Zombie Invasion - game design

[Jontom Xire]

As a side effect of the current Zombies werewolf game on this forum (start here: http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=6753862&postcount=679) there seems some support for having a similar game with more of an RP/rules based element and less of a WW element.

This thread is to incorporate suggestions and build a working rule set that can be used either as a party/RP game with dice, or in a forum such as this. More unique title suggestions would also be appreciated.

The next post will be a working copy of the rules, updated with suggestions as they get agreed upon or if I like them enough. :smallbiggrin:

[Jontom Xire]

Zombie Rampage
A game of rampaging zombies and plucky survivors for parties or forums.

Game play:

Game turns consist of a day phase and a night phase.

During the day phase zombies tear down the previous day's barricades hunting for victims that are no longer there (not too bright) and during the night phase the zombies can do one of:


Roam the streets, hunting for survivors.
Attack the barricades.
Try and sneak into the barricades and attack those hiding within.


If there are no barricades, the zombies will all roam the streets hunting for survivors.

NPC zombies decide their night action randomly. Players that have turned into zombies can decide their own night action, and choose their action in many other places where it would normally be decided randomly.

During the day phase the survivors can do one of:

Scavenge for useful items
Fortify a barricade
Heal
Be healed
Slope around the place being lazy


During the night phase the survivors can do one of:

Hide in the barricades taking pot shots at zombies (if they have a ranged weapon).
Roam the streets looking for lone zombies to fight.
Find a hiding place and hope they survive until morning.
Find a hiding place and snipe at zombies (if they have a long ranged weapon).


The game ends when:

There are no more survivors (zombies win)
There are no more zombies left (survivors win)
N turns have passed and the military arrive to rescue the survivors (survivors win)


The number of turns depends on the number of survivors and zombies at the start of the game. There will be 1d3 zombies per player. Each zombie will have 9 points which will be distributed randomly amongst the different stats with the minimum value being 1 and the maximum value being 5.

Advanced optional rules: Additional roles and win conditions such as cultists who try and get everyone infected. Or a hunter who starts the game with a gun and one round and has to kill N zombies to win.


Stats/Skills:

Players get to spend 13 points on the following stats. The maximum value for a statistic is 5, the minimum that players can allocate is 2, although some NPCs and zombies may have 1.

STRength: Affects melee combat and barricade building.
AGiLity: Affects ranged combat and stealthiness (hiding, sneaking).
CONstitution: Affects disease resistance and toughness.
INTelligence: Affects healing and searching/scavenging.

If there aren't enough players, NPCs can be rolled randomly.

If a player gets turned into a zombie, their stats remain the same but are used for different purposes:

STRength: Affects melee combat and breaking through barricades.
AGiLity: Affects dodging ranged attacks and sneaking into barricades.
CONstitution: Affects disease infectiousness (and TBD).
INTelligence: Affects searching for hidden players.

Each player gets one skill from the following list, which they lose on becoming a zombie, which gives them +1 to the corresponding action.

Barricading
Healing
Melee Combat
Scavenging
Shooting
Stealth (hiding)

Health

A living person has two damage states, one for physical damage and one for infection. Zombies have only the physical damage state.

Physical Infection
-----------------------------
Healthy Healthy
Scratched Dormant
Injured Malignant
Wounded Spreading
Dead Zombified

When a character with any sort of infection dies, they automatically become a zombie. If a character is killed by a zombie they automatically become a zombie.

Each 24 hours a player with "Malignant" or "Spreading" infection who isn't having their infection medically treated rolls 1d6. If they roll higher than their CON stat they go up one state. Any player who reaches the "Zombified" infection state becomes a zombie.

If a player becomes a zombie, their stats are reduced by 1 point for each physical damage state above "Scratched", with a minimum value of 1. So if they become a zombie after death, all stats are reduced by 3. If they are "Healthy" when they turn into a zombie they become a super-zombie and all stats are increased by 1.

When taking physical damage, a survivor's toughness is his Constitution divided by 2 and rounded up. Zombies toughness is calculated in the same way but with a +1 bonus for being dead already. Toughness is used when calculating damage taken. Divide the damage total by the target's toughness to work out how many levels of physical damage the target goes up by.

Example:

Rob the Zombie (Con=3, toughness=3) gets beaten up by Bob (Con=4, toughness=2) using a baseball bat. Rob is currently undamaged. Bob ends up getting a damage total of 8. That makes 2 levels of physical damage, so Rob is now "Injured".

Next round Rob the Zombie wins and ends up with a damage total of 7. That's 3 levels of physical damage for Bob, so he goes from "Healthy" to "Wounded".

Ranged Combat:

Ranged weapons have one of two ranges. Short or long. If a short ranged weapon is used then if the target doesn't die it can initiate melee combat. If the shooter is protected by a barricade then the target will need to force it's way through the barricade first (see "Barricades") but once it does so will target the shooter. Zombies will always attack if they are not killed by the ranged attack.

Long ranged weapons mean that the shooter is far away from the target and so can make a get-away easily, assuming the target can even see the shooter that is.

Zombies lack the co-ordination and intelligence to make ranged attacks.

To make a ranged attack, the shooter and target both roll 1d6 and add their AGL stat and any appropriate to hit or defensive modifiers. If the shooter's total is higher then the target is hit. The shooter adds any damage modifiers from the weapon and this gives the damage total. The damage total is then divided by the target's toughness and that gives how many levels of physical damage the target takes.

Melee Combat

Normal melee combat consists of three rounds. Attacks through barricades are resolved in the same way as melee combat, but the number of rounds depends on the success of the attacker in breaking through the barricade.

Survivors cannot attack zombies unless they possess a weapon capable of harming a zombie. A mob of survivors, some with such weapons and some without, cannot attack zombies and if attacked by them cannot damage them. However on encountering zombie(s) the members of the mob with weapons can form a smaller mob and attack the zombie(s) while the unarmed survivors run away.

Before melee combat begins, all participants may fire any short range weapons they possess at the enemy. Or at their friends. But that's probably not a very good idea.

For each melee combat, all participants on one side are decided and all the participants on the other side are decided. The STR stats of all participants, and all the "to hit" modifiers of any melee weapons being used are added together to get a total melee strength for each side.

Each round, each side then rolls 1d6 and adds the value to the total melee strength to get a "To Hit" total. The side with the highest total wins the round.

If survivors win the "To Hit" roll they may choose to push back the zombies and run away rather than deal damage. This is particularly useful if they do not actually possess any weapons capable of damaging zombies.

To deal damage, take the the difference in the "To Hit" totals as the base damage value. Any damage modifiers of any weapons being used by the winning side are added to the damage value to get the damage total which is then divided by the toughness of the targets (it is assumed that all characters on one side are either zombies or living). This gives the number of physical damage levels suffered by the losing side. These are divided randomly and as evenly as possible amongst the characters on the losing side.

If survivors are being attacked by zombies then each zombie, once per round of combat, has a chance to infect a survivor. Infection attempts are spread evenly and randomly amongst the survivors. Each zombie and their target rolls 1d6 and adds their CON stat. If the zombie has a higher total then the target gains one infection level. If a survivor becomes zombified as a result of this, he drops out of the combat as he wanders off confusedly.

Example 1:

Earlier, Rob the Zombie attacked Bob, wounding him. Rob has a CON stat of 3 and rolls 2 on 1d6. Bob has a CON stat of 4 and even though he only rolls a 1 the zombie didn't roll higher, so although Bob was wounded he doesn't get infected.

Example 2:

Ann, Bob, and Charlie are attacked by 2 zombies. Although they easily defend themselves, 2 of them might get infected. Rolling randomly Charlie is the lucky fellow not to have any risk of infection. One of them (CON=3) targets Ann (CON=4) and rolls a 2 so Ann is safe, but the other (CON=4) targets Bob (CON=3) and rolls a 3 while Bob only rolls a 1, so Bob gets a Dormant Infection.


Scavenging

When scavenging, first pick a type of item to scavenge for, or decide to scavenge for miscellaneous items. Melee Weapons and Ranged Weapons cannot be specified independantly; you can only choose Weapons as your item type.

To scavenge, the survivor rolls 1d6 and adds their INT stat to get their scavenge total.

When scavenging for miscellaneous items, survivors get a +1 bonus to their scavenge total and choose randomly from all types of items, not just those listed under "Miscellaneous Items".

Survivors may scavenge in teams. Use the INT stat of the team member with the highest value and add +1 for each additional team member scavenging. Only one item will be found and it will go to a random team member. If they are unable to carry it without dropping another item they may give it, or the other item, to another team member.

Example:

Bob (INT=4) wants something to heal his infection, so he goes to scavenge for medical supplies. He rolls a 5 which means he gets a total of 9.

Anna (INT=1) and Charles (INT=2) decide that they need to work as a team. To further increase their chances they will take whatever they find. They roll 1d6 and get a 2. That makes a total of 6.

Next look up the scavenge total on the chart below:

1-5: You find nothing. Bad luck.
6: You don't find what you're looking for, but you do find something. Randomly pick a different category and you get a low value item.
7-8: You find a low value item.
9-10: You find a high value item.
11+: You find an excellent item.

Next randomly select from all items of the type and quality found to find the exact item found.

Example:

Bob's total of 9 means he has found a high value medical item. Nice one, Bob! He decides odd numbers are paracetamol and even numbers are first-aid kit. He rolls a 4. Bad luck, Bob!

Anna and Charles' total of 6 means they have found a low value item. Just. They roll a 1d4 and get a 2 meaning that they have found a ranged weapon. They decide that odd numbers are a pistol and even numbers are ammunition. They roll a 1d6 and get a 6, so get ammunition. A further roll of 1d4 gives a 3 meaning that they have found a single shotgun shell.


Items

Zombies do not carry or use items at all.

Each survivor has the following item slots which can be used to carry items as described:

Left hand, right hand: Any single item of any size can be carried in a single hand unless it is described as a two-handed item.

Left pocket, right pocket: Any number of items up to a total size of 2 can be carried in each pocket.

Belt: A single item of any size up to size 4 can be carried tucked into a belt.

Back: Any single item that is described as being able to be slung can be carried on the back.

Items without a size value can only be held in the hands or slung on the back (if slingable). Weapons slung on the back or carried elsewhere cannot be used unless items or weapons being carried in the hands can be stored elsewhere to free the hands for use. E.g. a survivor with a slung rifle cannot use it if he is also carrying a pistol and a cleaver and has no free slots to store them, but can use it if he has a katana that can also be slung.

If a player obtains an additional item that he cannot carry as a result of scavenging or because another player gives it to him, they must choose one to drop which will be permanently lost, or can give items to other players. It is also possible for two players with full inventories to exchange items without dropping one or using a third player as an intermediary. However at the end of a day phase after all scavenging has been resolved but before the night phase has started, all surplus items must have been redistributed or discarded.

Melee weapons

2 by 4: 2-handed, +1 to hit, won't damage zombies. Low value item.
Frying pan: Size 6, 2-handed, +1 to hit, won't damage zombies. Low value item.
Cleaver: Size 4, 1-handed, can damage zombies. Low value item.
Baseball bat: 2-handed, +2 to hit, won't damage zombies. High value item.
Blowtorch: Size 6, 1-handed, 1 use, +1 to damage modifier, can damage zombies. High value item.
Axe: 2-handed, -1 to hit modifier, +1 to damage modifier, can damage zombies. High value item.
Chain saw: 2-handed, -2 to hit modifier, +4 to damage modifier, can damage zombies. Excellent item.
Katana: 2-handed, slingable, +1 to hit modifier, can damage zombies. Excellent item.


Ranged weapons
All ranged weapons are found with one set of ammunition loaded.

.22 Pistol: Size 2, -1 damage modifier. Short range. Low value item.
Air rifle: 2-handed, slingable, cannot cause damage but distracts target preventing them from performing any action. Low value item.
Beretta: Size 3, -1 to hit modifier. +1 damage modifier. Short range. Low value item.
.22 Rifle: 2-handed, slingable. Long range. High value item.
Shotgun: 2-handed, slingable. Short range. High value item.
Double-barrelled shotgun. 2-handed, slingable. Can shoot second zombie with -1 to hit on both attacks. Requires twice as much ammo for reloads or acts as normal shotgun. Short range. High value item.
Uzi: Size 6, +1 to hit modifier. Can shoot second zombie with -1 to hit on both attacks. Short range. Excellent item.
Sniper rifle: 2-handed, slingable, +1 to hit modifier. Long range. Excellent item.
Ammunition: Size 1 for each 8 or part thereof for each individual type of ammo not loaded in a weapon. .22 rounds, Uzi clips, shotgun shells, sniper rifle rounds. 1, 2, or 3 at a time for low value, high value, excellent items.


Medical items

Bandages: Size 2, 2 uses, heals damage only. Low value item.
Sleeping pills: Size 1, 2 uses, puts target to sleep, looks just like antibiotics. Low value item.
Whisky: Size 3 (cannot be stored in belt), prevents infection spreading, but player can still barricade, scavenge or whatever. -1 modifier to all actions. Low value item.
Poison pill: Size 1, when swallowed player will die but not become a zombie regardless of infection state. High value item.
Paracetamol: Size 1, 2 uses, heals infection, -3 modifier. High value item.
First-aid kit: Size 3, 2 uses, heals damage only, +1 modifier. High value item.
Antibiotics: Size 1, 2 uses, heals infection, +1 modifier. Excellent item.
Med-kit: Size 6, 3 uses, heals either damage or infection. +1 modifier healing damage, -1 modifier healing infection. Excellent item.


Construction items

More nails: Size 1, 2 uses. Goes with hammer. Low value item.
No More Nails: Size 4, 1 use. +2 barricading modifier. Low value item.
Duct tape: Size 3, 1 use, +2 barricading modifier. Low value item.
Hammer and nails: Size 3, found with one set of nails, +2 barricading modifier. High value item.
Nail gun cartridge: Size 1, 1 use, Goes with nail gun. High value item.
Planks: 1 use, +3 barricading modifier. High value item.
Cement: Size 8, 1 use, +6 barricading modifier. Excellent item.
Nail gun: Size 4, found with 1 nail gun cartridge, +5 barricading modifier. Excellent item.


Miscellaneous items

Satchel: Slingable, can store any number of items up to a total size of 6. High value item.
Backpack: Slingable, can store any number of items up to a total size of 8. Excellent item.



Barricades

Players who are barricading decide amongst themselves how big a barricade they need, how many people it should shelter. They add together the STR stats of all the characters helping to build the barricade, plus any modifiers from items to get the barricading total. This value is divided by the size of the barricade, and then they add 1d6 for the base strength of the building they are barricading, to get the barricade's defence value.

Example:

4 people with STR stats 2, 3, 4, 5 build a barricade for 5 people. They roll a 3 on 1d6 and so the barricade strength is ((2 + 3 + 4 + 5) / 5) + 3 = 5.

Cumulative barricade building is an optional rule still under discussion. Ideas include a cap on barricade strength (before the dice roll is added) and also that the 1d6 roll only applies for that night, while strength and items are cumulative. E.g. in the example above, if the same people barricaded the following night, the total would be 2 (from previous day) + ((2 + 3 + 4 + 5) / 5) (from STR) + 3 (1d6) = 7. There would also have to be an effect from zombie attacks otherwise once a barricade had hit it's cap no-one would need to barricade at all yet would still get a full barricade to hide in.

Healing

Instead of barricading or scavenging, a player can choose to heal themselves or others. The player being healed (the patient) can also not barricade or scavenge. The healer can use medical items owned by either themselves or by the patient. The healer can heal as many patients as they choose, but not heal themselves, or can heal themselves only. The healer must use an appropriate medical item to heal and can only use one such item per patient per attempt to heal.

To heal infection or physical damage, roll 1d6, add INT stat and any modifiers from the medical item being used. Divide this total by 6 to get the number of levels healed. Players cannot go to better than "Healthy" state.

Attacking Barricades

Zombies attack the people inside barricades in one of two ways. The first is to physically break through the barricade and the second is to sneak inside through an unlocked/undefended back door that has been overlooked.

To break through a barricade a zombie rolls 1d6 and adds its STR stat. It then subtracts the barricade defence value and the result is the number of attacks it gets against a randomly selected occupant of the barricade up to a maximum of 3.

Example :

The barricade built earlier had a barricade defence value of 5. Rob the Zombie (STR=4) rolls 3 on a 1d6 so gets 2 attacks against a randomly selected defender.

To sneak into a barricade, a zombie must roll 1d6 and add it's AGL stat. If it scores higher than the barricade defence value then it finds an appropriate unlocked door or unboarded window. It then subtracts the barricade defence value and the result is the number of attacks it gets against a randomly selected occupant of the barricade up to a maximum of 3.

Example:

The barricade built earlier had a barricade defence value of 5. Rob the Zombie (AGL=4) rolls 1d6 and gets 4. The total of 6 is higher than 5 so Rob finds an unlocked back door. He gets one attack against a random survivor in the barricade before being driven out.

Hide 'n' Seek

Survivors outside of the barricade at night can do one of two things. Cower in fear in an appropriate hiding place or hunt down some zombies. The latter they can do either as a group or individually.

All characters who intend to hide or use long range weapons to kill zombies roll 1d6 and add their AGL stat. This is their "hide" score. If multiple characters are hiding together, use the lowest AGL stat of the group and subtract 1 for every character after the first. Characters roaming the streets are considered to have a "hide" value of 0.

For each zombie who is roaming the streets roll 1d6 and add their INT stat. The total is their "seek" score. Randomly select a target from all survivors with a lower "hide" score. Once all zombies have found a target (if they can) work out all survivor and zombie mobs for melee combat.

