T.G. Oskar
2009-07-29, 04:59 PM
Again, the build bug strikes again!
While checking for the Carmendine Monk bonus feat on behalf of explaining the features to some people on the forums, I stumbled upon a funny build that might just work out. Of course, it probably isn't legal, but if it becomes possible, then it would be a hilarious way to do so.
Basically, the premise is to get the prerequisites of Sublime Chord by level 11, with or without touching a single level in bard, using a wide variety of different methods. If done correctly, while not in the playing level of a tier 1 or sorcerer, it could do pretty funny things.
In either case...here's the build:
Human Harmonious Knight 1/Paladin 4 of Milil/Knight of the Weave 5/Eldritch Knight or Virtuoso 1/Sublime Chord 1/EK 8(+?)
Feats:
1st level or Human: Able Learner
6th level: Initiate of Milil
Skills for qualifications:
Diplomacy 4, Intimidate 4, Perform (any) 10 (for Virtuoso)
Knowledge (arcana) 1, Knowledge (history) 1, Spellcraft 1 (for Knight of the Weave)
Knowledge (arcana) 13, Listen 13, Perform (any) 10, Profession (astrologer) 6, Spellcraft 6 (for Sublime Chord)
Perform (any) 3 (Initiate of Milil)
The principle behind this is to use Knight of the Weave to qualify for the spells, and to use either the ruling of Initiate of Milil that paladin levels stack with Bard levels for purposes of access to Bardic Music abilities OR use the Bardic Music ability of the Virtuoso coupled with the Initiate of Milil. It's pretty insane, mostly because it almost completely emulates Bardic Music abilities. I'd need to see the ruling of the collective to see how it works.
(In either case, it *could* be fixed with a Bard level and Devoted Performer, but the hilarity is if this could work without taking a level in Bard)
The idea is that, with the right amount of levels and abilities, you can get 8th-9th level spells and around 16+ BAB, which are the key elements for a typical gish. The second thing would be the ability to use the spell lists of bard, sorcerer, wizard and paladin for purposes of using scrolls, staves and wands. The third is to use a hilarious ability from the Knight of the Weave in which you can sacrifice a spell slot to add at least one metamagic feat to a cast spell. Certainly, depending on the choices it may seem like a bad move, but the possibilities are endless.
Actually, the idea of persisting Time Stop with the use of a 6th level spell cracks me up.
Of course, the whole concept is throughly untweaked, but this is why I ask guidance from you, fellow Playgrounders. Here are my doubts and questions:
1) You may know already of the bardic music limitation. Another limitation would be Listen. Aside from taking a level in Bard, which would an alternative way to get Listen as a class skill?
2) What metamagic feats (aside from Extend and Persistent), divine feats (4th level Paladins get Turn Undead), and other feats may aid this build? While at that, what other feats can aid the build? Since this isn't meant for playing (yet...), consider that virtually any official book goes, with Dragon magazine content merely as suggestions.
3) While at that, which magic items would be worthwhile? I could think of a Cloak of Charisma and mithral armor, as well as probably a Badge of Valor.
4) Has this been done before? I've seen builds blending Paladin with Nar Demonbinder, but none using Knight of the Weave.
While checking for the Carmendine Monk bonus feat on behalf of explaining the features to some people on the forums, I stumbled upon a funny build that might just work out. Of course, it probably isn't legal, but if it becomes possible, then it would be a hilarious way to do so.
Basically, the premise is to get the prerequisites of Sublime Chord by level 11, with or without touching a single level in bard, using a wide variety of different methods. If done correctly, while not in the playing level of a tier 1 or sorcerer, it could do pretty funny things.
In either case...here's the build:
Human Harmonious Knight 1/Paladin 4 of Milil/Knight of the Weave 5/Eldritch Knight or Virtuoso 1/Sublime Chord 1/EK 8(+?)
Feats:
1st level or Human: Able Learner
6th level: Initiate of Milil
Skills for qualifications:
Diplomacy 4, Intimidate 4, Perform (any) 10 (for Virtuoso)
Knowledge (arcana) 1, Knowledge (history) 1, Spellcraft 1 (for Knight of the Weave)
Knowledge (arcana) 13, Listen 13, Perform (any) 10, Profession (astrologer) 6, Spellcraft 6 (for Sublime Chord)
Perform (any) 3 (Initiate of Milil)
The principle behind this is to use Knight of the Weave to qualify for the spells, and to use either the ruling of Initiate of Milil that paladin levels stack with Bard levels for purposes of access to Bardic Music abilities OR use the Bardic Music ability of the Virtuoso coupled with the Initiate of Milil. It's pretty insane, mostly because it almost completely emulates Bardic Music abilities. I'd need to see the ruling of the collective to see how it works.
(In either case, it *could* be fixed with a Bard level and Devoted Performer, but the hilarity is if this could work without taking a level in Bard)
The idea is that, with the right amount of levels and abilities, you can get 8th-9th level spells and around 16+ BAB, which are the key elements for a typical gish. The second thing would be the ability to use the spell lists of bard, sorcerer, wizard and paladin for purposes of using scrolls, staves and wands. The third is to use a hilarious ability from the Knight of the Weave in which you can sacrifice a spell slot to add at least one metamagic feat to a cast spell. Certainly, depending on the choices it may seem like a bad move, but the possibilities are endless.
Actually, the idea of persisting Time Stop with the use of a 6th level spell cracks me up.
Of course, the whole concept is throughly untweaked, but this is why I ask guidance from you, fellow Playgrounders. Here are my doubts and questions:
1) You may know already of the bardic music limitation. Another limitation would be Listen. Aside from taking a level in Bard, which would an alternative way to get Listen as a class skill?
2) What metamagic feats (aside from Extend and Persistent), divine feats (4th level Paladins get Turn Undead), and other feats may aid this build? While at that, what other feats can aid the build? Since this isn't meant for playing (yet...), consider that virtually any official book goes, with Dragon magazine content merely as suggestions.
3) While at that, which magic items would be worthwhile? I could think of a Cloak of Charisma and mithral armor, as well as probably a Badge of Valor.
4) Has this been done before? I've seen builds blending Paladin with Nar Demonbinder, but none using Knight of the Weave.