PDA

View Full Version : Biggest character challenge I have ever met!



Cedrass
2009-08-05, 01:02 AM
Ok well last night my party and I met our ends by the claws of our teammate who became a werewolf without us (our characters) noticing. We all laughed and stuff and then we asked ourselves what we would roll up next. I never did a Paladin because I just knew I'd hit the @!(#$ cliché of having a stick up my butt and just being annoying, but I thought now was the time to roll one.

So seeing as I was exploring different territory I decided to roll my race too (cause I'm always playing Human...) and got a Drow Elf... This is where I really don't know what to do! I don't care about stats and if I'll be strong enough, even if I will try and make my character viable, but the role play/background of that character, I just can't come up with. I just can't see a Drow going Paladin without being all Driz'zt like, and this is something I want to avoid at all costs!

So I'm coming to you guys for help with that problem since I know there are a lot of creative minds on those forums who can come up with incredible stories.

I'm still poking around with some ideas, but nothing solid enough that I can post here, but when I do get something, I'll post it here.

Again, thank you all.

Shademan
2009-08-05, 01:08 AM
simple, he was found as an infant by some simple farmers and raised as a good little boy. no, wait! He was raised by mountain goats!

Harperfan7
2009-08-05, 01:09 AM
Say that he was raised from a baby by a wandering elf paladin. Find what an elf paladin would be like, then add in the fact that his reputation would be worse due to being a drow, then add that in.

Actually, I think a drow paladin would be fairly good. Your low stats won't actually be low, your highest stat will be higher. Your already good saves will get even better, and you'll likely never be affected by an enchantment spell.

Quellian-dyrae
2009-08-05, 01:17 AM
What about a paladin who was originally of some other race (for maximum effect: elf), who was killed and reincarnated as a drow (handwave the fact that the stats wouldn't technically match). Maybe even say he was originally part of a very "Detect Evil first, Smite second, ask questions never" order. Now, he has to be on the receiving end of that, while also struggling to get any good accomplished when his very presence tends to provoke the fight or flight response in everyone he meets. You could even play up the "cannot associate with evil" bit; he can't have many allies, since the people most likely to associate with him, he can't associate with.

Also, wield a greataxe and have an irrational hatred of cats.

Keld Denar
2009-08-05, 01:22 AM
As far as build...migh I suggest a standard Sorcadin or a Suel Arcanamach build on a Paladin/Duskblade chassis? Drow are inately magical by all fluff, and those 2 contribute HUGE amounts of awesomeness to a paladin. You pick up all of the fluff from level 1, and never stop kicking ass, unlike a standard Paladin who really starts to peter out around 6 when everyone is getting cool stuffs and he still doesn't have 2nd level spells and all he really has to look forward to is more boring Cure Disease uses...

Alternatively, our very own Fax Celestis rebalanced the paladin incredibly well in the Homebrew forums. Its incredibly awesome, flavorful, and awesome. Scales well though levels, and there is almost always something unique and exciting to gain at each level!

As far as stories...badgers. I don't care what it is, but there has to be badgers involved. Badger badger badger badger badger.

Jergmo
2009-08-05, 01:27 AM
Drow PALADIN OF TYRANNY OR SLAUGHTER!! :smallfurious:

RTGoodman
2009-08-05, 01:31 AM
Say that he was raised from a baby by a wandering elf paladin. Find what an elf paladin would be like, then add in the fact that his reputation would be worse due to being a drow, then add that in.

As cliche as it might sound, that could actually be cool. And hey, Drow have the (Elf) subtype, right? So I think you could probably qualify for the Champion of Corellon Larethian PrC in RotW, which is AWESOME for lightly-armored or Dex-based Paladins (which you'd probably end up being).

Shademan
2009-08-05, 01:44 AM
As far as stories...badgers. I don't care what it is, but there has to be badgers involved. Badger badger badger badger badger.

like... raised by a mushroom dryad?
* can be found in the 'critters' thread in the homebrew forum

Cedrass
2009-08-05, 01:46 AM
What about a paladin who was originally of some other race (for maximum effect: elf), who was killed and reincarnated as a drow (handwave the fact that the stats wouldn't technically match). Maybe even say he was originally part of a very "Detect Evil first, Smite second, ask questions never" order. Now, he has to be on the receiving end of that, while also struggling to get any good accomplished when his very presence tends to provoke the fight or flight response in everyone he meets. You could even play up the "cannot associate with evil" bit; he can't have many allies, since the people most likely to associate with him, he can't associate with.

Also, wield a greataxe and have an irrational hatred of cats.

I kind of like that! The "he has to be on the receiving end of that" is extremely awesome even if it might have been done to death by others, I didn't :smallwink:.

