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View Full Version : Help! My party keeps killing me! - part two: Sweet revenge



Kyselina
2009-06-21, 12:12 PM
Hello again, I think that I need help from the mighty D&D players of this forum. Many helped me in the last thread, but now, this is special.

We were playing, happily, no killing. A new player joined in, fine (barbarian half orc). Then some two friends of the DM came and he gave them NPCs to play. One played my genie, the other played the NPC which loved beer (the drunk that helps us). So, the genie turned against me (the player did it so), then the drunk, then the cleric and so I got killed (in short). Now, I start on level 4. I need YOU to help me create an ultra-strong character! All 3.0 and 3.5 rulebooks allowed!

Also, the new barbarian got killed by them too.

So far: Level 4, raceless, classless
Stats to assign: 16 14 11 13 16 11 (I was allowed a 3-point manipulation, for example, I will redice the 16 to 13 and can add the 3 points to any of the other numbers. Or reduce the 16 to 14, the 11 to 10 and then assign the 3 points to the other numbers. Whatever I want. The maximum remains 18)

Everyone of the players is at level 6 (probably excluding the drunk):
Elf druid
Elf cleric
Dwarven fighter
Genie

I need YOUR help to make the strongest character to help me beat them all (the genie and the drunk players probably won't be present the next session, which is on tuesday)!

Froogleyboy
2009-06-21, 12:16 PM
be a magic cannon? Max Your INT first, CON 2nd, and build a human Warmage. (From complete arcane). Take improved initiative and improved edge for your feats.

Kroy
2009-06-21, 12:18 PM
Strongest? Play Pun-Pun, of course!

Korivan
2009-06-21, 12:19 PM
Too much TKing, where's the fun if all your group does is scheme and plot at each other...

and for uber strong, its completely up to what the dm lets you get away with...so far, doesnt sound like he lets you have any advantage against a group against 1 (ive read your last posts), so its unlikely that any design given on these threads will work. Even pun-pun is pointless if the dm puts their foot down.

Origomar
2009-06-21, 12:21 PM
be a magic cannon? Max Your INT first, CON 2nd, and build a human Warmage. (From complete arcane). Take improved initiative and improved edge for your feats.

That's kind of hard at level 4.

I saw someone post something that was simple it was like fighter 3/barbarian 1 so you get rage increased movement speed avg is high health and you get a ton of feats.

ex cathedra
2009-06-21, 12:33 PM
Uh. Whirling rage, Lion totem barbarian 1/fighter 2/something. Power attack and charge someone, preferably with something big and two-handed.

Or, make a Psion. Ego whip the ones with low Cha into submission. I wouldn't be surprised if the dwarf has 6-8 charisma.

LordZarth
2009-06-21, 12:40 PM
Look, seriously:

1. If your party keeps killing you, and
2. You don't want this to happen
3. Then your DM should have already dealt with them, but hasn't, so you should
3. Leave the game.

But you don't want to. Honestly, play a cheesed-out character. Play Pun-Pun. Your DM deserves it.

only1doug
2009-06-21, 12:44 PM
Hello again, I think that I need help from the mighty D&D players of this forum. Many helped me in the last thread, but now, this is special.

We were playing, happily, no killing. A new player joined in, fine (barbarian half orc). Then some two friends of the DM came and he gave them NPCs to play. One played my genie, the other played the NPC which loved beer (the drunk that helps us). So, the genie turned against me (the player did it so), then the drunk, then the cleric and so I got killed (in short). Now, I start on level 4. I need YOU to help me create an ultra-strong character! All 3.0 and 3.5 rulebooks allowed!

Also, the new barbarian got killed by them too.

So far: Level 4, raceless, classless
Stats to assign: 16 14 11 13 16 11 (I was allowed a 3-point manipulation, for example, I will redice the 16 to 13 and can add the 3 points to any of the other numbers. Or reduce the 16 to 14, the 11 to 10 and then assign the 3 points to the other numbers. Whatever I want. The maximum remains 18)

Everyone of the players is at level 6 (probably excluding the drunk):
Elf druid
Elf cleric
Dwarven fighter
Genie

I need YOUR help to make the strongest character to help me beat them all (the genie and the drunk players probably won't be present the next session, which is on tuesday)!


OK Then, the party needs a skill monkey (for party balance) this will encourage your fellows to preserve you because they need the help.
Factotum is often lauded as a good choice for skill monkey, other options might be beguiler or rogue. (or others, I don't often make skillmonkeys).

But you might like a bit of combat monkey mixed in for party balance so I'm going to build a Swashbuckler/rogue

Stat alterations:

Original:
16, 16, 14, 13, 11, 11

Altered:
18, 17(18 at L4), 14, 12, 10, 10.

so Int 18 (starting stat for skill points), dex 18(at L4) for AC,

Str: 12
Dex: 18
Con: 14
Int: 18
Wis: 10
Cha: 10

Grey Elf Gives +2 dex , +2 Int, -2 Con, -2 Str
After racial modifiers:

Str: 10
Dex: 20
Con: 12
Int: 20
Wis: 10
Cha: 10

L2 Rogue, L2 Swashbuckler. Next Level take swashbuckler for Int bonus to damage.
(If your GM ignores Multi-class penalties go L1 rogue, L3 swashbuckler)

Option 1: skill points:
(rogue Level First)

6+1d6+2d10 (+4x con bonus) Hp
skillpoints:(8+5)x4, +4+5, +8+5, +4+5
skillpoints:52 +9 +13 +9



Option 2: Hit points:
(Swashbuckler Level First)


10+2d6+1d10 (+4x con bonus) Hp
skillpoints:(4+5)x4, +8+5, +8+5, +4+5
skillpoints:36 +13 +13 +9



I'll continue this later....

Kyselina
2009-06-21, 12:44 PM
Is Pun-Pun some kind of premade character?

Korivan
2009-06-21, 12:47 PM
Is Pun-Pun some kind of premade character?

no, someone out there took the kolbold, and showed that as rules written, how it could transend all balance and senses, however, it requires a willing dm to ever play it

Mando Knight
2009-06-21, 12:49 PM
Is Pun-Pun some kind of premade character?

It's a kobold that cheeses its way into Ultimate Cosmic Power.

Possibly by being a Paladin, taking a couple ranks in Knowledge (the Planes), and calling out to Pazuzu for a Wish that unlocks a certain cheesy chain of permanent stacking buffs (that are open to DM interpretation).

Elhann
2009-06-21, 12:49 PM
Seriously, what's the point? Why did they kill your character this time?

I'd try finding another group, or talk to them out of characterseriously.
If you're determined to screw them, play a bard, or a beguiler. Max diplomacy and bluff. Learn disguise self as a spell.

Once you're in a large town, say you're going shopping. Cast disguise self, and tip a guard that you overheard two elves and a dwarf saying they were going to kill the king (whatever) tonight.

See what your DM does with that information (and remeber you've got max ranks and sinergies up the wazoo in diplomacy and bluff, the tipical guard will believe you. If you manage to squeeze forgery in the mix, you can even write an incriminatory letter to make things worse for your so-called companions).

If the city guard doesn't even lift a finger, your DM is not going to do anything about your friends. Your character is going to get killed once and again, and again, and again... If you think that's fun, go ahead. Else, find a new group.

If they're killed, they need new characters.
If they're captured, go visit them in jail. Let them know that you're not going to spring them, and can rot in jail as far as your're concerned.

Either way, they need new characters, and there's no real reason to keep this PKing campaign: so get this chance to talk out of character, and explain that getting killed every second gaming session is not fun, as they certainly would notice.

Lamech
2009-06-21, 12:55 PM
Pun-pun. This calls for a pun-pun. But only use your power for good ensuring group harmony.

LordZarth
2009-06-21, 12:55 PM
I'm not understanding this situation.

