Help! My party keeps killing me!

[Kyselina]

We use 3.0e but the DM has allowed me to use 3.5e rules and things too.

My party keeps killing me. They killed me twice so far and they are planning a third kill (I know it). I am a level 3 gnome wizard (illusionist) (level 3 because the DM has a rule, first time you die you lose one level then you start at level 1). The party:

Me
Zorxal, a level 5 dwarven fighter
Wasari, a level 4 elven druid
Eleanor, a level 5 elven cleric
(Also, the cleric and druid have each 1 extra spell slot as if they were a higher level.)

Now to my char: STR 12, DEX 15, CON 20, WIS 11, INT 18 and CHA 12. My prohibited school is abjuration. I've got 24 HP. Feats: Improved familiar, craft magic wands, scribe scroll. Items: Got few spellbooks, with some custom spells. A magic amulet which has some kind of spell I forgot. 93,5 gold. A library (We'll get to why I can carry this much later), a stone bed, a dead dwarf, then a lamp. Now, I have the lamp because my familiar is a genie. He has an ability which allows him to carry as much as he wants. He has to obey me. With the improved familiar feat, he gains +2 levels and is level 5 now.

I appreciate any hints and tips. Do I even stand a chance?

[Dogmantra]

Are you okay with being killed?
If not, ask them Out of Character to stop killing you. If the DM is on their side, it might be time to find a new group.

[Morty]

Stop playing with people who try to kill your character? Because as a 3rd level character against two 5th level and one 4th level character, you don't have much of a chance.

[Pharaoh's Fist]

I can't help you find a new game, but I can help you murder your companions.

[Nohwl]

1. get a scythe.
2. wait for them to sleep.
3. coup de grace.

[Kyselina]

Dogmantra: The DM told them to stop killing me.
M0rt: I don't want to find a new party.
Pharaoh's Fist: Appreciated.


1. get a scythe.
2. wait for them to sleep.
3. coup de grace.

I could use a custom spell I got. It's called arena. It locks me and someone else in a field that is not interrupted until someone dies. Theoretically, I could use color spray and then coup de grace. But I am a gnome, and can use only small weapons, but that shouldn't matter much with a coup de grace.

[cezyou]

Not if they keep ganging up on you.

1. Run away and become a villain next time! Then plague their existence with Various monsters! Note: this requires DM compliance.

2. Make your genie thing carry them around and drop them in the ocean in revenge.

3. Leave this group. If they're just being a--holes, then leave. If there's a reason (like your first character was insane or did something that made them suffer), then sort it out.

[kamikasei]

Not to put to fine a point on it, if they're repeatedly killing your character for no good reason after the DM has told them to cut it out, they're jackasses. Ditch them.

Why are they killing you?

What do you imagine either a) surviving an attack or b) killing them will accomplish?

[Kyselina]

My previous characters: A level 4 halfelf bard, and a level 1 halfling ranger/level 2 rogue.


Not to put to fine a point on it, if they're repeatedly killing your character for no good reason after the DM has told them to cut it out, they're jackasses. Ditch them.

Why are they killing you?

What do you imagine either a) surviving an attack or b) killing them will accomplish?

I don't know why they are killing me. But I sure know that I will piss them off by killing them all, and that is enough for me.



Also, I think I should get a plan if they attack me. I can have 2 illusion spells at this level, so what about just preparing invisibility and mirror image every day? I could just mirror image, then cast invisibility on me and go away.

[Dogmantra]

Try asking them why they're killing you.
They might not realise that you don't like it (which, admittedly, is unlikely when the DM's already told them to stop)

[Pharaoh's Fist]

Does your party ever put you on watch without any backup?

If so, cast Silence and CDG them with scythes.

[Kyselina]

Try asking them why they're killing you.
They might not realise that you don't like it (which, admittedly, is unlikely when the DM's already told them to stop)

Will try. But I am also playing a gnome which kind of enjoys killing, planning, pillaging and stuff (they don't know that yet). So that's atleast a reason.


Does your party ever put you on watch without any backup?

If so, cast Silence and CDG them with scythes.

They do. Great idea!

[Tempest Fennac]

I'd agree with the people who recommended leaving the group. I'm surprised the DM hasn't done something about it by now.

[Kyselina]

I also forgot one important fact. They're newbies. These are their first characters.

[Tempest Fennac]

If you've not done anything to offend them, it could be that they are doing it solely to be annoying. Apart from making it perfectly clear that you won't tollerate their behaviour any longer (ignoring their attacks on your character completely, even if it delays the game, will probably help here).

[Renegade Paladin]

Here's the more pertinent question. Why is your character staying with these people? What is his motivation to not ditch them and/or plot revenge from out of their reach?

[Kyselina]

Here's the more pertinent question. Why is your character staying with these people? What is his motivation to not ditch them and/or plot revenge from out of their reach?

I was doing a quick quest for money and they happened to go into the same dungeon :smallconfused:. So I guess nothing. Although, my DM lives in another city.

[SilverClawShift]

I...

I can't imagine playing a game in this kind of situation :smalleek::smallfrown:

[Learnedguy]

I second the silence and c-d-g advice:smallbiggrin:

(Seriously, these are one of those times when escalating the situation is the only option:smallwink:!!)

(No, I'm not taking this thread too seriously:smallyuk:!)

[Nohwl]

I also forgot one important fact. They're newbies. These are their first characters.

that makes killing them even better. it will teach them not to screw with other members of the party.

[Kyselina]

I second the silence and c-d-g advice:smallbiggrin:

(Seriously, these are one of those times when escalating the situation is the only option:smallwink:!!)

(No, I'm not taking this thread too seriously:smallyuk:!)

You're awesome :smallamused:. Now, 1st problem: No silence. 2nd problem: The city we are in has no spell shops. 3nd problem: The city that probably has some is days away.

[Pharaoh's Fist]

Perhaps you can post a list of what you have to work with so that we can help?

Alternatively, make tons of noise the first few nights, then gift your party members earplugs.

[Kyselina]

Perhaps you can post a list of what you have to work with so that we can help?

Alternatively, make tons of noise the first few nights, then gift your party members earplugs.

List of spells or usefull items?

[Drogorn]

Rocks fall, everyone but Kyselina dies. Roll up new character sheets. Now stop killing her character.

[horus42]

I've had a similar problem before. One of the guys in my group pretty much plays the same character every time, no matter what game we're playing. (Usually Scion or World of Darkness, but it's close enough to make a comparison.) And the aforementioned character is -always- a huge jerk.

So, I made a really, really good Scion character one time. My character and his got into a fight. He tried this huge complicated move, and it ended up doing nothing. Then, on my first turn of the fight, I insta-killed him with a lightning bolt. He hasn't been a jerk ever since. Maybe you should do that.

[Kyselina]

Rocks fall, everyone but Kyselina dies. Roll up new character sheets. Now stop killing her character.

That won't probably happen. Also, I'm a he.

[Nohwl]

silence is only there to make it so they don't scream or something when you coup de grace.

it is also not a wizard spell, so you can't cast it.

you don't need it, if you have glitterdust, that would really help you for when the other 2 wake up. blindness/deafness and web would be useful too.

[Alleine]

I...

I can't imagine playing a game in this kind of situation :smalleek::smallfrown:

That is because you DM and players are made out of pure win and awesome. The rest of us are not so lucky.

But, I've never had to deal with this sort of thing. There stands a chance that you'll just make them all paranoid and they'll decide that DnD is all about killing each other. Then your game will just devolve into a PvP fest as everyone kills each other. Hopefully that is not the case, but I would advise talking to them about it and telling them to stop. Not having the DM do it, you should tell them.

[Pharaoh's Fist]

There's also the part where you cover them in oil and set them on fire. That's always fun.

[Eldan]

Okay, a few people in this thread alluded to it, but it has to be said:

Killing each other ingame never solves a problem. Generally, no amount of being an a**hole ingame helps.

They are newbies, these are their first characters, they will be attached to them, since they have already gained enough experience to advance four levels. If you kill them, they will be pissed, you are correct so far.

However, what will this accomplish? They will be angry, both in character and out of it. The situation will only escalate, to the point where you can probably forget ever forming a party again.

Instead, ask yourself two questions:

a) Why are they killing you? Ask them.

b) Why are they not listening when the DM asks them to stop? No game can ever work when the players are not listening to what the GM says.

Under these circumstances, I can only recommend one thing: inform the DM that you dislike the situation. Then prepare for a discussion with the group. Sit down, all of you, and discuss the two things above. Make it clear, out of game, that you hate it when your character is killed. Ask them how they would feel if you just started killing them all. Ask them if there is a reason: did your characters behave in a hostile manner, were they incompatible for ideological reasons? Then the problem is ingame, and can be solved when oyu make a character that can work with them.
If they only want to annoy you? Explain them that this behaviour isn't working, that a game can not function like this and will collapse if it's not possible for the entire group to work together, DM incluced.
Also,and this is most important: they have to listen to what the DM says. If he says killing others is not okay, then other players aren't killed without a good reason.

So, once again: if you kill their characters, they will be angry. There will be an amount of whining towards the DM, and revenge, if you don't talk about it. Doing it is only a contest of being the greatest ******* at the table and won't help with any problem.

We actually had a similar situation in our first game: three characters, one was evil (That was my character, actually). Now, the group soon decided that it would be fun to play pranks on each other. They started harmless enough, hiding another player's sword during the night. But the nit started to get worse, usually with two players conspiring against the third, even with changing group, always with the motive of "teaching lessons". It only stopped when we talked about it.

[Kyselina]

There's also the part where you cover them in oil and set them on fire. That's always fun.

You activated my trap card! On oil-and-fire!



Eldan's massive post: They should've though about that. Well, the first time they killed me, it was the fighter. I accidently hit him with a poisoned arrow when I rolled a 1 for which he killed me. Second time, we were introducing our new characters, and the elf cleric insulted me. I just "knocked" her (a male IRL) on the knee with my 1d6 hammer (it was meant to scare). Then the druid just poisoned me and I died because my CON got to 0. The cleric had all healing spells and bandages (received from my first character).

[kamikasei]

Why are you playing the game?

Why are they playing the game?

Why are you playing together?

Is there a plot? Surely this internal strife is a distraction. Is it a pure sandbox game? Surely there are more interesting things to do than kill one another.

If the others are newbies, it sounds like you all may need to just take a few minutes out of game to work out what you actually want to achieve in your time playing. Make characters who don't want to kill one another, or keep your current ones but choose to behave differently (http://www.giantitp.com/articles/tll307KmEm4H9k6efFP.html).

If your goal for the game is PvP, then plenty of options are available to you. But if that's not what you want to spend the entire game on, continuing with it now is likely to be counterproductive.

[nightwyrm]

How old are you people?

This is a OOC problem, sit them down and explain to them that D&D is not a PvP game. If they want to play PvP, play WoW or Streetfighter or something.

Or this could be a not-so-subtle hint that they don't like you playing with them. In that case, there's nothing you can do except don't play with people who don't like you.

[Trizap]

If DM is involved: leave group

if DM is not involved: take your revenge while they are asleep.

and make it so that you do it defiantly as possible in both scenarios for max effect.

[Kyselina]

I want to kill atleast one to show them that I do not like being killed, and to show them what it is like. I will probably kill the fighter because he is the biggest ass ever.

[Pharaoh's Fist]

Or this could be a not-so-subtle hint that they don't like you playing with them. In that case, there's nothing you can do except don't play with people who don't like you.

Also, kill their characters.

[Kyselina]

Also, kill their characters.

I like how you think.

