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Gorthaur
2005-12-18, 12:21 AM
Seeing as this is... ok, pretty much the only reason I joined this site, to promote my own work selflessly, I figure I should get around to doing it.

This is the Capuchin- my campaign worlds version of batman. In effect, they are defensive powerhouses, capable of surviving dastardly blows, and bludgeoning people to a bloody pulp (only to drop them off at your local law enforcement office). She originally showed up as an NPC who did just that to a Paladin of Slaughter. The lesson? Don't tick off authorities in my game, because I, as GM, have the right to make a mean prestige class. :P

Capuchin Class
10 level Prestige Class
d6 HD
6 + Int Mod Skill Points (Skills- as monk)
BAB as Fighter
Good Will and Ref saves
Light Armor proficiency, simple and rogue weapon proficiencies
Requirements: Must be lawful, or chaotic working for the cause of their alignment (Not chaotic neutral, but Lawful Good, Lawful Neutral, Lawful Evil, Chaotic Evil, Chaotic Good)
Base Attack Bonus +5, Tumble 8 ranks, Balance 8 ranks, Move Silently 8 Ranks, Hide 8 ranks, Dodge, Combat Reflexes
Special- Must have been given the Capuchin title by the former Capuchin, who must either retire or die.
Special- You must have read some of the Capuchin's notes, which usually must be given to you to study completely for at least one full year.
You may choose to fulfill either of the special requirements.

Level Abilities
1 Sneak Attack +1d6, Capuchin Neonate
2 Misdirection
3 Acrobatic Dodge
4 Sneak Attack +2d6, Capuchin
5 Silence
6 Acrobatic Leap
7 Sneak Attack +3d6, Capuchin Adept
8 Unseen Justice
9 Acrobat's Balance
10 Sneak Attack +4d6, Capuchin Master

The Capuchin is a devout follower of the gods of Law. A vigilante, who brings terror into the hearts of its foes, it is known for being undying- but this is not so.

When one Capuchin dies, another takes its place. This has continued for many years, and will continue forever, so long as the line remains pure.

Sneak Attack: As Rogue.

Editors note- I will be placing these after each ability, so I can justify it and such. Sneak attack is pretty obvious- its something that requires stealth, so sneak attack is appropriate. I staggered the progression, so it only comes each time you go up in rank.

Capuchin Neonate: The Capuchin is only a novice Capuchin, most likely one being trained to succeed the old. The Capuchin has access to the old notes of the old Capuchins, and is able to study their techniques and skills. This gives her the capability of knowing more than one her age might possibly know, though they cannot often recall it. The Capuchin gains the bardic knowledge ability. Furthermore, if they did not have it already, they begin advancing in speed as though they were a monk. (if they already have it, continue their speed progression normally)

Editors note- If they have bard levels, they stack with Capuchin levels for the purpose of the notes. You will note that I have a lot of abilities that this Prestige Class gains, that can easily be merely duplicates. I don't like duplicate abilities, so this class is always fresh and new, providing a new ability if you've already got the one it offers.

Misdirection (sp): The Capuchin is a master of hiding who and what she is. She gains Spell Resistance 20 + Capuchin Level, only usable against divination spells focused on uncovering her identity. This may be loosely interpreted by the DM- for example, it may apply to a True Strike spell cast and then used to make a Disarm attempt on her mask, or on a See Invisibility spell when she is not in costume.

This was added, quite specifically, in a game where some nasty swashbuckler disarmed my character of her mask. I hate that person, so I added this ability out of spite. Is it useless? Yeah, mostly. Is it helpful? Sure.

Acrobatic Dodge (ex): The Capuchin's ability to dodge blows becomes incredible. Once the Capuchin has declared an enemy the target of her dodge, she may make a reflex save whenever that person attempts to harm her with a weapon, natural weapon, or AC based spell (such as touch or ranged touch attacks). The DC is equal to the total attack roll of the enemy. Success indicates that she dodges the brunt of the blow, taking only half damage. Evasion does not apply to this ability.

Editors note- Fixed, mostly? Maybe? I dunno! I suck at balance.

Capuchin: The Capuchin has become in name and deed the full Capuchin. They have access to all the old notes, and equipment, of the old Capuchin's, and may effectively "buy" equipment for less. They may "buy" items that relate to stealth, sneaking, or divination (such as True Seeing) for one half price by finding their locations and proclaiming themselves the Capuchin. Finally, they recieve their Wisdom as a bonus to their armor class. (if they already had this ability, they may use monk abilities and recieve their wisdom bonus even while wearing light nonmetal armor)

Editors note- I liked the idea of the guy gradually adding pieces of steel to the armor, and so it was added. Its not terrifyingly broken, when you look at the example of the Warforged Monk who gets to wear armor in addition to getting WIS to AC and all that jazz. The buying items thing... I honestly don't quite know how much it works, but I figure its not half-bad, and kind of fun. Another example I found that may be applied- there is a class ability somewhere that allows you to add a certain amount of a bonus to your AC. I think Int, maybe? I dunno. Perhaps changing this to a more gradual thing might be better...

Silence (sp): 3/day, the Capuchin may cast Silence. This effect only extends to herself and and willing targets.

Editors note- There are a few classes in 3e that got +10 to Jump, Move Silently, Hide, and Tumble, and ended with +30 to those skills. This is the same, only a dispel magic will rip you up. Also, I'm quite sure this isn't normal D&D legalese that prevents super wordsmithing, and its also not the way the real silence spell works, but I'm not too concerned.

Acrobatic Leap (ex): Capuchin gain gain the Slow Fall (up to 60 feet) ability as if they were a monk.

Editors note-The only monk ability that becomes redundant.

Capuchin Adept: The Capuchin is now ranked among the greatest of the Capuchin that have existed. At this level, they may make a Flurry of Blows if they did not already have this ability. (if they had this ability, they may instead use their unarmed attack bonus even while armed, and may flurry while armed with a weapon of medium sized or smaller.)