1. I don't understand the killers. What jerks would kill their party member against his will? This is a group game--why are they ruining it? Because they aren't playing D&D if they're doing this.

2. I don't understand you more, though. It seems to me that perhaps you actually want them to kill you. Otherwise, why wouldn't you have told them not to, talked with your DM, or left the group? Why are you seeking revenge in-character?

3. Most of all, however, if you actually don't want them killing you, I don't understand your DM. It's his job to keep the game fun for everyone. That's what D&D is. I can't understand why he hasn't told the players to stop, killed them in-game, or kicked them out of the group.

Pharaoh's Fist
2009-06-21, 12:58 PM
Time for pun pun.

Can't believe I said it.

TengYt
2009-06-21, 12:59 PM
Looks like it's time to derail the game. For your new character, don't even join the party. Stay the hell away from them. Just say you don't have an IC reason to join up with murderous strangers. Play a Commoner and work on farming crops for a living and crafting small wooden items, far away from whatever town the party is in. If the party still decides to hunt you down and kill you, you know it's time to leave.

aivanther
2009-06-21, 01:03 PM
Pun Pun, the level 5 kobold turned Deity with 20,010 stats (http://forums.gleemax.com/showthread.php?t=491801)

There you go, have fun

Pharaoh's Fist
2009-06-21, 01:04 PM
It's a level one build now.

Sinfire Titan
2009-06-21, 01:07 PM
Does your DM enforce XP Penalties? If not, Totemist 2/Barbarian 1/Warblade 1. Shoot for Totemist 4/Barbarian 1/Warblade 1/Totem Rager 10/Bloodclaw Master 2. Shape the Girallon Arms at all times. Watch the carnage unfold. If you can, devote yourself to an Elder Evil and give yourself a reason to kill these guys IC.


Feats:

1st: Expanded Soulmeld Capacity
Flaw 1: Martial Study (Shadow Blade Technique)
Flaw 2: Cobalt Charge (retrain this to Multiattack at 2nd level using either Psychic Reformation or PH2's retraining)
3rd: Cobalt Rage
6th: Free
9th: Martial Stance (Assassin's Stance)
12th: Arterial Strike
15th: Bonus Essentia
18th: Double Chakra (Totem)

Bonus feats if devoted to an Elder Evil:

1st: Chosen of Evil
5th: Evil Brand
10th: Master's Will
15th: Willing Deformity
20th: Willing Deformity (Madness)

If possible, be an Azurin. If you do devote yourself to an Elder Evil, have the Azurin Bonus Feat be Evil's Blessing. If not, Improved Init.


Alternate Class Features:

Lion Totem Barbarian (Complete Champion)
Whirling Frenzy (Unearthed Arcana)


The point behind this build is to 1: Charge, 2: Pounce, 3: Kill. Girallon Arms give you a massive bonus to Grapple checks. Cobalt Rage should have as much Essentia invested in it ass you can afford, while still having enough to max out Girallon Arms. Get the Druid in a grapple ASAP, kill him first. This should be a piece of cake, even at your level and if he Wild Shapes (his grapple cannot be higher than your's, as Totemist have the highest grapple abilities in the game). Remember that grappling gives your enemies a chance to hit the guy you are grappling with each attack they make, so its an amazing tactic for you to use.

Stat priorities

Con: 16
Str: 19
Dex: 14
Int: 13
Cha: 11
Wis: 8

Reallocate 3 points from Wis to Str. It's more important for you. If needed, get Willing Deformity (Madness) ASAP, as it makes you immune to Mind Affecting spells (which cuts out over half of the spells you need to make Will saves against).


If Magic of Incarnum is not allowed, play a Druid. Get a Flesh Raker as your animal companion. The other Druid in the party is clearly not optimized, otherwise his race wouldn't be Elf.

Lycanthromancer
2009-06-21, 01:09 PM
Looks like it's time to derail the game. For your new character, don't even join the party. Stay the hell away from them. Just say you don't have an IC reason to join up with murderous strangers. Play a Commoner and work on farming crops for a living and crafting small wooden items, far away from whatever town the party is in. If the party still decides to hunt you down and kill you, you know it's time to leave.

Morelike, make a character that was a relative/lover/friend of one of the characters they killed (Vow of Peace beguiler, or something), that does not, under any circumstances, want to associate with murderous psychopaths. Make sure you have this discussion in front of the city guard, or something, and tell the party that you'll be doing your best to make their lives a legal hell through proving that they're murderous bastards, and that nobody in the city is safe.

Pay the town guard a nice donation to the city's coffers (or better yet, offer your spellcasting services for free, which is much more valuable) in exchange for some higher-level bodyguards straight from the city watch. Take up residence in the city watch's barracks, and have a handful accompany you at all times. Do your best to find evidence of their wrongdoings, and if they try to attack you, use that as further proof (especially if the city has diviners or seers in their employ, so they can see the murders that transpired).

In short, make their lives difficult, while making it very hard to actually attack you effectively (and without resorting to violence yourself).

aivanther
2009-06-21, 01:10 PM
It's a level one build now.

Really, you have a link? I'd love to see that!

TengYt
2009-06-21, 01:13 PM
Morelike, make a character that was a relative/lover/friend of one of the characters they killed (Vow of Peace beguiler, or something), that does not, under any circumstances, want to associate with murderous psychopaths. Make sure you have this discussion in front of the city guard, or something, and tell the party that you'll be doing your best to make their lives a legal hell through proving that they're murderous bastards, and that nobody in the city is safe.

Pay the town guard a nice donation to the city's coffers (or better yet, offer your spellcasting services for free, which is much more valuable) in exchange for some higher-level bodyguards straight from the city watch. Take up residence in the city watch's barracks, and have a handful accompany you at all times. Do your best to find evidence of their wrongdoings, and if they try to attack you, use that as further proof (especially if the city has diviners or seers in their employ, so they can see the murders that transpired).

In short, make their lives difficult, while making it very hard to actually attack you effectively (and without resorting to violence yourself).

Even better, find a way to detect their alignment. If the DM doesn't rule that murdering multiple comrades shifts them into evil, you know it's a lost cause as it means the DM is against you too. If the DM does rule them as evil alignment, you can have all sorts of fun with this. Put a bounty on their heads and try and hire/persuade some high level adventurers to go hunt them down.

Korivan
2009-06-21, 01:17 PM
I'm going to have to say that this question is about done for. Theres no more to be said, let this thread and all others like it die off, save for those newbies new to the game. In both of your threads, the same exact thing has been said to death. "Play Pun-Pun", "Work out issues out of game", "Find new group". Thats all you can really do, though i warn against in game fighting, all it does is create more anger issues, soon, you'll all be teed off at each other.

I agree with "Lord Zarth", whats the point? Why do you keep coming back? If all you want is revenge, revenge, revenge, then your in the same boat as the people your plotting against. There, I said it. Please take it from someone who's had alot of tking problems back in 2nd edition, its not fun, those that partake in it constantly and dont leave room for other players to have fun, are simply no more than jerks. Trust me, ditching them is going to make the game run alot smoother, and think how much fun you'll have reaching level 8!!!! 10!!!

kamikasei
2009-06-21, 01:22 PM
Show up with a commoner with useless feats like Skill Focus (basketweaving) and so on - total dead weight. When killed (by the others or otherwise - guy's not going to have much survivability) whip out a replacement sheet that's exactly the same except for name and/or level. It's as much effort as the game merits.

Pharaoh's Fist
2009-06-21, 01:23 PM
I can't help but notice the party has very poor reflex saves, and that a Sorcerer at 4th level can cast Web many, many times.

The other second level spell? Alter Self.

Take the Otherworldy feat, and then alter self into a Ravid for flight and a huge NA bonus.


