"I don't think *patient* is a word i would use to describe V Haley"

[Raenir Salazar]

Whats Elan meaning by this? Concern? Take That?

[Ancalagon]

He means that Vaarsuvius simply is not "patient", not at all.

[Ichneumon]

He means that Vaarsuvius simply is not "patient", not at all.

I had to read it twice before understanding the pun, the double meaning of the word "patient".

[Draxonicar]

The fact V didn't wait 5 minutes for roys rez so she copuldnt teleport them ALL in and kill xykon, instead she went and went in rambo and lost

[Axl_Rose]

The fact V didn't wait 5 minutes for roys rez so she copuldnt teleport them ALL in and kill xykon, instead she went and went in rambo and lost

Ouch. *Tssss*

[EmperorSarda]

Then they all would have died.

[Beorn080]

I don't think so. V was handling Xykon relatively well, though clearly not hands down, and even if V just took everyone but Roy, I'm sure the other 4 could have handled Red Cloak and Jervix before Tsukiko showed up. Granted, had V waited for Roy to be raised, and took Hinjo and Lien too, they would have stomped them into the ground. I mean V and O-Chul crippled Red Cloak, killed Jervix, and nearly got the soul thingy.

[hamishspence]

the fact that V killed Kubota on the spot instead of giving the legal system a chance, might count.

[Red XIV]

I don't think so. V was handling Xykon relatively well, though clearly not hands down, and even if V just took everyone but Roy, I'm sure the other 4 could have handled Red Cloak and Jervix before Tsukiko showed up. Granted, had V waited for Roy to be raised, and took Hinjo and Lien too, they would have stomped them into the ground. I mean V and O-Chul crippled Red Cloak, killed Jervix, and nearly got the soul thingy.
Yeah, if the rest of the party were dealing with Redcloak and Jirix (and Tsukiko, once she showed up), it never would've occurred to Xykon to dispel V's Mind Blank and drive off the splices.

On the other hand, if things got desperate and (unlike in the Dugeon of Durokan) Xykon's phylactery wasn't safe, he might have unleashed MitD, in which case who knows what would've happened.

[Mortugg]

I think it's a pun when you consider the fact that V is frozen right now and can't do anything, so it would be quite cynical to refer to his actual state as "patient" :smallwink:.

[Aris Katsaris]

I don't think so. V was handling Xykon relatively well, though clearly not hands down, and even if V just took everyone but Roy, I'm sure the other 4 could have handled Red Cloak and Jervix before Tsukiko showed up.

It's not as easy a calculation as that. E.g. Had a whole group of adventurers showed up, Redcloak and Jirix might have called for their own reinforcements. Keep in mind, that both Jirix and Tsukiko left (and Redcloak dropped his guard) because they thought the threat to be over. If the threat had been bigger their own contributions would have also been bigger.

And we don't even know that V could transport other people through the Cloister.

Anyway, my point is, we just don't know how it would have gone had V brought everyone along.

[Rebarth]

The point is that durkon has an impatient to take care of.

[Spiky]

I don't think so. V was handling Xykon relatively well, though clearly not hands down, and even if V just took everyone but Roy, I'm sure the other 4 could have handled Red Cloak and Jervix before Tsukiko showed up. Granted, had V waited for Roy to be raised, and took Hinjo and Lien too, they would have stomped them into the ground. I mean V and O-Chul crippled Red Cloak, killed Jervix, and nearly got the soul thingy.

Maybe I read a different comic. The only help Xykon received was a shortcut to the win when RC mentioned a good tactic. But that was merely a shortcut, X had already taken away most of the help from V's buddies on his own. At that point it was epic lich vs non-epic wizard with temporary access to epic spells. Not to mention that Xykon is the comic's best dueler and V is the "dumbest smart person I know." V didn't have a chance.

Anyway, Tsukiko accomplished nothing, V was too high an effective level to be affected by her. And she wasn't even there for the O-Chul moment.

[Random832]

Anyway, Tsukiko accomplished nothing, V was too high an effective level to be affected by her.

What rule do you imagine to apply in this way? Redcloak's Dispel didn't work because the caster level of the Mind Blank spell (the spliced soul's level, _not_ V's effective level) was too high, but that wasn't what Tsukiko did.

[Beorn080]

From what I see, V wasn't doing that badly against Xykon. I would say about tied, up till the point RC said to use dispel and V fell in Tsukiko's Mind Fog. By my reckoning, that means if V brought along the other 4 living members, V could have finished him off without outside interference.

Another odd note. Team Evil consistently calls V a she in http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0653.html.
Not sure if that means anything.

Edit: What I meant by V and O-Chul was the fact that one human paladin and one wizard did significant damage to Team Evil in what was about 5 minutes time tops. Yes, V was down when O-Chul broke out, but he would have broken out anyway if the entire team showed up, though V and team wouldn't have known that before hand. With a cleric, rogue, bard, and SSGOW taking on RC and Jirix, followed by Tsukiko, RC would never have told Xykon about the splices. Besides, one good Heal on Xykon, and he would have been toast.

[DSCrankshaw]

It's not necessarily a reference solely to V going to kill Xykon. V's never shown a lot of patience, that was just an example.

