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View Full Version : [Eberron] Magekilling Trinkets - feedback requested



Kemper Boyd
2009-07-25, 05:41 PM
Liberally stealing from R. Scott Bakkers Prince Nothing trilogy, I decided to introduce a nasty little magic item into Eberron. Trinkets.

They're copper spheres which were found in an ruin on the continent of Xendrik, by a tomb robber archeologists who didn't really think about the implications of them, and created by the long-dead giants of Xendrik. For anyone who is blind to magic, they're just metal golf balls.

They destroy magic. They also can hurt, maim and kill arcane magic users (with the exception of artificers, who are for some reason not hurt by them). Also they have an effect not realized by their long-dead creators - they can actually break planar connections under the right circumstances. If you put enough of them together and scatter them quickly enough, they give out a temporary anti-magic pulse stopping any magic items and breaking any planar connections, banishing manifest zones for a brief time, no more than half a minute at most.

In game terms, any magic-user who is touched with a trinket will take damage that increases per turn, starting from 1d4 and going up to 2d20 per turn. Also, even briefly touching a trinket will completely disarm a mage by draining all his spells for the day. Users of divine magic aren't affected, artificers are not affected either.

Using detect magic will show trinkets as little purplish-black vortexes of an odd magic type. Magic users can also sense the presence of trinkets - they give them headaches and tend to make magic users feel uncomfortable.

And now someone brought half a million of them to Sharn to destroy the manifest zone making the city viable.

Feedback, comments?

Pharaoh's Fist
2009-07-25, 05:45 PM
You could try to assassinate a wizard's guild with halfling rogues armed with slingshots...

Salt_Crow
2009-07-25, 06:03 PM
That sounds like it's more of an artifact than a simple magic item. It makes sense not to harm the artificers though; infusions are, by definition, neither arcane nor divine. Has anyone at all realised the potential of those items? How about the dragons? If the Eyes of Chronepsis know that the power to sever planar connection had been turned over to the humans, that may spell doom for Khorvaire.

I can see how it would be of very useful property to many powerful manipulators too. Say, House Tarkannan (not exactly one of the big boys, but still based on Sharn nonetheless, and they're responsble for Sharn's destruction so many years ago), the Lords of Dust if it would somehow sway the Prophecy to their favour, Daelkyr just so they can muck around with it etc etc. It'd mean to Dreaming Dark/Thousand Eyes that they can now learn the secret behind the severed connection of their plane. (it would provide some valuable clues to the quori who understand magic, like halashaq). Daask would almost certainly be aware of them, as the Daughters of Sora Kell would likely have some interest in furthering their influence.

If the items in question are really so easily detectable by arcane spellcasters (read: rakshasa and chamber agents), I would imagine there'd be some serious plots undergoing the moment it arrived in Sharn. Since it'd be risky for them to actually touch the artifact (save Naztharune or divine-conversion dragons), I'd imagine they'll run a shadow war never before seen. Government officials swapped out, laws governing Xen'drik artifacts changing all of a sudden, gang wars becoming much more lethal as Boromar and Daask clash head-on once again etc etc.

It'd be very interesting indeed. What could PCs do? What change could the PCs make? There's like half a million of them and if they get together, that'd spell certain doom for the city of towers. If the Trinkets could really sever planar connections even for a few seconds at a time, yep, many would have some interest in acquiring enough of them indeed. Imagine the Blood of Vol agent using in in the middle of Shae Mordai. All the undyings and ascendent councilors, suddenly without their connection to Irian! What'd happen then? How does it work out with the Prophecy? Would the dragons act before such disaster strikes? Or wouldn't they?

I'd say those are the questions that would drive my Eberron group, trying to beat the big boys from using them to twist the world in their favour, possibly destroying them if they could in the process.

Sinfire Titan
2009-07-25, 06:21 PM
This sounds familiar... (http://brilliantgameologists.com/boards/index.php?board=99.0)

kpenguin
2009-07-25, 06:25 PM
Obviously, this is the work of giants. They were found in Xen'drik and what is the big thing that nearly destroyed giant civilization? Severing the connection between Eberron and Dal Quor.

I suspect that the Gatekeepers would be highly interested in these little trinkets.

Kemper Boyd
2009-07-25, 06:27 PM
That sounds like it's more of an artifact than a simple magic item. It makes sense not to harm the artificers though; infusions are, by definition, neither arcane nor divine. Has anyone at all realised the potential of those items? How about the dragons? If the Eyes of Chronepsis know that the power to sever planar connection had been turned over to the humans, that may spell doom for Khorvaire.

