Bullying in the Playground

[Yarram]

Well I've been thinking about Bullying and the like lately, and I'm interested in how others deal with it. I'm sure we've all experienced bullying at some point in our lives, I-Myself am not worried about it because I've developed enough coping mechanisms so it doesn't really bother me.
In fact the thing that bothers me most about bullying isn't what's being said to me, or what power that is being taken away, but rather that a person/group of people dislike the person they're bullying so much, they have to go out of their way to harass them.

NOTE: I don't want to hear about how you're bullied, just how you deal with it.

My own method of coping with bullying works on several steps, depending on what is being used against me. Most of it works on the don't care principal, where you can't be worried about what's going to happen to you, so you don't lose any personal power. Remember it doesn't matter if you're weak and your aggressor can overpower you:

Walking down an enclosed space and being swung at or pushed:
This bothers me the most out of all bullying methods, just because it's so vindictive, and also because it's physical.
My own method of dealing with this is what only comes through experience, and it involves the manner in which I walk, which makes me unable to be tripped or knocked over while I'm walking.
The worst thing that can be done, is bumping into them on purpose because that starts a fight, and we don't want any of that.
Usually a pleasant, or stern (but not angry) "excuse me" will allow you to bypass any blockade, as it shows the aggressor that you're acknowledging their presence, but you don't actually care.

Being harrassed in lines Part 1: Someone Pushes in front of you;
To this, I say who cares. It doesn't really matter when someone pushes in front of you, unless you have some sort of urgent date, in which case I would quietly ask them to not, as I have an important date.
Part 2: Someone tries to pick a fight with you:
In this situation, I'll do one of three things, none of which involve leaving the line. Firstly I'll use witty repartee to change the subject or just act friendly towards the person that's trying to pick a fight with me.
Secondly, I'd say "Hey, I'm trying to talk to my friend here," and motion to the person in front of me, and even if they aren't my friend, I'll strike up a conversation that is clearly faked with them, which shows the aggressor that not only aren't you bothered by them, you can't be bothered to put in the effort to resist them properly, which normally would be a show of disrespect in their eye's and would likely make them try harder, except you're obviously disinterested in them.
Thirdly, I'd have a conversation with the person trying to harass me, in which I directly confront them in a light, joking manner, and give really absurd reasons for why their assaults arn't valid. Often making the conversation become really immature works well for example, "You're a Pineaple" (in an exaggerated voice)"Your mum is a Pineapple!" Which completely defuses any sort of situation.

Most important to my evasion techniques though, is taking control of the situation. Don't ever let people talk at you while you remain silent. Interupt insults half way and explain that you find what they're saying pretty offensive, but make sure nonverbally, that they don't see you being unconfident.
While I'm bothered fairly often, it's because I'm weird. (or different, however you want to say it) I don't let it affect me though, and I make sure everyone understands that too, by always holding the high morale ground, never believing what anyone that's trying to harass me says. While my method of coping doesn't always stop bullying, it is in no way central to my life, and it doesn't really affect me, just because I don't care enough about it.

Like I said before, I find the most upsetting part, that someone feel threatened by you so much, that they have to go out of their way to confront you, rather than anything actually said.

[horngeek]

Tell the teacher. If your school is half-decent, this will get it dealt with very quickly.

Admittedly, part of my measure of whether a school is decent or not is how it deals with bullying.

Also, remember that bullies are essentially cowards, looking to feel manly about themselves. Essentially, they are compensating.

[ghost_warlock]

I'm not sure if it was the right way to deal with bullying, but I know what I did and that it worked.

In elementary school:
For verbal stuff, I was simply thick-skinned. Insult me, my parentage, my hobbies, whatever; I don't care.
For physical stuff, I disproportionately escalated the situation. A minor poke was met with screaming, swearing, name-calling, throwing things, etc. This would immediately draw the attention of everyone nearby and I certainly wasn't the one who'd get embarrassed to suddenly become the center of attention. I usually stopped short of actually making physical contact with the bully, but the one time that a bully did try to 'pick a fight,' I bit him. Prest-O: no physical bullying for more than five years.

In middle school:
Mergers within the school system in 8th-grade meant that I had to educate some newcomers on the downsides of bullying. I continued with the thick-skinned routine for verbal bullying, on the rare occassions when it came up. For the single physical instance, I escalated again. Our parents were notified of the incident and we each ended up spending a day in the principle's office (in-school suspension) but that was the last time I was ever bullied.

In high school:
The only thing even approaching bullying when I was in high school was a rumor that someone started about me which was so utterly ridiculous that everyone (even me) simply laughed and life went on.

[horngeek]

Nope. Not really appropriate ways of dealing.

Thick-skinned works as well, though.

[Exeson]

Ummm, grow a pair?

Sorry, that is my method anyway.

And if you can't, grab some people and a baseball bat or two.

[horngeek]

No. Responding to bullies with voilence makes you into one yourself. That's a bad move.

[ghost_warlock]

http://www.japanfocus.org/data/Hownaturesaysdonottouch.png

[Kaelaroth]

No. Responding to bullies with voilence makes you into one yourself. That's a bad move.

See, were I one who hadn't been bullied at any point, I'd likely agree. But, sadly, in the true way of things, I'mma forced to disagree. Though violence is, blatantly, not a good idea in nearly any situation, punching a bully to get him/her the hell away/off you/your-back, works surprisingly well. And, no, please don't play the "it makes you a bully too" card - you're not bullying them, you're standing up for yourself. As long as you don't make it a recurring motif throughout your scholastic sonata, or don't pre-emptively strike...

In other news, growing a pair works, but takes some time, I've found, and maintaining a thick skin can seriously damage what lurks beneath such an armored exterior.

[horngeek]

I have been bullied as well, and I still think this. It is possible to stand up for yourself without hitting them.

[billtodamax]

Meh, I've been bullied a bit, nothing physical cause I'm pretty good at defusing/avoiding those situations, but I find the best way to deal with verbal abuse is to ignore it. They soon get tired of no reaction at all. Or I start laughing at them. That works surprisingly well.

[Kaelaroth]

It is possible to stand up for yourself without hitting them.

To a degree, I agree. But it depends very much on situation and person.

[Yarram]

Tell the teacher. If your school is half-decent, this will get it dealt with very quickly.

Admittedly, part of my measure of whether a school is decent or not is how it deals with bullying.

Also, remember that bullies are essentially cowards, looking to feel manly about themselves. Essentially, they are compensating.

That's what we're told to do, but I disagree with getting external help, not because it portrays weakness, but why bother going to a teacher when you can stop things before they even start. And lame and overused as it is, going to teachers doesn't always help because then a casual harrasser takes it personally, and begins to go out of their way to be annoying. Often teachers don't help out too unless you're showing some form of distress, which I've never shown, so they don't take complaints seriously.

[rakkoon]

Stand up for yourself does work in some occasions. My bullying stopped when I hit back once and that was just on the arm. No need for big fights but the idea that you will not take anymore worked fine. Of course when the bully is head of the football team that might not be the best approach.

[horngeek]

That's what we're told to do, but I disagree with getting external help, not because it portrays weakness, but why bother going to a teacher when you can stop things before they even start. And lame and overused as it is, going to teachers doesn't always help because then a casual harrasser takes it personally, and begins to go out of their way to be annoying. Often teachers don't help out too unless you're showing some form of distress, which I've never shown, so they don't take complaints seriously.

Okay, maybe your school does stuff differently, but mine does not tolerate bullying. It may be chiche, but it really does not.

[ghost_warlock]

Another thing that might work with bullies is doing something that may radically change their perception of you.

Learn to play electric/bass guitar or a trap set, get a tattoo1, crash a party, let it slip that you have a pet snake or tarantula2, take up a sport or athletic activity like rock climbing or a martial art3, that sort of thing. The idea here is that these sorts of activities are generally "safe" but are, nevertheless, seen as risk-taking (which will make you seem more badass). Make sure, however, that whatever you do it's genuine; something you're actually interested in and/or plan to follow through with, not something you're doing for the sole purpose of attempting to ward yourself against bullies. In the process, you'll likely make new friends/contacts and start to explore new ways to express and redefine yourself - you'll essentially outgrow the bullies.

1For Elan's sake, just not something like Tinkerbell, butterflies, or the like if you're a guy! Make sure it's something you honestly appreciate/identify with but that won't be too counter-culture, "girlie," or "for kids." Good/popular choices are probably things like yin-yang, "Celtic" glyphs, kanji, or maybe military-themed stuff if you actually plan on enlisting or have family members in the service.
2This sort of thing had better be true, though; cuz you'll really look like a dweeb if anyone finds out you were lying.
3Don't try to be the Karate Kid or use it to show off how cool you are for taking the classes; emphasize the fact that it's a sport/solid form of discipline-building exercise. The goal shouldn't be solely to scare off bullies with how tough you are, but getting in shape and meeting new people/making new friends in your classes.

[Serpentine]

Horngeek: Sadly, I think Australia's schools do an uncommonly good job of dealing with bullying :smallsigh: and if they don't, a good portion of the time it gets thrown into the news.
I got tired of being the only person who didn't advocate a victim dealing with it on their own last time this came up, but I just want to let you know that I agree with you entirely. Intimidation, theft and physical and verbal assault is a crime whether it occurs between adults in the street or children in a school. It should be treated as such. If it's not treated as such by the authorities who should do so, then they should be publically reprimanded. And those who say "you shouldn't seek help from authorities because they won't help", are just ensuring that this will be true for even longer. If you go to the authorities and they don't help, then, again, they should be punished for not doing their damn jobs.

[Dispozition]

Quick note, last time this came up it was locked with a few bannings and a decent amount of warnings iirc.

Anyway...I've been bullied a lot, although thankfully not in recent years. Originally violence was my first answer, which didn't work too well...Then teachers, which worked marginally well. Then, thanks to a rock-bottom self-esteem (it does come in handy!), bagging yourself along with the bullies deters them. It's amazing how it works. Surprsingly my self-esteem has recovered, but it's still my choice tactic since it confuses the buggery out of them.

