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Elfin
2009-08-11, 08:17 PM
In an upcoming game, I'm planning to play a human fighter. While fighters are of course extremely weak, I still wanted to get the most mileage out of it so I decided to go THF...however, I'm left with a lot of feat slots.
Besides Power Attack, Shock Trooper (and necessarily Improved Bull Rush), and Leap Attack, what are some good feats to take to enhance my combat capabilities?

Sstoopidtallkid
2009-08-11, 08:19 PM
Look at Dungeoncrasher, from Dungeonscape. Pretty good, especially if you can fly.

Or multiclass to something with, you know, class features.

Glyde
2009-08-11, 08:20 PM
Combat reflexes and improved disarm, maybe? Two handed weapons are good at that.

AstralFire
2009-08-11, 08:25 PM
IIRC, it's -AC instead of -Atk for Power Attack on a charge.

Weezer
2009-08-11, 08:26 PM
It allows you to subtract from your AC instead of your BAB when PAing on the charge.


EDIT: A fiery ninja! thats what I get for checking my sources

AstralFire
2009-08-11, 08:28 PM
Not just any Fiery Ninja... a BATHROBE NINJA!

No seriously, that's one of the nicknames for my avatar's alter ego. He's from a book I wrote.

Doc Roc
2009-08-11, 08:29 PM
Get a valorous weapon as soon as you can. I believe it's from Unapproachable East.

Elfin
2009-08-11, 08:30 PM
Ok, that's what I thought. Just checking.

Sstoopidtallkid
2009-08-11, 08:31 PM
IIRC, it's -AC instead of -Atk for Power Attack on a charge.Um, out of curiosity, what's this in response to?

@the OP, have you considered snagging Imp Trip? Might as well add some bonuses to your free attempts.

AstralFire
2009-08-11, 08:31 PM
Um, out of curiosity, what's this in response to?

@the OP, have you considered snagging Imp Trip? Might as well add some bonuses to your free attempts.

OP deleted a post wherein he asked for confirmation on what Shock Trooper did.

Glyde
2009-08-11, 08:33 PM
That's not all it lets you do. It also has some nifty thing about directing bullrushes... Or something.

You could, if you really wanted to, use feats to grab maneuvers.

Sstoopidtallkid
2009-08-11, 08:37 PM
That's not all it lets you do. It also has some nifty thing about directing bullrushes... Or something.

You could, if you really wanted to, use feats to grab maneuvers.Or go Warblade(see 2nd post:smallwink:).

And Shocktrooper has 3 effects: Power Attack to AC, push people sideways during a Bullrush, and Trip enemies by Bullrushing them into each other.

elliott20
2009-08-11, 08:43 PM
don't forget elusive target to counter anybody that uses the ubercharger build against you.

Sstoopidtallkid
2009-08-11, 08:45 PM
don't forget elusive target to counter anybody that uses the ubercharger build against you.Great feat, but prerequisites of "useless" and "boop".

Keld Denar
2009-08-11, 08:49 PM
Dwarven Flurry Fury!

Ranger1/Fighter2/Barb2/Deepwarden2/ExoticWeaponMaster2/X rest

Use a Dwarven Urgrosh 2handed, and use EWM's Flurry of Strikes and Uncanny Blow to do massive damage with one end. Has all of the advantages of having 2 2handed weapons and being able to Quickdraw between them. Base damage is a little low, but you'll be hitting hard with your 2x str damage and 2:1 PA. The extra attack is golden.

For X, Pious Templar is good, if you have Spell Compendium. Rhino's Rush is AMAZING, and Knights Move and Righteous Fury are also good. Alternatively, Occult Slayer is easy to qualify for and gives you a lot of really good defensive bonuses like keeping you from getting Dominated. Alternatively, Frenzied Berzerker, although by then you are pretty heavy in feat requirements and it'll be tough to get ALL of them. Alternatively, Warblade.

Thrawn183
2009-08-11, 08:53 PM
The combat focus feats are pretty cool.

Close quarters fighting(?): the one that lets you make and attack of opportunity when something grapples you, even if it has improved grab, AND you apply the damage as a bonus on your grapple checks synergizes amazingly well with Combat Reflexes and a reach weapon.

Combat Expertise --> Improved Trip is also nice.

Actually, my standard all THF's should have list is:
Power Attack
Combat Expertise --> Improved Trip
Combat Reflexes

That's all you really need to do your job.

elliott20
2009-08-11, 09:00 PM
Great feat, but prerequisites of "useless" and "boop".

I tried looking it up online but all I got was Martial Defense, which is apparently basically a watered down dodge.

yeah, not sure that's entirely worthwhile either unless we're talking about grabbing more feats and building off of the dodge tree.

