[3.5 D&D] Class suggestions

[Ahab]

I'm looking to create an NPC for my players to encounter, but I'm not sure how to class him. The character is an acrobatic warrior who mixes martial arts (in particular, Capoeira) and twin punching daggers.

At first I considered a Monk/Rogue, then I discovered the Battledancer which I think is my best bet, seeing as the martial art of Capoeira IS a dance. Any other suggestions for a class/classes?

[Pharaoh's Fist]

Swordsage.

[Eldariel]

Martial (Feat-variant) Rogue 2/Unarmed Swordsage 18. Swordsage captures just what you want and Rogue gets you the remaining proficiencies and such you'll want. Alternatively, good old Swordsage 20 with Improved and Superior Unarmed Strike-feats (if you want unarmed capability). But yeah, martial artists are easiest to make as Swordsages that don't use the mystical maneuvers.

[Darwin]

You need to do this (http://forums.gleemax.com/wotc_archive/index.php/t-979511)

Don't blame me, it was only a matter of time.

[Telonius]

Depending on the level of this NPC, the Dervish PrC from Complete Warrior sounds just like what you're looking for. If ToB is available, use Swordsage. Otherwise, Monk2/Fighter4 or Monk1/Fighter4/Swashbuckler1 could get you there.

[Eldariel]

Depending on the level of this NPC, the Dervish PrC from Complete Warrior sounds just like what you're looking for. If ToB is available, use Swordsage. Otherwise, Monk2/Fighter4 or Monk1/Fighter4/Swashbuckler1 could get you there.

Monk 2/Swashbuckler 3/Fighter 1 is slightly stronger than either without PHBII, however given PHBII, Monk 2/Fighter 4 becomes a solid option thanks to Melee Weapon Mastery (and Swashbuckler's Int-to-damage has the pesky Precision-type). Monk 2/Fighter 4 picks following bonus feats:
IUS
Dodge
Mobility
Weapon Focus
Combat Expertise
Weapon Specialization (going for Melee Weapon Mastery later on)

Levels can also pick up the following:
Two-Weapon Fighting
Improved Trip->Knock-Down (provided you're strong enough to use it)/Weapon Finesse (provided you're going for Dex-base over Str-base that just happens to have enough Dex for Imp/Greater TWF)
Improved Two-Weapon Fighting
Greater Two-Weapon Fighting (annoyingly, the feats fall out all wrong due to losing 1 point of BAB)

Deadly Defense
Combat Reflexes
Double Hit
Robilar's Gambit
Mage Slayer

Uh, yeah. Human with insane Dex & Str (high enough to go Str-based TWF) could go:
Monk 1: Two-Weapon Fighting, Combat Expertise, Dodge
Monk 2: Mobility
Fighter 1: Weapon Focus, Improved Trip
Fighter 2: Knock-Down
Fighter 3
Fighter 4: Weapon Specialization, Deadly Defense
Dervish 1:
Dervish 2:
Dervish 3: Improved Two-Weapon Fighting
Dervish 4:
Dervish 5:
Dervish 6: Greater Two-Weapon Fighting
Dervish 7:
Dervish 8:
Dervish 9: Melee Weapon Mastery
Dervish 10:
and then rest. It's possible to take another class at Dervish 8 instead and finish Dervish off later, but that other class better give you bonus feats. Getting Combat Reflexes, Double Hit, Robilar's Gambit and Mage Slayer would help your life so. That only requires 3 bonus feats more too (Martial Rogue alone gives 2; 2 more levels of Fighter would give the last one finishing the whole package by level 18 and taking 10th Dervish level by 20...). Oh yeah, he's still missing Elusive Target. Ah well. 2 levels of Psychic Warrior or something instead of 2 extra Fighter-levels would do it. Or 2 flaws.


But yeah, the point of this was to showcase how bad it sucks to lose that point of BAB in Dervish-build due to how the feats fall (getting ITWF on 6 would be swell). Good news though: Once you have:
Two-Weapon Fighting, Combat Expertise, Dodge, Mobility, Improved Two-Weapon Fighting, Greater Two-Weapon Fighting, Elusive Target, Weapon Focus, Weapon Specialization, Melee Weapon Mastery, Improved Trip & Knock-Down, you've gotten something good out of all the crappy prerequisites (Elusive Target, Melee Weapon Mastery & Knock-Down respectively)!

Add Combat Reflexes > Robilar's Gambit > Double Hit > Mage Slayer and your Dex is beneficial too! Now, only to make that character viable before level 18... Oh, and he'd preferably have Carmendine Monk/Kung-Fu Genius to somewhat synergize the abilities too. And really, another Weapon Focus and High Sword Low Axe would kick all kinds of ass as well. And then you only need Karmic Strike (for which you qualify) for Jack'B'Quick Dervish! So a total of 21 feats wanted to make the thing a killing machine. Fighter 4/Monk 2/Martial Rogue 2/Psychic Warrior 2/Dervish 10 Human with 2 Flaws gets 9 feats from levels (Improved Unarmed Strike doesn't count), 7 from standard progression, 1 from human and 2 from flaws putting him squarely at 19 so only two feats short given we dedicated a good half of the build to getting right feats. I guess that means giving up High Sword Low Axe. Then again, Knock-Down+Robilar's+Karmic+Double Hit does pretty much the same thing. And since you don't really want to be hit that much, leaving Karmic Strike out for Deadly Defense works too.