Anyway, I'm no good at actually dealing with bullies in a reliable and profound way, so I doubt you'll see me in here again :P

[Yarram]

Okay, maybe your school does stuff differently, but mine does not tolerate bullying. It may be chiche, but it really does not.
Just out of interest, do you go to a private school?

Another thing that might work with bullies is doing something that may radically change their perception of you.

Learn to play electric/bass guitar or a trap set, get a tattoo1, crash a party, let it slip that you have a pet snake or tarantula2, take up a sport or athletic activity like rock climbing or a martial art3, that sort of thing. The idea here is that these sorts of activities are generally "safe" but are, nevertheless, seen as risk-taking (which will make you seem more badass). Make sure, however, that whatever you do it's genuine; something you're actually interested in and/or plan to follow through with, not something you're doing for the sole purpose of attempting to ward yourself against bullies. In the process, you'll likely make new friends/contacts and start to explore new ways to express and redefine yourself - you'll essentially outgrow the bullies.
I disagree with this. (I play electric bass) Australia prominently has this thing called tall poppy syndrome, where people who are successful are taken down by all the people around them, because they think the successful person makes them look bad. :smalltongue: Most of that stuff would just make you look like a tryhard. Plus you'd have to change significantly in reaction to other people, which isn't really true to yourself.

EDIT:

Quick note, last time this came up it was locked with a few bannings and a decent amount of warnings iirc.


I'm hoping the thread won't degenerate to that, because I've implicitly (or at least subtly) said this thread isn't about saying when you've been bullied, but rather how you deal with it.

Futher note, I dislike the metaphore, "Thick Skin" because it indicate's that you're being hit by something that could cause damage in the first place, where-as in an ideal world, we don't care enough about what's being said to have need of defence from it. That's how I think though, but I guess it's a hard state of mind to attain, and I originally thought of it as "thick-skinning it."

[horngeek]

Actually, selective.

[Dispozition]

I disagree with this. (I play electric bass) Australia prominently has this thing called tall poppy syndrome, where people who are successful are taken down by all the people around them, because they think the successful person makes them look bad. :smalltongue: Most of that stuff would just make you look like a tryhard. Plus you'd have to change significantly in reaction to other people, which isn't really true to yourself.

This. I'd dislike someone who went around doing all that since they'd just look like a wanker in my eyes.

[Yarram]

Actually, selective.
(I go to a public school. In a regional city(20k people)... The city with the highest teen pregnancy rate in Australia if that puts things into perspective)

[billtodamax]

Horngeek: Sadly, I think Australia's schools do an uncommonly good job of dealing with bullying :smallsigh: and if they don't, a good portion of the time it gets thrown into the news.
I got tired of being the only person who didn't advocate a victim dealing with it on their own last time this came up, but I just want to let you know that I agree with you entirely. Intimidation, theft and physical and verbal assault is a crime whether it occurs between adults in the street or children in a school. It should be treated as such. If it's not treated as such by the authorities who should do so, then they should be publically reprimanded. And those who say "you shouldn't seek help from authorities because they won't help", are just ensuring that this will be true for even longer. If you go to the authorities and they don't help, then, again, they should be punished for not doing their damn jobs.

My Sose teacher said a similar thing. He said that most bullying was assault, and occasionally battery, but by giving it a different name it was taken less seriously. He also told us that if you got given a detention you could technically sue for trespass. He's a great teacher.

[Serpentine]

(I go to a public school. In a regional city(20k people)... The city with the highest teen pregnancy rate in Australia if that puts things into perspective)Oooo. Where, exactly?

My school was pretty tame, so far as I ever saw. As far as I could tell, physical stuff was very limited, and it was much more emotional abuse, and not very much of that. Of course, this school also leaped upon any report of bullying... I don't know how effective it was (the only example of it I participated in wasn't a very good one), but they tried this thingy where they brought in the accuser and the accused and a witness for each, and talked it all out together.

[Yarram]

Oooo. Where, exactly?


South Grafton High School. It's funny because it has both extreme's. It's got groups of people that are going to absolutely KILL the HSC, but then it's got derro's that can barely read. (I know, I tutored a couple of them... I got a Tafe cert from it.:smallbiggrin:)

[Serpentine]

Grafton... I think my Boy might be from Grafton. I'll ask when he gets back. I think he's mentioned something about bullying, but I can't remember what... I don't think he got it too bad, if only because he's a reasonably big guy.

[Exeson]

I have been bullied as well, and I still think this. It is possible to stand up for yourself without hitting them.

If someone hits me I'm gonna hit them back. Harder.

Maybe it is just the fact that I don't take bulls*** but in fact, if someone hits me I'm going to make every effort not only to retaliate but also to ensure that he never touches me again and if that means he walks with a limp for a while then it is his problem because he should not be bullying me.

You got to realise you can't be bullied if you don't let yourself be bullied. Be that by fighting back or ignoring them.

[Coidzor]

I didn't get much of the whole physical bullying thing due to generally being larger than other children my age. I'm thinking I more than made up for it in the whole harassment thing, since I've been getting **** from my peers for little to no apparent reason since my first growth spurt after attaining sapience.

[Yarram]

I'm thinking I more than made up for it in the whole harassment thing, since I've been getting **** from my peers for little to no apparent reason since my first growth spurt after attaining sapience.

I have a cunning solution for you. :smallwink:
Every time someone pays you out for being a lanky bugger, you hit them on the shoulder, in the same place, just hard enough to bruise lightly. Then, you will have revenge for them being able to play hide-n-go seek better than you.
*I do not condone violence of any kind.
Exeson^@: On some level I agree with you, and to each his own, but I'm a massive pacifist, excepting in video games, so I'm afraid I'm totally against that method. But hey! If it works, and does no harm, go to it!

[Coidzor]

Eh, a bit late these days.

The worst I get nowadays is friends accusing me of wanting to rape them out of the blue. And then things take a turn for the weird and insulting.

Thankfully that's only happened three times so far, but uh... all within the same 3 month period.

That was an odd winter semester...

[Yarram]

The worst I get nowadays is friends accusing me of wanting to rape them out of the blue. And then things take a turn for the weird and insulting.

That's... The oddest thing I've heard all day.

[xPANCAKEx]

i've always been a small kid - not short, just physically lacking in build. However, a few things through-out my childhood have ensured i was never on the recieving end of much hassle:

1) for christ sake, learn to make friends. When the toughest kid in school sat next to me, told me to give him a pen for the lesson, i said "no" - he made some remark about my mother, i made one in response. this went back and forth until i had one that trumped his ("thats rich coming from a boy whos mum was so fat she got baptised at sea world"). Totally purile, but if you stand up for yourself from the get go, and keep a smile on your face people will respect you. But thats how it is when you're 14.

2) aged 9 i threw a chair a good 25ft across a class room at another child while screaming that i'd rip his guts out, and getting away with it (well, being sent to the heads office to math problems and play with toys) despite the deputy head teacher being only a meter away - how? Teachers know who the trouble makers are. If you're usually placid, and the other guy is a... well... an ass - the blame is rarely going to come your way. The key is to pick your moments to defend yourself and blow up big. Not that i advocate violence, but if you're going to defend yourself physically make sure its done in a way that people think twice in future

3) tell the teacher - if only in confidence. Then they can keep and eye on them and catch them in the act

4) tell the teacher

5) get involved in sport. Lots of bullying comes down to "whos bigger/stronger than who" - if you equalise the equation through physical training, they will be less interested in hassling you. Plus excercise boosts your mental and physical well being, and lets you meet new people - part of bullying is about picking on the 'weakest' of the bunch with no friends to defend them.

6) a note of self defence/martial arts - if you take them up, do not let your bully know you have been training in martial arts. If you fight and lose after such an announcement it makes you look weaker and an even bigger target

[Yarram]

@ Pancake: The problem with alot of your suggestions is they involve changing your lifestyle, which is really difficult to do. While they are permanent solutions, they arn't effective in the short term.
The other problem I see is where you bickered with the bully on his terms, which most people can't do. The saying, "Never argue with an idiot, because they'll just bring you down to their level and beat you with sheer experience" applies here.

[Coidzor]

That's... The oddest thing I've heard all day.

Yeah, that was pretty much my reaction too.

[Ninja Chocobo]

Tell the teacher. If your school is half-decent, this will get it dealt with very quickly.

Ah-hah.
Ah-haha.
No.

Anyways, people pretty much stopped bullying me after I stabbed a mo'****er in the eye, 'cos he wasn't showin' proper respek', yo?
((well actually when I say "stabbed", it was with a bull clip on the end of a pan, and when I say "eye" I mean "eyebrow", but it still managed to draw blood and this is the version everyone got told so yeah))

[Serpentine]

You got to realise you can't be bullied if you don't let yourself be bullied. Be that by fighting back or ignoring them.So it's the victim's fault he's being bullied? That's some dodgy reasoning right there.

I think Pancake's suggestions aren't too bad...

[Coidzor]

So it's the victim's fault he's being bullied? That's some dodgy reasoning right there.

I think Pancake's suggestions aren't too bad...

:smallconfused: I think he's more advocating pro-active solutions than assigning blame, per se...

Also expressing a love of casual violence, but that doesn't seem too outside of his modus operandi.

[Jalor]

The worst I get nowadays is friends accusing me of wanting to rape them out of the blue.
Wow, I thought I was the only one that happened to.

Anyway, my reaction depends on the nature of the bully.

If they get physical right away, I take my fist and hit them with it. You don't condone violence, so this isn't much help.

If they don't, I remain calm but tell them, in no uncertain terms, to leave. It's surprising how many people will take orders from a skinny, geeky guy who is addressing them in a slow, even tone.

[Coidzor]

Wow, I thought I was the only one that happened to.

Oh god? people make a habit of this?