Example:

Ann, Bob, and Charlie are roaming the streets as a mob, hunting zombies. Derek has a gun and intends to shoot a zombie from long range. Ellen is hiding. 3 zombies are roaming the streets tonight. Ellen's hide score is high enough that she passes the night safely, but all the others can be targetted by the zombies. One finds Ann, one finds Charlie, and one finds Derek. The zombies that find Ann and Charlie form a mob and attack. Ann, Bob, and Charlie form a second mob and prepare to fight.


A recommendation for how to calculate who gets found by a zombie is as follows:

For each hiding group that could be found by a zombie, subtract the hide total from the seek total and that gives how many chance they have of being found.

E.g.
Rob the Zombie gets a seek total of 8. Ann has a hide total of 4, so 4 chances of being found. Bob has 2 = 6 chances and Charles has 6 = 2 chances. That makes 12 chances total so the probability of being found for each person is:
Ann = 4/12 = 1/3
Bob = 6/12 = 1/2
Charles = 2/12 = 1/6

Roll 1d6: 1-2 = Ann, 3-5 = Bob, 6 = Charles

This makes it a little fairer as Charles is less likely to be found due to his much higher hiding total.



For each combat, there are two steps. First each character with a short range weapon can choose to use it. Second there are three rounds of melee combat as described in the "Melee Combat" section.

Example:

Bob has a shotgun. As the zombies attack he fires, wounding one zombie (selected randomly) slightly. Derek grabs his baseball bat, and the fight begins.


If a zombie hunting mob is not attacked at all, take the highest INT stat of the group, add 1 for each character after the first, and add 1d6. This is the mob's "seek" score. If their "seek" score is higher than 6 then they find a randomly selected zombie. If that zombie is attacking another survivor, the mob joins with that survivor.

If a character using a long range weapon is found they lose their chance to shoot a zombie. In the example above, Derek never got to use his weapon. If they are not found, calculate a "seek" score as for an unfound hunting mob. If the "seek" score is higher than 6 then a suitable target is found. Resolve the attack as described in the "Ranged Combat" section.

If, for some reason, a living character chooses to hunt another living character then calculate a "seek" score as for hunting mobs and long range attack mobs above.

[Elm11]

Aha! this was the post i was waiting on :smallbiggrin:.

If you jsut give me a few minutes to review it all, i'll see if i can help add anything to it.

Thanks Jontom :smalltongue:

Ok. the first thing i'm noticing here is that combat will be too complex to narrate, and it would be too clunky to work effectively. the other problem i see is that ganging up is going to be a little too overpowered, though it is much more debatable. For combat, i suggest that for combat, the two combatants simply roll 1d6 (computerized of course) the add half their strength (rounded up) and whoever has the highest gets to deal damage. This should be calculated by rolling 1d4, and adding the whole strength modifier. for instance:

Jabba the frog has a strength of five, fighting everyone else in the playground zombie, which has a strength of 3. Jabba roles a 4 for his dice roll, and adds 3 to that. Zombie rolls a 4, and adds 2, so we end up with 7 (jabba) vs 6 (playground). Now that Jabba has won, he roles a d4 and gets a 3. + his strength of 5 deals 8 damage to everyone else in the playground.

I've got what could be a good way to calculate health. Instead of having 20 points to dish out among 6 skills, make it 23 points for 7 skills, and add a new one, called toughness. For each point you have in toughness, you get 5 points of hp. This means that if you invest 3, you have enough health to survive a few attacks without some form of healing, but not so much that you can go strolling around fearlessly.

What do you think?

[Selrahc]

Aim: wasted stat - zombies don't use guns. Can we use it for something else?

Dodging bullets maybe? In life the zombie knew about weapons, so in death they instinctively take paths harder to target.

[Elm11]

Awww the data backup ate my post :smallfrown:.

Thinking about the use of accuracy, i'm wondering whether a zombie could use it to attempt to attack a player through a barricade.

It'd have to provide a very low chance, because otherwise late game zombies could just do that every night and keep killing players, so i was thinking along the lines of a 3/6/9/12/15% chance (3% per point) to allow the zombie to make an attack agaisnt aplayer inside barricades. What do you reckon?

So i can keep track, i'll write up a word doc and start getting all of this in proper order :smallsmile:

Hmmmmm... another problem i'm starting to see is that the zombies and players will react in a meta gaming sense because the two sides can read the other team's posts. This will be a major issue, as we can't just Pm all actions to the narrator, or he/she'd be swamped with messages. Any suggestions?

[Jontom Xire]

Umm, why a word doc? This thread is meant to be tracking changes etc.

===========

I think rather than "A attacks B then B attacks A" to make melee combat a mutual attack situation. It will make attacks quicker to resolve. Something like each participant rolls 1d6, adds weapon bonuses and Str stat. The person with the highest value takes the difference as a damage roll. For zombies this gets added to Med stat and looked up on a table/divided by 3 and rounded down/whatever. For players this reduces the target's strength. I think for player vs. player the strength reduction is temporary and can be healed by med-kits, etc. Strength 0 = incapacitated, Strength -1 = dead. If killed without infection of any sort, the player is permanently dead. If infected they become a zombie unless the person who killed them decides to chop them into small pieces to prevent this (automatic but optional).
Zombies strength is permanently reduced.

Votes for? Against? slight modifications to the idea? I'd like feedback before I update the rules post.

[banthesun]

I'm really starting to like the idea of mob combat the more I look at it. What I'd suggest though is totalling the STR of all the combatants before rolling any dice, to nerf gangs just a little. It would be possible to use a single value to encompass both attack and defence, unless the narrator feels up to managing both. Instead of each side making three attacks there could be three rounds of combat, with which ever side wins dealing damage.

It might also be a good idea to use simple damage states instead of ever decreasing STR values. For humans this would be infected (like malignent in the current game) and zombified. For zombies this would be disabled (for how ever many phases we determine as balanced) or dead.

Also, perhaps it would be interesting to limit inventory space to max number of items = STR value. Comments?

Working on some barricade ideas now

[Jontom Xire]

Yeah, one die roll per mob attacker would be a bit over-powered.

What you were saying about a single value for both attack and defence and three rounds of combat instead of three attacks each was exactly what I was trying to say. So resolving combat would be like:

Side A: Add up STR and melee weapon to hit mods for all participants and add 1d6
Side B: Ditto.

The side with the highest total value takes the difference, adds any melee weapon damage mods and applies it to:

1) A random member of the other side?
2) Divided equally amongst the other side?

I hear what you say about damage states, but would like to separate physical damage (which reduces your ability to fight, shoot, scavenge, build, etc.) and infection state. I envision a big tough guy getting a tiny scratch which barely affects him at all but gives him a malignant infection so that two turns later he is dead. Or a small guy getting so ripped to pieces by zombies that he doesn't become one.

Thinking about that, how about your physical state when you die becomes your starting state as a zombie, so a player who gets badly torn up in a zombie attack becomes a weak and ineffective zombie but a player who gets infected but is otherwise unaffected is a much stronger zombie.

So we could have damage states "Scratched", "Injured", "Wounded", and "Dead". A character goes up a state for each 2 or 3 points of damage they receive. Each level causes an additional -1 modifier to any action and that modifier also gets applied to all stats when the person becomes a zombie.

You then add the MED total of attacking zombie(s) to the damage total and subtract 1d6, and that makes the infection total. We then have infected states "Dormant", "Malignant", "Spreading", and "Zombified". A character goes up a state for each 2 or 3 points of infection they receive. Each 24 hours a player with "Malignant" or "Spreading" infection rolls 1d6. On a 5 they go up one state. On a 6 they become a zombie.

As for inventory limitations - I'm not sure. I want to keep this simple. If we make scavenging quite dangerous and the chance of finding decent items low - we could make it so you can only have one of each type of item - one gun, one melee weapon, and so on, then it should stop people building huge caches of items.


I also had an idea about barricading - how if you add all ENG stats of all barricading players, add 1d6 and divide by the size of the barricade (number of people in it). Add some value that represents the initial strength of the building being barricaded, and that gives the defensive value of the barricade. Thus a few people can build a big weak barricade or a small strong barricade, but it will almost never be strong enough to withstand a good zombie attack because the 1d6 roll when building it is divided amongst the whole size of the barricade.

E.g. 4 people with ENG stats 2, 3, 4, 5 build a barricade for 5 people with a base value of 3. They roll a 3 on 1d6 and so the barricade strength is ((2 + 3 + 4 + 5 + 3) / 5) + 3 = 6.

A zombie with ENG stat of 4 would then need 3 or better on 1d6 to break through, whereupon he would get to attack a single random occupant. He would get a number of attacks equal to the value by which he broke through (to indicate the size of the breach), i.e. if he rolled a 4 he would get 4 + 4 - 6 = 2 attacks.

What do you think? And I really should be concentrating on work!!

[Opeth_Freak]

Need to discuss barricades, whether they are cumulative or destroyed each night (preferred), and also how to stop the game becoming just a bunch of players hiding behind barricades interminably.

Well I thought about it, and I have an idea:

How about both at once? As we know, destroying something is much easier than creating.

My point? Let's say, zombies will get bonus to destroying barricades. As long, as the barricade stands, it's cumulative (so if zombie attack will leave barricade at +3 status, and 6 people will fortify on the next day with ENG stat 1, then barricade stands at 9), if zombies will manage to destroy the barricade (with their destroying bonus), then players will have find another shelter.

Also, new barricades to find could have natural defense stat (wooden storage will have lesser stat than concrete house), and its up to Perception stat, how safe shelter will be found.

Thoughts?

[Jontom Xire]

Inventory ideas:

Rifle: -3 to hit modifier against zombies (hitting anywhere except the head has no effect), but always kills zombies. No modifiers against people. Long range.

Sniper rifle: Like rifle but -2 to hit against zombies, +1 to hit against people. Long range.

Shotgun: +1 to hit, -3 to damage against zombies (remember the +1 to hit carries through to add to damage total). Short range. Great way to annoy a zombie and get it to attack you.

Uzi: +3 to damage. Short range.

Pistol: Like rifle, but -2 to hit against zombies. Short range.

Long range means there is no come-back - the target cannot reach you.

Short range means if you don't kill the target it gets to attack you as per normal melee combat unless you are behind a barricade in which case it will attack the barricades and target you if it breaks through.

Weapons come with varying amounts of ammo depending on how successful your scavenge was.

Med-kit: 3 uses, heals either damage or infection, +1 modifier.
First-aid kit: 2 uses, heals damage only, +1 modifier.
Bandages: N uses, heals damage only.
Antibiotics: N uses, heals infection, +2 modifier. Number depends on success of scavenge.
Sleeping pills: N uses, puts target to sleep, looks just like antibiotics.
Paracetamol: N uses, heals infection, -1 modifier.

I guess healing will have to be MED stat + 1d6 + modifiers divided by 2. On a 5 the level decreases by 1, on a 6 it decreases by 2. That kinda sucks - it's a bit complicated. Can anyone think of anything better? How about multiply the state value by whatever the divisor was when acquiring damage (2 or 3, see post above), and you have to get higher than that. The trouble is that that seems to easy.

[Jontom Xire]

Well I thought about it, and I have an idea:

How about both at once? As we know, destroying something is much easier than creating.

My point? Let's say, zombies will get bonus to destroying barricades. As long, as the barricade stands, it's cumulative (so if zombie attack will leave barricade at +3 status, and 6 people will fortify on the next day with ENG stat 1, then barricade stands at 9), if zombies will manage to destroy the barricade (with their destroying bonus), then players will have find another shelter.

Also, new barricades to find could have natural defense stat (wooden storage will have lesser stat than concrete house), and its up to Perception stat, how safe shelter will be found.

Thoughts?

The wood/concrete thing is what I already suggested at, just not so explicit.

I thought about doing the PER search for new shelter, but it just seemed wrong.

As for cumulative barricade, if players hugely outnumber zombies attacking the barricade, then the barricade just gets stronger and stronger.

Lets say we have 8 players with ENG of 3 and 2 zombies with ENG of 3. All players barricade and roll 3 on 1d6 giving a total of 27 (protection of 3). Zombies all attack and roll 3 giving them 2 attacks on each person inside, but only doing a total of 12 damage to the barricade. The following day the barricade starts with a strength of 15! Add another 27 and the barricade is near impregnable.

The only way I'd allow this is if during the day phase, all the zombies all got one free attack on anybody entering or exiting, and in addition got to repeat their night-time barricade attack based on the defence value of the barricade at the end of the night (2). This would mean (assuming all rolls were the same and no-one died) that the barricade would have a value of 30 at the end of the day/start of the next night. Thus progress made by 8 people against a mere 2 zombies is negligible with a high chance of additional people turning to zombies in the process.

If players choose to abandon their barricade, the zombies remain at the old barricade, still attacking it while the players get a free build phase in a new building.

Buildings start with a basic structural strength of a base value multiplied by the size (remember it gets divided by size to calculate barricade value).

[Trixie]

Well, my opinion?

You're overthinking some things, needlessly complicating another. As things stand now, expected return of investment in some stats is much lower than the others, and some items are gamebreakers. Looks good, mostly, though.

I could run the math when I got home I you want to, I don't have time currently. If you want to, of course.

[Opeth_Freak]

And that's why I said, we should give Zombies some additional bonuses to destroying. I'm not an awesome mathematician (even more so, if I'll have to say all those formulas in foreign language :smalleek:), but I think, there is some way to give zombies such destructive powers, so there's absolutely no way for humans to barricade themselves once and for all.

And if not by perception, then how else survivors are going to find some decent shelter, after the previous one got destroyed? Plain luck?

[banthesun]

Perhaps it would be possible to give the zombies two types of attacks against barricades. A direct attack where they try to destroy the barricades and grind them down, and a infiltrate attack, kinda based on this (http://drmcninja.com/page.php?pageNum=18&issue=8). The direct attack uses ENG and is most effective with large numbers of zombies and small, weak barricades, while the infiltrate attack uses STE and is most useful with small numbers of zombies and large barricades (more space to slip through).

[Jontom Xire]

Well, my opinion?

You're overthinking some things, needlessly complicating another. As things stand now, expected return of investment in some stats is much lower than the others, and some items are gamebreakers. Looks good, mostly, though.

I could run the math when I got home I you want to, I don't have time currently. If you want to, of course.

I'd like to know what you think I'm needlessly complicating, what stats are game breaking, etc. etc. I'd love you to run the math. However comments like thsi without the required detail to go fix the problems don't really help.


And that's why I said, we should give Zombies some additional bonuses to destroying. I'm not an awesome mathematician (even more so, if I'll have to say all those formulas in foreign language :smalleek:), but I think, there is some way to give zombies such destructive powers, so there's absolutely no way for humans to barricade themselves once and for all.

And if not by perception, then how else survivors are going to find some decent shelter, after the previous one got destroyed? Plain luck?

I feel that any bonus to destroying can probably be overcome by just having more players and similarly weights the game unfairly in the zombies' favour in the end game.

Also we want to keep the game simple. I totally agree that using PER here might help but also that it over-complicates the game a bit. Also consider that some of the living will have lived in the town, know it really well, and know exactly which buildings are how big, what they are made of, etc. etc.


Perhaps it would be possible to give the zombies two types of attacks against barricades. A direct attack where they try to destroy the barricades and grind them down, and a infiltrate attack, kinda based on this (http://drmcninja.com/page.php?pageNum=18&issue=8). The direct attack uses ENG and is most effective with large numbers of zombies and small, weak barricades, while the infiltrate attack uses STE and is most useful with small numbers of zombies and large barricades (more space to slip through).

Yes, I was forgetting the infiltrate attack. Fancy making up some rules for it?

Also, to try and make the game reasonably realistic, if you stay in the same barricade, why on earth would the zombies not spend the day time trying to rip it down and attacking everyone going in and out?

Also cumulative barricades make the game more complicated. With my original proposed idea you do one quick and relatively simple calculation to work out the barricade value and that's it. With cumulative barricades you need to keep track of an overall structure strength, etc. etc.

My idea to run the game is:

1) Everyone states what they plan to do (scavenge/barricade).
2) All scavengers roll dice to see what they find.
3) GM works out which players are in barricades. Scavengers don't get a say as to how big the barricade is. If there aren't enough spaces, then scavengers get randomly chosen to stay out after any volunteers are removed.
4) Calculate barricade as (total ENG of all barricaders / barricade size) + 1d6 (yes I know I've changed this).
5) GM works out which zombies attack barricades and which hunt for players.
6) Resolve barricade attacks.
7) One by one resolve each zombie/player hunting/hiding action and do combat.

If we add cumulative barricades then we need to add a load of extra maths to this after and before the barricade attacks phase (6). Plus a possible extra phase of basic zombie demolition. I'd rather avoid it. Maybe leave it out for now and add it in later as an additional rule or something? What do you all think?

[Jontom Xire]

Elm11, I just spotted your edit to your first post. Please add new posts to make it easier for me.

Comments:

Too many numbers, too many dice rolls, too much to remember.

Strength gets used twice.

I agree (and have incorporated in all later posts) the idea of highest roller gets to deal damage.

---

I have just updated the first post with rules on health and ranged attacks, based on earlier posts. Suggested adjustments welcomed. You will see I have incorporated the concept of armour. I don't like it as it complicates the game, but on the other hand it adds a necessary element of realism. However armour itself could be removed because 1) You're unlikely to find much armour in the modern day world and 2) you start introducing the idea that some parts of the body are better armoured than others and it all starts becoming hugely complex to track.

I'd like to miss out armour. Comments?

