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theonesin
2009-06-03, 01:00 AM
At college in the fall, a friend is going to DM a DnD 3.5 campaign, but he creating characters up to a certain level and giving them randomly to the players in the group. While he hasn't created my character yet, he informed me that I'm a Dwarven Paladin (each player was told to choice 2 classes and 1 race for the random character pool, and Dwarf and Paladin where my picks).

I know that until I get a hold of the character sheet, I won't have much to go off of in trying to optimize myself, but I'm just looking for general tips to make the most of things.

We are limited to only what is available on d20srd.org (spells, feats, items, etc), with no Prestige Classes allowed, though he seems to be ok with multi-classing so long as we can roleplay it good.

One specific question I had though regards mounts. I looked around, but I couldn't find anything that explain what mounts you can choose from. Can someone explain that to me? Also, assuming the DM chose a mount for me that I don't want, is it possible to get rid of it and "summon" a different one, like Druids with their Animal Companions?

Thanks.

Doc Roc
2009-06-03, 01:11 AM
Failure to take spirited charge and use a lance two-handed with power attack will make me show up at your freaking house.

Goatman_Ted
2009-06-03, 01:51 AM
One specific question I had though regards mounts. I looked around, but I couldn't find anything that explain what mounts you can choose from. Can someone explain that to me? Also, assuming the DM chose a mount for me that I don't want, is it possible to get rid of it and "summon" a different one, like Druids with their Animal Companions?

Thanks.

There's a list in the DMG, page 204. I'm not sure where it is in the SRD.

At level 6, you can call a Celestial Warhorse, Dire Wolf, Hippogriff, Large Monstrous Spider, Large Shark, Unicorn, Celestial Warpony, Dire Bat, Dire Badger, Dire Weasel or Giant Lizard.

At level 7, you can call a Dire Boar, Dire Wolverine, Giant Eagle, Giant Owl, Pegasus, Rhinoceros or Sea Cat.

At level 8, you can call a Dire Lion or Griffon.

Advancement is delayed by 1 level for the first list, 2 for the second, etc.

Doc Roc
2009-06-03, 02:02 AM
Giant Eagles are absolutely superb, but you may find Dire Bat to be a better option. In either case, I strongly recommend getting a mount of no larger than large with a fly speed of some sort.

theonesin
2009-06-03, 02:14 AM
I don't know a lot of details, but the DM mentioned that this game is kind of a play test for his dungeon-making skills, so I'm not sure how useful a flying mount would be if I'm going to be indoors a lot.

Which ones would be useful in that sort of situation?

Doc Roc
2009-06-03, 02:30 AM
I take flying mounts even when I shouldn't, frankly. It depends a lot on how high the ceilings are. If you drop improved flight (races of the wild) onto your eagle, it should then be able to hover, I believe. Alternatively, you might be able to snag a dragonnel from the draconomicon, which is smaller and more mountable.

Goatman_Ted
2009-06-03, 02:31 AM
I don't know a lot of details, but the DM mentioned that this game is kind of a play test for his dungeon-making skills, so I'm not sure how useful a flying mount would be if I'm going to be indoors a lot.

Which ones would be useful in that sort of situation?

If flying's out, I like the spider's Tremorsense, Poison and Web. The Climb speed doesn't hurt either.

And Darkvision. Just so you can run a party without a single torch.

Doc Roc
2009-06-03, 02:35 AM
Oh man! Spider is a really good option! I had completely forgotten it.
Climb speed is basically magnificent in dungeons.

RMS Oceanic
2009-06-03, 02:35 AM
Definately take the Swift Battler feat, or whatever it's called, from Complete Champion: All your paladin spells are quickened for free. So you can go "Slash! Slash! Cure Light Wounds! Slash!" if the need arises.

theonesin
2009-06-03, 02:42 AM
Thanks for all of the advice so far. But remember what I said: We can only use what's available on d20srd.org, which pretty much means just the 3 core rulebooks, I think.

In the case of the alternative animal companions, I might be able to make a case with my DM to allow them since they are in the core rules.

Doc Roc
2009-06-03, 03:04 AM
The dragonnel is not, but it's so cool that I almost always allow it in my games. :)

You are, by the way, thinking of the superb feat battle blessing.

Calmar
2009-06-03, 05:10 AM
Try to get a mighty dire boar. That's the best ride a dwarven paladin can get. :smallbiggrin:

#Raptor
2009-06-03, 06:08 AM
Try to get a mighty dire boar. That's the best ride a dwarven paladin can get. :smallbiggrin:

I should have known that I wasn't the first one with that Idea... :smallbiggrin:


As for the Dwarf himself, I guess you don't get to decide what kind of dwarf it'll be, no? Just asking because the Gold Dwarf (DMG, and therefore core) gets his -2 to dex instead of cha.

Person_Man
2009-06-03, 10:24 AM
Instead of a Dwarf, consider a Halfling Paladin. That way you can ride a Medium sized special mount anywhere. Find something with a Climb speed, and you can attack enemies from the walls or ceiling.

Feat suggestions: Power Attack, Mounted Combat, Ride by Attack, Spirited Charge, Combat Reflexes, Hold the Line, Stand Still. All are in the SRD (though some are in the divine or psionic section). Be sure to use your lance two handed, to maximize Power Attack damage (BAB * 2 * 3 with Spirited Charge).

