Looking to take down Xykon

[Korivan]

Not sure if I spelt the name right, nor was I sure if this went under OOTS, or gaming. But anyways, alot of times when reading a fantasy book or movie, my mind wonders to thinking, "ya know, if our dm pit that against us, what would we do?" So thats the question, I'm looking to take that arrogant son of a gun down. From this thread I might be taking ideas for a lich boss in my campaign. So far, Xykon has slain/defeated at least 4 or 5 wizards/druid? All the while taunting them about thier sense of superiority. I figure the key to taking this is using buff spells to make myself immune to his spells. So far, I know of his spell list is following...

1st level
burning hands, magic missile
2nd level
shatter
3rd level
fireball, lighting bolt, possible dispel magic
4th level
otilukes resilient sphere, greater invisibility, animate dead
5th level
cloudkill, symbol of pain, overland flight
6th level
????
7th level
forcecage?, finger of death
8th level
????
9th level
meteor storm, energy drain

Epic
superior dispelling, that warding spell (something cloister?)

I know I'll want epic counterspelling, and superior dispelling, energy immunity (fire), death ward, and shield. I figure those alone will stop almost half of his known arsonal, anyway to optimise the rest of his spell list (so far i think he's almost all fire and necro).

[JeminiZero]

Feat wise I think he has Sudden Maximize somewhere in there (no other way to Maximize Energy Drain). And Craft Wondrous Item for the Phylactery.

Looking at that, your best bet might be a Necropolitan Swordsage/Master of the Nine. Use Dual Stance to Project Air Walk and Flames blessing for fly and fire immunity. Necropolitan takes care of most of Death/Symbol/Magic. Swordsage evasion should take care of all his other big flashy spells. And since these are all Ex or Su abilities thay cannot be dispelled. Squeeze fast healing somewhere in there and he might win a war of attrition.

[arguskos]

Here's a good resource for Xykon's stats (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=5183593&postcount=13).

[Korivan]

Here's a good resource for Xykon's stats (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=5183593&postcount=13).

Dude, THANKS!!!!

[Quietus]

Feat wise I think he has Sudden Maximize somewhere in there (no other way to Maximize Energy Drain). And Craft Wondrous Item for the Phylactery.

It's possible that Xykon has 12th level spell slots. We know he's Epic, but we don't know just *how* Epic.. and it's not really all that difficult to get Improved Spell Capacity x3 and Epic Spellcasting when you're getting a free bonus feat every other level.

[Saph]

You can't build a character until you know what is and isn't allowed, and no-one knows exactly what houserules/available books the OotS-verse uses. From what we've seen it's mostly Core, but there are enough slight discrepancies that there's no way to know exactly whether any build is legal or not.

In RL terms, this would be like building a character for a campaign where the Dungeon Master is too busy to talk to you and doesn't have room in his group anyway. :P

- Saph

[herrhauptmann]

Normally I'd say 'mindfog' but he's undead, so I don't think that'll work.

Mindblank, to protect your own head.
Disjunction. It's cheating, but it is also unfair to build a creature specifically to fight something. Like building to fight a Balor. It can be done at level 14, but your character can ONLY fight balors effectively. Everything else, you're not as effective against it.
Slashingdispel. You remove his buffs, and deal damage to him.
Black blade of disaster (SC)
A spell which makes you incorporeal. Xykon doesn't seem to have many force spells, which is the only real way to hit incorporeal targets (besides making them solid again). So he's going to a 30% miss chance against you.

He seems to use a good bit of symbols, fire, and lightning.

[Totally Guy]

What no, don't do it he's too dangerous. And he's smarter than he looks.

[Tempest Fennac]

herrhauptmann, Ghost form is a level 8 Transmutation which makes you incorporal for 1 round/level. (Xykon used this spell in the last Azure City beacon tower). Gate could be useful if you're willing to summon something really powerful.

[Pharaoh's Fist]

If your enemy is quick to anger, seek to irritate him. Pretend to be weak, that he may grow arrogant.
-Sun Zi, the Art of War

[Mando Knight]

Gate could be useful if you're willing to summon something really powerful.

Yeah, that could work! And then throw in an epic level Wizard to boot...

...OH WAIT.