I can see how it would be of very useful property to many powerful manipulators too. Say, House Tarkannan (not exactly one of the big boys, but still based on Sharn nonetheless, and they're responsble for Sharn's destruction so many years ago), the Lords of Dust if it would somehow sway the Prophecy to their favour, Daelkyr just so they can muck around with it etc etc. It'd mean to Dreaming Dark/Thousand Eyes that they can now learn the secret behind the severed connection of their plane. (it would provide some valuable clues to the quori who understand magic, like halashaq). Daask would almost certainly be aware of them, as the Daughters of Sora Kell would likely have some interest in furthering their influence.

If the items in question are really so easily detectable by arcane spellcasters (read: rakshasa and chamber agents), I would imagine there'd be some serious plots undergoing the moment it arrived in Sharn. Since it'd be risky for them to actually touch the artifact (save Naztharune or divine-conversion dragons), I'd imagine they'll run a shadow war never before seen. Government officials swapped out, laws governing Xen'drik artifacts changing all of a sudden, gang wars becoming much more lethal as Boromar and Daask clash head-on once again etc etc.

It'd be very interesting indeed. What could PCs do? What change could the PCs make? There's like half a million of them and if they get together, that'd spell certain doom for the city of towers. If the Trinkets could really sever planar connections even for a few seconds at a time, yep, many would have some interest in acquiring enough of them indeed. Imagine the Blood of Vol agent using in in the middle of Shae Mordai. All the undyings and ascendent councilors, suddenly without their connection to Irian! What'd happen then? How does it work out with the Prophecy? Would the dragons act before such disaster strikes? Or wouldn't they?

I'd say those are the questions that would drive my Eberron group, trying to beat the big boys from using them to twist the world in their favour, possibly destroying them if they could in the process.

I introduced them in my current campaign by having an antagonist give one to the players when he was bargaining for his life. A cult of the Mockery had brought them to Sharn, and they're keeping most of them in an undisclosed location, but a few have been lost on the way (since the trinkets aren't that valuable individually). The beauty of it is that at this moment, there's exactly seven people in Sharn who are aware of the potential of them: the player characters and a House Cannith research leader who helped them study them and the guy who brought them there.

The dragons might know of their existence, but at the moment they think the trinkets are mostly a historical curiosity that has been lost.

And since the planar connection severing is actually something that not even the creators realized, it's a hard thing to actually do: you need something to scatter the trinkets as far and wide as possible (and it needs to be done in the span of seconds) to get a real effect, otherwise it might just fizzle out and do nothing. Also, to get it to work you need a huge pile of them, at least ten thousand to get even a limited area effect. Of course that doesn't mean that the various factions you mention would be averse to trying to get their hands on them.

I'd also imagine that there will be various factions trying to find a new cache of them somewhere in the jungles of Xendrik.

Animefunkmaster
2009-07-25, 06:33 PM
I would prefer the items drain a #d# spell levels as opposed to ALL arcane spell levels and deal damage only if the target has things to drain (literally pulling the cosmic energy out of them, or contact with there deity). I would not make a distinction between arcane/divine/infusions/psionics... and make something interesting for vestiges/warlocks (can't use spell likes for #d# minutes or rounds or hours).

If it breaks down and severs planar binding it should also affect divine (and vestiges), since there spells are by definition (fluffy definition) from there connection to there deity. Anything that affects arcane and divine magic should also affect psionics (as per psionic-magic transparency).

Kemper Boyd
2009-07-25, 06:39 PM
I would prefer the items drain a #d# spell levels as opposed to ALL arcane spell levels and deal damage only if the target has things to drain (literally pulling the cosmic energy out of them, or contact with there deity). I would not make a distinction between arcane/divine/infusions/psionics... and make something interesting for vestiges/warlocks (can't use spell likes for #d# minutes or rounds or hours).

If it breaks down and severs planar binding it should also affect divine (and vestiges), since there spells are by definition (fluffy definition) from there connection to there deity. Anything that affects arcane and divine magic should also affect psionics (as per psionic-magic transparency).

I wanted to make the individual trinkets horribly scary to magic-users, which is why their effect is so dramatic. At least the duskblade in the group is sort of permanently nervous after he picked one up and burned his hand (I propped the trinket at the game table with a golf ball).

I've not put much thought into psionics and warlocks, since my campaign doesn't have any as player characters. And it does not affect divine magic since divine magic in Eberron is powered by the individual conviction of the character, not by a genuine divine connection.

