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Ranis
2009-07-22, 03:30 PM
I have a wonderfully balanced 3.5 group that I run with a bunch of mutual friends, and so far it has been a lot of fun. However, between the four of them, there's much more of a mixed experience than I thought when I started the game and ever since have been struggling with keeping everyone happy with what they want out of the game, as is my job as a DM.

Let me explain further. Bobby and Sue (Sue happens to be my girlfriend) are very, very new to D&D and as such they enjoy the combat encounters aspect of D&D most of all. They are very, very awkward roleplayers. When I ask them what about roleplaying is so difficult, they tell me "I don't know what to ask/say," or "I just don't know all what I can do." It seems to me like they are having trouble getting into character in the first place, and I don't want to press them about it if they are uncomfortable; I want to slowly ween them into roleplaying over time. It's these two I'm most especially focused on making their first D&D game be exciting and wondrous as possible; because let's face it, almost everyone compares almost all of their D&D experiences to the first one they ever had, and I want to set a fantastic precedent.

Dave is very, very into roleplaying. He's used to the kind of D&D where you might go an entire session never fighting a single monster, albeit only with sharp tongues and rolling only d20's for skill checks. He's not opposed to or against combat encounters in the slightest, but I know that I would bore Bobby and Sue to death if I had a session with just roleplaying. However, I know that he would quickly become completely disinterested in my game if I didn't include it (which I'm not, because I really want to tell my story).

Tim is a very experienced D&D goer, and we play together in another mutual friend's game that's been going on for over 3 years now. He's been the one keeping the party pushed forward with roleplaying and has taken the defacto party face roll (Dave for some reason is playing a brooding ranger and thus doesn't talk much). I feel that Tim has a lot of weight on his shoulders with the party, and though he tells me that it's no big deal, I feel unless something is done he's going to quickly become exhausted under the pressure.

So far they are level 3 and I have been doing everything straight down the middle, splitting combat encounters and roleplaying. However tonight is a somewhat bigger plot exposition and storytelling through Bobby's character. I'm worried that it might stagnate from him getting stage fright.

Has anyone else encountered any situations similar to mine? How did you remedy them?

Gnaeus
2009-07-22, 03:47 PM
I would start with talking with the experienced players. Explain the issue. Tell them to give you regular input on whether the game is too combat heavy for them.

Do the same with the newbies, but don't expect as much helpful input. They don't know the game enough to really understand the balance thay you are trying to do.

As long as the players understand that you are trying to make the game fun for them, and are talking with you about how to do that, you are unlikely to go far wrong.

ericgrau
2009-07-22, 03:47 PM
My cheat sheets (sig) include lots of rules for skill checks. If you print it booklet style as described in the .zip, all the non-combat skills are on the back cover.

As for my own experience, I'm playing in a 2nd system (not d&d) which I still don't understand very well due to laziness on reading through the rules. My character is fairly lousy, but I still have a lot of fun with the non-combat stuff. It's just a matter of getting comfortable with the situations. Describe scenarios to your player in non-game terms, like a book. Let basic social interaction take over from there. Part of that is taking the time to get comfortable with the environment, so be patient.

Pharaoh's Fist
2009-07-22, 03:50 PM
Note cards with abilities on them for the newbies.

And ask them to write a one paragraph backstory and try to draw a hook from that.

Or a questionnaire with things like:

"What is your character's favorite food? Entertainment? Friends and family?" and etc so you can involve them more in the world.

talus21
2009-07-22, 03:50 PM
Two thing I would tell your new players. Say what you think your character would say in situations.

The other is to tell them to say or ask if they can do whatever they come up with. Then either have them roll skill checks or if it's completely out of the realm tell them no.

If you don't encourage role play they never will. And face it that's what you end up remembering.

lsfreak
2009-07-22, 04:08 PM
I'll also go with coming up with a background. Before the session, have the two newer people come up with what their family is like, why they left, and how they were trained in their chosen class. Beyond that, encourage them to come up with the character's general mindset and goals.

That will then start them thinking in their character's mindset. During the session, ask a few simple questions, like what their character does while the food is cooking. It might be beneficial to ask "what would [charactername] be doing during this" rather than "what do you do," as this again gets them thinking like the character and not as the player.

Hopefully, this gets them in the habit of thinking in the character's mindset. This should naturally lead them into developing the character more as they have to come up with what the character would do in different situations.

Rhiannon87
2009-07-22, 09:31 PM
I also support the call for backstories from the less experienced RP'ers. I wouldn't intimidate them with a bunch of detailed questions that will probably scare them off... something more broad that can be easily adapted and trimmed down helps.