Show up with a commoner with useless feats like Skill Focus (basketweaving) and so on - total dead weight. When killed (by the others or otherwise - guy's not going to have much survivability) whip out a replacement sheet that's exactly the same except for name and/or level. It's as much effort as the game merits.

Or a bard. With fifty spare character sheets.

Captain Alien
2009-06-21, 01:27 PM
I don't see neither how a pointless PVP is actually enjoyable in a standard D&D adventuring campaign, nor I see how could a DM actually enjoy it.

I have only had a similar situation while being a DM. I had three players and they were all new in this game. The first thing the third player did (a first level rogue) was climbing up a tree and start shooting arrows at them (a second level fighter and a second level cleric). They were about to die, so I had to make a Lizardfolk party appear (they were in a swamp and lizardfolk were relevant to the adventure, in fact) to save them, Deus Ex Machina style.

Much later, the barbarian argued with the druid for a stupid helmet whose only actual power was Light 30' radius. He drew his sword, and the druid and his loyal wolf nearly obliterated him. Hell, the druid's player didn't even want the helmet. The barbarian learnt the lesson. But this was much more incidental than the previous fight.

Belive me, your DM will get tired as soon as your party's childish embroilment interrupts his campaign. I would find it odd if your DM does not get tired of it.

Origomar
2009-06-21, 01:34 PM
Meh why don't people just use non lethal damage? Beating the tar out of someone should tell them to leave you alone.

SSGoW
2009-06-21, 01:42 PM
what exactly did you do this time though? did you ask your genie to do something and he said no so you attacked him or somthing? come on there has to be something you are doing! are you a jerk to them out of game or maybe just to the DM and he is setting these killings up as a way to say they dont want you around...

AstralFire
2009-06-21, 01:42 PM
I like the occasional spot of PvP in D&D, but it just seems this is Dungeons and Deathmatches. Why are you still playing with such a massively uneven circumstance?

Kyselina
2009-06-21, 01:44 PM
The DM told me that the genie will obey all my requests. But then the player appeared, and declined all the requests, so I was about to burry the lamp into the ground, then the whole party started arguing about it and everyone wanted him, so killing started. And I wanted to prevent killing :smallconfused:.

Maybe I could just make a completely non-combat character?

Pharaoh's Fist
2009-06-21, 01:45 PM
Haxil
Human Sorcerer 4

Stats:
Str 11
Dex 14
Con 16
Int 13
Wis 11
Cha 17


Feats:
Otherworldy
Versatile Spellcaster
Fell Drain Spell

Spells:

0:
Sonic Snap
Caltrops

1:
Mage Armor
Magic Missile
Grease

2:
Alter Self

Method of Attack: Cast Mage Armor, Shield, Reduce Person and then Alter Self into a Ravid for +15 Natural Armor.

You now have +2 (Dex) +4 (Mage Armor) +4 (Shield) +15 (Natural Armor) = +25 to your armor class. Congratulations, you have an AC of 35.

Sonic Snap is a spell that auto-deals damage, no save, but SR. However, no one has SR.

Fell Drain is a +2 metamagic feat that drains 1 negative level when one of your spells does damage.

Versatile Spellcaster allows you to give up two spells of X spell level to cast one spell of X+1 spell level.

First thing you do when on watch is to Fell Drain Sonic Snap someone to death. It will take four turns, while he wastes actions trying to hit you. Then move on to the next person.

You can Fell Drain Magic Missile people if more people wake up. You get two magic missiles, so it will take you 8 turns to kill everyone with magic missiles.

You can spread caltrops and marbles around people when they're asleep so that they can't move close to you easily. (Marbles require reflex save to stand, kinda like grease)

Adumbration
2009-06-21, 01:46 PM
This is the approximation of the build my friend used at an Arena-style fight to defeat 3 people in a free for all at 5th level; he defeated my swordsage, the DM's wasp-flying fighter, and... actually, I can't remember the third. He had some crazy magic items, anyway.

Take Half-ogre as the base creature. You can find it in Races of Destiny, page 97. Apply Feral template from Savage species. This gives you a total Level Adjustment of +3, so you have 1 class level. Take Barbarian.

This build will garner you:
- +10 Str, +4 Con, +2 Wis, -4 Dex, -6 Int, -2 Cha.
- Natural armor +6
- 2 Claw attacks, 2d6 damage each
- Large size
- Darkvision 60 ft
- Landspeed of 40 ft
- Improved Crab
- Fast heal 2

If you want to go even cheesier, take Goliath as the base creature, and also add Mineral warrior, making it Feral Goliath Mineral Warrior, which is just nasty.

Pharaoh's Fist
2009-06-21, 01:47 PM
Improved Crab
Who'd have thought?

Adumbration
2009-06-21, 01:51 PM
Who'd have thought?

Yes. That Damned Crab. (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=57301)

Kyselina
2009-06-21, 01:52 PM
Interesting. I'll talk with my DM tomorrow, because he may not allow me that though :smalleek:.

Waspinator
2009-06-21, 01:54 PM
You could always go Crusader. If nothing else, they're really hard to kill.

Pharaoh's Fist
2009-06-21, 01:54 PM
Interesting. I'll talk with my DM tomorrow, because he may not allow me that though :smalleek:.

To feth with the fighting, start with the level draining!

Adumbration
2009-06-21, 02:04 PM
Interesting. I'll talk with my DM tomorrow, because he may not allow me that though :smalleek:.

You do realize that the Improved Crab is actually Improved Grab, not that Damned Pseudonatural Crab? :smalltongue:

I know, I know. It's just hard to tell over the internets.

Kyselina
2009-06-21, 02:07 PM
You do realize that the Improved Crab is actually Improved Grab, not that Damned Pseudonatural Crab? :smalltongue:

I know, I know. It's just hard to tell over the internets.

I don't know whether he will allow me to play a monster

Grady
2009-06-21, 02:08 PM
Seconding the "make a commoner" suggestion. Make it clear why you're doing it. If they don't understand by this point, don't show up for your sessions and while you're at it you should probably stop calling these people friends.

Quietus
2009-06-21, 02:21 PM
If you MUST go PvP on them, play a Human Sorcerer.

Stats :
Dex primary, Cha secondary, con tertiary. You're not going to be forcing saves as your primary role. Try and get 14 cha for the bonus second level spell if possible.

Feats :
1st level : Extend Spell
Human : Sudden Maximize
3rd level : Sudden maximize
If you can get flaws, Point Blank Shot will help.

Skills : Max Bluff


Spells :
1st-level; Magic Missile, Grease, Mage Armor
2nd-level; Scorching Ray



The general idea? Best is if you can wait till they're weakened after a fight. Focus on the Druid first, as his companion will be annoying. Sudden Maximize Scorching Ray when you're fairly certain you can tag him with it; That's 24 damage. If he's already damaged, it may be enough to drop him, but otherwise, depending on the situation, follow with another Sudden Maximized Scorching Ray. Make sure you do this now, as opposed to in one more level, when their Resist Energy spells increase to 20 points of protection instead of 10.

As for the Cleric; Extended Grease it. It's probably wearing heavy armor, right? And can't have five cross-class ranks in Balance. This means passing the DC 10 Balance check will be a massive pain in the ass for him. If you got your 14 cha, you now have one second-level spell left; Burn it on burning him with Scorching Ray, then finish things with magic missiles. Walk 30 feet back each turn, and cast; In heavy armor, he won't be able to catch up to you, so the best he can do is waste his healing spells on himself. Lead him toward a town, and when he comes after you, run to the guards and ask for their protection from the madman trying to kill you. Bluff : "I didn't do anything, he's just a murdering psychopath!". This shouldn't be too hard a bluff to pull off.

If, at any point, you can Coup de grace one of them... do it, with a Sudden Maximized Scorching Ray. Even if they don't die outright from 48 points of Scorching Ray to the throat, they're not gonna be too tough to take out following that. After all, they're both d8 hit die classes; Average HP for both should be around 30+6x con, so MAYBE 42.