Editors note- Yes, you do get Capuchin level to the bardic knowledge checks twice. And yes, you can flurry with non monk weapons now. It shouldn't be too broken, since monks who can enter this class can usually beat most weapons with unarmed damage.

And yeah, it is a bit archaic in wording.

Unseen Justice (sp): The Capuchin may cast Invisibility (as per the spell) 3/day. Its caster level is equal to her Capuchin level.

Editors note- Probably going a bit over the top here, but if you think about it another way, its getting a +30 to a hide check, for a very short amount of time.

Acrobats Balance (ex): The Capuchin may never be knocked down without her conscious effort. She gains a +4 competance bonus to all Balance checks, and Bull Rush attempts on her suffer a -4 penalty.

Editors note- Alright, I'll be honest- I hate empty levels, so I put in a bunch of mostly worthless abilities so they aren't blank. So does WOTC, sometimes, but they aren't very happy when you admit that..

Capuchin Master: The Capuchin is the greatest of those who have come before her. She has likely read all of the notes of the previous Capuchin, and very likely corrected a few of their mistakes. They have skill and talent and poise beyond most normal people. The Capuchin may apply her Dodge Bonuses and her Acrobatic Dodge bonuses to two additional enemies.

Editors note- Again, see starmantle cloak for fairness here.

Random edit- double posting is frowned upon. Doh. I'll wait until people comment on this one for me to post more. I've got something like 30. This could take some time.

bosssmiley
2005-12-18, 05:33 AM
I like it, focused, but not over-powering. Did you use the thief-acrobat as the base?

Ther's just one thing though: the name.

I know, I know, the Capuchin Order exists. But I'd never be able to stop my players from making the simian connection.

"Tremble before the just wrath of...the Capuchin!"
http://www.phoenixthrone.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/images/capuchin1.jpg

Deleran
2005-12-18, 05:41 AM
Id have to playtest the acrobatic dodge ability, the hard stats seem awfully good too. And I think double posting would be acceptable if you wanted to post several PrCs. I think the rule is more to prevent people from stringing a bunch of short posts together when they could just use one post.

Maryring
2005-12-18, 06:23 AM
Broken. The acrobatic dodge is just horribly wrong, and the double bardic knowledge is too much. Why should she know more than a bard equal to her level anyway? And I know of NO class that can reduce the damage they take by HALF. Rouges may get a much weaker ability that allows them to take half damage from an attack that would normally have killed them, and then they HAVE to succeed on the save. Sorry, but it is overpowered. The cloak gives no justification because it is an ITEM not a class. Big difference. And what has chaotic evil got to do with justice anyway?

Thomas
2005-12-18, 07:15 AM
Broken. The acrobatic dodge is just horribly wrong, and the double bardic knowledge is too much. Why should she know more than a bard equal to her level anyway? And I know of NO class that can reduce the damage they take by HALF. Rouges may get a much weaker ability that allows them to take half damage from an attack that would normally have killed them, and then they HAVE to succeed on the save. Sorry, but it is overpowered. The cloak gives no justification because it is an ITEM not a class. Big difference. And what has chaotic evil got to do with justice anyway?

I definitely agree that Acrobatic Dodge is broken. With a bit of work, the Reflex save can become automatic. Just one enemy per round is bad enough (sorry, dragon, you're useless!) - but three enemies per round? That's crazy.

As for the starmantle cloak - first of all, Gorthaur, you've misquoted it. It lets the wearer ignore damage from nonmagical weapons. With magical weapons, a successful save halves the damage. That's nowhere near as powerful as this acrobatic dodge ability, and saying otherwise is just plain incorrect.

Nevermind that the BoED is a non-core book, and therefore automatically "suspect" - non-core books are not guaranteed to be balanced at all.

This class definitely fails the most important test: Does it make other classes redundant? Yes. I can't imagine a monk NOT taking at least three levels of this. The acrobatic dodge alone trumps every other ability in the game.

Limiting acrobatic dodge to one, and only one, and never ever more than one, attack per round from the target of the dodge feat, might make it viable and balanced, but I wouldn't be too sure - you'd better find a class ability that lets you do something similar to base this one off.

Now, the others...

Misdirection: Too powerful. Maxing out a stat is easy, and then you end up with broken abilities. Also, using character levels instead of class levels is usually unfair or overpowered. Make it SR 20 + class level vs divination (similar to the ninja). "Added this ability out of spite" - well, er, if you realized this, maybe you should have re-evaluated giving the ability to the class at all.

Silence: At will? I don't know how many PrCs get to cast spells at will, but that definitely sounds too powerful. 1/day, maybe 3/day.

Unseen Justice: Again, don't use the Wisdom modifier for this kind of ability. It's fine for Turn Undead etc., but for a spell-like ability? 1/day, or 3/day at most.

Removing the monk's armor limitation is a broken power, too. The point of the Wisdom bonus is that it makes up for not having armor. Now it's just a free +8 or +10 to AC, on top of the +10 for a +5 mithral breastplate, Dexterity, etc. Monks (in my experience) can get horribly high, broken ACs anyway.

Armed Flurry of Blows, at least, exists (Sohei, some PrCs). Won't argue that. (Although the wording is a bit off - 3.0 rules, I assume?)


"Don't tick off authorities in my game, because I, as GM, have the right to make a mean prestige class."
You need a new design philosophy, seriously. (And maybe a new DMing philosophy.) "I can do anything to beat the PCs!" is not a sound principle.

In a straight-out fight against a PC (or several), yes, this class is nigh-invulnerable, because you have made it so. Absolutely unfair, and judging by your statements, more than slightly immature.

For achieving the feel and style of this class, the Ghost-Faced Killer PrC might be appropriate.

Thrune
2005-12-18, 03:42 PM
O. V. E. R. P. O. W. E. R. E. D.

