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BobVosh
2009-08-17, 12:49 PM
I've seen it somewhere around, but I'm considering telling my party when they get BAB 11+ they can move and do thier two worst iteratives, and then three worst at 16+.

Hmm. Wonder if that sentence is clear. Example: Paladin 11 moves 20 and attacks. He can make one attack at +11, or two attacks at +6/+1.
Fighter 16 moves 20, and attacks. He can make one attack at +16, or three at +11/+6/+1.

Is this too much a buff? Not enough and just let them do thier highest attacks? I figure they would be semi-intelligent and not do 2 bad attacks at a dragon, etc. I know some playgrounders have done something like this before.

If it matters, right now the game is pathfinder core. I may allow a few PrC from completes, but I'm running a pathfinder module so I don't want to retool every fight even more than I have to.

Person_Man
2009-08-17, 01:14 PM
It's already quite easy to get Pounce or Free Movement (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=5884385). What you propose is a nerf. All you need to do is expand your books allowed (or suggest that someone buy wands of Polymorph). There's also several good but non-broken PrC that offer Pounce if that's what you want to do - Wild Plains Outrider, Singh Rager, Ashworm Dragoon, etc.

BobVosh
2009-08-17, 01:18 PM
Polymorph doesn't work that way in pathfinder. Very few of those books are open, and I don't really want to open them.

And how is another option they can take a nerf? It isn't replacing anything.

Kylarra
2009-08-17, 01:23 PM
It ups the anti-mook stuff, but other than that, I don't see it being too relevant as iteratives rarely hit anyway, so unless the enemy is massively debuffed, you're almost always going to be better off with your primary.

Person_Man
2009-08-17, 01:34 PM
Polymorph doesn't work that way in pathfinder. Very few of those books are open, and I don't really want to open them.

And how is another option they can take a nerf? It isn't replacing anything.

Beast Shape II (the Pathfinder Polymorph) grants Pounce (according to my Beta release version, at least). So you can still get it with a wand in core.

If you want melee classes to have at least a somewhat comparable power level to caster classes, they need at least some of the following: Pounce, Tome of Battle, Magic of Incarnum, Expanded Psionics Handbook, PHBII, and/or Leadership. Certain Complete and environment books help a lot as well, but aren't strictly necessary. Core only Pathfinder fixes some things, but nerfs many things that didn't need to be nerfed. So in my opinion, by denying your melee classes a much needed class ability that is commonly available in many suppliments, you're choosing to nerf them compared to casters. That's fine, as that's how core was written, and many players prefer a challenge. But if your goal is to add more balance, you should just open up the books allowed for PrC and feats.

Eldariel
2009-08-17, 02:25 PM
I'd just plain allow full attack after moving, or at least full attack minus last iterative after moving, and all iteratives at -5. Otherwise you're gimping people who don't want to sit and full attack which IMHO is really bad for the logical and strategic aspects of the combat.

PairO'Dice Lost
2009-08-17, 02:38 PM
There was no attack/full attack distinction in 1e and 2e, and fighters played just fine with the ability to move and attack in the same round--and they've all been nerfed since then relative to casters. You could give martial characters the ability to move and attack and remove iterative attack penalties and you'd probably be fine.