I thought it was just that some idiot gas sprung a leak in the area...:smalleek:

Anyway, I've mainly developed a thicker skin and the ability to give as good as I get in terms of verbal insult fighting.

I generally tried to leave the situation physically or shut it down through other means if things started getting truly nasty rather than just being slightly more **** than usual.

Originally this was attempted with violence when I was small, but even then I wasn't that fast compared to the other kids, so that wasn't really a viable tactic so I adjusted to the more-or-less friendlessness of my youth after a certain point by becoming more bookish.

So I got to be normal until I was about 6 or 7, and then more or less lost all but a few of my friends for reasons I either never knew or don't recall and never really recovered socially, being at best slightly distant from others and at worst actually outcast. So I read, which in turn, y'know, fed the gap between me and my peers.

[Exeson]

So it's the victim's fault he's being bullied? That's some dodgy reasoning right there.

No, sorry I didn't make that clear. I was more refering to a mental frame of mind rather than place the blame. What I meant is that if you ignore the bullying then it no longer bothers you, therefore it is no longer bullying(hence you are not letting yourself be bullied - you are still being harassed and stuff, but it no longer poses a problem. This obviously doesn't work if things get physical, in which case refer to my other point about standing up for yourself). I'm a very big advocate of metal willpower, and I know that I come across as tough love but I have learned from experience that a lot of problems can be solved by just approaching them with a different frame of mind. This of course does not work for everyone as it does require a fairly strong willpower and a level of self belief and confidence. (This is where my crippling superiority complex actually comes in useful :smalltongue::smallbiggrin:)


Also expressing a love of casual violence, but that doesn't seem too outside of his modus operandi.

Ooooh, please explain this more? I have only really heard that term with regards to Serial murderers (In a book I was reading) and do not still fully understand it.

[Jalor]

Oh god? people make a habit of this?
Well, it only happened once. And she followed through; the restraining order is still in effect. Not only that, but she ran into me a year later and didn't recognize me. We actually really hit it off, for the second time; she gave me her number and hugged me when she left. I nearly died laughing.
The above story is 100% true and free of BS.

[Coidzor]

Ooooh, please explain this more? I have only really heard that term with regards to Serial murderers (In a book I was reading) and do not still fully understand it.

*points at your avatar* Also, I seem to recall you claiming to be mildly sociopathic at one point... So yeah... Operating mode, way of going about things, though I guess it would've been more appropriate to say the face you present to us....

[Exeson]

*points at your avatar* Also, I seem to recall you claiming to be mildly sociopathic at one point... So yeah... Operating mode, way of going about things, though I guess it would've been more appropriate to say the face you present to us....

Again yay for willpower. Since then I have curbed my anger management problems and no longer pin the rugby team's captain to a locker by his throat... Thinking about it I think there might be a reason in there somewhere that made them stop bullying me, ah well.

[Trog]

Enroll in a martial arts program for a few years. Make sure your classmates know this but don't ever make a big deal out of it. This likely will prevent you getting in most fights since it will be assumed by many that you are able to defend yourself and thus you will not present an easy target. And if you do get into one it'll end quickly and with you on the winning side. At least this worked for me. Your mileage may vary.

As for verbal stuff I find thick skinnedness (everyone gets picked on by someone sooner or later so learn to recognize posturing as posturing and nothing more) and a willingness to trade insults with a smirk will get you past most of these situations. Also the friends thing. Not that you need them to back you up or anything but being able to make a lot of friends or just generally be liked might get the occasional person to chime in in your defense even if you aren't there. Goodwill can go a long way. :smallsmile:

[banjo1985]

Thick skin is good I think. Bully's can often lose interest and move to another target if they think that their words have no affect on you, at least early on. It's your reaction to the first few slung insults that sets the tone I think, if you don't put them off then you can be stuck with it.

I was never really bullied at school, a bit of verbal when I started high school that I completely ignored and that was it. Having friends helps I think, the people who got bullied worst at my school were the outsiders that had no-one to back them up. There was surprisingly little physichal bullying at my school, and it was mostly confined to the girls strangely enough. My old high school has since been closed down due to being put under special measures, and having the worst GCSE results in the area. I think I got away pretty lucky at that place overall.

[Serpentine]

What about all the sensitive kids who can't "grow a thicker skin", to whom these things really get and hurt them deeply, or who are simply attacked by unusually clever and astute bullies? What are they meant to do?

I never really had a "method" of dealing with my bullies... It went kinda like this:

Grade 4
Them: "Haha! You're riding a pink bike with a pink helmet!"
Me: >stops riding bike to school except when running late<

Grade 7
Them: >point out and mock embarassing habits, block my way in class, etc<
Me: >cries<

Grade 9
1. Them: >various vague mockeries<
Me: >sits on a tank reading, or sitting in the library hanging out with "library people" and/or reading, generally just doesn't hear anything<
2. Me: >Says something stupid in class, like announcing loudly that pigs' orgasms last half an hour in response to a question about whether dolphins are the only other animals that have sex for fun. Shakes head sadly at own faux pa<
Them: "Hey Serpentine, how long does a pig's orgasm last?!"
Me: :smallsigh: "Yeah, funny guys."

Grade 11
Them: As Grade 7, for some strange reason.
Me: :confused: "...why would you even start that again?"

[xPANCAKEx]

@ Pancake: The problem with alot of your suggestions is they involve changing your lifestyle, which is really difficult to do. While they are permanent solutions, they arn't effective in the short term.
The other problem I see is where you bickered with the bully on his terms, which most people can't do. The saying, "Never argue with an idiot, because they'll just bring you down to their level and beat you with sheer experience" applies here.

there isn't always a quick fix

long term solutions always trump short term ones in my eyes

so get out there, change your life style, as usually its your life style that a bully will try and pick on. Im not saying change what you do (hell, i've always been a massive geek - never gunna change), but you doing other things as well - such as excercise and expanding your social horizons - will reap long term benefits for your mental and physical well being, as well as solve the bullying issues

[SDF]

What about all the sensitive kids who can't "grow a thicker skin", to whom these things really get and hurt them deeply, or who are simply attacked by unusually clever and astute bullies? What are they meant to do?

I'd say that's the problem with bullying, thought, isn't it? That it works. If it didn't just devastate physically or emotionally certain people it wouldn't happen. I think most kids (or adults in similar workplace situations) in such a situation are affected by it, and instead of being proactive and doing something about it end up becoming depressed, develop psychological problems, or abuse substances. Not everyone can cope with it.

[thestarvingpoet]

Thicker skin can work against verbal bullying, but not always. Sometimes it just makes the bully try even harder to get through. I personally had lots of experience with name calling/nick names, and typically had three approaches.

Sometimes bullies chose nicknames that were just idiotic (yet they still bothered me, why I don't know). One bully insisted on calling me Big Al (my name is Alix) for ages, which I couldn't stand. Finally one day after talking with my mom we came up with a similar nickname for this girl - Little Cassie (she was quite short). It took about 1 day of responding to her 'Hey Big Al's' with 'Hey Little Cassie' for her to approach me alone and set up an I'll stop if you stop deal. I've heard of this approach working for other kids as well.

Some nicknames were perfectly fine. In junior high they tried to come up with a nickname that would bother me, and all they could come up with was Ali. I thought this was perfectly fine, and started using it on my own, and laughed at them when they got frustrated that I wasn't upset. The laughter really got to them.

By the time high school rolled around I just refused to answer to names that I didn't like. As most people came to me for help in one class or another (I was one of the few people who would help out *anyone* who asked nicely), they pretty quickly came around to my way of thinking.

I was lucky that I only had to deal with verbal and exclusionary types of bullying. Physical bullying is a whole other kettle of fish that I have no real advice for.

[Krrth]

Enroll in a martial arts program for a few years. Make sure your classmates know this but don't ever make a big deal out of it. This likely will prevent you getting in most fights since it will be assumed by many that you are able to defend yourself and thus you will not present an easy target. And if you do get into one it'll end quickly and with you on the winning side. At least this worked for me. Your mileage may vary.

As for verbal stuff I find thick skinnedness (everyone gets picked on by someone sooner or later so learn to recognize posturing as posturing and nothing more) and a willingness to trade insults with a smirk will get you past most of these situations. Also the friends thing. Not that you need them to back you up or anything but being able to make a lot of friends or just generally be liked might get the occasional person to chime in in your defense even if you aren't there. Goodwill can go a long way. :smallsmile:

Funny thing, that worked for me as well.

The last time someone tried to bully me, it was the "I'm not gonna let you walk past me, whatcha gonna do about it?" type.

The first and last time someone tried to get physical, I won.

[Tengu_temp]

there isn't always a quick fix

long term solutions always trump short term ones in my eyes

so get out there, change your life style, as usually its your life style that a bully will try and pick on. Im not saying change what you do (hell, i've always been a massive geek - never gunna change), but you doing other things as well - such as excercise and expanding your social horizons - will reap long term benefits for your mental and physical well being, as well as solve the bullying issues

I find this to be is terrible advice. Not only does changing your lifestyle mean you'll be doing things you're not enjoying, it also means that you let the bullies influence your actions - and the whole point of resisting bullying is to not let them influence what you do. If a bully sees that his actions have an impact on you, he'll only bully you even further, about other things.


What about all the sensitive kids who can't "grow a thicker skin", to whom these things really get and hurt them deeply, or who are simply attacked by unusually clever and astute bullies? What are they meant to do?

I suggest gathering enough friends that you'll have advantage in numbers and confronting the bullies. They won't mess with you if they know you bite back.

[Exeson]

What about all the sensitive kids who can't "grow a thicker skin", to whom these things really get and hurt them deeply, or who are simply attacked by unusually clever and astute bullies? What are they meant to do?

They either learn or suffer. Simple really. It is pretty harsh but life at the moment is, always has been and always will be, survival of the fittest. And if you are not the fittest, and can't learn to become one then you don't survive. (phew - extended metaphor FTW)

I'm not saying everyone is on their own etc. but friends can only help to a certain extent, again going back to my previous post the person who can give you the most help is yourself and unfortunately if you can't hack it (either by improving yourself or finding a way to avoid the problems - e.g. ignoreing them etc.)then you fall by the wayside.