---

I still need to write up melee combat. I think we all have a certain degree of consensus on it. We still need to decide how to convert dice rolls and stats to health levels. I fancy dividing by two.

Bob (STR=5) has a baseball bat giving him a +1 melee combat bonus to both to hit and to damage. Rob Zombie (STR=1) wants braaaaiiinssss and attacks Bob. Bob rolls a 6 and Rob rolls a 1. You can tell how this is going to go, can't you. Bob's total of 11 beat's Rob's total of 2 by 9. Now add damage modifier and that makes a damage total of 10.

Obviously such excellent luck should result in instant death of Rob from a full health state.

What if there was less luck but you were using a katana or a chainsaw? How about if the fight was much more balanced and Bob only beat Rob by 1 point? I'd like to have attacks that deal only 2 or 3 damage not actually changing the health state. The victim gets a bruise or something. Maybe zombies are more resilient to damage. I'm thinking something like divide the damage total by 3 when attacking living people and by 4 when attacking zombies. So in the example above, Rob would only go to Injured rather than dead. How about 2 and 3? Rob would go to Wounded rather than dead.

What happens if Rob got the 6 and Bob the 1? Bob ends up with a total of 7 (including the baseball bat) and Rob ends up with a total of 7 ending in a draw. Rob can never hurt Bob. This seems a little unreasonable unless we say that a 6 always hits (unless your opponent gets one too) in which case Rob can't hurt Bob but can only infect him. Moreover unless Rob gets a 6, Bob is sure to win the fight every time. Is that fair? Bob is much much stronger than Rob and he does have a baseball bat too, so maybe it is.

What do you think?

[Fawkes]

I'll read through and help you work on this when I get my computer back, but it looks like it may be too complicated. Its already a difficult game to narrate.

[Deathslayer7]

The problem I see with this is when you have 20 players with twenty different characters, you're going to have one hell of a mess, esp when try to add in barricades, whether you hit or not, how much damage is dealt, how much you can take, etc..

It's already over-complicated by forum standards if you ask me.

[Fawkes]

On second thought, this doesn't really look viable for Invasion of the Zombies. I think I'll leave this to you and work with Zombies 2 with Dr. Bath.

[Jontom Xire]

I've updated some more sections of the rules above and spoilerised them.

How about "Zombie Rampage" as a title?

Also, we seem to have two points of view about the rules I've suggested so far - either too complicated or not complicated enough. Most suggestions seem to be making the rules more complicated. Most comments are that it is too complicated to run on the forum.

I think I have enough structure in the rules that, once I finish writing them up in post #2 we could start a very small tester game, maybe 5 players and 2 zombies to start with. There's still a few areas I haven't even started on, such as scavenging and deciding what the NPC zombies do, and also I'm thinking not to bother with rules to decide whether scavenging players make it to the barricades or get caught outside.

For scavenging I'm thinking of a results table. Something like:

PER+1d6 Result
1-5 You find nothing. Bad luck.
6 You don't find what you're looking for, but you do find something. Randomly pick a different category and you get a low value item.
7-8 You find a low value item.
9-10 You find a high value item.
11 You find an excellent item.

Then all items are categorised into low value, high value, excellent, as well as by type. e.g. a baseball bat (+1 to hit) is a low value melee weapon. A chainsaw (+2 to damage) is a high value melee weapon, and a katana (+1 to hit, +2 to damage) is an excellent melee weapon.

[Jontom Xire]

It's occurred to me that currently melee combat is too balanced and that the players will not bother with a barricade but simply head out in a mob each night to hunt zombies. They will win easily if they outnumber the zombies.

As such we need to balance the game. What I propose is something along the lines that zombies get a small to hit bonus per zombie or get to roll an extra dice or something but not so much that they will easily kill players. Also that zombies cannot be attacked or harmed if the player is unarmed and that the majority of melee weapons won't harm zombies either.

If anyone is still reading this thread; what do you think? Got any ideas on the mechanics?

[Selrahc]

You could remove the ability to get rid of infections. Which means injured humans are screwed without, perhaps, some rare scavenged items.

Alternatively then I'd make zombies much much harder to kill. Or start with more of them.

Really, I'd go for the idea that zombies are not players. It would remove an entire strata of complexity from the game, and allow you to introduce however many zombies are needed to provide a challenge.

[banthesun]

I'm thinking large numbers of zombies. Instead of having the goal as kill all zombies, you could have it as survive a certain number of days. As an added feature this would mean that the last few days would have a real desperation feel to them, you're not going to beat the zombies, but can you survive against the greatest hordes? But back to the topic at hand; I'd have large numbers of zombies, but only have them form large mobs at night. During the day the players can take out a few undead seperated from the groups, but once the sun goes down they're too active to try and hunt.

[Jontom Xire]

BTS: If you look at the rules post you'll see I've already got surviving as a game end condition - but as a draw.

Selrahc: I always planned to have several NPC zombies - I just wanted to make it so players could still enjoy the game once they got zombified. I don't think that really adds complexity.

I don't think I'll remove the ability to cure infections, but I will make it harder than healing physical damage. If you look in the rules post at the medical items and the rules for scavenging you will see that it's really really hard to get items that will reliably cure infection anyway (I'm going to reduce the modifiers as well). And I'll make it so you have to have a medical item to do any healing.

Also If you look at the rules post you'll see I've made it so that when healing or being healed (or healing yourself) you cannot scavenge or barricade. I think that will balance it so that if players are infected and don't heal then they turn into zombies, but if they do heal then the barricades are not strong enough and they end up being killed by zombies and becoming a zombie anyway!

I agree that we need more zombies. Zombie films always have quite a lot of zombies even at the start. But even so we don't want players mobbing up and picking off lone zombies too easily until there are none left. I also realise that there is a flaw in the "cannot damage zombies" thing. I think I'll keep it to prevent players mobbing up and hunting down zombies too easily, but basically if there are more players than zombies then they don't need barricades because they can always prevent themselves being hit.

Maybe the solution to that is to make it so that there is a chance of being infected whenever you are attacked, even if you don't get hit. Hence if 20 players stand in the open and easily defend themselves against a mere 5 zombies, there is a chance that 5 of them will get infected. Hence you need barricades to prevent getting attacked in the first place.

[Jontom Xire]

Ok, rules are almost finished. Just need to finish the "hunt and seek" section. I think it's obvious how it finishes.

I'd like lots of comments on the rules as they stand, but if you don't like something, please suggest an alternative instead of just criticising.

I'd like to start a small tester game, in this thread, on Monday. 5 to 10 players max. If you want to play, post your character name and stats in this thread. Rules may change during the course of the game, and there probably won't be much/any flavour text.

Thanks for all your comments. Most of them have been really helpful and I hope you can see that they've been incorporated in some form or other in the finished current rules.

[Deathslayer7]

I'm interested in this. Let's see how it goes.

Use the same character from the on-going Zombie. :smallbiggrin:

Jon The Ace-Zombie Killer. Having practiced experience before hand, he knows that the best way to get rid of an zombie infestation is to kill them before they can kill you.

RNG: 4
STR: 4
ENG: 1
PER: 5
STE: 5
MED: 1

[The Bookworm]

Garth the Librarian
RNG: 3
STR: 1
ENG: 4
PER: 4
STE: 4
MED: 4

[Trixie]

Ok, rules are almost finished. Just need to finish the "hunt and seek" section. I think it's obvious how it finishes.

I'd like lots of comments on the rules as they stand, but if you don't like something, please suggest an alternative instead of just criticising.

Hmmm. Okay, here are a few tips (from IMHO) you might want:

1) A few too many stats, mix of stats with skills. For some reason, having strength, stealth and engineering in the same place bugs me. As it is, it might be good for small games, but over 20+ players you need to keep it as simple as possible. Suggestion:

4 stats: Strenght, Agility, Constitution, Intellekt. In short, SICK (yes, I'm aware that English spells 'intelekt' differently :smallannoyed: ). Each stat ranges from 2 to 5 (13 divided between four stats - yeah, players are unlucky considering they're in the midst of the zombie attack).

Each has two uses: STR (melee combat, carrying capacity) AGL (ranged combat, stealth) CON (HPs, disease resistance) INT (healing, barricading). To keep the flavor of different people each player can choose two 'skills', representing areas in which he excels (+1 to roll while using these) - for example, melee combat & stealth, or healing & disease resistance.

2) Health - 2xCON. Damage is subtracted from that. If health falls below CON, player takes -1 to all stats. When HP falls to 0, player takes -2 to all stats, is prone and dies at the end of the round unless stabilized. This of course applies to healing and disease checks.

Disease resistance - each time player is damaged by zombie, the damage taken+d6 is rolled vs CON+d6. Each time player loses this check one disease mark (DM) is added. Players turn into zombies if:
A) number of DMs > CON, and,
B) they fail to roll more than number of DMs on a d6 (last chance will save, rolled on the end of every turn). This roll is kept secret.

3) Phases within turn: Activation, Seek, Battle, Repair.

Activation: everyone heals 1 HP, zombies heal 2 HP, new zombies spawn.

Seek: Scavenging party. If someone failed their disease check and wandered out, they turn into a zombie while outside. Everyone outside can either scavenge or guard (more in battle section).

Battle: attack of zombies. Zombies that haven't took part in the outside battle (note - narrator has to randomly assign zombies to both battles) attack the 'fort'. If someone failed their disease check and remained, they turn into zombie now, and attack from within a barricade.

Repair: healing, repairs to damaged barricade, last chance to stop zombification.

3) Battles - again, simple. While scavenging: [long range phase] people that are guarding get one extra action. They can shoot (if equipped with long range weaponry) or warn comrades. Then comes [short range] - everyone with ranged weapons fire. Then melee attacks are resolved simultaneously. At this time, people can break contact with the zombies, taking wounded with themselves (one per 3 STR points), or press attack. Zombies also can run, if the battle goes badly, but as they are slower they get one last long ranged phase against them. Wounded left behind are instantly zombified.

Note - to make the game more balanced, maybe only warned people can fight? Or maybe each killed zombie (blood spraying, etc) can give one disease mark to killer (except in long range), to disencourage munchkin killing sprees with a katana?

Fights are resolved simply, mostly as you proposed - STR+d6 vs STR+d6, or DEX+d6 vs DEX+d6 - winner deals damage equal to difference. Note that makes existence of weapons with bonus to damage or to hit only possible. If human loses, disease check also applies. In general, stat + d6 vs opposing stat + d6, with as low number of modifiers should always apply, without crosschecking, to make it consistent.

But please, not katanas, and especially not with huge to hit bonuses. Make weapons unique in other ways - scoped rifle gives a +1 shot in long ranged phase, -1 in short range, chainsaw adds 3 to damage (if you manage to hit, that is), uzi lets you attack one zombie, or two at -1 to hit.

Barricade battle is similar, but this time everyone has a chance to shot at long range, and the zombies have to force through a barricade. Unless they are already inside, heh heh.

4) Zombies - to solve problem of them being not a big threat - spawn a few of weak ones each turn. They come from outside, or something. To make players shine - their INT is always 1, which means zombie players can redistribute freed points to other stats. Make them tough - free +1 to CON, +1 to damage. Let the zombified players be 'sort of' in command - as the fresh zombies they have better stats than others and they can sway the NPC ones to battles they want to fight.

There should be many of them, if weak, more than players, to not make the PCs wipe the whole zombie population out.

5) Healing - let's say, INT + d6 vs damage dealt = difference healed. Still, to not make this too tough, a few points, perhaps equal to equipment bonus, should be healed always. Similarly, a check against disease might heal one point, or two in case of excellent equipment or huge success.

Huh. I wonder if anyone will read this. Tl;dr - a list of changes that might streamline a few part, and a few general comments.

[The Bookworm]

I read it. It's a whole lot simpler.

[Fawkes]

I'd be willing to help test, especially if you use some of Trixie's rewrite. I do think the gae still seems geared more toward smaller numbers.

[Jontom Xire]

Hmmm. Okay, here are a few tips (from IMHO) you might want:

1) A few too many stats, mix of stats with skills. For some reason, having strength, stealth and engineering in the same place bugs me. As it is, it might be good for small games, but over 20+ players you need to keep it as simple as possible. Suggestion:

4 stats: Strenght, Agility, Constitution, Intellekt. In short, SICK (yes, I'm aware that English spells 'intelekt' differently :smallannoyed: ). Each stat ranges from 2 to 5 (13 divided between four stats - yeah, players are unlucky considering they're in the midst of the zombie attack).

Each has two uses: STR (melee combat, carrying capacity) AGL (ranged combat, stealth) CON (HPs, disease resistance) INT (healing, barricading). To keep the flavor of different people each player can choose two 'skills', representing areas in which he excels (+1 to roll while using these) - for example, melee combat & stealth, or healing & disease resistance.

I like it, but:

1) STR shouldn't affect carrying capacity. I don't want long inventory lists or whatever. I don't want to have to check against Str every time a character finds an item - it's too complicated.
2) I don't like the idea of HPs. Again, it's a bit too complicated. Too much to keep track of as you need to remember max HPs as well as current.
3) Skills are ok. More to remember, more complexity, but not too bad.

I quite liked mine, but it was more numbers, this is a little simpler.


2) Health - 2xCON. Damage is subtracted from that. If health falls below CON, player takes -1 to all stats. When HP falls to 0, player takes -2 to all stats, is prone and dies at the end of the round unless stabilized. This of course applies to healing and disease checks.


Ugh - more numbers to keep track of, more complexity. I definitely prefer the health states above where you get -1, -2, -3 or dead.


Disease resistance - each time player is damaged by zombie, the damage taken+d6 is rolled vs CON+d6. Each time player loses this check one disease mark (DM) is added. Players turn into zombies if:
A) number of DMs > CON, and,
B) they fail to roll more than number of DMs on a d6 (last chance will save, rolled on the end of every turn). This roll is kept secret.


I think disease can be applied every time a player comes in contact with a zombie. It is both more realistic and solves the problem of munchkin killing sprees as you put it. But yes, making the disease attack be versus CON is much better than what I have atm.

I'm not sure about DMs, but I'll try to find a way to work CON into the "not turning into a zombie when infected" process too.


3) Phases within turn: Activation, Seek, Battle, Repair.

Activation: everyone heals 1 HP, zombies heal 2 HP, new zombies spawn.

Seek: Scavenging party. If someone failed their disease check and wandered out, they turn into a zombie while outside. Everyone outside can either scavenge or guard (more in battle section).

Battle: attack of zombies. Zombies that haven't took part in the outside battle (note - narrator has to randomly assign zombies to both battles) attack the 'fort'. If someone failed their disease check and remained, they turn into zombie now, and attack from within a barricade.

Repair: healing, repairs to damaged barricade, last chance to stop zombification.


Really not sure about this. Yes it's simpler, but I really don't like the idea of cumulative barricades. It's just more numbers to remember.

I also like the current idea of day and night phase. There's no sense of time in this system.


3) Battles - again, simple. While scavenging: [long range phase] people that are guarding get one extra action. They can shoot (if equipped with long range weaponry) or warn comrades. Then comes [short range] - everyone with ranged weapons fire. Then melee attacks are resolved simultaneously. At this time, people can break contact with the zombies, taking wounded with themselves (one per 3 STR points), or press attack. Zombies also can run, if the battle goes badly, but as they are slower they get one last long ranged phase against them. Wounded left behind are instantly zombified.


Umm, this prevents the idea in the current WW game of hunting parties. I love the idea of survivors wandering into the night with a long range weapon, holing up on some roof top, and sniping any zombies they see, or even stalking a specific zombie.

Melee attacks are resolved simultaneously? You mean if you have 20 zombies and 20 players then we end up with 20 individual battles to resolve? Ugh, no way. The current "mob" system may seem a little complex, but I think it'll resolve itself nicely in actual game play.

Zombies run? Huh? Zombies NEVER run away.


Note - to make the game more balanced, maybe only warned people can fight? Or maybe each killed zombie (blood spraying, etc) can give one disease mark to killer (except in long range), to disencourage munchkin killing sprees with a katana?

Fights are resolved simply, mostly as you proposed - STR+d6 vs STR+d6, or DEX+d6 vs DEX+d6 - winner deals damage equal to difference. Note that makes existence of weapons with bonus to damage or to hit only possible. If human loses, disease check also applies. In general, stat + d6 vs opposing stat + d6, with as low number of modifiers should always apply, without crosschecking, to make it consistent.



But please, not katanas, and especially not with huge to hit bonuses. Make weapons unique in other ways - scoped rifle gives a +1 shot in long ranged phase, -1 in short range, chainsaw adds 3 to damage (if you manage to hit, that is), uzi lets you attack one zombie, or two at -1 to hit.


Yes, I like this. To be honest when doing the Inventory section I was a bit tired and trying to do it in a hurry as I was at work. I just wanted to get the rules finished. I'll add your suggestions, but I'd like more on the other equipment, please.

And the katana stays. Katanas are cool! :smallcool: especially against zombies. And the huge damage bonus is because if you shoot a zombie it gets a small hole in it. Big wows. Cut it's head off and it can't see where it is going. Cut it's legs off and it can't go anywhere fast. Cut it's arms off and it can't attack very easily. Katanas are much more effective than guns against a zombie (except perhaps shotguns).


Barricade battle is similar, but this time everyone has a chance to shot at long range, and the zombies have to force through a barricade. Unless they are already inside, heh heh.


Already got this or didn't you notice ;)


4) Zombies - to solve problem of them being not a big threat - spawn a few of weak ones each turn. They come from outside, or something. To make players shine - their INT is always 1, which means zombie players can redistribute freed points to other stats. Make them tough - free +1 to CON, +1 to damage. Let the zombified players be 'sort of' in command - as the fresh zombies they have better stats than others and they can sway the NPC ones to battles they want to fight.

