OOTS #663 - The Discussion Thread

[The Giant]

New comic is up.

[shadowxknight]

Good to see that O-Chul is fine and dandy.

I thought something happened to him from having Xykon's hand down his throat.

[anamiac]

Wait, I'm confused... Where are they again?

[Snake-Aes]

Such unlikely coincidence! :p of course of course. I want to see his debrief =(

I wonder if Elan watched Premonition.

[Mr Jones]

I guess that answers whether O-Chul is wearing pants

[H. Zee]

Hurray!
O-Chul is okay!

And Elan's Genre Savviness skills have failed him for once.

[kpenguin]

Wait, I'm confused... Where are they again?

The abandoned elven outpost island V teleported the fleet to earlier.

[Ratzinkaiser]

Oh wow, soon as I turn the computer on I see a Stick update, and quite a recent one too, it seems.
Poor Elan, his bardic knowledge seems to have been incorrect in this situation. I suppose that's for the best, though. Good to see O-Chul reunited with his people, and rather nice of him not to bad-mouth the deceased.
I do, however, wonder how Durkon's faring with Roy's resurrection off screen, and how long V's actually been away for.

[lord_khaine]

Nice comic, and nice aiming from the monsters side.

also, i like the way O'chuul dance around the subject of the gate explosion without lying, or revealing what actualy happend.

[hanglekuk]

Any comments about teleport location. The spot is safe. But how would a MITD know this spot? Or thats what wish would do?

[Sovjohn]

Hahaha...

Elan's comment: Priceless! :smallbiggrin:

[Zukhramm]

It is nice to see them all back together again.

[petersohn]

Veeery good comic. I like how diplomatic O-Chul is. And the 2nd and 3rd last panels are just great.

[paddyfool]

Finally, something that really went well both for the Azurites and for the Order (touch wood). May O'Chul settle down in well-earned peace and cease his DMPC ways, as he watches his people grow prosperous once more!

EDIT:


Any comments about teleport location. The spot is safe. But how would a MITD know this spot? Or thats what wish would do?

I'm increasingly viewing this as evidence for the MitD being some form of Godling that merely looks like a large and scary beast, with the reality revision ability. Frightening, given how naive he is.

[Gez]

Panel 5, typo in "destroy"

Nice to see the Order reunited and O-Chul getting a happy end, Elan's gloomy trope-based predictions aside.

[Arraxis]

Hehe, yeah, wouldn't want O-Chul invoking retirony... but that is quite an impressive coincidence that they've all met up. Wait... Durkon wasn't there, so does that mean he's still resurrecting Roy? Looking forward to the next one!

[Aethir]

It's gonna be interesting seeing how long it'll take the group to start questioning V more intensely now that they're reunited.

Great strip as always Giant!

[Starscream]

This strip contains more Lampshades Hung per frame than any I've ever seen!

And it looks like everyone is back together at last! If we can get Roy back without a hitch, my dreams will have finally come true, and I can retire tomorrow happ-*BLAM!*

[ImmortalAer]

...That comic was officially Elanfied.

[Kobold-Bard]

Awww, I thought we'd finally got rid of the Azurites. One's ok, but the whole lot all over again.

Ahh, I've missed Elan's particular brand of crazy :smallbiggrin:

Idiotic moaning aside, thank you Giant for the recent wave of updates.

[Hacktor]

Nice :) masterfully done giant :D

[Eric O'Really]

woo, new oots in the morning, nice.

hehe, seems like elan is not allways right with dramatic scenes. o-chul should also never try to wear a red shirt and go on a away mission with the main cast ^^.

[Wandiya]

Giant your a comic-making machine, a awesome plot writer, a cool order of the scribble-er oh and you have your own website:smallbiggrin: awesome comic keep up the good work:smallwink:

[Salt_Crow]

Such degree of accuracy! It just reinforces my theory of MitD as an outsider capable of using Wish as spell-like ability XD

[Snake-Aes]

Any comments about teleport location. The spot is safe. But how would a MITD know this spot? Or thats what wish would do?

Yes, a wish would do that.

[LightningNinja]

O-Chul is going to have some choice words for Belkar in a few rounds. He was surprisingly civil to Haley, all things considered.

[KIDS]

Yeee-haaaaaw!!! What a fortunate coincidence :)

...coincidence... heh. *snicker*

[Tempest Fennac]

Regaring V, everyone may have assumed that s/he was somehow responsible for the teleport due to not knowing about the Soul Splice being responsible for V's new spells or apperance change, so they wouldn't worry about him/her due to O-Chul explaining why s/he wasn't moving.

[RMS Oceanic]

Interesting that he opted to keep Miko's involvement in the Gate destruction, and Soon's failed intervention, out of his report. And also, he's gonna investigate how they escaped. Will this lead him to discover some inportant information?

Anywho, I suspect we won't see Team Evil for a while now, except if they're part of the wrap up page that Rich usually has at the end of most books.

[mescaLEO]

Oh, yeah! :smallbiggrin:+
Today's my 30th birthday :cool: , and the Giant granted me what i desired so much as present: a new comic!!!

[nimby]

Panel 5, typo in "destroy"


Panel 9 as well, though instead of through.

*Edit*
We must have been hallucinating, there are no typos there! :smallwink:

[Snake-Aes]

O-Chul is going to have some choice words for Belkar in a few rounds. He was surprisingly civil to Haley, all things considered.

O-Chul doesn't seem to be the kind of guy with resentments, but yes, he'd let Hinjo know that.

[Atcote]

Yay! I knew they'd end up together again - it's taken too long to bring them all back into the same place to completely throw that away.

[Monan]

I made page 2!!!!!

It'll be interesting to see what plans the OOTS make next with all the info coming together as groups merge.

[Calmness]

It's nice to see the Paladins back together. And we'll probably get to see the Order reunited very soon, as well. :smallsmile:

Thanks, Giant.

[Pandabear]

And thus the troupe is (almost) complete again.. :smallsmile:

[slb]

Reunited at last ! :smallbiggrin:

And the MitD not knowing this location, this looks really like a wish spell-like ability that was used.

[dogmac]

Wow, they are all back together! Huzzah!!

With O-Chul, who is NOT TO BE LEFT BEHIND!!!

Because, and I am not the only one who feels this way...

I LOOOOOOOVE him!!

[Pandabear]

Oh, yeah! :smallbiggrin:+
Today's my 30th birthday :cool: , and the Giant granted me what i desired so much as present: a new comic!!!

I'd congratulate you, but luckily I saw the age was 30 in time :smallbiggrin:

[Coldwind]

I think next strip will be the end of this arc, with Roy as alive as other party members, with team paladin supporting OotS for the final challenge a.k.a beginning of the end.

Cool!

[Roc Ness]

Yay!!! New Comic!!! :smallbiggrin:

[Finn Solomon]

Getting O-Chul back alive safe, sane and sound is a tremendous boost for team good. The man is an absolute beast and will be of great help to the Order, I feel.

[Freefall]

Hurrah! The fellowship is close to reforming!

[Zanaril]

Aww, poor V is still being ignored.

[banjo1985]

Ah poor Elan, still clinging to his fiction and TV cliche's...it doesn't work every time buddy, not every time. :elan:

[Mawhrin Skel]

I wonder if the Azurites "most learned scribe" will understand V's use of the soul splices - and that V sold hir soul.

[Gez]

O-Chul is going to have some choice words for Belkar in a few rounds. He was surprisingly civil to Haley, all things considered.
Well, it led to him working to free a powerful creature from Xykon's evil influence. In the broader view of things, it was for the better -- and O-Chul is wise enough and selfless enough to see it that way.


Anywho, I suspect we won't see Team Evil for a while now, except if they're part of the wrap up page that Rich usually has at the end of most books.

I predict Roy resurrection next strip, a briefing with the entire reunited order and some important Azurite in #665, and #666 as a brief return to Team Evil.

[Teddy]

All back together again! YAY!!!:smallbiggrin:

And I love Elans fear of tropes regarding good guys death, even though he's allready been proven wrong once in Azure City.

[Fungusamnguss]

/sniff /sniff .... anyone smell that? smells like ... like .... like the end of another book fast approaching. i cant wait to see how this turns out.

[grautry]

And the tension is over!

While I loved the previous arc, it was just too tense after a while.

Now we can all breathe a sigh of relief. :smallbiggrin:

Or not, perhaps Elan's prediction will come true?

[ironballs]

There must be some major climax planned for Strip 666 - my guess it'll be either Roy resurrection strip, or something major reviled about MitD - or more likely a joke related to MitD and the number 666.

plus I don't think MitD was the one how transported V & O - he wouldn't know the location of the Azura fleet. I think it's more likely the 3 demons did it - to protect their investment - although it is unlikely that they would have saved O-chul as well.

[Georlik]

Good strip. But I've already lost myself in this plot. Where is everybody?
Have to read it again from the 1st strip.

[plipsig]

Any comments about teleport location. The spot is safe. But how would a MITD know this spot? Or thats what wish would do?

Maybe it's not a matter of place, but of person. Consider: MitD seems very childlike. To make his friend O-Chul safest, he would probably think to send him to the person who is the closest thing to a parent figure to O-Chul, i.e. the ruler of the Azurites, and his Lord. O-Chul landed closest to Hinjo, right on top of him actually, not the members of the Order. Just an idea.

[Freefall]

I'm pretty sure the Azurite's scribe will soon be looking up the MitD as well as interesting information on destroying phylacteries.

[xanaphia]

Epic.

Now what would be funny would be if O-Chul now does die for some stupid, random reason.

[Freefall]

I think it's more likely the 3 demons did it - to protect their investment - although it is unlikely that they would have saved O-chul as well.

Didn't the demons say they couldn't intervene in strip 656, that only imps could?

[RMS Oceanic]

Good strip. But I've already lost myself in this plot. Where is everybody?
Have to read it again from the 1st strip.

The Order (Mind, Body and Soul, if not all reunited) - Azure Island
The Sapphire Guard - Azure Island
Celia - Azure Island
Team Evil - Azure City
The Souls formerly known as Spliced - wandering the material realm/possibly recaptured
The IFCC - On their couch
Qarr - Floating over the IFCC's couch
Eugene Greenhilt - Outside Celestia
Julia Greenhilt - Cliffport
The Linear Guild - Currently unknown, possibly en route to Girard's gate.

Does that help? :smalltongue:

[fractal]

Well, I'd say this is yet another case of O-Chul being awesome. He avoids laying needless blame upon Miko, and does his best to give credit to Vaarsuvius and the MitD. Note that although he is just another paladin, his addition makes an attack by an ancient black dragon much more hazardous - this sort of possibility is why she was cautious and waited to catch Vaarsuvius alone.

Meanwhile, it's amusing to watch Lien and Haley's different reactions to Elan. Lien's patience is exhausted, while Haley instead sees the humor in the situation. O-Chul, on the other hand, is just bewildered.

Oh, for those saying that O-Chul may have choice words for Belkar... what about when he sees his true nemesis here on the island... Mr. Scruffy!?!

[Ridureyu]

This is the happiest comic I've seen in a long time.


And look at how noble O-Chul is. Wow.

[mescaLEO]

By the way...

I wonder if MITD will recognize Redcloak now, or if he'll think it's Right Eye...

[J.Gellert]

:D I'm very glad Elan didn't get it right this time!

[Ghastly Epigram]

The title makes this a very sad (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0360.html) comic. :smallfrown:

[Taekwondodo]

Gosh is everyone still asleep?

Everyones back together again, yay!

[Freefall]

V, you're alive! And less scary!

This line is full of WIN!

[TSED]

The title makes this a very sad (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0360.html) comic. :smallfrown:

Man, why'd you have to remind us all? ):

[fractal]

Incidentally, Hinjo's Charisma must be through the roof. O-Chul must have been almost dead (he was only brought back by a few potions, and then absorbed another Meteor Swarm). We know he's got at least 10 hp/level. Furthermore, Hinjo's almost certainly a lower level than O-Chul is now (probably 14-15, like the OotS, compared to O-Chul's 16-18). So given that Hinjo appeared to heal him fully with a single Laying of Hands, does that give Hinjo like a 30 Charisma? Wow! I guess it's good to be the king.

[snafu]

I wonder if the Azurites "most learned scribe" will understand V's use of the soul splices - and that V sold hir soul.

I would have said no... but Redcloak recognised what was going on pretty quickly. Mind you, he actually got a good look at the attached souls, which is what clued him in: there might be any number of other ways in which a wizard might temporarily go all dark and evil-y.

Recognising what V did might have to wait until Roy gets raised - if those raised from the dead remember their experiences while dead, he'll be asking who the hell those 'subcontractors' were.

And aside: Belkar is dead. For O-Chul to kill him at the first opportunity would be a perfectly legitimate act. He'd better hope like hell that O-Chul's feeling more Good than Lawful at the moment, because Lawful says that Belkar gets hanged, drawn and quartered.