Gerbah
2009-06-21, 02:22 PM
Though everyone here has a lot better suggestions and such, I'll offer up one that could be fun and should work.

Play a Ninja (Complete Adventurer), basically max all the stealth skills and, yes, wait for them to sleep. The thing the Ninja can do, is Sudden Strike + Coup de Grace someone, then turn invisible (a number of times/day equal to half Ninja level + Wisdom modifier, which is quite a lot). Basically, repeat. I don't know how the Genie works, but invisibility has to count for something. Oh, and you can use poisons too. If you need to run away, well, invisibility again, but you can also consider maxing Jump since Ninja ignore the "have to move 20 ft or DC is doubled" thing.

Heck, if you survive long enough you could level into Assassin/Avenger or some other similar class (Ghost Faced Killer or the like). But yeah, other people have better ideas, but it's an option.

Pharaoh's Fist
2009-06-21, 02:23 PM
Problem, Quietus: There is a dwarven fighter and a genie unaccounted for in your method of attack.

Lawless III
2009-06-21, 02:24 PM
What is the average age of you DnD group? If they're above thirteen and still acting like this, drop them from your speed dial and move on. There is nothing for you here.

If you insist on pissing them off, show up with the commoner character sheets as mentioned before. Every turn switch off between two phrases. "I make rope" and "I dig a whole." Bring extra, premade character sheets (more or less identical to the first) for your inevitable murder. Rinse. Repeat.

Fitz
2009-06-21, 02:39 PM
serious answer : feral anthropomorphic wolverine (played one in an underdark campaign where the DM liked to kill peripheral characters to make the "heros" look cooler....since i was the healer it was pretty fun (con +10 between wolvarine and feral, fast healing, couple of racial hit dice, natural weapons, wisdom con and dex all can be very high...and you look like a vicious bestial monster)

less serious answer : kender....you will get killed, but you will annoy the hell out of them first, it can really make them treasure your characters if they know you can pull something that anoying out

Fitz

Pharaoh's Fist
2009-06-21, 02:46 PM
serious answer : feral anthropomorphic wolverine (played one in an underdark campaign where the DM liked to kill peripheral characters to make the "heros" look cooler....since i was the healer it was pretty fun (con +10 between wolvarine and feral, fast healing, couple of racial hit dice, natural weapons, wisdom con and dex all can be very high...and you look like a vicious bestial monster)

http://xrayvision.today.com/files/2009/05/wolverine-4.gif

Eldariel
2009-06-21, 02:51 PM
If you really just want to kill them, they can be done. Dark Whisper Gnome Anything is practically undetectable to their party; just sneak around and snipe them to death one by one, or just use the tools your class gives you. Wizard could be just fine for example dropping Web and Glitterdust, blinding and disabling the party, then one-by-one disabling and killing them (or just going for face-blow-up). Abrupt Jaunt = Get Out Of Backstab Attempt For Free-card. The Druid may have too good Spot, but probably not; you'll just have massive bonuses that simply outpace skill ranks at this point.

Another decent option, Feral Mineral Warrior Water Orc Whirling Frenzy Barbarian with infi AC, saves, DR and some HP too. Just go to town with charges and break everything. Not too amazing, but sufficient to kill this bunch.

Doc Roc
2009-06-21, 02:52 PM
:: steeples fingers ::

How much power do you want? Really. Think before you answer.

Eld's suggestion is great, and some of the others are fantastic. If you're interested, I'll put up my two-pence. I think this entire endeavor is kinda silly though. Here's my suggestion:

Buy pizza, ask them over, run a session or two of paranoia. Help them get the murder out of their system. Explain to them that you're fine with playing this way, it's just that DnD isn't well-suited to PvP and you'd like to have more fun with your sorrows.

If you're deadset on dnd, I'll loan you my buildomancer.

#Raptor
2009-06-21, 03:01 PM
I'm honestly surprised people still bother.
You were give multiple methods to kill them off regardless of your character. And I'm fairly sure you got about half a dozen builds now, specifically for this one purpose.

I'd usually love to give more plans to 'kill em all', but I just don't feel it anymore. Just kill em and be done with it.
They show up again, you kill them again with by another one of the gazillion methods posted before in the almost 10 pages long thread.
And then you repeat it untill they nuked back are level 1. And once theyr characters have reached level 2 again? You kill em again.

Really, if you still don't know how to kill em, its not because of the lack of plans submitted. Its because you lost track of them.
I'd suggest you read each page of the old thread carefully and copy & paste the different ways to kill em into a word file. Get organized.

Assassin89
2009-06-21, 03:15 PM
I have an interesting idea for revenge

1. Have each member sign a "No party member killing" contract with a neutral third party present.
2. If for any reason your character is killed, a kolyarut (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/inevitable.htm#kolyarut) might appear in a later session.
3. ???
4. Profit

Kyselina
2009-06-21, 03:15 PM
:: steeples fingers ::

How much power do you want? Really. Think before you answer.

Eld's suggestion is great, and some of the others are fantastic. If you're interested, I'll put up my two-pence. I think this entire endeavor is kinda silly though. Here's my suggestion:

Buy pizza, ask them over, run a session or two of paranoia. Help them get the murder out of their system. Explain to them that you're fine with playing this way, it's just that DnD isn't well-suited to PvP and you'd like to have more fun with your sorrows.

If you're deadset on dnd, I'll loan you my buildomancer.

I want to run paranoia but they are not interested :smallfrown:

Pharaoh's Fist
2009-06-21, 03:18 PM
I've done some calculations, and while you can't kill all the other players with the Enervator, getting drained by 2 negative levels is definitely a deterrent to future aggression.

So play nice, but when they start teamkilling, buff up then go to town.

TengYt
2009-06-21, 03:43 PM
Do you actually know why they keep killing you? Did you do something to upset them, or are they just a bunch of jerks? Have you played with them before? Maybe they really dislike "outsiders" or something. Either way, if it was me, I'd be off that table and finding another group by now.

Pharaoh's Fist
2009-06-21, 03:48 PM
Do you actually know why they keep killing you? Did you do something to upset them, or are they just a bunch of jerks? Have you played with them before? Maybe they really dislike "outsiders" or something. Either way, if it was me, I'd be off that table and finding another group by now.

Kill their characters first though.

TengYt
2009-06-21, 03:51 PM
Or at least screw up the game for everyone else. Killing the king or whatever should do that. Got a hostage to save? Kill him. Need to meet an informant? Kill her.

Starbuck_II
2009-06-21, 03:55 PM
http://xrayvision.today.com/files/2009/05/wolverine-4.gif

Wouldn't Feral Totomist or Feral Incarnate fit the character better?

You can shape soulmelds to get claws like wolverine.

Need Magic of Incarnum, but pretty sweet once pull it off.

BlueWizard
2009-06-21, 04:12 PM
I still can't believe your DM allowed the break in character of established PCs. Then made you start at less than their level. They should've been given new PCs. I'd probably refuse to play in that campaign.

Quietus
2009-06-21, 04:21 PM
Problem, Quietus: There is a dwarven fighter and a genie unaccounted for in your method of attack.

Which, unless I was mistaken, he said wouldn't be at the next session. And at the rate this group self-destructs, one session is all this character has.

That being said, this is my last post in this, or any related thread. I'll just get frustrated by it if I continue reading, I think.

SSGoW
2009-06-21, 05:03 PM
its starting to seem like the OP is just using this topic for attention... but never the less i also shall say goodbye since this is getting no where

Myrmex
2009-06-21, 05:25 PM
It's a level one build now.

If your DM lets Pazzuzu give you free wishes, sure.

