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View Full Version : Warforged Artificer advice on build please.



Paganboy28
2009-08-17, 09:10 AM
I have also chosen to be a Warforged Artificier (though the DM has changed Warforged to native outsiders of Mechanus). I like the idea of being able to make pretty much anything I like and then infusing my own body with awesome destructiveness. Plus Warforged components sound good to being able to swap parts of my body out dependant on the situation. I have also taken the Tools of War racial sub level as it seems to double the Craft Reserve which is awesome.

Can anyone foresee any disadvantages to being a native outsider?
(apart from hedging out and banishment and such... hmmm will ask the DM about compensation). He has said I can take the Native Outsider template for a +1LA (is this worth it!?).

We have 8 ECL build to create, so I was planning on Warforged Artificer Lvl8; nice and simple.

So in light of this, does anyone have any thoughts as to feats?

I have 4 general feats to choose (plus 2 bonus feats from Artificer).

I have chosen:
Extend Spell (bonus)
Persistant Spell (24hr buffs using wands!) (bonus)

Adamantine Body (not sure about this one... it limits my Dex to +1 which could affect my ability to hit with wand attacks, but the AC bonus is great. Maybe Mithril Body would be a compromise?).

Other three feats could be:

Reach Spell (give those touch attacks some range)
Silver Tracery (pre-req for Spellcraft Soldier PrC)
Steady Concentration (take 10 on Concentration checks all the time to ensure infusions and wands and such can be used in battle)
Improved Initiative (always good and my Dex is only +1 at the moment)
Skill Focus UMD (obviously very important skill for Artificier)
Point Blank Shot (better to hit with wands)
Maximise Spell (uber blasty wands)

Any others?

Any other WF Artificer tips (items, stats, feats, progression, etc)???


Advice is welcome,
Cheers,
PB

Eldariel
2009-08-17, 09:49 AM
Well, use the Artificer bonus feats to at least pick up Extraordinary and Legendary Artisan. Since you'll be crafting stuff, making it cheap is the key. Basically you get everything for 37.5% the full price this way.

Since you give up Craft Homunculus for Tools of War, it's imperative that you pick up Craft Construct at some point. This allows you to make Homunculi again (absolutely pivotal that you can get at least one Dedicated Wright with you to craft in a Portable Hole/Bag of Holding while adventuring) and has the added benefit of enabling you to craft Effigies [Complete Arcana] & Golems (I particularly love Greater Stone Golems; great DC on those Slow-effects and very badass melee types - you can craft one on level 12!). And yeah, the other Homunculi are useful too.


Also, do pick up the first substitution level. It costs you nothing and gives you a bonus when infusing yourself. Adamantine Body doesn't restrict your Dex-bonus for ranged attacks and such - it only restricts the amount of Dex-bonus you can apply to your armor, nothing else. That said, I'm not sure if it's worth spending a feat on. I'll let you decide that.

As for feats, Item Familiar is always a great option for reliably hitting those Use Magic Device DCs. I wouldn't bother with Skill Focus though - just craft Circlet of Persuasion [DMG] ASAP, have some base Cha (10-12), get Cloak of Charisma and max ranks and you'll be doing fine with it soon enough.


The whole Native Outsider-thing means you get free martial weapon proficiencies, immunity to some poisons (doesn't matter for Warforged) and some great Polymorph-forms (provided the line of spells isn't banned). Other than that, there are immunities to some spells (apparently you wouldn't be affected by Construct-affecting spells this way, and you aren't affected by Humanoid-spells anyways) and that's about it.

It's worth noting that for feats, you could pick Metamagic to use with Metamagic Spell Trigger for great offensive potential. That said, since you already have the buff-line feats, I'm not sure you can spare the slots for Twin Spell, Empower Spell, Energy Admixture, Quicken Spell and company. Besides, you can actually fight pretty well given decent Str with your martial weapon proficiencies and ability to persist spells.


Out of the feats you listed, I don't think you should be picking any yet. The Artisan-feats, Craft Construct, metamagic and Item Familiar take priority, though Item Familiar isn't really necessary anymore since you're already on a rather high level (Circlet is +3, ranks are +11, Charisma is +1-+2 for +14-+15).

PinkysBrain
2009-08-17, 10:00 AM
There are resurrection problems. The major problem with warforged being outsiders though is that it hurts your brain ... having to see the common sense defying "warforged" and "outsider" next to each other on your character sheet all the time is a major downside. Does he make the Inevitables outsiders too?

+1 template for being native? Screw it ... limited wish isn't that expensive, so just use that to get raised if you die.

Adamantine body only limits your DEX to AC of course, not your DEX to hit, in general though yeah ... you don't want to dump your DEX too much. I'd go with a monk's belt rather than a body feat though, items are cheaper than feats.

I'm not a fan of Spellcarved Soldier ... nice concept, poor execution. Everything except the 4th level rune is crap and even that is really not worth giving up all the wonderful higher level infusions and class abilities artificer would give you.

