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View Full Version : Creating A Villain Who Has Good Reason To Destroy Everything: Ideas?



Leliel
2009-07-22, 10:20 PM
Anyway, I've been enthralled with the general villain trope known as the Woobie Destroyer of Worlds (not linked to TV Tropes, as you will get distracted and forget to even answer this post)-a villain with the stock motivation of Destroying the World (TM), but has a list of reasons why oblivion seems infinitely preferable to the world continuing to exist. I decided to put my own spin on it. The villain I have in mind, who currently has the working name of Beatus Incendia Glacialis, the Blessed Fire Frozen (not her real name, just a title she thinks sounds fitting-and yes, I know it's a masculine name, at least the forename), thinks the world should continue after her death, but effectively restarted; Altering the past so that human history takes a very different course-and effectively committing genocide on a cosmic level (with history changed, everyone alive in the present will not have been born). Think Ultimecia, but with a backstory and the powers and personality of the Time Devourer from Chrono Cross.

Now as for her backstory-that's a stumbling block. Obviously, she underwent some tragedy that caused her to believe that humanity went horribly wrong in the past, and that she has to correct it by any means possible-but exactly what kind of tragedy is currently beyond me.

So, help a guy out, would you?

Drakyn
2009-07-22, 10:36 PM
If you want her to seem plausible she's going to need one hell of a compound trauma to mentally justify her actions to herself, some lifelong trail of events to make her think humans need the cosmic reboot. One reason seems like too little. The trick is that she's going to have to hate HUMANS as they are now, not just "sentient races/humanoids/PC races."
Maybe she was an up-close-and-personal witness to one too many typical "Bwahahahaha I will rule the world" villains when she was a child (human, naturally), and her family suffered for it?
On top of that, maybe her family became refugees thanks to the local area of collateral damage defeating said villains tends to cause, she lost a few of them, and then the predominately human kingdom she ended up in was a piece-of-piss place unsympathetic to foreigners?
Then, on top of that, she makes most of her friends in the (almost completely immigrant) nonhuman community, only to see them go through a massive and incredibly cruel pogrom a few years later after distrust intensifies thanks to the influx of foreigners over the past couple of whiles?
To top it off, her (human) fiancee might have been a member of the local law enforcement, who privately agreed with the persecutions, and weaseled the hiding places of her friends out of her without her knowing it, or maybe even trusting him?
Any of the above, in any pattern, in some combination, removed all together and replaced with new, whatever works. But assuming she's human herself, and assuming it's geniunely just humans she's after, she's going to have to have a good reason to feel it's just them that needs the boot, and having a long history of other races being kind to her and humans being bastards seems a good way to go about it.

Thurbane
2009-07-22, 10:48 PM
In Kevin Smith's Dogma, there was a demon who wanted to destroy everything because he was sick of living in Hell...

playswithfire
2009-07-22, 10:53 PM
There's always the Ra's al Ghul-type character; someone who's been around almost forever, either through an in-game Lazarus Pit or timeless body or whatever method you want to use who has seen the so-called sentient races destroy the planet as a whole and occasionally each other, though rarely to extinction. So, he takes it on himself to take it to its "logical conclusion"; destroy the sentient races and let the planet reboot itself.

EDIT: note to self; watch dogma again and that fallen angel/now demon's motivation also works excellently for this

quick_comment
2009-07-22, 10:55 PM
You could also just have someone like the Snarl - he is infused with the primordial chaos and wants to destroy the order that was forcefully imposed on chaos by the elder gods. Chaos is the natural state of the universe!

Make sure you give him levels of entropomancer.

CountD
2009-07-22, 10:58 PM
Religion is always a good one.

The villain belongs to some sort of cult that wants to fulfill its own prophecy of the destruction of the world.

quick_comment
2009-07-22, 11:04 PM
He could also believe in something similar to the Cathar heresy - that is, this universe was created not by god, but by the devil, so he could observe us and learn how to tempt real souls more effectively. By destroying the world the BBEG is furthering the cause of good.