Lord Blace
2009-06-21, 07:12 PM
Ok, time for something not as great as pun pun, but still amazing.
White dragon spawn kobold sorcerer, taking the draconic right ritual dealy, and lore drake. Buying back your la at lv3.
White dragon spawn- dragon magazine, +4 or 5 natural armor, +1 level sorcerer, +1 LA., changes your type to dragon.
Draconic right ritual dealy - Draconimicon iirc - +1 level of sorcerer, minus some permanent hp
Lore drake - Also Draconomicon iirc - +2 levels of sorcerer.
So you'll end up a lv3 kobold sorcerer who casts like a lv7 sorcerer. :smallbiggrin:

Keld Denar
2009-06-21, 07:35 PM
If you do a Dark Whisper Gnome Wizard with Fell Draining MM, you only need to kill one character. Once you do that, he becomes a Wight. One Wight often kills more people, making them Wights.

So, kill one character, and then fade away. The wight should be able to mop up the others, but you can help it along a bit from out of sight if you need.

ReluctantReaper
2009-06-21, 07:58 PM
Heres and Idea leave and find a new group...not that hard unless you live in the middle of nowhere

NPCMook
2009-06-21, 07:59 PM
Heres and Idea leave and find a new group...not that hard unless you live in the middle of nowhere

100% QFTFT

Pharaoh's Fist
2009-06-21, 08:15 PM
Heres and Idea leave and find a new group...not that hard unless you live in the middle of nowhere

But what if you're like the king of nowhere? You can't just move out of there.

Xuincherguixe
2009-06-21, 08:18 PM
I figure don't play with these guys. But if you're dead set on being petty? Well here's some ideas that are at least fun to think about. And there's not too many times one gets to put them into practice. At least not unless they're doing something wrong.

1) Play a Monk. If they start attacking you? Run away. You've got lots of great saves, so it should be pretty hard to hit you.

2) Hire thugs to kill your team mates. I don't know why anyone hasn't suggested this.

3) When you get a chance? Trap your team mates in spells and buff the monsters.

4) Don't actually do anything.

5) When they attack you, slash open your neck, then break out your next character sheet.

6) Secretly warn the monsters ahead of time that the party is coming, so they can set up ambushes. Best done with a sending spell.

7) When the team is getting sent on an adventure, casually mention how you're all cannibalistic cultists.

8) Refuse to proceed until you've counted all the stone blocks in the room.

9) When it's the first time for you to act? Stand up, leave the room, and walk out the door. Really that's probably the best one here.

10) Hand over all your items. Kill yourself. Get next sheet do it again. And again. And again. This will hopefully confuse them. It also disrupts wealth by level and unbalances the game. Only problem with this is that it's subtle and subtle doesn't work very well for when you're being petty.

11) Bring back your other characters from the dead, and have them team up to kill the party.

12) Open a portal to the far plane and kill the whole multiverse.

13) Poison all your healing potions.

14) Sell your soul to a Balor in exchange for murdering your team mates.

Or, if we go to the logical progression of events...

Plant drugs in their lockers and go tell the principal they have drugs in their lockers. Seem that's the direction this is going to go in.

OverdrivePrime
2009-06-21, 09:18 PM
If you must carry on with this, I'm highly partial to the Beguiler suggestion. The Beguiler is a highly-versatile class that can do a lot to affect the outcome of a battle without actually getting his hands dirty. I'd go with a gnome with maxed Intelligence and Constitution. A gnome is great as a beguiler due to the bonus with illusions that gnomes get.

Beguilers are fairly durable for primary casters - like a bard, you've got d6 hit points and can cast in light armor. Get yourself a mithral chain shirt and a headband of intellect +2 if you're able to.

I'd arrange your stats thusly: 18 14 10 12 17 10
Including the Gnome +2 con -2 strength, I'd make your final 4th level stats this:
Str 10 (12-2), Dex 14, Con 20 (17+2, up from 19 at 4th level), Int 18, Wisdom 10, Charisma 10. You've got skill points for miles, hit points for miles, a decent ranged attack and (with a chain shirt) AC, and none of your stats are giving you penalties.

If, as before, you're desperate to kill your part, it's pretty easy. You've got a big dumb fighter in the party. You've got charm person on your spell list. Bluff is a class skill and you've maxed it out. Life is good. :smallcool:

1. Buy a medium-sized heavy pick (crit x 4).

2. Once you find yourself sufficiently threatened and pissed off by your party members, wait until they're dumb enough to put you on watch.
Cast Charm Person on the fighter. He's sleeping, and will fail his save. Don't wake him up yet.

3. Cast Silent Image on the campground, making your other party members look like large lumps of hard-packed dirt. Remember to maintain concentration on the illusion and have it react as large lumps of dirt should.

4. Wake up your Charmed fighter and hand him your heavy pick. Tell him (bluffing as much as necessary) that a genie came by in the night and buried a magic sword and stash of diamonds under one of the dirt piles but won't tell you which one. You tried to find it, but you're too weak to dig through the dirt. Can he please use his mighty strength to dig apart the dirt piles with his pickaxe?

The fighter is charmed and has no reason to disbelieve you. He'll Coup de Grace the other characters for you. With his strength bonus on a 2 handed x4 crit weapon, the minimum damage he'll be dishing out will be 28, which means the other characters need to make a fort save DC of 38 to not die. Unlikely.

5. Thank the big dumb fighter and tell him to go back to sleep. You'll give him the diamonds and magic sword after your watch once you've cleaned them up.

6. Once he's asleep, cast Hold Person on him. Proceed to coup de grace him with your own heavy pick. Repeat as necessary until he's super dead.

7. Burn your character sheet in front of them, steal their girlfriends and leave town.

sambo.
2009-06-21, 09:58 PM
I need YOUR help to make the strongest character to help me beat them all (the genie and the drunk players probably won't be present the next session, which is on tuesday)!

you cannot build a lvl4 'toon and expect it to take out four lvl6 'toons on it's own.

it's just not going to happen short of major divine intervention (read: a DM who's sick of players killing off other players).

if you really want to build a 'toon to **** them over, about the only suggestion I can come up with is to play a Faerie Dragon PC, spending all your feats etc to max out the breath weapon (cone of euphoria gas).

then, wait for them to get into combat with the BBEG, breathe on 'em and let the BBEG kill em.

in any case, i don't understand why you keep playing with the same group. they sound like a pack of retards.

Ganurath
2009-06-21, 10:11 PM
Make your character an Expy of some fictional character that the players couldn't bring themselves to hurt.

Alternately, ask your DM if you can play the named villains. Since, y'know, those are the people that're supposed to fight and probably be killed by the party.

sofawall
2009-06-21, 10:32 PM
White dragon spawn- dragon magazine, +4 or 5 natural armor, +1 level sorcerer, +1 LA., changes your type to dragon.

White Dragonspawn: Dragonlance Campaign Setting, +7 natural armour, +1 effective sorcerer level, +1 LA, +2 Con, +2 Dex, Claws/Bite/Breath Weapon, Low-Light Vision, Darkvision (30 ft.), Fly Speed (twice land speed, average maneuverability), Fire Subtype, type changes to Monstrous Humanoid.

Seriously, 3 glaring errors, and you left out the tasty stat mods and fly speed. Did you even try? If not, please try next time. Wrong info (with the wrong source) helps no one.

oxinabox
2009-06-22, 12:18 AM
this average hitpoint roles (ie for the 2 levels of fighter you r0lled a 5.5 +5.5 = 11 + 2*8 con bonus = 27)
and avergave starting gold for a lvl 4.
uses Planar hand book (wildren) and Monster manual 4 (lolth touched tempate)
Stay away from wizards, you have neither a will save nor a reflex save.
Grapple them if you can get close enough and put a hand over their mouths.

I suggest you don't being by intiotating combat.
try to play the sesion this character was designed to be not unplayable normally.
Once combat starts burrow under the ground and hide/use spring attack.