[Jimorian]

Rich, you forgot a word at the end of the title. :smallwink:

[fractal]

And aside: Belkar is dead. For O-Chul to kill him at the first opportunity would be a perfectly legitimate act. He'd better hope like hell that O-Chul's feeling more Good than Lawful at the moment, because Lawful says that Belkar gets hanged, drawn and quartered.
I bet that Belkar expects something massive, but O-Chul does nothing. After all, Belkar's action was only neutral, not evil - he really did think that one of them was going to get eaten regardless. O-Chul has put up with far worse things than someone else choosing their own survival over his.

[i6uuaq]

And the OotS are reunited again!!

and also, it seems that whatever spell the MitD used allows the targets to pick their destination?

and it seems as if O-Chul is gonna try to figure out what the MitD is... "most learned cleric" indeed.

[Mawhrin Skel]

I would have said no... but Redcloak recognised what was going on pretty quickly. Mind you, he actually got a good look at the attached souls, which is what clued him in

It's possible O-Chul overheard Redcloak telling first Xykon and then Tsukiko that V was using a soul splice.

[Raging Gene Ray]

I'm looking forward to seeing their most learned scribe and their reaction to O-Chul's story. Yes...something that will probably happen off-panel has me more interested than the main cast being reunited.

[infiniteviking]

Well, well, well.... so one of first things O'Chul does once freed is to start investigating the MitD. That's pretty heartwarming. And the other is to take responsibility for Miko's actions -- it'll be too bad if that comes back to bite him.

I'm surprised nobody's trying to un-paralyze V (or does it just have to wear off on its own?), but exposition will make its own way.

And heh, Elan. *grin*

[Military Man]

I'm looking forward to seeing their most learned scribe and their reaction to O-Chul's story. Yes...something that will probably happen off-panel has me more interested than the main cast being reunited.

That would be interesting to see.

"That would be a highly unlikely coini-" *Pop*
Not to mention Elan in the last couple panels

Priceless :smallamused:

[Delgarde]

Interesting that he opted to keep Miko's involvement in the Gate destruction, and Soon's failed intervention, out of his report.

Does he even know differently? Prior to being paralysed by Xykon, the last thing he did in that scene was precisely what he said - made the decision to destroy the gate, and swung his sword at it. If he was not aware of his surroundings while paralysed, he may indeed believe that he succeeded.

[LuisDantas]

Wow. It is good to see Hinjo again. And reunited with O-Chul to boot. :)

I don't think O-Chul has any axe to grind with Belkar. Yet. Rude as the psycho halfling was when he threw O-Chul back to the MitD, he DID have sound reasons and it WAS the logical thing to do.

How the Paladin will deal with the antics of the Pretender from now on, however, is something else entirely... :smalltongue:

I don't think O-Chul was even trying to hide Soon's involvement in the confrontation with Xykon and the Gate's destruction, however; from Hinjo's words at the Azure City war I got the sense that he knows full well that Soon was protecting the throne room anyway.

Miko, however, is something else entirely. O-Chul's protectiveness of her memory is unexpected and frustrating, but in-character. O-Chul IS a true Paladin, after all.

(From Delgarde):

Does he even know differently? Prior to being paralysed by Xykon, the last thing he did in that scene was precisely what he said - made the decision to destroy the gate, and swung his sword at it. If he was not aware of his surroundings while paralysed, he may indeed believe that he succeeded.

We must assume that he knows about Miko at the very least. Otherwise his whisper about not speaking ill of the dead, naive as it is, lacks any reason for being whatsoever.

Can't wait to see how the plot develops from here.

Oh, one last thing - it seems that Haley and Elan aren't shaken from the conversation about Therkla. Nice to see.

[Green-Shirt Q]

I know that lampshading it is supposed to make everything okay, but I guess, despite the lampshade hang, the fact that O-chul and V are teleported directly to their teammates (presumably by the MitD, who I'm guessing probably wouldn't know where they were) and Hinjo and Lien show up somehow is still a "Wallbanger" as they might say at TvTropes. For me, I think this might be a little too much "convenience" in a plot for me to handle. :smallsigh:

Still, I look forward to seeing what will happen now that everybody's together again and the villains will stop dickin' around. :smallsmile:

[Devonix]

I would have said no... but Redcloak recognised what was going on pretty quickly. Mind you, he actually got a good look at the attached souls, which is what clued him in: there might be any number of other ways in which a wizard might temporarily go all dark and evil-y.

Recognising what V did might have to wait until Roy gets raised - if those raised from the dead remember their experiences while dead, he'll be asking who the hell those 'subcontractors' were.

And aside: Belkar is dead. For O-Chul to kill him at the first opportunity would be a perfectly legitimate act. He'd better hope like hell that O-Chul's feeling more Good than Lawful at the moment, because Lawful says that Belkar gets hanged, drawn and quartered.


Ten points says that he's not asking the scribe about V and instead giving information about MiTD in hopes of finding out what it is.

[Raging Gene Ray]

Does he even know differently? Prior to being paralysed by Xykon, the last thing he did in that scene was precisely what he said - made the decision to destroy the gate, and swung his sword at it.

His aside comment about "not mentioning more, lest he speak ill of the dead," indicates he was aware of his surroundings.

[RMS Oceanic]

Does he even know differently? Prior to being paralysed by Xykon, the last thing he did in that scene was precisely what he said - made the decision to destroy the gate, and swung his sword at it. If he was not aware of his surroundings while paralysed, he may indeed believe that he succeeded.

I think it's been established that Paralysis doesn't turn off your eyes and ears. How else did O-Chul know about the phylactery in the first place? It's because Soon mentioned it. Also, why else would he mention respect for the dead? He knows who struck the blow.

[lothos]

Wow, so great to have so many updates in such short order. I'm glad we know where V and O-Chul have ended up.

We have had some amazing jaw-dropping strips recently. For me, this wasn't one of them, but it still made me smile and I'm very grateful for Rich working so hard on this. I'm sure we are leading up to something awesome for Roy being resurrected very soon. 666 ? I personally don't think so, but who knows ?

I'm so looking forward to the compilation book of this, with hopefully scenes of the rescue of the bone golem and if we are really lucky, scenes of the goblins and unread searching the sewers of Azure city :-)

[Delgarde]

We must assume that he knows about Miko at the very least. Otherwise his whisper about not speaking ill of the dead, naive as it is, lacks any reason for being whatsoever.

Not necessarily - it didn't even occur to me that he was talking about Miko. My assumption was he meant his fellow paladins, who slaughtered each other under the influence of Xykon's symbol of insanity...

[Raging Gene Ray]

Not necessarily - it didn't even occur to me that he was talking about Miko. My assumption was he meant his fellow paladins, who slaughtered each other under the influence of Xykon's symbol of insanity...

....I didn't even consider that. Nice catch. Maybe it will be clarified later when he recounts his story to the scribe.

[Delgarde]

I think it's been established that Paralysis doesn't turn off your eyes and ears. How else did O-Chul know about the phylactery in the first place? It's because Soon mentioned it..

Possibly. But equally, he's been keeping company with Xykon and Redcloak for several months now, which provides any number of opportunities to put two and two together...

[RMS Oceanic]

Not necessarily - it didn't even occur to me that he was talking about Miko. My assumption was he meant his fellow paladins, who slaughtered each other under the influence of Xykon's symbol of insanity...

D&D paralysis still allows the victim to take mental actions. If they can take mental actions, they are still aware of their immediate environment.

And a bonus comic in Dungeon Crawlin Fools also suggests that the eyes and ears keep working.

And how could he possible know it was his blade that did the deed if he wasn't aware?

[xyzzy]

Wow. Once again, O-Chul demonstrates what being a paladin should be. :smallsmile:

[Delgarde]

....I didn't even consider that. Nice catch. Maybe it will be clarified later when he recounts his story to the scribe.

Could be either interpretation, certainly. But it's the first thing that came to mind when asking myself why O-Chul would be outright-lying to Hinjo - something very much out of character.

[Delgarde]

Actually, I've just realised that O-Chul was telling the exact truth. He *did* make the decision to destroy the gate. And it *was* his blade that did the deed - but it was in Miko's hand at the time...

Apparently O-Chul is a lawyer in his spare time - he's evaded the question without technically lying to his lord.

[Mojique]

Elan as we like him :smallbiggrin:

[Megido]

http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0544.html


:redcloak:Your crazy friend gave it a jumpstart when she shattered Soon's gate.

I'd say he knows who did it

[LuisDantas]

Not necessarily - it didn't even occur to me that he was talking about Miko. My assumption was he meant his fellow paladins, who slaughtered each other under the influence of Xykon's symbol of insanity...

Uh? Why would he even want to hide that?

Besides being no fault of theirs, it is an important fact of intelligence that he must, on the contrary, report in clear terms to Hinjo.

Of course he is talking about Miko.

[teratorn]

:smallfrown: I miss Miko :smallfrown:

[valce]

Good that they got back. Makes it even less likely that their escape was some sort of teleport spell, since the number of people who know where the fleet is and could have cast teleport is very small. Much more likely to be a wish-type ability.

Also, given Belkar's personality change, he might just apologize 'sincerely' to O-Chul and all will be forgiven :P

[shadzar]

Didn't the chief of the CPPD already mention he was getting too old for this? :smallconfused:

[triple zero]

Oh Elan...I've missed you. And it's only been...ummmm...thirteen strips? OK OotS, let's never do this separation thing again, eh?

[Ethereal_fire]

At the risk of no one getting this (please let there be another NCIS fan out there). Elan's statement in this comic brought to mind Kate. One of the most suddenly shocking deaths of any I've ever seen on TV, and "caused" by a statement of that very kind.

[Kogan Urufu]

Woot! The Good Guys are back together again, go team Oots!

Ahem...*coughs* moving on...not sure if it's been resolved yet, by MitD's Wish was most likely worded

"I Wish Mr. Stiffly and his Elven friend were back safe with thier friends."

Also, O'chul doesn't blame Miko for shattering the gate when Soon was about to win because it would disrespectful to the memory of Miko, a psychotic schitzophrenic zealot, but that's not really her fault, exsisting mental instability + rigorous religious indoctrination.

And O'chul has ungodly levels of power, he is immune to the power of plot!

[Tova]

As amazing as the recent storyline has been, it was almost a relief to get a comic with a bit of ... well... comic respite.

[Dr. Cthulwho]

Wooo, while parting is sweet sorrow, reunions are opportunities for humor and lots of questions.

And don't worry Elan, genre savvy can't be right 100% of the time, especially when it involves someone like O-Chul.

And so it seems the MitD ability is more aware then it is (sending O-Chul and V exactly where they need to be) or it was some other sort of power that pulled the emergency evac.

And do I sense a possible confrontation between O-Chul and Belkar? Or will O-Chul take the higher road and say something like "While your actions were fitting for a villain they proved fortuitous in the long term. So this time you are forgiven."


:smallfrown: I miss Miko :smallfrown:

So do I sometimes. So do I.

[motub]

Not necessarily - it didn't even occur to me that he was talking about Miko. My assumption was he meant his fellow paladins, who slaughtered each other under the influence of Xykon's symbol of insanity...
The whole idea is that O-Chul said, "I made the decision" (which we know he had, because he was paralyzed in the last second before destroying the Gate), and that "my blade struck the blow" (which it did), but not that it was his hand that wielded that blade, because it wasn't-- Miko took his sword out of his paralyzed grasp and used it to destroy the Gate.

Because this was an action that we regret for many reasons (for Hinjo, he's naturally sorry that the city was destroyed, but he was not present in the room, so he does not know, as O-Chul does, that the action prevented the destruction of Xykon, which had been imininent until Miko came along and pooched the whole thing), it would be distracting and unnecessarily rude to say, "but Miko actually destroyed the Gate".

I'm sure it will come out in the debrief, though I don't see why anything about V would. V is not a paladin, and is only peripheral to the intelligence that O-Chul has to deliver. Although, if the Order is allowed to "sit in", I'm sure they'll pick up on that sidebar with V privately--- but on the other hand, Roy himself will be able to tell them (or take V aside and have a "talk" with hir) in a minute anyway, since he knows about the splices from having seen and talked to them.

I don't so much need to see the debrief as the strategy session after the debrief. But I wouldn't expect either until the start of the next book, since it's too good a way to summarize events for new readers to let pass.

This was nice. Although I am saddened (now that I have been reminded) by the reference to the Chief (who did actually die according to Elan's "script", so it's not like he was so wrong). Seems to me that this pretty much confirms a Wish by someone, and the most likely suspect is of course the MitD, but there's a slim outside chance that someone else had such an ablility.

Great to see Lien, I must say, and glad that she seems to really like O-Chul (her face just lit up!).

It was also fun to realize that a lot of people involved in this situation are missing different, but vital, bits of information about the situation and how it has developed.

Hinjo doesn't know how the Gate was actually destroyed, who did it, or indeed how the fight had gone. Lien doesn't know how they got where they are (since she wasn't any place near V when V teleported the Fleet; she may not even know that V came and went, since the Kaito ship seems to be their "house", so no one else was on it at the time). I didn't know that V had teleported the party to the same area of abandoned Elven woods/fort/whatever it is as shi had teleported the Azurites to.

