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Claudius Maximus
2009-07-07, 07:34 PM
I see a lot of useful advice thrown around on these forums, so I thought I might solicit some for myself. In the game I run, the PCs are heading towards a ruined city, and I need some ideas for what they'll find there. Now, there's obviously a reason they're headed there; I'm looking for things other than their goal.

So, here's some information about the ruined city and its history: the city has been abandoned for six hundred years. It was once the seat of a vast empire that began to fall apart due to civil wars, monster attacks, a massive invasion of barbarians, and a large uprising of enslaved monstrous humanoid races. It's in the middle of a vast region of fertile plains. The entire region is populated by nomadic barbarian tribes, with the nearest example of civilization nearly 400 miles away.

The tribes generally stay away from ruins like this, since they're typically full of monsters and such, but a rare few (adventurers) raid them for the great magic and wealth they contain, so I'm thinking that the majority of the place has been picked clean, with only the depths untouched.

I'd like suggestions for monsters, interesting scenarios, and pretty much anything else you think is a good idea. I'm not averse to homebrewing if you have a concept that is not reflected in an existing book. As for what I already have in mind, I like the concept that it was once home to a mages' guild, so eldritch abominations and magical experiments are in. It's also been established that the city is built on the convergence of ley lines, making it a place of power. I'd like for there to be some great malevolence living in the deepest depths beneath the city, something that drains this energy. As for what exactly it is, I'm not sure, so suggest away.

There are two separate groups of characters, both consisting of 4 members. Both groups have an average level of 6. Sometimes they'll be separated, but occasionally they'll work together, so whatever you suggest should be possible for either 4 or 8 level sixish characters to handle. None of the characters are optimized, but nobody's particularly weak either.

Well, this ended up way longer than I intended it, so sorry to all those who feel that they have wasted their time.

herrhauptmann
2009-07-07, 07:45 PM
A party of antagonist adventurers? Think linear guild, but less obvious.
5 or 6 of them, level 8 or so. Enough to wipe out the individual parties if your players aren't smart enough to avoid conflict, but only a minor challenge if both of your parties are there.

Gargoyle statues that are, gargoyles?

Epic looking statues that are actually golems, come alive while the party is in a room, but deactivate if the party leaves.

Subversion: Stone golems that look like gargoyles.

Massive piles of undead often haunt ruins.

So do vermin. So maybe start with dire rats, then throw in a wererat or two.

Claudius Maximus
2009-07-07, 08:48 PM
A party of antagonist adventurers? Think linear guild, but less obvious.

I'm already kind of doing that. I think I should have made it clear that only one of the parties is composed of PCs. The NPC party is a bunch of amoral adventurers looking for loot, but they're also after the big nasty thing under the city, so I they'll probably appreciate the PCs helping them. Of course, the two parties might just fight each other (remember the amorality), in which case the PCs are going to have a tougher time against the more powerful stuff in the ruins. That's the idea, anyway. Thanks for the other suggestions.

Theres
2009-07-07, 09:17 PM
a giant nasty thing in the depths of a dead civilization draining energy would obviously be some sort of negative energy creature. i cant think of a truly remarkable one for level six to eight adventurers and why a weak old bodak would be in the depths of an ancient metropolis. a nightwalker or lich king while cliched as it is seems the best to me. city encounters are fun in a ruined city as I've run such an adventure before. Beholders the lesser kind, and mummies would be at their level and make sense in a city full of forgotten lore and dead copses. minotaurs lurking under the city would be cool taking advantage of natural forming mazes.drow (dark elves) are always cool for anything underground

Talon Sky
2009-07-07, 09:19 PM
Mimics are good fun for messing with the PC's. *evil grin*

Xenogears
2009-07-07, 09:37 PM
Euphoric Imps would be amusing. From the Fiend Folio. CR3. Basically all they can do is inject you with drugs that make you so full of bliss you are dazed.

Also for Fiend Folio. Cranium Rat Swarm. CR5 for an average size swarm. Basically rat swarms with their brains showing that have mind blast at will.....

Crypt Thing from Fiend Folio (okay so its the only book I have on hand.....) are kinda interesting. Their only real ability is to once per day force (will negates) everyone w/in 30 feet to be teleported between 100 and 1000 ft in a random direction. Good way to seperate some of the players if you throw a few of these at them CR3.

Carytid Column is a construct that looks exactly like a regular stone column until it awakens and turns into a stature of a chick with a magic sword. Plus any weapon used against it has a chance of breaking.

ErrantX
2009-07-07, 09:44 PM
Well, I don't know if you have access to the Complete Arcane or not, but the PrC in that book, Mage of the Arcane Order, inspired me to respond to your post.

