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View Full Version : Break this (a set of char gen rules for a one off game)



oxinabox
2009-08-21, 03:10 AM
ok i want to see how breakable my house rules I plan to use
for a one off game:

Alot of these rules i wouldn't normally do, but this is to speed up char gen, (since it's gen then play then throw away)

Starting Lvl: 3 (No selling off XP for item creation etc)
Races: PHB only
Classes: All WoTC 3.5
Feats: All WoTC 3.5
Spells/Power/invocations/etc...: all WoTC 3.5 *
Equipment: All WoTC 3.5
Stating Gold: WBL = 2,700gp.
Abiltities: 32 point buy
' (if i have more than one person who's never played before i will change this to a dozen or so pregenerated 32 pt buy arrays, explaining point buyt is hard there isn't enough words in the english language to describe that you must spend 3 point to increase this by one point, to get no change in modifier.)


*If you hold Everyone up choosing them i will select them for you in 1 minute and they will be PHB.
Similar if you spend to long on spell prep.
I don't think this will happen though.

I'm also considering a house rule that Halfelves get the human bonus 1 skill point each lvl (4 at 1st)

Weeboo fight'en magik fully endorsed and encouraged

Now Tell me how it's broken.


Lvl 3 seems like a great lvl:
Fighters have a lot of feats.
Wizards can't make fighters feel bad by blasting, (even though on the surface the fighter knows that without him the wizard would be dead, in his heart he cry's when he see the wizard killing more than him)
Magic missiles good, flaming sphere is the OMFG wizards are Awesohme spell.
everyone has enough wealth to get Masterwork Fullplate.
Masterwork there weapons, maybe even magic them.
Knights may be able to get a warhorse and put barding on it.
Don't have to deal with the increase one skill at lvl 4 (which saves some thought on pointbuy)
and everyone has a great feat to lvl ratio

erikun
2009-08-21, 03:24 AM
*If you hold Everyone up choosing them i will select them for you in 1 minute and they will be PHB.
One minute?! There's no way someone who has never read the rules will be able to pick spells out of the PHB/SRD within one minute, much less every rulebook in existance.


Wizards can't make fighters feel bad by blasting...
Trust me, when you throw out 8 dice and do less than a single sword swing, the fighters aren't feeling jealous. The feel jealous when you Entangle the entire encounter and let everyone plink off the now-helpless enemies. :smallwink:


Magic missiles good, flaming sphere is the OMFG wizards are Awesohme spell.
I've found that Scorching Ray is better. :smalltongue:


Don't have to deal with the increase one skill at lvl 4 (which saves some thought on pointbuy)
Huh? You won't get a stat up at next level in this system?


It sounds like a standard 3rd level party, which is a just fine starting point. Is there anything different that I missed?

Myrmex
2009-08-21, 03:31 AM
Glitterdust, color spray, and web are king at these levels. However, if you throw enough enemies at the players, everyone will love it when the caster incapacitates some enemies for 3 rounds. A caster level of 3 means grease, glitterdust, etc aren't so hot.

Skill checks for concentration and stuff won't be trivial, either, thanks to a lack of bonuses at these levels.

Casters are stymied at the low levels, and aren't nearly as great as they are after they get 5th level spells (I see 5th level spells as the break point for casters). They will certainly be very, very useful. 'Course, everyone's stymied at the low levels, but a human barb1/fighter2 has 5 feats, full plate, and a lot of HP. He's going to be king against most enemies (most humanoids, animals, some giants) that you'd throw at a level 3 party.

Jack_Banzai
2009-08-21, 03:36 AM
I was always fond of Ray of Stupidity, myself. Guaranteed to throw any monster with animal intelligence into a coma. Lovely. Provided you hit of course.

Myrmex
2009-08-21, 03:39 AM
I was always fond of Ray of Stupidity, myself. Guaranteed to throw any monster with animal intelligence into a coma. Lovely. Provided you hit of course.