Acrobatic Dodge is highly scary. Limiting it to one attack is slightly fair(Though the class is still overpowered). Capuchin Adept, well... double bardic knowledge is majorly overpowered. And I second the insane AC statement. In other words, I agree with everything Thomas said, though I'm not sure about the Ghost-Faced Killer(never read it).
In conclusion,

O. V. E. R. P. O. W. E. R. E. D.

Gorthaur
2005-12-18, 06:42 PM
...I thought I dropped the half damage on a failed save, thing. That is totally my bad. :P It got toned down according to my notes, to half damage on a successful save, full damage on a failed, evasion not applying.

The armor should be "light nonmetal armor" only, similar to a druid.

Regarding the divinations... its only specific divinations, used to discern who the person is. You can still True Strike them, but if you True Strike then disarm a mask, it won't apply. Your suggestion for SR is good, though.

The bardic knowledge was added because I wanted her to know a lot of things- in retrospect, easily covered by Gather Information. I'll remove one of them.

*edits top post to incorporate this*

You need a new design philosophy, seriously. (And maybe a new DMing philosophy.) "I can do anything to beat the PCs!" is not a sound principle.

It probably wouldn't make you feel better if I told you of the serious hardcore creeps who play in my games. I mean.. everyone made LG characters, for the most part, and one guy makes a Barbarian/Paladin of Slaughter/Frenzied Berserker. And started killing random people. So rather than use a broken cavalier build, I used a broken prestige class, that way, they don't whine at me to switch to GURPS. (They can blame broken builds on me, rather than WotC- I personally like Paladin5/Ranger1/WildPlainsOutrider3/Cavalier10/Something1) and I much prefer that they hate me rather than WotC.

I also loathe the builds my PC's try to sneak past me- for example, someone attempted to bring a pun-pun style build in there. So every time someone brings in a Twice-Betrayer of Shar, or wants Hulking Hurler... I get angry and add abilities out of spite. Not mature, no. I freely admit it. :P

And without further ado, next PrC.

Knight of Shadowed Flame
11 level PrC

Prereqs
Feats: Power Attack, Cleave, Skill Focus (Intimidate), Weapon Focus (any)
Skills: Knowledge: the Planes 5+ Ranks
BAB: +8
Alignment: Any Evil
Spellcasting: Must be capable of casting 2nd level spells

Editors Note- You'll notice that this is designed to be fueled from a Paladin of Slaughter, or possibly a blackguard. More likely blackguard, since everyone loves them. In my campaign world, this replaces blackguard, because at the time, it required Hide, and wasn't nearly... fiery enough. I didn't like the undead aspect of it, nor the 'willing association with demons', so instead, this is the class you'd pick if you wanted to play a balrog. Shadow and fire.

BAB: As Fighter
HD: d10

Saves: High Fort and Will
Skills: 2 + Int mod per level.
Class Skills: I don't know what I should put here.

Level 1: Initiate of the Spark
Level 2: Initiate of the Dusk
Level 3: Novice of Fire
Level 4: Novice of Shadow
Level 5: Blazing Sword
Level 6: Armor of Darkness
Level 7: Lord of the Phlogiston
Level 8: Umbral Lord
Level 9: Master of the Holocaust
Level 10: Pyro
Level 11: Tenebrous King

Weapon and Armor proficiency: The Knight of Shadowed Flame has proficiency in all simple and martial weapons, and all armor and shields.

Spells: A Knight of Shadowed Flame has the ability to cast a small number of divine spells. To cast a spell for this class, a Knight of Shadowed Flame must have a Wisdom score of at least 10 + the spell’s level, so a Knight of Shadowed Flame with a Wisdom of 10 or lower cannot cast these spells.

Knight of Shadowed Flame bonus spells are based on Wisdom, and saving throws against these spells have a DC of 10 + spell level + the Knight of Shadowed Flame’s Wisdom modifier. When the Knight of Shadowed Flame gets 0 spells per day of a given spell level he gains only the bonus spells he would be entitled to based on his Wisdom score for that spell level. The Knight of Shadowed Flame’s spell list appears below. A Knight of Shadowed Flame has access to any spell on the list and can freely choose which to prepare, just as a cleric. A Knight of Shadowed Flame prepares and casts spells just as a cleric does (though a Knight of Shadowed Flame cannot spontaneously cast cure or inflict spells).

They use the Blackguard table for spells/day.

Initiate of the Spark (Ex): The Knight of Shadowed Flame's mere touch can set ignitables alight, at his will. He recieves Fire Resistance equal to his levels in this class.

Nifty flavor ability (I BURN YOUR PAPER! GRR) and an ability that becomes useless six levels later. <_< Yay.

Initiate of the Dusk (Ex): The Knight of Shadowed Flame recieves a +1 competance bonus to attack rolls, saving throws, and skill checks between the hours of Dusk and Dawn.

At night, they're harder to kill.

Novice of Fire (Ex): All fire attacks done by the Knight of Shadowed Flame deal +2 points of damage. This does not apply to flaming weapons.

This is effectively, Weapon Specialization- Fire. I wonder if it is overpowered.

Novice of Shadow (Ex): In between the hours of dusk and dawn, the Knight of Shadowed Flame is immune to fatigue and exhaustion.

Now, at night, you can sleep in your armor, or march all night to get to a place you need to be.

Blazing Sword (Sp): Any weapon held by the Knight of Shadowed Flame, as well as any unarmed attacks or natural weapons he uses, are superconducted by his tremendous temperature. They deal one additional fire damage. This effect ends as soon as he releases the weapon. The Novice of Fire ability does not improve this damage, as it does not do die of damage.

Racial quality of the Azer.

Armor of Darkness (Su): Once per day per level in this class, the Knight of Shadowed Flame may bind shadows to his form. His armor gains the 'shadowed' quality, for one minute per class level.

Originally, this granted you the ability to cast Armor of Darkness, from the SRD and from Deities and Demigods, once per day. I stopped huffing paint, though, and realized it wasn't fair.

Lord of Phlogiston (Ex): The Knight of Shadowed Flame gains the Fire subtype. A creature with the fire subtype has immunity to fire. It has vulnerability to cold, which means it takes half again as much (+50%) damage as normal from cold, regardless of whether a saving throw is allowed, or if the save is a success or failure.