Sstoopidtallkid
2009-08-11, 09:04 PM
I tried looking it up online but all I got was Martial Defense, which is apparently basically a watered down dodge.

yeah, not sure that's entirely worthwhile either unless we're talking about grabbing more feats and building off of the dodge tree.Tac feat, CWar, prerequisites of dodge/mobility, allows you to negate one enemy's Power Attack, make that enemy target an ally if they flank, and trip an enemy that misses an AoO. Great feat, but Dodge and Mobility kills it.

elliott20
2009-08-11, 09:05 PM
Tac feat, CWar, prerequisites of dodge/mobility, allows you to negate one enemy's Power Attack, make that enemy target an ally if they flank, and trip an enemy that misses an AoO. Great feat, but Dodge and Mobility kills it.

ahh, the version I got apparently was somebody's homebrew.

but dodge and mobility? wow, that is pretty useless.

is there anything mobility opens up though? maybe there's some synergies to be had there.

AstralFire
2009-08-11, 09:07 PM
You could try for Desert Wind or Expeditious Dodge. Is there a 'better version' of Mobility?

Sstoopidtallkid
2009-08-11, 09:10 PM
You could try for Desert Wind or Expeditious Dodge. Is there a 'better version' of Mobility?There's a MIC armor enhancement version. I heartily recommend it. However, Elusive Target specifically only works with normal Dodge, requiring you to set a 'Dodge target' to get most of the effects.

Eldariel
2009-08-11, 09:11 PM
How to make a good Fighter-class:
1. Pick Dungeoncrasher alternative class feature. Congratulations, you now have class features ranging to level 6.
2. Pick Zhentarim Fighter (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/we/20060327a) substitution levels. Congratulations, you now have class features ranging to level 9.
3. Pick Overpowering Attack substitution. Congratulations, you now have a class feature on level 16.

You can also optionally be a Thug (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/classes/variantCharacterClasses.htm#fighterVariantThug) or Hit'n'Run Fighter [Drow of the Underdark] - Thug has extra skill points while Hit'n'Run gets bonus to Initiative and Dex to damage on flat-footeds. Both give up heavier armors.


Now, the only Fighter-thing left to do is to pick up Weapon Supremacy on 18/20, but you frankly have too many good feats available to afford the whole Weapon Focus-line; at most you can get Melee/Ranged Weapon Mastery. Other feats should be spent enabling combat styles:

Charging: Power Attack > Improved Bull Rush > Shock Trooper + Leap Attack (> Spirit Lion Totem ACF)
Tripping: Combat Expertise > Improved Trip > Knock-Down
Bull Rushing: Dungeoncrasher ACF > Shock Trooper > Knockback/Driving Attack (> Rampaging Bull Rush)
Intimidating: Zhentarim ACFs > Imperious Command (> Intimidating Rage) [> Dread Tyranny/Menacing Demeanor]
Area Control: Combat Reflexes > Stand Still/&Improved Trip > Mage Slayer > Martial Study - Devoted Spirit Anything > Martial Stance - Thicket of Blades > Overpowering Attack ACF > Defensive Sweep
All: Resolute ACF > Possible EWP: Spiked Chain

- Each chain shows the usual choices you'll want for basic competence (and prerequisites) followed by the options of taking the tactic further. Some, such as Tripping, lack such direct continuation while others have even long options (Area Control for example, and I'm not counting the feats that make you ugly like Aberrant Blood > Inhuman Reach or Willing Deformity > Deformity - Tall 'cause I'd never play a character with those).

- () parenthesis present options enabled by taking a Barbarian-trip that require either Rage or are only granted from the Barbarian-class
- [] parenthesis present other options (Dread Tyranny requires 3 levels in Cleric, Menacing Demeanor requires Orc-race) and are completely secondary, only serving to pump the Intimidate-check.


Sources
Dungeonscape (Dungeoncrasher ACF)
Champions of Valor Web Enhancement (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/we/20060327a) (Zhentarim Fighter ACFs)
Player's Handbook II (Overpowering Attack ACF, Driving Attack + Prerequisites, Defensive Sweep)
Complete Warrior (Shock Trooper, Intimidating Rage)
SRD (http://www.d20srd.org/) (Knock-Down (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/divine/divineAbilitiesFeats.htm#knockDown), Stand Still (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/psionicFeats.htm#standStill), Thug (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/classes/variantCharacterClasses.htm#fighterVariantThug))
Races of Stone (Knockback, Rampaging Bull Rush)
Drow of the Underdark (Imperious Command, Hit'n'Run Fighter)
Races of Destiny (Menacing Demeanor, Dread Tyranny)
Complete Arcane (Mage Slayer)
Tome of Battle (Martial Study, Martial Stance: Thicket of Blades - alternatively, Crusader-dip)
Complete Champion (Resolute ACF, Spirit Lion Totem ACF)


The build I suggest in the last post of this thread (http://brilliantgameologists.com/boards/index.php?topic=5110.60) (based on Woodenbandman's earlier build) is for example pretty decent, though it'd want flaws and two levels of Barbarian would obviously improve it notably.

Note that it's a Thug hence the lack of 1st level feat (losing out on heavy armor proficiency sucks, btw). I like my skill points. Thanks to Skilled City-Dweller (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/we/20070228a), you can do a few handy customizations on the skill list.

Doc Roc
2009-08-12, 02:27 AM
And that's the best summary you're going to get. Please don't let Eldariel's lovely post go to waste... :)