As they have something called a Spellpool, a giant magic Redbox for spells, the adaptation section says that it could be some sort of a chained demi power that they may have restrained. Use that. Say the Mages of the Arcane Order (or what you call them in your world) were based in that city, and when it was destroyed, they had to abandon their Spellpool. Whatever that darkness is, it could be a restrained and dying demi-power, an angel, a demon, or really anything!

As for encounters in the city, as it's been said, undead and vermin come to mind, as well as crafty kobolds and goblins. In the Book of Vile Darkness, there a small blurb about a tribe of Goblins that have a chemical pit that they dump their people into to mutate them into super goblins. Perhaps the Spellpool may have something to do with that, and it gives them the Spellstitched template (normally only for undead, but we're adapting here).

Maybe have some of that going on, or a tribe of kobolds dedicated to worshipping Tiamat (or the Spellpool!). Have a small splinter group of kobolds (dragonwrought or even dragonborn!) that venerate Bahamut instead, have a quiet civil war that still rages in the underbelly of the city.

2 cents,
-X

erikun
2009-07-07, 09:58 PM
For inside the city, packs of Dire Wolves. (or whatever is CR appropriate) Basically, the animals living in the ruins got big and ugly.

A hallway full of arrow holes, with dozens of spent bolts and several skeletons lying in it. Inspecting the traps reveals the traps are all out of ammo, but walking down the hallway animates the skeletons to attack.

Harperfan7
2009-07-07, 10:43 PM
Living spells (maybe ragewalkers), nishruus, vasuthants, and maybe spellstitched undead.

Put the ragewalkers (with a few living spells) on the surface roaming around. Maybe some undead roaming around. Then put nishruus, vasuthants and more living spells down in the depths. For the big bad at the bottom, I don't know what to tell you.

Claudius Maximus
2009-07-07, 11:09 PM
Nishruus and living spells are great, but a Ragewalker would be way too strong.

I love the spellpool idea. It makes perfect sense, especially since it's a place of power. The malevolence beneath the city will definitely be connected to an old and corrupt spellpool. Any ideas as to exactly what it is, though?

Mnymosene
2009-07-07, 11:10 PM
Canals would be really cool.

Nabbing small boats for quicker navigation, getting attacked by watery monsters, etc.

Set
2009-07-08, 01:02 AM
As they have something called a Spellpool, a giant magic Redbox for spells, the adaptation section says that it could be some sort of a chained demi power that they may have restrained. Use that. Say the Mages of the Arcane Order (or what you call them in your world) were based in that city, and when it was destroyed, they had to abandon their Spellpool. Whatever that darkness is, it could be a restrained and dying demi-power, an angel, a demon, or really anything!

Building off of this, and the mention of living spells in a later post, you could have the spellpool be a colossal living spell, that spits off lesser living spells (oozes that carry the effect of a single spell). The spellpool was not truly a chained sentient power, at first, but as members of the Arcane Order died, part of their essence, connected to the Spellpool, flowed into it, and when the final cataclysm befell the city, the dozens of mages dying at once shocked the thing into a mad sentience. It's completely crazy, with the shattered remnants of a dozen arcanists screaming within it's gibbering mass, and spits forth living spells that wreak havoc on the surroundings.

A tribe of local humanoids (Dark Stalkers and Dark Creepers? I've always had a fondness for them.) have corralled a few of these living spells and use their abilities. A living Burning Hands is trapped in their forge, for instance, while they have somehow managed to 'tame' a few Living Chill Touches which they use as hunting hounds of sorts, smacking them forward with ten foot poles.

During the day, the locals crawl up into ruined buildings and sleep away the day in fortified hidey-holes, from which they can spy out at intruders (and wandering monsters). At night they come scuttling out, with dozens of the Creepers (or Kobolds, or whatever) pouring forth from tiny cracks in the masonry that seem too narrow to admit even their slender frames. In some cases, they might even use alchemical oils to squeeze into areas that they normally could not pass through, being treated as one size class smaller for squeezing purposes for a minute after application or something.

Another race might have barricaded off a section of the ruined city, and call it their own. Kobolds, Goblins or even Gnolls seem like good choices to take over an abandoned ruin, rather than build their own city, and they might consider the living spells and dark folk to be vermin and nuisances. A Goblin or Kobold clan might insist that they built this city (and have no memory of it ever belonging to anyone else, so they technically wouldn't be lying...), and demand tribute or even send adventurers back into the monster-haunted sections to help them deal with the other inhabitants! (The ultimate adventure weirdness, performing hunt-and-kill missions for 1/2 HD monsters who cower atop walls ready to hurl missiles and filth and refuse at anyone who threatens their 'great city,' rewarding their 'friends' with the information they have gained over generations of living in the city, by pointing them towards the most profitable areas to pillage, and, not entirely accidentally, towards the most dangerous beasties...)