[Trizap]

I want to kill atleast one to show them that I do not like being killed, and to show them what it is like.

then just do it, catch em off guard while in battle, say maybe when the wizard is busy casting spells at enemies you just.....hehehehe......attack the squishy wizard unexpectedly, maybe walk at the rearguard of the group at all times so that you can wait for you opportunity.

remember: a newbie wizard is not optimized, not experienced, and probably doesn't have any spells that can deal with their own team mates, killing him is you best bet :smallamused:

[Flickerdart]

If your DM is on your side, convince him to help you out. Perhaps there is a band of assassins hunting them, and you've been on their payroll all along?

[Kyselina]

then just do it, catch em off guard while in battle, say maybe when the wizard is busy casting spells at enemies you just.....hehehehe......attack the squishy wizard unexpectedly, maybe walk at the rearguard of the group at all times so that you can wait for you opportunity.

remember: a newbie wizard is not optimized, not experienced, and probably doesn't have any spells that can deal with their own team mates, killing him is you best bet :smallamused:

I am the wizard? ...

[Sanguine]

I think the obvious solution is Major Image so they think they are on fire and Hallucinatory Terrain to make them think that huge chasm is a lake.

[Pharaoh's Fist]

First one won't work. They'd notice they aren't taking damage. And he's too low a level for the second.

[Trizap]

I am the wizard? ...

frack.............

well I wouldn't go for the fighter....they got armor, are meat shields, basically bred to survive.......nor the cleric, they have good armor to and healing.........try the druid, they are limited to hides and he is only 4rth level, and are not as good of a healer as clerics are, try him.

[Pharaoh's Fist]

Pfft.

To quote the 242nd law of Acquisition, "More is good. All is better."

We really should be planning on how to take out all of them in one fell swoop.

My idea? Rent a hotel room, kill them with either carbon dioxide, carbon monoxide, or natural gas poisoning. Use science to your advantage.

[MrEdwardNigma]

I believe they won't kill you again if you explain this is bothering you and do not incite any further violence. Quite honestly, it was a horrible idea to kneecap one of them when he didn't do what you liked. If you proceed to kill any of them now, the war will be on. The ones that are left alive will kill your character for killing a party member. You will respawn together with the one you killed, and he will want revenge too. Possibly, this will lead you to want more revenge. It's a never ending cycle. More importantly, they'll lose trust in you, the player.

Show them that you can work together now, before it's too late, and ask them to do the same. That is my advice.

[Pharaoh's Fist]

I believe they won't kill you again if you explain this is bothering you and do not incite any further violence. Quite honestly, it was a horrible idea to kneecap one of them when he didn't do what you liked. If you proceed to kill any of them now, the war will be on. The ones that are left alive will kill your character for killing a party member. You will respawn together with the one you killed

Not if the plan is to quit gaming with a bunch of teamkillers right after you wipe them all out.

[Kyselina]

Change of plans! I just remembered that the fighter has an item which makes him immune to critical strikes. So no coup de grace.

[Pharaoh's Fist]

Gas poisoning it is.

[Demons_eye]

If the kill them in there sleep and they kill you another time and you make a new guy have him be the nice guy. Get real chummy with the players in game and then when they are Asleep/weak and the don't think you will try, kill them and say your guy was mind raped by your first characters dad. He made you a sleeper agent and bam.


OR get a wizard with Exsplosive runes and have them all over your body and kama kazi them.

[MrEdwardNigma]

If you really want to kill them (which I still think is a bad idea), I would suggest lots and lots of preparation. Be the Batman. Think traps, gadgets and tricks. Put a snake in their beds, grease up the floor, sabotage the stairs, leave sharp implements lying around, purchase explosives. You can kill anyone with the right amount of preparation.

[Adumbration]

On the bright side, if you pull this off, you'll gain more than enough XP for level 4, and a fair way to level 5. (4950 XP, to be precise.)

On the downside, the Encounter Level is 8, and the Difficulty is Unbeatable.

EDIT: Use non-magical items, stuff that isn't so expensive. Ditherbombs, alchemist fire, acid, non-magical grease, marbles, loads and loads of oil, contact poison, caltrops, poisoned caltrops, ingestion poison (poison their food), etc.

[Kyselina]

On the bright side, if you pull this off, you'll gain more than enough XP for level 4, and a fair way to level 5. (4950 XP, to be precise.)

On the downside, the Encounter Level is 8, and the Difficulty is Unbeatable.

EDIT: Use non-magical items, stuff that isn't so expensive. Ditherbombs, alchemist fire, acid, non-magical grease, marbles, loads and loads of oil, contact poison, caltrops, poisoned caltrops, ingestion poison (poison their food), etc.

I've just got an idea. I could make a voice using illusions out the room of one of them (we are currently in a tavern, I think that the cleric is with the fighter in one room though). I could put lots of alchemists fire around them and then just set it off with a MAGIC MISSILE. I could say "What did they expect?" and throw off a ciggarete and walk away.

[Pharaoh's Fist]

On the downside, the Encounter Level is 8, and the Difficulty is Unbeatable.

So reprogram scenario to achieve victory. You're a wizard. You can cheat reality.

[Flickerdart]

Remember to use notes that you pass to the DM, preferably ahead of time.

[SSGoW]

are you sure that you aint doing anything to piss them off though? in a campy that i ran there was a guy who kept gettting killed cause he was being a rule nazi (yet getting the rules wrong) and being a jerk in and out of character... one of the characters went so far as to bestow a curse on him (that was funny) so taht during battle he had a 50% chance to act or not act... so you might want to watch out cause sometimes it might be you that are instigating the problem without knowing you are the problem :(

[Kyselina]

Remember to use notes that you pass to the DM, preferably ahead of time.

But of course.

SSGoW: No, I am not doing anything wrong.

[Pharaoh's Fist]

Use the cantrip Message on the fighter while he's sleeping.

Message: "Alright, Cleric, let's gang on the fighter tomorrow and kill him. With your god given powers and my mastery of nature, we are sure to win a flawless victory.

Afterwards, cast Message on the Druid.

Message: "Alright, Fighter, let's gang up on the Druid..."

[MrEdwardNigma]

I've just got an idea. I could make a voice using illusions out the room of one of them (we are currently in a tavern, I think that the cleric is with the fighter in one room though). I could put lots of alchemists fire around them and then just set it off with a MAGIC MISSILE. I could say "What did they expect?" and throw off a ciggarete and walk away.
You're thinking too small. If you're gonna do this, have contingency plan upon contingency plan.

[Kyselina]

Use the cantrip Message on the fighter while he's sleeping.

Message: "Alright, Cleric, let's gang on the fighter tomorrow and kill him. With your god given powers and my mastery of nature, we are sure to win a flawless victory.

Afterwards, cast Message on the Druid.

Message: "Alright, Fighter, let's gang up on the Druid..."

You're awesome!

[Pharaoh's Fist]

I've just got an idea. I could make a voice using illusions out the room of one of them (we are currently in a tavern, I think that the cleric is with the fighter in one room though). I could put lots of alchemists fire around them and then just set it off with a MAGIC MISSILE. I could say "What did they expect?" and throw off a ciggarete and walk away.
Magic Missile does not work on objects.

[Kyselina]

Magic Missile does not work on objects.

But you can attack THE DARKNESS with it.


Okay, what about acid arrow?

[Trizap]

Use the cantrip Message on the fighter while he's sleeping.

Message: "Alright, Cleric, let's gang on the fighter tomorrow and kill him. With your god given powers and my mastery of nature, we are sure to win a flawless victory.

Afterwards, cast Message on the Druid.

Message: "Alright, Fighter, let's gang up on the Druid..."

this. oh and for extra revenge-ness, kill the person who survives then proceed to get rid of the cleric.

[Pharaoh's Fist]

But you can attack THE DARKNESS with it.


Okay, what about acid arrow?

This may break one flask, but isn't guaranteed to set off a conflaguration.

You aren't going to solve this with pure damage. You must think outside the box.

[Sanguine]

But you can attack THE DARKNESS with it.


Okay, what about acid arrow?

Nothing against it in the PHB

Ninja'd

[MrEdwardNigma]

... Why can't you just use matches?

[Kyselina]

... Why can't you just use matches?

Because I would get caught in the blast? Because it's too modern? Because it's not cool? :smallannoyed:

EDIT: I just discovered that I have a scroll of fireball. My genie would be able to use the scroll. So if I just scribe it into my book for usage later and so I can make more scrolls of it... Brute force would be usable.

[MrEdwardNigma]

Tie a tinderstick to the bottom of a door you know they're gonna use. There's no need for you to be nearby.

[Pharaoh's Fist]

Because I would get caught in the blast? Because it's too modern? Because it's not cool? :smallannoyed:

EDIT: I just discovered that I have a scroll of fireball. My genie would be able to use the scroll. So if I just scribe it into my book for usage later and so I can make more scrolls of it... Brute force would be usable.

So the plan is to stuff their immediate area full of Alchemist's Fire while they sleep, then Fireball the room?

Sounds fun.

[riddles]

your party sounds young. like, maturity young.

i'd second the advise on talking to them. from what you've said, the DM had a hand in the first death with the fighter and you were a bit silly and probably had your actions taken out of context.

failing that, just leave. there's plenty of closet d&d players out there. and the internet can provide pbp.

[only1doug]

I'd suggest abandoning plans of revenge and asking the DM for the following ruling:

NO PVP!
DnD is a team game and as such any attempts to deliberately harm another PC are assumed to be just trash talk and not intended seriously, should a player succeed in convincing the DM that he intends to hurt another PC then the plan backfires and that players PC is injured/killed instead.

if your DM is unwilling to institute such a ruling then he clearly supports PVP and you are allowed to plan (and execute (heh!)) the deaths of the other PC's as much as you like.

Just design each new PC to kill one member of the existing party and get killed off, continue until PVP is banned (or you are).

[Anakha]

Let me speak from experience. I hate party killers. There is no way to get yourself permanently banned from anything I DM, than to kill the party. It solves nothing, and does nothing other than piss me off at the player who does it, and the DM who allows it.

My advice would be to ignore most of the posters in this thread, sit down and talk with your DM and players. You may think Fighty Mc******* is an ass, but that doesn't mean he can't see things from a different Point of View. I will agree that he over reacted by getting shot with an arrow, especially considering thats really more the DM's fault than yours. The second situation was an inappropriate way to react, and acting hostile around people new to DnD, especially combat hostile, is a good way to get them to respond the way you do. These players will take your example as how DnD is supposed to work if you are the elder in the group.

If the group cannot reconcile accidents without killing people, then leave. Its not worth your time, and from what you say, it doesn't seem like you are friends with them. Trust me, its much better to not have DnD, than to have ****ty DnD.

[#Raptor]

During battle in a dungeon... cast levitate.
Then open fire/start debuffing your party.

Don't forget to close off the only possible exit with a wall of stone silent image.


Btw, did I miss something or why is noone mentioning the Coup de Grace with a Scythe while they sleep plan anymore?
Perhaps ask your dm before and suggest that it'd be reasonable that a C-d-G critical would loop a enemys head clean off. Theyr mouth isn't connected to theyr lungs anymore? Oops, no screaming for you.

And if you do it... after you passed the first note to the DM and he told the first player that he can roll up a new character, its time for a slight smile... and then you pass the secound note...
If those guys are a bit hard-headed and you REALLY need to drive the point home - a sack and theyr cut off heads make for a nice makeshift club.
It's just a shame Animate Dead is a 4-th level spell.

Oh, and always have invisibility prepared in case one of your plans fails and you need to get the hell away.
Then... have yourself some solo-adventures, become a batman/god-wizard, level up for a bit... and then its time for some payback.