Try to gain Levels (try burrowing away) you'll become much tougher once you gain some class levels. (cos i don't thing you can add anything to you HP from level adjustments... even with +8 constitution)
You automatically chaotic evil. but you can say that since being touched by lolth you have renounced the spider goddess and are one the run.

you addtion damage from twohanded str mod is +10.5 rounds to +10 unless you crit, or are using a potion that has a +an even number to you strength.


I suggest imidiately burrowing underground.
You then have a number of options:
*sprend a number of rounds knocking back potions then:
burrow 5 ft up, spring attack, no attack of opportunity. then burrow 5 ft down

*My prefered (peaceful)
Burrow across for a 10 or so rounds, ill your way out of there run distance. Shout and parley with them, continuing to retreat if they approch.
Demand that they hire a cleric or a wizard to put a geas on them swearing they'll never harm you, nor allow harm to come onto you through neglect on there part.
Downside is they might decide to just leave you and continue adventurning if so continue with the next option.

*Teh awesome:
Burrow away. a long way away.
Train, until you at least equal there level.
You should gain xp faster since there one of you and you can be training all day in the wilderness, where as they will have to do some rp eventually.
Also Build up an Army of badgers. (Badger is Wilden native language)
if you go mass longterm, invest levels in ride and handle animal (or use you ability to speak terran) to gain a burlette mount for the lols.



Bring multiple different character sheets from the forum.


Note: You going to have to try and sneak the spring attack past the DM.
your base attack is +2, but it requires +4.
Your effective attack with melee is 9 though so you BAB (+2) doesn't really matter compared to your str mod (+7).
a LA 0 fighter would have +4 attack by now so it looks right.
You dm deserves to have you cheat a little. He's not playing fair.
If he picks up, substitute for Imporved Grapple. with your strength and the feat you grapple at +13 with no attack of opportunity.
Puts who ever you have holdof out of game and gives you human shield.


Wow looking just at the ability mofifies on this character he is combat Filth.
Have fun roleplaying this.
Without further adue;
The PDF [535.97kBytes] (http://www.mediafire.com/?sharekey=054847d920976ff308f8df73f2072ed6e04e75f6 e8ebb871)

edit:
for anyone who's interested:
Lolth-touched template (MMIV p94):
+6 str, +6 con
Become chaotic evil
Fearless (Ex): immune to fear effects
Level adjustment +1.
not as good as white dragon spawn but still terribly broken.
hmm. What dragonspawn loalth touched withern. Me Likey!!

EDIT 2:
What out for the drunk.
It you haven't see his character sheet up close he might be a drunken master.
In which case you have monk who can turn anything into a weopon, and the more he drinks the stronger he gets.

Kyselina
2009-06-22, 01:16 AM
I forgot to mention that the dwarven fighter is a PC, if someone got confused. Also, these builds are all great.

mr.farche
2009-06-22, 01:23 AM
CHECK OUT THE NATURAL WERE-TIGER WARSHAPER!!!
It has a level adjustment of 3 but it is soooooo overpowered that when my friend optimized the crap out of it, he killed a CR 11 Dragon at ECL 6 IN ONE ROUND!!

One of the many great thing about were-tigers is that they meet the prerequisites for warshaper with only one level of fighter

He gave it a ring of adimantine touch, a necklace of natural attacks (allows you to enchant you natural attacks like weapons i.e. flaming burst, keen etc.), this thing has the pounce ability, it can make two additional attacks with pounce (2 rakes), immune to critical hits (warshaper), DR 10/silver, Scent, He gave it improved & uncanny scent feats to basically give it blind sight, He also got a feat that allows one turn (up to 90 degrees) in a charge, he also got some feats to improve his crit range and multipliers. Another item that helps is beast skin armor, so you can keep the armor on in tiger, hybrid or human form. (most or all of the magic items above can be found in the magic item compendium)

This class is so amazing, do it if you want to get back at your party members because it can deal around 250 damage max in one pounce (without any criticals). it is a character that is extremely fast hitting and usually kills targets very quickly. you also have the option to start grappling after single melee attack, and continue to make rake and bite attacks. This is good if the pounce doesn't kill them immediately. I bet you could take out your entire party in a matter of 3 or 4 rounds without any problem.

Reaping mauler is also great prestige class for this build!

The rules for lycanthropes are in the monster manual 1
Here are some links:
http://www.4shared.com/ -- this is where you can download almost any DnD book for free without even registering (all pdf files)
http://www.crystalkeep.com/d20/index.php -- crystal keep is a great website that has PDF file compilations of almost every feat, race, classes, monsters, items, and pretty much everything else SRD

P.S have fun!!:smallbiggrin:

Kyselina
2009-06-22, 01:38 AM
Also, my first goal is to level up a bit, not to kill them straight off.

mr.farche
2009-06-22, 01:56 AM
you should consider this though, because it is amazing. it is very good at killing monsters solo, which would also make it a very good character for leveling up as well.

He also gave it some grappling feats so it could grapple a gargantuan creature without penalty.

Kyselina
2009-06-22, 02:04 AM
Yeah, that build sounds very interesting.

Also, a new idea. The DM lets me have nonstandard familiars (had a genie), so, he would let me make myself some kind of a nonstandard creature as a familiar. Theoretically, would I take the houseruled improved familiar (+2 levels to him), he would have 6 levels. Would I take a sorcerer/wizard, using various templates and creatures I could make a strong familiar which would do the work for me. Ideas?

The new player which also got killed is making a new lvl 5 character. We already planned that we will have a shared story, so we will be friends.

oxinabox
2009-06-22, 02:08 AM
Also, my first goal is to level up a bit, not to kill them straight off.

yay. My build is optimised for levaling up. +8 con mod to hp *****es!
In which case is suggest not buying the potions.
dropping the fighter levels (and associated feats) if you don't want them. take your str based combat class of choice.

Drop the spring attack until legal, if you don't want to cheese your dm and take improved grapple, then go wrestle some orges/elephants and win.

For RP/sensory purposes you have scent:
Scent

This extraordinary ability lets a creature detect approaching enemies, sniff out hidden foes, and track by sense of smell.

A creature with the scent ability can detect opponents by sense of smell, generally within 30 feet. If the opponent is upwind, the range is 60 feet. If it is downwind, the range is 15 feet. Strong scents, such as smoke or rotting garbage, can be detected at twice the ranges noted above. Overpowering scents, such as skunk musk or troglodyte stench, can be detected at three times these ranges.

The creature detects another creature’s presence but not its specific location. Noting the direction of the scent is a move action. If it moves within 5 feet of the scent’s source, the creature can pinpoint that source.

A creature with the Track feat and the scent ability can follow tracks by smell, making a Wisdom check to find or follow a track. The typical DC for a fresh trail is 10. The DC increases or decreases depending on how strong the quarry’s odor is, the number of creatures, and the age of the trail. For each hour that the trail is cold, the DC increases by 2. The ability otherwise follows the rules for the Track feat. Creatures tracking by scent ignore the effects of surface conditions and poor visibility.

Creatures with the scent ability can identify familiar odors just as humans do familiar sights.

Water, particularly running water, ruins a trail for air-breathing creatures. Water-breathing creatures that have the scent ability, however, can use it in the water easily.

False, powerful odors can easily mask other scents. The presence of such an odor completely spoils the ability to properly detect or identify creatures, and the base Survival DC to track becomes 20 rather than 10.
I once fought a battle, blind using scent. I lost, but then again it was a Battle royal good team vs evil team. evil team had constructs and an army of zombies.