Nobody (other than Belkar) knows that Belkar has triggered and overcome his MoJ (although Roy may be able to see it, since he has the emergency trigger word). O-Chul may or may not know that that makes Belkar essentially a fugitive from justice without his "collar" on (which is the only reason I can see that O-Chul might legitimately kill him; it was really only a pragmatic decision on Belkar's part to "throw him back", and indeed it worked out in everyone's favor, so why people consider it a killing offence I have no idea). But since the fact of Belkar's parole was meant to be a secret (remember that Eugene was posing as Belkar to fool the guards), and then events intervened, Belkar's escape could well be considered "legitimate" (in the sense of non-violent; if the prison was destroyed and the prisoners leave to avoid being killed in the disaster, who could blame them?). It's not like he's hiding out; Hinjo-- who is after all, the ultimate authority on both the legal issue and the paladin code issue-- knows where he is (or will soon, as in next strip), and if Hinjo doesn't kill Belkar out of hand, then O-Chul certainly will abide by that decision-- O-Chul is, as we hopefully well know by now, not Miko.

A little joke that I just caught--- who remembers the name of the movie that line, "I'm getting too old for this ****" is featured in? Which character was the star of this strip? If you say that the latter is the former (as we have indeed been saying for several comics now), it's not only a nice homage, but a nice joke (and makes more sense than Love, as featured in that movie's end title song, which I try to forget :smallsmile:)

[kierthos]

So, let's see. O-Chul has survived months of torture, almost being fed to an acid-breathing sharks, multiple spells thrown at him by a Lich, AND said Lich shoving his bony hand down O-Chul's throat to set off another Meteor Swarm.

He is the Chuck Norris of the OotS-verse.

[theinsulabot]

proof that lean doesnt know o-chul. that lay on hands from hinjo took him to full or near full health. so even if the trope kicks in and like 8 or 9 goblin ninjas pop out of no where and sneak attack him, it will still end up something like this

http://pw0nd.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/06/hp-500x376.jpg

[Fri]

I like plot heavy or dramatic parts, but this is my favourite strip on the 'attacking xykon' chapter. I even laughed for real.

[mec]

I hope Blackwing made it out okay, too!

[Conuly]

Nobody (other than Belkar) knows that Belkar has triggered and overcome his MoJ (although Roy may be able to see it, since he has the emergency trigger word).

Haley and Celia know. The cleric told them in Greysky.


And don't worry Elan, genre savvy can't be right 100% of the time, especially when it involves someone like O-Chul.

Indeed. O-Chul is safe from everything (let's hope) by the sheer fact of being O-CHUL.

[theinsulabot]

I hope Blackwing made it out okay, too!

he is with V. as he always has been?

[Samuraiko]

Re: the whole discussion about how much O-Chul will or will not tell Hinjo about Miko's involvement, and speaking ill of the dead...

He's not just being diplomatic to his liege lord. IIRC, he and the MitD were having a conversation about being in a 'club' that allowed girls, and that it worked out rather well... "with one unfortunate exception."

(And props to the poster who earlier mentioned that O-Chul is being completely honest in saying it was his blade that destroyed the gate... but Miko was in fact holding it.)

Not quite up on the paladin rules of 'honourable behaviour', but damn, O-Chul gets full points for samurai honour there.

And yay! Elan's back! You just KNOW he's going to be ECSTATIC when he hears about all of this... his potential now for providing dramatic music (DUN DUN DUNNNNN!) has never been needed more.

Kudos, Rich! If I had to wake up at 5:30am for no discernable reason, finding today's strip here was just about worth it. *hugs*

Michelle
aka
Samuraiko

[choie]

Fun strip! I'm glad to see everyone back together and, y'know, alive. Elan's genre awareness and sincerity are, as always, a delight.

But I'm gonna be controversial here and say, man, I dunno, O-Chul is getting perilously close to Mary Sue territory for me. He's perfect, awesome, able to withstand everything, and in classic Mary Sue form, even our main characters care more about this NPC's return than one of their fellow leads' -- to the point where they just leave their friend on the ground, still battered, paralyzed and unhealed, as they gather around and bask in O-Chul's beatific radience. (Look at Haley's expression ... she's like "oh hey, V's back, whatevs," whereas seeing O-Chul makes her face light up in rapture! Of course, she thought O-Chul was probably dead, but surely her friendship with V should've made her show a little more pleasure at seeing V back, not to mention concern at the elf's state. Heck, Elan looked happier and he had a big fight with V!)

I also think it's interesting that O-Chul is being seen as bravely taking blame for the Gate incident, but it seems to me that he's actually taking a fair amount of credit for everything, too. Yes, destroying the gate was, in hindsight, not the best thing to do, but it wasn't wrong; it was always the alternate plan for solving the problem, after all. Andhis saying that the elf just "helped" O-Chul with the Xykon task? V's attack on Xykon was dumb and badly fought, but it gave O-Chul the opportunity to escape and steal the phylactery in the first place, plus when O-Chul failed, V healed him and saved him from months of even worse torture, and was the one to get the phylactery out of the castle and hindered Xykon from grabbing it back. That's more than just "helping" O-Chul!

Certainly O-Chul helped V just as much, and O-Chul was incredibly brave and smart for grabbing the phylactery. "The elf helped me" just seems like odd, backhanded phrasing on his part.

I don't really think he's a M-S -- Rich is too good a writer for that. But it's edging that way for me, in my own purely subjective opinion.


Maybe it's just that O-Chul's beginning to believe his own fanclub. :)

[Lunaya]

Didn't the chief of the CPPD already mention he was getting too old for this? :smallconfused:
Yes, and look at how he ended up. :smallwink:

I wonder why Lien and Hinjo were looking for Durkon. Does this mean that we have a dramatic screaming birth scene starring Kazumi in our near future?

Sweet Giant, I hope not. Human reproduction scares the living crap out of me. :eek:

[Dark Faun]

:smallfrown: I miss Miko :smallfrown:
So do I. She is my favorite character after Vaarsuvius.

Awesome strip!

[Georlik]

Does that help? :smalltongue:

Whoa! Thanks a lot! It surely cleared my head.

[JackTheTripper]

even our main characters care more about this NPC's return than one of their fellow leads' -- to the point where they just leave their friend on the ground, still battered, paralyzed and unhealed, as they gather around and bask in O-Chul's beatific radience.
If you ask me, it might have something to do with Vaar being a gigantic, utter prick after the battle for Azure City, bossing everyone around and snapping at them for the littlest things. Even Elan pretty much gave up on V a while back, not saying a word when V decided to just abandon them all to continue hir studies. And V wasn't exactly nice during the first reuiniting of the Order- shi was still obssessed with proving how superior hir magic was, especially with the Splices.

[HandofShadows]

When the (so called) Monster in thje Darkness teleported V and O-Chul out I wasnearly dead certain they would end up with the City fleet. Very VERY good to see the gang (nearly) back together again. Though I wonder if V is going to be put on trial for murder (or dealing with demons, O-Chul DID hear about the soul splice. But he might just forget to mention that part).

[Vonotar]

The updates are coming thick and fast :smallsmile:
Nice of O-Chul to not mention Miko blew the place up.

[Primy]

:smallfrown: I miss Miko :smallfrown:

She is the best character. Bring her back Giant

[Mauve Shirt]

:smallsmile: Yay, they ended up in the right place! I am so glad they both got out of this alive.
So, is Roy resurrected or what?

[Rebarth]

As soon as I saw 2nd panel is was like "YES!"
Great strip

[the_tick_rules]

Elan knows the laws of dramatics.

[HOLEkevin]

Poor Elan. How many years has he had to figure things out now?

[Kaytara]

Funny strip. "That would be highly unlikely" and then two battered heroes pop out of nowhere. Heh. And nice to see that Elan doesn't hold a grudge. Although, I admit, this kind of chaos is why I was hoping that the MitD didn't teleport them directly back to their friends. Besides, I really like the relationship that was built between O-Chul and V in the last few strips - a sort of unquestioning, desperate trust between comrades when they don't even know each other's names but work together to survive. I was hoping to see some more of that in peaceful surroundings before the two returned to their respective teams.

I also have to agree with choie that the comic is once again (as before the Xykon fight) being very dismissive of Vaarsuvius. For one thing, he's completely neglected by the other heroes even though the paladins heal O-Chul immediately. For another, I too feel that V did more than just "help" during the battle. Even putting aside the fact that his arrival was what allowed the whole thing to unfold in the first place, what victory they managed to reap was, in a way, entirely V's doing. It was V's decision to come back and help the unconscious O-Chul despite having just been threatened with unimaginable torture that turned the tide in the struggle. O-Chul was only able to take another shot at grabbing the phylactery because V had just risked his neck (literally, in the end) to heal him. Without that decision, O-Chul would still be a prisoner and Xykon would still have his phylactery. However, I don't think this is meant to highlight O-Chul's virtues but rather to simply keep the pattern of not considering Vaarsuvius to be important. We may see a display of V's character growth next if he's shown to be not as bothered by neglect as he would have been at any point in the past before the Xykon fight.

However, it's possible that this tendency of neglect will only be turned completely around in a few strips' time when the true extent of V's achievements is revealed and especially when the Katos come along and casually repeat their thanks for moving the fleet and surprise everyone else. It would be fitting as a sort of karmic highlight to V's character change.

I am curious what happens next. V obviously can't be un-paralyzed without Durkon's help and I doubt we'll be seeing Roy's resurrection with V still stiff as a board, so I'm guessing that V finally made his save off-panel and will skulk away pondering his failures and successes.

[Aerysil]

Don't bump Durkon...
Don't bump Durkon...

[Bastian]

Oh, yeah! :smallbiggrin:+
Today's my 30th birthday :cool: , and the Giant granted me what i desired so much as present: a new comic!!!

Happy Birthday then!
It's my best buddy's birthday too today, and he's Italian too like you. :smallsmile:

[lord_khaine]

i like the look Lien gives Elan in the last panel, its clearly the look of someone who have lost patience with his antics.

[Mr Jones]

But I'm gonna be controversial here and say, man, I dunno, O-Chul is getting perilously close to Mary Sue territory for me. He's perfect, awesome, able to withstand everything, and in classic Mary Sue form, even our main characters care more about this NPC's return than one of their fellow leads' -- to the point where they just leave their friend on the ground, still battered, paralyzed and unhealed, as they gather around and bask in O-Chul's beatific radience. (Look at Haley's expression ... she's like "oh hey, V's back, whatevs," whereas seeing O-Chul makes her face light up in rapture! Of course, she thought O-Chul was probably dead, but surely her friendship with V should've made her show a little more pleasure at seeing V back, not to mention concern at the elf's state. Heck, Elan looked happier and he had a big fight with V!)

Eh, I think it actually makes sense. V was acting strangely, teleported away, and then teleported back minutes later.

O-chul on the other hand was someone she was not only certain had died a horrible death, but also felt a considerable amount for responsibility for. She mentioned it when she went back to save the blue mustache paladin (Thanh?) during resistance bit. So naturally she'd be thrilled to see he turned out to be okay.

Anyway, I've got a feeling O-chul will be taking a back seat from here on out. He's back with the Azurites, and there's a lot that needs to be done.

[Aenghus]

Elan could have been right - he just didn't know O-Chul has graduated from throwaway NPC status to a NPC with significance and supporting subplot. Surviving that fourth wall violation is a good sign, if we needed any after the shark tank.

[Kaytara]

If you ask me, it might have something to do with Vaar being a gigantic, utter prick after the battle for Azure City, bossing everyone around and snapping at them for the littlest things. Even Elan pretty much gave up on V a while back, not saying a word when V decided to just abandon them all to continue hir studies. And V wasn't exactly nice during the first reuiniting of the Order- shi was still obssessed with proving how superior hir magic was, especially with the Splices.

Haley wasn't around for V's antics - and V's obsessive rants in the form of "Lo! I shall now use my mighty power to reunite the Order!" are completely in-character with what he was like BEFORE their separation. In short, to Haley Vaarsuvius is still the same old V she knew before the battle, arrogant and snobbish but ultimately sensitive and good-natured, which is why it's odd that she of all people displays such a complete lack of concern.

Personally I'm going to have to go with Mr. Jones' explanation that V's departure just didn't have time to really register with them enough to make them really focus on it, while O-Chul's survival is something that is both unexpected, wondrous, and mind-boggling.

[otakuryoga]

Funny strip. "That would be highly unlikely" and then two battered heroes pop out of nowhere. Heh. And nice to see that Elan doesn't hold a grudge. Although, I admit, this kind of chaos is why I was hoping that the MitD didn't teleport them directly back to their friends. Besides, I really like the relationship that was built between O-Chul and V in the last few strips - a sort of unquestioning, desperate trust between comrades when they don't even know each other's names but work together to survive. I was hoping to see some more of that in peaceful surroundings before the two returned to their respective teams.