Of course, the reasonable thing to do? Yupp, that'd be talking to them.
But if that doesn't lead to anything and you have reason to believe that they won't really stop... It's killing time.
You've got 3 good plans for that so far, and maybe people will come up with more.

You know the saying... Speak softly and carry a big stick.

[Tiki Snakes]

Will try. But I am also playing a gnome which kind of enjoys killing, planning, pillaging and stuff (they don't know that yet). So that's atleast a reason.



They do. Great idea!

...yeah. You should probably tell us less about your Class and levels, and MORE about what has actually happened, and what you have and have not done.

I'm not accusing you of anything, but it's possible you are the problem? If you tell us more, we can help better.

[Tsotha-lanti]

First rule of playing any game:

Don't play with *******s (unless you are being paid to).

Seriously, just don't play with them. Why would you?

Edit: Alchemist's fire is an incendiary, not an explosive. It does not explode, it catches fire.

[Korivan]

it might be difficult, but you gotta talk to them out of game about it. remember its just a game, people are supposed to have fun. since they are new to this game get together with the dm, talk to him about making sure the encounters so that everyone in the group is needed. thats how i used to try to get people to stop team killing, just pummel them with encounters untill they have a new jerk to hate...me:smallsmile:. after that, they all new that i wasnt comfortable with team killing, and i wont tolerat it. not if it destroys the group and every one walks away mad.

though you could be running into a different problem like i did. i had a friend that got bored with his characters if they didnt perform like ten times better then the party and he'd go off trying to kill the strongest, or next strongest character. if this is the case and these newbs just dont like thier characters, or something, heck i dont even know how to explain this kids lunacy. anyways, if these guys/girls just dont like teamwork, then you may have to find a new group. i suggest playing never winter nights 1 and 2 inbetween.

[Weimann]

If your interest is to actually make any progress in the matter and have them stop killing your character and start playing as a team (because, believe me, unless this revenge of yours is the last action before leaving the gaming group, war will be an undeniable fact), show them this thread. Make them understand that you are really, really TIRED of them offing your PC all the time.

Also, you say that you are doing nothing to incite this behaviour. Now, I don't mean to be insulting here, but are you sure they see it that way too? Clearly, you consider them the problem (and I definitely agree that two wasted characters is at least one more than I personally would have endured before bringing my future attendance on the table), but maybe you are also doing something that annoys them (and they are overreaction to the extreme)? Maybe it's something minor you're not even thinking about. Ask them. It's can't hurt, and it'll, again, make them understand that if you are willing to change your behaviour, you are serious about your position.

Also, as has been mentioned, ask the DM to ban PvP.

If none of this works, well, I do like the Alchemist's Fire plan.

[Jayabalard]

your party sounds young. like, maturity youngThat appears to be the case to me as well.

[Quietus]

But of course.

SSGoW: No, I am not doing anything wrong.

Yes, you are. You're escalating the situation, rather than actually dealing with it.


As for those who seem to have missed the reasoning behind his previous deaths...


Eldan's massive post: They should've though about that. Well, the first time they killed me, it was the fighter. I accidently hit him with a poisoned arrow when I rolled a 1 for which he killed me. Second time, we were introducing our new characters, and the elf cleric insulted me. I just "knocked" her (a male IRL) on the knee with my 1d6 hammer (it was meant to scare). Then the druid just poisoned me and I died because my CON got to 0. The cleric had all healing spells and bandages (received from my first character).

First death : The Fighter overreacted. Your bow had a mishap, and he KILLED you for it? That's ridiculous. Tell him to smarten up, and ask the DM not to use the OPTIONAL critical fumble rules in the future.

Second death : *this* is where you, yes YOU, already did something wrong, even before escalating things. They insulted you, and you inflicted LETHAL DAMAGE on someone. Even with no strength behind it, 1d6 damage is easily enough to knock a typical commoner unconscious. She says "Yo' mamma so fat!", and you try to DESTROY HER KNEECAP? You made the same mistake the Fighter did, in overreacting. Her poisoning you was entirely justified in this case, because you made an actual, lethal, KNOWING attempt on her life. Even if it was only meant to "scare". If someone walked up to you in real life and whacked you on the knee with enough force to really do actual damage, would you really think "Oh, he's just trying to scare me!", or would you call the police because it's ASSAULT? Well, the Druid had no police to call, so she answered violence with violence.


My advice : Stop being a whining baby about this whole thing. Accept that the first death was an overreaction on the Fighter's part as a result of a poor ruling on the DM's part, and that you DESERVED the second death. Then suggest that there be no PvP, because it's just going to get stupid and make everyone resent each other.

[Weimann]

Mm, yeah, so if I had actually read the thread properly, I'd had said the same things Quietus said.

Still, both parties need to smarten up. It's not entirely your fault.

[AslanCross]

I can't even begin to imagine how I'd react to this if I were in the OP's position.

From a DM's PoV, however: Why is the DM letting this happen? I normally find it immensely frustrating when players fight each other, since they're, you know, supposed to work together no matter how much they distrust or hate each other in character.

More and more why questions are piling up. I think it would be best to answer them before retaliating. Retaliation will only provoke further retaliation, and that way you can't really say "D&D isn't for PvP."

[mistformsquirrl]

Are you okay with being killed?
If not, ask them Out of Character to stop killing you. If the DM is on their side, it might be time to find a new group.

Agreed.

My first group killed a my second character with them on the flimsiest of pretexts... which I later found out was due to the DM having offered them XP for killing me. (... yeah, the guy who invited me to game put a bounty on my character's head behind my back <-.->;)

It's one thing if there's a decent IC reason: Ie - you're evil/good and keep causing problems for the opposite aligned party (though why they'd bring you back after that would be beyond me) - but if it's just general jerkery, then it's best to settle it out of game; because nothing you do in-game will stop it.

[SSGoW]

yeah i thought it was going to be something like this...

anyways another solution would be to have everyone reroll characters and make their background as best buds or somthing that way if a crit failure ends up hurting a team mate then that team mate would forgive his/her best friend for an accident (assuming they will roleplay right) or have it where since you accidently damaged your friend you offer to buy them something or give them gold

of course the DM could change crit failures to not hurt teammates but hurt the person who crit failed. I tend to do it that way so that another party member wont be "punished" for one party member messing up. like if i'm shooting a bow and roll a 1 thne i will accidently sneeze and shoot my foot or graze my leg

[Korivan]

My first group killed a my second character with them on the flimsiest of pretexts... which I later found out was due to the DM having offered them XP for killing me. (... yeah, the guy who invited me to game put a bounty on my character's head behind my back <-.->;)


wow, thank god ive never had some a hole dm put bounty's on any of my characters or those of my party. i have had a dm allow team killing because "its not against the rules". now thats lawful neutral if ive ever seen it.

[Origomar]

I agree kill the strongest one while they sleep and run away and join the villains team or become one or something

[TSED]

A bunch of people said that killing their in-game characters won't solve anything, so...


What about the real life guys? Sure you'll be insane and get like 20 years of jail time (or more), but you sure showed them not to mess with gnomes!

[FoE]

ldan's massive post: They should've though about that. Well, the first time they killed me, it was the fighter. I accidently hit him with a poisoned arrow when I rolled a 1 for which he killed me. Second time, we were introducing our new characters, and the elf cleric insulted me. I just "knocked" her (a male IRL) on the knee with my 1d6 hammer (it was meant to scare). Then the druid just poisoned me and I died because my CON got to 0. The cleric had all healing spells and bandages (received from my first character).

Tell me, have any of the other players killed each other, or have they only killed you?

If it's the latter, then I would say the problem doesn't lie with the rest of your party.

[woodenbandman]

I also forgot one important fact. They're newbies. These are their first characters.

This is why. I had a friend in a game who was a noob. He committed some minor sleight, like not being "involved enough" in the game (he's shy), and the party killed him against my protests. There were like a billion people in that group and the turns DID get really boring. This was almost everyone's first game, besides 2 people.

My first character got angsty at players when he didn't get to do anything cool, so I tried to kill a fellow player.

My friend's girlfriend's first character attacked my character in a WoD game.

It's natural for a player's first character to attack a fellow party member, especially if that party member is more experienced than them, because they may want to stand on their own and not receive help from people.

[Almn]

Go look up the Killer Gnome build and wreck them with shadow miracles. Show them what gnomes can do!

[Leon]

Your a Gnome - there is your problem, change race and the symptoms should clear up.

[Olo Demonsbane]

I reccommend talking to them first, and above all, do not do anything like hitting someone. Bad idea. If I just killed someone's character, and their new character walked up and hit me, I would utterly destroy that guy.

IF, however this doesnt work, bring the DM into it. Have the DM to say NO PVP!

IF that fails as well, have your character die and let us help you optimize the &%#$ out of your character.

[Nohwl]

his character would be level 1. he is better off doing something now if he wants to do it.

[xPANCAKEx]

what ever you do, run it by your DM first

[yilduz]

Someone may have said this already (I didn't read the whole thread)... but you're a gnome with 20 con. You shouldn't be an illusionist. Level 3... this is how I'd do it.

level 1 - fighter
-feat: toughness, bonus feat: roll with it
-Now you have 18 HP and DR 2/-
level 2 - fighter
-bonus feat: roll with it
-29 HP (average), DR 4/-
level 3 - barbarian
-feat: roll with it
-40 HP (average), DR 6/-, Rage, fast movement.

Your small size give you +1 to attack and AC. Get some heavy armor, put your second highest ability score in str, get a big sword, start destroying. Clobber the cleric first, and the druid to avoid the spells and their healing. Then go after fighter - even a couple of levels lower, you'll destroy him. Make sure you get the surprise round and as long as they don't get lucky, you'll beat them all.

Go get 'em.

[Origomar]

How old are you people?

This is a OOC problem, sit them down and explain to them that D&D is not a PvP game. If they want to play PvP, play WoW or Streetfighter or something.

Or this could be a not-so-subtle hint that they don't like you playing with them. In that case, there's nothing you can do except don't play with people who don't like you.

this made me lol, if you want pvp under no circumstances play WoW

[Kyselina]

Someone may have said this already (I didn't read the whole thread)... but you're a gnome with 20 con. You shouldn't be an illusionist. Level 3... this is how I'd do it.

level 1 - fighter
-feat: toughness, bonus feat: roll with it
-Now you have 18 HP and DR 2/-
level 2 - fighter
-bonus feat: roll with it
-29 HP (average), DR 4/-
level 3 - barbarian
-feat: roll with it
-40 HP (average), DR 6/-, Rage, fast movement.

Your small size give you +1 to attack and AC. Get some heavy armor, put your second highest ability score in str, get a big sword, start destroying. Clobber the cleric first, and the druid to avoid the spells and their healing. Then go after fighter - even a couple of levels lower, you'll destroy him. Make sure you get the surprise round and as long as they don't get lucky, you'll beat them all.

Go get 'em.

Big sword? Gnomes can use only small size weapons without penalties. Good idea though.


Also: I asked the DM. He is okay with me killing them. I think I will last 1/2 sessions to gain some levels before killing them.

[yilduz]

Big sword? Gnomes can use only small size weapons without penalties. Good idea though.


Also: I asked the DM. He is okay with me killing them. I think I will last 1/2 sessions to gain some levels before killing them.
I mean something big for him.

[Fuzzy_Juan]

Honestly, some people just feel a need to be silly and will find it amusing to kill a player's character. You have to be the judge if killing them back is a good option. If they are just being silly and doing it for kicks, then it may set them straight if they see that party conflict just leads to everyone is now dead, game over.