Sir_Elderberry
2009-07-22, 11:08 PM
He could also believe in something similar to the Cathar heresy - that is, this universe was created not by god, but by the devil, so he could observe us and learn how to tempt real souls more effectively. By destroying the world the BBEG is furthering the cause of good.

I like this idea. What if the villain doesn't believe in the Upper Planes? By his/her logic, every single soul is going to be tortured for all eternity. Personally, I'd rather have oblivion. This particular villain may simply prefer to... make the choice for others.

Gorgondantess
2009-07-22, 11:10 PM
Well, that all depends. What are you willing to do, and where are you willing to go with it? Maybe he saw into the future, and knew there would be some terrible event, so rather than let everyone suffer through it he just wants to end it all. Dogma, also, would be a great source of inspiration.

quick_comment
2009-07-22, 11:14 PM
If you use the Cathars, you can them make use of the following quote. The head of a crusader army asked his Lord how he could tell the Cathars from good christians.

The response?

Caedite eos. Novit enim Dominus qui sunt eius." — "Kill them all, the Lord will recognise His own.

Leliel
2009-07-22, 11:21 PM
Well, that all depends. What are you willing to do, and where are you willing to go with it? Maybe he saw into the future, and knew there would be some terrible event, so rather than let everyone suffer through it he just wants to end it all. Dogma, also, would be a great source of inspiration.

SHE.

I referred to Beatus at least 6 times using the female pronun, and I think it would have been implied that I when I said I realized that "Beatus" is a masculine name, that I knew that it's an odd name for a woman.

That, and the fact if you had actually READ my post, you would know that I already have a pretty good basic idea of who she is.

[/rant]

Angry ranting aside, I was thinking of her being a time traveler who seeks the ability to truly alter the past, thus making sure that a civillization that died out due to political squabbles before the PCs' time survives, thus creating what she views as a utopia as the civilization's ideals change the world.

The whole "Woobie Destroyer of Worlds" thing is because altering the past will ensure that everyone alive past that point will have never been born...including her. Needless to say, she views this as an "acceptable loss".

erikun
2009-07-22, 11:24 PM
Chaotic Insane - Someone like Tharizdun (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tharizdun), who is just so crazy they want to wipe out everything, either to end their suffering or just because.

Religious - With Incendia Glacialis in mind, it could be that she's assured the world will end with Ragnarok, and she wants to be the one to bring it about.

Accept All Comers - Thinks they are the greatest, and wants to take on everything to prove it.

Ultimate Predator - Is intent to kill off everything, simply because there isn't anything worth living unless she feels like it. (She generally doesn't.)

kjones
2009-07-22, 11:32 PM
Could you be a little more specific about what you mean by "destroying the world"? In order, from biggest to smallest:


The entire multiverse, everything
Some subset of the planes
Just the prime material plane
Just the Earth/fantasy equivalent planet
All life, planet uninhabitable
All life, planet inhabitable (clean slate)
All sentient life
Specifically humans

9mm
2009-07-22, 11:42 PM
too much time in marshmallow hell...

Leliel
2009-07-22, 11:54 PM
Could you be a little more specific about what you mean by "destroying the world"? In order, from biggest to smallest:


The entire multiverse, everything
Some subset of the planes
Just the prime material plane
Just the Earth/fantasy equivalent planet
All life, planet uninhabitable
All life, planet inhabitable (clean slate)
All sentient life
Specifically humans


Technically option number one-all things from a certain point in history (by changing it, she's literally making it so that everything that was born or created after that point never existed). Admittedly, there's going to be something to replace them, but still...

Her motives-thanks to Draykn-are actually a mix of 7 and 8: She thinks humans as they exist now are an inherently corrupt species, and the scheme in mind makes it so that a utopian civilization that died out didn't, resulting in the changing of the race for the better. Of course, she also knows that if she does that, the demihumans she looks up too will not have existed, but she doesn't care-if she succeeds, neither will have she.