I also have to agree with choie that the comic is once again (as before the Xykon fight) being very dismissive of Vaarsuvius. For one thing, he's completely neglected by the other heroes even though the paladins heal O-Chul immediately. For another, I too feel that V did more than just "help" during the battle. Even putting aside the fact that his arrival was what allowed the whole thing to unfold in the first place, what victory they managed to reap was, in a way, entirely V's doing. It was V's decision to come back and help the unconscious O-Chul despite having just been threatened with unimaginable torture that turned the tide in the struggle. O-Chul was only able to take another shot at grabbing the phylactery because V had just risked his neck (literally, in the end) to heal him. Without that decision, O-Chul would still be a prisoner and Xykon would still have his phylactery. However, I don't think this is meant to highlight O-Chul's virtues but rather to simply keep the pattern of not considering Vaarsuvius to be important. We may see a display of V's character growth next if he's shown to be not as bothered by neglect as he would have been at any point in the past before the Xykon fight.

However, it's possible that this tendency of neglect will only be turned completely around in a few strips' time when the true extent of V's achievements is revealed and especially when the Katos come along and casually repeat their thanks for moving the fleet and surprise everyone else. It would be fitting as a sort of karmic highlight to V's character change.

I am curious what happens next. V obviously can't be un-paralyzed without Durkon's help and I doubt we'll be seeing Roy's resurrection with V still stiff as a board, so I'm guessing that V finally made his save off-panel and will skulk away pondering his failures and successes.

i dont think they are being dismissive of V...its just that ochul is a h*ll of a lot more beat-up looking than V is...triage says take the most hurt first(if they can be saved of course)

[Freefall]

Hasn't V been highly contrite in the past? Will we now see a chastened V?

[Torquinette]

A nice tidbit before things get moving.

What happens when the Azurites see Belkar? sorry if ninja-ed.

[warmachine]

Ha! Nobody got around to unparalyzing Vaarsuvius. I know, Durkon is still running to catch up.

[keldorn]

A nice funny comic.

So this debrief with the scribe,

Is this going to involve mention of various of the theories for the MitD that have appeared on the forum?

[Dark Faun]

I agree that I'd like to see V less ignored in the future. Hopefully the Katos will help.

O-Chul being close to a Gary Stu... I never paid much attention to him so I never thought about it...

[aboyd]

I think it's fine that V is ignored. V is not a team player, so now that V is back, the team is like, "Oh. Whatevs."

Eventually, they will all wander off excitedly chatting, and V will be there on the ground, alone. Durkon will walk up & cast Remove Paralysis. V will be like, "WTF? I do all this stuff and they basically ignore me."

And Durkon will say, "You're not exactly a team player."

V will sit there stunned for a moment, and let that sink in. And thus V's metamorphosis will be complete.

[DigoDragon]

O-Chul is going to have some choice words for Belkar in a few rounds. He was surprisingly civil to Haley, all things considered.

He may be civil to Belkar as well. Had Belkar tried to hold onto O-Chul then the halfling may have been killed. And since O-Chul is currently alive and reunited with his lord he may simply let the past go and focus on the present situation. :smallsmile:

Also, I think O-Chul definitly earned "PC" status by now.

[Rollory]

I just want to mention I'm going on vacation starting tomorrow and will have no internet access for a while, and to thank Mr. Burlew for providing me with closure to just about all the immediate crises JUST prior, so I won't be gnawing my fingernails the whole time wondering how things turned out.

This story has been getting consistently better for a long time.

[Moriarty]

i don't think we should take the "helping" comment too seriously, i'm sure Ochul will explain the real conditions later. As with V, he was only 3 or 4 minutes gone, contrary to Ochul which had been held prisoner for months

[Fri]

Honestly, I didn't think that O chul would get out from all of these alive. Glad to be proven wrong.

[Solara]

So I guess this is definite confirmation the MitD was using a Wish, right? O'Chul wound up exactly where he wanted to be. The lampshade hanging was funny but not really necessary in this case.


Not necessarily - it didn't even occur to me that he was talking about Miko. My assumption was he meant his fellow paladins, who slaughtered each other under the influence of Xykon's symbol of insanity...

I assumed he was talking about Miko. There was also that one line (will have to dig up the link...) when he told the MitD that letting girls in their 'secret club' worked out okay...with one exception. Again, Miko wasn't actually named, but I don't remember anyone arguing that the joke wasn't about her.

Really though it's probably as simple as looking up the rules on paralyzation, which I'm sure someone has already done in the two pages I haven't gotten to yet. :smallsmile:

[spargel]

Ironically, V's the one who has been trying the hardest to reunite the order after Azure City.

[Deme]

I'd like to point out to those feeling Haley seems a lot happier to see O-Chul than V... That Haley may still feel bad about the way she and Belkar (mostly Belkar) left O-Chul behind. But now it's OK, because she didn't leave him to his death.

[Sijo]

Heh, Mr. Burlew loves to tease his characters (and us.) :smalltongue: First he has several coincidences in a row (the Azurites running into the heroes, then V and O-Chul teleporting on top of them) and then he has Elan guess WRONG for once. (This could also be interpreted as "the strip has gotten less silly than it used to be".)

Damn, but is O-Chul noble, allowing himself to take the blame rather than "speak ill of the dead." Whether Miko deserved such respect will require more thought to decide...

...Oh, man, I just realized: now that the team is back together, that means Belkar will be back too. Damn, I really enjoyed reading OotS without his odious personality (my apologies to his fans, but I CANNOT stand him.) Maybe he'll have changed as was hinted at (but I seriously doubt it.) :smallmad:

[Rotipher]

i dont think they are being dismissive of V...its just that ochul is a h*ll of a lot more beat-up looking than V is...triage says take the most hurt first(if they can be saved of course)

Yep. He's also conscious and mobile, which means his injuries will be more evident in how they impair his movements. O-chul is also one of Hinjo's own subjects and Sapphire Guard comrades, which may leave Hinjo duty-bound to provide for O-Chul's care before that of a foreign ally, like V. (If V had been dying it would've been a different story, but ve's evidently not in that bad a state.)

[Shadowbane]

Yay. :] Now start healing V, dammit.

[FlawedParadigm]

I'm a tad curious as to exactly why O-Chul is choosing not to discuss Miko. I mean, unless he really does just have a thing for not speaking ill of the dead, I'd think her involvement and subsequent death would be important to discuss. Heck, the fact that she even IS dead isn't common knowledge to anyone alive (except Tsukiko, who had no idea what she was seeing - keep in mind, the other people who heard directly about her death were at the Oracle's and will have forgotten they were told - except maybe Roy, but then he's not alive (yet).)


Also, I think O-Chul definitly earned "PC" status by now.

Why "PC" in quotes? Plot Catalyst? :op

[Krytha]

Danny Glover says - rrrghhhhhh getting too old for this....

[Rotipher]

I know that lampshading it is supposed to make everything okay, but I guess, despite the lampshade hang, the fact that O-chul and V are teleported directly to their teammates (presumably by the MitD, who I'm guessing probably wouldn't know where they were) and Hinjo and Lien show up somehow is still a "Wallbanger" as they might say at TvTropes.

It's likely that O-Chul and the MitD have talked about what course of action O-Chul would take, had he successfully escaped from Xykon, and "Report to Hinjo" was surely at the top of his To-Do list. When Monster-san willed / Wished / whatever for O-Chul to "ESCAPE", it evidently sent its friend straight to the person he'd always intended to rejoin.

[SadisticFishing]

Urm.. Hold Person shouldn't last more than 2 minutes. Natural 20 on save'll hit eventually. I wouldn't even waste a spell - just wait it out.

Ochul is pretty impressive, and not dead. They all thought he was. V DID attack Xykon himself though, and they should be more curious about that...

[Slayn82]

I also have to agree with choie that the comic is once again (as before the Xykon fight) being very dismissive of Vaarsuvius. For one thing, he's completely neglected by the other heroes even though the paladins heal O-Chul immediately. For another, I too feel that V did more than just "help" during the battle.

I am curious what happens next. V obviously can't be un-paralyzed without Durkon's help and I doubt we'll be seeing Roy's resurrection with V still stiff as a board, so I'm guessing that V finally made his save off-panel and will skulk away pondering his failures and successes.

Well, first V is paralized, so is not like the paladins could do something about it. Maybe Elan healed him off panel. Second the party is very distracted by nature, V should be thankfull that he is not in the situation Durkon passed in the Dorukan dungeon.

And O-Chul is not a man to waste words, and i dont think he is stealing the glory o V, he is just being laconic.

I guess Elan could use song of liberation to release V from the paralisation. May V batered sanity resist.

[Werekat]

I kind of think V might have crawled off already - having made the required save and now just trying to get out of sight. The wizard had been laying right under O'Chul's feet, but is not there in the last panels. I have the feeling that before talking with anyone Vaarsuvius will be considering the excursion an utter and complete failure, and might try to start being scarce just to avoid dealing with everything that should hit the fan, at least in the elf's mind. I think that now that the fevered pace will cool down somewhat, an understanding of what has transpired might make itself into V's mind. It shouldn't be pretty, by my estimates.
Invisibility. A wizard might have prepared that twice. Why not?

[Raenir Salazar]

its only Hold Person spell not Paralyzing touch, she'll get out of it within 3-4 minutes or so, its 6 seconds per level duration.

[Xentropy]

I'm not sure why people think V is being ignored and O'chul lavished with attention any more than should be the case.

Compare: Your friend is angry and drives off in a huff. You're worried he's going to do something stupid because he's angry. But before you can get TOO worried, he comes back just 5 minutes later, and in the car with him--is an acquaintance who you haven't seen since he went off to war a year ago, and who you'd heard was killed in action!

Yet the guy who left 5 minutes ago should get more attention, because he's someone you've known longer.....?

V just teleported off 5 minutes ago. O'chul was lost, presumed dead, MONTHS ago. It seems fairly normal to me that everyone would be more surprised and elated to see him.

[sihnfahl]

And nice to see that Elan doesn't hold a grudge.
Elan's genre savvy - well, most of the time. When someone starts acting in a way that Isn't Quite Usual, they're under the influence of Plot; when Plot is satisfied, they'll return to normal.


For one thing, he's completely neglected by the other heroes even though the paladins heal O-Chul immediately.
Not neglected; O-Chul was the more seriously wounded (and talking is a free action), so very little time actually passed.


V obviously can't be un-paralyzed without Durkon's help
Hm? Xykon used Mass Hold Person, not Paralyzing Touch, and that has a duration. Just give V a minute or two and V'll be sputtering...


I doubt we'll be seeing Roy's resurrection with V still stiff as a board, so I'm guessing that V finally made his save off-panel and will skulk away pondering his failures and successes.
Durkon's somewhere in the middle of casting a 10-minute spell... Rule of Funny would have Roy resurrected and commenting on V's current state... stiff as a corpse, but not a corpse, which is what Roy feared.

[derfenrirwolv]

I know that lampshading it is supposed to make everything okay, but I guess, despite the lampshade hang, the fact that O-chul and V are teleported directly to their teammates (presumably by the MitD, who I'm guessing probably wouldn't know where they were) and Hinjo and Lien show up somehow is still a "Wallbanger" as they might say at TvTropes. For me, I think this might be a little too much "convenience" in a plot for me to handle. :smallsigh: :

Monster-San used a wish spell, spell like ability, miracle, or some equivalent thereof. It wasn't an asspull, it was forshadowed back in strip 543 when the monster said "I hoped really really hard and mr stiffly still didn't escape!"
Those spells exist in D&D, and they specifically do the sort of thing that happened : namely put people where they most want to be. O chul was probably praying that he would be reunited with the paladins, so BAM.

[Kaytara]

Hm? Xykon used Mass Hold Person, not Paralyzing Touch, and that has a duration. Just give V a minute or two and V'll be sputtering...

I meant that there is nothing they can DO to speed up V's release from paralysis, since Durkon is still occupied. As in, maybe they should pay more attention to V, but since they can't make him unparalyze any sooner it's all a moot point, anyway.


I'm not sure why people think V is being ignored and O'chul lavished with attention any more than should be the case.

Compare: Your friend is angry and drives off in a huff. You're worried he's going to do something stupid because he's angry. But before you can get TOO worried, he comes back just 5 minutes later, and in the car with him--is an acquaintance who you haven't seen since he went off to war a year ago, and who you'd heard was killed in action!

Yet the guy who left 5 minutes ago should get more attention, because he's someone you've known longer.....?

V just teleported off 5 minutes ago. O'chul was lost, presumed dead, MONTHS ago. It seems fairly normal to me that everyone would be more surprised and elated to see him.