If you only say 'WTF?!?!' they'll likely just laugh and do it again later. If you can't talk things out, then just kill them all. I know I did. They tried a to kill one of my characters once...i let it slide cause they failed and the character was good aligned...then they did it again to an evil assasin so i snuck off then killed their mounts, stole their stuff, implicated them in crime, sent the guard after them and killed them in their sleep while they were resting at camp battered, bruised, and out of most spells. They didn't try and mess with one of my characters again for over a year...and when someone so much as gave another of my characters lip in another game that i felt was out of line, i killed them on the spot. When they asked 'WTF!' I said simply, noone talks to him like that and lives...in game actions have in game consequenses...read any of the fluff, mouth off like that to the prince and you are a dead man (Vampire, masquerade) unless you are very useful, and you just broke the masquerade, made my punishment descision easy.

Never had any other problems...once they found out that i would play my character and would no longer put up with any crap 'for the good of the party' that would be out of character for who i was playing...it was all good.

[Kyselina]

Honestly, some people just feel a need to be silly and will find it amusing to kill a player's character. You have to be the judge if killing them back is a good option. If they are just being silly and doing it for kicks, then it may set them straight if they see that party conflict just leads to everyone is now dead, game over.

If you only say 'WTF?!?!' they'll likely just laugh and do it again later. If you can't talk things out, then just kill them all. I know I did. They tried a to kill one of my characters once...i let it slide cause they failed and the character was good aligned...then they did it again to an evil assasin so i snuck off then killed their mounts, stole their stuff, implicated them in crime, sent the guard after them and killed them in their sleep while they were resting at camp battered, bruised, and out of most spells. They didn't try and mess with one of my characters again for over a year...and when someone so much as gave another of my characters lip in another game that i felt was out of line, i killed them on the spot. When they asked 'WTF!' I said simply, noone talks to him like that and lives...in game actions have in game consequenses...read any of the fluff, mouth off like that to the prince and you are a dead man (Vampire, masquerade) unless you are very useful, and you just broke the masquerade, made my punishment descision easy.

Never had any other problems...once they found out that i would play my character and would no longer put up with any crap 'for the good of the party' that would be out of character for who i was playing...it was all good.

Yeah. I need to show them that I do not like them messing with my characters.

[The White Knight]

Edit: Alchemist's fire is an incendiary, not an explosive. It does not explode, it catches fire.

Except when paired with Thunderstones.

[Tsotha-lanti]

Yeah. I need to show them that I do not like them messing with my characters.

You seriously need to listen to the people telling you that killing the other PCs will not accomplish anything, and least of all this.

Nevermind that you won't be able to do it, much less continue to do it (you're outnumbered), but the only effects you're likely to cause are 1) your PC getting killed even more times, and 2) the group breaking up because nobody is enjoying the game and everyone is fighting.

Seriously, just address the issue with the group like a grown-up. (I know this is hard when you're all 13 or whatever, but you have to learn it sometime.)

Edit:

Except when paired with Thunderstones.

"When it strikes a hard surface (or is struck hard)"

Thunderstones aren't explosives either.

[The White Knight]

"When it strikes a hard surface (or is struck hard)"

Thunderstones aren't explosives either.

When the Alchemist's napalm bomb came up, I assumed creativity was an option. I'd certainly let a fireball set off a bunch of thunderstones, and I'd certainly let the sonic boom they emit propel the alchemist's fire. We'd be getting into a pretty pricy napalm bomb for a 3rd level character though.

[Tsotha-lanti]

I'd certainly let a fireball set off a bunch of thunderstones

How does that make any sense at all? Fireballs explicitly don't have force, and don't impact on anything. Thunderstones aren't set off by heat or flame - they're set off by sharp impact.

Just get a scroll of fireball. 150 gold pieces. That's the price of three thunderstones and three flasks of alchemist's fire, and does more damage (since thunderstones and alchemist's fire don't actually stack damage if you have more of them, and shouldn't).

[Bucky]

1)Look up the rules for subdual damage
2)Show your friends the rules for subdual damage
3)Get beaten up next time instead of killed

Problem solved

[awa]

Now i would like to say like several other pepole have said that killing the party wont solve the problem. Now if they try and attack you and you defend yourself that's one thing but most of the advice you seem to be getting revolves around attacking the party unprovoked. If you do that and kill the whole party in their sleep with out in game provocation what you can expect is the new party to swarm you.

How exactly did you accidentally shoot the fighter i had one game (not dungeons and dragons) where two pcs were fighting a monster in a doorway with the shooter trying to hit the monster past the melee charecter in this situation i informed him that he had a substantially better chance of accidentally hitting his friend then hitting the monster. If the situation was similar he may have been justified.

[Pharaoh's Fist]

Now i would like to say like several other pepole have said that killing the party wont solve the problem. Now if they try and attack you and you defend yourself that's one thing but most of the advice you seem to be getting revolves around attacking the party unprovoked. If you do that and kill the whole party in their sleep with out in game provocation what you can expect is the new party to swarm you.
Getting killed twice is not in game provocation?

[Mystic Muse]

he got killed once by an overreaction and he got killed another time because HE overreacted. therefore it is currently balanced. if you KNOW they plan on killing you a third time it's justified.

[Pharaoh's Fist]

he got killed once by an overreaction and he got killed another time because HE overreacted. therefore it is currently balanced. if you KNOW they plan on killing you a third time it's justified.

I'd hate to use the scales you're using.

[Jayabalard]

Yeah. I need to show them that I do not like them messing with my characters.You could just try [insert socially unacceptable bodily function here] on their floor.. it's about as effective as killing them in game for showing them that you don't like their behavior.

[Olo Demonsbane]

he got killed once by an overreaction and he got killed another time because HE overreacted. therefore it is currently balanced. if you KNOW they plan on killing you a third time it's justified.

...And they are...

[Caewil]

The best option would be poison. Don't poison their food either - that's too obvious. Instead, poison their water flasks while they're sleeping. Ensure that the poison is colourless, odourless and tasteless.

Once they've been poisoned, they'll probably try to kill you. Tell them that if they do, they'll never find the antidote in time - you've buried it somewhere far away enough that they won't be able to get back and kill you. The fun part is that instead of giving them the location of an antidote, you bury some more poison somewhere, which they will then take voluntarily. You should also have taken the real antidote beforehand in case they get smart and make you drink some of the fake antidote before them.

[Pharaoh's Fist]

The best option would be poison. Don't poison their food either - that's too obvious. Instead, poison their water flasks while they're sleeping. Ensure that the poison is colourless, odourless and tasteless.

But what if they've spent the last few years building up a resistance to iocane powder?

[kjones]

Serious question: What are you planning on doing after you kill their characters? They'll come back into the game with new characters, and do you think that they'll be willing to just "forgive and forget"? Chances are, they'll be out for blood, regardless of whether or not their characters would have motivation to do so.

So what are you going to do to their new characters? Kill them, too? And what about their characters after that?

If you're trying to make it clear that you don't want them killing your character - talk to them, out of character. If they don't listen to that, then it's unlikely that killing them will solve your problems.

[WrathOfLife]

I always wonder why people choose to talk about justification in these threads... Strikes me as odd, considering some of these people will kill an Orc on sight, unless its a PC in which case it will trust them straight away.

The OP asked for help, so help he shall have...

Your first mistake is playing as a gnome *shudders* but I'll let that slide. I'm not overtly fond of wizards in general either...

I would personally cover the characters in oil while you are on watch, and they are sleeping. Cover everything in oil, including there horses, tents, ground near by. Then light a fire near by and throw a torch into the area. They can't prove it was you if they live (I was only gone for a little while, when I came back everything was on fire!), and even then they will be weak enough to die later on.

[HealthKit]

I'm also sensing a lack of maturity all around this situation.

Seriously, how old are you guys?

[WrathOfLife]

I'm also sensing a lack of maturity all around this situation.

Seriously, how old are you guys?

You realize your asking this question on a forum dedicated to stick figures living in a fantasy world?

The irony to the question amuses me greatly.

[Waspinator]

"Someone ever tries to kill you, you try to kill 'em right back!"
-Mal

[MCerberus]

I think it would be a good idea to explain how your party killed you twice. Was it just them stabbing you? If so explain how it isn't cool, and then STAB THEM IN THE BACK ANYWAY... sorry... evil lapse.

If your character died from something else and your party didn't seem to help you enough, it could be that they aren't trying to get you killed. They're new, so they may not know what they can do to save you. Stay near the back and do a little jig when their life is in mortal peril while drinking wine and hitting on their... evil again.

Either way you should try the diplomatic route OOC before having your gnome kill everything.

[ashmanonar]

A bunch of people said that killing their in-game characters won't solve anything, so...


What about the real life guys? Sure you'll be insane and get like 20 years of jail time (or more), but you sure showed them not to mess with gnomes!

And then make sure to tell the dudes in prison that you killed 3 people OVER A TABLETOP GAME.

You won't become anybody's b****.

[WrathOfLife]

And then make sure to tell the dudes in prison that you killed 3 people OVER A TABLETOP GAME.

You won't become anybody's b****.

http://img514.imageshack.us/img514/7421/politicalpicturesgoogle.jpg

Of course I don't suggest OOC actions, thats just silly, that requires actually having to do things.

However I maintain that MAD (Mutually Assured Destruction) beats the heck out of "Kick the little guy"

[Jayabalard]

You realize your asking this question on a forum dedicated to stick figures living in a fantasy world?

The irony to the question amuses me greatly.I don't see any irony. Stick figures in a fantasy world can appeal to people of all ages.

[WrathOfLife]

I don't see any irony. Stick figures in a fantasy world can appeal to people of all ages.

I agree, however my point was that in such an environment, a person can remain ignorant of the fact that age has no correlation to maturity.

And of course Maturity has little bearing on a game. I've played evil before, I've killed team mates before. One of my characters had a basement with previous team mates frozen to death in it.

Doesn't mean anything about me. To judge me based on how I play a game, is to pass judgement on every little girl who plays the sims.

That is a scary scary thought.

[Jayabalard]

age has no correlation to maturity.No, there's definably a correlation between age and maturity. Older people tend to be more mature than young, so there's some sort of correlation there (not causation, ie older people are more mature because they are older, since there are undeniably older people who are very immature)


And of course Maturity has little bearing on a game. I've played evil before, I've killed team mates before. One of my characters had a basement with previous team mates frozen to death in it. Yeah, but that doesn't sound like our OP's situation... it really sounds like he's playing with a bunch of pre-teens who haven't fully joined the human race yet.

[WrathOfLife]

No, there's definably a correlation between age and maturity. Older people tend to be more mature than young, so there's some sort of correlation there (not causation, ie older people are more mature because they are older, since there are undeniably older people who are very immature)

Yeah, but that doesn't sound like our OP's situation... it really sounds like he's playing with a bunch of pre-teens who haven't fully joined the human race yet.

I'll concede the first point happily, you are correct.

On the second point, I'll have to disagree. I've had the misfortune of meeting several ... lets call them people, who have never truly grown up. From watching TV shows like Sailor moon (and discussing it avidly) to failing to realize that if they don't like something they shouldn't have there character do it to the character who's player is far more versed in the rules... and then crying afterwards.

[TSED]

You can be mature and fixated with something usually meant for 'kids.'


My friend is in college with me, right? He watches The Big Comfy Couch EVERY DAY and will not under ANY circumstances miss it.

He's still pretty mature.

In other words... bad example.

[WrathOfLife]

You can be mature and fixated with something usually meant for 'kids.'


My friend is in college with me, right? He watches The Big Comfy Couch EVERY DAY and will not under ANY circumstances miss it.