Also, this is just a personal thing but I love clever bullies. They make thins so much more interesting and so much more enjoyable when you bring them down to their knees.

[SilverSheriff]

When Bullied I go Beserk...Repressed Rage, Violent Household and stuff, etc, etc...

I'm not above biting, scratching, eye-gouging, punching, choking and all of the colours of the Violent Rainbow people still, because I like the Idea of nobody talking to me for long periods of time; sure beats listening to the stuff those ****heads would put me through otherwise (beatings...regularly...every school I've ever been too...).:smallmad:

[SDF]

When Bullied I go Beserk...Repressed Rage, Violent Household and stuff, etc, etc...

I'm not above biting, scratching, eye-gouging, punching, choking and all of the colours of the Violent Rainbow people still, because I like the Idea of nobody talking to me for long periods of time; sure beats listening to the stuff those ****heads would put me through otherwise (beatings...regularly...every school I've ever been too...).:smallmad:

Holy crap, dude. :smalleek:

[Jack Squat]

If someone hits me I'm gonna hit them back. Harder.

Maybe it is just the fact that I don't take bulls*** but in fact, if someone hits me I'm going to make every effort not only to retaliate but also to ensure that he never touches me again and if that means he walks with a limp for a while then it is his problem because he should not be bullying me.

You got to realise you can't be bullied if you don't let yourself be bullied. Be that by fighting back or ignoring them.

I completely agree with this. I grew up in an environment where there were 2 or 3 "cool" kids who basically became popular by being intimidating, and by bullying people who didn't think they were the cat's PJs; I was one of those.

For awhile, I ignored them, blocked and shielded myself in so many layers that today I still have trouble getting in "deep" conversations at times. If one of the guys blind-sided me when playing "tag" football (on pavement), I just got back up and didn't react - still have some of the scars, I probably always will. As it turns out, these guys weren't in it for the reaction, they wanted control.

One day, I had enough. When one of the guys rushed me while playing a game of football, I stood my ground. Completely stopped him moving forward, and even managed to spin him back and off to the side some. Later I ended up getting in a couple small brawls, but I'd already left my mark as someone who wouldn't take to being messed with too well anymore. And however it's done, that's the message you want to ultimately get across.

Going to a teacher doesn't always work, as even though the bully may get in trouble, you're still labeled as a target. Just as a criminal's not always deterred by the small chance of getting arrested again, a bully may not see getting suspended as a way to fix the error of his ways. Whether it's through diplomatic pursuits or more physical ones, the way to deal with bullies is to show that you're not an easy target; unless it's personal, they'll move on to someone else.

[ghost_warlock]

I find this to be is terrible advice. Not only does changing your lifestyle mean you'll be doing things you're not enjoying, it also means that you let the bullies influence your actions - and the whole point of resisting bullying is to not let them influence what you do. If a bully sees that his actions have an impact on you, he'll only bully you even further, about other things.

No, the point of resisting a bully is to make the bully stop inflicting physical and/or emotional abuse, not to avoid being influenced by the bully. He's already influencing you if you change nothing and just let him keep abusing you.

The objective of bullying is typically making oneself feel powerful or look cool at the expense of another, it's not a simple stimulus-response exercise. The point is that the bully expects you to react in a way that gives him power, acceptance, or even just a laugh and if you don't give him the feedback he wants, the bullying won't be fulfilling and he'll find someone else to pick on.

As for changing up your routine/self-image, I see it more as exploring yourself as a person and seeking out things you might possibly enjoy but may have never really considered before. Obviously, if something is utterly repulsive to you, that shouldn't be your first option. However, if you've always thought X sounded interesting or Y could be a good way of losing some "baby fat," then you should go for it and see how it works out for you. Explore your horizons and possibly shake yourself free from bullies as a side benefit.

[multilis]

A bully is looking for fun/reaction, if he doesn't get it he may lose interest.

Adversity isn't all bad, at times it can build strength/willpower.

Bullies often tend to feel inferior/jealous and try to compensate by bringing others down. Eg if they may get poor marks in school and unhappy home life and see future of low paying job, and envy those they think may be happier/more successful.

[SilverSheriff]

Holy crap, dude. :smalleek:

Yeah, it gets even more mysterious knowing that 2 of my schools were in the Private system and those 2 were the worst. I prefer the Knife School... I took peoples knives and chucked em on rooftops... nothing but Ornamental Crap anyway.:smallfrown:

In all my Years at school I'll still came out with the Cleanest record of a Grand Total of 2 suspensions and about 20 Detentions.


Edit 2:37am East Australian Coast time: Also note I am the Nerd...the Wide-shouldered physically imposing but overweight Nerd... I don't know what it is maybe its similar to that weakness that everyone is drawn to like a Siren's Song.

[Exeson]

Bullies often tend to feel inferior/jealous and try to compensate by bringing others down. Eg if they may get poor marks in school and unhappy home life and see future of low paying job, and envy those they think may be happier/more successful.

Oh god, how I hate that theory. This is something people who are bullied like to cling to to try and deal with it. Most bullies just do it because they can. There is usually no deeper motive than that. Because they can bully, they do, because they get a kick out of it, not because they think they are worse than you.

[Kaelaroth]

Bullies often tend to feel inferior/jealous and try to compensate by bringing others down. Eg if they may get poor marks in school and unhappy home life and see future of low paying job, and envy those they think may be happier/more successful.

Even if that's true, I don't care! If they're bullies, they're not (in nearly every case) nice people. Lots of bad people are traumatised - isn't gonna make me stop hating 'em! You might argue that that's harsh, as they're inferior or jealous... but they try to compensate by bringing others down. The latter isn't justified. It's horrible! Plus: what Exe said.

[ghost_warlock]

There's many different reasons why a bully might choose to bully. From the literature I've read on the subject (part of my job), it seems that most bullying is a result of trying to fill some social need. The model that we use in our treatment program breaks down everyone's social needs into four categories (coutesy of a Dr. William Glasser): Love/Belonging, Power/Importance, Fun/Pleasure, and Freedom/Choice. If someone's needs in pretty much any of those areas aren't being otherwise met, bullying might be a fulfilling means of doing so.

Everyone tries to meet these needs, bullies simply do so at others' expense.

[SilverSheriff]

...if they may get poor marks in school and unhappy home life and see future of low paying job, and envy those they think may be happier/more successful.

I didn't turn out so bad... I think...:smalleek::smallfrown:

[Telonius]

My preferred method of dealing with it, in this order:

0. DON'T PANIC.
1. Know yourself. Know where you're strong and where you're weak.
2. Training. Improve yourself. Not just in strength, but in confidence. Bullies will rarely attack a truly confident person, even if that person is physically weaker. They will often dominate a person who is physically stronger but lacking in confidence.
3. Identify risks. Figure out who's likely to bully. Figure out what situations they usually bully in.
4. Manage risks. See if you can make friends with potential bullies. "Friends" does not mean "Bully/toady," it means meeting the person on a level of mutual respect. This is not always possible by a long shot. But a wiser man than me said that the greatest martial art is turning an enemy into a friend.
5. Avoid risks. If you know the people in #3, and can't befriend them, don't be where those people are. You are not being paid to enforce school policy or your local laws. Let the people who are, take care of it.
6. Minimize risks. If you can't avoid the bully, look at your available resources. Have backup (either friends, administrators, police, etc).
7. Manipulate the playing field. If you must meet the bully, do so where you are strong and he is weak. If he's Two-Ton Tony and you're the little twerp, don't try to arm-wrestle him. If his strength is based on his gang of friends, try to separate them. Sow dissent if you have to.
8. Conflict. Sometimes, despite your best efforts at avoiding escalation, conflict is unavoidable. If the bully does blindside you and physically attack you, respond with overwhelming force. (This is not necessarily physical force. Getting him tossed in jail also qualifies as overwhelming force). Self-defense is a basic right of all people. If you're in a position where your back is well and truly to the wall and no aid is coming, do not sit there and take it. Do not fight fair, fight to win. (Read up on your local laws about proportional response - this does vary from place to place). Force is the absolute last resort option, but it is always an option.

[Mr.Moron]

As I recall I mostly dealt with it by getting highly antagonistic and trying to get them in trouble with the school authorities. I wouldn't recommend it. It mostly caused them to increase the intensity of their efforts.

Later I tried simply withdrawing, not interacting with anyone and just generally becoming anti-social. I wouldn't recommend that either.


So, I can't really give any good pointers. I can say for certain those two methods are not the way to go with it.

[Serpentine]

Oh yeah, I was friends with the bullies once, in grade six... It was either them or the girly-girls :smallyuk: They "rescued" me when I was talking to a mentally disabled girl, and once when we were walking through the playground one of the girls stole a ball off a younger kid, gave it to me, and walked off. I didn't know what the bajeebus I was meant to do with it, so I gave it back to the kid...

[Trog]

What about all the sensitive kids who can't "grow a thicker skin", to whom these things really get and hurt them deeply, or who are simply attacked by unusually clever and astute bullies? What are they meant to do?
They'll suffer, most likely. The idea that someone is powerless against the things that are said to bring that person down is a self-defeating one. Remember:

"No one can make you feel inferior without your consent."
- Eleanor Roosevelt

Recognize bullying for what it is. Part jockeying for social status, part lashing out at others to boost one's own ego, and part cruelty. What does any of this really have to do with you if you are the one being bullied? Nothing. You are a convenient victim for someone who has a lot of problems of their own.

If, instead, you believe and take to heart all the degrading things said about you by another, you perpetuate your own suffering. Chances are a bully insults you, forgets about it, and moves on. Don't carry it with you. It's better for you to let it go and to believe you are a better person than your detractors say you are. After all aren't you?

[Blackjackg]

Hum. Ok.