For my part, I'm not saying that Vaarsuvius should be getting obsessively fussed over - as you say, O-Chul's is the more unexpected reappearance, so it's natural that he gets more attention. But for all but one of the panels (two, if we count O-Chul's response about their elven friend), they do not acknowledge V's presence at all. I don't know, if a close friend of mine had suddenly returned from a battle with the scary epic-level evil Lich sorcerer, paralyzed and battered to near death, I'd be at least checking them somewhat closer for hidden injuries and other not readily apparent status effects. Perhaps while I talk to the paladin. It's just that - something as simple and subtle as Haley kneeling down to check V's injuries while talking to O-Chul would have gotten over the message that she cares about her friend. By contrast, the lack of such a simple gesture looks rather out-of-place for someone who had hugged the elf on sight minutes earlier.

Also, I don't want people to think that I'm horribly bothered by this... just explaining what I mean. That, and wondering if Rich has done this intentionally. Also, I think O-Chul is quite safe from being a Mary-Sue - one of the most important requirements for a MS is that they completely take over the story. O-Chul will now be presumably retreating to the background, until the time when him and the MitD meet again.

[brionl]

It's not a "coincidence" at all that the Azure Fleet and the rest of the Order ended up in the same place. Varsuvius was the one teleporting people around in the first place, and he sent them all to the same place. In the first panel of 649 when the Order teleports in, you can see the fleet offshore there. Since Hinjo doesn't know where they are, or how they got there, he would send out exploring parties. If the monster wished for O-Chul and Varsuvius to be back with their friends, then that's where they would end up too.


I picked up on O-Chul's "my decision" and "my blade" weasel right away, but I'm assuming he wants to tell Hinjo about Miko and Soon and everything more privately.

[Laketh Stadt]

I'm a tad curious as to exactly why O-Chul is choosing not to discuss Miko. I mean, unless he really does just have a thing for not speaking ill of the dead, I'd think her involvement and subsequent death would be important to discuss. Heck, the fact that she even IS dead isn't common knowledge to anyone alive (except Tsukiko, who had no idea what she was seeing - keep in mind, the other people who heard directly about her death were at the Oracle's and will have forgotten they were told - except maybe Roy, but then he's not alive (yet).)



Why "PC" in quotes? Plot Catalyst? :op

The rule of "polite" says you avoid assigning blame. While dealing with polite people like paladin's you have to ask multiple questions to get the full answer. Hinjo should not be ignorant of that and in the full debriefing all should come out in the polite way. Then, hopefully, Miko can take the blame and all Azure city children should be taught to avoid the hubris of the fallen paladin!

[mec]

-- to the point where they just leave their friend on the ground, still battered, paralyzed and unhealed, as they gather around and bask in O-Chul's beatific radience. (Look at Haley's expression ... she's like "oh hey, V's back, whatevs," whereas seeing O-Chul makes her face light up in rapture! Of course, she thought O-Chul was probably dead, but surely her friendship with V should've made her show a little more pleasure at seeing V back, not to mention concern at the elf's state. Heck, Elan looked happier and he had a big fight with V!)

Yeah, I noticed that. And then a panel or two later, Vaarsuvius isn't even in the panel any more.

I thought it was subtly funny.

[Red XIV]

Poor Elan, his bardic knowledge seems to have been incorrect in this situation.
His knowledge wasn't wrong, it's just that it only applies to lesser men. O-Chul is beyond such things. :smallbiggrin:

Which reminds me, the Giant needs to give us an O-Chul smiley.


I wonder if the Azurites "most learned scribe" will understand V's use of the soul splices - and that V sold hir soul.
Not sold. Just leased.


I'm surprised nobody's trying to un-paralyze V (or does it just have to wear off on its own?), but exposition will make its own way.
Durkon would be the one to handle that, and he's kind of busy at the moment.

[Kaytara]

Nobody (other than Belkar) knows that Belkar has triggered and overcome his MoJ (although Roy may be able to see it, since he has the emergency trigger word).

Actually, Roy witnessed what set the MoJ off, he was there, and got to keep the memory, as well. It's also unlikely that he'll be forgetting his post-death memories after Resurrection, as well, since that would render the "I remember everything!" and anti-spellcaster Fighter feat bits completely meaningless.

[Blaznak]

Together again....

[OOTS_Supporter]

Clever. Waiting for Roy to be revealed and the Order brought back together.

[Dread Cthulhu]

I'm not all that knowledgable on the rules, but can't Elan fix up V now he has Greater Dispel Magic?

Amazing strip, great closure on that bit.

[Shatteredtower]

Yet the guy who left 5 minutes ago should get more attention, because he's someone you've known longer.....?

I agree with your position, though it's a pretty common player character attitude to ignore NPCs in favour of their own. It's nice to see it go in reverse, but that goes somewhat in hand with people taking V for granted, as was the case the last time the elf was paralysed, as well as the time spent as a newt.

O-Chul as a Sue? Mmm... no. Hinjo has very good reasons for focusing all of his attention on an old, trusted friend, the only survivor of events that are core to their organization's oaths, and someone he'd thought dead -- now if only I could remember what those were. Others noted why Haley would be No point talking with the paralysed person yet, though I'm sure there will be questions later. Besides, the elf has hogged centre stage (relative to the rest of the Order, at any rate) for quite some time now.

Also, be fair: Haley is off panel from the moment she greets O-Chul until Elan sounds his warning. (Nice touch flipping the direction from which we view the party in the last panel on the second last line, Giant.) More than enough time to check on V there.

O-Chul is also entirely correct in claiming that the elf assisted in one last mission, as the lion's share of that was done by the paladin. It would not have been possible if V hadn't O-Chul's life and provided the emergency backup for Blackwing, but O-Chul was the one that managed to take the item and drive away its keeper in the first place.

Heh. Calling an NPC in a story full of PCs a Mary Sue. That's a good one.

[Yoyoyo]

This strip (at least the first half) is from the point of view of non-party members, so their focus on one of their own (O-chul) makes sense, particularly since he needs to give them updates and important background information to advance the plot. And last time they hung around V (presumably), V insulted them and generally told them to shut up. http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0643.html


Not too mention that V told the party that she would be killing Xykon and would be back shortly:

http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0650.html

Okay, so she's beat up, but that's not unexpected, and, from appearances, seems to have saved O-chul. Doesn't strike me as a panic inducing situation, particularly since O-chul is so calm.

[kamuishirou]

Whew, that comic was needed. We needed a good laugh :D. Now, what is MitD?

[Poppy Appletree]

I know that lampshading it is supposed to make everything okay, but I guess, despite the lampshade hang, the fact that O-chul and V are teleported directly to their teammates (presumably by the MitD, who I'm guessing probably wouldn't know where they were) and Hinjo and Lien show up somehow is still a "Wallbanger" as they might say at TvTropes. For me, I think this might be a little too much "convenience" in a plot for me to handle. :smallsigh:

No. I still have three pages of this thread to go, but I think this post deserves a response.

General consensus is that the Monster in the Darkness used a Wish effect, and I think this post by plipsig has it bang on the head:


Maybe it's not a matter of place, but of person. Consider: MitD seems very childlike. To make his friend O-Chul safest, he would probably think to send him to the person who is the closest thing to a parent figure to O-Chul, i.e. the ruler of the Azurites, and his Lord. O-Chul landed closest to Hinjo, right on top of him actually, not the members of the Order. Just an idea.

Hinjo and Lien were in the ships that Vaarsuvius Epic Teleported, but they have no idea about V's involvement in it, so they don't know why they are now at the abandoned elven settlement, hence their confusion at seeing Durkon.

The reasons that these things happened are perfectly justified, but from an outside perspective that lacks knowledge of such (as is the case with Hinjo and Lien), it does seem like a massive coincidence.

[Kaytara]

Shatteredtower, I wouldn't dismiss the idea of O-Chul being a possible Mary Sue just like that. Now, I do NOT think he is a Mary-Sue, but that is not the same as him not having qualities typical of Mary Sues (which, again, is no in and of itself a bad thing, since Mary Sues are definitionally made up of too many good qualities). That is, if the main plot actually centred on him, he quite likely would be one. O-Chul is far too perfect, wise, courageous, noble and serene to make an interesting main character - as a rule of thumb, anyway, of course there are exceptions, but characters tend to be interesting because of their growth, and are less interesting if there is literally no room for improvement. By contrast, the Order are all hilariously flawed individuals, and that's what makes them so fun to read about. O-Chul is awesome as someone with limited screentime, someone to worship from afar, not someone to actually center the story on. And it so happens that this particular scene and the way the characters act is similar to the way a Mary Sue scene would unfold - except there are good reasons, as you noted, whereas with a Mary Sue there would be no good reasons.

[Sethram]

Whew, that comic was needed. We needed a good laugh :D. Now, what is MitD?

I'm of the Pit Fiend (http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/SRD:Pit_Fiend) following since they can use Wish as an SLA.

[Roszlishan]

Oh wow, soon as I turn the computer on I see a Stick update, and quite a recent one too, it seems.
Poor Elan, his bardic knowledge seems to have been incorrect in this situation. I suppose that's for the best, though. Good to see O-Chul reunited with his people, and rather nice of him not to bad-mouth the deceased.
I do, however, wonder how Durkon's faring with Roy's resurrection off screen, and how long V's actually been away for.

Do you think so? It seems to me that Elan's genre savviness (as someone else put it) is quite on-target. O-Chul's was exactly the sort of remark that precedes some kind of catastrophe befalling the speaker. Such a remark need not always precede disaster, but ... Elan is correct in noting that it does, and the circumstances of narrow escape are precisely those of that particular ironical trope.

At some point Elan might even note that his own interjection of "Oh noes! Don't say that!" has its own effect of forestalling whatever event he's concerned about.

[Alaska Fan]

I'm a little concerned about the reunion of the Paladins and OOTS. As others have noted, Belkar needs to be concerned, although the little psychopath can probably bluff his way out of the situation. But V whacked Kubota (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0595.html), and Elan lied about it afterwards. And V sold lease his/her should to demons, and that's pretty likely to come out. How are all those issues going to play against the stiff-necked paladins?

Hinjo is pragmatic, for a paladin, but paladins aren't permitted a lot of flexibility. It's hard to see how an alliance of the paladins - not the Azurites generally, but the paladins - and the OOTS can be created, let alone last.

[Bibliomancer]

If we're lucky, the most learned scribe to escape from Azure City knows what the MitD is. That is clearly what O'chul is hoping, based on his comment in the sixth-last panel. (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0663.html) However, I doubt that one of the two great mysteries of the comic will be resolved by an NPC...unless, of course, the NPC wizard is back.

If nothing else, O'chul's interview with the scribe will provide a handy summary of MitD facts, if it is shown on-screen, and we might even get some new facts that O'chul observed while in close proximity with it for months.

[factotum]

It's also unlikely that he'll be forgetting his post-death memories after Resurrection, as well, since that would render the "I remember everything!" and anti-spellcaster Fighter feat bits completely meaningless.

I disagree. The Oracle is a tricksy little bugger, and it would be just like him to dismiss Roy's ghost, knowing he'd have the delight of remembering stuff he shouldn't but also knowing he wouldn't ultimately remember it when it mattered. As for the anti-spellcaster feat, even with it I don't think Roy would be a match for Xykon, so it might be a bit of a red herring.

[Trebuchet]

I don't think it is a coincidence that O-Chul ended up on the same island as Mr. Flopsy (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0475.html) (Roy). Why wouldn't the MitD send one of his friends to be with the other of his friends?

[Doug Lampert]

There must be some major climax planned for Strip 666 - my guess it'll be either Roy resurrection strip, or something major reviled about MitD - or more likely a joke related to MitD and the number 666.

plus I don't think MitD was the one how transported V & O - he wouldn't know the location of the Azura fleet. I think it's more likely the 3 demons did it - to protect their investment - although it is unlikely that they would have saved O-chul as well.

Rich tends (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0600.html) to anti-climax (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0100.html) significant number strips.

"I wish O'Chul escaped and was with his friends", well within the limits of a safe wish, exactly the effect observed. Wish, Alter Reality, Miracle, or pretty well any other wish or wish-like ability could do exactly this.


I know that lampshading it is supposed to make everything okay, but I guess, despite the lampshade hang, the fact that O-chul and V are teleported directly to their teammates (presumably by the MitD, who I'm guessing probably wouldn't know where they were) and Hinjo and Lien show up somehow is still a "Wallbanger" as they might say at TvTropes. For me, I think this might be a little too much "convenience" in a plot for me to handle. :smallsigh:

Just to pile on. V put two groups on that island, the MitD put the other group there. There is no actual coincidence, some characters percieve one, but everyone goes exactly where they are put and all the events putting them there were initiated by V's post ABD soul-splice activities, which lasted maybe 10 minutes or so TOTAL. No coincidence at all.


Urm.. Hold Person shouldn't last more than 2 minutes. Natural 20 on save'll hit eventually. I wouldn't even waste a spell - just wait it out.

It conceivably could also be Lich paralysis which is permanent. But waiting a couple of minutes first to make sure it isn't a hold person is a reasonable thing to do, and other than Durkon, who is already occupied, who is likely to have any way to remove paralysis? Acting on V's condition isn't that urgent.