Kyselina
2009-06-22, 02:21 AM
What about a winged feral ankheg?

mr.farche
2009-06-22, 02:24 AM
another good build if you want to take the more subtle route, you could be a half-nymph bard. they have a level adjustment of +2 and they get crazy high bonuses to almost all charisma related checks. here is a list of all that amounts up to my character's miscellaneous modifiers to her charisma related skills:

Bluff: +5 for being half-nymph, +3 for comeliness, pheromones (+3), circlet of persuasion (+3) = +14
Diplomacy: half-nymph (+5), high comeliness (+3), synergy for 5 ranks in Knowledge (nobility/royalty) (+2), synergy for 5 ranks in Bluff (+2), synergy for 5 ranks in sense motive (+2), skill focus (diplomacy) (+3), pheromones (+3), circlet of persuasion (+3) = +23
Disguise: synergy for 5 ranks in Bluff (+2), half-nymph (+5), comeliness (-3), pheromones (+3), circlet of persuasion (+3) = +10
Gather Information: half-nymph (+5), comeliness (+3), pheromones (+3), circlet of persuasion (+3) = +14
Handle Animal: half-nymph (+2), pheromones (+3), circlet of persuasion (+3) = +8
Intimidate: synergy for 5 ranks in Bluff (+2), pheromones (+3), circlet of persuasion (+3) = +8
Perform (dance): half-nymph (+5) (chosen perform skill), comeliness (+3), pheromones (+3), circlet of persuasion (+3) = +14
Perform (string instruments): comeliness (+3), masterwork string instrument (+2), pheromones (+3), circlet of persuasion (+3) = +11
Perform (sing): comeliness (+3), pheromones (+3), circlet of persuasion (+3) = +9
Perform (string instruments & dance): half-nymph (+5) (chosen perform skill: dance), comeliness (+3), combining perform checks (versatile performer) (+2), masterwork instrument (+2), pheromones (+3), circlet of persuasion (+3) = +18

My character's comeliness is a 44 (d20+CHA modifier+racial modifier, +15 for half nymph) which gives a +3 to all charisma-related checks except Handle animal (+0), Intimidate (+0) and diguise (-3)

My ECL 10 half-nymph, arcane blooded, star elf, bard 7, marshal 1, ended up having a +36 to bluff, +45 to diplomacy, and a +40 to my highest perform check (string and dance)

having such a high bluff, I got the bow feint feat and a phasing bow, pretty much denying them any AC bonus, and you can also influence attitudes from hostile to helpful with a rushed diplomacy as a full round action (-10 to diplomacy check), if you roll at least a 15. this basically means you can head off a fight with no problem whatsoever.

Downsides: Extremely low HP, STR, CON, damage
Great for role-playing though

NPCMook
2009-06-22, 02:49 AM
What about a winged feral ankheg?

Find
A
Different
Group

Myrmex
2009-06-22, 03:27 AM
Ok, time for something not as great as pun pun, but still amazing.
White dragon spawn kobold sorcerer, taking the draconic right ritual dealy, and lore drake. Buying back your la at lv3.
White dragon spawn- dragon magazine, +4 or 5 natural armor, +1 level sorcerer, +1 LA., changes your type to dragon.
Draconic right ritual dealy - Draconimicon iirc - +1 level of sorcerer, minus some permanent hp
Lore drake - Also Draconomicon iirc - +2 levels of sorcerer.
So you'll end up a lv3 kobold sorcerer who casts like a lv7 sorcerer. :smallbiggrin:

You also get wings, so you can just fly away from harm.

Taking it farther:
Apply the two dragon templates Riddled and Spellscaled from Dungeon Magazine to get +8 int -8 wis and casting as a wizard. So now you are a level 3 kobold that casts as a level 7 wizard with nearly 30 intelligence and a set of wings!

Of course, the one thing no one pays attention to is the greater draconic ritual requires 6 hitdice, so you will actually only cast as a level 6 wiz/sorc.

Goatman_Ted
2009-06-22, 04:51 AM
Judging by the game so far:

Half-Elf Commoner 4
Feats: Combat Casting, Brachiation

It's not like any other build will keep you alive much longer.

oxinabox
2009-06-22, 05:13 AM
Half-Elf Commoner 4
Feats: Combat Casting, Brachiation
No Half-Elf Commoner 4
Feats: skill focus Crafting: Basket weaving, skill focus Preform: Interpretive dance.

Talic
2009-06-22, 05:38 AM
Level 4 Sorceror (metamagic specialist Variant - UA)
Lesser Aasimar - +2 Wis, +2 Cha (0 LA)

Versatile Spellcaster
Fell Drain
Practical Metamagic (Fell Drain)

Now, you're already a native outsider. So alter self accordingly.
You can Fell Drain for +1 level. You can burn 2 level 0 spells to cast a level 1. You can burn 2 level 1 spells to cast a level 2.

Now you can burn things down with fell drain Magic missile. If you can get 1 flaw, there's a feat in Complete Mage, I think, that gives you +1 caster level with force spells. That'll put your Magic missile to 3 bolts. Drain em down 3 at a time. When you have watch, divest them of weapons, Levitate 40 feet up, and go to town. Bonus points if you tie a rope to a ledge you're on instead. Then when they climb halfway up it? Rope Trick and command it to untie. Fun times, fun times. If they have ranged capability, get the climb ranks and use Wind wall on your ledge.

Added bonus: When you kill 3? They raise as wights. The 4th guy will have his hands full stopping you.

Oh, the serious route? While the DM's friends aren't there? Talk to him. Tell him you were told the Genie would do what you say, and they completely pissed all over that. Tell them you don't want any of your minions controlled by people that aren't the DM. Emphasise that you trust him, but his friends really ruined last session.

warmachine
2009-06-22, 06:47 AM
As you want to play in a backstabbing game, play a Monk with max stealth and 'help out' in combat by providing them with cover with an Eversmoking bottle. If they turn on you, escape, follow them and smoke them again in combat. Play any race with darkvision and no movement penalties. Scout ahead and bring monsters to them.

oxinabox
2009-06-22, 08:40 PM
Correction to the character sheet i provided.
You need to increase its HP by 4.
My bad

HamsterOfTheGod
2009-06-22, 09:15 PM
Hello again, I think that I need help from the mighty D&D players of this forum. Many helped me in the last thread, but now, this is special.

We were playing, happily, no killing. A new player joined in, fine (barbarian half orc). Then some two friends of the DM came and he gave them NPCs to play. One played my genie, the other played the NPC which loved beer (the drunk that helps us). So, the genie turned against me (the player did it so), then the drunk, then the cleric and so I got killed (in short). Now, I start on level 4. I need YOU to help me create an ultra-strong character! All 3.0 and 3.5 rulebooks allowed!

Also, the new barbarian got killed by them too.

So far: Level 4, raceless, classless
Stats to assign: 16 14 11 13 16 11 (I was allowed a 3-point manipulation, for example, I will redice the 16 to 13 and can add the 3 points to any of the other numbers. Or reduce the 16 to 14, the 11 to 10 and then assign the 3 points to the other numbers. Whatever I want. The maximum remains 18)

Everyone of the players is at level 6 (probably excluding the drunk):
Elf druid
Elf cleric
Dwarven fighter
Genie

I need YOUR help to make the strongest character to help me beat them all (the genie and the drunk players probably won't be present the next session, which is on tuesday)!

This is either a joke on us or on you. If on you, then I'm sorry.

Simply take any class (it does not matter which), lay low and do not roleplay much. When you are finally in a melee with an enemy, turn on the first party member whose hp fall into the range that you can take out in 1 round (at 4th level that should be around 15 hp for an average fighter, rogue or sorcerer/wizard). After that, attack the next weakest party member. Keep going until you or they are killed.

If asked why your character did that simply say that your character was always on the side of <insert_name_of_enemy_NPC> or was a seeking revenge for <insert_name_of_previously_killed_PC> or was <insert_name_of_previously_killed_PC> reincarnated and seeking revenge.

If the PC killed, repeat using the exact same character sheet but a different name for the PC.