There should be many of them, if weak, more than players, to not make the PCs wipe the whole zombie population out.


Most of the ex-players will be weak zombies with the rules I came up with, due to damage before death.

I was thinking of a system of a few alpha zombies and a bunch of weaker ones, and maybe sort of virtual zombies.

I also thought about the stat redistribution, but couldn't think of a fair way to do it. Zombies should be weaker than people. I think they keep the INT, but it's an animal cunning sort of stat rather than a rational being kind of stat. It still helps them force their way through barricades better sort of thing, but not in a "pull out a calculator and calculate how big a lever I need" sort of way.


5) Healing - let's say, INT + d6 vs damage dealt = difference healed. Still, to not make this too tough, a few points, perhaps equal to equipment bonus, should be healed always. Similarly, a check against disease might heal one point, or two in case of excellent equipment or huge success.

The current system should be balanced like this. I don't like the idea of using damage dealt as the opposing force though. Makes small wounds too easy to heal and big ones too difficult.


Huh. I wonder if anyone will read this. Tl;dr - a list of changes that might streamline a few part, and a few general comments.

My comments have been added inside the quotes (Duh!) But I'm too lazy to change them and have sopent FAR too long doing this post while at work. Almost an hour in fact. I hate spending too much time on this forum in one lump at work and now feel really guilty.

I'll try to find time to rewrite the rules tonight at home and then ask for more comments.

[Jontom Xire]

I just figured a flaw with Trixie's stat proposal - no stat for scavenging, hiding, or seeking.

I like the idea of survivors hiding from zombies at night. In the end game it may be all that keeps the last survivor alive night after night.

What do you all think?

Still need to write up the adjusted rules. Sorry, had no time last night.

[Jontom Xire]

Ok, I've adjusted the rules to use a slightly modified version of Trixie's idea.

CON is currently underused. I don't want to use it for hit points. I am thinking of using it for 1 or both of the following:

1) When being healed, the difficulty of being healed is 12-patient's CON stat.
2) When being damaged, either divide by or subtract the target's CON rather than divide by 2 for survivors and 3 for zombies. However this might make some targets unkillable in combat.

Any comments? Any other ideas?

Sorry for the long delay - work is a bit busy atm.

[Jontom Xire]

Modified inventory items a bit.

There may be fresh zombies spawned as per Trixie's idea. Otherwise I think I've incorporated all of Trixie's ideas that I think will work without just throwing everything away and starting again.

Can I have a quick headcount of who likes the modified rules enough to have a go? I think 4 players minimum, 10 maximum, and maybe 2 zombies to start with.

I'm also thinking of making the dormant infection less dormant so that it too can cause you to get more infected as per the other two infection levels.

[Deathslayer7]

I like it. A lot. I'll rework the character, but at a later time.

also: 1-5: You find nothing. Bad luck.
6: You don't find what you're looking for, but you do find something. Randomly pick a different category and you get a low value item.
7-8: You find a low value item.
9-10: You find a high value item.
11+: You find an excellent item.

Next randomly select from all items of the type and quality found to find the exact item found.

I think you should make it 1-4 find nothing and 5-6 find something else. Cause that means people with a 4 in scavenging still have a chance to find something useful, and not just have to have a 5 to go scavenge stuff.

Also, you need more items then what you have at the moment. I can help with that as well, but again at a later time. Other then that, I'm definitely in.

[Wizibirb]

I would love to try this out, so sign me up please.


Garrick the Hunter,

STR:2
AG:5
CON:3
INT:3


EDIT
A quick question that may make life needlessly complicated but one I wish to ask regardless.... Will there be a map, so we can see where good buildings to defend would be? Or to see what parts of town are more infected... ie if we know that at one location was overrun with zombies, we can stay away from there.

[Deathslayer7]

Jon

STRength: Affects melee combat and barricade building.
AGiLity: Affects ranged combat and stealthiness (hiding, sneaking).
CONstitution: Affects disease resistance (and TBD).
INTelligence: Affects healing and searching/scavenging.

STR: 2
AGL: 4
CON: 2
INT: 5

[Deathslayer7]

Some more thoughts.

People are able to hunt in mobs, I think the same should be applied to scavenging. Two or more people can scavenge for the same item to have an increased chance of finding that item. They get a +1 modifier to find it for every extra person they have, but only 1 person actually gets the item (randomly determined). That way, it gives more incentive for people to scavenge together.

Ex: Billy and Bob decide to search together for a ranged weapon. Billy has a 3 in INT while Bob only has 2. Instead of getting two low value items, they try to find a good item.

They roll a d6 and come up with a 5. Adding that with Billy's INT of 3 and the +1 modifier from Bob, their total is 9. Thus they get a high value item instead of nothing/a low level item.

edit: question. Can you use a ranged weapon in combat with a zombie that is attacking you? I mean this is after you shoot it once and it intiates melee combat.

edit2: and on the issue of whether or not barricades should be cumalitive, I believe that any items used on barricades remain there, but every time you roll to add your STR to the value, that disspears by the next day. Makes sense since if you cement a safehouse, the cement will last till attacked by zombies. But you also need a cap too on how much you can barricade a building. Larger buildings have a higher cap, but an easier way in, etc. Smaller the opposite.

[Wizibirb]

If we are limited to one weapon for each category, when we scavenge for weapons in that particular class do we find ammo or other weapons...
or do we specify we are trying to find ammo
ie
Say Joe has a shotgun and wants more ammo does he scavenge for ammo... or does he hope that a scavenge for ranged weapons turns up ammo?


and a Katana did you play Dead Rising? :D

also I have some items suggestions
Magnum, ranged weapon. -1 to hit modifier and +3 to damage modifier. Excellent item.
m16, ranged weapon. Can shoot up to two zombies without penalty. Excellent item.
and if you have a katana why not have an
AXE! Melee weapon, +1 to damage modifier. Excellent weapon.

Shouldn't a Shotgun have a plus damage modifier?

Also I disagree with having the lower tier weapons having no damage to zombies, it should be a damage reduction. If you hit someone with a baseball bat in the right place you can do some serious damage.

edit: CHECK THIS OUT! (http://blog.garrickanson.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/08/preparedness.jpg) Can i start out with this???

[Jontom Xire]

Answers and comments on previous posts:

Even with a 1 in scavenge, if you roll a 6 you get a low value item of the type you wanted. So I don't quite understand your point about the scavenge result table.

Yes I need more items and all ideas are very much appreciated.

No map. There is sort of an implicit map, but having an actual map is more work for the narrator and actually limits the game.

Mob scavenging: Absolutely and totally agree, great idea.

Ranged weapons in combat: No. You get to fire it before melee combat if it is a short range weapon. Not during. Too complicated. I'm not sure about firing long range weapons from behind a barricade, but figure that the barricade would reduce your field of fire too much for a long range weapon to be effective. Maybe I need to clarify the rules on this.

Cumulative barricades: I like the idea of a cap. I also like the idea of some of the effort from the previous day (the 1d6 roll for example) being lost. However for the first game we won't be doing cumulative barricades. I will add the ideas to the optional rules bit.

Scavenge for weapons/ammo: I need to clarify this. My thoughts are along the lines that a piece of ammo is an item of it's own but comes under the general class of ranged weapons, but clearly there is quite a lot of variation in types of ammo. You can't scavenge for ammo separately. So if you already have a weapon you can't specify to scavenge for ammo. Also, if you are holding a rifle and you find shotgun ammo then you either throw it or the rifle away. I may make it so you can carry a reload (ranged weapon or building item such as nails) as a separate item type so that if you find shotgun shells while carrying a rifle and spare rifle ammo, you have to throw one of the ammo types away. However if you have no spare rifle ammo you can keep the shotgun shells to give to someone with a shotgun.

Item ideas: I don't want to have too many excellent weapons. I'd rather have more crummy items. However I'll take your ideas on board. No M16s though. What are the chances of finding an M16 lying around, even in America? You might find some guy's rifle with a telescopic sight (aka sniper rifle) if he's a keen hunter. Similarly shotguns and rifles are used for hunting even in the UK. A handgun of some sort is also likely in the US although less in Europe. M16 or other assault rifle? Not a hope. Even if it wasn't game breaking.

[Opeth_Freak]

I'm in for Playtesting!

Mike:

Str: 2
Agl: 3
Con: 3
Int: 5

[Aemoh]

I'll join ya guys for the playtest.

Bob the Builder (What? :smalltongue: )
STR: 5
AGL: 2
CON: 4
INT: 2

Skill: Barricading

[Opeth_Freak]

Skill - Scavenging.

[Deathslayer7]

Jon Skill: AGL (Hiding from Zombies :P)

[Fawkes]

Ted
STR: 5
AGI: 2
CON: 4
INT: 2
Skill: Melee Combat

Now if Sanity picks Shooting, and someone else joins a healer, we'll be set!

[Deathslayer7]

nvm :smalltongue:

[Wizibirb]

Garrick skill shooting :smallbiggrin:

more ideas for items

Also how about another catgeory of items

Misc
Ammo (could go here. If it does go here, it gives people an incentive to scavenge in this category.)
Alcohol +2 temporary to any single skill -1 to intell, for one day. One use only. Low value item
Cigar +1 to range attack. Low value item
"Fake" Death pills, prevents human players from harming you during the night it is used, does not work against zombies. 2 uses. High value item
bicycle allows you to run away from harm for one night. Does not work against long ranged weapons. 1 use. High value item.
cyanide capsule automatically taken right before death. Prevents you from turning into a zombie with an infection level of dormant. Excellent Item. One use only.
I dont know if the last one is to game breaking or not.

other items
Ranged
beretta (this is the standered issue police sidearm): can damge zombies low value item
Magnum, ranged weapon. -1 to hit and +3 to damage. Excellent item. (please)
Melee
Cleaver or Butcher knife, can damage zombies. Low value item.
Blow torch, +1 to damge. 2 uses. High value item.

I would also consider adding a medium value category,
1-5 None
6-7 low
8-9 medium
10 high
11+ excellent

This would also require a reworking of the items we have thus far.

[Jontom Xire]

I love the item ideas, Sanity, particularly the cigar, but I'm not sure that smoking a cigar actually improves one's aim :smallbiggrin:

Some of those will definitely make it in.

As to the medium value items, I think that gives us too many categories and too much complexity. Plus we'd need a lot more items to fill them.

Anyway...

[Jontom Xire]

Playtest game starts!

The scene: a small town deep in the country somewhere. Five people, on the run from the hordes of zombies come across a ghost town, all the population fled. A quick search reveals no people whatsoever. No zombies either. The terrain in all directions is flat and featureless and barren. No zombies would cross that looking for fresh food. It looks like the perfect place to hole up, regroup, survive.

But that night scraping, lurching sounds are heard. Faint moans, vague voices calling out, "Braaaiiiiiinnnnsss". A quick careful check reveals that there are 4 zombies in this town after all. Lying quiet during the day the five survivors never saw them.

After a quick consultation a decision is reached. Even with the zombies this town seems the best place to survive. Better than the big towns and cities with their hordes of zombies. Better than the suburbs and other heavily urbanised areas where zombies roam from one town to the next. All you have to do is kill off the zombies. Maybe just survive until more survivors turn up, giving you a better chance of destroying all zombies.

Players:

Sanity702=Garrick the Hunter
---------
STR:2
AG:5
CON:3
INT:3
Skill: Shooting

Deathslayer7=Jon
------------
STR: 2
AGL: 4
CON: 2
INT: 5
Skill: Stealth

Opeth_Freak=Mike
-----------
Str: 2
Agl: 3
Con: 3
Int: 5
Skill: Scavenging

Aemoh=Bob the Builder
------
STR: 5
AGL: 2
CON: 4
INT: 2
Skill: Barricading

Mechafox=Ted
---------
STR: 5
AGI: 2
CON: 4
INT: 2
Skill: Melee Combat

----------

Day actions, please (posted in thread of course):

* Scavenge for useful items
* Fortify a barricade
* Heal
* Be healed
* Slope around the place being lazy

[Aemoh]

Bob the Builder takes a good look at the "town", the place in shambles. Scratching his chin, he looks back to the others and says "Can we fix it?"

...

Ok, first and only time. I have no idea what Bob the Builder is like, and I got his phrase from Wikipedia. Anyways...

Fortify the Barricade (duh :smalltongue: )

I assume for 5 people, unless someones planning on hunting zombies or whatever tonight.

EDIT: Make that just for one person, little ol me.

[Jontom Xire]

Only people building barricades get a vote technically, but there's no reason why you can't decide together and allow yourself to be swayed by those who are not barricading.

For ease of game play, I think I'll let you decide how big a building you picked towards day end, and just pretend that you all decided before pickign a building to barricade.

Don't forget that 4 people barricading a 5 person building makes a fairly weak barricade. In this way it's meant to be similar to the WW game. I.e. people barricading will tend to be selfish or their efforts are, in effect, wasted. Once you get some construction items that can change.

[Opeth_Freak]

Urban Jungle was always the dearest friend of Mike. He knew every part of the city, and some of the sewers too. When the situation became desperate, Mike knew he had to use all his skills to survive. Firstly - find a weapon. And so, Mike went to the place, that once was a weapon shop

((Scavenge for a Weapon))

[Fawkes]

Ted grumbles in a deep, raspy voice. "If we strike fast, maybe we can take 'em out quick-like. I'm gonna see if I can find something to hit 'em with."

Scavenge for weapons

[Deathslayer7]

About time people have some common sense around here! Jon yells out throwing his hands above him in a prayer. I swear the other ones were too stupid to make it out alive.

He'll gladly chat with Ted about the best way to kill a zombie.

Scavenge for armnaments

[Jontom Xire]

Just waiting for Sanity now.

I'd like to point out that a 5 man barricade built by 1 person, even if he does have a stat of 5 and a +1 bonus, is only going to give a protection of 1+1d6 against the zombies STR+1d6. In other words the zombies are almost guaranteed to break in.

I suggest you make the barricade just big enough for one person. I do want to know how big it will be before I hand out scavenge results (which I will do in thread for convenience).

[Wizibirb]

sorry i was sleeping :)

Garrick looked around everyone had made a very interesting point, it would be the best to scavenge for a weapon

[Wizibirb]

I love the item ideas, Sanity, particularly the cigar, but I'm not sure that smoking a cigar actually improves one's aim :smallbiggrin:


Obviously you have never played any Metal Gear game. :smalltongue:

EDIT:
I know its a little late for a question but eh,
Would it not make more sense to be able to carry two of each item if one of them was a lox value item.
IE
Bob Has a shotgun and finds a Beretta he is able to keep both of them because the Beretta is a low value item... so basically you would be allowed to have a pistol and a higher value item.
comments?

[Aemoh]

Just waiting for Sanity now.

I'd like to point out that a 5 man barricade built by 1 person, even if he does have a stat of 5 and a +1 bonus, is only going to give a protection of 1+1d6 against the zombies STR+1d6. In other words the zombies are almost guaranteed to break in.

I suggest you make the barricade just big enough for one person. I do want to know how big it will be before I hand out scavenge results (which I will do in thread for convenience).

Yeah, was thinking of that today. Suppose it's best just wall myself up.

Fortifying a barricade for one.

[Jontom Xire]

As evening rolls around the scavengers look at what they found that day. Despite all scavenging for weapons, they didn't all find them:

Garrick the Hunter: A bag of nails.
Jon: 1 shotgun shell
Mike: Blowtorch
Ted: Beretta (ammo=1)

Strange that, given that Ted is the worst scavenger, he got the best result.

Meanwhile Bob set about building a barricade (value 9). Bob hid in his barricade. The others set out to survive the night in town.

----

Ok, I need to know which of you guys are hiding, if you're hiding individually or as a mob, or if you want to form a mobile mob to go hunt some zombies.

If you like you can swap items before night begins - I.e. give Bob the nails, etc. etc.

[Opeth_Freak]

"Hey Ted wanna trade? Blowtorch seems to more fitting for you and your... apparition..."

[Fawkes]

Ted flips the Beretta, catching it by the barrel and extending the grip to Mike. "Here ya go."

[Jontom Xire]

Trade noted. I still need night actions for all but Aemoh who is safely holed up in his barricade.

Do you:

1) Hide somewhere
2) Hide somewhere with some buddies in case the zombies do come calling (if so who and do they agree to hide with you)
3) Go hunt some zombies (who with and do they agree to come with you)

[Opeth_Freak]

I'm not feeling good enough for a hunt with one round. I'll hide, and if someone wants to hide with me, your welcome (possibly with Jon, as he's good in sneaking and staying hidden).

[Deathslayer7]

Jon will just hide by himself. And I'm asleep over here Jontom when you do updates. :smalltongue:

[Wizibirb]

Garrick grumbled disheartened. Lugging around the worthless sack of nails. He found Bob and said Here thought you might appreciate these.
After dropping off the Nails and noticing no room in the barricade, Garrick hides alone.

I am also asleep when you do updates. Sorry mine are so much later than everyone else.


Mike: Blowtorch
Ted: Beretta (ammo=1)
Strange that, given that Ted is the worst scavenger, he got the best result.

I do believe a blow torch is a tad better than a Beretta

[Fawkes]

Ted will hide with Mike, if that's alright.

"I'll come with ya. I'm a big guy, though. I'm not used to hidin' from problems. And if somethin' goes down, I'd like someone to have my back."

[Opeth_Freak]

Mike smiles a little.

"Sure thing, Teddy Bear... It's good to have a company. :smallamused:"

[Fawkes]

"Don't call me that."