Arutema
2009-07-23, 12:35 AM
I wouldn't go with one big tragedy. Look up Trauma Conga Line on tvtropes. Lots of small to medium tragedies can more believably break a character.

Perhaps she's a victim of race/class/magical ability/other fantastic bigotry. She has decided that the only way to end said bigotry is to prevent it from beginning, no matter how drastically it might change history.

Milskidasith
2009-07-23, 12:43 AM
You could go with the whole Kefka storyline; got some kind of crazy powerful infusion of magic (go nuts with broken abilities here!) but it also made him/her totally batcrap insane and nihilistic.

I love FFVI way too much.

Rhawin
2009-07-23, 01:04 AM
Destruction can either be a means to an end or an exercise in itself. While the latter only has a few permutations (revels in chaos, personal trauma or somesuch) the former is rife with possibility.

-End an eternal life/suffering, most likely their own (not much of an option because existence should continue)
-Prevent ultimate suffering in others (if the humans are fundamentally flawed, suffering creatures, isn't it easier for them to simply not exist?)
-Revenge upon sentient life for childhood suffering
-Revenge upon some divinity
-Simply to assert and prove one's power (to one's self?)
-A cycle of rebirth: they believe that, perhaps rightly, the end of this existence will shepherd a new, better one.

I realize you realize that the first name is masculine but do you realize that none of the declensions agree with each other? : p (Glacialis is alright 'cause its genitive, but Incendia is neuter plural if I recall my Latin correctly. The correct form is either Incendi or Incendii, depending on preference. Of course the chances of your players noticing is minuscule to non-existent)

Guancyto
2009-07-23, 01:35 AM
I wouldn't make her cackling insane at all - that's been done too often. Some villains can pull it off (<3 Kefka) but it's too easy to go over the top with.

I think the essence of Woobie Destroyer of Worlds is complete, utter and total despair. Everything she has worked for has been torn down (possibly by her own hands), everything she trusted has betrayed her (possibly because of her actions) and every sacrifice she made has been proven to have been for nothing. In the end such a mess has been made of everything she believed in that she feels it's better to start over. Add a dash of the Fallen Hero and the PCs assuring her of the overall goodness of things is going to be hard because she's seen this before and done it before and it all came apart in shambles - and she isn't laying the blame for it on anybody but herself.

How many times has she tried to build her sand castle? The first time it was grand and sweeping, with hope for the future. The second one was a little more cautious, a little more geared toward defending itself. The third one was born of a need for its own survival and wasn't nearly so inspiring. By the fifteenth it was twisted beyond recognition and by the thirty-seventh she realized that. She didn't just decide to pack up her pail and shovel and go home, she decided screw the beach and screw the ocean, when she leaves she's taking the place with her.

Heck, if she's an INT-y type, maybe she's figured out the most likely scenarios for present day if her plan succeeds. Maybe the timeline she's trying to create really is genuinely a better place to live in, and this is her last-ditch effort to make up for everything she's done. It's easy to have a villain trying to create a Utopia. Having one be correct about it? Little less common, and people are dangerous if they think something is their last shot at redemption.

Milskidasith
2009-07-23, 01:38 AM
If she's correct about it, then what? I know how great speeches defying the evil knight templar who knows she is evil can be, but if she has actually been, flat out, word of god, the DM says it's true right about the world being better after wiping it out... somebody is going to let her do it, and stopping her might seem like a **** move (sure, you saved your own life... but if it was going to give rise to a better world, and everybody would have just died instantly... you just screwed the entire world for yourself. Sounds evil to me.)

squishycube
2009-07-23, 01:40 AM
I realize you realize that the first name is masculine but do you realize that none of the declensions agree with each other? : p (Glacialis is alright 'cause its genitive, but Incendia is neuter plural if I recall my Latin correctly. The correct form is either Incendi or Incendii, depending on preference. Of course the chances of your players noticing is minuscule to non-existent)

-a is also singular feminine nominative. But the BBEG might just not speak Latin very well ^^. (Incendium is neuter, of course)
If you like moral ambiguity in your stories, I would definitely go with the option that the BBEG wants to destroy the world/universe because it is for the best. Make it so that there is some sort of sense in it, that the players can relate to the BBEG's wish and then feel guilty about even considering that destroying and killing all things might be a good thing.