With a +1 BAB, +2 dex, and -4 for shooting into melee, good luck!

erikun
2009-08-21, 03:40 AM
With a +1 BAB, +2 dex, and -4 for shooting into melee, good luck!
Hey, the fighter didn't need that INT bonus anyways.

Jack_Banzai
2009-08-21, 03:45 AM
With a +1 BAB, +2 dex, and -4 for shooting into melee, good luck!

Oh, please. It's a ranged touch attack, remember. As long as you're using it on a big dumb beastie, it should be easy as pie to nail. Just have someone else aid your attack and you're good to go. And why on earth would you bother shooting into a melee? Even the dumbest fighter (well, maybe; I haven't met the fighters in your party) can see the value in disengaging long enough for the wizard to take a shot at putting said monster into a coma. If memory serves, the purple worm, for example, has a pretty decent AC, but versus a ranged touch attack, they have an effective AC of... I think it was 3? Easy meat for any wizard with Ray of Stupidity.

Kurald Galain
2009-08-21, 03:48 AM
Now Tell me how it's broken.
At the risk of stating the obvious, Pun-Pun.

But yeah, 3.5 works very well at levels 3-8 or thereabouts.

oxinabox
2009-08-21, 03:50 AM
One minute?! There's no way someone who has never read the rules will be able to pick spells out of the PHB/SRD within one minute, much less every rulebook in existance.
I'm sorry if I was unclear.
If they are still picking spells long after everyone else has finished.
I (who have a good knowledge of the PHB spells) will pick out the spells for them, (i will spend one minute ticking boxes on a spell sheet)



Trust me, when you throw out 8 dice and do less than a single sword swing, the fighters aren't feeling jealous. The feel jealous when you Entangle the entire encounter and let everyone plink off the now-helpless enemies. :smallwink:
No they feel Happy and great full when you do that.
That's why the Batman wizard is fun for fighters to play with (compared to some wizards)




Huh? You won't get a stat up at next level in this system?
They won't get a stat up at the next level 'cos this is a one off game.
they won't lvl.



It sounds like a standard 3rd level party, which is a just fine starting point. Is there anything different that I missed?
Yes, you missed that it was for a one off game (second line).


I agree this does nerf casters and favor fighters. just by the low lvl.
But then again, no full attack.


I say the tipping point for wizards is third lvl spells, fireball, dispel, lightning bolt.

Jack_Banzai
2009-08-21, 03:56 AM
Okay, I was wrong, the Purple Worm has a touch AC of 4. >4<. With a +3 to hit? I get the feeling that you can just about manage that.

Other SRD monsters with a touch AC of <10 that can be taken out (potentially) with a Ray of Stupidity:

Ankheg
Athach
Basilisk and Abyssal Greater Basilisk
Behir
Dinosaur (Triceratops or Tyrannosaurus)
Dragons (quite a few, actually)

You know what? I'm tired of looking through the SRD. It's a great spell, that's the bottom line. And if you don't want to use your single 2nd level spell slot on it, a wand is definitely in order.

oxinabox
2009-08-21, 04:33 AM
At the risk of stating the obvious, Pun-Pun.

Is PunPun build able at lvl 3, with PHB races only?
And without UA variant rules? eg Flaws antd traits?


what if i took away all gods, but my own home brew gods?

Lanora, the bountiful. (Healing, Feast, Commutity, ) NG
Nerath, the wrathful. (Ocean, Storm, watery death, ) CN
Raino's, the Sun (Sun, Fire, destruction) NN
Midnas, the Mad (Magic, Force, Madness) CN also know as the Mad Mage God.




A couple more along those lines, as requested by players.

Kurald Galain
2009-08-21, 04:59 AM
Is PunPun build able at lvl 3, with PHB races only?
And without UA variant rules? eg Flaws antd traits?
Surprisingly, yes.

It's easily solved by banning Sarrukhs and Pazuzu, though.

kamikasei
2009-08-21, 05:04 AM
Sarrukhs

Aren't Sarrukhs a 3.0 thing, though, arguably outside the parameters of the OP?