What books do you have access to?

AslanCross
2009-08-17, 04:55 PM
Yeah, your DM should see that the Inevitables from Mechanus actually aren't outsiders. Rather, they're Constructs (Extraplanar). That said, Native outsiders can be resurrected, actually.

Furthermore, Banishment does not work on Native outsiders. It works on anything that has the Extraplanar subtype, whether it be undead or an outsider.

Paganboy28
2009-08-20, 04:01 PM
Again thanks for the advice.

So are you saying that I SHOULD take the +1 LA for the "Outsider template"? It does sound like it has some nifty advantages.


As for feats. I recognise that the whole concept of the Artificer is crafting items and I was going to get the Legendary and Extraordinary Artisan feats as they make crafting quicker...

Craft Construct I have mentioned to the DM, though he says that it might not be that useful (I quite like the idea of being at the centre of an army of golems though).

Can you construct clockwork horrors???

Is the Homonculus really worth it?

As I have explained to the DM, its all about downtime for the Artificer as they need that to create their "tools of war". If there isn't enough downtime then the Artificer is going to be really weak, unless I find excessive gold or magic items to use.

Is Persistant Spell worth it?

I am guessing Extend Spell goes along the same lines as Persistant Spell....


Reach Spell to me makes sense as for an extra charge I can turn touch spells into range touch spells. Useful for all sorts.


I am now not sure about Adamantine Body or Mithril Body.... the AC boost is nice for both and sounds Artificery....

Paganboy28
2009-08-20, 04:16 PM
What about Psi-Forged?????

PinkysBrain
2009-08-20, 06:21 PM
As for feats. I recognise that the whole concept of the Artificer is crafting items and I was going to get the Legendary and Extraordinary Artisan feats as they make crafting quicker.
Only exceptional artisan does that ... and it's a really bad feat. For expensive stuff it doesn't really matter whether it takes a month or 23 days IMO. Legendary isn't that great either. You can use retain essence for XP and even using your own XP isn't that bad ... when you lag a level you earn XP faster.

Extraordinary artisan is a good feat though.

Craft Construct I have mentioned to the DM, though he says that it might not be that useful (I quite like the idea of being at the centre of an army of golems though).
DMs generally don't like that idea, it makes combat slow, makes the Fighter look bad etc. I'd stick to one golem.

Can you construct clockwork horrors???
No, but they don't have magic immunity anyway ... so less interesting than golems anyway.

Is the Homonculus really worth it?
The dedicated wright can do your crafting for you, so it's indispensable ... the packmate from MoE is cute (maybe not cute enough to keep upgrading the HD though, which is necessary so it doesn't die in the first fireball).

If there isn't enough downtime then the Artificer is going to be really weak, unless I find excessive gold or magic items to use.
Meh, it's not so bad ... even with cheap wands of orbs and scorching ray you can do quite a bit of damage.

Is Persistant Spell worth it?
Yes it's worth it, but it's overpowered.

I am guessing Extend Spell goes along the same lines as Persistant Spell....
Extend is nice for the 1 round duration swift spells.

Artificers are sickly overpowered, unless the whole party is likewise I'd limit myself a bit. No persistent spell, only 1 metamagic feat applicable with metamagic item and 1 through metamagic spell trigger and no stacking of the same infusion with different effects. That's just me though :)

I am now not sure about Adamantine Body or Mithril Body.... the AC boost is nice for both and sounds Artificery....
It's really not necessary, improved mage armor and a monk's belt can get your AC up equally well.

Psiforged doesn't get you much unless you take a psionic class.

Deth Muncher
2009-08-20, 07:42 PM
Psiforged doesn't get you much unless you take a psionic class.
Unless you go Psionic Artificer.

PinkysBrain
2009-08-20, 07:49 PM
The psionic artificer doesn't actually use power points :) So, it still doesn't get you much.

Paganboy28
2009-08-21, 12:10 PM
The feats I have chosen are:

Craft Construct
As others have stated I can now rebuild my Homonculus and have Dedicated Wright working away in his little portable workshop. As well as being able to craft effigies, golems, and other construct devices. I have also found the Clockwork Mender which I can make so that I have automated repair bots :D (just need to build a thousand for a swarm...)

Extend Spell
So that I can extend infusions, metamagic wands and so forth for buffs and summonings and all other sorts of things.

Persistant Spell
24hr buffs from wands to enhance my stats or anyone elses or those kind of things.

Adamantine Body
After lots of thought, since I cannot wear armour I might as well go for the biggest armour I can. The dex penalty isn't that important as far as I am concerned as the skills it affects are not really that important (unless I am mistaken).

Extraordinary and Exceptional Artisan
Reduce gold cost and time to produce. I am banking on sapping magic items for XP to cover that cost.


Now all I have to work out is the magic items that I have crafted up to level 8... ;S