I don't think I'll push up the "Cannot associate with Evil", one of the players already canceled his idea to roll up a Necromancer so I could do my Paladin, I don't want them to have and endure my extreme zeal on that "rule".

That being said, it may be the fact it's 3AM here, or I just never heard of it, but I don't get the cats part... :smallconfused:

Myrmex
2009-08-05, 02:03 AM
What if the paladin that reared him slew his parents? You know, what do you do with kobold babies after you clean out the mines? That sort of thing.

[edit]
To help you play a paladin, you should try to write up a small moral code for him. Certain things he abides by, and perhaps even a moral dilemma or two he has had to face, and how he overcame them. I find that that sort of thing helps me figure out how to play a consistent character.

Quellian-dyrae
2009-08-05, 02:38 AM
That being said, it may be the fact it's 3AM here, or I just never heard of it, but I don't get the cats part... :smallconfused:

Was a reference to Guenwh...Guenue...to Guen.::Swears he used to know how to spell the durned panther's name::

Skorj
2009-08-05, 02:43 AM
Really, playing any good Drow who's not a dual-scimitar wielding walking cliche is a worthy cause. Just don't be angsty, or a rebel. I like a "raised by non-Drow and doesn't really care about Drow society at all" background myself.

Flickerdart
2009-08-05, 02:52 AM
Try using the Prestigious Paladin that you go into from Cleric, for stronger spellcasting. I can definitely say that Fax's variant is made of win. You might consider going Grey Guard at some point, too, and take your first level in Knight for that sexy d12 hit die, as your LA and CON penalty mean you want all the hit points you can get your grubby little hands on.

Navigator
2009-08-05, 06:52 AM
Use the paladin of freedom variant from Unearthed Arcana, and worship Eilistraee (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eilistraee) if you want to make things simple-ish.

Lord Loss
2009-08-05, 12:17 PM
Use a story similaar to that of Calasi Archwinter/Tamesik, but change what happened after the Transformation.

Cedrass
2009-08-05, 12:20 PM
Thanks a lot people for the suggestions!

That being said, I had a great idea with the "reincarnated paladin" so I'll stick with that :smallsmile:.

As for my build, my group is undergoing a "back to basics" period so the DM does not like little class dips and such. I may however look for a PrC, Grey Guard looks like something I should look. We are also using Pathfinder (which I like, mind you :smallwink:) so taking Paladin 20 isn't all that bad, especially when I get my hands on the Official book.

I'll update this post or create an other one if this one is too old when I get my background figured out. Thanks again to all of you!

Pharaoh's Fist
2009-08-05, 12:20 PM
Ranger/Ranger who dual wields his dual wield.

Thrawn183
2009-08-05, 01:17 PM
Raised by a gnomish were-bear?

RTGoodman
2009-08-05, 01:52 PM
Raised by a gnomish were-bear?

Or an awakened bear were-gnome?

Rixx
2009-08-05, 02:06 PM
Ranger/Ranger who dual wields his dual wield.

Favored enemy: Enemy (favored)

Jack Zander
2009-08-05, 02:10 PM
Ranger/Ranger who dual wields his dual wield.

Yo Dawg, I heard you like gestalt, so we put a ranger in your ranger so you can dual-wield while you dual-wield. (http://http://www.nuklearpower.com/2009/01/27/episode-1087-exalted-feat/)

Devils_Advocate
2009-08-05, 06:22 PM
"That's twice the amount of Ranger that the human body can contain!"

Aren't there a bunch of communities of non-***hole drow on the surface? It's just the ones under Lolth's influence who are all sociopaths.

Although the idea of a child whose evil parents were slain by adventurers is also good.

Cedrass
2009-08-05, 10:38 PM
Aren't there a bunch of communities of non-***hole drow on the surface? It's just the ones under Lolth's influence who are all sociopaths.

Well yes there are, but I don't like this idea at all. Maybe I'm too old school but come on, they ARE Drow! They sacrifice and kill stuff, they don't preserve life!! That is for elves to do!

That being said, I think I have something to work on:

The guy would have been a Paladin of Tempus back when he was an Elf, however, he was the zealous type. And I mean ZEALOUS. Now I'm pondering about if he died a natural cause, or if I use the Calasi Archwinter/Tamesik thing. If he died an natural cause, he was then reborn as a Dark Elf. The reason? Right now I've only got something like Eilistraee got pissed because as an Elf he would have killed a bit too many Drows to her liking, some Good and some Evil, he didn't mind, black = bad.

So yeah, Eilistraee got Tempus to allow her to get his soul when he died and reincarnate as a Drow, with his memories and personality intact so that he'd see what it's like on the other side, when you get judged (or killed :smallwink:) based on what you look like, or the opinion of others.
So, with all that I think it'd make for a nice Paladin, basing his judgement on what people do instead of their races/families/etc.