[RdMarquis]

O-Chul? Retire? While there are still bad guys around? Don't be silly, Elan. :smalltongue: That said, his bit of genre savvy was very funny.

Glad to see the group together again. Now, all the OotS need is their leader.

Hopefully the next strip will address that, or any lessons V learned on his five minute trip to Azure City.

[Elderac]

I suspect that we will not see a debrief of O-Chul shown. Having O-Chul and Hinjo discuss a debrief serves to let the readers know that O-Chul will tell Hinjo everything he knows without actually having to write it out.

As far as the identity of the MITD, I see one of two things happening, either the scribe will have no idea (quite likely) or he gives O-Chul a clue regarding MITD's identity. In the latter case, we may not be told it until O-Chul meets MITD again, which may not be likely.

I had a stray thought that Hinjo might send his seafaring paladin, Lien, to find the phylactery, however Xykon did not give O-Chul enough information during his rant to tell him it was in the sewer.

Like others, I see this book rapidly drawing to a close. I suspect that it will soon be too uncomfortable for the OOTS to remain with the Azurites and they will sail away for the western continent.

Whether the Paladins will have a further hand in this remains to be seen. At once they were forbidden to check on the other gates. However, Shojo, not a Paladin, did get involved in the aftermath of the destruction of Dorukon's gate. Perhaps Hinjo will have learned from this and offer assistance.

I have the feeling that Gerard's Gate will not be the final encounter between the OOTS and Xykon. If that gate is destroyed, the stakes will be much higher at the last gate.

Just some random thoughts.

[Doug Lampert]

I'm of the Pit Fiend (http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/SRD:Pit_Fiend) following since they can use Wish as an SLA.

Lots of monsters can use Wish as a SLA, at least 5 in the first 3.5 Monster Manual that I can think of (1 demons, 1 devil, 1 archon, 2 jinn).

Given the number of other books including monsters with SLA wish it doesn't tell us all that much. Earthquake is probably a better thing to look for.


I disagree. The Oracle is a tricksy little bugger, and it would be just like him to dismiss Roy's ghost, knowing he'd have the delight of remembering stuff he shouldn't but also knowing he wouldn't ultimately remember it when it mattered. As for the anti-spellcaster feat, even with it I don't think Roy would be a match for Xykon, so it might be a bit of a red herring.

We've never actually seen the Oracle do anything all that tricky or give a prophesy that was demonstrated to not be straight forwardly correct other than arranging for Belkar to be in a town one fine day. Which was also straight forward and involved the prophesies meaning what they say.

[Ellye]

Nobody (other than Belkar) knows that Belkar has triggered and overcome his MoJ (although Roy may be able to see it, since he has the emergency trigger word).And Haley. And Celia.
The Cleric of Loki told them.

[sihnfahl]

I'm not all that knowledgable on the rules, but can't Elan fix up V now he has Greater Dispel Magic?
Possibly, but why would anyone use the spell rather than let the duration run?

Since there's apparently no danger, waiting a minute or two for the Hold Person to wear off is no biggie.


As others have noted, Belkar needs to be concerned, although the little psychopath can probably bluff his way out of the situation.
Depends on what O-Chul says.


But V whacked Kubota, and Elan lied about it afterwards.
Only Elan knows this, and so far, nobody's called Elan on his lie. Durkon and Elan have been with Hinjo this entire time, and Hinjo hasn't taken them to task about it.

And the nobles would know if Hinjo and Lien were involved in Murder; they'd Fall.


And V sold lease his/her should to demons
Only Roy and Inkyrus know that V had soul splice. Of the mortals, only Inkyrus knows V made a deal with the ICC; else just knows V got a sudden burst of power. Roy knows the power came from the Subcontractors, but not where the Subcontractors came from.


and that's pretty likely to come out. How are all those issues going to play against the stiff-necked paladins?
Stiff-necked? O-Chul, Hinjo and Lien are anything BUT stiff-necked. Miko was the stiff-necked one. They'd question the wisdom of V's action, but unless someone spills the beans on Familicide, V apparently used the powers for Good.
1) The Fleet has been moved to a fertile land with ready-to-go fortifications
2) O-Chul has been returned
3) They know what Xykon's Phylactery is
4) The OOTS has been reunited
5) They're going to get a full debrief; O-Chul knows some of Redcloak's plan because of the interrogations...

[Joerg]

Does anyone else think that O-Chul is an extremely cold thinker here? One second Xykon has his fingers down his throat, preparing to cast Meteor Swarm, the next second he's on some island back with his fellow paladins. And the first thing he says is "I bring greetings from our homeland". No surprise, no relief, no joy. Just duty.

Similarly, aren't the paladins all a bit formal? I was under the impression that O-Chul and Hinjo were friends. But there's hardly any celebration, O-Chul calls Hinjo "my Lord" and they talk about strategy very soon.

And I'm wondering why Haley and Elan don't ask about Xykon. I mean, V promises to kill Xykon and be back soon, teleports away, and returns after a short time with O-Chul, who reports that he has been a prisoner in Azure City. OK, V is paralyzed, but nevertheless a logical conclusion would be that V has somehow won the fight, freed O-Chul and teleported both of them back. O-Chul himself says nothing contradicting that theory ...

Just imagine, if we hadn't seen the strips in between, what theories and questions would flood the forums :smallwink:

[Zanaril]

Does anyone else think that O-Chul is an extremely cold thinker here? One second Xykon has his fingers down his throat, preparing to cast Meteor Swarm, the next second he's on some island back with his fellow paladins. And the first thing he says is "I bring greetings from our homeland". No surprise, no relief, no joy. Just duty.

The look on his face says otherwise.

I think he was so surprised he just said the first thing that came to mind.

[redzimmer]

I smell the end of a story arc coming.

Or maybe it's just Skittles.

Has anyone theorized that the MiTD is the spawn of the snarl?

[Roszlishan]

Mmmm.

Not really. A Mary Sue character is the author projecting herself (or himself) into the story as an unrealistically perfect character. All of the characterizations and Mary-Sue-Tests are aimed at capturing that.

O-Chul does not strike me as an authorial self-portrait, perfected or otherwise. Yes, he's pretty cool. He's a Paladin[\I]. Reasonably high level, with significant fighter levels. He's tough. He should be tough. He's determined. That's a paladin trait. Miko was equally determined (although ... less effectively wise). He behaves in every way like a determined, devout paladin might be expected to. Both his successes and failures drive the plot forward, and serve as a counterpoint to the actions of the main characters (Vaarsuvius, in particular). I do like O-Chul, I do root for him to succeed - and I do like that what saved him was not his own might (his power, as Xykon might put it) but [I]that he inspired the MitD, and it is that success - his example and friendship - that saved him. That's true success of and for a paladin. That's the real power of a paladin.

So yes, O-Chul rocks. But a successful, determined, likeable character - even one who succeeds - is not an ipso facto Mary Sue. Not at all. Not in any way. Not even remotely.

Roszlishan

[Selene]

Has anyone theorized that the MiTD is the spawn of the snarl?

Repeatedly. And the general consensus is, no he's not. See this thread (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=114313).


O-Chul will not be upset with Belkar for leaving him behind. It was the will of the Twelve Gods. He ended up in the place where he could do the most good.

As for V, they've been there what like two minutes? O-Chul has confirmed that he's ok, just paralyzed. Not sure what else they're supposed to do for V before Durkon gets there. They're probably saving their questions about what happened with Xykon until V can speak. He can't answer right now. And O-Chul probably would have mentioned something like "oh, by the way, the lich has been destroyed."

[Mystic Muse]

yay. a comic with a funny joke. we haven't seen one of those since "I have no feelings on viewing you. you are largely irrelevant." and twelve comics doesn't seem like it'd be very long but when each comic takes about 3 days to come out and sometimes longer. it is.

[snafu]

Does anyone else think that O-Chul is an extremely cold thinker here? One second Xykon has his fingers down his throat, preparing to cast Meteor Swarm, the next second he's on some island back with his fellow paladins. And the first thing he says is "I bring greetings from our homeland". No surprise, no relief, no joy. Just duty.

Similarly, aren't the paladins all a bit formal? I was under the impression that O-Chul and Hinjo were friends. But there's hardly any celebration, O-Chul calls Hinjo "my Lord" and they talk about strategy very soon.

They're just that Lawful.

Think of the idealised imperial British gentleman, a real Phileas Fogg type, for whom the stiff upper lip is a way of life. Multiply that by the noble samurai whose every action is dictated by his dedication to the Bushido. Put the result into an order of knights whose holy discipline makes the Templars look like the West Side Boys.

Then you've got something like what a D&D paladin ought to be.

[Rollory]

Am I the only one who thinks that bit of cleavage Lien is always displaying is really freaking hot?

Or maybe I just have a thing for blue-haired girls.

[Poit-Narf]

The first two panels were great. :smallbiggrin:

[AyuVince]

Finally, something that really went well both for the Azurites and for the Order (touch wood).
Outside the government, beyond the police. Tracking down alien life on earth... oh, wait, toUchwood. My bad.

Yay, things are going well for the good guys again! I'm happy. Not that I didn't like the conflict in between, but I really wanted the Order and the Azurites back again. Team Good is back and ready to kick some ass, it seems.

TO GIRARD'S GATE!

:mitd: Wait, what gate?

[Istari]

YAY! We has some funny :smallbiggrin:

[Tykopulus]

There must be some major climax planned for Strip 666 - my guess it'll be either Roy resurrection strip, or something major reviled about MitD - or more likely a joke related to MitD and the number 666.

I whould lauge if the MitD crawls out of the box and we see an
http://tbn2.google.com/images?q=tbn:avuuo8YyTsVNrM:http://www.rreynoso.com/blog

or
http://tbn3.google.com/images?q=tbn:xlYzOQbplixkqM:http://www.welt.de/multimedia/archive/00260/teletubbies_DW_Verm_260780g.jpg

But please only as an joke^^
MitD the most fearfull "monster" is a Teletubby ;-)

[teratorn]

Nobody (other than Belkar) knows that Belkar has triggered and overcome his MoJ (although Roy may be able to see it, since he has the emergency trigger word).

Huh (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0602.html)? Haley and Celia have known that for sixty strips...

[gjp]

Ochul becomes a new member of the OOTS, possibly foreshadowing Durkon's soon to happen departure from the mortal realm.

[David Argall]

Heh. Calling an NPC in a story full of PCs a Mary Sue. That's a good one.
It is an exaggeration. A true Mary Sue would have escaped from Azure City on her own. But it is the way to look. Like a Mary Sue, O-Chul has just gone around being awesome. There is no real conflict here, and the character is in the last analysis dull. He is too perfect to be much good. From a story view, he has just been a way to do things. If O-Chul left the story to become an off-screen bureaucrat, we would not notice the hole he left. No real questions about loose ends or how things will develop. We need somebody to lay down the smack? Belkar and Roy can do that fine. Miko here would have been tremendously superior in developing story and plot.



Belkar is dead. For O-Chul to kill him at the first opportunity would be a perfectly legitimate act. He'd better hope like hell that O-Chul's feeling more Good than Lawful at the moment, because Lawful says that Belkar gets hanged, drawn and quartered.
While we have very good reason to question Belkar's motives, the actions can easily fall within the range of good here. Belkar was faced with a situation where his survival was questionable, even if he was not carrying 200 lb of stiff paladin. Dumping O-Chul may have been the only way either of them could survive. We can decry his eagerness, and have to wonder if it was really necessary, but we can easily see O-Chul dumping whoever we put on his back in a situation much like the one Belkar faced. We don't expect O-Chul to be thrilled about being tossed to the MitD, but by what we know, he will be accepting of that.



it seems that whatever spell the MitD used allows the targets to pick their destination?
There are several possibilities. One that does not seem to be mentioned is that the choice was somehow made by V. She was the one who knew about the island and the presence of party and paladins there. A model might be: MitD casts the escape spell, which has open-ended destination. O-Chul has no clear destination in mind. [He doesn't know if Hinjo is alive.] V by contrast does have a clear destination, and so might be the source of that choice.



take responsibility for Miko's actions --
As he said, he tried to destroy the gate, and was definitely an aid in having it destroyed. He really needs a good lawyer [or the sympathetic jury he would get around here] if he wants to argue he was totally good and virtue and she was entirely wrong and sinful.



Apparently O-Chul is a lawyer in his spare time - he's evaded the question without technically lying to his lord.
More precisely, he has put the point off to later. Right now, there are more immediate concerns and the question of who deserves what credit or blame can be delayed. Presumably O-Chul will report in full off-camera.
Which is the big concern. O-Chul's report is likely to be rather dull, and we want all that sort of stuff off camera.
An excuse that might apply here would be that O-Chul has seen Haley & Elan approaching, and Miko is paladin business, not to be discussed casually with outsiders.



Haley and Celia know. The cleric told them in Greysky.
Several people know partly. Nobody in the party knows everything.