Trodon
2009-07-08, 01:26 AM
Shadow Dragon... what :biggrin:


Edit: I don't mean an adult one just a wyrmling or young one then have the mother/father come after them once they gain a few levels.

ErrantX
2009-07-08, 01:46 AM
Nishruus and living spells are great, but a Ragewalker would be way too strong.

I love the spellpool idea. It makes perfect sense, especially since it's a place of power. The malevolence beneath the city will definitely be connected to an old and corrupt spellpool. Any ideas as to exactly what it is, though?

Make it a focus for something later in your campaign, perhaps they set it free and it escapes, leaves a smaller boss for them to fight. Perhaps a massive living spell? To the above poster who suggested living spells: Brilliant, I wish I had thought of it.

The actual critter itself could be any number of creatures, something with lots of magic. Perhaps a powerful rakshasa ultimate magus(CM) (think like Eberron and its rajahs, but less potent in scale), to represent the massive arcane power it can wield?

-X

Myrmex
2009-07-08, 01:50 AM
An ogre camp, or goblin warcamp might be cool. They could have cleared a section, like a tower or small fort, and entrenched there.

The magic forge of the city (it has a magic forge, right? right?) could have fire elementals that randomly roam it, and an Azer that now dwells there. He would be a neutral NPC that could go either way. Maybe have him in conflict with a salamander.

Undead of all types would fit well. Some zombies or skeletons shuffle around in some of the more abandoned ruins. Maybe a cabal of ghouls, led by a wight, are learning arcane magic.

A dark shrine erected to a foul god (Nerull, Vecna, Erythnul, a demon lord, etc) along with a small cohort of clerics could also be some encounters.

A kobold or dwarven or gnome mining team (or maybe kobolds vs. dwarves & gnomes) may be trying to excavate lost items or maybe just harvesting for the exquisitely carved stone.

Wild animals, esp. vermin would fit nicely. A cave (dire) bear could be a big fight.

Oozes and fungus are a must, especially for the danker parts.

A monster in the lake, or perhaps a tribe of aquatic humanoids, would be fitting.

Chained outsiders could also be encounters, left behind by the clergy or mages or whomever. Perhaps in the church basement is a chained pit fiend who the high priest bound but never had time to properly interrogate. Maybe the fiend succeeded in corrupting the priest and driving them all mad, a la Diablo, but has never succeeded in freeing himself from the prison. Or maybe he's just stuck down there and wants to trick you into letting him out.

There's a monster called a Boneyard that is just all the bones in a graveyard that rises up and attacks. I think it's CR 10+ though. Don't know what book it's in.

Traps should either be the sort that include either very old and powerful magic- sealed doors, golems, and the like- or more recent, set up by the current inhabitants.

A dragon could always work, a small dragon sitting on gold it snuck out from the treasury. It doesn't have to be an evil dragon, either. A juvenile or younger bronze dragon that has hidden amongst the ruins to accumulate what wealth it can could give the party bizarre oddjobs where they steal shinies and play pranks on the evil denizens of the ruins.

In an interesting subversion, he could be hiding with a gang of kobolds, beset by ruthless treasure seeking gnomes and dwarves.

Fey creatures could also have moved in. Redcaps are vicious, CE monsters that dwell in ruins where there has been much bloodshed, with a low CR.

Rhawin
2009-07-08, 01:58 AM
If you have access to any Eberron books, anything which inhabits the Mournland makes a pretty good candidate.

Even if they aren't necessarily a challenge, have hosts of vermin, vultures, and other creatures that trail death. The PCs don't necessarily have to fight them, simply mention them to help set the mood. Otyughs (and the Lifeleech varient from MMIII), oozes, and miscellaneous aberrations also are ideal candidates, if there's a supply of corpses. Expanding on the Mimick idea, a Cloaker could make an interesting and CR appropriate encounter.

Violent plants, such as an Assassin Vine, can heighten the sense of the location's fundamental hostility and provide a basis for life existing there. Tendriculos also makes a good (and unusual) challenge for the level 6 adventurers.. Other possible plants:
Phantom Fungus (multiple or advanced)
Fungus (Shrieker) - attracting either a Magic Beast or an Aberration
Dread Blossom Swarm (MMIII)

I would avoid undead unless there's some greater reason for them being there (below). If you do use them, focus primarily on lower CR undead (CR 2-4) with CR 6s and higher being exceptions, to make it seem more as if common folk were animated. Encountering Wraith after Wraith while investigating what once was a slum slaughter's verisimilitude.