Thoughts?

Thurbane
2009-08-05, 10:41 PM
Helm of Opposite Alignment?

Devils_Advocate
2009-08-05, 11:00 PM
Well yes there are, but I don't like this idea at all. Maybe I'm too old school but come on, they ARE Drow! They sacrifice and kill stuff, they don't preserve life!! That is for elves to do!
... If you have a problem with Good-aligned drow, why are you trying to make one? :smallconfused:

Personally, I don't like the assumption that each non-human race has only one culture and only one environment, and any deviation from that requires a separate subrace. But that's me.

Woodsman
2009-08-05, 11:16 PM
Breaking the paladin stereotype is as easy as reversing the order of "Smite first, ask later."



Personally, I don't like the assumption that each non-human race has only one culture and only one environment, and any deviation from that requires a separate subrace. But that's me.

I have a player with a similar mindset. "Hey, can I homebrew a Balmy-subtropical elf subrace?"

Cedrass
2009-08-05, 11:20 PM
Like I said, it's a challenge, and I'm not saying they are inherently evil, the thing I have a problem with is communities of good happy and joyful Drows. Ok maybe I am exaggerating a bit, but the idea is there. Yes, there are some Good Drows, but I just can't picture a community of those.

Especially when most Drow are a zealous bunch that would track down any Drow that defied them (those that prey Loth).

Well it's how I've always pictured Drows, and I'm pretty sure my group agrees with me. That being said, I agree with you when you say a race can only have one culture per subrace, and in my last session, I introduced my players to an encampment of semi-peaceful Orcs. However, they don't make towns and won't prey to Mielliki and they can still get aggressive when angered.

The thing with the character I want to make is it's gonna be a Paladin. A Good Drow ok, but a Paladin, I can't picture that... The only Paladin I could see would be of Eilistraee and I don't want that. Too... cliche for a lack of a better word (english not being my primary language, so finding the right words can be hard).

Oh and no I won't make a Paladin of Freedom and such, the DM is not a big fan of anything Unearthed Arcana.

So huh, no one has an opinion on the little draft of a backstory I wrote?

Darcand
2009-08-06, 12:10 AM
Does he have to be a straight Paladin? I was thinking SHE could be a fallen Blackgaurd of Lloth, I know fallen paladins can swap out levels for BG, is there a reason a fallen (risen?) blackgaurd couldn't do the reverse?

I recently read a short story about a spy, captured by enemies and being taken back for questioning. When they were attacked all of his enemies died protecting him because they had given an oath to do so. Not too hard to imagine a similiar situation inspiring a change of heart.

Altima
2009-08-06, 01:08 AM
Eilistraee is Chaotic good, which means, by RAW, she can't use paladins. I think the only chaotic good deity with a paladin order is Sune.

Vhaeraun has surface conclaves where he encourages drow to breed with surface elves. Children resulted from such a union are, more often than not, drow.

There's plenty you can do with it. It all depends, really, on where you wish to go with your character.

Shademan
2009-08-06, 04:18 AM
Eilistraee is Chaotic good, which means, by RAW, she can't use paladins. I think the only chaotic good deity with a paladin order is Sune.

Vhaeraun has surface conclaves where he encourages drow to breed with surface elves. Children resulted from such a union are, more often than not, drow.

There's plenty you can do with it. It all depends, really, on where you wish to go with your character.

dunno why... but i have thie eerie feeling of fanservice.
how long has it been like this?

Fitz
2009-08-06, 07:42 AM
ok, reincarnation idea is pretty cool, and works, definitly avoid anything with scimitars /cats/angst

how about playing a very lawful paladin, who aspires to true paladinhood, but that clashes with a more brutal upbringing, resulting in a judge dread outlook? might be a little too neutral though. most elven deities are chaotic so cannot really have paladins by the standard ideal (but no reason not to move things around a bit unless the setting specifically prohibits it)

reincarnated human or dwarf? might be the best option

Fitz

Altima
2009-08-06, 02:00 PM
dunno why... but i have thie eerie feeling of fanservice.
how long has it been like this?

One edition--ever since they expanded the drow for 3.x edition. Right around the time Elaine Cunningham's Daughter of the Drow series came out.

And it's not really fanservice. Vhaeraun is as big an ass as Lolth, but he wants to surface, and the Underdark can screw itself as far as he's concerned. He's actually more tolerant than Lolth as he accepts both males and females, as well as non-drow elves (hence the breeding program). But he's still evil to the core.

Eilistraee...well, she is pretty fanservicey. But what do you expect, one of Greenwood's Seven Sisters being made for her particularly.

And right around the time both of them were getting better, 4e rolls around and kills them both. But everyone I know generally ignores 4e FR anyway.