Roy is the only one who currently remembers that Belkar killed the Oracle. But his memory may not survive his revival. Roy seems to have been upstairs watching his girlfriend while Belkar was having his curse removed.
Haley and Celia know Belkar did something wrong at the Oracle's, but not what. They were not present when Belkar got the curse removed, and the cleric left without telling them. [Belkar of course may have told them, but he may have lied, or may not have been believed.]
Belkar knows the cleric removed the curse, but doesn't know what triggered it.

[Poit-Narf]

I whould lauge if the MitD crawls out of the box and we see an
http://tbn2.google.com/images?q=tbn:avuuo8YyTsVNrM:http://www.rreynoso.com/blog

or
http://tbn3.google.com/images?q=tbn:xlYzOQbplixkqM:http://www.welt.de/multimedia/archive/00260/teletubbies_DW_Verm_260780g.jpg

But please only as an joke^^
MitD the most fearfull "monster" is a Teletubby ;-)

It's been seen before...

http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0397.html

[wootage]

Any comments about teleport location. The spot is safe. But how would a MITD know this spot? Or thats what wish would do?

possibly the MitD imagined O-Chul safe with friends?

[Megido]

Roy is the only one who currently remembers that Belkar killed the Oracle. But his memory may not survive his revival. Roy seems to have been upstairs watching his girlfriend while Belkar was having his curse removed.
Haley and Celia know Belkar did something wrong at the Oracle's, but not what. They were not present when Belkar got the curse removed, and the cleric left without telling them. [Belkar of course may have told them, but he may have lied, or may not have been believed.]
Belkar knows the cleric removed the curse, but doesn't know what triggered it.

Well what Celia and Haley do know from the Cleric is that the Mark was triggered at some point and that it made Belkar really sick.
Considering his fine condition shortly afterwards, they might've assumed he removed the curse after all

[Kaytara]

From a story view, he has just been a way to do things. If O-Chul left the story to become an off-screen bureaucrat, we would not notice the hole he left. No real questions about loose ends or how things will develop. We need somebody to lay down the smack? Belkar and Roy can do that fine. Miko here would have been tremendously superior in developing story and plot.

I am curious, what do you mean by that? Could you elaborate? In what way would Miko have been better in developing story and plot, and why?

[Bastian]

Also, I don't want people to think that I'm horribly bothered by this... just explaining what I mean. That, and wondering if Rich has done this intentionally.

I am not bothered by this, actually.

It's not how eloquently you write.
It's not your in-depth psychological analysis.
It's not even my being in agreement with you.

It's the fact that...I just realized...you'll never love me as you love Vaarsuvius. :smallfrown::smallfrown:

[Shatteredtower]

Shatteredtower, I wouldn't dismiss the idea of O-Chul being a possible Mary Sue just like that.

I would. He's an NPC in a comic based on a game in which Mary Sue is often a synonym for PC.

As for David Argall's assessment, that's even funnier.

[Thoughtbot360]

Stupid O-Chul, taking credit for Miko's kill :biggrin:

[Porthos]

I am curious, what do you mean by that? Could you elaborate? In what way would Miko have been better in developing story and plot, and why?

It's nothing more than David's never-ending crush on Miko. :smalltongue:

Snarky? Moi? Surely you jest. :smalltongue:

[Invisible Queen]

Is O-Chul's middle name Galahad? He's the most ridiculously Perfect Knight I've seen. Passing on the chance to spill the truth about the most whacked-out screw-up she-dog in all the planes, because he realizes it really doesn't matter if people know how she failed? He's a living saint! I'm jealous.

Also, I must rely to you a conversation I had about his use of the word "debrief". I suggested that using "brief" instead, as in "I must brief you" would have been satisfactory and less convoluted, to which the response was "He's talking about his clothes."


:sabine:

[Red XIV]

Roy seems to have been upstairs watching his girlfriend while Belkar was having his curse removed.
But he saw Belkar show up without the curse incapacitating him after that, so Roy knows it's been removed.

[kinai]

At first I thought that O-chul have lied, but I checked it and he said only the truth. He made that decision and his blade did the deed. But, why did he say it that way? He could say that Miko destroyed it. I don't think that he wants the recognition, so then why? After it, he added: "lest I speak ill of the dead". So O-chul thought that if he said the straight truth it is going to be speak ill of the dead (Miko), why? The only explanation would be that O-chul knew that the ghosts were going to kill the Redcloack and Xykon, but he couldn't know it. :smallconfused: He was paralized and looking the other way. :smallconfused:

Kinai.

[Porthos]

The only explanation would be that O-chul knew that the ghosts were going to kill the Redcloack and Xykon, but he couldn't know it. :smallconfused: He was paralized and looking the other way. :smallconfused:

Kinai.

He could hear Lord Soon's speech easily enuf, along with Xykon screaming at the top of his lungs negative-energy-powered-speech that Team Evil needed to get out of there, stat.

[berrew]

At first I thought that O-chul have lied, but I checked it and he said only the truth. He made that decision and his blade did the deed. But, why did he say it that way? He could say that Miko destroyed it. I don't think that he wants the recognition, so then why? After it, he added: "lest I speak ill of the dead". So O-chul thought that if he said the straight truth it is going to be speak ill of the dead (Miko), why? The only explanation would be that O-chul knew that the ghosts were going to kill the Redcloack and Xykon, but he couldn't know it. :smallconfused: He was paralized and looking the other way. :smallconfused:

Kinai.
His ears still functioned - and from what Xykon was saying, it was pretty clearly the end for Team Evil.

Edit: Err, what Porthos said. Yeah, that.

[motub]

Outside the government, beyond the police. Tracking down alien life on earth... oh, wait, toUchwood. My bad.
Thank you for making me laugh :smallbiggrin:.

[Kaytara]

I am not bothered by this, actually.

It's not how eloquently you write.
It's not your in-depth psychological analysis.
It's not even my being in agreement with you.

It's the fact that...I just realized...you'll never love me as you love Vaarsuvius. :smallfrown::smallfrown:
Well, for one thing, you're not a literary character. :smalltongue: That's a great deal; I'd probably instantly hate Vaarsuvius if he were a real person in real life, but I can really appreciate him as a well written and thought out complex character.


I would. He's an NPC in a comic based on a game in which Mary Sue is often a synonym for PC.
.

That seems like a strange claim. "Mary Sue" is more of a literary term associated with stories, after all, while many DnD games do not have deep stories at all. So it's odd to say that Mary Sue equals PC in DnD.... Besides, from what I've heard, Mary Sues in DnD sessions tend to be DM-NPCs and NOT PCs, because the former are literally favoured by the active powers in that universe, namely the DM.

Besides, Order of the Stick is based on that game, but it is a story, so a character being an NPC does not preclude him being a Mary Sue. (I am not trying to prove that O-Chul is a Mary Sue in a roundabout way like this, by the way, I already said that I disagree with that notion. Just musing.) For example, if O-Chul actually joined the Order as a tag-along the way Celia did, and then promptly proceeded to inspire Haley to stop her thievish ways and Belkar to finally appreciate the cuteness of unharmed innocents, all while teaching Elan to focus his mind and become more intelligent... then we'd be in Mary Sue territory, and it wouldn't mean jack that O-Chul is technically an NPC.

Furthermore, the "Mary Sue=PC" rule you mentioned does not seem to apply in this universe, since the only confirmed PCs are the Order. Unless you're arguing that they are Mary Sues?

[Skaarg]

Lots of monsters can use Wish as a SLA, at least 5 in the first 3.5 Monster Manual that I can think of (1 demons, 1 devil, 1 archon, 2 jinn).

Given the number of other books including monsters with SLA wish it doesn't tell us all that much. Earthquake is probably a better thing to look for.

True. The only possible culprit in MM1 v. 3.5 that has both Wish and Earthquake (that I've found) is the Solar. Now, there may be something from a later book that could be an option, but I think the Giant won't be too obscure, as he said that he has given clues and that people won't respond with "what's that?" This is why I think a lot of the guesses are way off base. A Pit Fiend is possible, as is a Solar,but the suggestions of third party stuff (I saw someone suggest Zodar and I had no idea what the heck that even was until I looked it up) I think is likely flat wrong, as is (as I think most people have come to the conclusion of already) homebrew stuff like a baby Snarl.

[Red XIV]

At first I thought that O-chul have lied, but I checked it and he said only the truth. He made that decision and his blade did the deed. But, why did he say it that way? He could say that Miko destroyed it. I don't think that he wants the recognition, so then why? After it, he added: "lest I speak ill of the dead". So O-chul thought that if he said the straight truth it is going to be speak ill of the dead (Miko), why? The only explanation would be that O-chul knew that the ghosts were going to kill the Redcloack and Xykon, but he couldn't know it. :smallconfused: He was paralized and looking the other way. :smallconfused:

Kinai.
O-Chul is clearly aware of what happened while he was paralyzed in the throne room. That's how he knew Redcloak's holy symbol was also Xykon's phylactery. If he heard that part of Soon and Xykon's conversation, then he obviously knew the battle was going badly for Team Evil and thus was aware that Miko screwed up by destroying the Gate.

[Skaarg]

And I'm wondering why Haley and Elan don't ask about Xykon. I mean, V promises to kill Xykon and be back soon, teleports away, and returns after a short time with O-Chul, who reports that he has been a prisoner in Azure City. OK, V is paralyzed, but nevertheless a logical conclusion would be that V has somehow won the fight, freed O-Chul and teleported both of them back. O-Chul himself says nothing contradicting that theory ...

Just imagine, if we hadn't seen the strips in between, what theories and questions would flood the forums :smallwink:

True, but then we knew how powerful V was. The OotS knew V was able to do some things they hadn't seen him or her do before, but that's a far bit from saying that V will be able to take on Xykon alone. They are used to the idea that Xykon is a supremely powerful enemy, but none of them have any idea that V was (for a short while) the most powerful arcane spellcaster in the world (with crappy skill bonuses and hit points to be sure).

[Selene]

Also, I must rely to you a conversation I had about his use of the word "debrief". I suggested that using "brief" instead, as in "I must brief you" would have been satisfactory and less convoluted, to which the response was "He's talking about his clothes."

Debrief is what Hinjo is going to do, though.

de⋅brief
  /diˈbrif/ Show Spelled Pronunciation [dee-breef] Show IPA
–verb (used with object)
1. to interrogate (a soldier, astronaut, diplomat, etc.) on return from a mission in order to assess the conduct and results of the mission.
2. to question formally and systematically in order to obtain useful intelligence or information: Political and economic experts routinely debrief important defectors about conditions in their home country.
3. to subject to prohibitions against revealing or discussing classified information, as upon separation from a position of military or political sensitivity.
4. Psychology. (after an experiment) to disclose to the subject the purpose of the experiment and any reasons for deception or manipulation.


brief
  /brif/ Show Spelled Pronunciation [breef] Show IPA
–verb (used with object)
14. to make an abstract or summary of.
15. to instruct by a brief or briefing: They brief all the agents before assigning them.
16. Law. to retain as advocate in a suit.

[mec]

Also, I must rely to you a conversation I had about his use of the word "debrief". I suggested that using "brief" instead, as in "I must brief you" would have been satisfactory and less convoluted, to which the response was "He's talking about his clothes."

Wow!

For hundreds of comics, O-Chul has been wearing only a pair of briefs. However, he carries himself with so much dignity that I didn't even notice the double-entendre in panel 8 until you pointed it out.

"Lord Hinjo, I suggest you debrief me immediately."

[Bastian]

Well, for one thing, you're not a literary character. :smalltongue: That's a great deal; I'd probably instantly hate Vaarsuvius if he were a real person in real life, but I can really appreciate him as a well written and thought out complex character.




For your information, I am actually named after a literary character. Ideated by a compatriot of yours, nothing less. :smallwink: I mean, that must surely have some value within your framework for evaluation?

Anyway, while I do appreciate your kind attempt to protect my feelings, we both know what's wrong in me, and the real reason why I will never live up to V. Time for me to acknowledge defeat.

It's my... gender, am I right? It's too...defined. I know.

Twelve Gods know I tried, but I failed to reach even metrosexual status, let alone V-ness.

[mec]

Does anyone else think that O-Chul is an extremely cold thinker here?

Actually, no. I don't think he's being anywhere cold enough.

All of us readers have read Comic 662 where Xykon sets forth his plan of searching for this phylactery and then teleporting to the next gate. However, O-Chul and Vaarsuvius know none of this. (In fact, if the teleport is instantaneous, the action of 663 takes place at the same time, or perhaps even before, 662. Tsukiko and Redlock have both returned to the throne room in 662, but 663 starts with the teleport ending).

As far as O-Chul and V know: Xykon's last words were "Meteor -" and his last words before that were "I am officially DONE WITH THIS. I'm snuffing you sickening pouches of warm goo right now."

And a few comics before that, Xykon gave a big speech about V's attack being a personal challenge, "That needs to be met by all means at my disposal".

Again, as far as O-Chul and V know: a raging pissed-off epic lich is likely to follow them in about 15 seconds.