Something like this:


Name:
Age:
Sex:
Height/Weight:
Hair/eye color:
Appearance:
Heredity:

Birthplace:
Occupation:
Education:
Home Life:
Religion:
Race:
Community Status:
Hobbies:

Morals:
Ambition:
Personal Premise:
Disappointments:
Achievements:
Temperament:
Attitude towards life:
Attitude towards people:
Abilities:
Qualities:
Flaws:

Additional Notes:



I use this (or a modified version, cutting and adding things if needed) as the basis for pretty much every character I play. From there I'll usually branch out into much more detailed information, but this is a good starting point. For people who are new to the whole roleplay thing, it'll help them get a sense of their character, something they probably haven't done much at all. And once they've filled this out, have them print it and keep it with their character sheet. Having a reference around is always good.

Ranis
2009-07-22, 10:46 PM
Bobby and Sue pleasantly surprised me tonight by the way they caught up with the roleplaying. We did some pretty heavy roleplaying and I think I lost Sue's attention at some point in the middle of it, but I'm going to balance it out with more combat in later sessions.

I think that the idea of having them make a backstory for their characters is a great one. I'm going to do that and help them to really think about this person as someone they can emulate, instead of just a character they are controlling robotically.

Does anyone else have any ideas?

elliott20
2009-07-22, 11:58 PM
in addition to a back story, ask them what are their character goals, and have it written down on their sheet somewhere to remind them that's what their characters should be pushing for whenever the opportunity presents itself.

make sure that said goals are interesting not just for the characters, but also to the players. That way there is a more likely chance they'll push for these things.

and make sure that if they have ANY ideas how their character is going to develop that they feel like they can talk to you about it. Let them know that the game will at times feel like interactive writing, and that if they want to see their character go a certain way, that they involve you in the process.

that way, you can help guide them with the mechanical aspects, and it will help them organize and cement their thought processes.

ZeroNumerous
2009-07-23, 12:11 AM
"Most often, the simplest questions are the most profound. Where were you born? Who are your friends? Where do you live?" -- I forget who.

Point is: Don't ask about lofty things like "what's your character's goal in life" ask "Who is your character?" Ask what their hometown was. Ask who they had a crush on when they were a teenager. Ask the things that make their character feel human and they won't treat them like a robot anymore.

Kosjsjach
2009-07-23, 12:13 AM
You might want to check out the Ten-Minute Background (http://forums.gleemax.com/showthread.php?t=1036571) thread on the wizards.com forum. I think it'd be perfect for what people are suggesting.

Skorj
2009-07-23, 12:44 AM
"Most often, the simplest questions are the most profound. Where were you born? Who are your friends? Where do you live?" -- I forget who.

Point is: Don't ask about lofty things like "what's your character's goal in life" ask "Who is your character?" Ask what their hometown was. Ask who they had a crush on when they were a teenager. Ask the things that make their character feel human and they won't treat them like a robot anymore.

These can be really difficult questions to answer if you don't understand the campaign setting (which may involve reading a lengthy book). I like Rich's idea for villians: name two emotions that motivate your character to adventure (greed, wonder, ambition, rage, lust, need for respect, etc) . Build from there. This is the sort of thing you can understand from popular entertainment, with no understanding of the difference between an orc and a goblin.

ZeroNumerous
2009-07-23, 12:52 AM
These can be really difficult questions to answer if you don't understand the campaign setting (which may involve reading a lengthy book).

'Cept you don't actually need to know anything about the setting unless it's Eberron. Otherwise it's generic medieval fantasy.

Indon
2009-07-23, 08:59 AM
I'd run campaign ideas that get them into the idea of more immersive roleplaying.

A good first start might be an action-story sort of thing. Put the players in absurd, combat-oriented situations and give them clear, hammy villains to get into quip wars against. That would be a good time to indoctrinate them into DM invocation of the Rule of Cool to bend the rules as written and encourage them to get involved in a role - however shallow action movie heroes may tend to be, they're still really fun characters.

Epinephrine
2009-07-23, 09:06 AM
Stick less to the specifics of the rules for newer players, unless they want the nitty gritty. While more experienced players will say things like "I ready an action ...", newer players won't know that this is an option - instead, ask what they'd like to be doing. If they say that they are watching the mage to make sure he doesn't try to cast something, interpret that as a readied action. If they want to grab someone by the beard, tell them it's a grapple check, and resolve it. If it's something the rules don't cover well, make it up. The point of the RPG isn't really to master a library of rules, the rules are present to add consistency to resolving actions.

The idea of cards for the players is good too - we do this in our group, the newer player tends to be guided to classes with fewer options (a favoured soul rather than a cleric, for example), and that makes it possible to have a list of all her spells at hand, and eliminates the need to figure out spell choices each morning.