Kurald Galain
2009-08-21, 05:17 AM
Aren't Sarrukhs a 3.0 thing, though, arguably outside the parameters of the OP?

...not that any sane DM would allow Pun-Punning, or that any reasonable player would attempt it...

...but playing devil's advocate, (1) commonly 3.0 things are assumed to be valid in 3.5 unless superseded by a newer version; and (2) the sarrukh is a monster, not a class/feat/spell/equipment, and the OP only restricted the latter to 3.5

:smalltongue:

oxinabox
2009-08-21, 05:17 AM
Surprisingly, yes.

It's easily solved by banning Sarrukhs and Pazuzu, though.

Isn't Pazuzu a god? I'm not familiar...
Wouldn't he be gone since i removed all but my homebrew gods?
If someone makes punpun I'll just ask them to leave i think

kamikasei
2009-08-21, 05:22 AM
...but playing devil's advocate, (1) commonly 3.0 things are assumed to be valid in 3.5 unless superseded by a newer version; and (2) the sarrukh is a monster, not a class/feat/spell/equipment, and the OP only restricted the latter to 3.5

While I would say (1) doesn't apply here since the OP's wording was "all 3.5" rather than "all things valid in 3.5", on (2) you're correct.


Isn't Pazuzu a god? I'm not familiar...

He's the demon lord of... what is it, "all winged things"? Not a god, anyway.

oxinabox
2009-08-21, 06:00 AM
I think i'll go for:

PC says Pazuzu's name 3 times:
A certain Kobold with the extraordinaire abilities:


"If anywhere in the multiverse Pazuzu's name is said 3 times, Immedially Knows"
"Can swap locations with Pazuzu, at will as a free action (weather or not it is his turn), banishing pazuzu back to his home plane"

This Kobold then says: "So... this never happened did it?"
and used the Epic Ability to move time back 3 rounds, (which he possesses as and extraordinary ability).


EDIT:
Ooh! I found a copy of Tome of Horrors, this one off games going to be fun :-D

Myou
2009-08-21, 06:13 AM
I think i'll go for:

PC says Pazuzu's name 3 times:
A certain Kobold with the extraordinaire abilities:


"If anywhere in the multiverse Pazuzu's name is said 3 times, Immedially Knows"
"Can swap locations with Pazuzu, at will as a free action (weather or not it is his turn), banishing pazuzu back to his home plane"

This Kobold then says: "So... this never happened did it?"
and used the Epic Ability to move time back 3 rounds, (which he possesses as and extraordinary ability).


EDIT:
Ooh! I found a copy of Tome of Horrors, this one off games going to be fun :-D

Oooooooooor you could just tell the PC that it didn't work. And if he says it should have then he's metagaming. Even more than he was already.

oxinabox
2009-08-21, 06:30 AM
yeah, or i could do that...

On second thought's i shouldn't use Tome of Horror on a lvl 3 party.
Tome of Horrors would be much more fun with lvl 7 or 8s
Even there are CR1 creatures thanb can Blink asa a free action. :smallbiggrin:

PinkysBrain
2009-08-21, 07:03 AM
Why not just prepare some character sheets for them which they can chose between and adjust if they want? Even a level 3 character is a lot of work if you aren't familiar with the rules.

PS. print out a couple of stacks of the manoeuvre cards for the ToB classes (free download from the wizard's site, pity they never did that for spells).

oxinabox
2009-08-21, 08:54 AM
Why not just prepare some character sheets for them which they can chose between and adjust if they want? Even a level 3 character is a lot of work if you aren't familiar with the rules.
I expect to only have one new player, maybe two at max.
And I expect that two (maybe three)of my other players will be very experienced DM's.
Even if i was starting with all people who'ld never played before i wouldn't gen there chars for them.
I'ld start them at lvl 1, and go from there.

I've also managed to start 3 people who'ld virtually never played 3.5 before at lvl 9.
It wasn't fun.




PS. print out a couple of stacks of the manoeuvre cards for the ToB classes (free download from the wizard's site, pity they never did that for spells).

I didn't know that existed! i spent hour hand writing them.