I like the fire subtype. >_> It negates the fire resistance from earlier, but reasonably so.

Umbral Lord (Sp): Once per day, for one hour per class level, the Knight of Shadowed Flame may change himself into a Greater Shadow. He retains all of his abilities, including his fire subtype.

Wild shaping into one form of undead is very useful and handy, but not gamebreaking, I don't think. For one, you're probably missing a lot of your abilities. The big benefit is the ability to do 1d8 strength damage, and hide really well. Its an ability to escape things, really.

Master of the Holocaust (Ex): The Knight of Shadowed Flame is a supreme master of all things related to the fire. His metallic weapons are now Flaming weapons (+1d6 damage), and his body produces a tremendous amount of heat. Anyone who hits him with a natural or unarmed attack, or is engaged in a grapple with him, takes 1d6 fire damage.

The former- an expansion of his earlier ability to make get the Azer racial quality of Heat.

Pyro (Ex): The skill of the Knight of Shadowed Flame is tremendous- he knows how to burn, in just the right place, always. His fire damage always burns his enemies- always. Opponents who have fire resistance do not apply them against his fire attacks. Enemies who are immune to fire damage still take 1/2 the full fire damage. The only creatures who remain immune to the pyre of the Knight of Shadowed Flame are those with the fire subtype.

The piercing cold metamagic feat, and class ability of a level 7 PrC ability from Frostburn (which autoPiercing's all your spells), converted to fire.

Tenebrous King (Su): Upon attaining 11th level, the Knight of Shadowed Flame is surrounded by a perpetual aura of darkness. Torches dim in his presence, cloud cover coats him perpetually, but for all this, he still remains a burning beacon of pure elemental hatred. The Knight of Shadowed Flame can automatically know the location of any corporeal creature within 10 feet by sensing the disturbance in the ambient temperature that the creature causes.

Last, if he does not already have it, he gains the Evil subtype. This means that all natural attacks he has, as well as any weapons he wields, bypass damage reduction as though the weapon were Evil aligned.

Evil subtype hurts more than it helps, I've found.

Knights of Shadowed Flame choose their spells from the following list:

1st Level- cause fear, corrupt weapon, doom, endure elements, inflict light wounds, produce flame, summon monster I*.

2nd Level- bull’s strength, darkness, heat metal, inflict moderate wounds, flaming sphere, pyrotechnics, summon monster II*.

3rd Level- deeper darkness, inflict serious wounds, protection from energy, summon monster III*.

4th Level- fire shield, freedom of movement, inflict critical wounds, poison, summon monster IV*.

*Evil creatures only, or any with the Fire subtype who are not good.

I love this spell list. Its so cute. Not enough 3rd level spells, though, I was hoping someone could suggest some non-fireball spells that would concievably apply.

Anyway, I wanted a hardcore fighter elemental class. They don't really exist anymore- the only real elementalist PrC's are for mages... something which I wasn't a huge fan.

Maryring
2005-12-19, 03:53 AM
Why does it have 11 levels ???

And the magic, why Bull's Strenght but no Bear's Endurance? And why no cure magic. If I remember correctly, Black Guards can use cure magic.

Tynan
2005-12-19, 04:20 AM
I like what's going for it, some evil fire knight. The abilities seem well enough off, and since it's not making any other classes redundant... (That I know of).

As Marying said... 11 levels??

Gorthaur
2005-12-19, 04:25 AM
I originally had it at 13 levels, but then realized it needed high prerequisites to justify it, and didn't want it to hit epic.

Eleven levels allows it to fit in all the abilities I wanted it to have.

Dragonmuncher
2005-12-19, 04:36 AM
11 levels!?!?! You sir, are a crazy man. I don't think I want to stand too close to you...

All jokes aside, PrCs are usually 5 or 10 levels. I guess it's more just so they all fit a standard, than of any real reason. Although a 3-level prestige class just seems kind of silly.

But really, one extra level shouldn't be that much of a deal, if you really can't think of a way to squeeze it a bit more.

I actually like this class- it seems pretty cool. I'm sure others will have suggestions, I'm too tired to really analyze it at the moment. You might want to clarify that first level ability, though. Can he set anything on fire, just by touching it? Is there a size/weight limit? Does it count as a firey touch attack?

I understand the flavor you were going for with it, just needs to be tightened up a bit.

ILM
2005-12-19, 05:29 AM
PrC the first :
The others have done a fine job of pointing out how broken it is, so I won't expand on the subject (except by pointing out that aside from all the abilities it gets high bab, high skills, and two high saves, and that Acrobat's Balace should be reworded so it doesn't sound like you get complete immunity to trips and any other conditions that knock you down).

What I will say, however, is that using the excuse that WotC made broken abilities therefore you can as well is childish and, more importantly, a fallacy. Yes, WotC made broken stuff. That doesn't mean you have to as well. In fact, you as a DM are supposed to keep stuff like that from getting in your game. If you have players whose characters do stupid stuff, smack the players behind the head and tell them to quit their antics, and then make them face the consequences in-game. If they insist to slaughter anything in sight and you can't legitimately (ie without using level 20 NPCs with custom classes the players can never get access to) stop them, then announce that they've killed the whole city, end of campaign.

Also, telling them your exact opinion on Twice Betrayers or Hurlers or what-have-you before the game might help a bit. The CO Boards spotlight build are the reason why I ask my players to tell me where they're character is going before the game starts.

As for the second PrC, I find that it's much more balanced. 11 levels is strange, and you should take a look at the Elemental Warrior PrC in the Planar Handbook (or is it the Manual of the Planes ? I forget).

Thomas
2005-12-19, 08:41 AM
Libris Mortis, True Necromancer - 13 levels. Don't ask me why, but it certainly sets the precedent for prestige classes with more than 10 levels.