He's still pretty mature.

In other words... bad example.

...

You realize you just agreed with me right?

Immature actions =/= Immature person.

[TSED]

That's not what I attacked at all!

I said that watching childish TV shows isn't immature.

[WrathOfLife]

That's not what I attacked at all!

I said that watching childish TV shows isn't immature.

But playing a game in a way a childish way is immature?

Isn't that some what inconsistent?

[The Glyphstone]

You realize your asking this question on a forum dedicated to stick figures living in a fantasy world?

The irony to the question amuses me greatly.

You have seen XKCD, right? Most cerebral stick figures I've ever heard of.

[WrathOfLife]

You have seen XKCD, right? Most cerebral stick figures I've ever heard of.

Of course, I'm not saying this is a constant, merely questioning the assumption that age is the leading factor in maturity, and that maturity is linked to how you play a game.

[The Glyphstone]

Absolutely true.

[Jair Barik]

"Death is not the answer to everything Charnel"
"No.... torture also has its merits" :smallwink:

Don't kill them, nick their stuff while their asleep, sell it, buy better items to compensate for your lower level and suggest that the party goes on a quest to find the mysterious thief who has been plaguing you and to bring them to justice.

if they attack you then your perfectly justified to go invis and implement any number of the plans mentioned already as an act of self defense.

[DeathQuaker]

Ya know, if you think that vengeance will teach people like this a lesson, and you think they won't stop killing you or being jerks in play, you deserve the frustration you've been put through and whatever future agony they put upon you. You clearly want to continue misery rather than solve it, so I have no sympathy for you.

But, for the record, summon the library and stone bed about 50' over their heads and let the damage ensue from there.

Then watch them continue to gang up on you. Continue to try to get your own back. Lather, rinse, repeat. :smallsigh:

[Kyselina]

Did anybody read the part where I told you that they are preparing a third attack on me (or did I forget to write it?)? They justify it with "kill him before he gets too powerful".

[Tsotha-lanti]

Did anybody read the part where I told you that they are preparing a third attack on me (or did I forget to write it?)? They justify it with "kill him before he gets too powerful".

The old advice stands:

Stop playing with them.

How can you not understand the simple, obvious fact that killing them back will only exacerbate the situation?

[kjones]

Did anybody read the part where I told you that they are preparing a third attack on me (or did I forget to write it?)? They justify it with "kill him before he gets too powerful".

Did you read the part where we asked you how you think killing them will solve anything? It will only lead to further player kills - either you killing them, or them killing you.

[HealthKit]

Did anybody read the part where I told you that they are preparing a third attack on me (or did I forget to write it?)? They justify it with "kill him before he gets too powerful".

Have you read the several posts that suggest that you have a serious talk with your DM and the other players about the situation?

You haven't given a whole lot of information about what's gone on with that.

[Pharaoh's Fist]

The old advice stands:

Stop playing with them. After crushing them and hearing the lamentations of their women.


There we go.

[warmachine]

Alternative advice: Play Paranoia. It's the RPG where the players are supposed to be scheming, paranoid backstabbers and everyone gets six lives.

[Weimann]

Stop playing with them. After crushing them and hearing the lamentations of their women.There we go.Mm, but from what we have heard, he doesn't intend to quit the group after his revenge, and as such, it will not at all help, but make the situation worse.

Well, I mean, it's not my decision at all, but he doesn't seem to get that point.

[sofawall]

You have seen XKCD, right? Most cerebral stick figures I've ever heard of.


How do I write "xkcd"? There's nothing in Strunk and White about this.

For those of us pedantic enough to want a rule, here it is: The preferred form is "xkcd", all lower-case. In formal contexts where a lowercase word shouldn't start a sentence, "XKCD" is an okay alternative. "Xkcd" is frowned upon.

Sorry, I had to.

[SSGoW]

I know what you mean this PvP stuff must really be cutting into game play and i wouldn't be surprised if eventually even the DM doesn't want to run the campy anymore. usually if people kill you off they dont want you there
and even if you come back the same thing will happen ver and over. my first campy we ended up killing off a jerk cause he was a jerk in and out of game, he was metagaming, he was breakng his allignment, and also he was setting up his character to be able to be able to kill us all at night. we didnt want to play dnd with this guy cause he brought the game down not only with the way he would misquote rules but he just sucked the fun out of the game. although he didnt realise he was doing anything wrong even after being told he didnt join anymore.

moral of the story

if more than one person keeps wanting to kill you off then you dont sit right with them YOU are the outlier, the black sheep. And in such you may be doing somthing you dont know you are doing (your second death is prime example) killing their characters is not an option if you want ot continue to play dnd with them. it is an option if you are either going to leave the group or get new people to replace them.

[Fixer]

I was doing a quick quest for money and they happened to go into the same dungeon :smallconfused:. So I guess nothing. Although, my DM lives in another city.No quicker money than a bunch of jack@sses who have a reputation for party-killing and trust this new guy to watch them while they sleep. Fits with your character well.

If the players are newbies, it is likely they are powertripping. Once you kill off their characters they are going to go after you no matter what reason you give. As a result, I recommend your DM grows some balls and intervenes or starts awarding XP penalties for team-killing without a bloody good reason.
-------------------------
I recall a situation where we had one player (have known the guy for more than half my life) who was just being a jerk in-game. He was continuously grandstanding, and not when it was appropriate. Trying to be a poser-gangster and everyone calling him on it. At one point he goes and does something that required out characters to start rolling initiative against each other because he's about to perform some hideously stupid act. the gaming session ended badly and that campaign ended right there and then.

Do not expect your campaign to survive your encounter, if you win. Do not expect a difference in behavior from your party-mates if you lose. The only way you can possibly get a 'win' out of this situation is diplomacy. If I were you I'd pump a few ranks into it personally.

[Guancyto]

I know what you mean this PvP stuff must really be cutting into game play and i wouldn't be surprised if eventually even the DM doesn't want to run the campy anymore. usually if people kill you off they dont want you there

They may be jerks, but this is actually a strong possibility. Give some careful consideration to this, and to your interactions with them in and out of game.

Ask yourself. Are you That Guy?

Also, what was said about "is the party killing anyone else's characters."

[Dagren]

To everyone saying that the OP killing his team-mates is an inherently bad idea, I would first say that obviously, I agree that talking this out OOC is the only way to deal with this. That said, killing their characters first would add impact to the argument that PVP combat isn't what the game is about, not being a lot of fun. That's if they can't empathise with why killing his character is upsetting to him, of course. It is, as always, a judgement call as to whether this would be appropriate without trying just talking first.

[Tokiko Mima]

I'll agree with most everyone else. If they're killing you and the DM is doing nothing to stop, then you need to find another D&D group. Retaliation will accomplish nothing in the direction of solving the real problem.

However, if you would like revenge anyway remember that unconscious characters are automatically considered willing for any Will Save spells you have. Charm or Dominate will stop this behavior cold, and you can have any sort of revenge you like after that. Make them cluck like chickens or whatever, just try not to go overboard because then you'll start to feel sorry for them.

[Mystic Muse]

Did anybody read the part where I told you that they are preparing a third attack on me (or did I forget to write it?)? They justify it with "kill him before he gets too powerful".

you also don't seem to read anybody else's advice. you also haven't told us whether you've tried just talking to them. if not I suggest doing so. and if it doesn't work kill their characters and THEN talk to them. then they'll realize how non-fun it is for your team to kill your character and might listen to you better.

[kjones]

I'll agree with most everyone else. If they're killing you and the DM is doing nothing to stop, then you need to find another D&D group. Retaliation will accomplish nothing in the direction of solving the real problem.

However, if you would like revenge anyway remember that unconscious characters are automatically considered automatically willing for any Will Save spells you have. Charm or Dominate will stop this behavior cold, and you can have any sort of revenge you like after that. Make them cluck like chickens or whatever, just try not to go overboard because then you'll start to feel sorry for them.

Is that really true? I don't think you're wrong, I've just never seen that rule before. Cite?

[Tokiko Mima]

Is that really true? I don't think you're wrong, I've just never seen that rule before. Cite?


http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicOverview/spellDescriptions.htm#targetorTargets

Some spells have a target or targets. You cast these spells on creatures or objects, as defined by the spell itself. You must be able to see or touch the target, and you must specifically choose that target. You do not have to select your target until you finish casting the spell.

If the target of a spell is yourself (the spell description has a line that reads Target: You), you do not receive a saving throw, and spell resistance does not apply. The Saving Throw and Spell Resistance lines are omitted from such spells.

Some spells restrict you to willing targets only. Declaring yourself as a willing target is something that can be done at any time (even if you’re flat-footed or it isn’t your turn). Unconscious creatures are automatically considered willing, but a character who is conscious but immobile or helpless (such as one who is bound, cowering, grappling, paralyzed, pinned, or stunned) is not automatically willing.

Some spells allow you to redirect the effect to new targets or areas after you cast the spell. Redirecting a spell is a move action that does not provoke attacks of opportunity.

It's on page 175 of PHB as well. Basically, if you're a wizard with a nasty streak, you can do whatever you like to your party if they fall asleep and circumstances (silence, Silent Spell, poor Listen checks, etc.) prevent the spells verbal components from waking them up.

This is why you *never* want to travel with a wizard who has any reason to get revenge on you, and why banning Enchantment can make parties feel a lot more relaxed with the wizard in their presence.

[only1doug]

Did anybody read the part where I told you that they are preparing a third attack on me (or did I forget to write it?)? They justify it with "kill him before he gets too powerful".

And who can blame them?
You are planning to kill them and they probably realise it. The solution is to abandon adversarial playing and ask the GM to rule PVP out of the game.
A no PVP ruling would prevent the actual problem that you are describing.

Unfortunately this tactic won't work, because you don't desire this solution, you are seeking external approval for a course of action that you (maybe subconciously) know is going to be counterproductive.

Take whichever course of action you desire.
The more mature gamers here will shake our heads sadly when you mess up your group and the younger people will laugh at your sob story once you have been banned from your group for following their advice.

[WrathOfLife]

Sah, this makes me cry on the inside....

I haven't seen a single post where the OP has mentioned having hard feelings about PC's dying. He's stated that a) His PC has being killed. b) Other members of the group wish to kill him again c) He now wishes to kill the other PC's

To me, this sounds like a fun game. Throw in the right amount of plot and a workable DM and you have a great game.

I've played in some great games where groups of players activity competed against other groups of players, until they finally had to work together. Just as we finished off one part of the plot we all betrayed each other in a great night time blundering.

Why must it always be personal? Clearly if the other players didn't want PvP in the game, they wouldn't have attacked the OP. But they did, so they do. Their actions endorse it, the fact the game still runs shows there are no hard feelings.

I wonder if the people who post advising not to play etc etc, would quit a game if for a valid in-game reason their wizard found himself without his spell book.

A game is just like real life, its only as fun or as bad as you let it be.

[Jayabalard]

Sah, this makes me cry on the inside....

I haven't seen a single post where the OP has mentioned having hard feelings about PC's dying. He's stated that a) His PC has being killed. b) Other members of the group wish to kill him again c) He now wishes to kill the other PC's He also said that "The DM told them to stop killing me." ... so the DM at least, does not find this to be a "fun game".

[WrathOfLife]

He also said that "The DM told them to stop killing me." ... so the DM at least, does not find this to be a "fun game".

And yet the OP also said
Also: I asked the DM. He is okay with me killing them.

I'm not saying that in every case, just going along with it is the right thing to do. I'm just saying the OP wishes for it to be this way, it is not a question of morals, but rather of an outcome for him, better or worse, richer or poorer, till death do they part. :smalltongue:

[Indeed.]

