The World within the Snarl: A Theory (Spoilers!)

[nihilistic]

Hello.

There has been much speculation over the nature of the world within the Snarl, and I'd like to postulate something.

Could the world within the snarl be our actual Earth? Considering the fourth-wall-breaking nature of Oots, (and the fact that the Snarl is in fact a hole in reality,) this seems vaguely plausible, though it could possibly derail the entire plot. Like V says, "Perhaps we do not know everything we ought to regarding the task we are undertaking."

I know that Rich has stated that there are no actual players in Oots, but maybe this is an alternate Ootsland which doesn't follow the DnD rules?

If this seems familiar Pratchett came up with something similar in his Science of Discworld series, where the wizards created 'Roundworld', or our reality. I'd like to know your opinions on this theory (but it's a fairly long shot, no?)

[Cruiser1]

Could the world within the snarl be our actual Earth?Interesting idea, however if that were the case, I'd expect the continents to look like Earth's (e.g. see Africa, etc). Instead they look like an alien planet. Assuming north is up (or down), which is likely given the ice caps, there's a large northern continent and a large southern continent. That makes it also not a perfect clone of OOTS-world 2.0, since OOTS-world 2.0 has a large Western continent.

[lonewolf23k]

Maybe the Original World created before the Snarl still exists?

[Lkctgo]

There's another thread with the same topic. Merge?

[rainbowjo]

I think that maybe the snarl is not actually a being of pure chaos, and it didnt actually 'destroy' the first world, but basicly engulfed it to keep the 'Gods' (Children playing with magic they cannot hope to understand in the snarls eyes?) from interfering,

[Turkish Delight]

Could the world within the snarl be our actual Earth?

If it is, I will have to punch the Giant in the stomach. And I mean that in the most respectful way possible.

[pflare]

Maybe its (a careful parody of) Eberron due to the (friendly) rivalry between the two creators. Imagine the oots coming across a world that is similar to their own but ppl don't know what skill points are.

PS I also like the idea of it being the original world the gods created.

[Ron Miel]

Interesting idea, however if that were the case, I'd expect the continents to look like Earth's (e.g. see Africa, etc).

The continents looked quite different a few hundred million years ago. Maybe its Earth during the Silurian or Eocene era.

[Vmag]

My thoughts is that the world within the Snarl IS the OotS world.

How this works, you ask? Well, the Snarl is intertwined with all reality, yes? Ergo, the very world itself is within the Snarl. If you think about this too hard, you end up having infinite Snarls within infinite Worlds within infinite Snarls; if you're happy not thinking too deep into things, it's like putting a couple mirrors in front of each other.

I think the implications here is that the OotS world is intimately dependent upon the Snarl; destroying the Snarl could end up with negative consequences for the World, as the Snarl is so intertwined so as to actually be one of the very forces involved in keeping the World together.

[nihilistic]

Or maybe there's another hole in reality in that planet, where inside there is yet another planet, and so on and so forth.

Ultimate mindscrew, but for what purpose?

[Sanguine]

Crazy theory I just came up with. What if this world inside the rift is the seal on the rifts that The Order of the Scribble made.

[Herald Alberich]

The continents looked quite different a few hundred million years ago. Maybe its Earth during the Silurian or Eocene era.

Ok, but what would be the point of that? The only reason to make it Earth at all is for wacky shenanigans when the characters discover a place where no one can be resurrected, only geeks know what "skill points" are, and the gods are not confirmed to exist.

[Conuly]

Ok, but what would be the point of that? The only reason to make it Earth at all is for wacky shenanigans when the characters discover a place where no one can be resurrected, only geeks know what "skill points" are, and the gods are not confirmed to exist.

So we do all that but, you know, with dinos.

It could work!

[Lord Seth]

The world inside the vortex being Earth would be a plot twist so idiotic I'd probably drop the comic.

That said, it doesn't even look like Earth based on what we see of the continents, so...

[Bibliomancer]

So we do all that but, you know, with dinos.

It could work!

Why not add magical trains (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0344.html) while you're at it?

[Ancalagon]

Could the world within the snarl be our actual Earth?

That'd be the most horrible and lame thing that could happen.

[Bibliomancer]

That'd be the most horrible and lame thing that could happen.

Fortunately, the continents are all wrong, the ice-caps are too large, the moon is missing, and the constellations don't look right. I think we're safe there.

[AstralFire]

I suspect that even if it is meant to be Earth, in such a case it would just be used for a throwaway joke.

[Ancalagon]

I suspect that even if it is meant to be Earth, in such a case it would just be used for a throwaway joke.

I stand corrected: Not only making the world inside of the world our world, but even just using it as throw-away joke would be the most horrible and lame thing that could happen.

[Bibliomancer]

I stand corrected: Not only making the world inside of the world our world, but even just using it as throw-away joke would be the most horrible and lame thing that could happen.

If it was a throw-away joke, Elan would have wandered into the conversation and it would have gone something like this.

:elan: *hears description* Hey, that sounds just like the Realm of Tropes!

:vaarsuvius: What?

:elan: It's a magical land containing some of the greatest bards in the multiverse, who devote their time to writing new things for us to allude to in our day-to-day lives!

:vaarsuvius: *facepalm*

:elan: Hey, your Raven was talking! Hi Raven! How late does V let you stay up?

Given that nothing of that nature occurred, we're probably safe.

[Rhuna_Coppermane]

Fortunately, the continents are all wrong, the ice-caps are too large, the moon is missing, and the constellations don't look right. I think we're safe there.

Yes, thank goodness. I'm wondering if the snarl coalesced into a planet.

[Bibliomancer]

Yes, thank goodness. I'm wondering if the snarl coalesced into a planet.