First off, I was bullied a lot as a kid. Elementary, middle, most of high school. Second, I am a working child/adolescent psychologist and have put a lot of time and energy into understanding and working with bullies and bullied kids. So I have some idea what I'm talking about.

Two points I want to make right off the bat: 1) If you are in imminent, physical danger, seek help immediately. Go to the school, go to your parents, and if they can't provide the help you need, go to the police. 2) If you are not in imminent, physical danger, remember that bullying happens. It just does. That's how the teenage mind works.

It goes away eventually as people mature, but at different speeds for different people. For the most part, it'll be over with by the end of high school. The best advice I can give is to be thick-skinned and wait it out (again, barring actual danger). It sucks being taunted, pushed and tripped, but most things you can do to try and stop it will actually make it worse.

That being said, one thing you can do is to try and figure out what it is you're doing that's making you a target. One of the hardest things I had to realize in coming to terms with the years that I was bullied was realizing that I was asking for it. This doesn't excuse the behavior in any way, but when I consider that teenagers feel some need to pick on someone, I was really doing a lot of things to make myself that someone. I won't go into them all, but to make a long story short, I was weird. If I had been better able to understand and apply the social rules, had made a few temporary changes to my lifestyle (like bringing a basketball to school instead of the Monstrous Manual), I wouldn't have been such an attractive target. Would they still have bullied me? Maybe. But when I walk down a school hallway now as a professional psychologist, I can always pick out the kids who are bullied because they're the weird ones. There may be something in that.

The OP mentioned a "special way" of walking down the hall to avoid being pushed or tripped. Maybe I'm reading too much into that, but if your way of walking makes you stand out, it's probably more of a harm than a benefit.

For God's sake, DO NOT ESCALATE THE SITUATION. What I mean by this, mostly, is do not take Exeson's advice. (Sorry, I don't usually just say to straight-up ignore someone, but his replies in this thread are almost terrifyingly counter-productive). If your bully is content mocking you and shoving you into lockers, introducing a baseball bat into the mix is the last thing you want to do. That will make him embarrassed and angry, and you'll probably wind up on the receiving end of something much worse. He shoves you, you hit him with a bat, and he runs you down with a car (tragically, I have seen this happen more than once). Generally speaking, you don't want to do anything that embarrasses a bully in front of his friends, because that will increase his need to retaliate in order to regain the power. If you have a chance to talk with him alone and say, in a reasonable and adult manner, "Listen man, we have got to figure out a way to work this out," it's worth a shot. But don't try it when he's got something to prove or it'll wind up worse for you.

As a last resort, don't underestimate the power of a fresh start. At the end of the year, talk to your parents about changing schools. It's a pretty extreme measure, but if the situation is unbearable, it's preferable to violence and suicide. Don't expect a "New Guy" scenario like in the movie of that name, but know that bullying is a self-perpetuating cycle. The more you are bullied by a group of people, the more you are likely to be bullied in the future. So by cutting yourself off from that group and starting fresh, you may avoid re-entering the cycle. I changed school systems between middle and high school, and it was the best choice I had ever made (I still got teased, because I was still weird, but to a much more bearable extent).

Once again, if there is threat of actual physical harm (beyond maybe a bruise or a skinned knee), seek help immediately, and keep seeking it until you get it. Otherwise, try and shrug it off and know that it will get better with time.

[H. Zee]

I dealt with bullying by working hard at becoming more popular than the bullies, and then turning them into the school-wide targets.

But what can I say? The constant abuse wore me down a little too much. Especially when it extended online. They called me fat, so I lost 3 stone. They took the mickey out of my glasses, so I started wearing contacts. They then ran out of things to say that genuinely hurt me. I became friends with almost everyone else apart from this select group, and soon people who had been friends with that group were abandoning them and becoming more friends with me. Then I started to sow the seeds of "Oh yeah, x is kind of a *expletive*, isn't he? Do you know what he did?" etc etc, until said small select group was a mockery. And then things got even worse for them than it had been for me at the start of the year. I didn't bully them myself, but I didn't put a stop to it either, and I could have done so easily.

...Yeah. It works, but it's not a particularly moral way of dealing with the situation. One of the kids eventually moved schools, and in retrospect, I think I became the monster rather than overcame it, and I'm not proud of that.

I like to think I'm a much nicer person now than I was then, though.

[Kaelaroth]

I didn't know what the bajeebus I was meant to do with it, so I gave it back to the kid...

Perhaps she thought you should wield it as a token of your initiation? Though you could've just bounced it, too. *shrug*

[OverdrivePrime]

When I was a little kid, I was constantly bullied. I grew up sheltered, well read, cheaply dressed, very sensitive, and generally trained from birth to turn the other cheek. When my family moved to a new, wealthier school district when I was in first grade, I instantly became a target of the burn-outs and popular kids alike. My first name is Max, so they had a field day with me.

The popular kids eased up by about 6th grade, but the burn-outs kept right on it. Eventually, I learned to not take it to heart. I knew that I was a good person, a loved person, a smart person, and in my own weird way, a cool person. Finally, I learned to laugh it off.

Not just in a lame "ha ha, real funny guys", but in a brutally self-depreciating, "Is that the best you unimaginative losers can do? Lemme show you how to really make fun of me" kind of way. I was funny, could take the hits gladly, and it made the jerks uncomfortable. Add to that the fact that I was a big, athletic kid, and the teasing eventually petered out by the time I got to high school. So, I guess I lucked out by genetic chance, and thanks as well to developing a wicked sense of humor.

20 years later, my philosophy on bullying is that so long as it remains out of the physical realm, you should suck it up and learn to deal with it however you can. Don't give the bullies the satisfaction of seeing you cry, and if you can, use your smarts to make them look dumb. If you just ignore it, don't let it outwardly get to you, and just don't give them any pleasure out of trying to torture you, the bullying will stop (or shift to some other poor bastard). As long as you're safe from physical injury, I'd strongly advise against bringing teachers or other authorities into it. The best that will happen will be the bullying will stop for a week, and then be redoubled. The more likely case will be that you'll become a social pariah, known as a weakling and tattletale who can't solve their own problems.

However, if someone physically attacks you, I strongly subscribe to the code of Malcolm Reynolds (http://i177.photobucket.com/albums/w219/mwellenstein/Win/fair_play.jpg). Meet force with equal force. If they attack you unarmed, you fight back unarmed. If they attack you with sticks and stones, you fight back with sticks and stones. If they get a gun - you run your sorry butt for cover and call the frickin' cops.

[Renegade Paladin]

Due to widespread apathy on the part of school authorities and the nature of both the issue and the perpetrators, bullying is one of the very small subset of problems best solved through the careful application of force.

This does not mean to haul off and administer a righteous beatdown, as tempting as that might be. No, what it means is that you tell the teacher and the principal, in writing exactly what is happening in as much detail as you can manage, and retain a copy of your written message, which was preferably delivered by certified mail with a signed acknowledgment of receipt. When they proceed to do what teachers and principals do (i.e. absolutely nothing that will stop the problem, and a whole lot of things to make it worse), you proceed to apply the only thing that bullies respect: As much force as it takes to make you more trouble than you're worth, preferably in a way that doesn't leave visible injuries (the last part for your sake, not theirs; someone who behaves in that manner deserves what he gets). Thanks to your earlier paperwork, you can readily show that the authorities have failed to act on a problem well known to them, and that you have exercised your right to self defense in the absence of their useful intervention.

Of course, if school discipline were of an even remotely effective variety, the steps preceding active self defense would be unnecessary, but they seem intentionally set up to let the aggressors off scot free while heaping trouble upon the victim who has the temerity to do anything other than hand over his lunch money and climb into his locker to save them the trouble of stuffing him into it. :smallannoyed:

[lvl 1 fighter]

Having been the nerd and loner geek from Kindergarten up till 11th grade, I have plenty of experience with bullies.

If it's verbal, just ignore it. Not worth your time.

If it's physical, try and ignore it. If it's not serious they'll probably stop after not getting the reaction they want.

If it's repeated physical, or any kind of serious physical, respond with escalating levels of force. Make them realize that bullying you is not worth their time.

What do I mean escalating levels? Forget Malcom Reynolds code. They shoved you down? Kick them in the groin, then stomp them when they're down. If the situation isn't life threatening then don't resort to life threatening or crippling force, but - you must make them understand that hurting you is going to get them hurt much worse in return.

Violence isn't the best answer. I will concede that. But it is the only answer that some people will listen to.

[Blackjackg]

Seriously, violence is not the answer. It's not only not the best answer, it's barely an answer at all. If you escalate things, odds are that it will work out badly for you.

It's not impossible that, if you give the bully a good beating, they'll see you as a nonviable target and leave you alone. It's also not impossible that they'll be back the next day with a knife or a gun to take your life. While both of these are rare occurrences, I have seen the latter more often than the former. More likely than either of those, they'll just step up the antagonism but do it in force. And that's in the unlikely event that you win.

Do not, do not, do not respond to bullies with violence. Morally, that qualifies as sinking to their level. Practically, it's much more likely to make things worse than better.

[potatocubed]

Violence worked for me, although that was 15 years ago and I'm not sure it's a viable solution any more. There is, as others have pointed out, the very real risk that the bully will come back with a knife, or a gun, or a dozen of his mates, and just kill you.

If you're not going to hospitalise your tormentors, and you don't think you can just turtle up and take it, your other option is to make as much of a fuss as humanly possible. The teachers will do nothing if you let them - the school will have an anti-bullying policy, and it will be about as useful as a chocolate kettle - so what you have to do is make yourself such a massive pain in their collective arse that they have to do something.

Bring in your parents, bring in the police, the local education authority, the media if you can. You need to arrange things so that it is easier for the school to expel the bullies (or, better yet, have them locked up in a young offender's institution) than to ignore you.

Failing that, home schooling. Your social skills will suffer, but it's not like you were getting much social education by being used as a pinata anyway.

