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View Full Version : Killing/damaging the unharmable.



keybounce
2009-06-24, 04:41 PM
This can't be thread necromancy. I'm not bumping an old thread. But with regard to "Can you hurt it", seen at http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=34785

This creature is basically immune to magical effects that affect it. But it's not immune to magical effects that affect the area around it, doing just physical damage to it.

My first thought was a spell "Earthquake" or "Collapse Ceiling". This spell, when cast underground, causes the entire wall of earth from you to the ground level to fall down. This is the classic "Rocks fall, everyone dies" situation. Even if the massive weight falling doesn't hurt you, the lack of breathable air / large amount of dust in what little air you can breath will either suffocate you or cause lung damage.

But maybe that's not enough. So lets up that spell just a little. I suggest "Erupt volcano".

This spell causes a nearby volcano -- dormant or otherwise -- to explode, creating large quantities of lava. While the creature is immune to fire, it still needs to breath, which it cannot do when flooded in lava. Additionally, when the lava cools, it will be encased in rock; further unable to breath or eat.

Now, erupt volcano isn't a hard spell to cast. You need two casters working together, and (alright, this is the hard part) probably need a psionic character to co-ordinate the two casters.

It does require a volcano in the caster's hex, or adjacent hex; since it will also destroy the caster's hex, you need some other escape route to leave.

Thoughts?

Llama231
2009-06-24, 04:44 PM
I say use a supernova (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=115530).

woodenbandman
2009-06-24, 04:54 PM
Portable Hole trap?

Lupy
2009-06-24, 05:01 PM
Simple: He will die. No one can survive that.

Jack_Simth
2009-06-24, 06:15 PM
A number of ways. No mention was made of:

1) It having planar travel.
2) It being immune to anything not mentioned.

No mention is made of it being immune to Fort save, or immune to positive energy. Ready an action to open a Gate to the Positive Energy Plane when it moves - it goes through the Gate, you close the gate. A while later, it's temp HP exceed it's normal HP, and it starts making Fort saves. Eventually, it fails one, and goes boom.

No mention is made of it being immune to suffocation, thirst, or hunger. Bull Rush it into a Portable Hole, and close the hole. Bury the portable hole somewhere; eventually, it dies of suffocation. Problem solved.

Cast Transmute Rock to Mud on the ceiling, and a Quickened Dispel Magic on the mud. It's buried in what amounts to instant-cement. Unless it's good enough to break out, problem solved.

None of these target the creature with magic directly.
None of these target anything it's listed as being immune to.

Any of the three can be solved if the creature has access to the proper spells, but theoretically you can follow and counterspell as needed.

kopout
2009-06-24, 06:38 PM
If its a construct than non of those work.

erikun
2009-06-24, 07:58 PM
Are we playing Psionics are Different? If so, then Psionic Disintegrate (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/powers/disintegratePsionic.htm) at 49 PP will deal 81d6 damage on a successful Fortitude Save. (still only 22d6 if it fails its save, though) :smalltongue:

Pharaoh's Fist
2009-06-24, 08:03 PM
Are we playing Psionics are Different? If so, then Psionic Disintegrate (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/powers/disintegratePsionic.htm) at 49 PP will deal 81d6 damage on a successful Fortitude Save. (still only 22d6 if it fails its save, though) :smalltongue:

So first, we need to get a manifester level of 49...

Keld Denar
2009-06-24, 08:08 PM
So first, we need to get a manifester level of 49...

Expanded Knowledge: Metamophasis + Metamorphic Transfter + Barghest + some method of setting ML=HD, and you are there!

Maybe True Mind Switch into a creature with innate psionic abilities linked to HD? I dunno where to start looking for one of those though...

The Glyphstone
2009-06-24, 08:13 PM
Are we playing Psionics are Different? If so, then Psionic Disintegrate (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/powers/disintegratePsionic.htm) at 49 PP will deal 81d6 damage on a successful Fortitude Save. (still only 22d6 if it fails its save, though) :smalltongue:


Umm, how do you figure that?


For every additional power point you spend, the damage this power deals to a subject that fails its saving throw increases by 2d6 points. Augmenting this power does not change the amount of damage the target takes if it succeeds on its saving throw.