EDIT: in response to Milskidasith.
In a black and white morality (like default D&D) you are right, but in a system with a little more ethical realism one can disagree about whether the medicine is worse than the disease. I find this sort of problems lead to interesting roleplaying.

Mongoose87
2009-07-23, 02:04 AM
Simple: He wants to go down in history as "The Cat Who Destroyed the Universe."

Devils_Advocate
2009-07-23, 02:21 AM
You can change history through revisionism, but you can't change the actual past. If you time travel to the past, everything you did then happened before you left. That's what the past is. You can't go back and make things go differently the second time around because there's only one time around. It may be possible to go into the past of an alternate timeline, but changing your own timeline's past is a hopeless proposition.

A deluded character might think that it's possible to change the past, but she'd be doomed to failure.

Tokiko Mima
2009-07-23, 02:32 AM
I'm reminded of a time when the Joker managed to acquire godlike power over the universe, and rewrite past, present and future in an image he desired. Though he had a great deal of fun and mad cackling as he teased Superman and killed entire nations, eventually he decided that his universe (and he himself) had to end. Why? So that a person like him, so full of pain, hatred, and madness could never exist.

One Step Two
2009-07-23, 02:43 AM
A motivation for an Abyssal Midnight Caste Actor I once created. The Masque of Ivory and Crimson Silk. She felt her art was so perfected, that with her death, everything in creation needed to be sent to the void because clearly they didn't have any reason to exist without her.

Your villaness could be a being filled with such immeasurable amounts of conceit (and the power to back it up) that she decides that when she dies the world obviously has no reason to exist without her. So her final merciful act, (in her mind) is to obliterate exitence once she draws her last breath.

Belobog
2009-07-23, 02:45 AM
This really depends on your interpretation of time travel. I tend to agree with Devil's Advocate above, except further; not only would she not being to change the past, she might be a part of the catalyst involved in starting that specific event, simply through her presence. Causes kind of a loop, but creates a real sympathetic figure, which seems to be what you're trying for.

Anyway, how did she come to the conclusion that this 'utopia's' downfall was the beginning of the end for all good things in the universe? Why does she believe stopping its fall would bring about world peace, harmony, and Good Vibes all over? What gives her the confidence, let alone the conviction, to even think that she can overwrite the universe, and that everything will be for the better if she does? A utopia could just as easily become corrupt as any civilization, given the right set of factors; what makes this proposed utopia special?

ShneekeyTheLost
2009-07-23, 02:50 AM
You could go with the whole Kefka storyline; got some kind of crazy powerful infusion of magic (go nuts with broken abilities here!) but it also made him/her totally batcrap insane and nihilistic.

I love FFVI way too much.

His touted reason for destroying the world: Everyone was living such pitiful lives in such squalor. He was merely giving them blessed relief from their drudgery and escape from such a wretched existence.

Of course, the real reason is that he was batboop crazy to begin with, the magical tampering made it moreso, then when he pulled his Level Up, it went off the charts...

Drakefall
2009-07-23, 02:58 AM
To make her truly a sympathetic villain something must have happened in her past, something so unbelievably tragic that, from her point of view, the world is irrevocably broken, a place where terrible things happen over and over and never end. In fact, I'd make her life a tale of misery and woe, one of cruel fate. Perhaps she lost her family, later her one true love and that she fell to depression and violence until one day she actually finds a long lost family member but ends up causing their death. Give her somewhat of a Gendo Ikari motivation, ie. a complete evil prick who onlookers think to be emotionless and motivated solely by pragmatism and arrogance, only to end the world for love (shock and gasp).