OP continues to sidestep the question of his age.

This leads me to believe that he is in fact a kiddie and everyone involved is in the wrong.

I await further updates on this comedy of errors.

[kjones]

Sah, this makes me cry on the inside....

I haven't seen a single post where the OP has mentioned having hard feelings about PC's dying. He's stated that a) His PC has being killed. b) Other members of the group wish to kill him again c) He now wishes to kill the other PC's

To me, this sounds like a fun game. Throw in the right amount of plot and a workable DM and you have a great game.

I've played in some great games where groups of players activity competed against other groups of players, until they finally had to work together. Just as we finished off one part of the plot we all betrayed each other in a great night time blundering.

Why must it always be personal? Clearly if the other players didn't want PvP in the game, they wouldn't have attacked the OP. But they did, so they do. Their actions endorse it, the fact the game still runs shows there are no hard feelings.

I wonder if the people who post advising not to play etc etc, would quit a game if for a valid in-game reason their wizard found himself without his spell book.

A game is just like real life, its only as fun or as bad as you let it be.

Maybe if the OP told us that he, and the rest of the players, were having fun doing so... but no, it seems that the reason he wants to kill the other players is to keep them from killing him.

If that's the sort of game you want, more power to you, but I don't think that's the case here. If it is, then I stand corrected.

[WrathOfLife]

Maybe if the OP told us that he, and the rest of the players, were having fun doing so... but no, it seems that the reason he wants to kill the other players is to keep them from killing him.

If that's the sort of game you want, more power to you, but I don't think that's the case here. If it is, then I stand corrected.

Well, if it isn't the kind of game he wants, why does he constantly ignore or rebuttal the posters saying that he's being immature, or offering advice on anything other than how to kill his party?

[kjones]

Well, if it isn't the kind of game he wants, why does he constantly ignore or rebuttal the posters saying that he's being immature, or offering advice on anything other than how to kill his party?

Perhaps because he thinks that killing his party will end the violence, instead of perpetuating it.

[herrhauptmann]

If the DM keeps saying 'Don't kill him' and the players ignore him. The DM should do more than just say it. Penalize them with XP perhaps, or say 'No, you actually killed an illusion of him, he's right behind you pulling the trigger to a trap'.
OR, the DM could let him make a 10th level character, but only tell the party he's third. When they start something, this poor sot can turn the tables and thrash them all. Afterwards, everybody agrees to stop the infantile BS and make new characters that get along.

[Tsotha-lanti]

Perhaps because he thinks that killing his party will end the violence, instead of perpetuating it.

Or he's thirteen.

[tribble]

OR, the DM could let him make a 10th level character, but only tell the party he's third. When they start something, this poor sot can turn the tables and thrash them all. Afterwards, everybody agrees to stop the infantile BS and make new characters that get along.

see, that's what it seems like the people here who are giving ideas are doing, only with ingenuity, not the crude expedient of a power level in excess of 9000. here's what I would say as a DM after the delicious murders:
Players: WTF???!
DM: oh, what's that? you dont like having the characters you put hours and hours into creating and nurturing brutally murdered for infantile reasons? what a concept!

[MeeposFire]

Since the DM seems to want to help I think this would be the best idea. The problem is that the players do not realize that killing each other is bad for their characters. We also can figure they want to keep their characters alive. Lastly we know that wizards have abilities that can not be easily replicated by other classes. My idea is to put the entire party in a dungeon. In this dungeon you put obstacles that the party can not beat without the wizard. Make it in fact a fatal trap. If the party kills the wizard make the next room that trap. Make the trap inescapable without the wizard and make it obvious that killing the wizard led directly to their deaths. The DM should make encounters that need all the characters to succeed and if any characters were killed by each other on purpose then continue to show them that they need to work together in order to survive. Right now they must not need to work together to survive so in summation ask the DM to make it necessary. This will also keep the party from engaging in actions for revenge.

EDIT: Also the DM should also make encounters that need the other characters as well not just the wizard.

[HealthKit]

OP continues to sidestep the question of his age.

This leads me to believe that he is in fact a kiddie and everyone involved is in the wrong.

I await further updates on this comedy of errors.

Agreed.

Though personally I'm curious to know what the other players and the DM think of the situation. I'd love to hear about it from their point of view. :smallamused:

[raptor1056]

Have you asked them to stop killing you? If you have not, do it. I mean, since the DM told them to and they didn't, I assume this won't matter. Still, you will have a much better out-of-game argument for murdering them having done this.

On to the murder!

Now, assuming you can't fight these people, keep in mind that your character has 18 Int, and as such is most likely a good schemer. Thus, this works in game. Scheming is the only way to kill these people. Schemes should not include combat. They should include either CDGs or poison. Charm Person on a bartender to whom you have just handed some very deadly poison is always nice. Alternately, quietly sneak poison into canteens. Alternately, volunteer to find food for the party, then poison the hell out of it. So on.

Useful spells:
Color Spray: If you get anybody alone, this gives you a chance to lop off his head.
Charm Person: See example.
Invisibility: Sneak up. Poison stuff. Hurt people with explosives/ hypercombustives. Run away.
Blindness/ Deafness: Cast it on the dude who's on watch. Kill everyone.
Pyrotechnics: Blind everyone. Then light them on fire. Then laugh.

Alternately, pay somebody higher level than the party to do it. Alternately, become friends with the BBEG and scheme. Alternately, find friends who aren't douches.

EDIT: Wow, I did not see those other five pages. This is probably no longer relevant in its entirety. Well, whatever.

[Haven]

It's on page 175 of PHB as well. Basically, if you're a wizard with a nasty streak, you can do whatever you like to your party if they fall asleep and circumstances (silence, Silent Spell, poor Listen checks, etc.) prevent the spells verbal components from waking them up.

This is why you *never* want to travel with a wizard who has any reason to get revenge on you, and why banning Enchantment can make parties feel a lot more relaxed with the wizard in their presence.

"Unconscious creatures are automatically considered willing" is by far the most unfortunate sentence in the SRD. :smalleek:

[Coidzor]

...That is a pretty bad sentence...

Also. I'm surprised this thread has been going on for so long and... yargh...

What kind of wussy DM is this? If they're doing PVP they should be slaughtering one another much more often than just one guy

[Kyselina]

Okay, I talked to them today at school. Response? "We're going to kill you anyway."


So. The next session is tomorrow. I also forgot to list my skills (without racial bonuses), so:

Concentration - 6
Alchemy - 4
Spellcraft - 6
Knowlodge (arcana) - 6
Appraise - 2
Forgery - 4
Bluff - 1

[Elixia]

Okay, I talked to them today at school. Response? "We're going to kill you anyway."
Alright, this is a form of bullying. you cant really argue there. either YOU should leave the group to there immature games and find a better group to play with or your DM needs to take action, i mean REAL action.
Is there a peronal reason why they are singling you out? are they your normal friends at school? I think this is a issue that needs to be resolved out the game rather than in it

[Kyselina]

Alright, this is a form of bullying. you cant really argue there. either YOU should leave the group to there immature games and find a better group to play with or your DM needs to take action, i mean REAL action.
Is there a peronal reason why they are singling you out? are they your normal friends at school? I think this is a issue that needs to be resolved out the game rather than in it

They're my normal friends. Also, there was atleast one reason. "Why do you have to play a selfish gnome?" (selfish because I declined to give my genie some stuff to carry). Another reason why to kill me. This is like going to someone IRL and asking him "Why are your jokes not funny?" and kill him for that (Not like you should compare a game to real life.) .

[Elixia]

a selfish gnome? ah, i see.

we had a similiar problem (only we didnt kill him) we had a selfish halfling. he could ruin the best laid plans of mice and men. eventually it got to a point where a whole session got de-railled and went off course so we had a talk to him.
He addressed the issue himself by killing off his own character (in a cool arane explode, he was a sorcessor) and replacing his character with one that was more fitted to the group.

maybe your character isnt meshing well with the group and thats why they feel the only way to confront the issue is to kill him (though tbh they should talk to you out of game if thats the the problem)
If so then maybe can make steps to setting your character on track and pull the team together.

[Kyselina]

a selfish gnome? ah, i see.

we had a similiar problem (only we didnt kill him) we had a selfish halfling. he could ruin the best laid plans of mice and men. eventually it got to a point where a whole session got de-railled and went off course so we had a talk to him.
He addressed the issue himself by killing off his own character (in a cool arane explode, he was a sorcessor) and replacing his character with one that was more fitted to the group.

maybe your character isnt meshing well with the group and thats why they feel the only way to confront the issue is to kill him (though tbh they should talk to you out of game if thats the the problem)
If so then maybe can make steps to setting your character on track and pull the team together.

The only selfish thing I did so far was only decline to carry these items...

[kamikasei]

Sounds like they don't like how you've been acting in game, and rather than discuss the issue they've decided to simply punish you by killing your character(s). If they think you're still behaving badly, a plea for them to leave you alone could be seen as an attempt to escape the consequences of your actions.

So,

- do you think you have been behaving badly? Are you willing to apologize to them, and pledge to stop?
- do you think they actually care about your behaviour, or are they just enjoying messing with you?
- is there an enjoyable game under all this, that you can get back to once the PvP is out of your systems, or is the backbiting what you're focused on now?

If you're all enjoying the PvP, and it's not distracting you from the game you set out to play (because it's not cool to relegate the DM and all the work he does to just refereeing a series of grudge matches), you may as well continue until you become sick of it. If you're not, then either try to talk it out or walk away. You say you have tried to talk it out, but a little introspection may be in order: if you think their behaviour is a reaction (even an overreaction) to perceived bad behaviour on your part, you may want to address that.

[Dagren]

"Unconscious creatures are automatically considered willing" is by far the most unfortunate sentence in the SRD. :smalleek:What, even worse than the one that says that they automatically fail any saving throw? That turns "save or dies", that are already considered by overpowered by some, into "yeah, just die". There doesn't seem to be an exemption for the Fort save on a CDG, either, so it's not just wizards that can bring on the hurt.

[Kyselina]

- do you think you have been behaving badly? Are you willing to apologize to them, and pledge to stop?
- do you think they actually care about your behaviour, or are they just enjoying messing with you?
- is there an enjoyable game under all this, that you can get back to once the PvP is out of your systems, or is the backbiting what you're focused on now?



1. I don't think I behaved bad.
2. Mostly the second.
3. Yes.

[ImmortalAer]

Then what you need is a copy of... How not to play D&D


Immortal's Traps and Treason
A Player's Guide to the 'Accidental' Slaying of Others

[Tsotha-lanti]

Okay, I talked to them today at school. Response? "We're going to kill you anyway."

Why play with them?

[Coidzor]

Your friends cause me to facepalm. :smallannoyed:

[kamikasei]

1. I don't think I behaved bad.
2. Mostly the second.
3. Yes.

Then you've got a group who are ignoring the game at hand in order to screw you over, and nothing you can/are willing to do will dissuade them. They're griefers. Let them cause one another grief, and leave. You will accomplish nothing by staying.

[Kyselina]

I already decided to kill them.


What about getting levitation, levitate them all 3 up when they're sleeping (willing) and then just let them go up, and up, and up... and when it runs out, BAM!



(Since I don't really think I will survive their attack, what should be my next character?)

[Coidzor]

I already decided to kill them.


What about getting levitation, levitate them all 3 up when they're sleeping (willing) and then just let them go up, and up, and up... and when it runs out, BAM!

That'd be about 600 feet of fall damage....so 20d6 fall damage... you can substitute your standard action after casting it twice to move up two of 'em each round...