[Renegade Paladin]

Do not, do not, do not respond to bullies with violence. Morally, that qualifies as sinking to their level. Practically, it's much more likely to make things worse than better.
Nonsense. Force is not a moral or immoral thing in and of itself; it is a tool. The morality or immorality of force depends upon the reason it is applied. Unless your reason for applying force is sadism and a wish to see your antagonists suffer, you have not remotely sunk to their level.

Passive resistance does nothing to stop bullying, at least at the school level. All you're doing is making yourself into an easy target. Bullies do not respond to anything but force, whether applied by the victim or by some third party on behalf of the victim. On the rare occasions when a school administration decides to do something effective about such a problem, they don't politely ask the bully to stop (which is what they usually do, and merely intensifies the problem as the bully punishes his victim for involving the authorities); they punish him and compel him to obey. In other words, they apply force. Criminals are not politely asked if they would please come with the police and voluntarily stay in the unlocked jail cell; they are arrested with as much or little force is needed to restrain them and locked away. Or, if they were unfortunate enough to try to victimize someone with the means to defend him or herself, they are repelled with force, and justly so. Force is the only thing that such predatory personalities respect, and for much the same reasons that wild predators tend not to attack prey animals with the ability to successfully apply force to them.

[lvl 1 fighter]

Seriously, violence is not the answer. It's not only not the best answer, it's barely an answer at all. If you escalate things, odds are that it will work out badly for you.

It's not impossible that, if you give the bully a good beating, they'll see you as a nonviable target and leave you alone. It's also not impossible that they'll be back the next day with a knife or a gun to take your life. While both of these are rare occurrences, I have seen the latter more often than the former. More likely than either of those, they'll just step up the antagonism but do it in force. And that's in the unlikely event that you win.

Do not, do not, do not respond to bullies with violence. Morally, that qualifies as sinking to their level. Practically, it's much more likely to make things worse than better.

When I say "serious physical", that's what I mean. I'm talking about bullying that actually qualifies as assault. Perhaps the shoving/groin kicking wasn't the best example I could have used to illustrate my point, as being shoved isn't really a serious physical assault.

However, I stand behind my response. I don't want my kids to learn that the appropriate first response to someone assaulting them is to run and tell the authorities. If life-threatening, evaluate whether you can escape the situation. If you can't escape, then fight until you can. Then you can alert the authorities.

[Hadrian_Emrys]

Sloth is my more powerful vice. I'm slow to act, and apathetic in general. So, when I was 'bullied' it usually ended one of two ways.

1) They became my bodyguards. I have no idea how this kept happening, but I'd get picked on (sassed, shoved around, hit, etc.) then just... talk with the person like we were just doing our thing and then bam: my own physical escort through the halls. I'm sure it helps that I also always seemed to have really tough identical twins rolling with me for some odd reason. Two stocky islanders in grade school, and two brilliant jocks in middle school. Both pairs were great guys to spend time with, though I had no idea how I kept running into matched sets. :smallconfused:

2) Not being one to bother with exerting much physical effort, I'd play passive mind games with them. Most people who 'bully' tend to not think very laterally. Dealing with them tends to be like social aikido in that you need to figure out how to just redirect them towards other people you don't like. Making a problem deal with another problem without having to lift a finger? Yes, please. :smallamused:

[Keshay]

Best way to deal with bullies is to hit them with the phonebook.

That's right, pick up the phonebook and call their home. Speak with thier parent(s) and let them know the situation. Let them know that your complaints have been registered with the appropriate school authorities, and that if a change is not made, then legal action will take place. (of course do this with your parent's supervison and consent.)

Its amazing how well this works, even after the ignoring and violence escalation and all other methods described here have failed.

Then again, for the one kid I did have to get to this level with it turns out that his father was physically abusive, and the reason he didn't come to school for a week was that he'd been beaten to within an inch of his life in response to my phonecall... But really, who cares? It got the d-bag to leave me alone, the fact he got beaten was just a bonus.

And yes I do carry this resentment with me years later. All those who claim to have been bullied and condemn the thought of escalating violence are either outright cowards content to live thier life in fear and shame, or were never truly bullied and just had thier tender sensitivities hurt by a cursory jibe or insult.

[Morty]

The real problem with using force against bullies is that it would work, if bullies weren't
a) stronger than the people they choose to pick on
b) working in groups.
Other issues with responding the bullies in kind aside, it's simply not possible most of the time. Of course, the sad thing is, nothing else is going to work either, because if someone is a bully, he's the type of a person who doesn't recognize anything but force.

[Blackjackg]

All those who claim to have been bullied and condemn the thought of escalating violence are either outright cowards content to live their life in fear and shame, or were never truly bullied and just had their tender sensitivities hurt by a cursory jibe or insult.

Or we've learned that there are more important things in life than who can inflict punishment on whom.

[Froogleyboy]

I used to be bullied, this is how i dealt with it:
I got some friends together we all filled our socks with gravel, change, etc. and gave some serious ass wuppins

[Exeson]

You know anotherway to deal with it? If they bully you just bully them the feck back.

[Castaras]

Both been a bully and been bullied. They both go hand in hand quite a bit of the time, really.

I dealt with it before by ignoring it. Now I deal with it by laughing openly at it. You'd be amazed at some of the things people do. :smalltongue:

[Froogleyboy]

If its verbal, fight back bye freaking them out. if they call you a name or insult you just glance at them, give the a furtive look, lick your lips, and charge at them. They will run like hell

[MethosH]

I shouldn't be the one to talk about bullies... Last time I've meet one I was about 6 years old and I almost killed the poor fellow by bitten his neck while punching his face.

[Jalor]

Morally, that qualifies as sinking to their level.
Anyone who maintains this moral high ground for long has probably never been bullied physically. If they're only calling you names or stealing your books, that's one thing. If the first thing they do is walk up behind you and slam your face into a locker, you have every right to defend yourself.

Now, if they're bigger than you or outnumber you, you'll probably get beaten up. Bruises heal; broken spirits are a lot harder to fix.

[SDF]

If you want a really simple, ballsy two step solution to stop physical bullying forget all that, "training" crap.

1. After it happens the first time tell the authority figure. (teacher) This may or may not do anything.

2. The second time it happens call the police and press assault charges. They will never touch you again, because if they do they go to juvie/jail.

Assault is assault, and the police are bigger than any of their friends.

[VeisuItaTyhjyys]

I make better, meaner jokes about myself than any bully could hope to. This not only ruins the point, as I'll hardly be hurt or offended by what they say, but makes it somewhat implicit I could be similarly witty and cruel about them, if I so chose. Basically, I understand that I'm ridiculous and have attributes that can be easily made fun of. I don't care that there are funny things about me. I'll be the first one to make fun of the way I walk, or attack my pretensions and self-consciously Byronic brooding romanticism. It's not really a thick skin, like I resist being hurt. It's more that I don't think anything other people say is really hurtful. The truth said in a humorous way is a soft way of saying something true, and it's silly to be mad at something that's wholly legitimate.

Really very few people have ever bullied me.

Edit: I'd argue calling the police is too drastic. Fighting back has gotten a lot of heat as a response, but I'd say it's far more serious a response to call the police. Beating someone up may hurt for a while, but even the first call can legitimately ruin the kid's life. I wouldn't recommend either, by any means, but I'd say calling the police will hurt the kid more than fighting back. It's just going to a power far, far above their heads to bully them more than they ever could you. I think it's a problem best solved with passivity and grace, rather than causing more harm in retaliation.

[Recaiden]

That could work if they're being violent to that extent, but if not, I have to say accepting insults and trying not to be phased by them.
You should probably at least try telling an authority figure. It'll usually fail, but it does sometimes work.

[Blackjackg]

Edit: I'd argue calling the police is too drastic. Fighting back has gotten a lot of heat as a response, but I'd say it's far more serious a response to call the police. Beating someone up may hurt for a while, but even the first call can legitimately ruin the kid's life. I wouldn't recommend either, by any means, but I'd say calling the police will hurt the kid more than fighting back. It's just going to a power far, far above their heads to bully them more than they ever could you. I think it's a problem best solved with passivity and grace, rather than causing more harm in retaliation.

I tend to agree with this, except that the police and the district attorneys of the world are not going to prosecute bullies under normal circumstances. Which means the cops can show up and put a scare in them which, while not earning you any friends, may cause them to be a little more circumspect about assaulting you physically and stealing your money. I would only recommend going to the police in cases where a) there is actual physical danger and b) you have already spoken to more proximal authority figures like teachers and your parents. Yeah, a juvenile record can be harmful, but no police/DA/court in the world would send a bully to Juvie unless they have truly done something to deserve it.

And an important thing to remember about beating up your bully (particularly with weapons like bats and socks full of gravel) is that you leave yourself wide open for prosecution. Shoving you face-first into a locker is a real jerk move, but beating someone with a baseball bat is assault with a weapon, and that is a felony.

[Keshay]

The real problem with using force against bullies is that it would work, if bullies weren't
a) stronger than the people they choose to pick on
b) working in groups.
Other issues with responding the bullies in kind aside, it's simply not possible most of the time. Of course, the sad thing is, nothing else is going to work either, because if someone is a bully, he's the type of a person who doesn't recognize anything but force.

Bullies are also:

a) cowards
b) non-cognizant of the fact that the most important determining factors in a fight are not strength or numbers, but instead suprise and the willingness to commit violence.

Even if its three on one, if they don't expect it and you kick one in the balls then proceed to bite another in the throat, the third will run away like the little bitch he is.

Thier goal is to intimidate and humiliate with no consequences to themselves. If one can make the repricussions readily apparent, they WILL stop and move on.


As for learning things more important than inflicting punishment on others... Yes, the most important thing you learn first is that tolerating abuse against yourself is totally unacceptable. Accepting being a victim is suicide. If you can not stand up for yourself, you can stand for nothing, and are a coward, plain and simple.

[Blackjackg]

Ok, time for me to resign from this thread. I'm a reasonable person, but I can only argue the same point so many times before I get tired and frustrated and hand the thread off to the unreasonable ones.