Just image that you don't know anything that happened in 662, and evaluate the chances that Xykon will follow them.

O-Chul should be raising an alarm and grabbing a weapon, and everybody in the Azurites and OOTS should be getting ready for the arrival of Xykon.

[DreadArchon]

Am I the only one who thinks that bit of cleavage Lien is always displaying is really freaking hot?

Or maybe I just have a thing for blue-haired girls.
Let's just say that I like Lien a lot and leave it at that. :smalltongue:

[Almaseti]

Great comic. O and V dropping on Hinjo like that made me chuckle. Hinjo looked like he was going to hug O-Chul for a panel there. I kinda wish he had. Then I could have made better jokes about what kind of "debriefing" O-Chul wanted Hinjo to do. (hurr, hurr)

Aaaaaaanyway. I honestly thought V and O-Chul were going to be sent off to some completely random location, talking thing over, and O-Chul helping V get a better perspective on what just happened. As it is, I'm very interested in precisely how this will play out with the rest of the order, and who will know how much about the Splice. If the popular theory about the "debt" being paid back while V is alive is true, those details could be vital.

[kinai]

O-Chul is clearly aware of what happened while he was paralyzed in the throne room. That's how he knew Redcloak's holy symbol was also Xykon's phylactery. If he heard that part of Soon and Xykon's conversation, then he obviously knew the battle was going badly for Team Evil and thus was aware that Miko screwed up by destroying the Gate.

Personally I think that Miko thought that she was doing the right thing. The question must be, did Miko know that Xykon and Redcloack was losing?

Kinai.

P.S: I have to admit that I like faulty characters.

[JessiTsuki]

I think my mind stuck on the part where O-Chul said "debrief me" and he's wearing nothing but his underwear.

[AyuVince]

Thank you for making me laugh :smallbiggrin:.

You're welcome.

Now, all you people who complain about O-chul being a Mary Sue character seem to forget one thing: Mary Sues are rarely popular with the audience. In fact, most of the time the fans hate a Mary Sue. But O-chul is immensely popular. Partly because he is a bad mofo in the spirit of Chuck Norris or Jack Bauer. But also because he is virtuous and intelligent - the anti-Miko, so to speak.

And concerning his combat abilities: it's not like he has slain an entire goblin bataillon on his own - his martial prowess has so far been limited to the ability to withstand massive amounts of punishment (surviving the castle explosion was probably his greatest feat). His endurance mirrors the Azurite spirit in some way. With Shojo dead and Hinjo being fairly inexperienced as a leader, the Azure City refugees could use a champion to look up to.

[Janmorel]

I don't think it is a coincidence that O-Chul ended up on the same island as Mr. Flopsy (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0475.html) (Roy). Why wouldn't the MitD send one of his friends to be with the other of his friends?

This is my favorite explanation of the Wish so far. I kind of want there to be a big meeting with the Blue Crew and the OotS now, with tea and snacks, just for the tea party deja vu moment.

As for V being ignored -- it looks like Elan was headed for V in panel 6, and he only starts paying attention to O-Chul when he starts spouting Famous Last Words in panel 9. There's no reason not to think that Elan was tending to V before that. As far as I'm concerned, Haley gets a pass for focusing on O-Chul because she's been blaming herself for his death for the last few months. It would be like if a bunch of the doomed no-name soldiers V's been flogging hirself with mysteriously fell unharmed from the sky.

Elan's got a point, O-Chul. You might as well say that you're going to marry a round American woman and raise rabbits.

[holywhippet]

Haley would be more interested to see that O-Chul is back than V. V only left a few minutes ago at best. Haley still feels guilty that O-Chul was left for dead with the MitD however so she feel very relieved that he is alive and more or less well.

For Hinjo healing O-Chul back to full health, notice that his position seems to change from the previous panel? It's possible he's been casting a series of cure spells to fix his damage up.

V must be suffering some servere penalties from lack of rest/soul splice withdrawal/depression over getting whupped. He/she gets a will save every round from the hold spell and should have some hefty bonuses from being an elf and a wizard.

[veti]

Again, as far as O-Chul and V know: a raging pissed-off epic lich is likely to follow them in about 15 seconds.

Just image that you don't know anything that happened in 662, and evaluate the chances that Xykon will follow them.

O-Chul should be raising an alarm and grabbing a weapon, and everybody in the Azurites and OOTS should be getting ready for the arrival of Xykon.

But one of the last things Xykon said was a whine about how damn' hard it was going to be to find his phylactery - with the clear implication that he (a) regarded finding it as a very high priority, and (b) expected it to take a while. O-Chul may reasonably be banking on that search to keep the RPOEL off their backs for a while.

[Rotipher]

The Oracle is a tricksy little bugger, and it would be just like him to dismiss Roy's ghost, knowing he'd have the delight of remembering stuff he shouldn't but also knowing he wouldn't ultimately remember it when it mattered.

Except that Roy could have told Eugene everything he'd learned at the Oracle's, when they met on the doorstep to Celestia. This means it needn't be that big a deal if Roy forgets stuff when he's revived, because his dad's ghost -- who wants Xykon destroyed as much as anyone -- can bring his son up to speed on the details.

[R. Shackleford]

I'm still not sure why O'Chul covered for Miko. No angle I look at it from makes sense.

[ResplendentFire]

Miko's dead. Publicly lambasting her at this point would serve what purpose? She's already suffered.

[Calmness]

I'm still not sure why O'Chul covered for Miko. No angle I look at it from makes sense.

Respect for the dead, maybe? Perhaps he admired her warrior skills and devotion to her Gods? Miko was a great Paladin in many aspects, and covering up for her isn't that different to speaking well of a close friend who passed away. And who knows, this being D&D there's still a chance her soul is out there, listening.

[holywhippet]

I'm still not sure why O'Chul covered for Miko. No angle I look at it from makes sense.

There's an old saying that "You shouldn't speak ill of the dead". They aren't around to defend themselves against your accusations.

All things considered, he can't exactly fault her for her actions - she did what he was planning to do anyway. Her timing and logic were highly suspect though.

[ColonelFuster]

Now, I could be wrong- but I think, after reading that comic, that The Giant is making fun of a certain group of people.

The people that don't know anything but certain bits of random dramatic cliches, and love to say how they know exactly what's going on, even though they're truly clueless to the complexity of the situation?

That's right.

People who link to TV Tropes.

[Lamech]

Except that Roy could have told Eugene everything he'd learned at the Oracle's, when they met on the doorstep to Celestia. This means it needn't be that big a deal if Roy forgets stuff when he's revived, because his dad's ghost -- who wants Xykon destroyed as much as anyone -- can bring his son up to speed on the details.
But the oracle would know if Roy would tell his father. So if Roy didn't... he's going to get ripped on by his father for not spilling his guts.:smallamused: Which would be pretty funny revenge.

[dps]

O and V dropping on Hinjo like that made me chuckle.

Well, that they would end up back on the island that V had Mass Teleported the Azurites and the OotS to would have been a good guess as to where they would go, but I certainly didn't expect them to land directly on top of another character, unless the phlumphs (sp?--the white tenacly things) made another appearance.


EDIT: And BTW, I'm not completely convinced that the MitD is the one who teleported V and O-Chul out, though I have no idea who else it could have been.

[Dr. Cthulwho]

I'm still not sure why O'Chul covered for Miko. No angle I look at it from makes sense.

Well while there is no explicit rule that says a lawful good character can't be critical of someone who is dead what would it achieve?

Miko was wrong, made a mistake, and only O-Chul knows that. Of course a few moments before O-Chul himself was about to do exactly what Miko did. Perhaps Miko said something to him when she took his sword "I can see what you were trying to do, don't worry, I will complete the task".

In the end the past is past, nothing is going to change it and O-Chul is glad to be free and reunited with Hinjo and Lien. Why spoil that by telling Hinjo that the fallen paladin that killed his uncle also played a major, though misguided, role in the ultimate fall of Azure City?

[shazza95]

Well, that they would end up back on the island that V had Mass Teleported the Azurites and the OotS to would have been a good guess as to where they would go, but I certainly didn't expect them to land directly on top of another character, unless the phlumphs (sp?--the white tenacly things) made another appearance.


EDIT: And BTW, I'm not completely convinced that the MitD is the one who teleported V and O-Chul out, though I have no idea who else it could have been.

speaking of the tentacly thingies, i've always kind of felt sorry fo them.
thats not to say they're not hilarious when they get squished!

[Tobimaro]

I suspect that, if anything, O-chul will only want to reveal what all happened in Azure City to Hinjo in private, if at all. He does have valuable intelligence of what has happened to Team Evil, but I feel that he will only want to talk to his lord, if only because he is worried about spies. After all, he (if anyone) is aware of ninja spies.

And the Order is almost back together. (This is the longest 10 minutes I have ever experienced.) :smallamused:

[gamephil]

Now, I could be wrong

Considering that the author regularly pokes affectionate fun at tropes, TV or otherwise, that he unashamedly uses, and that Elan has used that exact same kind of logic and been absolutely correct and totally wrong at different times, I'm almost sure you are.

Never understood the hate of these links, anyway, except that they did get out of hand. Never saw the linkers saying they had special insight, they were just having fun in their own way. The only thing I dislike is people who insist on insulting others for having harmless fun. But, again, to each their own.

[The_Weirdo]

I think it's fine that V is ignored. V is not a team player, so now that V is back, the team is like, "Oh. Whatevs."

Eventually, they will all wander off excitedly chatting, and V will be there on the ground, alone. Durkon will walk up & cast Remove Paralysis. V will be like, "WTF? I do all this stuff and they basically ignore me."

And Durkon will say, "You're not exactly a team player."

V will sit there stunned for a moment, and let that sink in. And thus V's metamorphosis will be complete.

They're an adventuring party, not the middle-management of a company.

[NakedCelt]

Is this a good time to point out that Roy has now been dead for very nearly exactly one-third of the strip?

[Geigan]

That's the problem with pointing out dramatic timing, tension, or irony. If you can see it coming and say it out loud before hand then it has very little chance of happening. Which in this is case is a good thing since O-chul is awesome and I don't wnat anything to happen to him(If the man can wrestle a shark in a vat of acid then he deserves a rest at the very least). So in this case go Elan!:elan:

[plipsig]

Is this a good time to point out that Roy has now been dead for very nearly exactly one-third of the strip?

Well actually, Roy was advised by his personal accountant to remain dead this long for tax purposes...

[Xentropy]

I think the comic is overdue for pointing out a major flaw in O'chul. Mostly because I'm sick of people calling him perfect. Nobody's perfect. We just don't know something about him that'd horrify us.

[oball]

Maybe he's a furry.

[Kobal]

Maybe I missed something, but how did Haley get to the island? Last time we have seen her she was in Greysky city, and her planned means of transport (teleport by V) became unavailable.

[Azura]

Maybe I missed something, but how did Haley get to the island? Last time we have seen her she was in Greysky city, and her planned means of transport (teleport by V) became unavailable.

V teleported the whole Order to the island in this strip. (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0649.html)

[pjackson]

But since the fact of Belkar's parole was meant to be a secret (remember that Eugene was posing as Belkar to fool the guards),

That wasn't Eugene himself. It was a programmed illusion created by Eugene. which is why the comments were generic.

[Raging Gene Ray]

I think the comic is overdue for pointing out a major flaw in O'chul. Mostly because I'm sick of people calling him perfect. Nobody's perfect. We just don't know something about him that'd horrify us.

O-Chul probably wasn't born perfect. He probably has led a life full of trial and error that let him recognize his flaws and act accordingly. I'd like to see something about that sort of past, but it seems something that would either be Bonus Material in a compilation or a Prequel.

[Rhuna_Coppermane]

I'd congratulate you, but luckily I saw the age was 30 in time :smallbiggrin:

Pah. Just an egg. (I'm 45. Back in my day....)

And yay for the Order being almost back together! Next comic, Roy will be alive again? Will Roy still remember that Belkar killed the Oracle?

[AyuVince]

V teleported the whole Order to the island in this strip. (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0649.html)

V could teleport because ze was spliced to a wizard who had mastered teleport spells. Without Jephton, V can't teleport, as teleportation spells belong to zir banned school.


As for O-chul's dark secret... maybe he is a Jonas Brothers fan? :smallbiggrin:

[RMS Oceanic]

V could teleport because ze was spliced to a wizard who had mastered teleport spells. Without Jephton, V can't teleport, as teleportation spells belong to zir banned school.


Um, Azura was simply explaining that Haley was already on Azure Island, and not still in Greysky like Kobal believed.

[Scarlet Knight]

They're an adventuring party, not the middle-management of a company.

"I'm sorry. Due to the economy & some bad contracts, our gold piece intake is way down. We're going to have to let the bard go...which has NOTHING to do with the fact that he is sleeping with the party's second in command. The gender-changing , sleeping with a sylph, using up party diamond resources leader will stay, and get a bonus because, well, he's the boss."

:smallamused: