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Lappy9000
2009-08-06, 10:50 PM
I have a couple of questions:

Are there any other classes (or prestige classes) that grant the Lay on Hands ability?
Are there any other abilities that are mechanically similar to Lay on Hands?
If so, do these abilities stack to determine the total hit points that can be healed per day?

Thanks!

RTGoodman
2009-08-06, 10:54 PM
The famous and most excellent Lists of Stuff (http://forums.gleemax.com/showthread.php?t=662842) to the rescue!


Lay on Hands - and stacks with
Paladin 1
Hospitaler 1, ecl 6, Complete Divine
Grey Guard, ecl 6, Complete Scoundrel
Champion of Correlon Larethian, ecl 8, Races of the Wild
Divine Champion 1, ecl 8, Player's Guide to Faerun
Knight of the Pearl 1, ecl 6, Stormwrack

Special Mention
Hands of a Healer, feat, Book of Exalted Deeds, treat Cha as 2 higher for lay on hands
Sentinel of Bharrai 7, ecl 12, Book of Exalted Deeds, can heal damage in self or others up to your total hp
Defiant 1, ecl 6, Planar Handbook, requires fallen cleric levels
Dragon Shaman 6, PHB 2, Touch of Vitality

Lappy9000
2009-08-06, 10:56 PM
Oh wow, marvelous! Thanks, rtg0922! :smallcool:

RTGoodman
2009-08-06, 11:00 PM
Oh, no problem. The Lists of Stuff and the X Stat to Y Bonus (http://forums.gleemax.com/showthread.php?t=320889) thread are the two things that every D&D player that's remotely interested in CharOp should have bookmarked. Great resources.

Rhiannon87
2009-08-07, 07:52 AM
It should be noted that for the Grey Guard PrC, Lay on Hands is a prereq. You have to already have the ability before you can go into it.

Darrin
2009-08-07, 12:40 PM
A Tattooed Monk can use the Nightingale tattoo to do something similar to lay on hands, but it doesn't stack with anything else.

Lifebond Vestments (Soulmeld, Magic of Incarnum) also works a little like lay on hands, although you can keep using it over and over again if you have some way of healing or preventing damage to yourself.

Dewey
2009-08-07, 03:25 PM
The famous and most excellent Lists of Stuff to the rescue!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lists of Stuff
Lay on Hands - and stacks with
Paladin 1
Hospitaler 1, ecl 6, Complete Divine
Grey Guard, ecl 6, Complete Scoundrel
Champion of Correlon Larethian, ecl 8, Races of the Wild
Divine Champion 1, ecl 8, Player's Guide to Faerun
Knight of the Pearl 1, ecl 6, Stormwrack

Special Mention
Hands of a Healer, feat, Book of Exalted Deeds, treat Cha as 2 higher for lay on hands
Sentinel of Bharrai 7, ecl 12, Book of Exalted Deeds, can heal damage in self or others up to your total hp
Defiant 1, ecl 6, Planar Handbook, requires fallen cleric levels
Dragon Shaman 6, PHB 2, Touch of Vitality



Umm, I don't mean to question your info, rtg0922 I don't have the Players Handbook around, but on the SRD it says that Paladins get Lay on hands at 2nd level, not first. Is it different in the PHB?

Sinfire Titan
2009-08-07, 03:28 PM
Interesting note: PrC enough and get a decent Cha, then take a Bloodline. 4 different classes that grant Lay on Hands+Cha of 30 or so+a Major Bloodline can boost your healing abilities to a respectable amount.

RTGoodman
2009-08-07, 03:40 PM
Umm, I don't mean to question your info, rtg0922 I don't have the Players Handbook around, but on the SRD it says that Paladins get Lay on hands at 2nd level, not first. Is it different in the PHB?

Huh, I didn't notice that, but you're right. I imagine it was just a typo from whoever first created the list. (That, or they got Lay on Hands at first level in 3.0 and it was changed in 3.5.)

Keld Denar
2009-08-07, 03:52 PM
(That, or they got Lay on Hands at first level in 3.0 and it was changed in 3.5.)

This...this is the correct answer.

RTGoodman
2009-08-07, 03:55 PM
This...this is the correct answer.

Ah, you're too fast for me again - I suspected that was the case and had to go find a 3.0 SRD to check. Yep, 3.0 Paladins made GREAT dips, apparently - Detect Evil, Divine Health, Divine Grace, AND Lay on Hands, all at 1st level.

