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Zore
2009-06-03, 03:03 AM
I'm trying to make a Kobold swordsage for an upcoming game, starting at level 1 but potentially going to level 20. Its a 32 point buy game. For my maneuvers I was thinking of focusing mainly on the tiger claw discipline as one of its special weapons is claws. Right now my Kobold has four natural attacks, three from the Kobold web expansion and the feat from Races of the dragon that gives it an additional tail attack. Is focusing on a multiattack build viable for a Kobold swordsage? What maneuvers would I pick if I chose to go down that route?

I'm allowed two flaws and most books as sources, though I have to run any non updated 3.0 stuff as well as Dragon magazines by my DM first.

elliott20
2009-06-03, 04:26 AM
how optimized on the rest the players going to be? Depending upon your answer, you'll probably get a different answer.

Darrin
2009-06-03, 08:17 AM
Right now my Kobold has four natural attacks, three from the Kobold web expansion and the feat from Races of the dragon that gives it an additional tail attack. Is focusing on a multiattack build viable for a Kobold swordsage? What maneuvers would I pick if I chose to go down that route?


Ask your DM if the Unarmed Swordsage variant is available. If so, then you'll want to start with that. This allows you to full attack with an unarmed strike, and then follow-up with your four natural attacks. Unarmed strike is both a Tiger Claw weapon and a Shadow Hand weapon, which may be important if you're taking Shadow Blade (adds your Dex bonus to damage when attacking with Shadow Hand weapons in a Shadow Hand stance). Yes, a multiattack build should be viable, although it's a bit feat-intensive for a class that doesn't get a lot of bonus feats. You may want to consider dipping into ranger, fighter, or swashbuckler to pick up one or two bonus feats, although this will delay your maneuver progression a wee bit. For straight unarmed swordsage, I'd consider the feats:

1) Shadow Blade
Flaw1) Multiattack (Shaky)
Flaw2) TWF (Poor Reflexes or Inattentive)
3) Weapon Finesse
6) Adaptive Style
9) ImpTWF
12) Snap Kick
15) GrTWF
18) Improved Multiattack

Gah... not enough feats! Travel Devotion should probably be in there somewhere, but it screws up your boosts. Snap Kick should be earlier...

Get into Bloodclaw Master after ECL 6, and you can reduce your TWF penalties to zero. Pick up a Fanged Ring for Improved Natural Attack and maybe a Monk's Belt to buff your unarmed damage... check with your DM if he'll allow your Swordsage levels to count as monk levels. Gloves of the Balanced Hand would give you ImpTWF, so you could take Snap Kick at level 9.

For maneuvers... you want to stay away from strikes, since those are standard actions and they'll prevent you from full-attacking. Focus on boosts and counters, mostly Tiger Claw and Desert Wind with a bit of Diamond Mind. Once you get Mountain Hammer you can ignore Stone Dragon. Setting Sun I tend to stay away from, and as a small character you shouldn't be making trip attacks anyway (and yes, I know there are a couple stances that cry out for small characters, but the Shadow Hand stances are just... so... darned... good.) To start with:

1) Burning Blade ("Would you like some fire damage with that full attack?")
Wind Stride ("Why yes, I can charge from 80' away...")
Wolf Fang Strike (mostly just to grab...)
Sudden Leap (free movement as a swift action)
Counter Charge ("Eff You, Mr. PA-Leap Attack!")
Sapphire Nightmare Blade or Shadow Blade Technique (nice to have at least one strike)
Stance: Island of Blades (the party rogue will LOVE you)

2) Moment of Perfect Mind

3) Mountain Hammer (the ultimate DR/whatever can opener, and unlimited shatter/sunder/landscaping tool)

4) Cloak of Deception
Shadow Jaunt (replace Wolf Fang Strike)

5) Mind Over Body
Stance: Assassin's Stance

6) Burning Brand or Fiery Riposte
Something strike-ish... Death Mark is good for crowd control. Soaring Raptor Strike is tempting, but small characters take a penalty on jump checks. Insightful Strike is good, particularly if you need the prereqs for Time Stands Still. (Replace whatever you haven't been using, such as Wind Stride, Sapphire Nightmare Blade, or Moment of Perfect Mind)

Zore
2009-06-03, 12:46 PM
My DM says the Unarmed variant is available. And he'll let me count Swordsage levels as monk levels. What levels would I dip fighter for the bonus feats if I go that route?

And this is a relatively optimized game, our party Wizard is going Focused Specialist Conjurer and we have a Shapeshifter Druid as well as a Factotum all of whom are veteran players to my newcomer. All of us are relatively inexperienced with TOB though, our DM got the book all of three days ago so most of our knowledge of it comes second hand.

Darrin
2009-06-03, 01:41 PM
My DM says the Unarmed variant is available. And he'll let me count Swordsage levels as monk levels. What levels would I dip fighter for the bonus feats if I go that route?


Good question... hmm. If you need to avoid multiclass penalties, use the Desert racial template (Dragon #306, check the 3.0 templates on Crystalkeep for details) to switch your favored class to Ranger... then I'd probably go with Swordsage 1/Ranger 2/Swordsage +3/Bloodclaw Master +2/Swordsage +12. Take Adaptive Style or Imp. Multiattack for your second flaw, which would let you take Superior Unarmed Strike at 6th level. If you can get Gloves of the Balanced Hand for ImpTWF, take Snap Kick at 9th.

Otherwise, if Fighter isn't a problem... Swordsage 5/Fighter 1/Bloodclaw Master 2/Fighter +1/Swordsage +11. Take Superior Unarmed Strike as your first fighter bonus feat, and take Snap Kick at 9th along with ImpTWF or Imp Multiattack.

Another dip you might want to consider: Spirit Lion Totem Barbarian (CChamp) with the City Brawler variant (Dragon #349). You get pounce, light armor proficiency, Improved Unarmed Strike (the non-monk version, which you don't need), TWF (for unarmed strikes only), reduced penalty for improvised weapons, and rage 1/day.

only1doug
2009-06-03, 03:15 PM
I'd have to suggest considering a couple of the kobold fighter racial levels (races of the dragon) to remove some of the stat penalties (at the cost of the fighter feats :smallfrown: )...

I'd also consider 3 levels of swashbuckler for the Int bonus to damage with light weapons (granting you weapon finesse for free on the way)...

but i guess 6 levels is a lot of dipping away from your main focus.