Really, you have to go all out on this or the pc's will just lop her head of in the end. You have to make them at least want to try and redeem her, even if they can plainly see that will never happen.

MickJay
2009-07-23, 03:55 AM
As for time travel: these are just some of the possibilities, others include creating a paralell timeline branching off at the point of change ("our" history stays the same, but another one begins in a specific point in the past, where the changes did happen). On a sub-molecular level, "time travel" is quite common and it doesn't seem to create a paradox (or we're just used to them happening all the time, or we can't see them). Anyhow, on a major scale, changing the past could simply create an alternative reality where the person who did the change remains.

One variation of the "good intentions" theme I like is the desire to release a major force of good by breaking its prison (be it physical world, collective consciousness of sentient races or anything in between).

Noobfish
2009-07-23, 04:50 AM
Maybe have two villains. One LE overlord who's been ruling the world for decades, maybe even centuries, because people can't remember how the world was before him (think Orwell's 1984) - the one your hero's are after initially. He's so powerful, that there doesn't seem to be any reasonable way of overthrowing him. Beatus could be the CG antihero, that see's no other way than to make sure that the present never happens, so the world ultimately can be a better place. The party could even team up with her, until they realize her true motives, or something.

Anyway, I'm no good at these things, I'd just think it'd be cool to have a villain that isn't Evil. :)

Gruesy
2009-07-23, 04:52 AM
The Inchoroi of R. Scott Bakker's Second Apocalypse series are trying to exterminate all life in order to seal the material world off from the afterlife, thus preventing their own damnation.

Many of the (immortal) Nonmen of the same series become what they themselves term "Erratics." They have infinite life, but finite memories. Furthermore, bad memories are easier remembered than good ones, as they metaphorically "scar" the mind. So some/all Nonmen do the evillest things they can do - in order to have memories of their own lives.

“I do that which I hate, I raise my heart to the lash, so that I might remember!" (http://www.penguin.ca/nf/Book/BookDisplay/0,,9780143015352,00.html?sym=EXC) - Mekeritrig, a Nonman.

Kol Korran
2009-07-23, 06:44 AM
first of all, i mostly read your own posts here Leliel, not the entire thread. don't have the time. i apologize if i repeat certain ideas.
a suggestion for a background:
she is of noble decent (oh, and by the way i suggest you think of a simpler name/ title for your players to use. only some rare few players will remember it as it is), probably the daughter of some politician/ diplomat, who'se responsibility is to negotiate in some sort of an over council for relationships and dealings between the various races. she also has a mentor/ teacher of history, who is responsible for her education.

she and the diplomat may be human, or not. (i think it might be better if they are. that way she also partly hate herself, knowing she must end herself as well becuase she is irrevocably tainted) the teacher may be human or not (could go both ways, or even a third way, but we'll get to there)

as a child, she has little contact with her father/ mother, who are usually busy negotiating and dealing with things diplomatically behind the scenes. she comes to have friends with children of other races (possibly including humans) who as her, are mostly estranged from their parents, but share a great kinship to their race.

in the mean time the teacher/mentor teaches her much about culture, raligion, and so on, but mostly history, from the racist point of view. (as in emphasis on races, not a particular hate towards a race). slowly slowly, she notices the vast influence of humans, and how they stand out with their ambition, expansionism, and assimilation of others cultures and ideas. in her mind, they are an odd phenomena, one worthy of exploration. (if she is human, the fascination is obvious, if not- then maybe she is fascinated because of some special influence her race recieved from humans in the past, an influence that looks like it changed their destiny. she wonders what would have happened if they hadn't met the humans...)

then the tragedy occurs- some great catastrophe inflicts some race or another, and some other races seem to benefit from it (or not get as harmed by it), the chief winners are humans, though it takes a subtle eye to see that. (if she is human, she may hear about it from her parent, if not then her parent or mentor might elude to that). some of her friends seem to suffer greatly from this, showing her for the first time true suffering.