A successful save will still be 5d6. It's only 81d6 if they fail the save.

erikun
2009-06-24, 08:16 PM
....er, yeah. I obviously can't read. :smallredface:

SSGoW
2009-06-24, 08:20 PM
put it in a bag of holding... teleport said bag of holding to the center of the planet/sun :D there aint to many things that cant be killed by sending it to the center of the sun

Curmudgeon
2009-06-24, 08:42 PM
Simplest approach is Transmute Rock to Mud and then Transmute Mud to Rock. You don't have to either kill or damage it; you just put it away for a geologically long time.

Emy
2009-06-24, 08:51 PM
This thing is too big for Forcecage, right?

FinalJustice
2009-06-24, 08:55 PM
Does it have a head? Does it need it to? If so, vorpalize it. Surge of Fortune (Spell, CChampion, I guess) + Vorpal means it's only a matter of confirming the critical. The spell doesn't directly hurt it, but still...

Also, Energy Substituted Freezing Fog can damage it. Just make sure he stays there a long time.

Emy
2009-06-24, 09:01 PM
I definitely have a way to injure it; I'm working on a sure-kill version now.

Tengu_temp
2009-06-24, 09:02 PM
put it in a bag of holding... teleport said bag of holding to the center of the planet/sun :D there aint to many things that cant be killed by sending it to the center of the sun

Actually, that's very easy - you just need to be immune to asphyxiation, high pressure, and fire. A simple fire elemental could survive that, much less an indestructable monster like the one in the thread OP linked.

quick_comment
2009-06-24, 09:42 PM
Supernatural imprisonment.

It also isnt immune to [death] spells.

ZeroNumerous
2009-06-24, 09:57 PM
It's not immune to ability drain. X Ghosts or X Allips auto defeat it. It's a CR 45 monster. That means a party of ECL 45 dudes should be able to defeat it. We take a single arcane caster, we give him 45 levels. We make an epic spell called "Kill [It's name]". We cast it. It dies, no save.

Emy
2009-06-24, 10:33 PM
Half-Dragon Venerable Gray Elf Factotum 20
Wyrmling Mercury Dragon Racial HD 3/Wizard 13/Fatespinner 4 (Dragon Cohort)
Bladeling Divine Minion of Sebek LA 3/Paladin of Tyranny 3/Binder 5/Fiend of Possession 5/Fiend of Corruption 1 (possessing the Factotum. cohort. Ritual from Savage Species used to give it the Chaotic subtype)

Factotum Int: 18 + 3 age + 4 racial + 6 enhancement + 5 inherent + 5 levels + 2 alchemical + 3 FoC + 4 profane = 50 (+20)

Mushroom Powder (Int +2 alchemical)

10 + 9 (spell level) + 20 (int) + 1 (sf) + 1 (gsf) + 4 (fatespinner) + 2 (panaeolo) + 1 (spellcasting prodigy) + 1 (corrupt arcane studies) + 1 (cold focus) + 1 (greater cold focus) + 5 (rod-maximized harmonic chorus w/sonorous hum)

Save DC 56.

the Thing's will save modifier is +36

It only succeeds on a 20. And if it does, the Fatespinner can make it reroll.

The Wizard uses a Forcecage on himself and the Factotum, to keep them safe for a round while they combine into Voltron. The Factotum uses Cunning Brilliance to get psion manifesting, and manifests fusion on the wizard. Once fusion's done, the combined being dismisses the forcecage, then uses Cunning casts as many rod-maximized Maw of Chaos as possible, the first of which has a will save DC 56, and the others have save DC 52. Once it's done casting, the bladeling hops out of the combined being and walks over next to the Thing, giving it -4 to its saves. The bladeling is immune to maw of chaos due to its chaotic subtype.

Cunning Surge is used to get all the actions needed for this, though scrolls of time stop would work fine too.

So basically, the Thing gets dazed for CL rounds, and takes N*6*CL^2 damage, where N is the number of Maw of Chaos cast. With 4 Maw of Chaos active at CL21 (very basic practiced spellcaster + create magic tattoo), that's 504 damage per round for a total of 10,584 damage. Not impressive damage per round by ubercharger or hulking hurler standards, but it has an 0.000625% chance to not be dazed each turn. And if it makes that chance, the combined being can force a reroll with its fatespinner ability.

Whew. That would have been a lot easier if the target creature were small enough to forcecage.


Alternatively, Factotum 20 and a Cleric with a stupidly high caster level (consumptive field abuse).


edit, fixed word wrap