[Flickerdart]

Part of Xykon's mojo is how much higher level he is than most things he goes up against. So long as you have immunity to negative levels and fire damage, and paralysis for good measure, some dispels to block Forcecage and you should do fine. You could even Empowered Sunburst-nuke him into dust, as straightforward as that strategy is.

[Alteran]

Would the safest way be to find him when he's not expecting anything, and not give him time to retaliate? IE, teleport in and wipe him out in a round. I expect V was trying to do that, but since he didn't get the skill bonuses from the soul splices, he failed his concentration check after getting zapped.

How about: Epic Teleport in through the Cloister, so you get a surprise round. Disjunction, then quickened maximized disintegrate. That would normally be a 13th level spell, but I've heard things about a "sudden maximize" feat/ability/whatever. If it's possible to do this with quicken, then it would only take a 9th level slot. And if you're high enough level to take 2 epic feats, you could take multispell (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/epic/feats.htm#multispell) so you can cast another quickened maximized disintegrate if he manages to save against the first.

Since he has no CON score, his HP won't be fantastic. I know he has d12 HD, but that isn't enough to withstand a single maximized disintegrate unless he somehow rolled extremely well on every die. He seems to have protection from disintegrate (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0653.html) (or maybe just a deflection bonus to AC?), but disjunction should take care of that, unless you fail to disjoin a key magic item.

[erikun]

If your enemy is quick to anger, seek to irritate him. Pretend to be weak, that he may grow arrogant.
-Sun Zi, the Art of War
This. You're going to get further with information-gathering than trying to blast him senseless.

As for defenses, I'd think most of the common suggestions would work best. Blur, Mirror Image, Greater Invisibility, Shield, some way to gain Incorporeal. Disintegrate would work well, if that wasn't so obvious and he no doubt has defenses against it. Sunburst (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0652.html) seemed to work wonders, although you're probably better sending in minions to fight for you. Iron Golems are a good choice, especially if they're wearing anti-magic amulets. Allies are a good second choice, too. :smallwink: If anti-magic equipment is too much, then throw out an Incendiary Cloud and a couple of fire elemental summons - possibly a red/gold dragon summon, if you can pull it off. Lob greater dispelling at him while the golems pound on him, and the elementals/dragon heal them up with fire damage.

Look into Death Ward to protect yourself - I'm sure you can get in on an armor, if a friendly cleric can't be found.

And this isn't even getting into epic.

Honestly, the hardest part in fighting Xykon (and any lich, for that matter) is cleaning things up after the battle - his Phylactery is likely immune to mundane damage, disintegrate, and has a permanent non-detection (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0661.html) effect on it. Xykon himself is no doubt using Mind Blank, making divination spells to gather information useless. There isn't much point in destroying him if he'll be back next week, and a chance to prepare afterwards.

[Coidzor]

And at this point, you'd need the loyalty/alliance of some aquatic creatures, preferably sahuagin or sommat (for the obvious numbers in the ocean thing) that can also lend aquatic creatures to the task of searching for the phlyactery right now.

[Harperfan7]

Since when is ghostform an 8th level spell? (Not saying that it isn't, I'm just curious)

[Eldariel]

Since when is ghostform an 8th level spell? (Not saying that it isn't, I'm just curious)

Since Spell Compendium.

[only1doug]

Since he has no CON score, his HP won't be fantastic. I know he has d12 HD, but that isn't enough to withstand a single maximized disintegrate unless he somehow rolled extremely well on every die. He seems to have protection from disintegrate (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0653.html) (or maybe just a deflection bonus to AC?), but disjunction should take care of that, unless you fail to disjoin a key magic item.

Looks like the spell "ray deflection" to me (Spell Compendium)

[Haven]

Xykon's plot armor gives him DR infinity/MacGuffin, so use one of those.

[Eldariel]

Xykon's plot armor gives him DR infinity/MacGuffin, so use one of those.

I dunno, Roy dismantled him barehanded. He doesn't seem very tough to destroy, just hard to hit.