Cedrass
2009-08-06, 02:43 PM
And right around the time both of them were getting better, 4e rolls around and kills them both. But everyone I know generally ignores 4e FR anyway.

Gee I wonder why, they basically took what made Faerun Faerun and just killed it. I'll admit I didn't read the whole book and what I am saying here may be false, but I couldn't get myself to read more...

Altima
2009-08-06, 05:40 PM
Gee I wonder why, they basically took what made Faerun Faerun and just killed it. I'll admit I didn't read the whole book and what I am saying here may be false, but I couldn't get myself to read more...

Yeah, pretty much. They raped something like a decade or two worth of lore to force FR into 4e. In fact, were it not for some coincidental names, some people might confuse 4e FR with the real one!

Personally, though, I think it'd be hilarious if they did that only to build the backstory up to its original monolethic proportions, only for the newer generation to be able to take part in its (slow) creation. Also, 4e hates gnomes.

Lappy9000
2009-08-06, 05:45 PM
What level are you starting at? If it's 3+, I like to do Fighter 1 or 2/Paladin the rest. For the backstory, the one I went was how he was a (insert unsavory non-good alignment here) (insert non-good profession) who was converted to the faith by the completely unselfish actions someone who he tried to (attack/steal from/etc). This works particularly well if the character killed his converter (making amends for past wrongs, etc)

Edit: Ah, you already went with one. My bad.

Cedrass
2009-08-08, 01:54 AM
Hum bringing this thread back to life, or more like a short coma. My DM insist we find a picture to give the other players of what our character looks like.

Ok... But the internet seems to not favor Drow Paladins... I'm wondering if anyone has something remotely looking something like it?

Thanks a lot!

PS: Background is being written. Slowly, but it is being done.

Pharaoh's Fist
2009-08-08, 01:56 AM
http://www.iside82.altervista.org/nwn/drow.jpg

warrl
2009-08-10, 05:47 PM
http://www.iside82.altervista.org/nwn/drow.jpg

Your mother-in-law?

Lord Loss
2009-08-10, 07:20 PM
For those unfamilliar With Calais Archwinter/ Tamesik:

A group of well known adventurers are resting in a town, preparing for an adventure, when they hear about problems at a nearby warehouse. Thinking it's something along the lines of dire rats or kobolds, they have little preperation and, when they walk in are PWNED by an armada of drow: Two adventurers are killed in the battle, and only two remain now, but barely any drow remain, including Tamesik a cleric, and a few others. Tamesik confuses Calais Archwinter, who kills Pietro. After the confusion ends, enraged by her guilt, she kills off the remaining Drow, only Tamesik and Her remain. As she steps in to kill tamesik, she calls to Lolth to curse Calais (who is an elf, by the way) Their bodies trade appearances and, in appearance, Tamesik has killed Calais. Clais now inhabits a Drow body. :smallbiggrin:

Felyndiira
2009-08-10, 07:57 PM
That's a really interesting backstory, turning the Driz'zt outcast angst 180 degrees and on its head.

If you're looking for technical comments on your backstory, though: Eilistraee is the quintessential Driz'zt deity. She advocates that her clerics and followers risk their lives to establish relations with the surface dwellers, so it strikes me as against her nature for her to wish something like this against an elf, malice or not.

Still, the elf has to have legendary conviction in order for him not to fall from paladin-hood after such a horizon-changing event; I'd actually suggest making him start off fallen from the sheer impact of the event. Maybe he's a complete moral and philosophical wreck after this; perhaps he has taken to drinking himself to forget all of this, was rendered a bit unstable, or was forced to kill an innocent to preserve his own life that shattered his moral righteousness. The roleplay niche for him, then, is to recollect himself, atone, regain his paladin status, and learn from the endaevor.

It means starting off weaker instead of as an optimized class, of course, but the only way (that I can see) for someone to remain faithful after that revelation is for his conviction to border irreconcilable, which means that you're playing a paladin that spends most of his time trying to explain that he's an elf, tanking damage from villagers, and all with very little change in conviction - basically, he's the same zealous elf, except he's now being attacked.

Just my two cents though.

Cedrass
2009-08-11, 12:31 AM
I really like your idea Felyndiira, and I'll admit I kind of thought about having him deny the thing and just get away from his responsibility (he did, after all, kill Drow only because of the color of their skin).

However, I am not willing to go as far as to make him the stubborn guy you would have him become, not because it is no a good idea, but because I know it will annoy my group. I thank you though for posting an interesting idea, and I wish I could play it. Sadly, I am not willing to sacrifice the fun-factor of my group for it. :smallsmile:

Mikeavelli
2009-08-11, 12:36 AM
#53 (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=5594109&postcount=10)

Mix and match as appropriate.