[Deathslayer7]

rule question on scavenging: wouldn't it be better to add the INT of all characters scavenging as a group rather then +1 per person + the highest person's INT.

Secondly, the example on scavenging in a group makes no sense, and contradicts what is said.

[Jontom Xire]

In what way does it make no sense? How does it contradict what is said. If you give me a few details (or even alternative text) I'd love to correct it.

[Deathslayer7]

Survivors may scavenge in teams. Use the INT stat of the team member with the highest value and add +1 for each additional team member scavenging. Only one item will be found and it will go to a random team member. If they are unable to carry it without dropping another item they may give it, or the other item, to another team member.

Example:

Anna (INT=1) and Charles (INT=2) decide that they need to work as a team. To further increase their chances they will take whatever they find. They roll 1d6 and get a 2. That makes a total of 6.

That does not make sense. How did they get a 6?

[Jontom Xire]

Ok, To give the game a bit more character, I would like to introduce: Shem and Japhet. Before they became zombies, Shem and Japhet were brothers. As close as anything, they stuck together at all times. Shem was the brains while Japhet was the muscle. Now, even after death, they still stick together.

Also I will be assigning zombie night actions randomly - I think it would get boring if the zombies always did the same thing every night.


Player Character Action Stat Dice roll Result
Sanity702 Garrick the Hunter Hide 5 3 8
Deathslayer7 Jon Hide 5/2 5/2,1,3 10/4,3,5
Opeth_Freak Mike Hide+Ted 2 - 1 1 2
Aemoh Bob the Builder Hide in barricade 9
Mechafox Ted Hide+Mike 2 - 1 1 2

Zombie Shem Search streets 5 + 1/7 6/6,4,3 12/13,11,10

Zombie Japhet Search streets 5 + 1/7 6/6,4,3 12/13,11,10

Zombie Frank Sneak into barricade 3/4 5/2 8/6
Zombie Ernie Attack barricade 3 4 7

I need to learn to do tables.


---------

Shem and Japhet were wandering the streets when they spotted Jon peeking out of a window. How they missed seeing Mike and Ted who were standing in a side alley whispering to each other - very loudly (honestly, the two characters with the lowest AGL stat decide to hide together?) was amazing.

Bursting through the door they attacked. With one blow Jon was history - or not quite. Moving in an ungainly lurching fashion he rose from the floor as an undead zombie and followed the other two into the night.


Str 2 against 2 zombies. They had highish rolls, Jon had lowish rolls, he died in the first round of melee combat.
Jon's stats are reduced by damage but increased by zombieism and are now 1, 1, 1, 2.

Bad luck. If the zombies had rolled 4 or lower you would have been safe and someone else would have died.

I think in future I'll make the random roll distributed such that people with a lower hide roll are more likely to be found.



Mean while the erstwhile Frank lumbered around Bob's barricade looking for an unprotected entrance. He didn't find one. And Ernie beat his sludgy fists futilely on the outside of the barricade. Looks like Bob did fix it!

[Opeth_Freak]

Hey, my AGL is 3, not two :smallmad: It's not the lowest, it's average. Also Bob the Builder also has lower AGL than me.

[Jontom Xire]

Umm, did I mention I was waiting for day actions?

Updates may be slow (or non-existant) over the weekend.

And Aemoh was in the barricades. Perhaps I should have said the two lowest AGL stats of all the people hiding.

Still actually that kinda makes sense. You're more likely to be found, so grouping up for mutual defence is a good idea. Maybe if Jon HAD hidden with you you would have been able to fight off the zombies and he would have lived.

[Fawkes]

Besides, doesn't hiding go with the lowest AGL score of the group?

Edit: Ninja'd. Yeah, that was why I wanted to hide as a group. I thought Jon would be able to hide fine by himself, though.

[Wizibirb]

wow.... That sucked.

Garrick saw Jon's horrible death, followed by quick reanimation. He shuddered at the thought of how quickly they had torn through his poor body.
With a quick glance around he knew now more than ever he needed a weapon to defend himself with.
Scavenge weapons


Although I wonder would it be beneficial to scavenge in a group of two?
If someone would be willing to I will scavenge with them in a group of two.

[Opeth_Freak]

"Say Teddy... urm, Ted, that blowtorch is enough, or should we find something more useful? I think, that 'Betty' you gave me could use some more ammo, I think..."

Search for weapons

[Fawkes]

"Actually, I think I'm gonna help Bob with the barricade. Hopefully we can fit more people inside it."

Fortify

[Wizibirb]

Looks like I will be scavenging alone then.

[Opeth_Freak]

"See you later then... Try not to die tonight!"

Mike smiled and went into the city again.

[Wizibirb]

Yea you to... He watched Mike walk off into the city. Then gathering everything he needed he headed out in a different direction praying for something more useful than that worthless bag of nails he had found yesterday.

[Deathslayer7]

wow. just wow. Can you explain the dice rolls though?

Also with only 5 people here, I do find the fact that killing a person night 1 in a such a low level game is kind of crappy. In a more populated game it would work though.

Also i never got a reply for my earlier question.

and the fact that i have 4 in AGL +skill would make one think that they would be safe <.<

[Deathslayer7]

{table=head]Player|Character|Action|Stat|Dice Roll|Total
Sanity702|Garrick the Hunter|Hide|5|3|8
Deathslayer7|Jon|Hide|5/2 5/2|1,3 10|4,3,5
Opeth_Freak|Mike|Hide+Ted|2-1|1|2
Aemoh|Bob the Builder|Hide in barricade|6|3|9
Mechafox|Ted|Hide+Mike|2-1|1|2
[/table]

heres a convient table if you need it. Not sure if the rolls and such were right or not, espcially for me.

[Fawkes]

Yeah, we've got some definite balance issues here. The game's too complex to run with more than, say, 10 players. You can't really be killing people off left and right with those numbers. Plus, it's day 2 and we're already outnumbered? Lame.

[Aemoh]

Bob was glad to have company. While he made some progress on the town by himself, another pair of hands was always good.

Fortify the Barricade

For the two of us. (Though it'd seem I'd be better off barricading a building by myself again. Hopefully the 1 point difference won't kill me... :smalltongue: )

[Fawkes]

Wait, how does group barricading work?

Edit: So, is there actually any benefit to barricading together? It looks like my simple involvement with the project is going to make the barricade worse. That can't be right.

[Wizibirb]

If it is ok with you Jontom Xire, Deathslayer and I are making some modifications to the game. Using your main concept, but changing some things. With your permission we would like to play test it in another thread.

So would this be ok with you?

Thank you

[Aemoh]

From the rules, it'd basically seem that way.

6(me) + 5(you) = 11
11 / 2(Number of people) = 5.5(Assuming we round down, that's 5).
Which is one less than I'd get on my own, obviously. If we round up, then it's same. It'd also appear we only roll 1d6 once for the barricade.

Gets worse the more people we barricade for. Just to show, if the other two barricade as well:

6 + 5 + 2 + 2 = 15
15 / 4 = 3.75 (3 or 4, depending on rounding).

Which would still be better for those two, since they only have Str 2, but worse for us. *shrugs*

[Fawkes]

Well, that kind of sucks.

[Jontom Xire]

Survivors may scavenge in teams. Use the INT stat of the team member with the highest value and add +1 for each additional team member scavenging. Only one item will be found and it will go to a random team member. If they are unable to carry it without dropping another item they may give it, or the other item, to another team member.

Example:

Anna (INT=1) and Charles (INT=2) decide that they need to work as a team. To further increase their chances they will take whatever they find. They roll 1d6 and get a 2. That makes a total of 6.
That does not make sense. How did they get a 6?

Ok, take the highest INT value = 2
Add +1 for each additional searcher = 3
+1 for not specifying a specific type = 4
+1d6 (2) = 6


wow. just wow. Can you explain the dice rolls though?

Also with only 5 people here, I do find the fact that killing a person night 1 in a such a low level game is kind of crappy. In a more populated game it would work though.

Also i never got a reply for my earlier question.

and the fact that i have 4 in AGL +skill would make one think that they would be safe <.<

Yeah, in retrospect, teaming up zombies is a bit too powerful. It won't happen again and I'm sorry it happened to you. But that's what playtest games are for. I'll also do a distributed random result as well. E.g. if one group of hiders gets only 2 as a result and another gets 6, and the searcher gets 8 then the first lot have 6 chances of being found and the second only 2, giving a 0.75 chance and a 0.25 chance respectively. If you see what I mean. So even if the zombie searcher is a crack hot searcher and could find anyone (as happened) better hiders still have a better chance of surviving.

The dice rolls were as follows:

{table=head]Player|Character|Action|Stat|Dice Roll|Total
Sanity702|Garrick the Hunter|Hide|5|3|8
Deathslayer7|Jon|Hide|5/2|5/2,1,3|10/4,3,5
Opeth_Freak|Mike|Hide+Ted|2-1|1|2
Aemoh|Bob the Builder|Hide in barricade|6|3|9
Mechafox|Ted|Hide+Mike|2-1|1|2
[/table]

For Jon, he had a stat of 5 for hiding and 2 for combat (stat includes skill). He rolled a 5 for hiding, and after being found rolled a 2, a 1, and a 3 for the three rounds of combat (I rolled in triplicate even though the later rolls weren't needed). That made a total of 10 for hiding, and 4, 3, 5 for each round of combat.

With a proportional search mechanism that I'm proposing that would give 5/8 chance of Mike and Ted being found, 2/8 chance of Garrick being found, and a 1/8 chance of Jon being found.


Yeah, we've got some definite balance issues here. The game's too complex to run with more than, say, 10 players. You can't really be killing people off left and right with those numbers. Plus, it's day 2 and we're already outnumbered? Lame.

I disagree that the game is too complex to run with more players. A bit of Excel excellence and you just plug a few numbers in a few squares and the results roll out. I'm still working on the Excel spreadsheet, but I have it so that you just enter the stat (+skill) and the type being searched for (0 for any) and it automatically calculates the exact item you get.

I could also always write a program that would do it all for you with drop down menus and everything. Wouldn't take more than a couple of weekends to write, even with a fancy GUI. Alternatively paper, pen, and a few dice work well too. I'm just a computer geek.

You are right about balance though. I think fewer zombies as strong as we already have, or more weaker ones. But that's what a playtest game is about.
And if no-one had been injured at all by some luck of the dice, then you might all be complaining about not enough zombies. More players means the odds even out. With fewer players you can almost all get wiped out in one night if the dice roll badly.

So yeah, I'm happy to lose one of the zombies if you think that'll balance the game more. Or ressurrect Jon with maybe just a slight infection and medium health loss.

Or redo the search result - maybe the group of two would get attacked instead and so be better able to protect themselves.


If it is ok with you Jontom Xire, Deathslayer and I are making some modifications to the game. Using your main concept, but changing some things. With your permission we would like to play test it in another thread.

So would this be ok with you?

Thank you

Of course, on one condition. In your ruleset, highlight the differences, and after you're finished bring your findings on game play, balance, how easy it is to run, etc etc back to this thread for discussion.


From the rules, it'd basically seem that way.

6(me) + 5(you) = 11
11 / 2(Number of people) = 5.5(Assuming we round down, that's 5).
Which is one less than I'd get on my own, obviously. If we round up, then it's same. It'd also appear we only roll 1d6 once for the barricade.

Gets worse the more people we barricade for. Just to show, if the other two barricade as well:

6 + 5 + 2 + 2 = 15
15 / 4 = 3.75 (3 or 4, depending on rounding).

Which would still be better for those two, since they only have Str 2, but worse for us. *shrugs*


Well, that kind of sucks.

Yeah. Just like life.

Imagine. You're a professional builder. You've been doing it for years. Zombies attack your town and you start building a barricade with the other survivors. One of them is a DIY "enthusiast" who takes twice as long to hammer in a nail as you do and hence nails half as many planks in the same time. The others are a bunch of teenagers who spend more time arsing around or hammering their thumbs than they do putting nails in wood. If you went off on your own you could build a small but incredibly solid construction in a day, no problem, and then get a good night's sleep in complete safety. As it is when night rolls around, half the windows haven't even been boarded up yet, and the rest are so flimsy that any zombie could break the boards out just by leaning on them.

That sucks, doesn't it? Your section is nice and solidly built, but when a zombie breaks in, who gets attacked? Could be anyone.

I have the same problem in my own life. I'm a software engineer. I write code REALLY fast and almost completely bug free and really readable, high quality and easy to maintain. I spend most of my days at work rewriting the absolute crap coded by some monkey who probably doesn't know what a byte is. If we fired them and I did all their work instead it probably wouldn't take any longer - after all I have to redo their work at some point anyway. If I could clone me and a few others who are as good we'd get twice as much work done in a tenth of the time with half as many people and it would be so solid and bug proof the customer would faint and our managers would be having perpetual orgasms. Instead we're struggling to make the quality good enough, things are always going wrong and I feel like I'm standing on a floor made of damp paper that is about to give way at any moment. I email some of the worse pieces of code I find to a mate at work to have a bit of a laugh over because if we didn't laugh at the crap we see we'd end up crying and having nervous breakdowns.

So yeah, when you build a barricade together those of you who have a Str stat of 2 will be massively degrading the work of the poor bugger who's a professional builder and has a Str stat of 5 and the barricading skill and the result won't be much better than if he built it all on his own. That's how life works. Sorry for injecting too much realism into this game.

---

Sorry for the rant. It's just that this touched a nerve a bit. I'm a perfectionist and I love my job but it's doing my head in a bit with all the rubbish I have to wade through every day.

---

Unfortunately the spreadsheet is at work so I can't do an update right now. Thanks for putting up with me and sticking with it. Oh and sign me up for that parallel game, please.

[Wizibirb]

Yes we can do all that you asked.
And all of you have first dibs in parallel game,
As of now Deathslayer7 is going to run the game and I will be one of the participants.

Also in respect to this game, resurrecting Jon with half health and a mild infection would probably be best. You could just say he was only attacked by one zombie. Thus allowing us to see how it plays out with maybe a little bit more balance.

[Deathslayer7]

we are using your idea for hide n' seek as well since it makes the most sense. Game rules should be finished shortly, followed by a post. And of course you can have a spot Jontom. :smallamused:

[Deathslayer7]

Thoughts/Comments appreciated.

Here is the update. Red taken out, blue added in. Black is as Jontom's.

Zombie Rampage
A game of rampaging zombies and plucky survivors for parties or forums.

Game play:

Game turns consist of a day phase and a night phase.

During the day phase zombies tear down the previous day's barricades hunting for victims that are no longer there (not too bright) and during the night phase the zombies either wander the streets looking for victims or attack the survivors hiding in the new barricade they have built.

During the day phase the survivors can do one of:

Scavenge for useful items
Fortify a barricade
Heal
Be healed
Slope around the place being lazy


During the night phase the survivors can do one of:

Hide in the barricades taking pot shots at zombies (if they have a ranged weapon)
Roam the streets looking for lone zombies to fight (must notify the narrator how many rounds of combat they wish to fight. If no round is specified, all rounds of combat are persumed to have happened).
Find a hiding place and hope they survive until morning (must notify narrator if they are attacked whether they wish to fight or run away).


The game ends when:

There are no more survivors (zombies win)
N turns have passed and the military arrive to rescue the survivors (survivors win)
Players do not win by killing all zombies.


The number of turns N depends on the number of survivors at the start of the game. N= (number of players)*(3/4)

The number of zombies is equal to (half the number of players)/2 rounded up. A zombie or zombies come into town every two nights.

NPC zombies decide their night action randomly

STR: Attack the barricades.
AGL: Try and sneak into the barricades and attack those hiding within.
CON: How infectious a zombie is.
INT: Hunt for hiding players.

If there are no barricades, the zombies will all roam the streets hunting for hiding players.

Once a player has turned into a zombie they can decide their own night action, and choose their action in many other places where it would normally be decided randomly.


Stats/Skills:

Players get to spend 21 points on the following stats. The maximum value for a statistic is 6, the minimum that players can allocate is 1.

STRength: Affects melee combat.
AGiLity: Affects ranged combat and stealthiness (hiding, sneaking), as well as running away in combat.
CONstitution: Affects disease resistance.
INTelligence: Scavenging for items.
ENGineering: Affects how well barricades are built.
MEDicine: Affects how well a person uses a healing item.

If there aren't enough players, NPCs can be rolled randomly.

If a player gets turned into a zombie, their stats remain the same but are used for different purposes:

STRength: Affects melee combat and breaking through barricades.
AGiLity: Affects dodging ranged attacks and sneaking into barricades.
CONstitution: Affects disease infectiousness.
INTelligence: Affects searching for hidden players.

Each player gets one skill from the following list, which they lose on becoming a zombie, which gives them +1 to the corresponding action.

Barricading
Healing
Melee Combat
Scavenging
Shooting
Stealth (hiding)

Health

A living person has two damage states, one for physical damage and one for infection. Zombies have only the physical damage state. Each physical damage state has a modifier that affects all stats. When a character becomes a zombie, they improve by one physical damage state.

{table=head]Physical|Infection|Modifier
Healthy|Healthy|0
Scratched|Dormant|-1
Injured|Malignant|-2
Wounded|Spreading|-3
Dead|Zombified|-4
[/table]

When a character with any sort of infection dies, they automatically become a zombie. If a character is killed by a zombie they automatically become a zombie.

Each 24 hours a player with "Malignant" or "Spreading" infection who isn't having their infection medically treated rolls 1d6. If they roll higher than their CON stat they go up one state.

When taking physical damage, living characters have a toughness of 2 and zombies have a toughness of 3. Divide the damage total by this toughness to work out how many levels of physical damage the target goes up by.

