'm playing a Travel cleric (spontaneous domain caster) in a group without a wizard/sorceror, and I use Teleport. All. The. Frickin. Time. Although the character is terrified of the mishaps (he's claustrophobic and the idea of ending up in rock/etc. freaks him out), so he will not use the spell unless he's relatively familiar with the destination.

If you're worried about players abusing it and just instantly getting to all their destinations, they just need a reason to HAVE to travel the long way. Party is too large/carrying too much stuff would be one of the easiest ways to do it. A large McGuffin may work, too. Our game is nautical and based around a ship, so when my cleric uses it, he's almost always popping over to buy something and then popping back to join the rest of the ship. It gives us a way to purchase things when we are in the middle of the ocean and nowhere near a port.

This means that surprises like "HEY BBEG appears and casts Weird on your ship and now all your NPCs and several PCs are dead!" are actually much less derailing for the plot. Instead of having to sail back months out of our way in order to get the material components for the rez's, we just need to come up with the gold somehow and then Mr. Travel Cleric just pops back to the last major port we visited to buy the diamonds. And so we don't get nearly so caught up in the nitty-gritty, but still get to have all the RP goodies.

Animefunkmaster
2009-05-25, 02:12 PM
I am sure you mean specifically the teleport spell and not spells of the teleport descriptor (which is imo essential to a conjurer/any wizard). I find that the teleport spell is very useful, depending on the campaign. Getting from a long distance from point A to point B is useful out of combat while many other teleport descriptor spells are useful in combat (and not with such huge range).

Many spells with the teleport descriptor are great for getting out of sticky situations. Lightning leap, as a spell compendium example, has no somatic components (good for grapple), teleports you, and deals damage in a line.

Keld Denar
2009-05-25, 02:17 PM
Lightning leap, as a spell compendium example, has no somatic components (good for grapple), teleports you, and deals damage in a line.

Lightning Leap, IIRC, is also the only teleportation effect that isn't a Conjouration. Its Transmutation, for some reason, again, if I recall correctly. I seem to be remembering this explicitly because I picked the spell for my Suel Arcanamach, and SA's are only allowed Div, Abj, Trans, and Illus. No Conjouration hurts, but this got around it.

Again, goin on memory atm...

Gorbash
2009-05-25, 02:18 PM
The reason I'm not using it too much is because my party consists of 6 people + a dire bear, so I need CL 21 to transport us all at once. So, I'll be able to use it around lvl 15, once CL boosters start to kick in.

IMHO, it's only useful to shorten the length of a journey. Not really as an escape mechanism since you'd all have to hold hands together, kinda hard to accomplish that in combat.

Swooper
2009-05-25, 02:52 PM
I'm not sure I've ever seen a 9th level wizard who didn't have it.

Never used it in combat, though. That's what Dimension Door is for.

monty
2009-05-25, 02:59 PM
Never used it in combat, though. That's what Dimension Door is for.

Unless you're a high level sorcerer. Since having multiple spells that do the same thing is a bad idea, and teleport can do pretty much everything dimension door does and more, you're better off picking something else, especially with the number of awesome fourth-level spells.

TheCountAlucard
2009-05-25, 03:21 PM
Underrated? How can anyone play a wizard without teleport? It's one of the most classic and overall useful spells ever.Gandalf didn't! Did he?

Providing my RL gaming group hasn't died, my wizard may soon have access to Teleport. He's only one level away from being able to learn it.

Devils_Advocate
2009-05-25, 03:36 PM
Gandalf didn't!
And see how much trouble that cost him?

"I teleport into Mount Doom and throw the Ring in. How much XP do I get for killing Sauron?"

hamishspence
2009-05-25, 03:38 PM
"You land 10 miles off-target. Right next to Barad-dur. Sauron spots you. Roll initiative"

(Gandalf has been into "the dungeons of the Necromancer" but never visited Mordor "to the east I go not")

Devils_Advocate
2009-05-25, 03:51 PM
"Whoops! I cast celerity! Wait, he has it too? Hey, what determines whose immediate action gets resolved first?"

:smalltongue: Crazy spellcasters and their crazy shenanigans.

Dark_Scary
2009-05-25, 04:41 PM
1) Level 12 Wizard in campaign. Used Teleport/DD a couple times, like to avoid a circle of Vrocks dancing, oh yeah, and to save the unconscious guy from the same fate.

2) All the time, go home every night, come back in the morning.