ILM
2005-12-19, 10:22 AM
Libris Mortis, True Necromancer - 13 levels. Don't ask me why, but it certainly sets the precedent for prestige classes with more than 10 levels.
14, actually.

Gorthaur
2005-12-20, 02:59 AM
11 levels!?!?! You sir, are a crazy man. I don't think I want to stand too close to you...

I'm only slightly crazy. For example, I wear tinfoil hats to keep out the Mind Flayers.

(On a side note, no- I'm never fully serious, and will often crack jokes at my own expense. I'm an easy target.)


All jokes aside, PrCs are usually 5 or 10 levels. I guess it's more just so they all fit a standard, than of any real reason. Although a 3-level prestige class just seems kind of silly.

I loathe 3 level prestige classes. I loathe them with the burning fire of a thousand suns. Eleven is also a pseudo-mystical number, seeing as its the number of apostles as well as being 1 and 1 together, and I like pretending that I'm smart enough to craft symbolism even in the number of levels in a PrC.


But really, one extra level shouldn't be that much of a deal, if you really can't think of a way to squeeze it a bit more.

In trying, I found I gave some abilities too soon, and it makes the class top heavy and too easy to splash... a 3.0 ranger if I've ever seen one. And as much as I like 3.0, I hate 3.0 rangers (except, oddly, when I wanted to dual wield. They're way cooler then)


I actually like this class- it seems pretty cool. I'm sure others will have suggestions, I'm too tired to really analyze it at the moment. You might want to clarify that first level ability, though. Can he set anything on fire, just by touching it? Is there a size/weight limit? Does it count as a firey touch attack?

It was added because the PC in question had a contract with an infernal being (rather specifically, it was the terms of service for him being a blackguard), and wanted to say "Oh, about that contract?" And burn it up in his palm.

The ability probably has a limitation of "nothing alive, only things like kindling, paper, and stuff thats cool to burn, like children". Something like that. If you're not aware yet, I like PrC's that have a lot of DM fiat, and my PrC's are based off mental images of Cool. I prefer a lot of mostly useless abilities (like, touching someone's artwork and watching it burn to ashes) as opposed to stuff that says "FIreball 1/day" or whatever.


I understand the flavor you were going for with it, just needs to be tightened up a bit.

I... agree. My PrC's are for rules-light games... or for ones where I have people way better at powergaming than myself. I'm sure its easily broken, what with its gaining of two subtypes and its "YAY ALL MELEE WEAPONS DEAL +1d6 DAMAGE" ability, but even that isn't so bad, I don't think... but then again, as the Capuchin PrC proves, I'm a huge idiot. Seriously.

*nod*

ILM
2005-12-20, 06:16 AM
I... agree. My PrC's are for rules-light games... or for ones where I have people way better at powergaming than myself. I'm sure its easily broken, what with its gaining of two subtypes and its "YAY ALL MELEE WEAPONS DEAL +1d6 DAMAGE" ability, but even that isn't so bad, I don't think... but then again, as the Capuchin PrC proves, I'm a huge idiot. Seriously.
*nod*
In fact, I think the class is grossly underpowered. If I wanted a fiery dark warrior, I'd bribe my DM into accepting the Pyrokineticist PrC (from the XPH, but there's nothing psionic about its abilities - one of which grants you +4d6 fire damage to all melee attacks, btw, so your +1d6 is clearly not anything to be worried about) or the Disciple of Mephistopheles one in BoVD, or the Elemental Warrior in the Planar Handbook, and mix it with Blackguard levels.

Gorthaur
2005-12-21, 03:52 PM
Balanced Warrior
10 level Prestige Class
d12 HD
2 + Int Mod Skill Points (skill list to be done)
BAB as Fighter
Good Fort saves.

Requirements:
Base Attack Bonus: +6
Feats- Endurance, Diehard, Karmic Strike, Combat Reflexes
Special- Must have damage reduction or energy resistance of some form.

Editors note- no, I didn't save the flavor. I worked on this as a favor to another board I went to. Basically, the ultimate in retributive warriors.

If you try to burn him, he will burn you back. Thats his policy. If you try to freeze him, he'll shoot bolts of ice across vast territories just to spite you.


1 Energy Return 5, Release
2 Vengeance
3 Energy Return 10
4 Vengeful Blast
5 Energy Return 15
6 Karmic Channeling
7 Energy Return 20
8 Retributive Strike
9 Energy Return 25
10 Wave of Mutilation, Energy Return 30

Energy Return (Su): Whenever a Balanced Warrior is dealt energy damage, he can instead choose to store the pure elemental damage within himself. Every odd numbered level, and 10, this improves by a further 5.

When he stores the damage within himself, his body seems to take on some of that elements properties- if he absorbs electricity, he seems to be jagged and quick. If he absorbs fire, his eyes smoulder, the air above him distorted with heat. If he has energy reduction, in order to use the Release ability, he must voluntarily lower it.

If he does not release this energy within (con modifier + Balanced Warrior levels) rounds, he instead takes it all. He can only store as much damage as his Energy Return is listed. If he has enough natural Energy Resistance to aid him, then it will help against the backlash, but all extra damage spills over.

Editors note- In effect, you can, by the time the PrC completes itself, store up to 30 points of elemental damage, and touch someone to hurt them with all of it. Balanced? Yes. Weak? Hell yes. "I ignore your fireball, and now rather than power attacking your wizard, I will touch him and deal 30 points of amazing fire damage!" So a lot of the class was trying to figure out how to balance this and also make it a worthwhile choice.

Release (Ex): Holding all this pent up energy is quite painful, and thus it must have some form of release. The stored up energy he may use as a bonus on damage in a melee attack, the bonus being damage of that element. Alternatively, he may make a touch attack, and release all the damage purely into a foe, or into the air.

Editors note- Around here, I decided... screw it. The guy has to voluntarily fail his saves, and sure, he gets effective ALL ENERGY RESISTANCE 30, but he can't store up two different types of energy. Not to mention that in order to be effective, he has to wait for a foe to hurt him.