A reason for the city to remain abandoned, beyond a few wandering monsters, is also a good idea. It sounds like you already have an idea for a few. Here's a few more random ones:
- An ancient portal from the Mageguild which regularly and temporarily summons outsiders.
- A large detachment of Golems went berserk, and now attack any humanoids who they encounter. Clockroaches and Clockwork Menders (MMIV) can fill the streets.
- A tribe of more primitive or "darker" humanoids, such as those mentioned by Set.
- A powerful undead, preferably one which can create spawn. Advanced Wights and Wraiths are useful for this, as are Mohrgs, but can make the adventure one-dimensional unless you randomly insert other types of undead.
- Any other self-replicating monster, such as Gibbering Mouthers or Chaos Beasts.
- A Fiendish Aboleth has occupied the the caverns below the city. The Aboleth keeps a small retinue of Dominated NPCs, who can interact with the PCs in a meaningful way. They can attempt to lure any trespassers to the Aboleth's lair. Perhaps the Aboleth can attempt to have the combined group eliminate a threat to its territory? (a CR 8-9 creature due to the larger group size). In this case failing to recognize the characters' mental state is actually beneficial, interestingly enough. If the effect is noticed, perhaps have the characters matter-of-factly explain the situation to the PCs.
- A particularly virulent plague took the city. It is now filled with Voidmind creatures (MMIII) (just refluff them a bit).
- A small group of Zern (MMIV) have occupied the city, and are using the crypts to create their experiments.
- The typical run-of-the-mill alter-to-a-forgotten/dark/forbidden deity emits negative energy. Every hour while in the city the party is forced to make Will or Fortitude saving throws to avoid Fatigue. Exhausted characters take damage. Alternatively just use ability damage.

Myrmex
2009-07-08, 02:30 AM
Maybe subject anyone who sleeps in the city after dark to make a (low) will save or suffer the effects of a Nightmare spell? Put some sleeping, malevolent entity beneath the ruins. It is responsible for the nighttime perturbations. Give casters a a mild penalty to the save.

Remember, if the city is 600 years old, don't put anything in that wouldn't make sense. A couple flesh golems running amok would make sense for a month or so after breaking out, but 600 years of smashing stuff? There would be no city left!

Various incorporeal undead that are tied to and haunt the ruins would be appropriate.

Dark Herald
2009-07-08, 03:44 AM
Just a thought, if these ruins have been picked clean, then there are going to be a bunch of monster and animal skeletons lying around. Hundreds of adventurers will leave a lot of dead Wolves and Goblins, and battlefields should be common among the ruins. Also, consider that something had been guarding the final BBEG Lair place all those years, or else any compotent level 10 party would have taken any treasure or killed any monster years before. Some recently collapsed tunnel or a Pit Fiend who just left after 500 years of guarding the site as payment of a life debt. Alternatively, have the entire dungeon up till that point be travled through numerous times, with chalk marks on the trapped squares and ropes tied at all the major climbs, dead monsters lying everywhere, for a nice change of pace. Then, at the final room, which has already been looted, Have some recent terrain feature or the aftermath of a spell unveil a hidden part of the dungeon. three to four encounters later, have the real BBEG show up doing something completely unrelated to the dungeon.

Just some ways to subvert the Squeaky Clean Ruins that plague DnD, and mak adventuring at least a somewhat plausible job, not just the PCs. Possibly some subtle meta jokes, like the Sphinx riddle or a room ripped from a movie or another adventure, to simulate a lazy DM who made this ruin 300 years ago.

oxinabox
2009-07-08, 04:25 AM
for the big bad:
What about an Effigu [MM2 p89] CR 17 (so slaughter individual party but only tough for a full party)

haven't tryed one out but sound good (i was originally thinking of a 4e EIDOLON - statue that thinks it is a god)

]An effigy is an envious undead that hates living creatures
and lusts after the life energy they possess. It seeks to possess
a living creature and take over its life, but it cannot maintain
its usurped body for long. Eventually the fires of its own raw
hatred literally immolate the body it has possessed.
An effigy appears as a translucent humanoid shape com-
posed of multicolored flame. Its eyes glow white within the
flickering fires of its insubstantial body, but it has no other
discernible facial features.
It could have been lying low sustained by the energy of the ley lines , until some adventure stirred it, and was consumed, giving it a body to posses.

maybe toss in a stack of statues come to life.
or maybe rather than negitive energy, something that has flourished with the removal of humans. maybe a colossal plant like life form

Gerion
2009-07-08, 04:45 AM
Have a look at Lost empires of faerun, there is a section about ruins even with random charts to roll what is left of an ancient site.