[Kilremgor]

So, I guess the overall plan is something like (core-only):

1) Have a level 20 wizard chuaracter with decent chances for ranged touch attack (that means sensible dex score).
2) Have three spells available: Disjunction (well that bomb is there in OotS, and no sense barring abjuration), Disintegrate (well, obvious, and keep Transmutation), Moment of Prescience (always there, can't bar divination). Time Stop and Fireball (or any damage spell that liches are not immune to and lower than 5th level) may also help.
3) Prepare Maximized Disintegrate x2, Disjunction and Time Stop as four 9-level slots you always have (fill other slots with something else), and 2xMoment of Prescience as 8-th level slots (and something else). Add Quickened Fireball x2 (or any damage spell you are going to use from 2).
4) Get yourself buffed with Death Ward (if no cleric, drop Time stop from 9th level slots, and prepare Wish, then Wish for one), Moment of Prescience, and other buffs you have.
5) Approach Xykon (how exactly depends on the situation).
6) If not having surprise round, win initiative with MoP.
7) Cast Disjunction on X, that will take care of all the dangerous protecting items and buffs. Cast Quickened Fireball.
8) If you had surprise round in 6, well then you already won. Use MoP to win initiative; or alternatively, if you think you can win initiative anyway, use it later on ranged touch attack roll. Cast Maximized Disintegrate on X, dealing 240 damage with little to no chance of failure. Very likely the battle ends right there. If not, throw 2nd Quickened Fireball to finish X off. If it still doesn't end the battle, proceed to 9.
9) Now, it's Xykon's turn. Being sorcerer with (apparently) usual quickened spells problem that can't be fixed short of 3xAutomatic Quicken Spell, there isn't much he can do, especially after Disjunction.
Death Ward will protect from all the instakills, and being buffed, you can survive any single direct damage spell from X (or fully prevent the damage, depending on buffs).
At that point, X will likely use Superb Dispelling. However, if he's hit by Max. Disintegrate in 8), that may not be an option since backlash damage will kill him. Still, Superb Dispelling is perhaps the most dangerous thing (among the spells we know of) he can use, so its usage is assumed.
10) The next round the situation is quite simple anyway. Even if Superb Dispelled, you should have full HP versus fully dispelled, "item-free" and wounded (ranging from SD backlash damage + quickened fireball to Maximized Disintegrate + backlash + 2*QF) Xykon.
At that point your 2nd Maximized Disintegrate is pretty much the guaranteed kill. Add 2nd QF if is wasn't cast before.

Time Stop alternative: it is also a solid tactic to cast Time Stop if something goes wrong, and recast 2nd MoP and throw some Delayed Blast Fireballs. 2nd MoP then guarantees another initiative win, so getting MaxDis cast, and delayed blast fireballs throw some more damage in.
MoP alternative: MoP can be used on critical concentration checks or saves. If something feels wrong, it is worth not using it to win initiative but instead save it to protect your plans/casting from any 'traps', items usage, etc.

So,
if you have surprise round, Xykon gets damaged for 240 + 2 * (quickened spell damage) before even getting first action. That is, basically, a win. Even if somehow it doesn't end there, you should survive a round from X (V survived a lot). And then 480+ damage with 2nd MaxDis? That's not survivable (remember the item disjunction).

if no surprise round, there is greater risk, but still victory is very probable. After surviving one X' turn, that is likely spent Superb Dispelling or throwing damage spell/level drain versus your fully-buffed state, you can use Maximized Disintegrate... and win.

More options can be used, but those above are basic tactics that have great win chance. Disjunction to get rid of whatever can stop or weaken disintegrate, or increase Fort saves + then a Maximized Disintegrate FTW. Having no CON score, X without items can likely save only on natural 20.

The only way X can win if he's much more powerful than shown in battle with V (for example, 32+ level), or extremely lucky with nat 20's (has to roll two in succession). But then, remember that the victory detailed above can be done by 20 level wizard without epics... if X is 32+, just make an attacking character 26+, that will be enough to win over a sorcerer given that as wizard, you can perfectly prepare for taking X down :)

It's also worth noting that V was specifically prevented from using the tactic above (or at least it seems so). Fiends made it impossible to Wish for Death Ward, Durkon being occupied with Resurrection to cast one, having no Disjunctions (them being from Haerta's prepared spells), having (apparently) penalties to ranged attack due to weak dex and not resting, etc.

Still why he hasn't used MoP is strange.