Part of the reason people didn't like this on my home forum is that while I was playtesting this, I discovered that if you are always up front, and have enough Energy Resistance to store up the damage from the wizards fireball, you effectively dealt about double damage with said fireball. But takes 10 levels to become effective, and while you store up your wizards LIghtning Bolt, ready to unleash the pain a second time, you can get hurt easily by an opponents Meteor shower. Potato, potahto.

Vengeance (Ex): The wrath of the Balanced Warrior is something that fills all with fear. If he unleashes the elemental damage within him on the foe who dealt it to him, no energy resistance will protect them. He cannot damage Fire subtype enemies with Fire damage, or Cold with Cold damage.

Editors note- Mostly because someone, in an early prototype of this class, said "OMG THE ARMOR BONUSES THAT GIVE RESISTANCES ARE BETTER THAN THIS CLASS", so I said "...alright" and added this. You have 30 Fire resistance, and you want to hit me with a fire spell? THATS ALRIGHT, I'LL BURN THROUGH YOUR RESISTANCE. You can't hurt a fire elemental with fire damage, though, so all is right with the world.

Yes, the spite comment is a joke.

Vengeful Blast (Su): To release the energy stored, the Balanced Warrior may now make a ranged touch attack as a standard action, with a range of thirty feet. This has frightened many warriors- to watch a warrior filled with rage swing his sword, and unleash an inferno.

Editors note- I liked the idea of... effectively.. a guy getting shot with fire, turning red, steam pouring from his mouth and eyes, and then he uses laser eye beams to burn off his excess heat, burning it into his foe. Also, since its a ranged touch, it won't apply with other things. And sure, there's no randomization of damage, but its pretty pathetic at best.

Karmic Channeling (Su): The Balanced Warrior now includes Holy and Unholy damage as energy types he can channel. Damage that is listed as Purely Divine (see Flame Strike) does not count- he still takes that damage, but he can store the fire.

Editors note- Someone said "BUT I WANTED MY PALADIN TO BE ABLE TO STORE INFLICT SPELLS AND THEN BASH PEOPLE WITH THEM BUT MY DM SAYS THAT INFLICT IS EVIL". Yes, this entire PrC was made to spite a stupid GM who said that Inflict was evil... Turned out nice, I think, though. Either way, you can store up the damage from Vile things, like Corrupt spell, and then hit an enemy with a bolt of pure evil that manages to burn the Balor's skin. I like that. A lot.

Retributive Strike (Ex): Merely damaging the balanced warrior is a stupid move. Any attack that deals elemental damage to him provokes an Attack of Opportunity, including a Flaming Weapon, or Shocking Grasp.

Editors note- an expansion of the Karmic Strike feat. Also, at the time this was made in 3.0, it was better to get a +1 Flaming Shocking Icy weapon than a +4 weapon. Still is now that they made DR not related to pure + bonuses... since technically you get a MINIMUM of +1 damage, and CAN get up to +5 more than that... yeah.

Wave of Mutilation (Su): The mastery of balance becomes quite overpowering. With a wave of his hand, as a full round action, the balanced warrior may release all stored up damage within himself and unleash it as a cone or line. If it is released as a cone, it has a range of 30 feet. If it is released as a line, it has a range of 60 feet. The reflex save against this ability is 17, for half damage.

Editors note- This one has a fun story. I was sleeping one day, and woke up with the phrase "Wave of Mutilation".

I have possibly hundreds of PrC's and Core Classes on my computer, almost all my own, all heavily modified. Most lack sufficient capstones or good ending abilities, which is something I'm a fan of. And when I come across a mechanic that reminds me of one of those things I haven't finished, I look through my classes and try to figure out which one it fits to.

Wave of Mutilation fits here, and frankly the phrase is so awesome it works. This may or may not be the most broken part of the whole class. They have 30 points to store up here, so they're at full capacity. Assume they are ignoring elemental attacks and doing 30 extra damage on the first hit in each round. Fair enough, thats what this class *was* designed to do, after all. Except here, try a mass combat situation. You're a level 7 barbarian, level 10 guy, up against a horde of level 15 guys or something. Wizard fireballs, you get angry and Wave of Mutilation everyone. People take 30 damage.

Lots of people at once.

Now, thats why the ability has a low DC. 15 damage to a lot of people is what I like to call Crowd Control, and most classes don't have it. It cleans orcs dead, and is mostly useless against bosses. Its just a version of Frost Nova, if you're a diablo 2 fan, that kills a lot of people right dead. Its what it does. 30 damage is nothing to scoff at, either, but considering how pointless that is when you compare it to a power attacking frenzied berserker...

Anyway, the PrC on the whole is designed to ruin the day of people who say "But I like this element and will never ever be diverse in my entire life!" Or a really fun PrC to take when your DM shows he has a serious love of Acid or what have you.

Seriously, this was built primarily to be a retributive warrior- who very rarely attacked, but hurting him was deadly. Its focus changed to being an anti-elementalist as I went on, and frostburn came out... yeah. I'm desperate for commenting on this one, though.

phleebagg
2005-12-22, 12:14 AM
Hey, is it just me, or is it possible to continuously bounce energy between two of these guys? And what exactly would the consequences be for this? Other than that, it would be pretty cool to play as.

Gorthaur
2005-12-27, 03:30 AM
Hrm... I have never considered that. That would actually be insanely smart, and would make their damage potential skyrocket. They'd still suck, and be utterly defeated by a subtype or immunity to energy, but thats no big deal.

Technically, yes, they can. It isn't as effective as, say, being hit with a flaming burst attack and whipping out an Attack of Opportunity dealing all that damage back to the person who hit you, but it is still a nifty idea. A very, very nifty idea. Does that unbalance them?

Anyway, here's another.

Disciple of Invincibility
HD: d10
Saves: Good Fort and Will

REQUIREMENTS
Skills: Knowledge Religion 6 Ranks
Feats: Endurance, Great Fortitude, Improved Toughness
Base Fortitude Save: +6
Alignment: Evil
Special: The character must participate in a ritual ordained by his faith and be capable of casting second level spells.