I was bullied, physically and socially, for many years. I have also studied bullying extensively, and work as a doctoral-level professional in prevention and intervention of bullying. This is my job. I am (without false modesty) the closest thing to an expert on the subject that you're likely to find on this forum.

Responding to bullying with violence is not the answer, it is never the answer. The people on this thread who advocate otherwise should seek professional help. To seek to avoid violence is not cowardice, and shame on anyone who says otherwise. You are part of the problem.

[averagejoe]

I've never really been bullied. Probably mostly because I'm bigger than everyone else. If one has the means, I would highly recommend it.

I guess I was verbally bullied back in middle school, but I mostly just didn't care.

[lvl 1 fighter]

Ok, time for me to resign from this thread. I'm a reasonable person, but I can only argue the same point so many times before I get tired and frustrated and hand the thread off to the unreasonable ones.

I was bullied, physically and socially, for many years. I have also studied bullying extensively, and work as a doctoral-level professional in prevention and intervention of bullying. This is my job. I am (without false modesty) the closest thing to an expert on the subject that you're likely to find on this forum.

Responding to bullying with violence is not the answer, it is never the answer. The people on this thread who advocate otherwise should seek professional help. To seek to avoid violence is not cowardice, and shame on anyone who says otherwise. You are part of the problem.


Emphasis mine.

1) Argument ad hominem. You complain about people being unreasonable yet use a fallacious argument in your complaint. The irony is delicious. :smallsmile:

2) You set yourself up as an expert, based on your first hand experiences with the problem and trained academic study. That's legit. But you apply your findings/solutions of your problems to everyones problems, taking the specific and making it universal.

Furthermore, you again insult the people who oppose your viewpoint by saying they need professional help. I say that responding to certain types of violence with violence in kind is not sick. It's part of our make-up as humans, also called Fight or Flight. Fighting may not be appropriate in all situations but it is an answer, even if the only evidence is in our own biological make-up.

[Renegade Paladin]

Seeking to avoid violence is not cowardice, no. Violence is always a last resort, and should be avoided if possible. (Note: If possible, not "at all costs.") There is a reason I have used the term "force" rather than "violence" in this thread; force can take many forms besides physical violence, including social pressure, deterrence, and legal action.

Force is what holds society together. The force of law in large part neutralizes criminal activity, military force deters marauding by pirates and foreign powers, etc. But force must always have the threat of violence as its ultimate manifestation if it is to have any effectiveness, or there is at the end no means to deter someone sufficiently desperate from defying all other consequences. But that is a subject that ranges far beyond bullying.

Am I, personally, willing to resort to potentially lethal violence in extreme (read: threatening to life and/or limb, whether my own or another's) circumstances? Yes. I'm not a pacifist, and I am not ashamed of that fact. It has, quite literally, kept me alive on two occasions; were it not for that willingness and ability, I would not be here typing this. Neither of those two instances were against simple bullying; one was against muggers (who fled at the threat of a spirited and armed defense) and the other was an ecoterrorist who I caught spiking trees and who attempted to use his hammer on me.

Now, to relate this to the subject at hand, bullies are cowards who only understand the language of force. Violence is rarely required, and when it is, it generally doesn't take a lot, because again, they're cowards, and ones who have abdicated their expectation to not have force employed against them by initiating force. Put more simply, they have no right to moan about it because they started punching people and stealing things, and their victims have a right to retaliatory force to preserve themselves from aggression. Since reason is utterly ineffective against a bully, there is no option but force of some variety if one wants them to stop.

[Jack Squat]

OK, I know that you basically said that you aren't posting here again, but...


I was bullied, physically and socially, for many years. I have also studied bullying extensively, and work as a doctoral-level professional in prevention and intervention of bullying. This is my job. I am (without false modesty) the closest thing to an expert on the subject that you're likely to find on this forum.

And it's my experiance that people who study something tend to not know too much about how it actually works. We like to try and fit people's quirks into these nice defined categories, and have a "this happens, do this" type plan. In reality, that's not always the case. Maybe a bully really is insecure and lashing out because he's not getting the right attention at home and failing school...maybe he was just beaten at the hand of a drunk dad and violence is all he knows.

You say you were bullied for many years. Tell me, how did you deal with it? Did it work effectively? Did you try any other courses of action that failed?


Responding to bullying with violence is not the answer, it is never the answer. The people on this thread who advocate otherwise should seek professional help. To seek to avoid violence is not cowardice, and shame on anyone who says otherwise. You are part of the problem.

Violence should not be the first answer, but it can and does get the job done if used right. If some guy teases you, should you bash his head in with a chair? No, it's best to ignore it. But if you're an unwilling participant of a fight, do you just stand there and take it? No. It's against basic survival instincts, and in the aftermath you'll be beaten and bruised, and the bully may just get suspended for a couple days. If you stand up, maybe the guy will come back with a knife, or a gun, or his friends; but it's much more likely that if you stand up they'll move on to a weaker target. I've seen this many times, and have never seen the retaliation outside of news reports and various studies, and have yet to see any evidence to the contrary.

One generalization that can stick is most bullies, as well as criminals, are out for an easy target. Show you're not going to let them have their way with you, and they'll likely move on to another target. This can be as physical as getting a good couple hits in if they start something, or it can be changing how you walk and not carrying around anything that'll get you labeled as a target. Just like with anything else, you've got to look at what's causing the problem, and try to fix it at the source.

[Yarram]

Emphasis mine.

1) Argument ad hominem. You complain about people being unreasonable yet use a fallacious argument in your complaint. The irony is delicious. :smallsmile:

2) You set yourself up as an expert, based on your first hand experiences with the problem and trained academic study. That's legit. But you apply your findings/solutions of your problems to everyones problems, taking the specific and making it universal.

Furthermore, you again insult the people who oppose your viewpoint by saying they need professional help. I say that responding to certain types of violence with violence in kind is not sick. It's part of our make-up as humans, also called Fight or Flight. Fighting may not be appropriate in all situations but it is an answer, even if the only evidence is in our own biological make-up.
Please don't start a flame war over this... As facetious as it sounds to say you're an expert and apply findings and solutions to everyone's problems, I'm sure he's right. (I agree with him. As lame as it sounds, "violence is not the solution" is only said over and over again, because it is true. If you solved your problems with violence, then you a) Lost the high morale ground, and b) Got lucky)



7. Manipulate the playing field. If you must meet the bully, do so where you are strong and he is weak. If he's Two-Ton Tony and you're the little twerp, don't try to arm-wrestle him. If his strength is based on his gang of friends, try to separate them. Sow dissent if you have to.
8. Conflict. Sometimes, despite your best efforts at avoiding escalation, conflict is unavoidable. If the bully does blindside you and physically attack you, respond with overwhelming force. (This is not necessarily physical force. Getting him tossed in jail also qualifies as overwhelming force). Self-defense is a basic right of all people. If you're in a position where your back is well and truly to the wall and no aid is coming, do not sit there and take it. Do not fight fair, fight to win. (Read up on your local laws about proportional response - this does vary from place to place). Force is the absolute last resort option, but it is always an option.
How do you do these personally. Can you give some realistic examples of where this would be effective?

[Renegade Paladin]

Please don't start a flame war over this... As facetious as it sounds to say you're an expert and apply findings and solutions to everyone's problems, I'm sure he's right. (I agree with him. As lame as it sounds, "violence is not the solution" is only said over and over again, because it is true. If you solved your problems with violence, then you a) Lost the high morale ground, and b) Got lucky)
First, the word you're searching for is "moral." Secondly:
Starship Troopers[/i]"]Anyone who clings to the historically untrue — and thoroughly immoral — doctrine that 'violence never solves anything' I would advise to conjure up the ghosts of Napoleon Bonaparte and of the Duke of Wellington and let them debate it. The ghost of Hitler could referee, and the jury might well be the Dodo, the Great Auk, and the Passenger Pigeon. Violence, naked force, has settled more issues in history than has any other factor, and the contrary opinion is wishful thinking at its worst. Breeds that forget this basic truth have always paid for it with their lives and freedoms.
Violence can and does solve problems; otherwise it would not be so popular a solution as it is. It is quite often not the best solution, and very frequently only makes things worse, but there are types of problems that violence quite readily solves.

[Xyk]

What I do when bullies try to insult me is laugh in their face. I wouldn't recommend it. Let me give you an example.

Bully: What's that wristband say?<little shove>
Me: Soccer for Life
Bully: More like Gay for life!
Me: What?! Are you f****** stupid? Hahahaha!
Bully: *pushed me over*
Me: <still laughing got up and gave him a little shove> Oh, you!
Bully:<slammed me against a wall and left>

I gotta say, though, it was worth the bruises. I can't help myself sometimes.

Good advice:
This advice is similar. Don't let bullies know you fear them. I use laughter and they are generally insulted and that makes them angry. It is important to not let your voice shake, and to keep eye contact. A smile helps sometimes as long as it isn't a smirk.

[lvl 1 fighter]

Please don't start a flame war over this... As facetious as it sounds to say you're an expert and apply findings and solutions to everyone's problems, I'm sure he's right. (I agree with him. As lame as it sounds, "violence is not the solution" is only said over and over again, because it is true. If you solved your problems with violence, then you a) Lost the high morale ground, and b) Got lucky)Emphasis mine.

Sure. Just being a little snarky.

As to the rest of the quote:

I question the values that equate the moral high ground with pacifism. I speak of pacifism as it applies to individual safety and protection, not as it applies to war and countries.

I have a natural instinct to protect myself. Why do I lose the moral high ground, or why is it morally wrong, for me to use violence if violence is the only way I can protect myself? I'm not speaking about all types of bullying, or all types of physical confrontations, but specifically the bullying that is assault.

[averagejoe]

Secondly:

While I tend to agree with the actual point you've been making, I can't help but notice that you're quoting from a book which claimed that gang violence can be prevented by parents spanking their children. Just saying.