she becomes more focused, more interested, and start reading history in ernest, trying to find a connection between past catastrophes to the human race. alone, or with the aid of the mentor, she "finds" many links (real or "interperted") that build in her mind the certainty that humans are a taint to be removed.

but why not destroy humans as they are now, why have to resort to erasing the past? because the taint has spread to other races as well. a race that has been influenced by the humans is tainted by them. now, most of the known universe is afflicted.

she may go on a few more self missions to places that have been affected by humans, where her resolve may be strengthened. in some of them she may act to punish the abberant humans (and the PCs may meet her there, or just meet her handywork)

suggestions and variations
- she doesn't need to be evil, in fact i think you can even pass her as good. she does what she think will be best for the entire universe! how can that be bad?
- i'd suggest something on the lines of a paladin's behaviour (though not necesserily the class, which is hard to make into an effective villain)

- she could be aided by many members of the various races, especially from places that have been wronged by humans ({whether this accusation actually bears merit or not). these could be quite fanatical.

- she may recieve help from outlaws, in a "temporary alliance". the campaign might even begin in a related adventure.

- the party could meet various people of her past- her parent (that might try and help the PCs, bemoaning that s/he haven't given enough attention to the child), her childhood friends (from which they learn of her once gentle nature, and her deep caring for non humans, and when she changed) and her mentor (who knows her reasons all to well, but see in a moment).

- her mentor may not be what s/he seems- it might in fact be a devil/ demon/ whatever who sought the perfect tool to bring such an apocalyptic event to happen. (or maybe it planned for something lesser, like a war, but his ward has outdone it). the party could even battle it, and then later try and persuade SHE that it was all a big bluff, all a scheme, to which she then might respond them by saying something like "i knew who it was, but the teachings, the meanings, the history itself- that was true. nothing has really changed" or such like. (or maybe they could have a real chance of turning her back?)

- in concordance with the outer influence idea, SHE might be aided by a small group (or just one) outsider, who share a common enough cause (or that just might want to keep an eye on her)

- a big problem with this campaign is that there is no real reason to do much time traveling at all. just one- to the first humans, and then kill them all. how would you justify more time travel? i suggest searching for earlier history, or just growing stronger in her convictions, but it's a bit wierd.

hope this helped.

Kaiser Omnik
2009-07-23, 07:40 AM
The Inchoroi of R. Scott Bakker's Second Apocalypse series are trying to exterminate all life in order to seal the material world off from the afterlife, thus preventing their own damnation.


I once created a villain for a tabletop game of D&D which had similar motivation. He was an evil bastard, but one day, he learned what was really going to happen after his death; he would have been tortured for a long time, damned to the Nine Hells, maybe turning into a lemure after enough time spent down there. Even then, it wouldn't really be him. So did he try to redeem himself? No, he didn't believe it was possible even if, at this point, he began to truly regret some things he had done. He could have become a lich, but there was a good chance he'd end up dead anyway. But then he found the perfect way to avoid his terrible fate: join Tharizdun and make the world end. In his eyes, only the Chained God could finally put him to rest, by making sure no material plane and no afterlife remained. Nothing is quite peaceful like oblivion, nonexistence. :smalltongue:

Indon
2009-07-23, 08:29 AM
You know, here's a thought: Maybe she didn't have any trauma or anything of the like.

Maybe she has some way to basically guarantee a better replacement universe (maybe the Evil-aligned outer planes won't get the reboot or something) and she is a devotee to Good or some Good-oriented concept or deity in your setting.

Leewei
2009-07-23, 08:50 AM
-The world that is has been terribly damaged. She must wipe the slate clean to start anew.

-Destroying the world is a process of selection. If the heroes rise to the occasion, she'll simply restart the process elsewhere. She does this in preparation for the true destroyer, who countless ages ago laid her own world to ruin. She wants beings powerful enough to put an end to something she lacks the power to stop, herself.