Class Skills: As Cleric

Skill Points: 2+Int Mod per level

Armor and Weapon Proficiency: All simple and martial weapons, all armors, and shields.

Base Attack Bonus: As Fighter

Lvl…Special Abilities
1……Devilbound, DR 2/-
2……
3……DR 4/-
4……Unstrikable (25%)
5……DR 6/-
6……Unstrikable (50%)
7……DR 8/-
8……Unstrikable (75%)
9……DR 10/-
10…..Invincibility

Devilbound- The DoI contains the spirits, and flesh, of more than a few demons and devils. He radiates an aura of evil as an evil cleric would at a similar level, equal to his levels in this class (in addition to any others gained with cleric, or Paladin). This rough demonlike skin gives him a +2 natural armor bonus. He also gains a base DR of 2/-, which improves by two every two levels.

Unstrikable- The DoI has gained some small measure of control over his own reflexes and powers. He has a 25% chance to ignore a critical hit, or a sneak attack. This provides no protection against vorpal weapons.

This improves to 50% at level 6, and is 75% effective at level 8.

Invincibility- Perhaps the most feared aspect of a Disciple of Invincibility, the level 10 disciple of Invincibility may double his damage reduction against a single type of attack- Slashing, Bludgeoning, or Piercing. They also recieve an additional ability depending on whether they picked Slashing, Bludgeoning, or Piercing. Once selected, this cannot be changed, for any reason.

Slashing- You are not hampered by loss of your head. You will continue to fight on without it. You suffer a -2 penalty to attack rolls, but otherwise suffer no more than the weapon did to you as it severed your head. (The critical damage may be negated by your Unstrikable ability)
Bludgeoning- You cannot be Stunned, Paralyzed, Held magically or Bull Rushed- such attempts automatically fail. You may not be knocked unconscious, and may act normally while Dying.
Piercing- You are immune to effects that produce incurable or bleeding wounds, such as mummy rot, a sword with the wounding special ability, or a clay golem’s cursed wound ability. This includes Vile Damage.

Editors notes- this seems overpowered, but in actuality, its basically a spell-less character who becomes immune to 'most' critical hits, a property gained by many other PrC's and is actually a purchase you can make for armor (Heavy Fortification). He also learns to ignore damage quite readily. through his DR, and becomes ultimately immune to 'lesser' wounds. However, he still gets no bonus to smashing people, as this is a purely defensive class. A scary one, but even it has its weaknesses (notably, in that energy spells completely bypass DR, as do most Inflict spells.)

I still view this as the defensive counterpart, a Lawful Evil variant if you'd like, of the Frenzied Berserker.

HUGE EDIT. I forgot to state why the Knight of Shadowed Flame doesn't get healing spells.... I thought it was obvious.

They are not suitable for party play.

Perhaps its me, but I think too many evil games rely on "yay, my guy is the same as you guys, but can do evil things". Healing is something usable on yourself or other people.

Originally, it was healed by negative energy, and hurt by positive- but it got the axe because I had too many nifty abilities for it as-is. Also, they're rather focused on destroying their enemies- not saving themselves after combat.

Gorthaur
2006-01-09, 02:26 AM
Sidenote- I'm really sorry about the lack of replies and PrC's, because yeah, I have a bunch (and I do like the comments on them, since they tend to make me notice things that I don't notice early on. They help me close loopholes)

I got very very inspired by the movie, play, and soundtrack of the Phantom, and to be honest, they all ROCK SO HARD I was inspired to come up with a prestige class for our favorite scarred friend. Also, most bard PrC's lack a level of FUN that most PrC's include. Sorry, but Seeker of the Sublime Chord just wasn't cool. Mechanically awesome, but not really different.

The Phantom
10 level Prestige Class
d6 HD
4 + Int Mod Skill Points
BAB as Cleric
Good Will and Ref saves, bad Fort saves
Requirements:
Inspire Greatness (the bardic music effect)
Skill Focus: Perform (Sing)
Alignment: Any non-good
Class Skills- As Bard

I gave you my music/Made your song take wing
and now, how you've repaid me/Denied me and betrayed me
He was bound to love you/When he heard you sing!
You will curse the day you did not do/All that the phantom asked of you!

Level Abilities
1 +1 Spellcasting, My Spirit and Your Voice
2 +1 Spellcasting
3 +1 Spellcasting, Think of Me
4 +1 Spellcasting, Trapdoor
5 +1 Spellcasting, Angel of Music
6 +1 Spellcasting
7 +1 Spellcasting, Masquerade
8 +1 Spellcasting
9 +1 Spellcasting, All I Ask of You
10 +1 Spellcasting, Past the Point of No Return

Spells per Day: When a new Phantom level is gained, the character gains new spells per day as if he had also gained a level in Bard. He does not, however, gain any other benefit a character of that class would have gained, except for an increased effective level of spellcasting.

Editors Note- I hate staggered spellcasting. :P It ends up ripping up your character concept, and as much as it may be balancing.. this only applies to bard spells. It doesn't kill game balance TOO badly to have BARDS WITH SIXTH LEVEL SPELLS OH NO. I think. And hope.

My Spirit and Your Voice (Su): The Phantom has taken on a protege, his songs being sung seemingly through another person. He may freely give up any of his bardic music abilities to another bard, usually his cohort, and his allies may willingly use his Perform skill modifier in place of their own. Often, a Phantom will refer to this as a strange duet.

Editors Note- For his abilities, I went through the names of his songs, and his lyrics, and came up with appropriate crunch to apply to his abilities and fit the words he used in the song. The Phantom can teach Christine to Sing, and be the best operatic performer ever, but it comes at a foul price.