EDIT: Given TWF feats combined and a feat every even level + 1st (how I like to run it), you can actually do it without Flaws given that you only need 19 feats anymore and get 11 out of levels. 11 out of levels + 9 out of classes alone is more than enough. Precisely why I like the altered rules (although I also nuke Dodge/Mobility nonsense...).

[arguskos]

I'm looking to create an NPC for my players to encounter, but I'm not sure how to class him. The character is an acrobatic warrior who mixes martial arts (in particular, Capoeira) and twin punching daggers.

At first I considered a Monk/Rogue, then I discovered the Battledancer which I think is my best bet, seeing as the martial art of Capoeira IS a dance. Any other suggestions for a class/classes?
I vote for Battledancer, personally. Any chance to use Dragon Compendium material is a good time in my book! :smallbiggrin:

[mabriss lethe]

with three levels of binder and a feat, you can bind Paimon (otherwise it's 5 levels of binder). His Dance of Death ability is a rather fun one. once per 5 rounds you can use a standard action to move up to your maximum speed,making a single attack at every creature you threaten. (this does provoke attacks of opportunity, but Paimon also lets you use tumble untrained, grants a +4 bonus to dex and an additional +4 bonus to tumble....Or you could just use a reach weapon) add that onto any build and things can get....fun

[Gaiyamato]

You need to do this (http://forums.gleemax.com/wotc_archive/index.php/t-979511)

Don't blame me, it was only a matter of time.

I was going to suggest something similar.
One thing though. Duel of wills uses Intimidate for the skill. The spell that build is based on uses concentration checks.
Unless I am missing something that build does not work.

[Eldariel]

I was going to suggest something similar.
One thing though. Duel of wills uses Intimidate for the skill. The spell that build is based on uses concentration checks.
Unless I am missing something that build does not work.

You're missing this:
"12: Unnerving Calm"

[Gaiyamato]

You're missing this:
"12: Unnerving Calm"

Duh!
thanks for that. :)

[Ahab]

I think I'm going to go with a Battle Dancer, primarily because of the role dancing plays in his whole motif/fighting style. Would adding a few levels of Rogue for the sneak attacks be a good idea?

This character is level 18.

[Eldariel]

I think I'm going to go with a Battle Dancer, primarily because of the role dancing plays in his whole motif/fighting style. Would adding a few levels of Rogue for the sneak attacks be a good idea?

This character is level 18.

Have you checked out Dervish [Complete Warrior]? 'cause Dervish Dance sounds exactly like what you want (the default weapons are twin Scimitars, but any slashing weapons will do). If he's level 18, you could even use the weirdo Dervish-build I suggested below to its full effect (let me tell you, at that point it is efficient) with Knock-Down, Elusive Target, Robilar's Gambit, Mage Slayer, Deadly Defense & Melee Weapon Mastery.

That said, if you really want a Battle Dancer, there's little advice I can give you - Battle Dancer is focused on Unarmed Strikes and gets few handy maneuvers like Pounce, Flight and Deny AoOs. With Superior Unarmed Strike, you'd really want to stack size increases on the UA strikes (note though that if you don't want to go Unarmed, Battle Dancer offers you very little and I strongly suggest Dervish in that case) to make for massive base damage. Greater Mighty Wallop as a boost spell would be an amazing alternative, for example (one of the very few ways to increase fist size category without increasing wielder size).


Really, if you want Battle Dancer with weapons, I suggest a notable Bard-dip (~4 levels) and Snowflake Wardance [Frostburn] to use Charisma for your attack rolls. Then Slippers of Battle Dancing [Dungeon Master's Guide II] and you can use Cha for attacks AGAIN in addition to getting Cha to damage. Then uhh, yeah... I don't think Rogue and Sneak Attack is the optimal way to go given how hard it is for him to qualify for Sneak Attacks. Scout and Skirmish seems much better; 5 levels of Scout and Improved Skirmish and he'll get nice +4d6 to damage.

[Quietus]

Sneak attack is never a bad idea. That being said, if Battle Dancer lets you move while full attacking, scout for Skirmish might be a better option. Instead of trying to get something flat-footed or flanked, you just have to move.. and if you can move while full attacking, that's a very easy situation to set up!

If Battle dancer doesn't let you move and full attack, perhaps consider Dervish instead. If you're in a Dervish Dance (and you SHOULD be!), you can do just that - a scout entry plus improved skirmish should give you three or four d6's to tack onto your damage, I think?

[thegurullamen]

What the heck is a Duel of Wills? Isn't that the thing where you can nab 1 or 2 points off an enemy's init before combat via a stare-down? If so, it's sort of weak to build a character concept around.

[Eldariel]

What the heck is a Duel of Wills? Isn't that the thing where you can nab 1 or 2 points off an enemy's init before combat via a stare-down? If so, it's sort of weak to build a character concept around.

Yeah, it's the debuff in the beginning of combat. But the point is, you win it with breakdance! You can also pick up Diamond Mind maneuvers like Insightful Strike and Greater Insightful Strike to breakdance your opponents into death! And you get to make your saves with breakdance!

Oh, and you can deliver Irresistible Dance with your whip, forcing people to dance! It's an awesome build.

[sombrastewart]

If you're building a capoeista, there should be a lot of using Improved Feint and Sneak Attack.