I prefer the theory that it's Earth 1.0

[Ancalagon]

I prefer the theory that it's Earth 1.0

I doubt this, I think Earth 1.0 really got destroyed. But I do that that this is an earth that was created from the remains of Earth 1.0 and the Strains the Snarl was made of.

So, we have one Earth 1.0, that got unmade and from there, it branches:
In one dimension, the gods started build a new earth and used it to lock all accesses and entries to the snarl-dimension. This is Earth 2.0
In another dimension, another second Earth formed, I'll just call it Earth S(snarl).

So, now we have an Earth 2.0 and an Earth S.0, both are in different dimension and, apart from a few rifts, totally isolated from each other.

[Fri]

My thoughts is that the world within the Snarl IS the OotS world.

How this works, you ask? Well, the Snarl is intertwined with all reality, yes? Ergo, the very world itself is within the Snarl. If you think about this too hard, you end up having infinite Snarls within infinite Worlds within infinite Snarls; if you're happy not thinking too deep into things, it's like putting a couple mirrors in front of each other.

I think the implications here is that the OotS world is intimately dependent upon the Snarl; destroying the Snarl could end up with negative consequences for the World, as the Snarl is so intertwined so as to actually be one of the very forces involved in keeping the World together.

From all the theories that flying around, I like this one best. It's like a moebius strip, a klein bottle, a loop. If they got good enough telescope, they can see themselves. Snarl is the world, and the world is snarl.

I don't think it's really the case, but the teory is so cool that I like it most.

[Herald Alberich]

So we do all that but, you know, with dinos.

It could work!

D&D already has dinos without time-traveling fourth-wall-demolishing silliness.

[Zevox]

Well, the Snarl is intertwined with all reality, yes?
No, no it isn't. It's imprisoned within the world.


destroying the Snarl could end up with negative consequences for the World
And what on earth gave you the impression that that was even possible? If the gods had to imprison it, wouldn't that seem to imply that the Snarl is impossible to destroy?



Could the world within the snarl be our actual Earth?
That'd be the most horrible and lame thing that could happen.
Agreed.

Zevox

[random_guy]

I would think the gods will be capable of destroying the snarl if they cooperate and set their minds to it. The world was woven from threads of reality similar to the snarl and it was implied that the gods could unmake the world. It stands to reason they can unmake the snarl as well if only its sentience and god-killing abilities were somehow excluded from the equation. It'll be similar to taking apart a tangled ball of yarn/string that's trying to kill you.

This comic http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0275.html indicates that the snarl's divine power is weakened while imprison. A god might be similarly weakened if he/she attempted to enter the prison to finish off the snarl, but a mortal or group of mortals with comparable power might be able to do the job. Shojo's comment that gods were more vulnerable to the snarl than a mortal of the same level might be an indicator of the possibility of certain characters reaching the level of gods.

[RPGAgmJAY]

Wow... real brain pain on this one. I'm going to limit my thoughts to a fantasy environment as I don't believe the Giant is looking for a SciFi answer here. D&D gives us plenty of examples to draw from.

1st off: Is it a planet or an entire universe(the stars question)? Well D&D doesn't work on universes, it works with prime material planes and other dimensions. The stars could easily be explained as shining from the crystal sphere that surrounds each prime material plane (star-jammer planetology seems to be commonly accepted through 3.5), though that does allow for up to an entire solar system to exist. I would guess it to be a single planet surrounded by a crystal sphere. (keeps the snarl out similar to how the gates keep the snarl in?)

2nd: How could a planet exist within the snarl? I tend to see two different approaches to this question. One sees the snarl as an embodiment of the powers of creation, as such even chaotic creation still happens to create (just as it also destroys). The other view point has snarl as the embodiment of pure chaos, which reminds me an aweful lot of the plane of Limbo. In Limbo we see githzerai monks of such willpower that they are able to hold together areas of order within the swirling chaos. Perhaps something "eaten" by the snarl was infact "swallowed whole", survived and forged this planet out of sheer willpower.

3rd: If we're reconsidering things, let's reconsider them from the very outset of time within the OotS storyline. We know that the Gods created the world from the chaotic energy of the snarl. The question is where did the Gods come from? The answer to that question is easy, they are interloper Gods. (Forgotten Realms has done fantastic things with this idea) The question is what right did they have to use the snarl to create a world in this prime material plane. Likely the snarl would have eventually gotten around to creating it's own world free from influence from these interloper gods, but it's power was used against it's will to create something alien from the snarl. This might explain the snarls need to destroy the world... it sees it as an abomination. Should this be the case, the planet within the snarl is the creation free from influence of the interloper dieties. So the snarl hasn't been "sleeping" but it has had it's attention directed elsewhere. Now if something wakes it by screwing with the gates, it has a planet of ??? that will help it wreck havoc on the OotS world.

Just some food for thought.

Good Gaming!

-Jay

[Prowl]

Maybe the Snarl chilled out in his old age and decided to become the planet he was supposed to be in the first place?

[factotum]

Maybe the Snarl chilled out in his old age and decided to become the planet he was supposed to be in the first place?

The Snarl was never supposed to be a planet--he was constructed of threads of reality, yes, but those would cover a lot more than a planet; besides, we clearly saw World 1.0 being destroyed by the Snarl in the Crayons of Time. Since those are the only evidence we have of the existence of the Snarl in the first place, you have to assume the other stuff we saw in them is also true if the Snarl exists!

[Serebii]

As Bibliomancer said, the ice caps are quite large. If you'll notice the top one in particular, it seems to cover about a third of the planet! Perhaps they aren't ice caps at all... Maybe they're force fields to keep out alien dinosaurs! Yeah, I have no idea whatsoever.