Does V really owe ~90 mins to the fiends?

[[TS] Shadow]

If you think about it, Haerta left about 2 mins into the splice. Shouldn't V only owe them ~62 minutes instead of the full 90?

[RMS Oceanic]

How did you conclude V has spent 30 minutes under one given splice?

[Bibliomancer]

I was under the impression that the common figure of 30 minutes referred to total time owed, not time elapsed since the splice started.

[NerfTW]

It hasn't even been 10 minutes. Maybe 2 minutes TOPS.

Wooooow. I just totally forgot everything that happened before the Xykon fight. :smalltongue:

Since it was at 19 minutes when V teleported out, it can't be more than 20-22 minutes total.


How did you conclude V has spent 30 minutes under one given splice?

One of the splices states the time when V mentions his/her debt to Haley.

[Bibliomancer]

Whoops, I underestimated the time. 30 minutes (meaning around 62 minutes owed) still seems a bit high. I agree with NerfTW that only 22 odd minutes have passed. V probably only waited a few rounds into Durkon casting Resurrection before teleporting away.

[[TS] Shadow]

The 30 mins was just an estimate; I have no clue how long they've actually have been there. Now I'd like an answer to my question, please. ;)

[Bibliomancer]

Taking this into account, yes, V only owes twice long time interval plus short time interval. This amounts to roughly 48 minutes by my estimation (23x2+2).

[Yucca]

Comic 633 agrees with you. Each fiend get V's soul for the amount of time that V was under their Splice.

The fiend that contributed Haerta get V for much less time that the other two.

The total amount of time V owes depends whether or not you think the 19:21 mentioned in 650 is a total amount of time V has had the Splice, or the total combined debt V owes.

I'd argue the former. So assuming the scene from the time V got the Splice to losing the first soul was about 5 min. And assuming the scene with Xykon took 5 min, V owes 5+24+24 = 53 min in total.

Exact order of custody to be determined at a later point.

[David Argall]

Now we have to be careful since we do not have the exact wordage of the deal and we can expect the fiends to use the meaning most favorable to them. But a time a little above 45 minutes is likely about right.

[rxmd]

Is this relevant?

[Atelm]

Is this relevant?

It certainly might come into play later on in the comic. Say, the fiends control over V, whenever they decide to take it, runs just short of completing whatever it is that they are planning?

[rxmd]

It certainly might come into play later on in the comic. Say, the fiends control over V, whenever they decide to take it, runs just short of completing whatever it is that they are planning?
Yeah, but there is no clock running in the comic. It doesn't matter whether that would actually happen at 30, just over 45 or 90 minutes. It's either sufficient for the finds, or it's not, and the precise number is irrelevant.

[[TS] Shadow]

Yeah, but there is no clock running in the comic. It doesn't matter whether that would actually happen at 30, just over 45 or 90 minutes. It's either sufficient for the finds, or it's not, and the precise number is irrelevant.

Being honest, I don't care about the precise number. I just want to know if whoever offered Haerta would have V's soul for the entire duration of the splice or just the amount of time Haerta was still affecting V.

[SteveMB]

Now we have to be careful since we do not have the exact wordage of the deal

Yes, we do (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0633.html). The wording says that each of them gets V's services for the same amount of time V was under their Soul Splice (emphasis added).

[Optimystik]

Now we have to be careful since we do not have the exact wordage of the deal and we can expect the fiends to use the meaning most favorable to them. But a time a little above 45 minutes is likely about right.

We do have some wording... in #633, Purple (Nero?) says "Each one of us will get your soul for the same amount of time that you are under the effects of their Soul Splice." The use of their is important because it indicates that each soul has its own timer. Since he provided Haerta, he will have V's soul for the least amount of time.

If it were me, I would have worded that differently to get the full 60 minutes, by claiming that the splice was an agreement made with the IFCC as a unit, rather than having been made with each individual fiend. Therefore, as long as at least one soul remained tied to V, the splice as a whole would have remained in existence. That wording would then be supported by the fact that V established the connection with all three souls by only taking one action - namely, touching the blue orb.

But then, as far as fiends go these guys seem pretty tame to me...

EDIT: Curse you, Playground ninjas!

[Elderac]

*Comment withdrawn after further consideration.*

[SadisticFishing]

"Each one of us will get your soul for the same amount of time that you are under the effects of their Soul Splice."

Except that line, which says EXACTLY that...

[Snake-Aes]

How did you conclude V has spent 30 minutes under one given splice?

V started the battle with Xykon almost with 20 minutes in the clock, and you can easily say at least 5 minutes passed. There was time for V and Xykon beat themselves a little, then a minute later Tsukiko arrived tipping the balance against the splice, then there was a few rounds of evil tastyness and Redcloak turning and losing his eye. At this point, how much time should have passed?

[Optimystik]

V started the battle with Xykon almost with 20 minutes in the clock, and you can easily say at least 5 minutes passed. There was time for V and Xykon beat themselves a little, then a minute later Tsukiko arrived tipping the balance against the splice, then there was a few rounds of evil tastyness and Redcloak turning and losing his eye. At this point, how much time should have passed?

I count 10 rounds. (Each of Xykon's metamagic uses is a full-round action until we know if he has RMM or not.)

1) [Surprise round] V appears. Time Stop (interrupted), Quickened Chain Lightning
2) Banter. Energy Drain. True Seeing from RC
3) Empowered Sunburst. Quickened Dimensional Anchor.
4) Maximized Energy Drain.
5) Bixby's Crushing Hand.
6) Still Meteor Swarm. Tsukiko arrives.
7) Mind Fog from T. Disintegrate
8) Banter, Counterspell
9) Superb Dispelling.
10) Slam Attack with rubble. Splices exit.

Keeping in mind that a couple of those could have happened in the same round (Bixby + Meteor Swarm, for instance) I'm looking at the entire battle lasting 1 minute, tops. 2 with a stretch. 5 is far too long.

[Zorack]

http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0633.html

I welcome you to read this again.

[fangthane]

Hmm, I'd missed the "19 minutes and counting" bit. If that's the time since the splice started V had roughly 42-51 minutes of total debt at that point, including 2-11 minutes for Haerta; otherwise it can be presumed to be the total including 2-6 minutes for Haerta's splice*. After all, we don't know what mitigating factors she used to develop Familicide, and it could have a cast time up to 10 minutes (more is unlikely as it starts getting into days to cast, and V doesn't seem that patient)

I'd compress Opti's timeline a bit too.
R1 - 1
R2 - 2/3
R3 - 4/5
R4 - 6/7/8
R5 - 9 (and 9a, V commenting on all the prep spells dropping)
R6 - 10

So yeah, I'd say your estimate of about a minute has to be pretty much spot on. If everything could, mechanically, have fit into 36 seconds, it makes sense that even with some delays for Redcloak to work things out, a minute is pretty much the utmost duration it could have taken.

V owes at least 21 minutes total (19:41 as total owing), and potentially as much as about 52-53 minutes total (19:41 showing on the meter).

*Haerta's time consists of roughly a minute of prep/fighting, including rounds during which time was stopped, plus 1-10 minutes for Familicide, but if 19:41 is the total then no more than 6 minutes can be Haerta's, as the others also accrue time owing during that interval

[NerfTW]

Agreed. Just reading the comic shows no more than a minute or two passed, since the characters are speaking one long conversation the whole time. There's simply no room for an extra 3+ minutes of fight time off camera.