But I doubt they'd let you live long enough past your introduction to get a chance with them asleep. In fact, I'd say if anything they'd just pounce on you as soon as they thought that you thought that they were asleep and did anything. The better to break you.

Your next character should be dice to the face of the lot of 'em.

[Elixia]

(Since I don't really think I will survive their attack, what should be my next character?)

Barb; theyre power houses

[ImmortalAer]

Your next character should be dice to the face of the lot of 'em.

I would suggest the noble d10. Enough points and edges to do some damage, and thier heavier than the spiky d4, making for a good balance.

The d100 would be effective for both wieght, and comedic effect. (It's a freaking golf ball.)

[Fixer]

Barb; theyre power housesI am inclined to disagree. Allow me to explain.

These are griefers who want to push someone around. The OP doesn't seem to mind the 'game' so he is working within it. Therefore, what he needs to do is to change the bullseye from his back to someone else's.

My first suggestion would be to play a cleric, but with a druid and a cleric already in the party this seems to be redundantly redundant :smallsmile:. Talk to your GM about the next part of his game and see if the GM would be willing to put more traps into the game. Play an artificer (Eberron) and appear to focus on your skills and trapfinding and making consumable magic items for others. This makes you useful to keep around and less likely for others to kill you.

Now, at some point make some wands of charm person and use them on your 'friends' while they sleep. From that point forward, just keep the wands charged up and refresh the charm before it expires. In this fashion you can keep your friends' characters charmed (and therefore unwilling to kill you) and yourself alive. If the players try to make their characters attack you, the DM should intervene and say the spell prevents the characters from wanting to do so. Make sure you clear ALL of this with the DM before you do it, though.

[Elixia]

I am inclined to disagree. Allow me to explain.

sneaky plan is sneaky, i like it but can you have articifers in 3.0/3.5? if so this is pure win!

[Killer Angel]

sneaky plan is sneaky, i like it but can you have articifers in 3.0/3.5? if so this is pure win!

Artificer is a class present in the Eberron setting, so it's "born" with the 3rd edition.
With google you can find a lot of material and articles.

[Garian]

I had this problem as a DM. The three melee based characters in the party kept killing both the spell casters. These characters being low level casters had no chance. It happened for the third time when I started taking away XP for bad role playing. Spontaneously killing a party member in the middle of combat cost the 4th level barbarian enough XP to take him down to barely 3rd level. It was the last time I had a PvP problem with that party.

PvP can be fun, but not if it is just pointless slaughter of you buddy's character.

[Killer Angel]

I had this problem as a DM. The three melee based characters in the party kept killing both the spell casters. These characters being low level casters had no chance. It happened for the third time when I started taking away XP for bad role playing. Spontaneously killing a party member in the middle of combat cost the 4th level barbarian enough XP to take him down to barely 3rd level. It was the last time I had a PvP problem with that party.


The THIRD time?!? He was lucky to lose only a level. :smallfurious:
But why on earth they did such a thing?!? Even a barbarian/ranger who hates magic and elects wizards as favourite enemies, should try to at least "respect" his teammates...

[Tallis]

SSGoW: No, I am not doing anything wrong.

You did attack one of them with a hammer....

I've only read the first 2 pages, so forgive me if I repeat anything.

Killing you for fumbling was wrong on their part, no question there. the second time though you started the fight. If you really felt the need to attack them (still a bad idea) you could have just punched him. A non-lethal form of attack might have just gotten you beat up instead of killed. Bringing it into the real world: if someone I just met shot me in the leg I'd kill him.

The first thing to do in a situation like this should always be to talk. Let the other players know how you feel about it and try to work it out before it escalates even more.

Now for what you wanted to hear:
If you're dead set on killing them the first thing to remember is don't get into a straight-up fight with them. You will lose. Trick them, separate them and catch them unaware. If it does turn into a head-on fight run away.

So you have a genie, a dead dwarf, a stone bed and illusions:). Get some poison, turn invisible and poison their food before it comes out of the kitchen. Be sure to fake the same symptoms. It may not kill them but hopefully it will weaken them. Place the dead dwarf in a public location and create an illusion of the cleric and the fighter killing him when someone comes by. At level 4 and 5 the local authorities should be able to arrest them. While they're occupied the druid is vulnerable. Set up a a trap outside the tavern to hold him in place (tanglefoot bag, have the genie dig a pit, whatever you can think of) then the genie can drop that stone bed off the roof on him. If for some reason that doesn't kill him it should at least hold him down as you coup de grace him. Now, does the prison cell that's holding the others have an outside window? While they're sleeping use your genie or a dart gun to hit them with paralytic poison. Then it's time to throw the alchemists fire in. At this point you'll probably want to leave town (you should have already gathered whatever belongings they left in their rooms).

[Fishy]

This is bullying.

Maybe not exactly, but it fits the psychological profile.

The first time was testing boundaries, to see if they could get away with it.

The second time an opportunity came up, and they knew they could do it.

The third time, they're creating an opportunity, and doing it just because they can.

You can ignore them, in which case they will escalate until you snap.

You can fight them by their own rules, in which case you will lose. There are more of them, they've been doing it longer. In the off chance that you win, it will prove nothing.

What you need to do is to go and get an authority figure, (your DM), and get him to bring the hammer down on them. If the DM doesn't want PvP, then he needs to do his booping job and prevent PvP from happening. "This is the new rule. If anyone breaks it, you leave the table for the rest of the session, no questions, we're done with this discussion."

[Kyselina]

Fishy: Hmm... interesting.



Also, a new plan! With the forgery skill, I could take a paper, change myself to look like a messenger, deliver mail to the current leader of the current fort we are in. The paper will have this written on it: "Wanted: Zorxal, Eleanor and Wasari". Could work?

[Tsotha-lanti]

What you need to do is to go and get an authority figure, (your DM), and get him to bring the hammer down on them.

Or, you know, leave the situation, which actually works out a lot better, since going to an authority figure just results in more bullying. It works the same in elementary school, the military, and workplaces - why would it work better in this context?

[Theogon]

The best way for killing a stronger character is using poisons. buy a cheaper poison to make them paralyzed, then CDG party!

[Lorn]

My advice on this...

Non serious advice:

1.
Kill them while they sleep. As in, ensure you're sleeping at an inn. Put Alchemists Fire all over the place. Exit the inn when they're asleep. Ensure the door will remain closed. Set off some of the AF - if you've left the tops off the vials then they'll all catch, and assuming you're playing a generic medieval time period then the building will be wood.

2.
Let them kill you. Then, play as a character with a stupid LA - LA+as much as possible. It'll be stupidly overpowered at such a low level. Destroy them. Hard. Train as much as possible, put a few levels in before they come back at level one and try to take you down.

3.
Pull a Belkar - put "Wanted" signs all over town. All their images should be on them. And it's wanted dead. Not alive. Reward is the money from their corpses. And don't forget to mention the kidnapped gnome they're travelling with who needs rescue...

4.
Wait until they're sleeping.
Leave.
Level up on your own, use Invisibility as often as needed to stay away from them, go in the opposite direction etc.
You should gain XP faster than them.
When you return as a level 18 wizard while they're still level 12 or so, you'll be able to annihiliate them if they try anything; just cast Fly, Greater Invisibility and do whatever.
Could take a while though and would probably require seperate sessions so they don't metagame into following you. Needs DM approval.

5.
Mind****.
You're an illusionist.
Fighters have low will saves.
Fighter thinks that perhaps the Cleric is your character. This will hopefully lead to infighting.

6.
Die. Next character, make up in your background he's a foreigner. And connected to royalty. Kill him, and an entire country will be after them...
This would only really work with DM approval though.



Sensible solutions that're less fun:

1.
Not really as sensible, but: Any of the above. Destroy them in the easiest way you can. Preferably one that does not require being a higher level - the "burn the inn down" tactic perhaps. Start sleeping with rope trick without them, maybe - just grab some scrolls - so they can't kill you.
When they're dead, then say, quite firmly "No more PVP." You said they're all newbies, which leads me to think you might be more experienced. You know the capabilities and limitations of this system...
If they repeat, kill them again. In a different way. Repeat the "No more PVP" bit.
If they don't get the message, point out that they're now coming back at level one, you're a wizard, you're a higher level etc. And point out the ease in which you killed them.

2.
Talk. At the table. Say, basically, "look, this is really annoying. I'm not interested in being in a PVP game."

3.
Leave the group if this continues.


Oh, and also... come on, all of you need to stop overreacting. Fighter shouldn't have killed you for a critical fumble. But you shouldn't have tried to kneecap someone for saying something you didn't like!

[Nohwl]

what spells do you have

[WrathOfLife]

Serious advice on your next character. Make two sheets. One to show everyone, have this be a Bard or a monk, or any other random class your group thinks is crappy. Play it out like "Fine, you don't want me to be strong, so I'll suck!"

But little do they know you have a second sheet, that only the GM see's. Have it be a Barb, working his way towards Frenzied Berzerker....

The two characters are in fact... one and the same. Play a human (because there average and its kinda hard to self hate), and always say your character is fearful and weak and scared. If you face it alone, run away.

Intentionally do less damage, maybe use a crossbow instead of an the axe which you carry "In case I run out of bolts and need to throw something at the enemy to distract them before I run away". Then once you hit FB, have your character do the total shirt ripping "You won't like me when I'm angry" moment. As an FB you'll be too powerful for them to risk trying to kill you, and they'll have to play nice.

[mikeejimbo]

Alternative advice: Play Paranoia. It's the RPG where the players are supposed to be scheming, paranoid backstabbers and everyone gets six lives.

Dangit, I started reading this thread thinking "Ooh I hope no one else has suggested playing Paranoia, then I can and I'll look witty and cool and in the know."

:smallfrown:

Day late, dollar short, I know.

[tribble]

ooh! guys! I just thought of something!

give them one more chance.

if they kill you again...

your next character is Pun-pun.

[aivanther]

After they kill you, come back as the brother of current guy, only, you are now out to kill them. Effectively, become a henchman to the big bad guy of the campaign, or a new secondary villain.

And if you really want to make their life hell, insist the DM give you higher levels and do something along the lines of either a
Thrall Herd- and have huge army of minions armed with poisons, wands, and other nasties
or
Assasin-Sneak up, middle of the night, CDG, or just poison the trail rations

[Kyselina]

2 hours before the session starts.

[Killer Angel]

2 hours before the session starts.

Keep us informed! :smallwink:

[Quietus]

"Unconscious creatures are automatically considered willing" is by far the most unfortunate sentence in the SRD. :smalleek:

They mean "Willing" in the sense of Teleport requiring willing participants, not "Willing" as in "I will happily fail all my saves, my friend!".

[Adumbration]

Heh. If you die again, make a Feral Half-ogre Barbarian.

[Kyselina]

Also, we play in a teahouse. There are no computers or wi-fi. If I die early, I'll have to make my new char there without the help of you :smalleek:



EDIT: NEW IDEA! Many people suggested poisoning... But what about poisoning their tea IRL :smallbiggrin:


EDIT 2!: Leaving, bye! Wish me luck!

[Haven]

Good luck! Hope it goes well with the murdering and all! And that it stays confined to the game, please :p


What, even worse than the one that says that they automatically fail any saving throw? That turns "save or dies", that are already considered by overpowered by some, into "yeah, just die". There doesn't seem to be an exemption for the Fort save on a CDG, either, so it's not just wizards that can bring on the hurt.


They mean "Willing" in the sense of Teleport requiring willing participants, not "Willing" as in "I will happily fail all my saves, my friend!".

Heh, neither of you read that sentence the way I did.
Maybe it's for the best.