Spell suggestions:
Shield Other: Cast it on your Mount. Helps keep them alive.
Delay Poison: Lasts for hours per level. So if you cast it at the beginning of the day, you're essentially immune to Poison (until it wears off, safely out of combat).
Zone of Truth: Use whenever you talk to an NPC for any reason.
Eagle's Splendor: Bonus to Cha, and thus your Saves and Smite.
Restoration & Cure Serious Wounds: It's always helpful to have a backup healer.
Holy Sword: +5 Holy weapon with Magic Circle Against Evil. Cast it on your adamantine lance. A Wand of Holy Sword costs 21,000 gp and has 50 uses, whereas an equivalent +7 weapon costs 98,000 gp.
Magic Circle Against Evil (if not using Holy Sword): Bonus to AC and Saves, prevents mind control, prevents summoned creatures from attacking you.

Remember, you can use a Wand for any spell on your spell list. If you're playing at a high level, then consider investing in Use Magic Device as a cross class skill. With high Cha, you can usually pull it off. This opens up all sorts of crazy buff combinations.

Swooper
2009-06-03, 10:36 AM
Oh man! Spider is a really good option! I had completely forgotten it.
Climb speed is basically magnificent in dungeons.
Bonus points if you call it "Golden Widow" :smallamused:

Renegade Paladin
2009-06-03, 10:39 AM
Instead of a Dwarf, consider a Halfling Paladin.
Erm... Read the post. The DM is making their characters for them; he doesn't get to choose.

Optimystik
2009-06-03, 10:57 AM
Can you be a Gold Dwarf? That way you won't get a CHA penalty.

theonesin
2009-06-03, 12:14 PM
I'm pretty sure my DM is going with the base races, not variants.

Keld Denar
2009-06-03, 12:15 PM
Check out Dungeonscape. Underdark Knight alt class features are pretty freakin sweet. Meld into Stone and teleportation and whatnot. Very tasty. Also, if your Cha is decent, check out Complete Warrior for Divine Might. Use Turn Undead attempts to up your damage. If your cha is crappy, check out Complete Champion for Devotion feats. Law Devotion in particular is VERY nice. Combine with Power Attack to convert that bonus to hit into damage. Complete Champ also has Awesome Smite, which is VERY useful when you have issues with incorps, golems, or just want someone to sit down and shut up.

Doc Roc
2009-06-03, 12:16 PM
Check out Dungeonscape. Underdark Knight alt class features are pretty freakin sweet. Meld into Stone and teleportation and whatnot. Very tasty. Also, if your Cha is decent, check out Complete Warrior for Divine Might. Use Turn Undead attempts to up your damage. If your cha is crappy, check out Complete Champion for Devotion feats. Law Devotion in particular is VERY nice. Combine with Power Attack to convert that bonus to hit into damage. Complete Champ also has Awesome Smite, which is VERY useful when you have issues with incorps, golems, or just want someone to sit down and shut up.

Core only, my dear. Excellent advice otherwise.

theonesin
2009-06-04, 07:51 PM
As it turns out, my DM doesn't seem to want to allow the alternative mounts, and he pretty much agrees that a warhorse will be useless in the dungeon we'll be playing. He rerolled to see if I got a better class, and he rolled Monk, which I haven't heard good things about.

So in a core-only game using only d20srd.org, which would be better: a mount-less Paladin (the DM won't accept any alternative class features to replace the mount), or a Monk?

Flickerdart
2009-06-04, 08:04 PM
Paladin still has full BAB and d10 HD, Monk's got nothing, especially in Core.

theonesin
2009-06-04, 08:11 PM
Eh, nevermind. Turns out I'm stuck with Monk now...


I guess the question now is, how can I make a Monk salvageable (or should I be making a new thread for this?)?

wadledo
2009-06-04, 09:08 PM
If your DM is this difficult (and not letting you stay paladin, which is decent at least), then your best bet is to simply shrug your shoulders and play.
You can't do anything to improve it, but a least you can mess with the other players by having your character do insane stuff during combat.

Hawriel
2009-06-05, 01:51 AM
Get a dire ram for your mount. They are dwarfy. I group used rams befor WOW.

Ravens_cry
2009-06-05, 02:04 AM
Get a dire ram for your mount. They are dwarfy. I group used rams befor WOW.
While delightful sounding, the original poster mentioned that they is playing a dwarven monk now.
Hmm, well mechanics Monks may suck, but role play wise this sounds like fun. Dwarves are stereotyped as drunken sots, why not play that but with a monk? Mayhap pick up some of the improvised weapon feats, and play a literally drunken master? I have heard there's ways of improving monks, but gosh darn if I know em'.

Fitz10019
2009-06-05, 03:22 AM
If your DM really wants to test his skills, he should start by NOT forcing his players to use characters HE has chosen.

Vizen
2009-06-05, 03:37 AM
If your DM really wants to test his skills, he should start by NOT forcing his players to use characters HE has chosen.

QFT, even if he's just using this lot to test out his dungeon making abilities.

2009-06-05, 04:00 PM
You should never be forced into playing a class, especialy monk. The monk is arguably the worst class around, especially from core only standpoint. Has uses and might be fun, but op wise...

As for Paladin mounts, if you get a unicorn at later levels it has some very nice healing capabilities. Also, make sure your mount has optimized feats. Even simple things like giving it "Improved Natural Armor" and "Improved Natural Attack" (from MM) will be a huge help if you go the mounted warrior routine. If your mount is small enough you can use it in any dungeon, especially since you're a dwarf, a medium but not really "medium" sized character.