Think of Me: This is a bardic music effect. The Phantom may expend one of his Bardic Music attempts to cast the spell Dominate Person (DC 10 + Phantom level + Phantom’s Cha modifier). This may only be used upon targets who have willingly accepted his Perform ranks in place of their own at least once. Though it is Bardic Music, this ability is nonmagical in nature, representing an almost demonic pact to serve him, and can be used in an antimagic field.

Editors Note- This is the biggest danger you have to fear if you deal with a Phantom. You see, they can dominate you, and assuming you crunch charisma to get +6 or so to it, at level 20, its a DC 26 nonmagical effect to Dominate people. Its nice, and actually makes enchantment a viable possibility except against people like monks and clerics.

Trapdoor (Ex): The Phantom is able to sense traps and secret doors simply by being within 5 feet of them, as though he were an elf.

Editors Note- A random cute idea I had, mostly because he vanished and did that. Plus, its an expansion of the elf ability. This one might be broken. Actually, it pretty much is. Any suggestions as to how to fix it?

Angel of Music (Ex): The Phantom's motives can no longer be discerned. He is protected at all times by a Mind Blank spell. True Seeing will not see him as he is, nor his alignment- but he will appear to be a celestial of some sort. This is apt, as his voice at this point has reached a level most would call Divine.

Editors Note- This one is designed because its impossible for evil PC's to get along in good parties, even if they genuinely like the good people near them- the party paladins just say "detect evil, you die!" and this is designed to snub that. Gotta use your own judgement... but also, its to provide a level of mystery. At that level, people begin leaving lingering evil auras that a paladin can trace.. and again, bard villain!

Masquerade: This is a bardic music effect. The Phantom may expend one of his Bardic Music attempts to cast the spell Seeming upon many people at once (1 per level of Phantom + levels in Bard). Unlike the spell, the targets do not get a save, although spell resistance applies normally.

Editors Note- Paper faces on parade! So at level 20, 20 people now look like elves, or trolls! Oh nos! Not that broken, I don't think, but its fairly effective. Its a useful ability... mostly for disguise.

All I Ask of You: This is a bardic music effect. The Phantom may expend one of his Bardic Music attempts to cast the spell Geas (DC 10 + Phantom level + Phantom’s Cha modifier) upon a single target. Though it is Bardic Music, this ability is nonmagical in nature. He may only use this on foes he has Dominated.

Editors Note- This one... might be the most broken of them all, depending on how cruel you are with Geas's. Again (for my PrC's), mechanics takes a backseat to style. The phantom can probably loan you 17 ranks in Perform, and grant that bonus to you... but is it worth being changed into his ideal performer, and his personal servant?

Past the Point of No Return: This is a bardic music effect. The Phantom may expend three of his Bardic Music attempts to cast the spell Insanity (DC 10 + Phantom level + Phantom’s Cha modifier) upon many people at once (1 per level of Phantom + levels in Bard).

Editors Note- Don't know how this one works out, honestly. Some feedback on it would be nice, because it just FEELS broken. Maybe fix it to be Random Action, affecting all who hear it?

Mechanically, nothing really gives this guy a lot over a normal bard, except he can use Bardic Music to do some nifty things. Originally, I was thinking of a 'scarred' ability, wherein you get a -2 to charisma, but you can use Int or Wis for the DC's of your abilities, for bardic spellcasting, and perform- but opted against it, it'd clutter the PrC up.

This is also quite obviously designed for a campaign long bard big bad evil villain... and if you want to be honest, the stereotype exists- but why then are there so many evil sorcerors, warlords, barbarian chieftains, and dark cultists? LET THE PHANTOM'S HAVE SOME LIGHT. BE KIND TO BARDS!

ShneekeyTheLost
2006-01-09, 04:35 AM
Balanced Warrior...

I like the concept. I would go ahead and give the Wave of Mutilation DC fort based (i.e. 15+ fort mod. Still won't get up over 20 very often, even if ya get someone front-loading, and for THAT high level a campaign, that's plenty easy to beat).

DoI...

Also a very good concept. They get 3/4 BAB, which is a VERY nice offset to their difficulty to kill. Even Dwarven Defender gets D12 hit die and full BAB. You also have no spells, although you require spells as prerequsite, so this can be done by fallen palladins, rangers, or higher-end clerics who choose to loose extra spells to get immunities.

As for the Phantom... I love the play, I loved the most reccent movie that came out. Not too sure if I like your take on it.

To be honest, the Phantom did everything with pure Bard. Facinate + Glibness and you could convince your own mother that you were a total stranger. Christine was an innocent and naieive little girl, no match for the powers of persuation any bluff-oriented Bard can level. Charm Person, Dominate Person... all spells Bards can learn. I think they even get Geas. You just had a chaotic evil bard tutoring a good little child in the ways of the bard. Then he got upset and people found out just how nasty a well-played Bard can really be.

I once had a Bard PrC that focused on their bluff/illusion/charm side. They got a slightly wider selection of magic, and could do a few things more with their songs, at a sacrafice of other bardic song (they loose inspiration and greater inspiration as I recall) and Bardic Knowledge progression (as well as a few other things I can't remember at this time). Prerequsite was something like Spell Focus (enchantment), Spell Focus (Illusion), and I think the feat that gives +2 to bluff and diplomacy, as well as bardic songs and something like a +4 BAB. Was fairly interesting. You should see some of the con-artists I came up with that thing.

MagFlare
2006-01-09, 09:34 AM
I imagine the Balanced Warrior spending a lot of time deliberately getting in the way of friendly spellcasters' areas of effect.

Mage: "Cone of Cold comin' through! Get out of the way, man!"
BW: "Bring it on! I'm tough! I can take it!"
Mage: "I'm not joking! These things really hurt!"
BW: "No! Seriously, I'm fine right here!"

Etc.

What I'm not sure about is that this class relies entirely on its enemies' behavior to provide its abilities. Sure, if a Balanced Warrior is fighting an Evoker, then he's pretty much the star of the show - but what if the wizard gets the idea that you're not supposed to toss energy at the guy and contents himself with summoning monsters instead? Suddenly the Balanced Warrior's got nothing to do.