I do, however, tend to agree that in these cases violence will escalate the situation more often than not. I'm not saying it's absolutely never a good idea, but the when and how much of its application should, at the least, be decided by cooler heads than one who has been pathologically bullied generally has. Introducing violence into a situation is a delicate matter, and there are many ways that it can backfire, as many of those aforementioned world leaders and extinct animals can certainly attest to.

[Yarram]

I question the values that equate the moral high ground with pacifism. I speak of pacifism as it applies to individual safety and protection, not as it applies to war and countries.

I have a natural instinct to protect myself. Why do I lose the moral high ground, or why is it morally wrong, for me to use violence if violence is the only way I can protect myself? I'm not speaking about all types of bullying, or all types of physical confrontations, but specifically the bullying that is assault.

If you're being physically attacked, then by all means incapacitate the person who's attacking you, but in the first place, I have never in my life been placed in a situation where violence is the only way to solve a problem, and I have always been able to talk my way out of any fights, even with people insistant on picking one with me.

[Blackjackg]

I generally don't return to a thread I've decided to leave, but I figured the points that have come up in response to my last post deserved a response. Yes, I realize the irony of my using an irrational argument after saying that I'm a reasonable person, but the irrationality of that argument was both understood and intentional. The "unreasonable" people I was referring to were the ones that ignored rational arguments against violence and instead made the blanket statement that those who advocated nonviolent solutions were either cowards or weren't really bullied. I thought that if they were going to make ad hominem arguments in favor of their points, I should do the same. My biggest concern is not who's right and who's wrong in this thread, it's whether some desperate reader will take certain advice at face value and wind up in a great deal of trouble.

Among the solutions presented anecdotally in this thread are multiple-person beatings with a baseball bat or a sockful of gravel, and
Even if its three on one, if they don't expect it and you kick one in the balls then proceed to bite another in the throat, the third will run away like the little bitch he is.

Thier goal is to intimidate and humiliate with no consequences to themselves. If one can make the repricussions readily apparent, they WILL stop and move on.
I like to keep an open mind, but this is bad advice. Someone who acts like this can face a wide range of consequences from getting beaten more to getting killed, to having charges pressed for aggravated assault and assault with a deadly weapon. So I do what I can to make this advice seem foolish and insane because, frankly, it is. If that means making an irrational appeal to pathos, I'll do it. My rational arguments had already been stated, with as much evidence and explanation as I could muster. And if people were prepared to ignore that, they had this.

And when I said that these people needed professional help, that was both a further attempt to undercut the emotional core of their argument as they had undercut mine and my honest, unvarnished opinion. Someone who is willing to beat another human being with a sockful of gravel should seek professional help. Odds are they'll disagree with me on that point, but if they don't, I'd be happy to help them find a psychologist in their area.

When I say that violence is never the answer, I do not say that it never works. In fact, I specifically said that it might. However, it works rarely enough and the potential negative consequences are severe enough (as I've noted in this and previous posts) that it should probably never be attempted.

Don't get me wrong: if you are in immediate, physical danger, do what you can to get away. Punch, kick, scratch, and bite if you have to. More importantly and more effectively, run and scream. Most of the time, however, bullies aren't trying to kill you and the best way to get out of the situation with minimal harm is to basically play dead. If they kick you a few times before they get bored and move on to another target, that's preferable to the potential consequences if you, say, kick them in the balls and bite their throats. (This applies to everyone, but especially considers that most of the time, you won't be able to physically dominate a bully.) This is true with muggers, too: if someone has a knife on you and asks for your wallet, give him your freaking wallet. Any cop will tell you this. Unless the alternative is death, or a fate worse than death (rape, for some people), just give them what they want and pursue legal channels afterwards.

The system we live in is designed so that you never have to engage in violence. There are all kinds of channels you can go through without ever throwing a punch. (In some cases, such as the large-scale international violence of Hitler, the system has been subverted to an extent that all other avenues are nonviable, but that is a very special circumstance.) With the exception of the aforementioned scenario where you do what you must to escape, I can not foresee any reason that violence would be necessary. If someone can honestly tell me that they have changed schools, pressed assault charges, and obtained a restraining order, and their bully was still attempting to cause them serious bodily harm, I might condone the use of violence. If they have not pursued all of the above channels, there is no call for any use of force other than the minimum necessary to escape a potentially harmful situation.

As for the question of moral high ground... well, it helped me get through the day, knowing that I was participating in something I valued highly. However, my advice is based on the law and potential practical consequences. The one mention I've made to the morality of violence was as a secondary adjunct to the other risks incurred by violence.

Thank you for the reasoned responses to my unreasonable storm-off. I apologize to anyone I've offended unnecessarily, but I do consider it of utmost importance that people realize that there are good reasons violence should not be considered an option except under the most extreme and exceptional circumstances (say, one in ten thousand, or so), after all other possibilities have been exhausted.

To Jack Squat: I tried many different solutions, none of which worked effectively (with the exception of the two I mentioned earlier: changing schools, and waiting it out). But then, I was a dumb kid with little understanding of social norms and a stubborn unwillingness to seek help. I recognize, of course, that most teens reading this thread will be about as willing to take advice from an adult as I was, but it's still my moral (and legal, to some extent) responsibility to provide it. And yes, one of the reasons I chose to study bullying was from my experience with it. However, I have grown from a socially inept kid to a pretty darned aware adult, and it's safe to say that most of this advice comes from my experiences and observations, and is supported by the relevant empirical research, rather than the other way around.

Alright, I'm done.

[lvl 1 fighter]

Well said. I'll settle for agreeing to disagree.

[Exeson]

Responding to bullying with violence is not the answer, it is never the answer. The people on this thread who advocate otherwise should seek professional help. To seek to avoid violence is not cowardice, and shame on anyone who says otherwise. You are part of the problem.

Lovely, I can assure you I am far, far from needing professional help, in fact I have gone out of my way to sort my problems myself.

I don't believe anyone who avoids violence is a coward, however there is just a matter of self respect. If someone physically abuses you then I believe it is your right and in fact your duty as a human being to stand up for yourself, and if that means smacking the fecker harder than they could ever hit you then I don't see the problem.

istill however stand by the fact that someone can only be bullied if they let themselves be bullied. People need to stop being so sensitive, and to be fair, why should you give a toss what people say to you? The only person who can make you feel inferior is yourself.

I didn't want to mention this earlier in the thread because I feel there was no real need to. I was bullied when I was younger, and the day I just stood up for myself and just fought back (In this case pinned the 1st XV rugby captain to a locker by his throat and telling him to leave me the f*** alone) was a very good day and they have never bothered me again. In fact I have gone one step further than that, I now look out for other kids in my school being bullied and help them, either to learn to ignore it, or by providing protection.

But again, violence is secondary to people just growing a pair and stop being so sensitive about everything. Not everyone is going to like you and those that don't you have the right, as a human being, to ignore. (Plus, out side of accidents in Judo, I have not harmed another person for two years now, so it is not like I'm saying your first answer to every problem is violence, I'm just saying that violence is sometimes the answer.)

[Castaras]

so it is not like I'm saying your first answer to every problem is violence, I'm just saying that violence is sometimes the answer.)

This. It is truth. An unfortunate truth, but truth nonetheless.

[Dallas-Dakota]

I'm going to second the pieomancer here.

[Ripped Shirt Kirk]

I learned to overwhelm them with kindness. Ask them if they want too be your friend, invite them for coffee, something like that always diffuses the situation and will do either 1:Make a new friend. or 2: Get extremely annoyed and acknowledge that you don't care. REMEMBER always act sincere!


EDIT: Exactly. If they just talk to you and don't do anything physical, just ignore/do my suggestion. If they do something physical, beat the snot out of them. There is a line between Physical confrontations and just insults.

DOUBLE EDIT: Jack, in the hypothetical situation presented, if someone threatens you and you attack first, that is self defense, solely because they threatened you.

Also, if you are on the ground and someone is kicking you, you are saying NOT to do anything? I mean I understand the one with the mugger, (because he has a lethal weapon) but if someone was kicking me on the ground, I would hold onto his leg and snap it.

[SilverSheriff]

Violence is not the Answer all of the time; If your really down on your luck and get a beating once a week then its pretty much condoned.

[Haruki-kun]

I learned to overwhelm them with kindness. Ask them if they want too be your friend, invite them for coffee, something like that always diffuses the situation and will do either 1:Make a new friend. or 2: Get extremely annoyed and acknowledge that you don't care. REMEMBER always act sincere!

<.< This reminds me of those anti-bullying, life-guidance classes in school. Nothing ever worked in those, sadly.

Best way I can think of to stop being bullied are to start working out and/or start taking self-defense lessons. And this is not to beat the crap out of them. It's mostly so that they'll leave you alone in fear that you might actually beat the crap out of them.

[SilverSheriff]

<.< This reminds me of those anti-bullying, life-guidance classes in school. Nothing ever worked in those, sadly.

Best way I can think of to stop being bullied are to start working out and/or start taking self-defense lessons. And this is not to beat the crap out of them. It's mostly so that they'll leave you alone in fear that you might actually beat the crap out of them.

Self Defense Classes? since when were any of those 'classes' any effective unless you were a Blue belt or Higher? I took what I learned from my 3 years (3 lessons a week) of White Belt in Karate and adapted it to a Brawling style because I was sick of losing with Faulty Fighting style. There are some things those places just don't teach.

[Exeson]

Self Defense Classes? since when were any of those 'classes' any effective unless you were a Blue belt or Higher? I took what I learned from my 3 years (3 lessons a week) of White Belt in Karate and adapted it to a Brawling style because I was sick of losing with Faulty Fighting style. There are some things those places just don't teach.

That's because combat is instinct. Some people just don't have any fighting instinct. Take for example one of my best friends. He has been training judo for longer than I have, and knows all the technique perfectly but I have vastly surpassed him, just due to the fact that he has little combat instinct.