Example:

Rob the Zombie gets beaten up by Bob using a baseball bat. Rob is currently undamaged. Bob ends up getting a damage total of 8. That makes 2 levels of physical damage, so Rob is now "Injured".

Next round Rob the Zombie wins and ends up with a damage total of 7. That's 3 levels of physical damage for Bob, so he goes from "Healthy" to "Wounded".


Ranged Combat:

Ranged weapons have one of two ranges. Short or long. If a short ranged weapon is used then if the target doesn't die it can initiate melee combat. If the shooter is protected by a barricade then the target will need to force it's way through the barricade first (see "Barricades") but once it does so will target the shooter. Zombies will always attack if they are not killed by the ranged attack.

Long ranged weapons mean that the shooter is far away from the target and so can make a get-away easily, assuming the target can even see the shooter that is. Long ranged shooters have too make a "hide" check to avoid being found, then they are able to shoot a random (unless specified) zombie. OR they can choose to protect a group or single player, and if they are attacked by a zombie, that zombie is shot from afar.

Zombies lack the co-ordination and intelligence to make ranged attacks.

To make a ranged attack, the shooter and target both roll 1d6 and add their AGL stat and any appropriate to hit or defensive modifiers. If the shooter's total is higher then the target is hit. The shooter adds any damage modifiers from the weapon and this gives the damage total. The damage total is then divided by the target's toughness and that gives how many levels of physical damage the target takes.

Ex: Garrick is hiding in a tower and has a hide score of 11. No zombie finds him, so he is free to snipe a zombie or protect a player. He decides to protect Ted. Ted's hide scroe is 2, and is found by a zombie. As the Zombie approaches Ted, Garrick pulls the trigger and hits the zombie in the chest, staggering it. Ted hears the gunshot and notices the zombie. With no time to run, he has an axe and decides to attack it. (Intiative has been changed in this case, but no chance is given to run until the second round). From here, melee combat proceeds.

Once Ranged combat is over, melee combat begins on the second round!


Melee Combat

Normal melee combat consists of three rounds. Attacks through barricades are resolved in the same way as melee combat, but the number of rounds depends on the success of the attacker in breaking through the barricade.

Survivors cannot attack zombies unless they possess a weapon capable of harming a zombie. A mob of survivors, some with such weapons and some without, cannot attack zombies and if attacked by them cannot damage them. However on encountering zombie(s) the members of the mob with weapons can form a smaller mob and attack the zombie(s) while the unarmed survivors run away.

Before melee combat begins, all participants may fire any short range weapons they possess at the enemy. Or at their friends. But that's probably not a very good idea.

For each melee combat, all participants on one side are decided and all the participants on the other side are decided. The STR stats of all participants, and all the "to hit" modifiers of any melee weapons being used are added together to get a total melee strength for each side.

Each round, each side then rolls 1d6 and adds the value to the total melee strength to get a total. The side with the highest total wins the round and the difference in the totals is the damage value. Any damage modifiers of any weapons being used by the winning side are added to the damage value to get the damage total which is then divided by the toughness of the targets (it is assumed that all characters on one side are either zombies or living). This gives the number of physical damage levels suffered by the losing side. These are divided randomly and as evenly as possible amongst the characters on the losing side.

The total melee strength is then reduced according to stat modifiers caused by taking physical damage before the next round begins.

If survivors are being attacked by zombies then each zombie, once per combat, has a chance to infect a survivor. Infection attempts are spread evenly and randomly amongst the survivors. Each zombie and their target rolls 1d6 and adds their CON stat. If the zombie has a higher total then the target gains one infection level.

Example 1:

Earlier, Rob the Zombie attacked Bob, wounding him. Rob has a CON stat of 3 and rolls 2 on 1d6. Bob has a CON stat of 4 and even though he only rolls a 1 the zombie didn't roll higher, so although Bob was wounded he doesn't get infected.

Example 2:

Ann, Bob, and Charlie are attacked by 2 zombies. Although they easily defend themselves, 2 of them might get infected. Rolling randomly Charlie is the lucky fellow not to have any risk of infection. One of them (CON=3) targets Ann (CON=4) and rolls a 2 so Ann is safe, but the other (CON=4) targets Bob (CON=3) and rolls a 3 while Bob only rolls a 1, so Bob gets a Dormant Infection.

The hunter always gets the first intiative in melee combat. If a zombie finds someone who has a ranged weapon, then it proceeds to ranged combat, in which humans always have first intiative. There is always at least one round of combat. If for any reason, the human wishes to flee, they can do so during their turn during the second or third round of combat. Doing so requires a roll of 1d6+AGL vs. the zombies STR+1d6. Beating the zombies score means you get away safely. Not beating the zombies score means you are attacked once more before you get away sucessfully.


Scavenging

When scavenging, first pick a type of item to scavenge for, or decide to scavenge for anything. Melee Weapons and Ranged Weapons can be specified independantly.

To scavenge, the survivor rolls 1d6 and adds their INT stat to get their scavenge total.

Survivors may scavenge in teams. Add together all the INT of each player scavenging and then subtract half of the lowest player's INT (rounded up).
Only one item will be found and it will go to a random team member. If they are unable to carry it without dropping another item they may give it, or the other item, to another team member.

Next look up the scavenge total on the chart below:

1-5: You find nothing. Bad luck.
6: You don't find what you're looking for, but you find a low-value item from a different category.
7-8: You find a low value item.
9-10: You find a medium value item.
11: You find a high value item.
12+: You find an excellent item.

Example:
Victoria and Vergil decide to scavenge together for a Ranged Weapon. Victoria's INT is 5 while Vergil's is 3.
Their total INT is (5)+(3)-(3/2 rounded up)=8-2=6
They roll a 6 and get an excellent item! Good job guys! Rolling a 1d2 will determine whether they get a sniper rifle or magnum. If Victoria had scavenged alone and rolled a 6, she would have gotten only a high value item.

Items

Zombies do not carry or use items at all.

Melee weapons
{table=head]Item|Value|Modifiers|Damage
Cleaver|Low value item|can damage zombies|1d4
Crowbar|Low Value item|cant damage zombies, +1 to hit|1d4
Blowtorch|Medium value item|+1 to damage modifier, 2 uses|1d4 +1
Axe|High value item|+2 to damage modifier|1d6 +2
Katana|Excellent item|+2 to hit, +1 to damage|1d8 +1
Chain saw|Excellent item|-2 to hit modifier. +4 to damage modifier|1d8 +4
[/table]

Ranged weapons
{table=head]Item|Value|Modifiers|Damage
.22 Pistol|Low Value Item|-1 damage modifier, Short range|1d4 -1
Beretta|Low Value Item|-1 to hit modifier, Short range|1d6
Shotgun|Medium Value Item|+2 to damage|1d6 +2
Uzi|Medium Value Item|+1 to hit OR shoot two zombies with a -1 to hit, Short range|1d4
Double-barrel shotgun|High Value Item|+2 damage, Short range. Starts off with two shells.|1d8+2
Sniper Rifle|Excellent Item|+2 to hit, +1 to damage. Long range|1d8 +1
Magnum|Excellent Item|+4 to damage, -2 to hit. Short range|2d4+4
[/table]

Miscellaneous
{table=head]Item|Value|Modifier
Alcohol|Low value item|+2 temporary to any single skill -1 to Int, for one day. One use only
Cigar|Low Value Item|+1 to ranged attacks. One use only.
"Fake" Death pills|Medium Value Item|prevents human players from harming you during the night it is used, does not work against zombies. 2 uses.
Bicycle|High Value Item|allows you to run away from harm for one night. Does not work against long ranged weapons. 1 use.
Cyanide capsule|Excellent Item|automatically taken right before death. Prevents you from turning into a zombie with an infection level of dormant. One use only.
[/table]

Medical items
{table=head]Item|Value|Description|MED Stat Req
Bandages|Low Value Item|heals damage only. 1 use. Max of 1 state healed.|1
Whisky|Low Value Item|Prevents infection spreading, but player can still barricade, scavenge or whatever. -1 modifier to all actions. 1 use.|1
Poison pill|Medium Value Item|When swallowed, player will die but not become a zombie regardless of infection state. Must notify narrator of use! 1 use.|2
Paracetamol|Medium Value Item|heals infection. Max of 1 state healed. 1 use.|3
First-aid kit|High Value Item|heals damage only. 1 use. Can heal max of 2 states.|4
Antibiotics|High Value Item|Heals infection. Max of two states healed. 1 use.|5
Med-kit|Excellent Item|Heals damage and infection. Any amount of states healed based on Med Stat, 1 use.|any
[/table]

Construction items
{table=head]Item|Value|Modifier
More nails|Low value item|Goes with hammer. 2 uses.
No More Nails|Low Value Item|+2 barricading modifier. 1 use.
Duct tape|Low Value Item|+2 barricading modifier. 1 use.
Hammer and nails|Medium Value Item|+2 barricading modifier. 2 uses.
Nail gun cartridge|Medium Value Item|Goes with nail gun. 1 use.
Planks|High Value Item|+4 barricading modifier. 1 use.
Cement| Excellent Value Item|+6 barricading modifier, 1 use.
Nail gun|Excellent Value Item|+5 barricading modifier. 1 use.
[/table]

Barricades

Players who are barricading decide amongst themselves how big a barricade they need, how many people it should shelter. They add together the ENG stats of all the characters helping to build the barricade, plus any modifiers from items to get the barricading total. This value is divided by the size of the barricade, and then they add 1d6 for the base strength of the building they are barricading, to get the barricade's defence value.

Example:

4 people with ENG stats 2, 3, 4, 5 build a barricade for 5 people. They roll a 3 on 1d6 and so the barricade strength is ((2 + 3 + 4 + 5) / 5) + 3 = 5.

Cumulative barricade building is an optional rule still under discussion. Ideas include a cap on barricade strength (before the dice roll is added) and also that the 1d6 roll only applies for that night, while strength and items are cumulative. E.g. in the example above, if the same people barricaded the following night, the total would be 2 (from previous day) + ((2 + 3 + 4 + 5) / 5) (from ENG) + 3 (1d6) = 7. There would also have to be an effect from zombie attacks otherwise once a barricade had hit it's cap no-one would need to barricade at all yet would still get a full barricade to hide in.

Healing

Healing is based solely off your MED Stat. There are no modifiers or dice rolls for healing.

Certain items require a minimum MED stat to be used. A player can either heal themselves based off what item they have and their MED stat, or heal someone else. Healing other players works by averaging both player's MED Stat and dividing by 2. If the total is higher then the cap given by the item, then only the max is healed.

Ex: Bob has a MED stat of 4 and Billy has a MED stat of 2. Billy has a first-aid kit but can't use it, so he gives it to Bob. Bob decides to heal Billy with the first-aid kit. Their average stat is 3, but the cap given by a first-aid kit is 2. Therefore Billy is only healed two physical states rather then three.

Ex: Charlie has a MED stat of 1 while Chris has a MED stat of 6. Chris found a med-kit last night, and Charlie is on his last limb being "Inured" with a "Spreading" Infection. Their average MED stat is 7/2=3 (rounded down). So, Chris decided that healing the infection is more important then healing the physical damage Charlie has taken. So Chris uses all 3 points to heal all infection levels. Now Charlie is "Injured" with no infection.

Note: Chris could have healed 1 physical state and 2 infection or 2 physical states and 1 infection if he wanted to, but he deemed that getting rid of the infection was more important.

Attacking Barricades

Zombies attack the people inside barricades in one of two ways. The first is to physically break through the barricade and the second is to sneak inside through an unlocked/undefended back door that has been overlooked.

To break through a barricade a zombie rolls 1d6 and adds its STR stat. It then subtracts the barricade defence value and the result is the number of attacks it gets against a randomly selected occupant of the barricade up to a maximum of 3.

Example :

The barricade built earlier had a barricade defence value of 5. Rob the Zombie (STR=4) rolls 3 on a 1d6 so gets 2 attacks against a randomly selected defender.

To sneak into a barricade, a zombie must roll 1d6 and add it's INT stat. If it scores higher than the barricade defence value then it finds an appropriate unlocked door or unboarded window. The zombie next rolls 1d6 and adds it to its AGL stat. It then subtracts the barricade defence value and the result is the number of attacks it gets against a randomly selected occupant of the barricade up to a maximum of 3.

Example:

The barricade built earlier had a barricade defence value of 5. Rob the Zombie (INT=2, AGL=4) rolls 1d6 and gets 4. The total of 6 is higher than 5 so Rob finds an unlocked back door. He then rolls 1d6 and gets 1. The total of 5 is not higher than the barricade defence value. Someone sees him coming and slams the door in his face, locking it for good measure and then nailing it shut to make sure.

Hide 'n' Seek

Survivors outside of the barricade at night can do one of two things. Cower in fear in an appropriate hiding place or hunt down some zombies. The latter they can do either as a group or individually.

All characters who intend to hide or use long range weapons to kill zombies roll 1d6 and add their AGL stat. This is their "hide" score. If multiple characters are hiding together, use the lowest AGL stat of the group and subtract 1 for every character after the first. Characters roaming the streets are considered to have a "hide" value of 1.

For each zombie who is roaming the streets roll 1d6 and add their INT stat. The total is their "seek" score. Based on a person's "hide" score and the zombie's "seek" score, different outcomes may ocur. Once all zombies have found a target (if they can) work out all survivor and zombie mobs for melee combat.

Seek-Hide=x
x/seek=chance of being found, iff seek>hide

Zombies have a greater chance to attack people with a lower hide score.

Ex: Jon and Jack are hiding seperately fr4om a zombie. Jon's AGL score is 4 while Jack's is 2. Jon rolls a 4 while Jack rolls a 1. Their total hide score are 8 and 3 respectively. The zombie's INT is 3 and rolls a 6. His seek score is 9, thus he can find both Jon and Jack.

Jon: 9-8=1 1/9 = 1/9 chance of being found
Jack: 9-3=6 6/9= 2/3 chance of being found

Thus Jack is in greater danger then Jon.

so a d10 is rolled to simplify. 1-6 Jack is found, 7 Jon is found. 8-10 is a reroll.

Ex: Al's hide is 4. Rob's is roaming the streets and his hide is 1. Katie's hide is 3. The zombie's seek score is 6.

Al: 6-4=2 2/6=2/6 chance of being found
Rob: 6-1=5 5/6= 5/6 chance of being found.
Katie: 6-3=3 3/6= 3/6 chance of being found.

Again a d10 is rolled to simplify things. 1-5 Rob is found. 6-8 Katie is found, and 9-10 Al is found.

If, for some reason, a living character chooses to hunt another living character then calculate a "seek" score as for hunting mobs and long range attack mobs above.

[Wizibirb]

Added weapons:
Rifle And Sledgehammer.

Items

Zombies do not carry or use items at all.

Melee weapons
{table=head]Item|Value|Modifiers|Damage
Cleaver|Low value item|can damage zombies|1d4
Crowbar|Low Value item|cant damage zombies, +1 to hit|1d4
Blowtorch|Medium value item|+1 to damage modifier, 2 uses|1d4 +1
Sledgehammer|Medium Value item|-1 to hit, +2 damage|1d6 +2
Axe|High value item|+2 to damage modifier|1d6 +2
Katana|Excellent item|+2 to hit, +1 to damage|1d8 +1
Chain saw|Excellent item|-2 to hit modifier. +4 to damage modifier|1d8 +4
[/table]

Ranged weapons
{table=head]Item|Value|Modifiers|Damage
.22 Pistol|Low Value Item|-1 damage modifier, Short range|1d4 -1
Beretta|Low Value Item|-1 to hit modifier, Short range|1d6
Shotgun|Medium Value Item|+2 to damage|1d6 +2
Uzi|Medium Value Item|+1 to hit OR shoot two zombies with a -1 to hit, Short range|1d4
Rifle|Medium Value Item|+1 to hit, Long range|1d6
Double-barrel shotgun|High Value Item|+2 damage, Short range. Starts off with two shells.|1d8+2
Sniper Rifle|Excellent Item|+2 to hit, +1 to damage. Long range|1d8 +1
Magnum|Excellent Item|+4 to damage, -2 to hit. Short range|2d4+4
[/table]

Miscellaneous
{table=head]Item|Value|Modifier
Alcohol|Low value item|+2 temporary to any single skill -1 to Int, for one day. One use only
Cigar|Low Value Item|+1 to ranged attacks. One use only.
"Fake" Death pills|Medium Value Item|prevents human players from harming you during the night it is used, does not work against zombies. 2 uses.
Bicycle|High Value Item|allows you to run away from harm for one night. Does not work against long ranged weapons. 1 use.
Cyanide capsule|Excellent Item|automatically taken right before death. Prevents you from turning into a zombie with an infection level of dormant. One use only.
[/table]

Medical items
{table=head]Item|Value|Description|MED Stat Req
Bandages|Low Value Item|heals damage only. 1 use. Max of 1 state healed.|1
Whisky|Low Value Item|Prevents infection spreading, but player can still barricade, scavenge or whatever. -1 modifier to all actions. 1 use.|1
Poison pill|Medium Value Item|When swallowed, player will die but not become a zombie regardless of infection state. Must notify narrator of use! 1 use.|2
Paracetamol|Medium Value Item|heals infection. Max of 1 state healed. 1 use.|3
First-aid kit|High Value Item|heals damage only. 1 use. Can heal max of 2 states.|4
Antibiotics|High Value Item|Heals infection. Max of two states healed. 1 use.|5
Med-kit|Excellent Item|Heals damage and infection. Any amount of states healed based on Med Stat, 1 use.|any
[/table]

Construction items
{table=head]Item|Value|Modifier
More nails|Low value item|Goes with hammer. 2 uses.
No More Nails|Low Value Item|+2 barricading modifier. 1 use.
Duct tape|Low Value Item|+2 barricading modifier. 1 use.
Hammer and nails|Medium Value Item|+2 barricading modifier. 2 uses.
Nail gun cartridge|Medium Value Item|Goes with nail gun. 1 use.
Planks|High Value Item|+4 barricading modifier. 1 use.
Cement| Excellent Value Item|+6 barricading modifier, 1 use.
Nail gun|Excellent Value Item|+5 barricading modifier. 1 use.
[/table]

[Jontom Xire]

I think healing is too powerful. Doctors, with all the resources of an entire hospital, sometimes fail to cure their patients, yet a bunch of untrained random survivors who happened to scavenge a med-pack are guaranteed to heal at least one level of either damage or infection? Without the cap a high skilled player would be able to heal someone on the verge of death back to complete health. With the cap, having a high skill in MED is pointless, except to be able to use items. And that sucks a bit too.

