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rokar4life
2009-06-02, 08:33 PM
so if i had an 18 on Int and one on Wis could i potentially take mystic theruge as my third level, also, would that be a good move?

Eldariel
2009-06-02, 08:40 PM
so if i had an 18 on Int and one on Wis could i potentially take mystic theruge as my third level, also, would that be a good move?

You cannot get bonus spells of a level higher than the highest level you can cast. Stats don't help you at all in that department. And if you already have 18s, Mystic Theurge isn't that good of an idea; the primary thing it does is give you extra spells on lower levels. Chances are you've got plenty if your starting stat is 18.

Mind you, it is possible to enter Mystic Theurge early. Wizard with Precocious Apprentice or any spontaneous arcane caster with Versatile Spellcaster can qualify with just 1 arcanist-level, and e.g. Ur-Priest only needs one divine-level. But high stat doesn't work.

Anyr
2009-06-02, 08:41 PM
No, since it requires (among other things) the ability to cast 2nd level spells in two classes. No matter how high your Intelligence and wisdom are, you can't gain bonus spells of any level that you can't naturally use.

TheCountAlucard
2009-06-02, 08:41 PM
so if i had an 18 on Int and one on Wis could i potentially take mystic theruge as my third level...Err, no, you couldn't. Just because you're entitled to a bonus second-level spell doesn't mean you're capable of casting it yet.

EDIT: Blasted ninjas... (grumble, grumble)

rokar4life
2009-06-02, 08:42 PM
awwwwwwwwwwww

Swooper
2009-06-02, 09:27 PM
Mind you, it is possible to enter Mystic Theurge early. Wizard with Precocious Apprentice or any spontaneous arcane caster with Versatile Spellcaster can qualify with just 1 arcanist-level
And those are both debatable in their RAW/RAI legality. I'd allow neither trick in my games, at least (but let's not start a debate on that here, it's been done).

Sstoopidtallkid
2009-06-02, 11:38 PM
And those are both debatable in their RAW/RAI legality. I'd allow neither trick in my games, at least (but let's not start a debate on that here, it's been done).But we've already got the thread.

I agree that Precocious Apprentice alone doesn't work. However, Focused Specialist to turn your single PA pseudo-slot into 2 guaranteed 2nd-level Conjurations(or any other school) works fine, by RAW.

Versatile Spellcaster, though, is even RAI. It allows you to cast 1 2nd level spell from 2 1st level slots. If that's not casting second level spells, what is? If you don't use the Beguiler/Dread Necro, it still works with any Spontaneous caster with Heighten Spell. There's even an FAQ entry saying a Sorcerer using it to cast a Heightened spell is perfectly legit, making it(possibly, I think they shouldn't be considered legitimate authorities on anything, butsome people on here respect their opinion for some reason) RAI.

Yuki Akuma
2009-06-03, 06:28 AM
Mind you, it is possible to enter Mystic Theurge early. Wizard with Precocious Apprentice or any spontaneous arcane caster with Versatile Spellcaster can qualify with just 1 arcanist-level, and e.g. Ur-Priest only needs one divine-level. But high stat doesn't work.

Ur-Priest needs two levels to qualify for Mystic Theurge.

And really when you're using Ur-Priest you won't qualify until you're level 11 anyway...

(Of course by the time you hit level 20 you're casting level 9 spells from your arcane list and the Cleric list, so.)

Sstoopidtallkid
2009-06-03, 12:03 PM
Ur-Priest needs two levels to qualify for Mystic Theurge.

And really when you're using Ur-Priest you won't qualify until you're level 11 anyway...

(Of course by the time you hit level 20 you're casting level 9 spells from your arcane list and the Cleric list, so.)Level 7. Ur-Priest is enterable, with the right builds, with the first level at level 6.

Sinfire Titan
2009-06-03, 12:25 PM
But we've already got the thread.

I agree that Precocious Apprentice alone doesn't work. However, Focused Specialist to turn your single PA pseudo-slot into 2 guaranteed 2nd-level Conjurations(or any other school) works fine, by RAW.

Versatile Spellcaster, though, is even RAI. It allows you to cast 1 2nd level spell from 2 1st level slots. If that's not casting second level spells, what is? If you don't use the Beguiler/Dread Necro, it still works with any Spontaneous caster with Heighten Spell. There's even an FAQ entry saying a Sorcerer using it to cast a Heightened spell is perfectly legit, making it(possibly, I think they shouldn't be considered legitimate authorities on anything, butsome people on here respect their opinion for some reason) RAI.

Ha! I didn't have to post it this time! Someone else did it for me!


Thanks for posting the PA+FS trick. Gotta mention it every time someone does a Theurge thread.

Keld Denar
2009-06-03, 12:52 PM
Level 7. Ur-Priest is enterable, with the right builds, with the first level at level 6.

Yea, Wizard5/Mindbender1/UrPriest2/MTX would work. Mindbender has a strong fort save, for some reason. Also gets you the tasty tasty 100' telepathy which opens up Mindsight!

Yuki Akuma
2009-06-03, 01:04 PM
Yea, Wizard5/Mindbender1/UrPriest2/MTX would work. Mindbender has a strong fort save, for some reason. Also gets you the tasty tasty 100' telepathy which opens up Mindsight!

...Really?

Hm.

Wonder if I could get away with changing my build in Loophole Closing Task Force...

... Probably not.