Sinfire Titan
2009-07-25, 06:45 PM
I wanted to make the individual trinkets horribly scary to magic-users, which is why their effect is so dramatic. At least the duskblade in the group is sort of permanently nervous after he picked one up and burned his hand (I propped the trinket at the game table with a golf ball).

I've not put much thought into psionics and warlocks, since my campaign doesn't have any as player characters. And it does not affect divine magic since divine magic in Eberron is powered by the individual conviction of the character, not by a genuine divine connection.

Oh, great. Another nerf to arcane casters that has no effect on CoDzilla. Like Arcane Spell Failure isn't enough? You just had to go and design an item that kills Arcane casters and does nothing to Divine casters.

For the record: Arcane and Divine magic are the same ends, just different means. A Fireball cast by a Cleric (however they get it) has the same effects as a Fireball cast by a Wizard. The difference is source.

IMO, if it affects spells, it should affect all types of spells. Limiting it to just one makes it seem like you hate that particular brand (its ok to hate casters, so long as you don't play favorites with them).

Salt_Crow
2009-07-25, 06:54 PM
Oh, great. Another nerf to arcane casters that has no effect on CoDzilla. Like Arcane Spell Failure isn't enough? You just had to go and design an item that kills Arcane casters and does nothing to Divine casters.

For the record: Arcane and Divine magic are the same ends, just different means. A Fireball cast by a Cleric (however they get it) has the same effects as a Fireball cast by a Wizard. The difference is source.

IMO, if it affects spells, it should affect all types of spells. Limiting it to just one makes it seem like you hate that particular brand (its ok to hate casters, so long as you don't play favorites with them).

Nay, I don't seriously think it's a DM-nerf to arcane spellcasters. It's just another campaign idea for the PCs to overcome! Unless, of course, it makes any of the players uncomfortable/downright unplayable. I guess some DM-to-player talk would be required then.

Although, I do agree with the idea that "all your spellz are gone!" is an extreme challenge in itself. I'd go with "lose one highest level spell as if you gained a negative level.", which would still be scary but not as debilitating as it is now.

Kemper Boyd
2009-07-25, 07:20 PM
Oh, great. Another nerf to arcane casters that has no effect on CoDzilla.

Since my campaign doesn't have a single cleric character, I'm not too worried about that balance. I would probably do some balancing if necessary for the campaign.


Nay, I don't seriously think it's a DM-nerf to arcane spellcasters. It's just another campaign idea for the PCs to overcome! Unless, of course, it makes any of the players uncomfortable/downright unplayable. I guess some DM-to-player talk would be required then.

Although, I do agree with the idea that "all your spellz are gone!" is an extreme challenge in itself. I'd go with "lose one highest level spell as if you gained a negative level.", which would still be scary but not as debilitating as it is now.

Since the player group isn't actually that reliant on magic (Paladin, Rogue, Duskblade, Artificer, Monk, Sorcerer) even a bunch of halfling slingers pelting them with the trinkets would be a minor problem.

The real idea with having a big amount of these nasty little things around is pretty much what you said in your first post: they change things. I'm not really planning on having enemies using them as weapons in personal combat, mostly because of their gravitas: they might be harmless for most people to touch, but the enemies can be as superstitious and careful as players might be. Why takes chances with something as dangerous as this?

Later on in the campaign, someone might actually try to use them as a melee weapon, but right now no one who knows about them is doing that, and by the time that happens, spellcasters will be inventing ways to minimize their impact.

woodenbandman
2009-07-25, 07:46 PM
Sovereign Glue + Touch Attack/Sleight of Hand...

My response: Don't do it. Unless you plan on banning all arcane classes from player use, it will only piss off players which is no bueno.

Coidzor
2009-07-25, 09:59 PM
So someone's going to try to make a dirty anti-osmium bomb to coat sharn in "copper" spheres of death, not only killing thousands from the explosion itself and the magical shrapnel, but also causing all of the floating towers to fall simultaneously and permanently in addition to eliminating the magical safeguards that would slow their falls if the worse case came about.

Yeah, if that doesn't restart the last war, it'll definitely attract the attention of the dragons which would be worse.

Be dead useful for carpet bombing Sarlona though.

What's it do to magic items? Disjunction? Dispel? Permanent spells? Spell effects with a duration that are still going?

Kemper Boyd
2009-07-26, 05:46 AM
What's it do to magic items? Disjunction? Dispel? Permanent spells? Spell effects with a duration that are still going?

It doesn't anything to magic items or any ongoing effect, since it wasn't designed by it's original users to do that.


Sovereign Glue + Touch Attack/Sleight of Hand...

Sovereign Glue is CL 20, which means there's not much of it around in Eberron.