For example, Bob has the lowest MED stat of 1. He finds a med kit which has several bottles of pills with long names that he doesn't have a clue about. He does eeny-meeny-miney-mo and pulls out a bottle, which, like all bottles of medicine has recommended dosage information on it. It may be for curing worms or it may be for curing Zombieism, but he has at least a CHANCE of getting it right.

Anyway, playtest it and we'll see how it goes.

Also it seems that you can do something like barricading AND heal people as well.

[Jontom Xire]

Ok, Jon has been brought back and is "Wounded" and has a "Malignant" infection.

I'll allow a bit longer for people to change their actions in response to this plus for DS7 to post a day action. Scavenge for medicine would be recommended, but remember you have a -3 to all actions due to your injuries (visualises Jon dragging his dying body from building to building in search of bandages).

[Deathslayer7]

ill help sanity scavenge for a weapon.

[Wizibirb]

ill help sanity scavenge for a weapon.

sounds good to me,
May i call dibs on the weapon?

[Jontom Xire]

Garrick and Jon together find a Shotgun! Very nice, watch out, zombies!
Mike finds 3 sniper rifle rounds. Now all he needs is a sniper rifle!

I think this game really needs more people in the beginning so that scavenging can be pumped up a bit and more items collected before there are so few people left that everyone needs to hide in a barricade.

Mike needs to decide whether to keep the Beretta or sniper rifle rounds.
Garrick and Jon need to sort out who gets the shotgun - I recommend that Garrick take both shotgun and Jon's extra shotgun shell.
Bob and Ted need to decide how big the barricade is.

I'd also like all night actions as well, please.

[Opeth_Freak]

Mike needs to decide whether to keep the Beretta or sniper rifle rounds.

You know, If you're all for following the realism (like with hiding, building barricades etc.), then it should be the case here. This is an ammo. As a gun passionate I was holding every single type of ammo in my hands, and there's just no way, It would be so heavy to not carry it along with anything else. You can even store it in pocket, and you won't feel the difference.

Also, I'm very weak person (most of people in my age are much stronger than me), and yet I still managed to easily hold a shotgun in my hands on a shooting range, and have a pistol in my holster.

So if we're really all for the realism this should be changed. Optimally to typical video game '1 heavier weapon + pistol' (of course, there's no chance to use both in one round), but if you really oppose, then at least don't give me item penalty for effing ammo, because it's ridiculous :smallannoyed:

[Jontom Xire]

There's a limit to realism - I just didn't want to end up with huge inventory lists that are complicated to manage. Having a single slot for each item type works nicely.

Can you propose a solution that is convenient? I thought about having an ammo inventory slot, but the problem is; what happens if a person with a shotgun and extra shotgun ammo finds, say, Beretta ammo? I know this sucks right now and I need a good solution that doesn't result in huge inventory lists and I'm open to ideas.

-------

General rule to playtesting (and life in general): By all means criticise, but when you do it's a REALLY good idea to come up with an alternative for discussion. It's the difference between destructive and constructive criticism. Destructive criticism is "This is rubbish and totally unrealistic". Constructive criticism is "This is rubbish and totally unrealistic, and it would be much better if you did .... instead".

[Opeth_Freak]

Well, I thought about this, and I think that simple 'gogo Excel!' can end the problem of inventory management.

For example, Lewis currently has:

Baseball Bat, Magnum .44, 5 rounds for magnum, 2 shotgun shells, antibiotics, sleeping pills and and pack of nails. Sounds really messy, but using simple table we have this:

{table=head]Lewis Inventory|Heavy Melee/Ranged Weapon|Light Melee/Ranged Weapon|Ammo|Meds|Other Stuff
1st slot|Baseball Bat|Magnum .44|5x Magnum Round|Antibiotics|Pack of nails
2nd slot|----|----|2x Shotgun Shell|Sleeping pills|
3rd slot|----|----||----|----[/table]

'----' means you cannot put anything more into this slot. Empty space means you can add something there.

On the next round Lewis finds a Shotgun. Since it's heavy, he must decide Baseball Bat, or shotgun. Since he has some shells, Lewis discards the bat.


{table=head]Lewis Inventory|Heavy Melee/Ranged Weapon|Light Melee/Ranged Weapon|Ammo|Meds|Other Stuff
1st slot|Shotgun|Magnum .44|5x Magnum Round|Antibiotics|Pack of nails
2nd slot|----|----|2x Shotgun Shell|Sleeping pills|
3rd slot|----|----||----|----[/table]

During the night, Lewis fights with a zombie. He killed it with a shotgun using both shells. He also was bitten by it, and have a dormant infection. On the next day Lewis uses antibiotics to heal himself.

{table=head]Lewis Inventory|Heavy Melee/Ranged Weapon|Light Melee/Ranged Weapon|Ammo|Meds|Other Stuff
1st slot|Shotgun|Magnum .44|5x Magnum Round|Sleeping Pills|Pack of nails
2nd slot|----|----|||
3rd slot|----|----||----|----[/table]

As you can see, after you'll do the table, no matter how much changes do you do, everything is clear as a day. This system means, we can add additional rules like:

Bigger items.

Lewis hides for the following night. On the next day he scavenges for meds and finds med kit. Since med kit is a bit bigger, it takes two slots in meds. Lewis discards the pills and takes it anyway.

{table=head]Lewis Inventory|Heavy Melee/Ranged Weapon|Light Melee/Ranged Weapon|Ammo|Meds|Other Stuff
1st slot|Shotgun|Magnum .44|5x Magnum Round|Med Kit|Pack of nails
2nd slot|----|----||Med Kit|
3rd slot|----|----||----|----[/table]

Dual Wielding!

Lewis successfully hides on the next night. Next day scavenge brings him 3 Beretta rounds. Another hide. On the next day he finds Beretta - Lucky! However, Lewis has already his Magnum, so there's no more room. On the other hand, Lewis has a Shotgun which is pretty useless without shells. Lewis decides to do some Gun Katta, and discards Shotgun in favor of Beretta.

{table=head]Lewis Inventory|Heavy Melee/Ranged Weapon|Light Melee/Ranged Weapon|Ammo|Meds|Other Stuff
1st slot|Beretta (Dual wielding)|Magnum .44|5x Magnum Round|Med Kit|Pack of nails
2nd slot|----|----|3x Beretta Round|Med Kit|
3rd slot|----|----||----|----[/table]

Of course, dual wielding means that the cost for additional damage, Lewis has additional minuses to hit, and a chance to injure himself, as recoil can do pretty bad thing to a hand, especially from a weapon like Magnum.

Those last two things are additional ideas if we'll use the tables. I think tables are perfect, because managing them is really easy, everything is clear, and you can handle more items this way, without breaking the realism too much.

[Jontom Xire]

Ok, but that means that you cannot have 2 heavy weapons even if one is melee and one is ranged. Heavy ranged weapons usually sling conveniently on one's back, but then chainsaws don't.

I'd be inclined to call it 2h/1h weapon, 1h weapon rather than heavy and light.

It also adds complexity to the item descriptions.

It is more complex than the existing table I already have, but not too much so and it does add realism with a relatively small cost.

3 rows per player is a bit yuck, but there's only ammo and med and construction items.

I'm almost thinking of just using your size method. I.e. a chainsaw takes up 6 slots, a rifle or something uses 3, a pistol just one. Kind of visualise a Diablo inventory page. So weapons would have a 6 size slot allowing you to carry a rifle and a shotgun but nothing else, a chainsaw on it's own, maybe a katana and a rifle but no pistol, or a katana and three revolvers. Actually, maybe revolvers need to be 2 slots just because of weight and ungainly shape.

What do you think?

I'll see what I can work out, but I think actually your idea is better than mine :P

[Opeth_Freak]

Well, the main problem with heavy weapons is, that you don't always have a way to put the other heavy ranged weapon on your back, and even if, you're such a slowpoke, that you're probably even slower than the zombies. So yeah, second slot can be added there, but I don't think it's a really good idea survival-wise.

I agree with 2 handed/1 handed stuff. It makes sense, especially considering, that some of the pistols are definitely not 'light weapons', and shouldn't be wielded in one hand only. (Desert Eagle, or even Magnum has very strong recoil, and shooting them with one hand is just stupid. And their weight is bigger than normal pistol as well)

Also be careful with size of the items, because giving 6 slots for a chainsaw can makes a lot of additional rows, which will probably be not used anywhere else.

So maybe a little compromise. My idea + your modifications, and then we'll see if it works.

[Jontom Xire]

I'm thinking that if you're carrying a chainsaw or a rifle then you probably wouldn't have room for carrying, say, a nail gun either.

Maybe we ought to say that each player has 2 hands so can hold either a 2 handed item/weapon or 2 1-handed items/weapons. They also have a satchel or similar bag and two pockets. The satchel can fit a 1-handed item or a med kit or something, and the pockets can take one type of ammo or construction refill each. I know you can fit more in a pocket probably, but if you mix, say .22 rounds and shotgun shells and then need to reload your .22 pistol, pulling out a shotgun shell isn't going to help. Then each player's spread sheet can have the following item slots:

left hand
right hand
satchel
left pocket
right pocket

And we don't care what gets put in what as long as it fits.

I know a katana or a baseball bat might not fit in a satchel, but presumably you can make some sort of sling for it quite comfortably.

To further simplify you can have one type of ammo in each slot only. Also you can carry a 2-handed weapon in one hand while using the other to wield a 1-handed weapon. So you can have both a 1h and 2h weapon but not two 2h weapons.

[Aemoh]

Bob and Ted need to decide how big the barricade is..

Barricade for the two of us.

[Opeth_Freak]

Funny enough, I also though about something similar. In fact, completely identical, but with backpack instead of satchel. I planned to use it as a alternative, if you would completely bash my previous idea :smallwink:

So basically, we are thinking about the same thing, and combining it with several ideas mentioned earlier, the system should work fine.

[Deathslayer7]

Sanity can have the weapon and shells, and i'll be hiding with him.

[Wizibirb]

sweet ill take it then.

I'll be protecting Jon this night.

[Wizibirb]

Since survival is of the utmost(or is it up most) importance in this game I have a battle plan... If we all survive the night this is,

Getting Jon (deathslayer) back to decent health is a priority. However so is more weapons for those of us remaining.
Here is what i propose
Death and Mechafox scavenge for med's for the simple reason that it will produce the best result, I will give my shotgun to death before you guys go scavenge.
edit:
unless we are changing the item carrying system.
Then either as a team or as individuals OF and I scavenge weapons. so that the rest of the team can be better equipped. (you may have to give your ranged weapon to someone who can hold it so you aren't forced to throw away a perfectly good weapon.)
and Aemoh you just keep on holing yourself up.

[Aemoh]

I realize this is a bit of deviation from the game but...

Why do people always seem to add a "t" to Aemoh? Seems to happen quiet often and I can't really figure out the reason for it. I mean, sure, the "t" is a little bit above the "h", but even typing how you're supposed to type(which I don't, cause it hurts my hands to try) I don't see how you'd accidentally hit the "t".

.... ok, I'm done. I'd like a response though if anyone knows a reason :smallamused:

Back on topic: Keep on building my fort, roger :smallcool:

EDIT: @Sanity: It's fine, I honestly don't mind.

I'm just curious, cause this ain't the first time. And it's basically always a "t" when someone misspells my name. I'm just rather curious about the reason :smallsmile:

[Wizibirb]

I realize this is a bit of deviation from the game but...

Why do people always seem to add a "t" to Aemoh? Seems to happen quiet often and I can't really figure out the reason for it. I mean, sure, the "t" is a little bit above the "h", but even typing how you're supposed to type(which I don't, cause it hurts my hands to try) I don't see how you'd accidentally hit the "t".

.... ok, I'm done. I'd like a response though if anyone knows a reason :smallamused:

Back on topic: Keep on building my fort, roger :smallcool:

cause as horrible as this sounds I thought it was actually Aemoth. >.> sorry.... Aemoh ill fix that now

[Jontom Xire]

Mike, I assume you're hiding?

Ok, Jon and Garrick have a hide stat effective of 1 (Jon has stat 4, -3 for being wounded, makes 1, and then has Stealth skill +1, -1 because two of you are hiding together) and rolled 5 gives 6.

Mike has hide stat of 3, rolled 1 (bad luck!) gets a total of 4.

Or to put it another way, Jon and Garrick found a hidey hole where Jon's moans of pain from his wounds aren't too audible, while Mike stood on a street corner with a plant pot on his head and pretends to be street furniture! :smallbiggrin:

The barricade has strength 11 (5 + 6 / 2 = 5, +1d6 = 6 - good roll there!).

Oops, wait, forgot to do Jon's infection!! Jon rolls a 1 which means the infection doesn't spread. However I'm not sure if we ought to take base CON or not. If someone is wounded their body is more vulnerable to disease, so I think I'll leave it as is.

---

Japhet the Zombie decides to attack that shiny new barricade. Stat=5, 1d6=3, total =8, he doesn't stand a chance!
Frank the Zombie decides to try and sneak into that shiny new barricade. Stat=3, 1d6=5, total=8, he doesn't stand a chance either!
Shem and Ernie both go searching the streets. One gets a total of 8 and the other a total of 10, so nobody is safe, but both roll who to find and find Mike! Bad luck, Mike. That bad die roll really put you in it. Let's see how well you do in combat!

(TBC)

[Jontom Xire]

Mike pulls out his Beretta and fires at Ernie (because he has the lowest AGL stat and I'm being generous as I can because I don't want Mike to die). Mike rolls 5, Ernie rolls 2, it's a hit! By a total of 2. Which is lower than the zombie's toughness of 3, so no damage is done.

Hmm, that sucks a bit.

I just realised that a Beretta is worse than a .22 pistol. <Tweaks stats a bit>. Let's try that again:

Mike pulls out his Beretta and fires at Ernie (because he has the lowest AGL stat and I'm being generous as I can because I don't want Mike to die). Mike rolls 5, Ernie rolls 2, it's a hit! By a total of 2. Add 1 for the Beretta's damage modifier makes three divide by the zombie's toughness of 3, and Ernie is "Scratched". Whoohoo! Mike's probably going to die anyway.

---

First round of combat: Zombie combined strengths is 4, Mike's is 2. Mike rolls 6, Zombies roll 3, Mike is safe.
Second round of combat: Both sides roll a 2 - uhoh! Mike takes 1 level of damage.
Third round of combat: Mike rolls 2, but zombies roll 1. Because Mike has a -1 on his strength, that's another point of damage.

Mike survives but is Injured.

Mike has Con 3 and rolls 4 giving an infection resist of 7. Shem and Ernie have Con 2 and 3 respectively and roll 3 and 1. Mike is not infected.

---------

Can I have all day actions now, please?

[Wizibirb]

Mike survives but is Injured.



Go Mike!!!

The night had been rather uneventful. Garrick stretched out his legs and helped Jon to his feet. "Here borrow this for today. in case i find another weapon. And do try to find some Medication." He hands Jon the shotgun then is off to ask Mike if we will be scavenging for weapons together or solo.

I will agree with Opeth_freak on wether to scavenge for weapons alone or together

[Opeth_Freak]

Question: Am I still in combat, or I ran away from those zombies? If the first one, then I'm pretty much booped, but I'll try to run. If that second thing, I'll scavenge for medicine and hope I'll manage to hide properly in the next round.

"I'm sorry Garrick, but no gun will do me any good, If I'll die of wounds after a few more scratches. I'm only a burden in this state."

[Wizibirb]

I understand I wish you the best of luck in finding what you needGarrick walks off with a sinking feeling of doom as he scavenges for weapons.

[Aemoh]

Bob paces back and forth, looking over his fort.

"Yes, yes. Perfect, a home away from home."

Fortify Barricade for One

[Fawkes]

Ted follow Mike to help him scavenge.

"Come on, let's go find you some pills."

[Deathslayer7]

Scavenge for meds

[Wizibirb]

Looking at Jon's pitifull state Garrick takes back the shotgun and decideds to Scavenge meds with Jon

[Jontom Xire]

Ugh - I just worked out all the scavenge results and then turned the page and saw the post above - Now I need to rework it. Mind you, good decision or neither of you would have got anything. Instead you get Bandages - who's going to look after them?

On another topic, Mike got lucky with a bug in my spreadsheet that gave an incorrect result, so rather than work out what it should have been, I re-rolled - and he got Antibiotics. Well done, Mike! I suggest you give them to Aemoh to look after and tomorrow everyone does healing. Otherwise if you die tonight they're lost.

Also worth swapping bandages for antibiotics (unless I forget what they each do).

The Barricade strength is 10. A safe place to be I think.