-The world is her lover, ailing and riddled with parasites (sentient beings using magic). She is seeking to cleanse and heal him.

Leliel
2009-07-23, 09:19 AM
\
Anyway, how did she come to the conclusion that this 'utopia's' downfall was the beginning of the end for all good things in the universe? Why does she believe stopping its fall would bring about world peace, harmony, and Good Vibes all over? What gives her the confidence, let alone the conviction, to even think that she can overwrite the universe, and that everything will be for the better if she does? A utopia could just as easily become corrupt as any civilization, given the right set of factors; what makes this proposed utopia special?

Uh, Woobie Destroyer Of Worlds?

That's not exactly a type of villain conducive to the mentally stable.

In all likelihood, she isn't thinking this plan all the way through.

Eorran
2009-07-23, 09:39 AM
Here's a take on it you might like, based on a different question:

What does the Operative do after Serenity?

Maybe he (your she) decides that serving the evil regime in the name of good was a start, but not enough: the regime must be replaced. Presumably, the thought goes, the regime was started with good ideas, but fell off-track. The purity of the original intent must be revived - by going back to the beginning and hitting the big red Reset button.
Her death matters little compared to Making Things Right (TM).

"I'm not going to live there. There's no place for me there. I'm a monster, Mal. What I do is evil, I have no illusions about that."

Choco
2009-07-23, 09:46 AM
Man, those "villains" are so fun to create, especially if you can get the players to sympathize with them :smalltongue:

I would suggest that in addition to what you already mentioned your BBEG is doing, have her also know of an incoming (and as far as she or the PC's know, unavoidable) catastrophe that would not only be MUCH worse than the BBEG's plot, but could be prevented BY the BBEG's plot.

Now explaining that can be a pain in the arse, so I'm just gonna give an example, as I did this before. The "villain" got trapped on a plane that is actually worse than hell, and there he was able to learn a bit of the multiverse's history that had been "erased" on the outside. The plane he is stuck on is constantly growing by eating the other planes. Now this is a problem, because there is no escape from that plane once you are in it (which is why those who know of its existence and can travel there us it as a prison, which is how this villain got there). And to make matters worse, the bigger it gets the faster it eats the other planes. Now the multiverse is doomed right? Not entirely, turns out that since the beginning of time there has been a way to "reset" the multiverse back into its infant state, with the pacman plane (thats what the players called it, fits rather well actually) also being reset to the same small size as everything else. Who/whatever created the multiverse created this reset capability on purpose because he/she/it wasn't able to work out the bug that was pacman. Using this reset uses the energy contained outside the pacman plane, so at least 51% of the multiverse needs to be intact for it to work, and at the time of the campaign it was down to 52%. In the past those who have used the reset have waited till about that time, to give others as much time as possible to find an alternative. But should they go OVER that limit, the entire multiverse is doomed to be eaten by the pacman plane and everyone in existence would basically live in an eternal hell.

So the guy does what he thinks is right and from within his prison starts manipulating his followers to go about resetting the multiverse. So now the PC's have to decide, what's the best option here? Stop the guy from resetting the multiverse and most likely dooming all of existence to hell for eternity, or help him achieve his goal against his main opponent (who is much more villainous and is actually evil) and reset the multiverse, thus dooming everyone who is currently alive to never having existed in the first place but giving creation as a whole another chance. Now it would be an ideal solution if they could get rid of the pacman plane, or pacify it somehow, but what chance do they got if the creator of the multiverse couldn't do it :smalltongue:

So yeah, it's fun watching the players squirm as they try to figure out what to do.

Master_Rahl22
2009-07-23, 10:05 AM
Check out the Mistborn series by Brandon Sanderson. For the sake of those who might wish to read it, the rest will be in spoilers.