AstralFire
2009-08-07, 03:57 PM
Ah, you're too fast for me again - I suspected that was the case and had to go find a 3.0 SRD to check. Yep, 3.0 Paladins made GREAT dips, apparently - Detect Evil, Divine Health, Divine Grace, AND Lay on Hands, all at 1st level.

Paladins and Rangers both, this was one of those things 3.5 fixed. Monks might have also been staggered, but the situations in which anyone ever dips monk have always been highly limited...

Keld Denar
2009-08-07, 04:31 PM
Ah, you're too fast for me again

Everyone keeps telling me those Swiftblade levels were a bad investment. They said the loss of CLs was not worth it.

They are the ones who are too SLOW!!!!!

:P <3

Cieyrin
2009-08-07, 05:07 PM
Monks used to get Evasion at 1st level in 3.0, which is why you might want to dip into them. :smalltongue:

sofawall
2009-08-07, 06:09 PM
I optimized up to a pretty damn high number for Lay on Hands, but I forget almost everything I used. I remember more paladin levels always beat a template/race for cha, and Greyguard has a really fun ability with it.

RTGoodman
2009-08-07, 06:26 PM
I optimized up to a pretty damn high number for Lay on Hands, but I forget almost everything I used. I remember more paladin levels always beat a template/race for cha, and Greyguard has a really fun ability with it.

Well, you could go Magic-Blooded Lesser Aasimar Paladin (Charging Smite variant)/Grey Guard 10. With a starting 18, we add +4 (racial and template), +6 (cloak of charisma), +5 (tome/wish), and +5 from levels. That's a final Cha of 38, or +14 modifier. Add in hands of a healer for another +1, effectively. Multiply that by our effective Paladin level, that's 300 points of healing (or damage, since we're a Grey Guard) per day. Not TOO bad, I suppose, but it's hardly something to base a build around, I think.

AstralFire
2009-08-07, 06:30 PM
That is a pretty nice number, and that would be a brutal smackdown for an undead if you were using Massive Damage. And hey, it's better than Wholeness of Body.

...

-weeps-

Darrin
2009-08-07, 07:09 PM
Somebody check me on this... shape the Lifebond Vestments + Stone Power feat = infinite healing in 20-point chunks as a standard action? Or, since you can use Lifebond Vestments on yourself, is Stone Power even necessary?

Hmm... and an Ironsoul Forgemaster can bind to the heart chakra at ECL 15...

Any other combos with Lifebond Vestments?

Glimbur
2009-08-07, 08:17 PM
Somebody check me on this... shape the Lifebond Vestments + Stone Power feat = infinite healing in 20-point chunks as a standard action? Or, since you can use Lifebond Vestments on yourself, is Stone Power even necessary?

Hmm... and an Ironsoul Forgemaster can bind to the heart chakra at ECL 15...

Any other combos with Lifebond Vestments?

Do note that you can't heal the same person more than once/hour with the Vestments, unless the Heart bind overrides that, which I think it does but I am not certain about. You also don't seem to be able to use it on yourself, but that sentence is between the fluff and the mechanics so it might belong in either.

The temp HP from Stone Power only last until the beginning of your next turn, and the Vestments take a standard action to use; so barring Celerity or 3.0 Haste or other ways to cheat that doesn't work. If you were a caster, you could qualify for the Reserve Feat Minor Shapeshift and use unlimited temp hp from that.

I just got Fast Healing from the Millennial Chain of Corelleon in MiC and healed the party.

mcl01
2009-08-12, 08:53 AM
Also, though I'm surprised it's not listed. The Prestige Paladin from UA in the SRD gets it at level 2. Good if you want cleric casting.

Sliver
2009-08-12, 10:32 AM
Also, though I'm surprised it's not listed. The Prestige Paladin from UA in the SRD gets it at level 2. Good if you want cleric casting.

Isn't it suggested not to allow Prestige Paladin with normal Paladin though?

Mongoose87
2009-08-12, 11:10 AM
Isn't it suggested not to allow Prestige Paladin with normal Paladin though?

It is, but no one on here ever seems to care, when suggesting a Paly build.

PairO'Dice Lost
2009-08-12, 11:14 AM
Isn't it suggested not to allow Prestige Paladin with normal Paladin though?

It's just another way to get LoH; (almost) no one's suggesting you use every single one of these in one character or game.

AstralFire
2009-08-12, 11:18 AM
You should get a bonus to Lay on Hands based on how many additional hands you have.