Lastly, Jon needs to make an infection spreading roll, but I'll wait until you decide who's holding what first.

[Jontom Xire]

Also, when I was doing Mike's attack last night I kept thinking that he should run away. I really like that rule. Shall we add it to this game? What do people think?

Also, I want to do it in a way that doesn't involve me having to interrupt processing night actions to ask people if they want to run away. So I reckon when you specify your night actions, if you are not in a barricade (in which case you can't run away) then you need to specify if you're going to run away first chance you get, or at a later round, or not at all.

[Deathslayer7]

i wont take any items yet. so have sanity hold on to it.

[Wizibirb]

i wont take any items yet. so have sanity hold on to it.

Takes Band aids from Jon. "Are you sure you don't want to use them right now?"

[Deathslayer7]

i would be good with runaway.

[Wizibirb]

I am all for running away being added.

And players should let it be known when they submit there night actions how many rounds of combat they will go through.

PS: sorry forgot heraling is a day action..... >.> Ill hold onto the band aids.

Protect Jon Tonight. Run away after Jon excapes first (or 1 round of combat. If he is able to escape while i fend off said zombie.)

[Deathslayer7]

Hide with Garrick Run away as soon as possible.

[Jontom Xire]

I'm off work today, so update will be on Monday when I get back to the office.

[Jontom Xire]

Still waiting for night actions from Mike and Ted. If I don't get them soon I will assume they are hiding and running.

Jon is the flukiest guy out! That's the second night in a row that 1d6 has rolled 1!! He now has a chance to use antibiotics tomorrow to heal his infection.

[Opeth_Freak]

D'oh! I forgot to send and action?

Yeah I'll hide and run.

[Fawkes]

Hide and run with anyone who will have me.

[Jontom Xire]

Wow. The two zombies with the highest int decided to search and sneak into barricade respectively. And 3 zombies rolled 6 on their action. Well, here goes.

Zombie Shem decided to search the streets and found Garrick and Jon. Mike and Ted weren't hiding much more successfully.

Zombie Japhet decided to go batter on the barricade, and batter he did, breaking in and getting Bob the Builder for 1 round of combat.

Zombie Frank also decided to batter on the barricade, but bob's building skills meant that even with a 6 he was frustrated.

Zombie Ernie decided to try and sneak into the barricade, but failed to find a way in. That Bob sure does build a mean barricade!

--------

Combat 1: Garrick and Jon vs. Shem.

Garrick started by letting fly with a shotgun volley. He peppered Shem with a highly accurate volley, scratching Shem.

Ok, that made me chuckle - Shem has Str=2, now down to 1! :smallbiggrin:

Anyway I didn't even bother trying to make you guys run away - Shem never got close to hurting you. But he might have infected...Garrick. Nope, Garrick is fine.

Dejected, and hurt by the two survivors' taunts, Shem slopes off to sulk.

---------

Combat 2, Japhet vs. Bob.

Japhet swipes at Bob...and HITS! But not hard enough to injure him.

I just realised that Japhet and Bob have identical stats. What a showdown this is, two such equally matched combatants! Anyway, Japhet fails to infect Bob before Bob drives him out of the barricade and nails up the breach.

---------

I think the number of zombies really isn't an issue here - the only problem with night one was that two were guaranteed to attack together (my bad).

Anyway, time for the next day, actions please.

For healing remember that you can heal multiple other people or just yourself. I've got rid of the restriction that you can only heal infection or physical damage but not both. It looks like Garrick healing Jon's infection and Mike's wound is the best bet. That means that none of the three of you can do anything else, but should restore a lot of health ready for the night. Unless I mis-read the rules, Mike should be able to heal himself as well as Garrick doing it, or could heal Jon instead. I think the rules may need re-writing there, but let's roll with it for now.

[Wizibirb]

Yeah get that zombie out of hear :smalltongue:

That's why they call me the hunter!
I wish for an item trade the band-aids for the antibiotics. Let me know.

[Aemoh]

Bob looks over his quick repair patch he did last night, after that zombie broke in. Sadly, he was in a bit of a rush and it's not up to code. Best fix that.

Fortify the Barricade for One

((Unless someones joining me again in building.))

[Fawkes]

"I'll see if I can scrounge up any weapons. Someone want to hold my blowtorch while I'm gone?"

Scavenge for weapons. If I find another melee weapon, would I have to drop the blowtorch?

[Jontom Xire]

Yes, you would have to drop the blowtorch.

I think that would count as a two handed item, and according to the new inv rules you only get one of those and no one handed items while you're carrying a two handed item unless you can sling it in your satchel/bag/backpack.

[Deathslayer7]

I must say that I dislike the rule of taking ability damage when hurt. Realistically it makes sense, but in gameplay it really really sucks when you have to depend on someone else to get you the healing item you need and to heal you since you cant do it yourself.

also being healed.

[Jontom Xire]

I agree, and while I'm sticking with it for the time being I have been having serious thoughts about changing it. To compensate I have been running with the rule that 1 is the minimum even when taking ability modifier into account.

I may just reduce it so you get -1 when heavily injured and nothing otherwise or something.

[Fawkes]

Can anyone hold the blowtorch for me? I don't want to risk losing a weapon here.

[Deathslayer7]

i will if you want mechafox

[Wizibirb]

For healing remember that you can heal multiple other people or just yourself.


I will Heal Jon(Deathslayer) and Mike(Opeth_freak) If he will give Jon the antibiotics so that he can stop having to make a check. That way we will have one antibiotics and two people looking better.

[Jontom Xire]

As Opeth Freak hasn't posted for ages, I am going to do his turn for him.

Mike gives the antibiotics to Jon. Garrick then attempts to bandage Jon and Mike. Garrick fails to help Jon at all, but succeeds in healing Mike by one level of physical damage.

Meanwhile Jon takes a dose of antibiotics and succeeds in healing one level of infection.

Ted goes scavenging for weapons but finds nothing. I'm guessing he wants his blowtorch back, right?

The barricade strength is 10.

As his infection is now dormant, Jon no longer needs to roll to see if he gets sicker.


Please can I have all night actions now.

[Fawkes]

I'm guessing he wants his blowtorch back, right?

It'd be nice.

[Wizibirb]

Garrick loads his shotgun with the last remaing shell.
Sorry I could'nt do anything for you Jon That being said he will
Hide with Jon

[Opeth_Freak]

Sorry guys for being inactive and unhelpful here. I don't have a lot of time, I have even problem with keeping up with WW games, so sorry, but I think I'll have to bail out of this. If someone's feeling hardcore enough, he can take Mike and for his wicked combos/whatever, or dearest narrator can just add him to the zombie legion, so at least he'll give more fun to other players :smalltongue:

Sorry once again guys!

[Jontom Xire]

Hi, all.

I know Zombie Rampage is on and Opeth Freak has dropped out, but if I could have more than one actual night action, that would be very nice. It's been all weekend for crying out loud!

[Deathslayer7]

Hide with Garrick

[Aemoh]

Don't think I need to send one, but uh, hide in the barricade I keep building back up day after day :smallsmile:

[Fawkes]

Hide with Garrick and Jon, if they'll have me.

[Jontom Xire]

It'd be nice to have confirmation from Jon if:

1) He's giving the blowtorch back, and
2) He's letting Ted hide with him and Garrick.

If I don't get an answer soon I'll assume yes to both questions.

[Deathslayer7]

yes and yes

[Wizibirb]

*Tries to poke thread back to life*

Are we still giving this game a shot?

[Jontom Xire]

Many apologies. I missed Deathslayer 7's response and then got sidetracked by work which has been not nice recently.

Update later.

[Jontom Xire]

Shem and Japhet try to sneak into the barricade, but it is far too well built for them to find a way in.

Frank tries the straightforward approach of hammering on the barricade as hard as he can, but he too is defeated.

Ernie decides that scouring the streets for survivors will be more effective. Mike is found.

Ernie attacks. Mike shoves him back and runs for his life. Mike resists being infected.

---

I have decided that from now on we definitely won't do the thing where being wounded reduces your stat. However I'd like to point out that some of you are only alive today because a zombie was winged with a firearm and so was 1 point too low to hit.


Can I have all day actions now, please?

Mike will give his sniper rounds and beretta to Bob to look after, will give the antibiotics to Jon, and go scavenge for meds.

[Aemoh]

Today, Bob's decided to work on the decorations of his little home, as it's getting awful depressing around here with all the splatted blood.

Fortify a Barricade for One

Also, I freely give back anything I'm holding onto when asked.

[Wizibirb]

Scavenge Ranged weapons Possibly with Deathslayer7

[Fawkes]

Scavenge for medicine.

I'm just carrying the blowtorch, right?

[Deathslayer7]

scavenge with sanity

[Jontom Xire]

Garrick and Jon scavenge for weapons (you can't specify ranged or melee in this game) and find a 2 by 4.

As per my last post, injuries no longer count, so you might have been better off scavenging separately.

Who takes the 2 by 4?

Mike finds a bottle of whisky. Ted finds nothing.

The scavenging rolls were all 1s and 2s today. Really bad luck!

Bob barricades.

I'm going to try a new barricading method where the strength of the barricade does not include the 1d6 roll, and then the 1d6 roll gets rolled for each zombie that tries to sneak in or attack. It makes it more in line with the way the rest of the game works.

---------

I now need to know who will take the 2x4, any other trades, and what your night actions are.

Mike is going to hide on his own.

[Wizibirb]

sigh DS can have the 2 X 4

[Deathslayer7]

Hide with sanity if hes fine with it.

[Wizibirb]

Of course hide with DS

[Jontom Xire]

And Ted?

Silly forum rules about short posts!!

[Fawkes]

Hide with the group.

[Jontom Xire]

Zombie Japhet tries to sneak into the barricade but is spotted by Bob who blocks his access. Simultaneously distracted by Zombie Ernie who almost breaks down one section of the barricade, his flailing arm reaching in but failing to find anything to grab, Bob fails to notice zombie Shem sneaking into the barricade! Bob could be in trouble as one round of combat ensues.

Meanwhile zombie Frank searches the streets but completely fails to find Mike, finding instead Garrick, Jon, and Ted.

It has just occurred to me that having a mega strong barricade with very few people act as a distraction while everyone else gangs up and butchers zombies is a really good tactic!

Anyway...

Zombie Frank dodges Garricks shotgun blast as he charges to attack!

You didn't specify, but the blowtorch only has one use so I'm guessing you'll run away in round 2 if possible.


Garrick grabs one of Frank's arms while Jon pins the other to the ground with his 2x4. Ted fires up the blowtorch while casually selecting a good place to apply it.

The good news is that Frank rolled a 1. The bad news is that you guys rolled a 1. The good news is that that still gives you an 8 point to hit advantage. +1 damage from the blowtorch, divided by 3 is 3 levels of damage!

Leaving the heavily charred, but not quite dead, Frank behind the trio wandered off into the night. However Jon's close contact to the zombie has caused his infection to get worse!

Meanwhile...

Ernie attacks Bob who gives a mighty shove and shoves him right out of the barricade. Bob is not infected.

---

Can I have all day actions next, please. Jon still has some antibiotics I believe.

Mike will be scavenging for weapons. Those zombies will be dead soon at this rate.

Apart from Jon dying (sort of) on night one, the death rate has been very very low. I think I need to make combat more lethal as per the original game where, on average, at least one person would die every night. So, tough as it was, I think I should have stuck to my original decision to make Shem and Japhet a tag team - give you a proper challenge - but maybe also give you some warning.

[Aemoh]

Bob looks a bit displeased this day. A zombie actually managed to get in wreck up the place! That won't do, that won't do at all...

Fortify a Barricade for One

[Fawkes]

Is the blowtorch gone now?

[Wizibirb]

Scavenge weapons possibly with Jon

[Jontom Xire]

Is the blowtorch gone now?

Yup.

Still need some day actions, please.

[Fawkes]

Scavenge for weapons

[Deathslayer7]

scavenge weapons alone this time.

[Jontom Xire]

After a hard day's scavenging, Garrick found a blowtorch while Jon and Mike both found a cleaver. Ted found nothing.

-----

Jon/Deathslayer7, you need to choose between keeping the 2x4 or the cleaver. Because your inventory is otherwise quite empty I'll let you carry both so you can e.g. give one to Ted, but you cannot use both.

Also note that if you group as a mob the to hit bonus from the 2x4 helps the total to-hit value and the cleavers then do damage as would the blowtorch, even thought he 2x4 cannot do damage.

Night actions, please.

[Fawkes]

I think that, since I have the highest melee skill, I should get a cleaver.

[Wizibirb]

Anyone want a Blow torch?

Hide with whoever wants to hide with me.

[Deathslayer7]

ill give him the cleaver then.

[Fawkes]

Sweeeeeeet.

[Jontom Xire]

Still need hide actions, etc.

[Deathslayer7]

hide alone

[Fawkes]

Group hide, if possible.

[Deathslayer7]

all right then group hide. :smalltongue:

[Wizibirb]

group hide it is

[Jontom Xire]

Well the group hide gets lowest stat = 2 -1 per extra person = -3 giving a total of -1!

A roll of 3 gives a grand total of 2, which is lower than or equal to any zombies Int stat, so...

Japhet and Ernie attempt to sneak into the barricade. Frank attempts to batter it down. All fail, as usual.

Meanwhile Shem searches the streets, looking for "victims", unaware that he is about to become one... He finds the group that are "hiding" with ease. Not difficult when they wandering around shouting "Here, zombie, zombie, zombie! Here, nice little zombie! We've got some nice fresh flowers for you!"

"Flowers, what do you mean flowers?"
"Well, flowers are nice!"
"Zombies like brains you schmuck!"
"Ooohhh. Right."
"Brains, I meant brains! Here, nice little zombie! We've got some nice fresh brains for you!"

Shem shambles towards them. Jon trips Shem with his 2 by 4, Mike and Ted hack off his arms with their cleavers, Garrick burns his face off with the blowtorch, and zombie Shem is no more.

However Ted picked up a dormant infection.

---

Day actions please.

At this point you are so tooled up that in a couple of rounds I don't think there will be any point in building a barricade. Once you outnumber the zombies and all have zombie damaging melee weapons, you can just scavenge for meds to fight off any infections, and group up to hack the zombies to death over three rounds of combat.


I think it makes running the game much much easier to not have to worry about how wounded someone is when working out their stat, so I'll drop that rule.

I think we need to make infections more dangerous - easier to catch and easier to spread. How about one chance of catching per round of combat?

Which reminds me that I forgot to do Jon's infection...

Frankly I'm not sure how, with a CON of 2, Jon didn't turn into a zombie long ago. Anyway his infection is now "spreading". You need to use those antibiotics while the others scavenge for Meds. Frankly I'm surprised you didn't mostly scavenge for Meds yesterday.

[Aemoh]

Once more, Bob set about fixing up his house. Though he'd started wondering what it was about the place that zombies just had to keep coming back for more.

Fortify a Barricade for One

((As to game mechanics, I've got nothing. Not a good judge of balance, sorry.))

[Wizibirb]

scavenge for weapons

Because its just so satisfying to kill those zombies. :smallbiggrin:

[Fawkes]

Ted is gonna go search for some sweet, sweet medicine.

[Jontom Xire]

I'm sure I'm still waiting for an action.

[Deathslayer7]

search for meds and pop some antibiotics

[Jontom Xire]

Can't do both.

Rules say healer and patient must both not do any other action, and if healing yourself, same applies.

I know you're only sticking pills in your mouth, but the label on the bottle quite clearly states that the patient must rest and be kept warm! :smallbiggrin:

No trekking all over town for you! Now put this thermometer in your mouth and stop complaining. You can go play with the other children tomorrow!

---

So which are you going to do?

[Deathslayer7]

the meds unless someone else will search for them.

[Jontom Xire]

As Ted is scavenging for Meds, and Mike decides to help him, I'm going to assume you try to heal yourself. Wise decision if you don't want to become a zombie.

---

Garrick goes scavenging for weapons and finds a shotgun shell for his shotgun. Nice find!

Mike and Ted head off to find some medicine and find a med-kit which they decide Ted should hold. That should keep the group going for a while and tomorrow they can heal Jon's wounds.

Meanwhile Jon swallows some antibiotics and get's a good day's rest, wrapped up warm in some old blankets. The treatment is a complete success healing two levels of infection!! (Rolled a 6 you jammy git). Jon's infection is now dormant.

---

Night actions please. If I had to guess I'd say that Aemoh was going to hole up in his barricade while the rest of you team up to take out some zombies.

Shall we call it game over soon? You now outnumber the zombies which basically means that, barring infection, you will win every combat round and probably kill a zombie a night. Or do you want to actually have the enjoyment of butchering helpless zombies, you cruel survivors you. leave the poor things in peace! :smallbiggrin:

[Wizibirb]

Are you really asking this? SLAUGHTER THE ZOMBIES!

[Jontom Xire]

I'd just like to post a semi-away notice.

Last night my fiance gave birth to a baby girl, so I am now on 2 weeks paternity leave followed by one week's annual leave, and my spreadsheet is at work.

Game suspended until I get back to work at which point I will ask if anyone wishes to resume it.

[Jontom Xire]

Back. Actually, back several days ago.

So, night actions please!

[Wizibirb]

attack the zombies!

[Aemoh]

Hole up in my lovely barricade, naturally.

[Jontom Xire]

It's now been exactly a month (to the day) since the last phase ended and I am STILL missing two actions.

I hereby officially declare this game dead.

With only 2 players active out of 5 this game is just not worth continuing. To be honest, players had won anyway.

Thanks for taking part and for all your comments. I think that ZR II will be much much better.