[pita]

Another odd note. Team Evil consistently calls V a she in http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0653.html.
Not sure if that means anything.
Thank you for finding the first piece of evidence towards V's gender.
You are an inspiration to us all.
Nerd. ;)

[Morquard]

I don't know why people say when the others have gone too, they'd kicked Xykons ass because V was doing so great.
Uhm... no not really. X didn't take the whole thing serious from the start, and toyed with V, thats why it looked like V was doing great for a while.
Once Xykon decided to end it... it didn't really take him more than 3 panels to kick Vs butt to hell and back.

[Moriarty]

nah, you get the impression Xykon was playing with V because he's taunting him, but he uses his best anti-caster tactics (namely spamming energy drain, even maximised) right from the start

[Bibliomancer]

Also, if V had waited for Roy, she would have had time to buff herself and the party to Baator and back, including a few spell turnings and contingent dispel magics (to dispel other dispel magics).

Also, consider how hard it would be for Redcloak or Jirix to call for help when if they were running like the little chunks of xp (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0115.html) that Belkar thinks they are.

[Alteran]

And we don't even know that V could transport other people through the Cloister.


I would be extremely surprised if he couldn't. The spell he used to teleport through the Cloister was the same one he used to teleport the entire Azure City fleet.

[Random832]

I would be extremely surprised if he couldn't. The spell he used to teleport through the Cloister was the same one he used to teleport the entire Azure City fleet.

I'm guessing the spliced soul's caster level just had to beat Xykon's - it's unlikely that it would cause a limitation on how much could be brought through, given a caster that could break through it at all.

[SaintRidley]

I'm guessing the spliced soul's caster level just had to beat Xykon's - it's unlikely that it would cause a limitation on how much could be brought through, given a caster that could break through it at all.

Going by the Sylph's explanation of the Cloister spell, I gathered that only epic spells could get through.

[Random832]

Going by the Sylph's explanation of the Cloister spell, I gathered that only epic spells could get through.

That was my point, sort of - and additionally that it doesn't somehow become less able to break the cloister for bringing more people.

[Red XIV]

Another odd note. Team Evil consistently calls V a she in http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0653.html.
Not sure if that means anything.
Xykon refers to V as "it" in this strip (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0657.html).

[Beorn080]

I think he was referring to the fact that V tried to tag him earlier, and not specifically a gender. And by tag, I mean kill.

[Cleverdan22]

I think he was referring to the fact that V tried to tag him earlier, and not specifically a gender. And by tag, I mean kill.

I think he was using that fact to also make a stab at V's androgyny.

[SaintRidley]

That was my point, sort of - and additionally that it doesn't somehow become less able to break the cloister for bringing more people.

Ah. My apologies then for the misunderstanding.

[Souhiro]

I think that the whole team, with Super-V WOULD be able to defeat Xykon and his team rather easily. Xykon had his hard time against an epic-inexpert-but-way-more-powerful Vaarsuvius. He only managed to defeat him by using "brains". But that isn't his strong poing

RedCloack IS the Xykon brains. While Xykon would be the evil genious that keep busting the heroes and put an inept guard to watch them, Redcloak is the one that just draw a gun and kill the arrested heros in place.

With RedCloack, undoing Xykon is WAY easier than now.

And the entire order would be ore than capable to dispatch Redcloack, disembowl Tsukiko, turning the crimsom mantle into the crimsom sreds, and say a few one-liners, while Xykon impavid saws how his Soul-Hidey-Thing is smashed by Durkon's heirloom hammer.

[Larkspur]

Why are we assuming Team Evil would just sit around and be slaughtered? They probably have a plan for what to do if they're confronted with a real threat, like a full party teleporting in, instead of one random guy.

If I were them I'd leave Xykon to hold off the group- and by "the group" I mean V and whatever ineffectual damage is dealt by Haley's arrows, since Xykon can fly. Elan has no offensive spells, Heal is touch range and electricity (and thus Thor) doesn't affect liches, so Durkon would have trouble doing anything useful, and Roy, Elan, Belkar and O-Chul are stuck on the ground (even if someone has the ring of jumping, Xykon can just fly out of range). And worst comes to worst, there's the phylactery, so it doesn't really matter if they kill him as long as he manages to take out V first- which he probably would have eventually, even without Redcloak and Tsukiko's help; it's not like he was losing before Redcloak started telling him what to do, the advice just made him win faster.

Meanwhile Redcloak (with the phylactery, note) and Jirix dash downstairs, grab hobgoblin reinforcements plus Tsukiko plus some of Tsukiko's undead, and come back upstairs. Or don't come back upstairs. Let the Order of the Stick capture the top floor of the tower- big whoop. There's nothing useful there except for MiTD's box, and now they're stuck on the top floor of a tower surrounded by a zillion hobgoblins. As long as Super-V is out of commission, the hobogoblins + Redcloak would have no problems whatsoever taking out the entire group, given enough time.

Plus you've got to figure Redcloak has some sort of contingency plan in place in case someone seriously tries to take back the city. And all of this is discounting MiTD, who Xykon would probably ask to reveal himself in a true emergency. I think our heroes would be in real trouble here unless they sat down and came up with a proper strategy, and given Roy's strategies the last two times he confronted Xykon were "Charge" and "jump onto zombie dragon, annoy autonomously flying guy until he ditches said dragon," I don't have much hope for them.

Xykon doesn't know V's gender: "Mr or Ms Spock"