The tyrannical overlord who brutally murdered anybody who even thought about rising against him and systematically enslaved/tortured/wiped out entire races was doing it because he knew that this big bad evil appeared every 1000 years and tried to convince the whole world that it was really a force of good and should be set free. Only he knew the truth, and so he set out to do whatever it took to make sure he lived for the next 1000 years so that he could make sure the thing didn't get set free and end the entire world. Cue the party that can stop this arguably very evil overlord and then probably get tricked into letting an even greater evil loose.

Tuttle
2009-07-23, 10:07 AM
I would say to take a page out of Fable 2's book.

Corruption. She can only see corruption in this world and could be a good person at the start (Instigator of the adventures journey) into gathering certain supplies, knowledge and a power-base (Almost an empire :D) to get such a tower built.

Try to give off subtle hints of paranoia and the city she lives in must be rife with corruption (Childhood, likewise) while she retained her own ideals through some sort of paladin upbringing and her mentor, father-figure (Just someone with a title or a boat load of cash that has some sort of relation to her) dies and some form of corruption is involved. She breaks, wants to build this massive magic tower that is basically a one-use super powered wish spell.

quick_comment
2009-07-23, 10:14 AM
Another idea is that she is true neutral - all she wants is for the world to be left to its own devices, and for people to live their own lives.

None of this outer plane business, they are just trying to remove free will from the prime material. So when she destroys the world, she hopes the outer planes will not respawn, but the world will.

Oslecamo
2009-07-23, 10:33 AM
I don't know if anyone already mentioned it, but there's always the

"Can't make an omelet whitout breacking eggs!"

Basically, the world isn't that bad, but the villain discovered some kind of power/ritual/magic/device that would allow him to create an almost "perfect" world.

Only trouble is, before creating said perfect world, he has to raze the old world.

He promises that any who endure the destruction will be rewarded beyong their wildest dreams.

If he actually has the means to acompish this, and isn't just (completely) mad, then it can provide for a great story, where a significant number of people will flock to the villain.

Kris Strife
2009-07-23, 11:15 AM
She's bored and thinks that destroying the multiverse will be fun and make an awesome explosion?

Extra dimensional being conducting a science experiment for their 5th period physics class?

Deliverance
2009-07-23, 11:51 AM
She's an artist convinced that some aspect of the observable natural laws is just plain wrong, ruining all her efforts. Imagine that everything in the whole universe just is slightly askew to you, a constant pain and offense to your senses, and that you have the power to change it. Whether the goal is to change the laws of attraction, straighten out the double helix, or enact a sweeping change to make everything from the smallest bit upwards more hexagonal than round, there's bound to be people who'll object out of their small-mindedness or egosticial desire for personal survival.

This does not prevent her from being an overall nice person suited for Woobiehood, she just has this one little problem to fix, that would make the whole universe better.

Belobog
2009-07-23, 01:10 PM
Uh, Woobie Destroyer Of Worlds?

That's not exactly a type of villain conducive to the mentally stable.

In all likelihood, she isn't thinking this plan all the way through.

Well, then, the above option sounds perfect. Really drives the Woobie point home when she's the source of her own problem. :smalltongue:

Leliel
2009-07-23, 10:19 PM
She's an artist convinced that some aspect of the observable natural laws is just plain wrong, ruining all her efforts. Imagine that everything in the whole universe just is slightly askew to you, a constant pain and offense to your senses, and that you have the power to change it. Whether the goal is to change the laws of attraction, straighten out the double helix, or enact a sweeping change to make everything from the smallest bit upwards more hexagonal than round, there's bound to be people who'll object out of their small-mindedness or egosticial desire for personal survival.

This does not prevent her from being an overall nice person suited for Woobiehood, she just has this one little problem to fix, that would make the whole universe better.

That's...brillant!

I can just see the thought process.

While I want the "flaw" she sees to be a societal one (one of the main potential themes of the WDOW is how a civilization could just ignore those who needed help until it was far too late), I can just think of dozens of motifs to go with this; Painting a portrait of the world of how she sees it, metaphorical decay (cracks in the facade and all that), opera...It's perfect!

Belobog: ...I'm not sure if that's sarcastic or not.