3) More then one campaign where it's come up.

4) Character with greater teleport at will. Yeah, used that a lot.

Saph
2009-05-25, 07:15 PM
It's a great spell, but it has a MAJOR problem, and that's the CL limit. When you first get Teleport at level 9, it can affect 3 other characters. Our regular group is 6 people plus the DM, so that means the party wizard has 5 characters to take, plus any animal companions or NPCs.

This has, on occasion, led to situations where the wizard is trying to evac himself and 5 other PCs from the BBEG's dungeon and can only take 3. As you can imagine, the two players who drew the short end of the stick were not amused.

At high levels this problem disappears, but I've found that many high-level areas restrict teleports somehow.

- Saph

Elminster1
2009-05-25, 08:13 PM
Iv'e played alot of wizards, and always had Teleport withut exception. It has so many uses in such variety it's astounding. Right now, I'm playing a Gray Elf Generalist at level 8, and I can't wait to get Teleport on level 9, lol. And I'm in a 2 player campaign, so it should still be good to escape with, etc, with only myself and the uh...well....Rikasha sorceror. I think were golden.

Aside from that, it's fun to hook up Teleport with his beautiful lover Contingency. Good times.....

Keld Denar
2009-05-25, 08:36 PM
It's a great spell, but it has a MAJOR problem, and that's the CL limit. When you first get Teleport at level 9, it can affect 3 other characters. Our regular group is 6 people plus the DM, so that means the party wizard has 5 characters to take, plus any animal companions or NPCs.

- Saph

My high level Conjourer has a spare level between now and Archmage 1, and hes dipping a single level in Wayfarer Guide. The prereqs are mostly RP wise, and as long as you don't take the 2nd level, you don't lose any CL. That 1 level along gives you an effective +4 CL when casting teleport abilities, since it allows you to bring along an extra person. I don't think I've ever seen it in a build, but its actually a pretty sweet 1 level dip. Too bad Idiots of the Coast removed a spellcaster level from the middle of it to reduce it from a neat little 3 level distraction to a steamy pile of dog leavins.

#Raptor
2009-06-19, 04:41 PM
Unless you're a high level sorcerer. Since having multiple spells that do the same thing is a bad idea, and teleport can do pretty much everything dimension door does and more, you're better off picking something else, especially with the number of awesome fourth-level spells.

And theres a armor/shield enhancement in the MiC that lets you DD 2/day.
Well, its actually a bit better than DD as you can port out of a silence area with it (its mental, DD is verbal).
Aporter, page 6.

Doc Roc
2009-06-19, 04:52 PM
Only if you're teleporting somewhere you're not really familiar with, or you have a DM who randomly generated volcanoes when you teleport.

:: hums innocently ::

sofawall
2009-06-19, 04:56 PM
I've yet to use the actual spell teleport. There's no point, really, as the one campaign where I'm a spellcaster, no matter what we do to get to a location, we'll still move at the speed of plot. If we start teleporting, so will everyone else.

On a side note, remind me to never teleport in Tidesinger's campaigns.

Lapak
2009-06-19, 04:59 PM
:: hums innocently ::Teleport's ability to make potential obstacles trivial is why I put together a Teleport Vortex spell on the homebrew boards a few years ago. I'm sure I still have the writeup around somewhere; it was a Forbiddance-style setup that redirected incoming teleportees to an alternate nearby location of the caster's choice. It was a good spell.

Dagren
2009-06-19, 05:06 PM
Many spells with the teleport descriptor are great for getting out of sticky situations. Lightning leap, as a spell compendium example, has no somatic components (good for grapple), teleports you, and deals damage in a line.Actually, all Teleport spells are verbal only, including DD. As you say, this makes them pretty good for escaping from grapples, which can really hurt a wizard.

quick_comment
2009-06-19, 05:12 PM
Its pretty trivial to keep teleport from getting around obstacles.

Forbiddance on important places, villians with anticipate teleport, villain's psionic agents with divert teleport, etc.

Also, adventures on the astral plane (teleportation doesn't wok on the astral), strange planar things that prevent access to the astral (so you cant teleport), etc.

Aneantir
2009-06-19, 05:36 PM
On a side note, remind me to never teleport in Tidesinger's campaigns.

What are you on about? That sounds hilarious. If I were in Tidesinger's campaign I'd cast teleport on a daily basis, if not more.

The character I'd run for it would be a Wizard studying the correlation between teleporting and volcano related deaths.