At some point it will become fun for no one, not just you. Then, and only then, something good might come out of this for you, e.g. they stop, you leave, they ask you to leave, etc...if what you are telling us is true.

oxinabox
2009-06-22, 10:01 PM
yeah, what he said.
PvP isn't fun at all.
Even BAttle royal between 2 parties isn't fun.;

Thing is players arn't designed to die.
That's why fighting pc/npc's is harder than fighting mosters.

Monsters exists almost solly for you to kill them.
There are exceptions.
Eg the bear that you meet is infact a good friend of the druids.

PvP is the reason why you can't have a team of Chaotic Evil.
Why you shouldn't play an inevitable (who is worse that a badly played paladin, when played correctly).
PvP is not fun for anyone.

It's not even fun for the instigator, weather they win or loose.
well it may be fun. but it's not as fun as a well played roleplay situation.
Talk to your dm.
Seriously, if he doesn't try to stop it then he's useless.
almost no good dm wants there party to become imbalance.
well maybe if players miss a session then cut them down on xp,
But he shouldn't have let you, a player who comes to all seasons, fall 2 levals behind just cos another player thinks it would be lolsy to prove that his build is better then yours.

For that matter dm shouldn't have introduced new players at a higher ECL than the party average. the ECL of a genie (http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/SRD:Genies%E2%80%94Jann_(Race)) is 11 (6 hit dice + LA 5).

Ask him whats going on.
That's jsut not how a dm should act.

I know dm's that help there players route the game, and there better than that.
I know dm's that are rock solid that you can't change your character in anyway even if you made a mistake and waste a feat, and there better than that.

I'm sure your dm doesn't want to see his carefully crafter plot/world fall into an arena of mortal combat.

holywhippet
2009-06-22, 10:11 PM
Use some of your starting cash to invest in some high quality poisons:

http://www.d20srd.org/srd/specialAbilities.htm#poison

Dark reaver powder has a good chance of killing some of them - even if they live the CON and STR loss will limit their fighting potential. You could also try Oil of taggit as well or instead.

Slip the DM a note saying you will be cooking the meal for that night the next time the party rests outdoors - don't do it at the time or the other players might be suspicious. Put the poison in the food then watch the saving throws fly.

You could also spend some of your money to hire some thugs to ambush your party. Mercenaries are only 3 silver a day - so for 30 gold you could have 100 mercs ambushing the rest of the party. 100 mercs with bows = rapid death for a level 6 party.

Myatar_Panwar
2009-06-22, 10:11 PM
I like the occasional spot of PvP in D&D, but it just seems this is Dungeons and Deathmatches. Why are you still playing with such a massively uneven circumstance?

Sometimes some PvP can be fun. If they want to play Dungeons and Deathmatches, as you put it, they can.

Also everyone who is suggesting him to get another group or whatever and not offering any sort of help, you fail. The OP asked for a build to help combat the other players, not for advice on his group. Especially considering that he said he didn't want to find another group in the last thread.

Of course, I have nothing to add. But your DM seems pretty cool, I would throw Pun Pun at them and see how they react.

HamsterOfTheGod
2009-06-22, 10:20 PM
Also everyone who is suggesting him to get another group or whatever and not offering any sort of help, you fail.

I don't mean to get all Dr. Phil but I don't have to be a lone orc warrior guarding a treasure chest in a 10x10 foot room to see that something is wrong with this setup.

The OP stated, "We were playing, happily, no killing." I assume he meant, "We were playing, I was happy, no other PC was killing my PC."

Then he says, "I need YOUR help to make the strongest character to help me beat them all." Which I took to mean, "I need YOUR help to do something impossible if a straight on PvP fight of a 4th level character against 4 6th level characters."

And this is the second time around...yeah.

So, like I said, this is either a joke on us or on him.

And if you fail to realize that, then, I'm sorry, you fail.

Elixia
2009-06-23, 04:18 AM
your DM seems pretty cool,.

hmmm, i'm not sure about that. his DM lets his friend play the PC's genie which broke character (genie was suppose to obey but decided not to) and doesn't seems to making an direct attempt to put a stop to the player killing.

I mean, if this PVP is a symtom of a bigger underlining problems (group dynamtics) then it should be treated diplomatically.

But still, i dont know enough about the group or DM in question to know whats truly going on here. so i maybe wrong


I don't have to be a lone orc warrior guarding a treasure chest in a 10x10 foot room to see that something is wrong with this setup.
i LOVE that analogy i might use that in future!

Korivan
2009-06-23, 07:44 PM
I dont know if anybody suggested this, but why dont you just be the dm? then either hijack characters, railroad plots to heck, never give out rewards, level them up quickly and kill them, or simply kill them however you want. one of our dm's in 2nd edition did that all the time, as soon as someone leveled to 3rd, they died.
i.e. "you find a treasure chest"
"i search for traps"
"you don't find anything"
"i open it up"
"a trap goes off and you take 300 damage, save for half. did you make your save?"
".......would it matter?"

oxinabox
2009-06-23, 11:12 PM
... you can't just "Be" the dm.
to "be" the dm, you have to be the dm.
Unless you regualry swap dm's which i would think would trash the plot

ghost_warlock
2009-06-23, 11:47 PM
The DM told me that the genie will obey all my requests. But then the player appeared, and declined all the requests, so I was about to burry the lamp into the ground, then the whole party started arguing about it and everyone wanted him, so killing started. And I wanted to prevent killing :smallconfused:.

Maybe I could just make a completely non-combat character?

Not to be a total buzz-kill, but wouldn't burying the lamp have essentially removed the genie (and thus the player) from the game? If I'd been DMing, I'd definitely see this as an act of aggression against another player. Really, you started the fight and should simply accept the consequences and get over it.

Make your new character and, the next time someone else at the table doesn't do exactly what you want them to, just shrug it off and go on with the game instead of resorting to vindictive tactics.

Korivan
2009-06-24, 12:08 AM
... you can't just "Be" the dm.
to "be" the dm, you have to be the dm.
Unless you regualry swap dm's which i would think would trash the plot

i didnt mean just take over for the current one silly. rather, talk to the current one, and ask if you can try out a campaign "idea" you have.

Guancyto
2009-06-24, 12:14 AM
This is so hilariously full of terrible advice it's hard not to read.

Good builds, though.

Myrmex
2009-06-24, 12:34 AM
You should definitely go with the 3 HD kobold that casts as a level 6 wizard and wipe the party out with extreme prejudice. Between fly and mirror image, you should be pretty much invulnerable. Then blast away with save-or-die of your choice. Make sure you buy off the White Dragonspawn template level adjustment.

You should gain 1.999 levels from that encounter, which will put you up to about 5. Just go kill a wolf or something to put you up to level 5.

If you don't act soon and kill everyone, you are going to slowly lose levels all the way down to level 1 and they will just keep gaining levels.

ACT NOW BEFORE IT IS TOO LATE.

Lawless III
2009-06-24, 12:34 AM
We need to stop feeding this thread. It's getting ridiculous. There's a ton of good builds here, and a lot of good (and some not so good) advice. Plus, We almost never seem to get the full story or any sort etra information regarding his dilema. The little info we do get always seem to paint the picture of dysfunctional group that has made the OP it's chew toy (my symapathy goes out to you but that's what you make it sound like). Use one of these builds (or one from the avalanche that accompanied the last thread,) or don't. Try to solve the interpersonal problems your group has, or don't. Find a NEW friggin' group, OR DON'T! There's so much here already! I'm sorry man, but as the saying goes, either **** or get off the pot.

Nothing that gets put in this thread seems to go to use. What can be done has been done. Let it die already.

(Yes, I am kind of a hypocrite for posting in this while telling others not too. It was necasarey.)

Myrmex
2009-06-24, 12:35 AM
I'll post wherever I like, thanks.