Also there are The helmed Horrors and Dread Warriors. Good Guardians for mage Guilds.

bosssmiley
2009-07-08, 05:16 AM
So, here's some information about the ruined city and its history: the city has been abandoned for six hundred years. It was once the seat of a vast empire that began to fall apart due to civil wars, monster attacks, a massive invasion of barbarians, and a large uprising of enslaved monstrous humanoid races.

[...]

As for what I already have in mind, I like the concept that it was once home to a mages' guild, so eldritch abominations and magical experiments are in. It's also been established that the city is built on the convergence of ley lines, making it a place of power. I'd like for there to be some great malevolence living in the deepest depths beneath the city, something that drains this energy. As for what exactly it is, I'm not sure, so suggest away.

So that'd be a classic mad wizard's multi-level mega-dungeon (http://www.megadungeon.net/) you'd be wanting there sir?

Also, *preen preen* (http://vaultsofnagoh.blogspot.com/2009/04/building-vaults.html)

random11
2009-07-08, 09:04 AM
Since the people who lived there knew about the dangers, you can add special buildings which were used as the last defense against the monsters.

On the outside, the buildings will look like a building with different architecture (built in a hurry and for military purposes). They will also be surrounded with monsters' bodies and skeletons that died when trying to approach.
The building will have magical automatic defenses (which will explain the dead monsters), mostly on the outside.

If the characters manage to get in, they will discover that while it is a safe place from monsters, all the people who tried to hide there died when they ran out of food and water.

This is an excellent place to get hints about what this culture was like, and maybe find some ancient items (which will be mostly useless).

AslanCross
2009-07-08, 09:08 AM
-The Ruin Chanter (MM5) is a fey that lives in, you guessed it, ruins. They're kind of creepy and emaciated as far as fey go.
-Ruin elementals. Elementals made out of ruined buildings. Also from MM5.
-You could even have a Retriever picking through the ruins for some demonic artifact that was stolen from a demon lord or somesuch who wants it back.
-Mind Flayers of Thoon, or their construct minions. (MM5). Due to the bizarre ideologies of the Thoon Mind Flayers, it's a lot easier to put them in random places than the garden-variety Illithids.

Claudius Maximus
2009-07-08, 11:57 AM
I love the idea that the dungeons have already been explored. I do value verisimilitude, so everything has to have some kind of justification for its presence, and everything should interact with the environment.

What kind of condition should this place be in? It was a huge city inhabited by a mix of the standard races. I imagine that wooden buildings would have outnumbered stone buildings at least 50:1. After 600 years, would they even still be around in any significant way, or would there be mostly stone ruins, the remnants of fortifications, temples, and mansions? What kind of condition would the stone ruins be in? I should note that it rains a lot in the region, and the tribes have probably salvaged building supplies from the outskirts.

Oh, and the city is located along a river, so there's the possibility of aquatic encounters and underground reservoirs and such, but the nearest shore is about a hundred miles away.

Rhawin
2009-07-08, 02:10 PM
After 600 years, any signs of wooden buildings would be gone, barring magic or extreme aridity. It would be interesting if there were large empty areas where they used to stand. Stone buildings often use wooden supports, and general erosion would limit the effectiveness of any stone supports, so most would be collapsed. Difficult terrain is common. Underground chambers could remain intact depending on the conditions.

Methinks many people aren't reading the OP thoroughly:

whatever you suggest should be possible for either 4 or 8 level sixish characters to handle
Pit Fiends and such are cool and definitely would explain the derelict state of the ruins, but the only option players would have upon seeing one is running. Unless the setting is FR style high-power, a CR 8 or 9 big bad could explain the derelict state of the city even after a few hundred years, and be within killing range of the PCs.

Is there any specific cataclysm which caused the city to fall?

Claudius Maximus
2009-07-08, 08:56 PM
Is there any specific cataclysm which caused the city to fall?

Well, all of that turmoil I mentioned in the first post contributed to the depopulation and destruction of the city, as it was sacked, rebuilt, re-sacked, conquered and claimed several times by various groups. I imagine the refugees were either killed or absorbed into the various marauding barbarian tribes. That was my original idea, anyway.

Now that the spellpool thing has come up, I guess I could throw a magical calamity in there somewhere. Perhaps the leaders of one of the armies tried to steal its power for himself, but lost control and rendered the city uninhabitable by transforming his army into horrible magical abominations. Or something. I don't know, someone else could probably come up with a better catastrophe.