[Fixer]

EDIT: NEW IDEA! Many people suggested poisoning... But what about poisoning their tea IRL :smallbiggrin:I do not think anyone present would condone poisoning their tea in real life. That is just purile.

[The Glyphstone]

Yes - poisoning their tea is tacky, overdone, and whatever freelance detective gets hired to track you down will figure it out immediately.

Poisoning their biscuits/cookies/whatever they're eating with their tea, on the other hand, is genius.

[kjones]

2.
Let them kill you. Then, play as a character with a stupid LA - LA+as much as possible. It'll be stupidly overpowered at such a low level. Destroy them. Hard. Train as much as possible, put a few levels in before they come back at level one and try to take you down.


This won't work - a character with a high LA is not necessarily more powerful at low levels. It's very likely that they will be less powerful, for many reasons - they won't have as many HP or caster levels, for example.

[Tallis]

Heh, neither of you read that sentence the way I did.
Maybe it's for the best.

I did :smallwink:

[Kyselina]

Baaaaaack :smallwink:!
So, no killing (of players) was done. The druid and cleric don't want to kill me anymore. The DM had some story advancement. I got a level. The NPC drunk that almost always gone with us is again with us. I got a mage's tower which will be built in a month. So, ordinary. Everyone excluding me (and probably the NPC) is lvl 5.

[Quietus]

Heh, neither of you read that sentence the way I did.
Maybe it's for the best.

Untrue. That joke comes up far more often than is strictly required at my gaming table.


@Kyselina : Glad to hear things are working out a bit better! Congrats on the mage tower, too.

[Mystic Muse]

yay it worked out!

and for future reference here's the best way to get revenge. throw a banana cream pie in their face.it helps you feel better AND it's hilarious!

[Xallace]

yay it worked out!

and for future reference here's the best way to get revenge. throw a banana cream pie in their face.it helps you feel better AND it's hilarious!

I have to concur! I was wondering why counter-killing was the OP's intent, rather than foiling his murderous companions' schemes in wacky, non-lethal, Home Alone-esque ways.

[Zain]

it all worked out yay!!!!!!!!!!!!!

i seconde the pie idea!

[Tallis]

Baaaaaack :smallwink:!
So, no killing (of players) was done. The druid and cleric don't want to kill me anymore. The DM had some story advancement. I got a level. The NPC drunk that almost always gone with us is again with us. I got a mage's tower which will be built in a month. So, ordinary. Everyone excluding me (and probably the NPC) is lvl 5.

Sounds like a much better result. Congratulations!

I have to ask though, what about the fighter?

[Yahzi]

I normally find it immensely frustrating when players fight each other, since they're, you know, supposed to work together no matter how much they distrust or hate each other in character.
I find it amusing. My world is far too dangerous for people to survive in alone. If they turn on each other, they would all die quickly.

See, that's the solution. Make the game world so freaking dangerous that the players have to cooperate just to survive.

[Dagren]

Heh, neither of you read that sentence the way I did.
Maybe it's for the best.:confused:

...

:eek:

[Kyselina]

Sounds like a much better result. Congratulations!

I have to ask though, what about the fighter?

I'm not sure. But would only HE attack me, I know how to handle him.

[warmachine]

So, what happened? The others simply decided to stop being immature jerks? The DM laid down the law? You're blackmailing them in-game?

[Flickerdart]

He's blackmailing them out of game?

[aivanther]

He showed him his premade character sheet for his next character (http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/Pun-Pun_(DnD_Optimized_Character_Build)) :smalltongue:

[Tsotha-lanti]

He showed him his premade character sheet for his next character (http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/Pun-Pun_(DnD_Optimized_Character_Build)) :smalltongue:

I swear that's always as funny. In fact, I think it gets even funnier after the 185,953th time someone refers to it and thinks a reference constitutes a joke.

[Flickerdart]

He showed him his premade character sheet for his next character (http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/Pun-Pun_(DnD_Optimized_Character_Build)) :smalltongue:
That's outdated. Pun-Pun is a level 1 Kobold Paladin now.

[Haven]

Glad it turned out so well! What changed--did they prove more reasonable than expected? Hooray for having a tower, at least, that should make things easier if they Face Heel Turn.


:confused:

...

:eek:

:davidtennant: I'm sorry. I'm so sorry. That should really be a smiley.

[Elixia]

so glad that turned out alright in the end!

[tribble]

If they do kill you, remember my pun-pun idea.

[Kyselina]

So, another session today . We'll see whether they want to kill me or not. Also, the druid got a +4 bow. We got (excluding the fighter, he was elsewhere :smallwink:) stuff from the king for helping him to access his city from the underground tunnel to the tunnel, which we protected (it could be opened only from the inside).

[Eurantien]

Hope it works out OK. My only question - why did your DM tolerate this? I'd just have told them to stop being stupid and ignored it when they tried to attack you. We've got a player in our group of - mostly neutral- players who's chaotic evil and I have to tell him at least once a session "no you can't stab that man in the face now he's paid you", "no, you can't slit your companions throats while they sleep because if you do the trancing elf will set you on fire", "Look, try random violence one more time and we'll kill YOU for XP".

[Kyselina]

Yeah, crisis's over. Although poor druid today. We wanted to build a balloon when he wanted to walk (the other players were wanted for murder of 2 Mortret clerics, my bard too but he was dead so I'm not wanted). The balloon was my idea. So, druid shaped wood to a canoe (...), I, a cleric, a druid and an NPC (which fed me cakes) made the canvas. My genie produced hot air, and we got it for a ride. At the end, we reached a mountain but we crashed (durr), so the canoe is ****ed up (we can make a new one anyway), the canvas has a hole in it and there were some magic slimes attacking us.

[Eurantien]

Sounds like fun. Certainly an eventful campaign. Are you playing evil? Cos there seems to be an AWFUL lot of murder going on :smalltongue:

[Kyselina]

Sounds like fun. Certainly an eventful campaign. Are you playing evil? Cos there seems to be an AWFUL lot of murder going on :smalltongue:

Well, that Mortet thing was the evil cleric's fault! They asked our cleric "Who do your worship?" and our cleric answered "Pelor.", so they attacked. The fighter scored 2 critical hits with a greataxe on 2 of them, hit the third too for alot. Knocked them all out in one round. The one who didn't get critted survived, and this is what happened. So we met a paladin and some clerics (3?) previous session and killed them.

[Eurantien]

Ah ok, hunted by the bad guys. What sort of campaign is it? (I'm just nosy :smallbiggrin:)

[HP McLuvin]

Hang on; what level are your characters at?

[Kyselina]

Hang on; what level are your characters at?

I'm at 4, everyone else is 6 (I think).

[Keshay]

So I read this thread and was mezmerized. I have a couple questions though.
I'll go ahead and assume that most of these differences are as a result of the mixing of 3.0 and 3.5 rules, but for some reason it seems unlikely.

1) What is your second prohibited school? I see only Abjuration. You're supposed to have 2 schools off limits (unless that was houseruled out)

2) How exactly did you have a genie as a familiar at level 3? Does 3.0 Imp Familiar grant +2 levels, because it does not in 3.5.

3) A wizard's tower at lvl 5. Wow. A +4 bow for the Druid before level 15? Double wow. Looks like a classic Monty Haul campaign here.

4) your stats would require a 53 point-buy. How exactly did you generate those stats? Roll 5 and drop the 2 lowest?

and most importantly: The Fighter is not your friend. Regardless of how you think of him, he does not perceive you as a friend. He may be friends with your other buddies, but he does not like you. Someone needs to tell you that.

Glad the situation seems to have passed. Have fun playing your first campaign. They will grow more complex and nuianced over the years, and you'll look back on this as a funny anecdote about how you got killed a couple times before settling down.

[HP McLuvin]

I'm at 4, everyone else is 6 (I think)....and you picked up a +4 bow?

Edit: my point ninja'd - and expanded upon - by Keshay.

[Kyselina]

I already explained that we saved a whole dwarven fortress and the king granted us these things.
What is wrong with the stats? Rolled 4 and dropped the lowest one.
Two schools? I thought there was only one school in 3.0e, but I can't check the rules since they took it down on the page where I gone to.
The DM gave me rather interesting familiars to choose from to spice the game up a bit.

[HP McLuvin]

Sounds like your DM was a little too generous...a +4 bow at level 5-6 is simply too powerful to hand out as party treasure, even if you did save the Dwarven kingdom. It has less to do with thankful dwarves and more to do with level-appropriate treasure.

[Eurantien]

It's one school in 3.0, I'd swear. Don't have the book to hand, but apart from anything else, that's what NWN uses, and it's RELATIVELY true to the original source.

[Keshay]

What is wrong with the stats? Rolled 4 and dropped the lowest one.
Two schools? I thought there was only one school in 3.0e, but I can't check the rules since they took it down on the page where I gone to.
The DM gave me rather interesting familiars to choose from to spice the game up a bit.

The stat array is something like 18, 18, 15, 14, 12, 11 (unsure what the 3.0 stat mods for Gnomes are) That's still pretty good for (4-1)d6, though not outside the realm of possibility. Point being, it would require a 53 point buy, where 32 is commonly used for high-powered campaigns.

Apparently 3.0 is only one forbidden school, which is much nicer than 2.

The Familiar allowance is a nice thing for your DM to do. So long as you don't satr getting wishes when the Djinn gets to a certain level. If its some sort of lesser genie that has limited casting/combat abilities, thats cool.

[Eurantien]

I've rolled higher stats than that. They're not that unbalancing. +4 bow seems a bit odd, but meh, it's your campaign, and it's up to your DM.

[HP McLuvin]

Tru 'nuff; I suppose it is the DM's call...the important thing is that you all seem to be past the player-killing and are all having fun.

[Dagren]

It's one school in 3.0, I'd swear. Don't have the book to hand, but apart from anything else, that's what NWN uses, and it's RELATIVELY true to the original source.3.0 was weird with forbidden schools. It was 1-3, depending on which ones you chose. Much simpler in 3.5, in which divination is the only exception.

[kjones]

So I read this thread and was mezmerized. I have a couple questions though.
I'll go ahead and assume that most of these differences are as a result of the mixing of 3.0 and 3.5 rules, but for some reason it seems unlikely.

1) What is your second prohibited school? I see only Abjuration. You're supposed to have 2 schools off limits (unless that was houseruled out)

2) How exactly did you have a genie as a familiar at level 3? Does 3.0 Imp Familiar grant +2 levels, because it does not in 3.5.

3) A wizard's tower at lvl 5. Wow. A +4 bow for the Druid before level 15? Double wow. Looks like a classic Monty Haul campaign here.

4) your stats would require a 53 point-buy. How exactly did you generate those stats? Roll 5 and drop the 2 lowest?

and most importantly: The Fighter is not your friend. Regardless of how you think of him, he does not perceive you as a friend. He may be friends with your other buddies, but he does not like you. Someone needs to tell you that.

Glad the situation seems to have passed. Have fun playing your first campaign. They will grow more complex and nuianced over the years, and you'll look back on this as a funny anecdote about how you got killed a couple times before settling down.

I'm glad I'm not the only one who notice these things. Not that big a deal, though - I played the same way when I was 12.

[Eurantien]

Original post by kjones
I'm glad I'm not the only one who notice these things.

Have to say, some of them struck me as odd. Only one I didn't raise an eyebrow at was the forbidden schools, but I assumed (correctly it seems) that it was the DM being nice.

[Quietus]

I'm glad I'm not the only one who notice these things. Not that big a deal, though - I played the same way when I was 12.

To be fair, a keep/mage's tower is as much a plot point as a bit of wealth..